“Gettleman, The Post has learned, is tearing up the Giants’ entire operation when it comes to the draft — from how players are graded, how scouts will be assigned and how the actual draft board is assembled.” Link - ( New Window )
Under Reese and Ross, the Giants were often drawn to height-weight-speed prospects who too frequently went bust rather than boom. It is believed Gettleman will bring the emphasis back to production on the field — stressing passion, desire and mechanics rather than raw talent.
A lot of people wanted everybody gone including the scouts. Imo, they have a ton of experience and connections that are extremely beneficial. They just needed to change how we evaluated players and what we emphasize. Gettleman has been killing it.
Gettleman knows all the Giants scouts, so this will be more indoctrination than introduction; what is presented to them will be eye-opening. Under Reese and Ross, the Giants were often drawn to height-weight-speed prospects who too frequently went bust rather than boom. It is believed Gettleman will bring the emphasis back to production on the field — stressing passion, desire and mechanics rather than raw talent.
This will be reflected in how players are actually placed on the Giants’ draft board. Gettleman took a look at how the Panthers graded players, preferred that system to what he knew with the Giants, and retained it in Charlotte. Now he is bringing it to the Giants.
“Putting your focus on different things, the board is gonna look very different,’’ Gettleman said. “It’s actually something I learned in Carolina. There’s an old saying: Every man is my equal, in that I may learn from him. These guys taught me a different way of looking at it — not how to evaluate, not how to do it philosophically, but just a different way of setting up a board, and I think it’s terrific.’’
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
That surprised me too. Makes me wonder what the hell he was doing. That's supposed to be his busiest time of the year.
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Unbelievable...especially the part about watching the walkthrough on Sat. instead of College games
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Wasn’t it widely reported that Reese was on hand for the Darnold/Rosen showdown late in the season?
on reese and ross duo in that article, jesus. straight up embarrassing. i would have to imagine they will be lucky to ever work for a NFL team in any capacity again.
he didnt learn from the Giants, then go to Carolina and learn from them, only to come back to NJ and learn from the Giants again, because that would suck.
And yea, I wanted a house cleaning, hell, I wanted the house burned down, foundation dug out and a new tree planted. While Im happy Gettleman has learned, and continues to learn, I still would have felt better if there wasnt a single remaining person from the previous front office or coaching staff.
Also want to pass on Darnold, or Rosen, trade back and load up on players, and still get a good QB that can compete with Webb for the future starting job as Eli fights them off for the next 2 or 3 years. Yea, I"m that hard headed.
Gettleman, according to a Giants source, wants more checks and balances, as it is his “bugaboo’’ that there are many players the Giants rated as “C” level prospects thriving in the NFL with other teams.
he didnt learn from the Giants, then go to Carolina and learn from them, only to come back to NJ and learn from the Giants again, because that would suck.
And yea, I wanted a house cleaning, hell, I wanted the house burned down, foundation dug out and a new tree planted. While Im happy Gettleman has learned, and continues to learn, I still would have felt better if there wasnt a single remaining person from the previous front office or coaching staff.
Also want to pass on Darnold, or Rosen, trade back and load up on players, and still get a good QB that can compete with Webb for the future starting job as Eli fights them off for the next 2 or 3 years. Yea, I"m that hard headed.
absolutely killed it with his first draft as GM in 2007. after ross was brought on as director of college scouting i guess reese disengaged from that aspect of his job.
A big problem that we have seen over the past several years is that there have been a number of players with "raw talent"- but no real love for the game.
Sure you can "hit a HR" drafting those types of players- but the problem is that that type of player is quite often unwilling to put in anything more than what will maintain their current state- and is definitely not willing to go "all in" to get better.
In some ways, I think this is what Coughlin was referring to years ago about injuries being a mental thing. When you live off your talent, you often are not willing to go at less than 100% simply because you do not have the mental strength to push through unless you can physically dominate your opponent- and a player at 80% is just another guy- meaning you aren't going to beat your opponent.
Think of some of the end season articles and reports that came out- where we learned that Collins and DRC, in particular, had been gutting it out through difficult injuries. THAT is the player willing to leave it all out there.
