With Treadwell stuck behind Adam Thielen, Stefon Diggs and Jarius Wright, Vikings are reported to be shopping their 2016 first round pick Laquon Treadwell.
He's still only 22 years old and if he can be gotten for a reasonable middle round pick, Pat Shurmur would have a solid young compliment to Odell, Engram and Shepard.
Thoughts?
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
I was with you on Randle - I thought he'd be Manningham 2.0. He had some redeeming qualities, but the behind the ears part is where he was severely lacking. Extremely low football IQ.
I did really like Mike Thomas a lot and wondered why he dipped behind some of the other prospects. He seemed to be the most complete of the bunch and checked most of the boxes.
In any event - just busting your chops, I enjoy reading your posts.
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In comment 13832263
allstarjim said:
I appreciate your insight.
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But about the only people knocking on this board was kwall and I. I can tell you he's not worth a day 2 pick. A 2nd or 3rd round pick for a guy that to this point has been a complete bust? No way Gettleman is doing that.
A lot of people on this board thought he would be a dominant receiver, just saying.
Jim, who do you like in this years draft?
Also, who do you not like?
You seem to know your stuff.
I'm not going out on a limb here at all, but I've had a very strong opinion on Saquon Barkley. I do think he's in the high, high end tier of RBs out of the last 20-30 years...Barry Sanders, LaDainian Tomlinson, and Marshall Faulk type of tier.
I also like Darnold a lot. Best combination of safe floor and upside at QB in this draft. My one hang up with him is if he has enough of a burning desire to win. I think he's at least a very good competitor, but I just want to see a guy that is a no-holds-barred, refuse to lose competitor.
I haven't yet had time to do full study or research on a lot of these guys yet, but if I were GM of the Giants, my board in the first round would be Darnold, then Barkley. Josh Allen has a chance to sneak in there depending on how combine and workouts go. I think all the tools are there...I think from a physical standpoint, he reminds me of Elway.
Guys on my like list for a little later in the draft:
Will Hernandez, OG, UTEP
Darius Leonard, LB, S Carolina State
Rashaad Penny, RB, San Diego State
Deon Cain, WR, Clemson
Cedric Wilson, WR, Boise State (going to be a good value pick for someone)
And although I don't have a fully fleshed out opinion of him yet, I am intrigued by Joseph Noteboom from TCU. Again this would be later in the draft.
I'm not really looking at DT because Giants really need to address OL here, but Derrick Nnadi from FSU...he has a chance to go late in the first, but more probably a 2nd rounder. I think he's going to be very, very good at the next level.
Sony Michel I'm high on. Going to be a great RB but don't think he'll end up on the Giants because he's either a late first, or we go OL at the top of the 2nd and he'll be gone by the third.
Guys I don't like:
Josh Rosen. I just don't see the 'it' factor. Everyone is talking about the injuries and concussions but honestly those reasons are pretty low on my list. I don't think he has a good makeup for QB in the NFL. I think he's a great competitor, and I have questions about his arm strength, his deep accuracy, his accuracy on the move, and although people keep telling me he played behind a terrible OL, every time I watch him, especially on his good plays, he is operating the vast majority from a clean pocket. I think mobility is an underrated attribute in the modern NFL, and he has the least of it out of the top QBs. We are getting bigger, faster, and better pass rushers in the NFL every year, and the quality OL coming from college are very scarce, and most are not prepared for the NFL.
For that reason, I think it's important to draft a QB that makes plays when protections break down, a guy who can make things happen with his legs, get outside and extend the play and still throw an accurate ball, all of which are weaknesses of Rosen's and strengths of Darnold's and Mayfield's. As for Allen, he can move and extend the play, we'll see on the accuracy, he's still developing, but he's one of the best at making plays with his legs and he has the biggest arm.
I also don't like Lamar Jackson. He can't make all the throws an NFL QB needs to make, and deep ball accuracy is terrible. Really bad. He's really good at passes in the middle of the field, between the numbers. Throwing outside in the intermediate range or deep, no bueno.
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In comment 13832276 arcarsenal said:
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
I was with you on Randle - I thought he'd be Manningham 2.0. He had some redeeming qualities, but the behind the ears part is where he was severely lacking. Extremely low football IQ.
I did really like Mike Thomas a lot and wondered why he dipped behind some of the other prospects. He seemed to be the most complete of the bunch and checked most of the boxes.
In any event - just busting your chops, I enjoy reading your posts.
Thanks arc, likewise.
So, he's not even cheap, and only under contract for 2 years.
