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Justin Pugh now a Priority to sign

Giants1975 : 2/10/2018 5:48 pm
Rotoworld is link says ESPN is source
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Highly doubt it  
Vanzetti : 2/10/2018 7:54 pm : link
.
Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
TheVette : 2/10/2018 8:24 pm : link
..at best. The Giants would be truly stupid to give this guy a deal at all.

Being the best OL guy on a team who has XFL players all over the OL is nothing to brag about. Pugh is grossly overrated, and a low character guy who ca chooses not to play.
RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
Jay on the Island : 2/10/2018 8:30 pm : link
In comment 13828822 TheVette said:
Quote:
..at best. The Giants would be truly stupid to give this guy a deal at all.

Being the best OL guy on a team who has XFL players all over the OL is nothing to brag about. Pugh is grossly overrated, and a low character guy who ca chooses not to play.

A rare post without a single fact. Low character? Where did you come up with this nonsense?
If its between  
ryanmkeane : 2/10/2018 8:57 pm : link
Pugh and Richburg I would go with Pugh. Hes a good right tackle. Just stay on the damn field.
RE: RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
TheVette : 2/10/2018 9:00 pm : link
In comment 13828825 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 13828822 TheVette said:


Quote:


..at best. The Giants would be truly stupid to give this guy a deal at all.

Being the best OL guy on a team who has XFL players all over the OL is nothing to brag about. Pugh is grossly overrated, and a low character guy who ca chooses not to play.


A rare post without a single fact. Low character? Where did you come up with this nonsense?


Quit on the the team - a guy goes into contract year, a continues to miss PT year after year. At some point you have to question the guy's ticker, but I know you aren't smart enough to put that together. The only single fact is that you are giving Pugh a pass, because you are too dumb to know any better.
Decent if not great  
TMS : 2/10/2018 9:08 pm : link
and very versatile guy to have in your bag. Leave that decision to DG who is considered to be excellent at OL talent evaluation. DG wants to win as much as any of us here..
RE: RE: RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
adamg : 2/10/2018 9:20 pm : link
In comment 13828837 TheVette said:
Quote:
In comment 13828825 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


In comment 13828822 TheVette said:


Quote:


..at best. The Giants would be truly stupid to give this guy a deal at all.

Being the best OL guy on a team who has XFL players all over the OL is nothing to brag about. Pugh is grossly overrated, and a low character guy who ca chooses not to play.


A rare post without a single fact. Low character? Where did you come up with this nonsense?



Quit on the the team - a guy goes into contract year, a continues to miss PT year after year. At some point you have to question the guy's ticker, but I know you aren't smart enough to put that together. The only single fact is that you are giving Pugh a pass, because you are too dumb to know any better.


Try civility. Or just leave the site. You've posted garbage since joining.
Just Stay on the Field  
Samiam : 2/10/2018 9:20 pm : link
Easier said than done. He is more likely to play a full season after he signs a big contract or before he does?
No thanks  
Bill in UT : 2/10/2018 9:31 pm : link
Even if he's healthy he's JAG
RE: RE: RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
Jay on the Island : 2/10/2018 9:34 pm : link
In comment 13828837 TheVette said:
Quote:



Quit on the the team - a guy goes into contract year, a continues to miss PT year after year. At some point you have to question the guy's ticker, but I know you aren't smart enough to put that together. The only single fact is that you are giving Pugh a pass, because you are too dumb to know any better.

When did he quit on his team? It is easy to throw accusations around without any proof. I am smart enough to trust facts over ridiculous speculation. Don't let facts get in the way of your agenda.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
Jay on the Island : 2/10/2018 9:35 pm : link
In comment 13828851 adamg said:
Quote:

Try civility. Or just leave the site. You've posted garbage since joining.


Clearly a dupe.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Pugh Is Good For 6-8 Game/Year  
adamg : 2/10/2018 9:41 pm : link
In comment 13828863 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 13828851 adamg said:


Quote:



Try civility. Or just leave the site. You've posted garbage since joining.



Clearly a dupe.