While I do not have any inside knowledge of the injuries that Apple or Hart had, the questions that were raised by many inside and outside the team about their toughness and willingness to do what it took raises questions in my mind about how much they love the game- and whether they play the game because their natural physical skills let them play vs. working to be the best player they can be.
Of course, we all know that the hardest thing to measure in a player is their heart and passion for the game- too many prospects are trained in the draft prep to say and do the right things before the draft, so that it is difficult to get to what makes the guy tick until you get him on the practice field.
However, I think that, Gettleman is attempting to get the scouts to find out what makes the player tick and how much he WANTS to play in the NFL when they are assessing how the physical skills translate to the NFL.
Are officially way worse than anyone (outside of the organization) knew.
I guarantee some in the org. spent some sleepless nights wondering WTF?
Someone like Coughlin, overseeing football operations, who is a psycho lifer, is necessary to keep the entitled in place and add expertise. I know Parcells and Holmgren failed. Easier said than done.
He might have been a burnt out coach, I didn't have a problem with change but it's really obvious now where the change needed to be made. Many of us thought Reese/Ross needed to go at the same time, just didn't realize how much they needed to go.
Two family members who were 1st round busts. One RB who played 10 years as a back-up and one LT who had success switching to RG for 12 years.
They both had one thing in common. They HATED football. I come from a family with a pro golfer, tennis player, 2 time Olympic medalist and a whole lot of just misses.
These two guys (both by marriage, the others are blood) are the only two who wouldn't allow for their profession talk during or after their playing days.
Had they been 4th round picks (which they should have been) they would have not have been busts. The talent and measurables were off the charts but their hearts were not in it. I'm talking all the way back to high school.
Gettleman has to know that many a measureable guy does not like the game. I'm two for two so I'm guessing there are a ton of them.
how Reese changed the process from what was done during the Young/Accorsi days (or if he was running things the way EA was). Funny, EA could draft Linebackers, but he always had issues with Offensive Linemen, if I recall correctly.
how Reese changed the process from what was done during the Young/Accorsi days (or if he was running things the way EA was). Funny, EA could draft Linebackers, but he always had issues with Offensive Linemen, if I recall correctly.
And WRs.
This validates what some of us have been saying about Â
A lot of people wanted everybody gone including the scouts. Imo, they have a ton of experience and connections that are extremely beneficial. They just needed to change how we evaluated players and what we emphasize. Gettleman has been killing it.
Don't be surprised if some people are let go after the draft.
A lot of people wanted everybody gone including the scouts. Imo, they have a ton of experience and connections that are extremely beneficial. They just needed to change how we evaluated players and what we emphasize. Gettleman has been killing it.
Don't be surprised if some people are let go after the draft.
Of course not. My post was about throwing the baby out with the bath water. The entire staff doesn't need to be blown up. I think the quote, "In order to make an omlete you have to crack a few eggs," is most appropriate.
In comment 13797986 KerrysFlask said:
Quote: Quote:
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.////
That surprised me too. Makes me wonder what the hell he was doing. That's supposed to be his busiest time of the year.
Hammer, it pisses the hell out of me, but given the production of the team's college scouting operation over the past five years, I can't really say I'm surprised. Fits in with his arrogance: once he became top dog, maybe he figured he didn't have to work at the most important part of his job.
Anyone hear from rfflair recently on JR's immediate employment prospects?
The size/weight/speed quote was music to my ears Â
with "seductive measurables" and a lack of passion for the game?
Travis Beckum
Clint Sintim
JPP of TE's
Amukamara
Will Beatty
Larry Donnell
So many more.
To me heart matters infinitely more than measurables. If one guy has more raw talent opposite a guy with intense passion for the game, and he's technically sound but doesn't have a 50" vertical that the first guy has... you go with the latter every single time.
Kudos to Gettleman for bringing common sense back to the New York Giants. I have high hopes with news like this.
how Reese changed the process from what was done during the Young/Accorsi days (or if he was running things the way EA was). Funny, EA could draft Linebackers, but he always had issues with Offensive Linemen, if I recall correctly.
Ernie Accorsi didn't draft a single above-average LB in his time with the Giants, unless you believe Dhani Jones was above-average. Reese followed the same model with the same results.
how Reese changed the process from what was done during the Young/Accorsi days (or if he was running things the way EA was). Funny, EA could draft Linebackers, but he always had issues with Offensive Linemen, if I recall correctly.
