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NFT: Heritage DNA test Question

MTN-G-man : 2/15/2018 9:49 pm
I just got my DNA results back and although my Dad was 100% Irish, it shows that I'm 52% English and 32% Irish. This doesn't make sense to me. Shouldn't the percent of Irish be much higher?
Does your postman like tea and crumpets?  
Bill L : 2/15/2018 9:50 pm : link
.
No  
MTN-G-man : 2/15/2018 9:53 pm : link
but he whistles "When Irish Eyes are Smiling"
I don’t know this one  
Bill L : 2/15/2018 10:02 pm : link
But I’m surprised they market their precision that highly. I saw reports from other countries where they’re much broader (e.g., Western Europe, Baltic, Eastern Asia, etc). I believe they’re mainly measuring prevalence of small sequences against a database and doing some sort of statistical correlation. It wouldn’t be shocking, considering how close the countries, intermingling and cross-migration that there would be some blending that would obfuscate that type of discrimination.
Yes  
MTN-G-man : 2/15/2018 10:13 pm : link
I guess there is a strong possibility that is what I'm dealing with. Thanks Bill
_________  
I am Ninja : 2/15/2018 11:06 pm : link
Could your fa being 100% irish be a false premise?
The Irish are a genetically heterogeneous population ...  
DonQuixote : 2/15/2018 11:10 pm : link
Even if you go back lots of generations within Ireland, genomes are a mixture of ancestry from England and Scandinavia ...
Why would you send your DNA to the internet?  
Gary from The East End : Admin : 2/16/2018 12:58 am : link
The Illuminati are building a robot replacement for you as we speak.
Well here's the thing...  
Zepp : 2/16/2018 4:21 am : link
Maybe your dad isn't 100% Irish. Living on that island its not hard to imagine that somewhere along the line your Irish ancestors mixed with the English.
RE: Well here's the thing...  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 6:54 am : link
In comment 13834154 Zepp said:
Quote:
Maybe your dad isn't 100% Irish. Living on that island its not hard to imagine that somewhere along the line your Irish ancestors mixed with the English.
Everyone would have. Which is why I find it hard to believe that the test itself can distinguish between them.
DNA Tests / Perspective  
varco : 2/16/2018 7:01 am : link
Given the migration of people over the many centuries, I don't believe there is anyone who can claim to be 100% of any ethnic group. By the common thinking, both my wife and I have "100%" ethnic backgrounds but when each of us had our DNA tested, we found out that we are both much more diverse than originally thought. Given the geographic location of our most recent ancestors, one can easily see that migrations, invasions, etc. brought a number of populations into contact with each other (with predictable "results"). For us, the big reveal was that, given the diversity of backgrounds in all of us, it makes literally no sense at all to be prejudiced against other ethnic groups, since, in my estimation, ethnic "purity" is pretty much a myth. In that respect, DNA testing is worthwhile and was an "eye opener". Maybe there would have been fewer wars and atrocities committed over the years had there been an awareness of how intermingled we all are. I'm far from being a PC person but the receipt of DNA testing results showing background diversity should be a cause for celebration.
You also didn't say where  
section125 : 2/16/2018 7:02 am : link
your mother is from. You are 1/2 of each.
RE: You also didn't say where  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 7:16 am : link
In comment 13834185 section125 said:
Quote:
your mother is from. You are 1/2 of each.
Yeah but his point was that if his dad was 100% Irish, then he should be at least 50% Irish himself. Since the results say he's a third Irish then his mother is irrelevant to the question. But really, it's a combination of ethnic mixing and a lack of discrimination in the test.

As an aside, the commercials for some of these tests bug the hell out of me..."I found out that I am 60% Italian; now I know why I like pasta so much", etc. I know it's only marketing but they actually imply cause and effect to a high degree. It's plain stupid.