Absolutely.
RE: I like Pugh more than  
LauderdaleMatty : 2/10/2018 9:43 pm : link
In comment 13828719 section125 said:
Quote:
most, but I doubt they spend big buck on him.


I think Hes a good to very good guard who is never healthy. I can see how people can disagree on that. But no one sane thinks he can be relied upon for 16. Games. Hes never healthy. No thanks unless the contract is w huge incentives for actual games played
1 year  
spike : 2/10/2018 9:45 pm : link
show me deal
RE: RE: I like Pugh more than  
Jay on the Island : 2/10/2018 9:46 pm : link
In comment 13828868 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
In comment 13828719 section125 said:


Quote:


most, but I doubt they spend big buck on him.



I think Hes a good to very good guard who is never healthy. I can see how people can disagree on that. But no one sane thinks he can be relied upon for 16. Games. Hes never healthy. No thanks unless the contract is w huge incentives for actual games played

agreed
I'd rather spend on Norwell  
Rjanyg : 2/10/2018 10:08 pm : link
And Get Fleming from NE. Draft Hernandez in round 2. We may have to let Flowers and Wheeler fight it out for LT for one more year.

Flowers/Wheeler, Norwell, Jones, Hernandez, Fleming is a much better line than we have had here in 5 years.
Over investing in flawed/injury-prone free agents  
IIT : 2/11/2018 6:08 am : link
like Pugh simply because you're desperate at the position is exactly the wrong way to manage a roster.

I'd rather keep panning for gold among undrafted rookies until a free agent that has a shot of earning his contract comes onto market.
RE: I wouldn't  
yatqb : 2/11/2018 7:10 am : link
In comment 13828680 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
spend big bucks on an offensive lineman who can't play a full season.


I agree.
Use an incentive  
Bubba : 2/11/2018 7:23 am : link
based contract like they did with Arrington who could not stay on the field either.
I know someone who knew Pugh and was a former NFLer  
idinkido : 2/11/2018 8:24 am : link
When Pugh was first starting out with the Giants, this person claimed that Pugh was a completely clean player and had not and would not do steroids. This person said based on that, Pugh had a limited future and that most of the NFL players were on steroids. He said that the players are given enough advance notice to clean up to pass the test and those that get caught are the ones too addicted to steroids. Look at the before and after photos of Snee and come to your own conclusions.
Read that article yesterday ....  
Beer Man : 2/11/2018 8:53 am : link
It was nothing more than ESPN expressing an opinion. No mention in it on DG's or PS's opinions. As with many BBIer, I'm a big Justin P. fan, but with his injury history I don't believe the team should give him the big payday or get in a bidding war for his service. As much cap space as the Giants have, there are 20 teams with more, plus they still have to figure out how to extend OBJ and Collins.
It doesn't make any difference  
Doomster : 2/11/2018 9:37 am : link
how versatile you are, if you can't stay on the field.....time to move on from this guy....
I'm going the other way and say we should keep Pugh  
Jimmy Googs : 2/11/2018 9:46 am : link
not disagreeing with the injuries/availability issues this guys has but he is also more talented than most of our lineman.

Also need some level of starting material to show up at OTAs and he would be where I would spend some money...
He's too good and too versatile for the Giants not to....  
Milton : 2/11/2018 9:55 am : link
...at least try to work out a fair deal with him, perhaps something with escalators and/or incentives based on games active. If there's a team out there willing to give him Kevin Zeitler money, well, then good luck to him. Norwell is the only potential free agent OL worth that kind of money.

If the Giants can find a way to sign Norwell, Pugh, and Fluker in free agency, trade Flowers for a late round pick, and draft one of the top interior OL in round 2, preferably Price, the Giants OL will be good enough for the offense to function at whatever level the skill players allow for (rather than vice versa).