Ernie Accorsi didn't draft a single above-average LB in his time with the Giants, unless you believe Dhani Jones was above-average. Reese followed the same model with the same results.
Yeah I’m not sure where the “Accorsi could draft LBs” line comes from.
Gerris Wilkinson...Reggie Torbor...Wes Mallard, Quincy Monk, Brandon Short, you mentioned Dhani Jones, Nick Greisen, Ryan Phillips
I’d say Accorsi sucked at drafting LBs. Thankfully we had a pro personnel guy named Gettleman on hand to find FAs like Antonio Pierce, Kawika Mitchell, Michael Boley (who on balance was eh, but was good during the 2011 SB season)
There is nothing wrong with height weight speed criteria Â
You don’t need a bunch of college stars who get run over in the NFL either. Most NFL draft choices were “productive” players. The problem was too many of these “JPP of (fill in position)” didn’t seem all that fast or all that strong or were tweeners. Does anyone think Adrien Robinson was a so fast for his size? How about Rosas’ generational leg? Did Clint Sintim seem mobile and agile?
There was nothing wrong with the criteria but the execution was horrendous. Gettleman won’t be long for the job if his productive players are filled with passion and desire right up until they get run over by some other team’s DL
RE: Remember when Mike Lombardi said that things Â
weren't going to change much in the Giants' front office?
Mike Lombardi is laughably bad. I safely ignore whatever he claims to know.
He knew McAdoo was a terrible hire two years ago. And he know Patricia and McDaniels weren't coming here. His point was the Giants weren't reorganizing their structure - GM who acquires players, owner who hires coach - not that a new GM wouldn't try to put his stamp on things.
Recall many of those LBs as attempts to find low pick Â
Value plays based on measurables (mallard, very fast, for example).
Lesson being :'pick higher.'
But lesson two (slightly better, Goff) looking for INTs and PDs...
Finally, for ALL defensive players ...you look for the outlier or indicator plays made
I.e. more than a handful of fumbles caused and recovered (even for DTs, for example)... Passes defended (even for DEs for example, tipped)...tackles behind the line... Sidelines.. In addition to height weight and tackles...and certainly over and above name of school.
Playmakers. Then. At lb...you have subsets based on the divergence of bigger and bigger OLs and quicker passing games. So pick your poison...more safety like or more able to take on huge O tackles.
Seems like former scouts would start with a single name Â
Much better to spreadsheet all players ALL, not just leading or good schools, eligible at a position...
And All stats ALL.. and height weight and age etc...
Than look for outliers.. Passes caught... Not just yards per.... Ints per game averages...not just highlight hits... Etc..regardless of name, school, etc...then work from there ...including that stuff with a grain of salt... or not (school, hype, name..)
This will be reflected in how players are actually placed on the Giants’ draft board. Gettleman took a look at how the Panthers graded players, preferred that system to what he knew with the Giants, and retained it in Charlotte. Now he is bringing it to the Giants.
“Putting your focus on different things, the board is gonna look very different,’’ Gettleman said. “It’s actually something I learned in Carolina. There’s an old saying: Every man is my equal, in that I may learn from him. These guys taught me a different way of looking at it — not how to evaluate, not how to do it philosophically, but just a different way of setting up a board, and I think it’s terrific.’’
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Quote:
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
That surprised me too. Makes me wonder what the hell he was doing. That's supposed to be his busiest time of the year.
Quote:
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Unbelievable...especially the part about watching the walkthrough on Sat. instead of College games
http://www.giants.com/team/staff/chris-pettit/1a450334-f1b1-4ad0-ab4e-ed05e964b211?qwr=fullsite_temporary
Giants Insider: Giants Insider: Giants Scout Chris Pettit
http://giants.com/videos/videos/Giants-Insider-Giants-Scout-Chris-Pettit/281f694b-77e6-4b5e-bc59-180674cad0fd
Found Victor Cruz
http://www.espn.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/7539034/super-bowl-2012-new-york-giants-scout-chris-pettit-found-victor-cruz
Quote:
Unbelievable...especially the part about watching the walkthrough on Sat. instead of College games
Agreed. Got comfy in his position I guess? Had his peons doing it instead.
