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PFF article on Mayfield

chuckydee9 : 2/12/2018 11:21 pm
Lots of details as to how he is making accurate NFL level throws and overall has the best accuracy and passer rating of all the QBs coming out. The only concern should be his off the field stuff.
Baker Mayfield's tape, numbers say he should be No. 1 overall pick - ( New Window )
"Who are those guys, PFF"?  
NYRiese : 2/12/2018 11:31 pm : link
.
My biggest knock on Baker  
est1986 : 2/12/2018 11:45 pm : link
Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..
RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
BestFeature : 2/12/2018 11:48 pm : link
In comment 13830602 est1986 said:
Quote:
Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..


The article addresses this, did you read it?
RE: RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
chuckydee9 : 2/12/2018 11:59 pm : link
In comment 13830605 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 13830602 est1986 said:


Quote:


Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..



The article addresses this, did you read it?


Most people that are critical of PFF simply dismiss them without properly reading their articles.. Usually they address all relevant information and provide detailed answer to all of those relevant information.. Like all analysis, theirs can be wrong and is wrong often.. but if I were to buy into someone analysis, give me someone who has done a lot of work and provides lots of details rather than some lazy story telling..
RE: RE: RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
BestFeature : 2/13/2018 12:03 am : link
In comment 13830609 chuckydee9 said:
Quote:
In comment 13830605 BestFeature said:


Quote:


In comment 13830602 est1986 said:


Quote:


Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..



The article addresses this, did you read it?



Most people that are critical of PFF simply dismiss them without properly reading their articles.. Usually they address all relevant information and provide detailed answer to all of those relevant information.. Like all analysis, theirs can be wrong and is wrong often.. but if I were to buy into someone analysis, give me someone who has done a lot of work and provides lots of details rather than some lazy story telling..


My big question is how do they arrive at their analysis. Do they have a process where they can quantify certain actions? How subjective is it?
RE: RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
est1986 : 2/13/2018 12:22 am : link
In comment 13830605 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 13830602 est1986 said:


Quote:


Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..



The article addresses this, did you read it?


Lol. Yeah the article says he is the best QB in this class and he should be the number pick. YOU HEAR THAT CLEVELAND, THE ARTICLE SAYS HE SHOULD BE THE NUMBER ONE PICK. It also says he is the best QB by far when he doesn稚 face any pressure, did you read that part? It also said something about he had the two highest QBR seasons in how ever many years they have been doing that so I guess that guarantees he will be a good NFL QB, right? Oh yeah Cody Kessler had the third highest QBR ever, shows how much that shit means... to answer your question yes, I read it... means close to nothing, per usual regarding PFF.. entertaining though... he has the best LT in football, playmakers all over that offense, don稚 get me wrong he is a hell of a QB but those numbers don稚 mean much to me, how much of Baker have you actually watched? Been watching him for about four years now.. and I think he is a better college QB than he will be a NFL QB and I think the opposite for Darnold.
Their methodology & rigor  
RetroJint : 2/13/2018 12:26 am : link
Is clearly outlined . Every grade that has ever been authored regarding an athletic prospect is subjective to a certain degree. That is because humans are interpreting the data and video . So his ball isn稚 as pretty as Allen. His deep arm strength is still more than sufficiirnt to get the job done. Baker is my choice at 2 for the Giants. My only concern that I have for him is his ability to drive the deep out to the long side of the field . To me, that痴 always been the best judge for functional arm strength . Fran Tarkenton got the ball deep over the top of the defense , even though the ball resembled a balloon . However his passes to the sidelines would hang , sometimes painfully so .

I wish they would grade his game in Norman against Ohio St in 16. Hooker made a couple of plays on Mayfield that would have elicited minus grades for the Q. But Darnold, by comparison , fared very poorly against a rush that was balanced but not oppressive . Plus he had the ridiculously lame read on a minor pre-snap disguise that Schiano gave him . I don稚 see Mayfield succumbing to that bait.

He has to clean up his off-field behavior . He needs to respect the opposition more . But neither must he fear it. I would love to have him as the new Q of the Giants .
I just don稚 agree with the overall assement  
est1986 : 2/13/2018 12:28 am : link
Baker痴 yards boosted with his guys killing the YAC
Baker has all day most of the day
When the windows get tight, the ball is not there more times than it is
When the pressure comes, he has some good avoidance but I don稚 see him making those big throws while stepping into a hit, more mad scramble, razzle dazzle and hopefully find a wide open man type stuff that will not work in the NFL IMO... he is a boom or bust QB if I ever seen one and it might be boom, I for one love his personality, his nastiness that is uncommon at his position, I would love a QB with some swag like that.. we shall see
RE: Their methodology & rigor  
est1986 : 2/13/2018 12:30 am : link
In comment 13830618 RetroJint said:
Quote:
Is clearly outlined . Every grade that has ever been authored regarding an athletic prospect is subjective to a certain degree. That is because humans are interpreting the data and video . So his ball isn稚 as pretty as Allen. His deep arm strength is still more than sufficiirnt to get the job done. Baker is my choice at 2 for the Giants. My only concern that I have for him is his ability to drive the deep out to the long side of the field . To me, that痴 always been the best judge for functional arm strength . Fran Tarkenton got the ball deep over the top of the defense , even though the ball resembled a balloon . However his passes to the sidelines would hang , sometimes painfully so .