Treadwell dealt with the after-effects of a broken fibula suffered at Ole Miss, one he had to push through in the pre-draft process to the point it never healed right. He also suffered a broken finger, pulled hamstring, and late-season ankle issue as a rookie.
Injuries derailed his combine numbers and rookie season. Although not sure what caused his lack of production in his season season, especially with Diggs missing a couple of games which Treadwell wasn't able to capitalize on that opportunity.
Here are also some comments from Shurmur on Treadwell...
"He came back and he was really on point with what he’s supposed to be doing mentally," Shurmur said. "He’s been out here competing and doing a nice job running routes and catching the ball." The comments came after a practice in which Treadwell ran with the first-team offense. -5/25/17
I'm not spiking the football here, and this is still a bit premature, but both KWALL and I were the loudest voices saying to stay away from him in the draft. We were both ridiculed and called morons and such, of course.
I do remember that, for the record. I seem to somehow have a pretty good memory of people calling other people morons for ridiculous reasons.
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I'm not spiking the football here, and this is still a bit premature, but both KWALL and I were the loudest voices saying to stay away from him in the draft. We were both ridiculed and called morons and such, of course.
I do remember that, for the record. I seem to somehow have a pretty good memory of people calling other people morons for ridiculous reasons.
Thankfully it's a kinder, gentler BBI now.
Third year junior. Some questioned his career after a broken fibula and dislocated ankle late in 2014. However Treadwell showed a tremendous drive and work ethic to fight his way back for an SEC leading 1,153 yards and 11 TD campaign. Treadwell has elite-level ball skills and strength for the position. He is a reliable target to throw to no matter where he on the field. He does things with and without the ball that impact the game from start to finish. Treadwell may still be bouncing back from his injury, as he’s been quoted saying he doesn’t quite trust his quick twitch yet. He is an immediate contributor in the NFL that has the drive to be great.
*Now I know there is a lot of negative talk about the poor 40 time and overall workout. I actually did decrease his grade a bit as a result. But I think he still is the top WR in the draft. He is a classic example of playing “faster than he times” and to be honest, speed isn’t what he’s built on. He can out-physical anyone and won’t need the room that some others do. You don’t lead the SEC in receiving and TDs without very good athletic ability. My Dez Bryant without the attitude comparison still exists.
I wonder what Shurmur currently thinks of him? Fair to say his opinion is low if he doesn’t make a move for him ecspecially if Minny ends up selling for cheap.. I liked him a lot at Ole Miss myself
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1 – LAQUON TREADWELL – 6’2/221 – OLE MISS: 83
Third year junior. Some questioned his career after a broken fibula and dislocated ankle late in 2014. However Treadwell showed a tremendous drive and work ethic to fight his way back for an SEC leading 1,153 yards and 11 TD campaign. Treadwell has elite-level ball skills and strength for the position. He is a reliable target to throw to no matter where he on the field. He does things with and without the ball that impact the game from start to finish. Treadwell may still be bouncing back from his injury, as he’s been quoted saying he doesn’t quite trust his quick twitch yet. He is an immediate contributor in the NFL that has the drive to be great.
*Now I know there is a lot of negative talk about the poor 40 time and overall workout. I actually did decrease his grade a bit as a result. But I think he still is the top WR in the draft. He is a classic example of playing “faster than he times” and to be honest, speed isn’t what he’s built on. He can out-physical anyone and won’t need the room that some others do. You don’t lead the SEC in receiving and TDs without very good athletic ability. My Dez Bryant without the attitude comparison still exists.
I wonder what Shurmur currently thinks of him? Fair to say his opinion is low if he doesn’t make a move for him ecspecially if Minny ends up selling for cheap.. I liked him a lot at Ole Miss myself
Sy did like him, comped him as another Dez Bryant. Sy also was high on Myles Jack, and that would have been an awesome pick if he would've gotten to our spot at 40. Sy is awesome at what he does, we all win some and lose some. Sy wins more than he loses. I also really liked Braxton Miller in that draft. I thought him in the 3rd was going to be a steal. Miller I think still has a chance. He's had a couple of productive games but now he's behind Hopkins and Fuller.
Another guy I really liked in the third round of that draft was Nick Vannett. I've been following him in Seattle, and he is going to be a good player. Every time I've seen him get on the field he looks real good. When Jimmy Graham moves on, I think Vannett is going to be a more well-known name at tight end.
The damn Titans had to jump ahead of us for Conklin in the first in that draft. What could've been.
ghost718 : 12:14 pm : link : reply
I'd trade Apple for an Ahmad Rashad rookie card
It would have to be a Bobby Moore rookie card!!
