Really not sure how to feel about this. Of course, I hate hearing all these stories, especially as the father of a young woman about to head out into the cruel world of reality.
Brennan's column asks: Why aren't we talking about sexual harassment allegations that were levied against White against a former band mate.
I won't re-hash the column here. But I admit, while the #metoo movement is certainly warranted and likely long overdue, are there limits? Is White right to say, "Hey, I'm here to talk about the Olympics?" Or is it Brennan who has it - that White needs to answer for his sins, even after an historical Olympics win?
Curious to know what you folks think.
And on this Feast of Saint Valentine ... BBI? I love you.
Brennan's column - (
New Window )
Better?
But part of the reason allegations hold so much weight is because the media doesn't want to wait for due process and they want stories to happen NOW.
There's a time and place for everything. The press conference was there to celebrate White's achievement. It wasn't there to discuss what he had for breakfast, what kind of home he lives in, what his relationship is with his parents, or any allegations that have been levied against him.
if the reporter cared so much about it, why didn't she hunt him down and interview him about it before the Olympics.
Seems like she's trying more to make a name for herself by stirring up controversy than protect a "movement" or an alleged victim.
And, personally, I lose a little sympathy for victims who settle. Because that makes it seem like it's about money, not justice or truth.
Does a guy have to publicly address every stupid thing he has done just b/c a reporter asks?
But not at this event. The reporter who asked that question after the event was simply trying to be controversial and get attention - which he did.
The Olympic committee was correct to cut him off immediately.
Time and place for everything.
I'm here as well.
And photos online have them shown together, and her identified as White's girlfriend.
If this was such a concern the journalist in question should have brought it up in advance rather than wait until the moment she knew she would get the most hits. It’s frankly tabloid journalism at its core and has the unfortunate side effect of having people dismiss or diminish valid claims.
“Honestly, if there was anything … I didn’t mean any disrespect,” White said. “The flag that’s flying up on my house right now is definitely really high up there. Sorry about that. I’m really proud to represent Team USA.”
Agree. I was pretty shocked that he dragged the flag on the ground for so long. Its one thing to accidentally touch the ground for a second or two but he was literally holding one end of the flag at his hip and letting it drag along the snow and dirt. Not cool.
Ok, back on topic here. The timing of the questioning is in my minds eye bad and good, said in that order for a reason. Bad in that, is sensationalizing an issue is the only way to get our short attention span to focus on a topic that is truly rehensible?
Good in that, as a man I feel we need to step up to the plate and show some god damn respect for the women in our lives. If those reporters were truly outraged then why not start banging the drum in 2016?
Shaun White had an opportunity to step up to the plate and address his own shortcomings, he already admitted to sending pics, and he called it gossip.
Lastly, I am disgusted by how he treated our countries flag. My father went to war at 17 for what that flag stands for and to see it carelessly dragged around like a prop.... If it weren't dis-respectful I would use it to teach him a lesson.
I am 54 and I sound really old in this post, I guess I am. I'm not a grammar expert, if your focusing on that you've missed the point.
We've gotten to the point where we focus on minutia as if people who just saw a reward for years of hard work happening know everything about their surroundings.
Hell, I've think about the end of some Giants games. When we won the SuperBowl in 2011, I had a grown man jump into my arms and we hugged it out for like a minute. My family still talks about how Dad and "Mr. Chris" were crying and in the middle of the room looking like babies. If there was a flag near by, I have no idea what the status of it would've been.
Good Lord, people are just looking for something to jump on.
It was a bad move, he apologized - move on.
I think people need to view things from the lens of intent vs a strict code, that has evolved over the years. Clearly Shaun White draped himself in the flag out of a demonstration of patriotism, not to be disrespectful.
As I mentioned in another thread, in this current climate we live in where American Flags are being removed from college campuses or public places because they are deemed as hate speech, I view acts like what Shaun White did as beautiful not douchy or disrespectful (up until he dragged the flag which he apologized for).
My father is a Vietnam veteran, and my grandfather had 5 brothers (so 6 boys in all) they were all in WWII, the oldest was in WWI and WWII, so we have a strong military tradition in my family, I think they would have been proud of Shaun White. My father commented on the flag dragging, wished he would have been more careful with the flag, but had no issue with him overall and was proud of the performance.
Intent plays a big part for most veterans I'm close with or are in my family.
Others are entitled to their opinions.