Pretty brutal.
I wasn't excited about this whole gettleman hiring since I expected 'more of the same ', but he's on the wholesale changes track.
Impressed so far.
Although it's hard to be much worse than Reese got there at the end.
Quote:
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.
Wasn’t it widely reported that Reese was on hand for the Darnold/Rosen showdown late in the season?
Either way, that’s pathetic.
Lol, good one
And yea, I wanted a house cleaning, hell, I wanted the house burned down, foundation dug out and a new tree planted. While Im happy Gettleman has learned, and continues to learn, I still would have felt better if there wasnt a single remaining person from the previous front office or coaching staff.
Also want to pass on Darnold, or Rosen, trade back and load up on players, and still get a good QB that can compete with Webb for the future starting job as Eli fights them off for the next 2 or 3 years. Yea, I"m that hard headed.
Quote:
Quote:
Unbelievable...especially the part about watching the walkthrough on Sat. instead of College games
Agreed. Got comfy in his position I guess? Had his peons doing it instead.
Pretty brutal.
I wasn't excited about this whole gettleman hiring since I expected 'more of the same ', but he's on the wholesale changes track.
Impressed so far.
Although it's hard to be much worse than Reese got there at the end.
I am exactly like you on Gettleman, pleasantly surprised seeing he tossing out the old for the new. I sure hope they move on from Spags though
And yea, I wanted a house cleaning, hell, I wanted the house burned down, foundation dug out and a new tree planted. While Im happy Gettleman has learned, and continues to learn, I still would have felt better if there wasnt a single remaining person from the previous front office or coaching staff.
Also want to pass on Darnold, or Rosen, trade back and load up on players, and still get a good QB that can compete with Webb for the future starting job as Eli fights them off for the next 2 or 3 years. Yea, I"m that hard headed.
Complain, complain, complain, complain. Jeezus, man.
I’m not sure “hard headed” is the words you’re looking for...
Very exciting times for us fans.
Sure you can "hit a HR" drafting those types of players- but the problem is that that type of player is quite often unwilling to put in anything more than what will maintain their current state- and is definitely not willing to go "all in" to get better.
In some ways, I think this is what Coughlin was referring to years ago about injuries being a mental thing. When you live off your talent, you often are not willing to go at less than 100% simply because you do not have the mental strength to push through unless you can physically dominate your opponent- and a player at 80% is just another guy- meaning you aren't going to beat your opponent.
Think of some of the end season articles and reports that came out- where we learned that Collins and DRC, in particular, had been gutting it out through difficult injuries. THAT is the player willing to leave it all out there.
While I do not have any inside knowledge of the injuries that Apple or Hart had, the questions that were raised by many inside and outside the team about their toughness and willingness to do what it took raises questions in my mind about how much they love the game- and whether they play the game because their natural physical skills let them play vs. working to be the best player they can be.
Of course, we all know that the hardest thing to measure in a player is their heart and passion for the game- too many prospects are trained in the draft prep to say and do the right things before the draft, so that it is difficult to get to what makes the guy tick until you get him on the practice field.
However, I think that, Gettleman is attempting to get the scouts to find out what makes the player tick and how much he WANTS to play in the NFL when they are assessing how the physical skills translate to the NFL.
You can't swing too far in the other direction. Philip Dillard and Greg Jones were tackling machine linebackers. Can't play.
I guarantee some in the org. spent some sleepless nights wondering WTF?
Someone like Coughlin, overseeing football operations, who is a psycho lifer, is necessary to keep the entitled in place and add expertise. I know Parcells and Holmgren failed. Easier said than done.
He might have been a burnt out coach, I didn't have a problem with change but it's really obvious now where the change needed to be made. Many of us thought Reese/Ross needed to go at the same time, just didn't realize how much they needed to go.
They both had one thing in common. They HATED football. I come from a family with a pro golfer, tennis player, 2 time Olympic medalist and a whole lot of just misses.
These two guys (both by marriage, the others are blood) are the only two who wouldn't allow for their profession talk during or after their playing days.
Had they been 4th round picks (which they should have been) they would have not have been busts. The talent and measurables were off the charts but their hearts were not in it. I'm talking all the way back to high school.