What do you want to give up for that?
What do you want to give up for that?
sounds like Reuben Randle redux
ugh
Hard pass
I also thought Aaron Gibson was going to be the best OL in the draft and thought Petigout was a stiff.
Very funny. Hadn't laughed like that at a YouTube video since I saw the Roy Hibbert Trash Can video.
Very funny. Hadn't laughed like that at a YouTube video since I saw the Roy Hibbert Trash Can video.
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
Did you used to have a different handle?
Nope, I just enjoy the draft. I like the research, the process, and just talking about it and debating the prospects. I've also been doing this a long time on BBI, so not new at all. And not a guru, it's just a fun thing during the offseason.
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In comment 13832276 arcarsenal said:
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
Did you used to have a different handle?
Nope. This is my original.
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Josh Allen has a chance to sneak in there depending on how combine and workouts go. I think all the tools are there...I think from a physical standpoint, he reminds me of Elway.
I don't expect a lot of people to agree with me, but from a physical standpoint, he's the perfect QB. We just have to see more. I'm in the camp that he had a lot going against him playing in that program and with a team that was not going to allow him to put up great numbers.
Don't mind if others feel differently about him, because my opinion of him isn't fully formed or informed yet.
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In comment 13832308 allstarjim said:
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In comment 13832276 arcarsenal said:
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
Did you used to have a different handle?
Nope. This is my original.
No offense but I have been around this site since it was Pete's Corner as a lurker before registering and I don't ever remember you being a big time draft pundit
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In comment 13832765 ThatLimerickGuy said:
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In comment 13832308 allstarjim said:
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In comment 13832276 arcarsenal said:
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Damn, Jim... don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back like this! :P
I was definitely wrong about Treadwell.. I soured on him a bit before the draft, though. I was higher on him a few months before it but then started to think the concerns were legit and wasn't as thrilled with the prospect of drafting him.
Will definitely not be the first prospect I'm wrong about - that's for sure.
Haha, arc. I have my share of misses. All of us that love this stuff do. Years ago I embarrassed myself trying to tell Sy that Bjoern Werner was going to be a great player in the NFL. Ouch.
I also was pounding the table for Rueben Randle in the 2nd round, and was ELATED when the Giants drafted him. In fairness, he did provide what I thought we would get with him...a good deep threat compliment on the outside. It's just...that's ALL he could do, and if you asked him to do anything else it led to INTs! LOL.
But, I was pissed when Reese picked Darian Thompson over Justin Simmons in the 3rd round. Sy also preferred Simmons, and that was a big mistake on Reese's part. Simmons is really playing well in Denver. And, I REALLY wanted Michael Thomas in the 2nd round of that draft. I thought he had a chance to be the best WR in the draft, and so far, it looks like he is. I like Shepard, but imagine OBJ and Thomas on the outside. The reasoning for me was it's easier to find a slot receiver than a dominant outside WR threat.
Did you used to have a different handle?
Nope. This is my original.
No offense but I have been around this site since it was Pete's Corner as a lurker before registering and I don't ever remember you being a big time draft pundit
None taken. I've been here though and have talked about the draft a lot in some years. There have been others where I might not have contributed as much to the discussion because of posting on another Giants community and real life. I just enjoy the conversation and everything about the draft. I'm not calling myself a pundit. I think I'm more informed than the average fan because I study the prospects a lot more and I consume a lot of information from bowl season to the draft. But you can search the archives on Treadwell, you'll find me and KWALL saying avoid.
I specifically said I wouldn't even have taken him at 40 and probably not at the third round pick, either.
Thank you for all of the great insight. What's your take on Mayfield ?
I think he is going to succeed. None of the character stuff bothers me. I will tell you this, I hope Darnold has Mayfield's competitive fire. Mayfield is not lacking in that respect and that will serve him well.
Giant history flat out sucks after the 2nd round, these last 9 seasons.....
Yes, we have new blood making decisions, but until they are made, we have no idea how good they will be until several seasons down the road....
Anyone thinking you are going to get a third year player, a former first round pick, for a 6th round pick, is nuts....
Giant history flat out sucks after the 2nd round, these last 9 seasons.....
Yes, we have new blood making decisions, but until they are made, we have no idea how good they will be until several seasons down the road....
Anyone thinking you are going to get a third year player, a former first round pick, for a 6th round pick, is nuts....
A complete bust with a cap hit of $2.9 million, and a dead cap hit of $5.9 million? I'm not giving up a 6th rounder, I'd wait for him to be cut, because that is what I bet happens to him.