From left to right: Wheeler Norwell, Price, Fluker, Pugh
Backups (L to R): Pugh, Jerry, Jones, Jerry, Fluker
The love for Fluker is  
section125 : 2/11/2018 10:02 am : link
kind of surprising. He did a good job run blocking, but the Giants need a pass blocking RG, also. I suppose Fluker at $4 mill for 3 years would be ok, but more?, forget it.
The thing I like about Pugh is he can play 4 of the 5 positions  
PatersonPlank : 2/11/2018 10:18 am : link
This is extremely important as we start rebuilding the line, because who know who we get. Pugh gives us flexibility in the search, plus he plays at a good-to high level. Obviously the issue is staying healthy, which is a problem. If he had stayed healthy most of the seasons he'd be demanding big bucks. I'd try to sign him for a deal that makes sense for us. I wouldn't be breaking the bank, but there is certainly a lot of value to us for keeping him.
RE: The love for Fluker is  
Milton : 2/11/2018 10:26 am : link
In comment 13828998 section125 said:
Quote:
kind of surprising. He did a good job run blocking, but the Giants need a pass blocking RG, also. I suppose Fluker at $4 mill for 3 years would be ok, but more?, forget it.
I think Fluker can be had for a reasonable price, but we'll see. I think he fits with "the culture" that Gettleman would like to create. He is a great locker room guy!
I like Pugh  
Metnut : 2/11/2018 10:28 am : link
but hes not durable enough to spend over $10M per season on. Wed be better off trusting our new scouts and rolling the dice and on two cheaper players that the front office thinks might be undervalued.
RE: The love for Fluker is  
Milton : 2/11/2018 10:35 am : link
In comment 13828998 section125 said:
Quote:
kind of surprising.

How can you not love this guy!? - ( New Window )
How can anyone conclude the signing of Pugh  
WillieYoung : 2/11/2018 10:38 am : link
means Flowers is staying at left tackle? Gettleman's first move is to bench him and to state publicly that Reese was ignoring the o-line's deficiencies, i.e. that playing a guy who was terrible just because he was a first round pick was a disaster. And how can anyone expect him to be better at right tackle? Most teams have two pass rushers and his technique issues aren't going away on the right side. He may make a + player at guard. it's his only hope of being in the league after next year.
RE: He's too good and too versatile for the Giants not to....  
Bobby Humphrey's Earpad : 2/11/2018 10:58 am : link
In comment 13828996 Milton said:
Quote:
...at least try to work out a fair deal with him, perhaps something with escalators and/or incentives based on games active. If there's a team out there willing to give him Kevin Zeitler money, well, then good luck to him. Norwell is the only potential free agent OL worth that kind of money.

If the Giants can find a way to sign Norwell, Pugh, and Fluker in free agency, trade Flowers for a late round pick, and draft one of the top interior OL in round 2, preferably Price, the Giants OL will be good enough for the offense to function at whatever level the skill players allow for (rather than vice versa).

From left to right: Wheeler Norwell, Price, Fluker, Pugh
Backups (L to R): Pugh, Jerry, Jones, Jerry, Fluker


Solid post on Pugh, Milton, and agree: his value really lies in his versatility. But there's a limit and Zeitler wasn't even worth Zeitler money.
I have said this on several posts here already  
rich in DC : 2/11/2018 11:31 am : link
The Giants should NOT bring back a single starting interior OL from last season. It will not matter what scheme they run- zone-block, power run, spread offense- doesn't matter: not one of them has the ability going forward to be an effective interior OL.

Pugh can blame injuries if he wants, but I believe that a LOT of his rep comes from his 1st round draft pedigree as opposed to actual production on the field. He wants to be paid the going rate for OG- which is somewhere between $10-14M depending on the perceived longevity of the player.

However, Pugh already has a bad back, and has had numerous other injuries- no need throwing good money after bad. His performance when on the field does not justify paying him- and add in the injuries- and it is an easy question to answer whether to re-sign him or not.

The Giants are better off pursing whichever OG is not signed in Carolina, targetting a solid vet at C who has a year or two left (and draft a replacement in the mid-rounds), and then find a servicable OG vet at the other spot. Move Flowers to RT and sign an aging LT type who won't demand super money. Draft a projectable OT in the 2nd-3rd round. Let Wheeler compete, but no guarantees.

Most of all- decide on an offensive scheme and play call to that sceheme. Coach the OL on the best techniques to be successful in that scheme- all things that we lacking the past several years.