The ethnicity tests are harmless and useful just for grins. Like a party trick. But a lot of these companies are expanding into pseudo-health science and, the gullible may make poor, or at least premature, lifestyle, dietary, or health choices based on statistical possibilities related to a specific genetic trait they carry. That can be down-right dangerous. And none of these tests, AFAIK, come with an FDA imprimatur.
TL; DR  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 7:19 am : link
for the non-ancestory tests, the smart consumer will walk away, IMO.
Do you look Irish and resemble your dad? That's should be enough.  
Marty in Albany : 2/16/2018 8:58 am : link
.
I was impressed. Mine turned out accurate, more than I knew.  
x meadowlander : 2/16/2018 9:21 am : link
My Mom is 100% Italian, so I was surprised when mine came back 34% Italian. There was 15% Iberian Peninsula. I found that odd. Spain? Portugal? WTF?

Mom told relatives in Sorrento, and they informed her that many generations ago, part of the family had in fact emigrated from Spain to Italy.

So, Kudo's to Ancestry.

They also nailed my Latvian and Irish/Scottish/British roots from my Dad's side.

My wife did better - connections through ancestry pointed her to information - turns out she has roots to the first Dutch landing in NYC - the New Amsterdam, and one line that apparently goes back to the Mayflower, which she's researching.

Amazing stuff.
My understanding is that these companies  
hocuspocus : 2/16/2018 9:21 am : link
use algorithms as part of determining percentages, so it may not be completely accurate.

I have the same issue as to what I "thought" I should be. My great-grandparents were both Italian (and came to the US from Italy). Therefore, my grandfather should be 100% Italian, my dad 50% and me 25%. I had my DNA tested and I came back only 17% Italian. Since my dad is deceased, my uncle is considering being tested. I'm curious to see what percentage he gets.
RE: I was impressed. Mine turned out accurate, more than I knew.  
hocuspocus : 2/16/2018 9:26 am : link
In comment 13834308 x meadowlander said:
Quote:
My Mom is 100% Italian, so I was surprised when mine came back 34% Italian. There was 15% Iberian Peninsula. I found that odd. Spain? Portugal? WTF?

Mom told relatives in Sorrento, and they informed her that many generations ago, part of the family had in fact emigrated from Spain to Italy.

So, Kudo's to Ancestry.

They also nailed my Latvian and Irish/Scottish/British roots from my Dad's side.

My wife did better - connections through ancestry pointed her to information - turns out she has roots to the first Dutch landing in NYC - the New Amsterdam, and one line that apparently goes back to the Mayflower, which she's researching.

Amazing stuff.


Interesting. Mine also came back with Iberian Peninsula (about 5%). I couldn't figure out why. Your explanation makes sense and may account for my situation as well.

I also tested 5% Scandinavian, which I had zero idea about. After researching it a bit, I found the ancestors who connected me to that (also some of the first settlers of Ulster County, New York). It would have taken me a long time to figure that out if not for the DNA test.
RE: RE: You also didn't say where  
section125 : 2/16/2018 9:33 am : link
In comment 13834192 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 13834185 section125 said:


Quote:


your mother is from. You are 1/2 of each.

Yeah but his point was that if his dad was 100% Irish, then he should be at least 50% Irish himself. Since the results say he's a third Irish then his mother is irrelevant to the question. But really, it's a combination of ethnic mixing and a lack of discrimination in the test.


Good point, you are right. It was the 52% English is what I was thinking of. But it is true, Ireland is a country that was overrun by a few European entities - the Vikings raised some hell there.

Ireland also has the Spanish background (so called Black Irish) survivors of the Spanish Armada destroyed in 1588(iirc) - the folks with dark hair and skin tones.
RE: I don’t know this one  
Section331 : 2/16/2018 10:18 am : link
In comment 13834080 Bill L said:
Quote:
But I’m surprised they market their precision that highly. I saw reports from other countries where they’re much broader (e.g., Western Europe, Baltic, Eastern Asia, etc). I believe they’re mainly measuring prevalence of small sequences against a database and doing some sort of statistical correlation. It wouldn’t be shocking, considering how close the countries, intermingling and cross-migration that there would be some blending that would obfuscate that type of discrimination.