Below, Jim Craig celebrating the Miracle on Ice:
I think people need to view things from the lens of intent vs a strict code, that has evolved over the years. Clearly Shaun White draped himself in the flag out of a demonstration of patriotism, not to be disrespectful.
As I mentioned in another thread, in this current climate we live in where American Flags are being removed from college campuses or public places because they are deemed as hate speech, I view acts like what Shaun White did as beautiful not douchy or disrespectful (up until he dragged the flag which he apologized for).
My father is a Vietnam veteran, and my grandfather had 5 brothers (so 6 boys in all) they were all in WWII, the oldest was in WWI and WWII, so we have a strong military tradition in my family, I think they would have been proud of Shaun White. My father commented on the flag dragging, wished he would have been more careful with the flag, but had no issue with him overall and was proud of the performance.
Intent plays a big part for most veterans I'm close with or are in my family.
Others are entitled to their opinions.
Below, Jim Craig celebrating the Miracle on Ice:
+1
LOL, nice job, well the actual picture of Jim Craig is out there.
and on this trading card
But people were too busy celebrating to care.
But I guess this is what gets clicks these days.
so what exactly is the point of bringing it up now, and during the Olympics no less, other than to feed a narrative that has a lot of attention on it right now (mostly justified)?
To be clear, I am not trying to minimize the reality of this and there are many really lousy individuals whose behaviour deserved a spotlight... but as usual... people have gone too far and are trying to lump everything - no matter how minor (never mind if it is actually true) - into this same bucket.
which means you have Shaun White being painted with the same brush as Weinstein and his ilk.
MASSIVE coverup.
Despicable and disgusting.
Win at ALL costs.
US should have been banned for the same exact reason Penn State was.
I say that as an absolute lover of Winter Olympics, and it crushes me to say that. But I stand by it.
If we start going on moral grounds for Olympic committees, then you aren't going to have any teams left to compete, especially if you extend to corruption, bribery and coverups.
Russia was banned for sponsoring the enhancement of athletes.
Weinstein/Cosby... These guys aren't even jail.
I can't think of an example where mere allegations took someone down. The punishments haven't been harsh enough for those with lists of accusers.
If we start going on moral grounds for Olympic committees, then you aren't going to have any teams left to compete, especially if you extend to corruption, bribery and coverups.
Russia was banned for sponsoring the enhancement of athletes.
So Penn State shouldn't have been suspended then, I take it?
If there's a tie-in to the USOC funneling girls to be molested or intentionally molesting them to gain an advantage, the book would be thrown at them.
I don't think you are separating a scandal perpetrated by one man to an entire Olympic body sponsoring cheating.
And we are talking about some of the most corrupt organizations in the World. Ones that routinely play favortism in return for bribes and who commit a lot of transgressions in many areas.
Weinstein/Cosby... These guys aren't even jail.
I can't think of an example where mere allegations took someone down. The punishments haven't been harsh enough for those with lists of accusers.
I'm not saying what is deserved and what isn't but how can you say Harvey Weinstein's career isn't over? I hope it is.
He's not in jail (for now), but he's been fired from his company, his wife left him, he's the subject of multiple criminal investigations, and he's a pariah. And a lot of these claims have statutes of limitations unfortunately.
But I consider these careers all ruined, maybe not permanently, but ruined for now at least. And again, maybe it's deserved and some of them have admitted to the acts, but others ruined based on allegations (credible, but what can't be credible?)
Matt Lauer
Bill O'reilly
Steve Wynn
Al Franken
Kevin Spacey
Peter Martins
Jerry Richardson
Danny Masterson
Charlie Rose
Russell Simmons
Louis CK
Roy Moore
Jeremy Piven
Dozens of women accused Weinstein. His response was almost an admission.
Louis CK confessed.
Aziz Ansari was a single allegation of douchey behavior (I don't think sexual assault) and nothing seemed to happen to him. If that post took him down, I'd understand the point.
Most of the guys had dozens of people accusing them. Some confessed, some settled. I don't think those are examples that lead one to being concerned over whether justice is being done too quickly.
Having said that, I've never been that keen on the athletes being draped in the flag. I really am glad that they represent us and I do want to acknowledge that, but the formality of flag etiquette is so contradictory to the display.
Dozens of women accused Weinstein. His response was almost an admission.
Louis CK confessed.
Aziz Ansari was a single allegation of douchey behavior (I don't think sexual assault) and nothing seemed to happen to him. If that post took him down, I'd understand the point.