I wish they would grade his game in Norman against Ohio St in 16. Hooker made a couple of plays on Mayfield that would have elicited minus grades for the Q. But Darnold, by comparison , fared very poorly against a rush that was balanced but not oppressive . Plus he had the ridiculously lame read on a minor pre-snap disguise that Schiano gave him . I don稚 see Mayfield succumbing to that bait.

He has to clean up his off-field behavior . He needs to respect the opposition more . But neither must he fear it. I would love to have him as the new Q of the Giants .


I agree mostly but compare Darnolds time to throw to Bakers time to throw against that same OSU defense... night and day, not a fair comparison
RE: RE: RE: RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
chuckydee9 : 2/13/2018 12:32 am : link
In comment 13830612 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 13830609 chuckydee9 said:


Quote:


In comment 13830605 BestFeature said:


Quote:


In comment 13830602 est1986 said:


Quote:


Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..



The article addresses this, did you read it?



Most people that are critical of PFF simply dismiss them without properly reading their articles.. Usually they address all relevant information and provide detailed answer to all of those relevant information.. Like all analysis, theirs can be wrong and is wrong often.. but if I were to buy into someone analysis, give me someone who has done a lot of work and provides lots of details rather than some lazy story telling..



My big question is how do they arrive at their analysis. Do they have a process where they can quantify certain actions? How subjective is it?


Yes they do.. its subjective as everything football is.. but they have a very rigorous process.. I used to listen to their off season podcast where they have time to dwell into how they analyze what they see and trust me ESPN or print media isn't doing their level of work to give us analysis..
Darnold doesn稚 blow that lead to Georgia  
est1986 : 2/13/2018 12:33 am : link
Darnold if given more than one chance to finish off a team, will gladly finish them off, Baker... idk, he didn稚 against Georgia.
est1986  
GeorgeAdams33 : 2/13/2018 2:18 am : link
You know Baker Mayfield? Is he a relative? A good friend? I bet he refers to you by your first name too. That's so special. Bless your heart.
This is an extraordinary QB class.  
idinkido : 2/13/2018 5:50 am : link
The Giants need to pick a QB. To trade down is insane unless its just a couple of spots lower. Mayfield is going to make it big in the NFL but that does not mean that he is the best QB in this draft. I think we got the right head coach to get this pick right.
This guy grabbed his junk on National tv  
Ned In Atlanta : 2/13/2018 6:27 am : link
And no way the giants draft him. Watch the second half of the rose bowl against a great SEC defense like Georgia. He went into a shell. I predict he痴 going to slide out of the top 20 picks once the draft rolls around
RE: This guy grabbed his junk on National tv  
KingBlue : 2/13/2018 6:46 am : link
In comment 13830643 Ned In Atlanta said:
Quote:
And no way the giants draft him. Watch the second half of the rose bowl against a great SEC defense like Georgia. He went into a shell. I predict he痴 going to slide out of the top 20 picks once the draft rolls around


Out of the top 20? Sorry, but that just will not happen. Too many teams that need a QB.
RE: RE: My biggest knock on Baker  
NikkiMac : 2/13/2018 6:50 am : link
In comment 13830605 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 13830602 est1986 said:


Quote:


Every big throw I have seen him make has been with all day to throw, no pressure in his face and wide open receivers... I like what I知 seeing but I知 always waiting to see him make a great throw while getting hit or making a great throw through coverage... IDK maybe I知 really, really knit picking but this guy has all day to throw vs Ohio State meanwhile Darnold is running for his life every snap, hard to compare..



The article addresses this, did you read it?


That痴 why we need to move up into the 1st round to get Orlando Brown !
Did he grow since he was last measured?  
ZogZerg : 2/13/2018 6:54 am : link
No concern at all about his height?