Exactly right. I did a test with 23 and Me, and it’s results were regional, rather than national. I know Ancestry.com has nation-specific results, but it’s fair to question how accurate they are.
My wife got one of these kits for me last birthday.  
Beezer : 2/16/2018 10:25 am : link
Cool stuff.

The results showed to be relatively what I had thought/been told.

Whole bunch of Scottish. Some Belgian. The rest mostly a conglomeration of Viking.

My wife's was a little more surprising, although not all that out of the realm of believability. All sorts of travelers came together to form most Ricans, so ...

... cool stuff.
I did ancestry and mine is closer to  
cjd2404 : 2/16/2018 10:37 am : link
the family verbal record. My kids are all over the place though.

The best way it was all explained to me was, as an example. Take a deck of cards where you can mentally separate them to approximate your verbal history. ie all black cards are your father, the hearts are German and the diamonds are Spanish (just making it up)

Shuffle the deck and deal half of that deck to you. There is no guarantee that you get the 50% you expect. Give that deck to a sibling and theirs could be fairly different than yours.

RE: Why would you send your DNA to the internet?  
Motley Two : 2/16/2018 10:40 am : link
In comment 13834143 Gary from The East End said:
Quote:
The Illuminati are building a robot replacement for you as we speak.


Come on man. Post the Bill Burr clip.
2% Portuguese!  
Motley Two : 2/16/2018 10:42 am : link
I knew I liked peppers too much!
Link - ( New Window )
Always wondered what happens to families  
Bubba : 2/16/2018 11:21 am : link
that are very into their heritage then find out they are something else. A woman I work with is Polish and celebrates every Polish festival and events. The holidays are always celebrated based on her Polish heritage etc. A few weeks back she mentioned her daughter wanted to do a DNA test to trace her heritage. I asked her what would happen if you find out your actually Italian? She got a terrified look on her face and I thought was going to cry.
As a general rule, people are dumb  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 11:31 am : link
if you're celebrating a heritage, presumably you have some reason to do so. Some letters on a card, based on some spit (hopefully your own) plugged into an algorithm shouldn't make you stop being what you believe yourself to be.
RE: Always wondered what happens to families  
x meadowlander : 2/16/2018 12:28 pm : link
In comment 13834483 Bubba said:
Quote:
that are very into their heritage then find out they are something else. A woman I work with is Polish and celebrates every Polish festival and events. The holidays are always celebrated based on her Polish heritage etc. A few weeks back she mentioned her daughter wanted to do a DNA test to trace her heritage. I asked her what would happen if you find out your actually Italian? She got a terrified look on her face and I thought was going to cry.
My wife's Maternal Grandmother handed down the story that they were native American. There were native American names sprinkled throughout that wing of the family, and I thought some of the noses certainly bore a resemblance.

Wrong - 100% wrong. Wife turned up ZERO % native American.

And no, she isn't Elizabeth Warren. :D
I grew up  
Pete in MD : 2/16/2018 12:40 pm : link
thinking I was 100% Polish on both sides. Later, my Dad started researching his ancestry and found that his father's side was not quite that clear. Fast forward to when these DNA tests become available, and he finds out he's mostly Eastern European, as expected, but 22% Scandinavian and 7% Irish, both of which were complete surprises. Mom came back 100% Eastern European, which was expected but not quite as exciting.
Populations weren't totally insular  
njm : 2/16/2018 12:59 pm : link
I did Ancestry and have traced branches of ancestors back over 500 years (assuming church records are right). Showed up as 50% Western European and 25% Scandinavian which matched the most recent 4 generations where there's truly verifiable records. What I didn't expect was 9% Italian. But one branch went back to right on the Southern German-Swiss border, and there was some migration from Italy to Switzerland over the centuries.

It can be fun. I found a copy of a passenger list from 1843 for a ship sailing from Antwerp to Baltimore with my 14 year old Great-Great Grandmother listed as a passenger. Going farther back you're not quite as sure about the data. One amusing anecdote involved marriage records. Most of my ancestors got married in their early 20's, but one recorded a marriage in the late 1500's between a 16 year old and a 15 year old. Had the shotgun been invented by 1585?
You do realize that while you father may claim he is Irish  
montanagiant : 2/16/2018 1:05 pm : link
It could be that his great-grandparents were English and migrated to Ireland.