There are solid skill position players (except at RB). Deciding what you want to do and the best OL for that scheme will be the key. But right now, not a single guy from the Giants 2017 interior OL should be brought back because they don't offer enough going forward to bother with.
He's quoted as saying  
Peppers : 2/11/2018 11:49 am : link
"I want to win. I want to win now, I'm excited for the first chance to choose where I play and the situation that I'm in. Ive been in five years. I only made the playoffs one time."

"Yeah, I think so," Pugh said when asked if he will be a hot commodity.


Doesn't really sound like someone who's coming back.
RE: I'd rather spend on Norwell  
Bruner4329 : 2/11/2018 11:56 am : link
In comment 13828889 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
And Get Fleming from NE. Draft Hernandez in round 2. We may have to let Flowers and Wheeler fight it out for LT for one more year.

Flowers/Wheeler, Norwell, Jones, Hernandez, Fleming is a much better line than we have had here in 5 years.


You can bet the ranch that DG will bring in a new LT and at least a guard via FA. There is no way he is going to let LT go another year with Flowers and or Wheeler. It is the most important slot on the line.
Odds are Pugh won't be any healthier.  
FStubbs : 2/11/2018 12:16 pm : link
If the terms are right, at least he can play half the games a year. But if you're rebuilding, why roll the dice with him? I'd rather have a healthy young guy learning.

Richburg isn't even JAG, he's terrible. Jones is JAG so we already have a better center on the roster.
The contreact  
MotownGIANTS : 2/11/2018 12:54 pm : link
will protect the team from truncated seasons due to injury....it is a smart move. He has the skills just needs to stay on the field. I bet the money is front ended and fair but jumps if he is on the field. I wager 3 yrs with an avg of 7 yrs but jumps to 10-12 depending on bonuses met.
'a Priority to sign'...  
Torrag : 2/11/2018 1:16 pm : link
God no. He's a league average OG whose best position is RT with an extensive history in concussion protocol. He's also clearly not 'the voice' to motivate these guy from within as he had that opportunity and they consistently sucked on his 'watch'.

The good news is Roto is just another media clickbait establishment with no chops for getting any of this stuff correct.
No way - HARD pass  
TD : 2/11/2018 2:40 pm : link
Health has preveted him from being a reliable player or even play 16 games in a season.

Health issues tend to get worse - not better - over time.

Even healthy, he is a solid but not great OL. I dont think hes worth even half of the going rate for premium guards.

Anything more than John Jerry money is throwaway money.
I like Pugh  
Giantfootball025 : 2/11/2018 2:52 pm : link
he's a solid OL. But, as others have mentioned before, he simply can not stay on the field. You don't shell out big contracts for guys who can't actually put the pads on. Then you have to pay him AND a quality backup. Just give me a guy with a clean injury history and lets get to work.
Don't write off the kids  
mrvax : 2/11/2018 3:06 pm : link
(Wheeler and Bisnowaty) yet. We all knew last year that these guys were developmental projects. Wheeler did a decent job near the end of the year even though he usually had some help.

Bisnowaty got lucky and was penciled in vs. the Skins in the season finale. Kerrigan was able to get 2 sacks off him and I believe 2 penalties too. There was no help given to Adam. IMO, he looked better than Hart ever did.

It is possible these 2 guys are working their asses off to make the team and it would be a damn shame if they don't get a shot in pre-season at being a starter.

Even if just 1 of them make it to starting tackle in 2018, it will be a big plus for the Giants.
If they spend money on Pugh  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 2/11/2018 3:31 pm : link
you can say goodbye to Norwell. There's no way they spend 20 million per on interior linemen, and LG is the best position for both players.

They couldn't be planning a LT move for Pugh could they? Seems like he'd be there already if he had the ability to start at LT on the regular.
RE: If they spend money on Pugh  
Beer Man : 2/11/2018 4:28 pm : link
In comment 13829205 LakeGeorgeGiant said:
Quote:
you can say goodbye to Norwell. There's no way they spend 20 million per on interior linemen, and LG is the best position for both players.