Most of the guys had dozens of people accusing them. Some confessed, some settled. I don't think those are examples that lead one to being concerned over whether justice is being done too quickly.
I'm not saying justice is being done too quickly, but allegations can certainly hurt, people like Ryan Seacrest, Michael Douglas, and others have been accused, but maintained their innocence.
None of us knows what's true or false, but I believe due process should be the norm, yet somehow we still need an environment where women (or male victims) seem safe and empowered to come forward.
The problem is it's almost impossible to prove you didn't do something. So many of these allegations will come down to he said she said.
But someone like Bill O'Reilly... I'm guessing his audience isn't gonna give much of a shit.
True acts of racism and sexual assault are an abomination and should be dealt with quickly and harshly. Unfortunately, in today's culture, they flourish and hide behind the kind of stupidity that throws the label without thought... The court of public opinion flourishes on social media. The judge and jury rule before the facts are known.
and on cue, the msn website is all over the "Shaun White Scandal"... with opinion pieces about his legacy being tarnished and apologies, etc..
Another pelt on the wall for the perpetually aggrieved.
Plus he.launched his helmet and goggles then got bent when the viewers didn't send them.right back.idiot.
I was there at the beginning..of the sport.. and ...Mr. White...he should move over and let the kids rule snowboarding.
- It's a youth thing. Retire.
All that said. Frigging over the moon for the success of Chloe Kim. She is the best..... in the world!
And Red whatshisname as well. Great! 5'5" 114...and best in the world!
so what exactly is the point of bringing it up now, and during the Olympics no less, other than to feed a narrative that has a lot of attention on it right now (mostly justified)?
To be clear, I am not trying to minimize the reality of this and there are many really lousy individuals whose behaviour deserved a spotlight... but as usual... people have gone too far and are trying to lump everything - no matter how minor (never mind if it is actually true) - into this same bucket.
which means you have Shaun White being painted with the same brush as Weinstein and his ilk.
The article isn't conflating White's behavior with Weinstein, you are. What make you say that the scrutiny has gone too far in this case? And why should White, probably the most famous winter olympian/athlete in the world, be above having his private behavior with women examined?
Quote:
what Sean White apparently did was juvenile, dumb and in poor taste. and is also seemingly over.
so what exactly is the point of bringing it up now, and during the Olympics no less, other than to feed a narrative that has a lot of attention on it right now (mostly justified)?
To be clear, I am not trying to minimize the reality of this and there are many really lousy individuals whose behaviour deserved a spotlight... but as usual... people have gone too far and are trying to lump everything - no matter how minor (never mind if it is actually true) - into this same bucket.
which means you have Shaun White being painted with the same brush as Weinstein and his ilk.
The article isn't conflating White's behavior with Weinstein, you are. What make you say that the scrutiny has gone too far in this case? And why should White, probably the most famous winter olympian/athlete in the world, be above having his private behavior with women examined?
Quote:
In comment 13832142 LG in NYC said:
Quote:
what Sean White apparently did was juvenile, dumb and in poor taste. and is also seemingly over.
so what exactly is the point of bringing it up now, and during the Olympics no less, other than to feed a narrative that has a lot of attention on it right now (mostly justified)?
To be clear, I am not trying to minimize the reality of this and there are many really lousy individuals whose behaviour deserved a spotlight... but as usual... people have gone too far and are trying to lump everything - no matter how minor (never mind if it is actually true) - into this same bucket.
which means you have Shaun White being painted with the same brush as Weinstein and his ilk.
The article isn't conflating White's behavior with Weinstein, you are. What make you say that the scrutiny has gone too far in this case? And why should White, probably the most famous winter olympian/athlete in the world, be above having his private behavior with women examined?
or you and yours for that matter
1) I don't make my money being famous and endorsing products.
2) I'm fine with my past with women being scrutinized.
I thought that was somewhat old news. If so, he's in trouble now for dismissing it so quickly as "gossip". He should have a serious standard response for that type of question, it was an emotional moment for him, but he didn't handle it well.
How hard would it have been for him to say. You know, that is a serious question. I am not a perfect person, but I like to think I learned from my mistakes as I've grown up. Right now, I'd like to celebrate my gold medal, but I'd be happy to talk to the press about this, and the more important issue of the empowerment of women
The #metoo movement is not an over reaction, it is long overdue. If you are making unwanted sexual advances or otherwise treating women with no respect, you have no sympathy from me.