My wife's test came back from 23andMe and even though her mothers maiden name is Savio and she is a distant relative of Saint Dominick Savio of Italy, her test showed 80% French/German with 20% English/Irish. Not a speck of Italian. Upon further investigation, it was discovered that her Great-Grandparents migrated from France to Northern Italy
Interesting Migrations  
varco : 2/16/2018 1:39 pm : link
Some of the family histories mentioned here are really amazing. When looking at some "improbable" ancestry mixtures, it should be noted that England was once part of the Roman Empire, for a number of centuries. Typically, the Roman legions were sent (from their native recruiting areas, such as Spain, France and Italy, etc.) to occupy outlying territories. They married locally and their offspring provided on going recruitment for the legions, farming, etc.

Other examples ---the Jewish population of Spain was expelled around 1492 and many wound up in southern Italy. Spanish and French garrisons were in place in Italy (especially Rome and Naples). In addition to the DNA "contribution", their influence could be seen in cuisine and heard in the local dialects.

Settlers from Alsace were imported to repopulate parts of Austria and Hungary after the Turkish Wars, while mercenaries were hired from Italy during those conflicts....some stayed behind when the wars ended.

Just fascinating stuff, which DNA testing helps to highlight.
30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
T-Bone : 2/16/2018 1:58 pm : link
He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.
RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 2:03 pm : link
In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:
Quote:
He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.
He still made out better than another guy I know who came out homozygous across his entire genome.

And I shudder to think about the 23 and me report of a (former) valuable poster which read 68% alpha centauri, 30% martian and 2% human.

When we did ours, I found out that I was 100% Other.
RE: RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
SomeFan : 2/16/2018 2:22 pm : link
In comment 13834672 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:


Quote:


He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.

He still made out better than another guy I know who came out homozygous across his entire genome.

And I shudder to think about the 23 and me report of a (former) valuable poster which read 68% alpha centauri, 30% martian and 2% human.

When we did ours, I found out that I was 100% Other.


My came back “not applicable”.

I think it is good to get DNA checked for potential disease susceptibility but I’m not interested in my or others even ethnic ancestry.
RE: RE: RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 2:28 pm : link
In comment 13834697 SomeFan said:
Quote:
In comment 13834672 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:


Quote:


He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.

He still made out better than another guy I know who came out homozygous across his entire genome.

And I shudder to think about the 23 and me report of a (former) valuable poster which read 68% alpha centauri, 30% martian and 2% human.

When we did ours, I found out that I was 100% Other.



My came back “not applicable”.

I think it is good to get DNA checked for potential disease susceptibility but I’m not interested in my or others even ethnic ancestry.
Actually, like I said above, I'm not a big fan of that. Too many people will look at some percentage of association and make precipitous decisions, even though they do't have a specific disease or have a low likelihood of ever getting it.
I did Ancestry DNA  
Greg from LI : 2/16/2018 2:38 pm : link
35% Europe South, 24% Great Britain, 20% Ireland/Scotland/Wales, 17% Scandinavian, 2% Europe West, 2% Iberian peninsula. The first three weren't surprises, although the percentages are a bit off from what I would have expected. The Europe South I expected to be lower - my paternal grandfather is 100% Italian (son of immigrants), so you'd think no more than 25%. My mom's family background is almost entirely Irish so I was expecting that one to be higher too. I have no idea where 17% Scandinavian comes from - the remnants of ancient Viking invasions in the British Isles, maybe? I know where virtually all of my ancestors immigrated from: Italy, Ireland, England, and Germany. There was only a trace of the German, which makes some sense because it was just one great-great grandfather. No Swedes or Norwegians that I can find.
If you are of mixed descent, then the  
SeanLandeta : 2/16/2018 2:40 pm : link
percentages will not tell you accurately your direct lineage (in the percentages). It will only tell you what percentages got passed down to you. Also, depending on what test you took, it can reflect only a certain line (male lines from both parents, etc).