They couldn't be planning a LT move for Pugh could they? Seems like he'd be there already if he had the ability to start at LT on the regular.
There are too many teams with more cap space. The Giants are going to find it difficult to sign any of the top FAs
RE: RE: If they spend money on Pugh  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 2/11/2018 4:31 pm : link
In comment 13829253 Beer Man said:
Quote:
In comment 13829205 LakeGeorgeGiant said:


Quote:


you can say goodbye to Norwell. There's no way they spend 20 million per on interior linemen, and LG is the best position for both players.

They couldn't be planning a LT move for Pugh could they? Seems like he'd be there already if he had the ability to start at LT on the regular.

There are too many teams with more cap space. The Giants are going to find it difficult to sign any of the top FAs


That's just the usual doom and gloom. They can't spend on multiple free agents, but they certainly have the money to get Norwell unless you expect him to get 20 mil.
Pugh is a "try-hard"guy ...  
Manny in CA : 2/11/2018 9:09 pm : link

But he's been over his head since he was drafted. He's basically another 1st round Jerry Reese mistake. IF he's willing to take vet minimum (or just a bit over, to save face), I'd sign him up as a reserve, that's all.

Giants need Norwell and one other vet FA  
twostepgiants : 2/11/2018 9:27 pm : link
Draft an OL top of round 2. That would be 3 new additions and move Flowers to RT.
Love to get Norwell, but ...  
Manny in CA : 2/11/2018 10:01 pm : link

Left tackle is a bigger need; that screams Nate Solder.

Then IF the Giants could negotiate a trade back with the Browns to grab Nelson, 2/3 of the problem is solved.

The draft can provide the Center issue with either Ragnow or Bozeman.

If we had the cap space - Solder & Norwell, then Barkley with our #2 over-all.
no he's not. hey nedd tos sign a player who can play all 16 games  
Victor in CT : 2/12/2018 8:42 am : link
and be better then mediocre. He simply isn't good enough to pay the kind of money he expects to get. BYE.
RE: I know someone who knew Pugh and was a former NFLer  
FStubbs : 2/12/2018 9:05 am : link
In comment 13828968 idinkido said:
Quote:
When Pugh was first starting out with the Giants, this person claimed that Pugh was a completely clean player and had not and would not do steroids. This person said based on that, Pugh had a limited future and that most of the NFL players were on steroids. He said that the players are given enough advance notice to clean up to pass the test and those that get caught are the ones too addicted to steroids. Look at the before and after photos of Snee and come to your own conclusions.


Huh.
Well,  
Doomster : 2/12/2018 1:06 pm : link
Don't write off the kids
mrvax : 2/11/2018 3:06 pm : link : reply
(Wheeler and Bisnowaty) yet. We all knew last year that these guys were developmental projects. Wheeler did a decent job near the end of the year even though he usually had some help.

Bisnowaty got lucky and was penciled in vs. the Skins in the season finale. Kerrigan was able to get 2 sacks off him and I believe 2 penalties too. There was no help given to Adam. IMO, he looked better than Hart ever did.

It is possible these 2 guys are working their asses off to make the team and it would be a damn shame if they don't get a shot in pre-season at being a starter.

Even if just 1 of them make it to starting tackle in 2018, it will be a big plus for the Giants.


I wouldn't be surprised to see both of them start.....and if they do, we will be in the same shit hole we were last season......we need 4 starters, and Flowers will only be a one year starter at a new position, that we have no idea if he can handle....

It just amazes me that BBI thinks we have the money to go out and get top FA's for the OL, and that we are going to hit on draft picks this year and solve our OL problems....it's not happening in one year....not to mention the problems we have at linebacker, CB, S, RB, WR, and DE....

This is a several year rebuild, and to hang onto Eli and his CAP, when we will not be going anywhere for the next two seasons makes no sense.....time to start the rebuild now.....

This off season will be a good indication, of whether this ownership is committed to it's future or will the same "we are only 1 or 2 players away" attitude, that we have had for the last 6 seasons, prevails....
It doesn't make a ton of sense  
JonC : 2/12/2018 1:09 pm : link
given his typical lack of availability for a full season.
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