It has to at least be a concern. Sure, their are successful NFL QBs at his height or shorter, but a very small percent. He'll have to figure things out like the others have. Can he? sure. But, it has to be a concern.
He had the top two PFF grades in the last 4 years  
Heisenberg : 2/13/2018 7:34 am : link
narrowly beating out.... Cody Kessler's third best score.
If the choice is Darnold or Mayfield  
Captplanet : 2/13/2018 7:54 am : link
I'll take experience over potential anytime. Mayfield has played in big games, won a Heisman, played in the college playoffs(loss due to awful Defense). What has Darnold done? What has Rosen done? It reminds me of last year, where there was so much tape on Dashaun Watson that teams nick picked him to death. Chicago, Cleveland and even KC took potential over proven production and leadership. There is something to say for actual production, leadership and accuracy. Kizer had potential, Trubisky had potential and Mahome(who Baker beat out his freshman year at TT, by the way he beat out Davis Webb too) showed one good game. I'll take Mayfield. Great article...
I would run  
Thegratefulhead : 2/13/2018 10:13 am : link
I think Mayfield has "it" We are all fighting over QB prospects. You can't have a short QB, you can't have an inaccurate QB. You can't have injury history, you can't have a QB that ran a spread, USC QBs suck.....Blah Blah Blah. Everyone has found an exception to every rule. If OU executes a squib kick, Mayfield is probably a National Champion. He wins, he has an arm, he is accurate he has many college games started. I think he is the best of the bunch. Gettleman likes film. Mayfield has great film. I am hopeful but not optimistic.
.....  
est1986 : 2/13/2018 10:44 am : link
In comment 13830633 GeorgeAdams33 said:
Quote:
You know Baker Mayfield? Is he a relative? A good friend? I bet he refers to you by your first name too. That's so special. Bless your heart.




Or it痴 just a really lame burn...
Cody Kessler  
AcesUp : 2/13/2018 10:58 am : link
They clearly state that their grades are for the college game and admit that there isn't a direct correlation. That chart listing Kessler as 3rd, is just a starting point for the entire article. The whole point of it is breaking it down from there and separating what makes Mayfield an NFL QB. It's really elementary shit. If you're bringing up Kessler, either you're not reading it or not comprehending the point of the article.
If Baker is the guy ...  
Beer Man : 2/13/2018 11:24 am : link
The Giants could probably trade back a few slots and still pick him up.
RE: est1986  
Beer Man : 2/13/2018 11:32 am : link
In comment 13830633 GeorgeAdams33 said:
Quote:
You know Baker Mayfield? Is he a relative? A good friend? I bet he refers to you by your first name too. That's so special. Bless your heart.
Sounds like the name of a small town somewhere in rural America
RE: Cody Kessler  
Heisenberg : 2/13/2018 11:39 am : link
In comment 13830887 AcesUp said:
Quote:
They clearly state that their grades are for the college game and admit that there isn't a direct correlation. That chart listing Kessler as 3rd, is just a starting point for the entire article. The whole point of it is breaking it down from there and separating what makes Mayfield an NFL QB. It's really elementary shit. If you're bringing up Kessler, either you're not reading it or not comprehending the point of the article.


Look, I like the guy. But, the point is that Cody Kessler sucks and if there's a metric that you're using to be predictive of Mayfield's value then you should question what it gets wrong about Kessler.

The rest of the article rightly praises the things that are good about Mayfield.
RE: RE: Cody Kessler  
AcesUp : 2/13/2018 11:46 am : link
In comment 13831015 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
In comment 13830887 AcesUp said:


Quote:


They clearly state that their grades are for the college game and admit that there isn't a direct correlation. That chart listing Kessler as 3rd, is just a starting point for the entire article. The whole point of it is breaking it down from there and separating what makes Mayfield an NFL QB. It's really elementary shit. If you're bringing up Kessler, either you're not reading it or not comprehending the point of the article.



Look, I like the guy. But, the point is that Cody Kessler sucks and if there's a metric that you're using to be predictive of Mayfield's value then you should question what it gets wrong about Kessler.

The rest of the article rightly praises the things that are good about Mayfield.


They aren't using their grades as a predictive measure. Its not even what they are trying to argue, that metric is just exposition to set up the whole point of the article. Read it.
RE: If Baker is the guy ...  
chuckydee9 : 2/13/2018 12:15 pm : link
In comment 13830954 Beer Man said:
Quote:
The Giants could probably trade back a few slots and still pick him up.


If he is the guy then you don't risk it.. Take him rather than move to 5 and have someone move into 3rd spot to take him.. If any of the 1st round caliber QB is the one the giants like the best then use the 2nd on him.. no need to get fancy..
RE: RE: If Baker is the guy ...  
Beer Man : 2/13/2018 1:14 pm : link
In comment 13831091 chuckydee9 said:
Quote:
In comment 13830954 Beer Man said:


Quote:


The Giants could probably trade back a few slots and still pick him up.



If he is the guy then you don't risk it.. Take him rather than move to 5 and have someone move into 3rd spot to take him.. If any of the 1st round caliber QB is the one the giants like the best then use the 2nd on him.. no need to get fancy..
I just don't see anyone ranking Baker that high. I could be wrong.
Idk  
NikkiMac : 2/14/2018 6:23 am : link
This kid is Friday night lights and so is Webb ,Texas boys let痴 see how they do .
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