So I've been trying to avoid mocks as much as possible this year, especially since it just seems that as every year goes by, there's more and more speculation and shit thrown at the wall. Last year, our own ESPN reporter listed 15 names and our pick at 23 wasn't even on it!
At any rate, most of the "football people" for whatever that means, have Josh Rosen as the pick for the Giants.
Giants hiring Shurmur as HC, Shula as OC, would make it seem that they are lining up their staff to maximize the QB position and if that's the case, a guy like Rosen would be the perfect choice. If he can throw and play the way that he does already at UCLA with minimal pro coaching and pretty awful weapons at his disposal, imagine what this guy can do with a HC like Shurmur and QB coach/OC like Shula added to the mix? Rosen seems like he was born to play QB and perhaps Shurmur's teaching style/demeanor would be great for him.
It seems that the "character" and concussion stuff is more important to BBIers than the media - but I have a feeling Giants will do more than their due diligence to vet this kid. Speaking of mocks, he's my pick for us in round 1, and I'm starting to come around on "Rosen no matter what" type of thinking - even if Darnold is on the board.
so if we can trade down and stay in the top 7 and add a high 2nd rd pick and a 1st next year I think its the move to make.
Ideal situation is Jets trade to 3, then Denver overpays to jump them
Jon - what's your take on Rosen? Know you're a Darnold guy, but what is it about Rosen you don't like?
Perhaps he's a 21 year old kid from an affluent background who needs to become more mature and self-aware. As a passer he certainly looks the part and it's alluring, but he doesn't ooze the it factor like Darnold.
If the Browns surprise and take neither, then the Giants choose Darnold.
It is probably unlikely, but shula has been part of an offense where the strength is in running with backs and the QB with success. Shurmur too.
But as you said, mocks simply don't matter. The only mock I take credence in, is Mayock's right before the draft, and we are a long, long ways away from that.
With that being said, If we do end up taking a QB. Rosen is the one I want. I don't watch College Football, but I just happened to catch the UCLA vs Texas AM game and I will never forget it. Being down 44-10 and coming all the way back to win it is something special. Granted he didn't do it all himself, but most QBs would have packed it in by then. You can't teach spirit and heart, and the one thing i've always loved about Eli is he has heart and will always try to win.
see for yourself
Rosen leads comeback over Texas - ( New Window )
This^^^^
For the 100th time.
If that is the case then the Giants should bring back both Reese and Ross.
Lets say you are on Eagles staff in 2012 with3rd draft pick Nick Foles. You watch him and think this guy is a Future Super Bowl winning QB.
You start him and he goes out and tbrows 27 TD and 2 Int. Now you think you have a franchise QB here.
Over his next 3 years Foles throws 23 TD to 20 INT and is on 2 teams and can only get a backup job.
Within that time he takes some peoples jobs who thought he was something. Now everyone thinks he is a bust and a journeyman backup
Finally this backup gets his chance with an injury on the 1 seed and goes on to have a monster playoff run and win SB MVP
No one who originally thought this ever could have survived their jobs to see it happen and it maybe never happens if they stuck by Foles and dont draft Wentz
The moral of the story is - how can anyone be CONVINCED. Webb hasnt even played. He could anyone be convinced? Even if he goes out and has 27 TD to 2 INT - how do you know he wont tbrow out 3 clunker seasons that you have to cut him and he becomes a journeyman backup in search of a nig break?
Foles is a Super Bowl winning QB now. Is he franchise QB though? We still dont know that.
Exactly, and then you throw in a new GM and coach into the equation, usually means they are going to want their own players.
Lets say you are on Eagles staff in 2012 with3rd draft pick Nick Foles. You watch him and think this guy is a Future Super Bowl winning QB.
You start him and he goes out and tbrows 27 TD and 2 Int. Now you think you have a franchise QB here.
Over his next 3 years Foles throws 23 TD to 20 INT and is on 2 teams and can only get a backup job.
Within that time he takes some peoples jobs who thought he was something. Now everyone thinks he is a bust and a journeyman backup
Finally this backup gets his chance with an injury on the 1 seed and goes on to have a monster playoff run and win SB MVP
No one who originally thought this ever could have survived their jobs to see it happen and it maybe never happens if they stuck by Foles and dont draft Wentz
The moral of the story is - how can anyone be CONVINCED. Webb hasnt even played. He could anyone be convinced? Even if he goes out and has 27 TD to 2 INT - how do you know he wont tbrow out 3 clunker seasons that you have to cut him and he becomes a journeyman backup in search of a nig break?
Foles is a Super Bowl winning QB now. Is he franchise QB though? We still dont know that.
More stupidity from you huh?
Nick Foles had an extraordinary 2 games as a QB this year. NFCCG and SB. Thats it. The question was asked before, but if the Browns offered both their top 5 picks to the Eagles for Wentz in a QB rich draft the Eagles would almost definitely say no.
Foles has been a disaster even for KC where he couldnt even beat out Alex Smith. His own OC didnt think of him enough to even question Wentz as astarter. He was abyssmal for 3 starts and good for 3.
You really want to use Foles as your evidence of quality in 3rd round pick QBs?
Youre the worst.
I'd love to see that happen. It's not even that I'm entirely confident it will make us a winning team. I just think it would be entertaining as hell.
It is probably unlikely, but shula has been part of an offense where the strength is in running with backs and the QB with success. Shurmur too.
Agreed, but where we differ is that I don't think any of the "big three" QBs are worth the #2 pick. Maybe Darnold, but I'm frankly not enamored with him either, and would certainly entertain offers to trade down.
Matt Waldman's argument against the anti-Rosen narrative - ( New Window )
Me too. We can only hope that, if Rosen is the pick, the Giants looked at this issue thoroughly and intelligently and made the right decision.
Perhaps he's a 21 year old kid from an affluent background who needs to become more mature and self-aware. As a passer he certainly looks the part and it's alluring, but he doesn't ooze the it factor like Darnold.
Jon what are your pre-combine thoughts on Allen?