Gettleman has to know that many a measureable guy does not like the game. I'm two for two so I'm guessing there are a ton of them.
And WRs.
Don't be surprised if some people are let go after the draft.
Quote:
A lot of people wanted everybody gone including the scouts. Imo, they have a ton of experience and connections that are extremely beneficial. They just needed to change how we evaluated players and what we emphasize. Gettleman has been killing it.
Don't be surprised if some people are let go after the draft.
Of course not. My post was about throwing the baby out with the bath water. The entire staff doesn't need to be blown up. I think the quote, "In order to make an omlete you have to crack a few eggs," is most appropriate.
Quote: Quote:
Reese didn’t spend enough time scouting college prospects, according to some people who work for the Giants.
Reese was a Giants scout before he rose through the ranks to top-executive status, but in recent years he increasingly distanced himself from his area of expertise. He assigned himself to only one college game in 2016 and only one in 2017 — Florida State at Louisville, to check out quarterback Lamar Jackson. There were some in the building who wondered why Reese did not at least drive down to Rutgers on game days to check out the Big Ten prospects on the field, or why Reese saw the need to watch a Giants walk-through on a Saturday when there were college games to see on various campuses.////
That surprised me too. Makes me wonder what the hell he was doing. That's supposed to be his busiest time of the year.
Anyone hear from rfflair recently on JR's immediate employment prospects?
Travis Beckum
Clint Sintim
JPP of TE's
Amukamara
Will Beatty
Larry Donnell
So many more.
To me heart matters infinitely more than measurables. If one guy has more raw talent opposite a guy with intense passion for the game, and he's technically sound but doesn't have a 50" vertical that the first guy has... you go with the latter every single time.
Kudos to Gettleman for bringing common sense back to the New York Giants. I have high hopes with news like this.
Ernie Accorsi didn't draft a single above-average LB in his time with the Giants, unless you believe Dhani Jones was above-average. Reese followed the same model with the same results.
Mike Lombardi is laughably bad. I safely ignore whatever he claims to know.
Quote:
how Reese changed the process from what was done during the Young/Accorsi days (or if he was running things the way EA was). Funny, EA could draft Linebackers, but he always had issues with Offensive Linemen, if I recall correctly.
Ernie Accorsi didn't draft a single above-average LB in his time with the Giants, unless you believe Dhani Jones was above-average. Reese followed the same model with the same results.
Yeah I’m not sure where the “Accorsi could draft LBs” line comes from.
Gerris Wilkinson...Reggie Torbor...Wes Mallard, Quincy Monk, Brandon Short, you mentioned Dhani Jones, Nick Greisen, Ryan Phillips
I’d say Accorsi sucked at drafting LBs. Thankfully we had a pro personnel guy named Gettleman on hand to find FAs like Antonio Pierce, Kawika Mitchell, Michael Boley (who on balance was eh, but was good during the 2011 SB season)
There was nothing wrong with the criteria but the execution was horrendous. Gettleman won’t be long for the job if his productive players are filled with passion and desire right up until they get run over by some other team’s DL
Mike Lombardi is laughably bad. I safely ignore whatever he claims to know.
He knew McAdoo was a terrible hire two years ago. And he know Patricia and McDaniels weren't coming here. His point was the Giants weren't reorganizing their structure - GM who acquires players, owner who hires coach - not that a new GM wouldn't try to put his stamp on things.
Lesson being :'pick higher.'
But lesson two (slightly better, Goff) looking for INTs and PDs...
Finally, for ALL defensive players ...you look for the outlier or indicator plays made
I.e. more than a handful of fumbles caused and recovered (even for DTs, for example)... Passes defended (even for DEs for example, tipped)...tackles behind the line... Sidelines.. In addition to height weight and tackles...and certainly over and above name of school.
Playmakers. Then. At lb...you have subsets based on the divergence of bigger and bigger OLs and quicker passing games. So pick your poison...more safety like or more able to take on huge O tackles.
Much better to spreadsheet all players ALL, not just leading or good schools, eligible at a position...
And All stats ALL.. and height weight and age etc...
Than look for outliers.. Passes caught... Not just yards per.... Ints per game averages...not just highlight hits... Etc..regardless of name, school, etc...then work from there ...including that stuff with a grain of salt... or not (school, hype, name..)