For example, if your parents took the test and it was a full reflection of your ancestry then your percentages would be exactly half of everything each of your parents are. But that isn't how it works, your percentages will be different based on what was passed on to you - some of yours might be more than half of what theirs are and some might be less (and you might show something they don't and vice versa).

I wouldn't read much into the percentages, the main takeaway is if you find out you are at all made up of a group you didn't realize. For example, if you thought you were part Italian, part French, part German, and part Scandanavian - I wouldn't read much into the percentages you get from each of those....but, the cool part is if you get something in addition to those 4 that you did not know.
Those tests are ...  
BronxBob : 2/16/2018 2:45 pm : link
... like Reese's draft picks: not always precisely accurate. My grandparents family names are McCormick, Scott, Alcott - and a German name. My test came back with -- like others have said theirs did -- Ireland/Scotland/Wales: 45% (Ulster, Ireland); Great Britain, 34%; Scandinavia, 5%; and just 3% Western Europe.
RE: Those tests are ...  
njm : 2/16/2018 3:26 pm : link
In comment 13834739 BronxBob said:
Quote:
... like Reese's draft picks: not always precisely accurate. My grandparents family names are McCormick, Scott, Alcott - and a German name. My test came back with -- like others have said theirs did -- Ireland/Scotland/Wales: 45% (Ulster, Ireland); Great Britain, 34%; Scandinavia, 5%; and just 3% Western Europe.


But go back a few generations farther and there might be ancestors with other names/ancestries. That's particularly true if they'd been in the US for a long time or married someone from a family that was.
RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
Beezer : 2/16/2018 3:53 pm : link
In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:
Quote:
He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.


lol

Happy Friday!!!
RE: RE: RE: RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
SomeFan : 2/16/2018 5:07 pm : link
In comment 13834705 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 13834697 SomeFan said:


Quote:


In comment 13834672 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:


Quote:


He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.

He still made out better than another guy I know who came out homozygous across his entire genome.

And I shudder to think about the 23 and me report of a (former) valuable poster which read 68% alpha centauri, 30% martian and 2% human.

When we did ours, I found out that I was 100% Other.



My came back “not applicable”.

I think it is good to get DNA checked for potential disease susceptibility but I’m not interested in my or others even ethnic ancestry.

Actually, like I said above, I'm not a big fan of that. Too many people will look at some percentage of association and make precipitous decisions, even though they do't have a specific disease or have a low likelihood of ever getting it.


Bill - Are you saying that someone would not show a susceptibility so be more cavalier about prevention?
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: 30 posts in and no one wants to break it to him eh?  
SomeFan : 2/16/2018 5:18 pm : link
In comment 13834861 SomeFan said:
[quote] In comment 13834705 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 13834697 SomeFan said:


Quote:


In comment 13834672 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 13834661 T-Bone said:


Quote:


He’s not your real Dad,

Sorry you had to find out like this.

He still made out better than another guy I know who came out homozygous across his entire genome.

And I shudder to think about the 23 and me report of a (former) valuable poster which read 68% alpha centauri, 30% martian and 2% human.

When we did ours, I found out that I was 100% Other.



My came back “not applicable”.

I think it is good to get DNA checked for potential disease susceptibility but I’m not interested in my or others even ethnic ancestry.

Actually, like I said above, I'm not a big fan of that. Too many people will look at some percentage of association and make precipitous decisions, even though they do't have a specific disease or have a low likelihood of ever getting it.



Bill - Are you saying that someone would not show a susceptibility so be more cavalier about prevention? [/quote

I see you are saying that. I don’t View DNA analysis as pseudo science and there is a strong correlation to disease. The precision in which genes can be analyzed seems to be the fastest developing area of medicine. The breast cancer gene is one that can be determined and then decisions for prevention can be made with a physician’s advice of course.
Sure, but for most genes, including cancer gene  
Bill L : 2/16/2018 6:34 pm : link
There’s generally an association with higher risk, but you don’t have cancer until you do. People may decide to lop off a breast because they carry a gene associated with higher risk. People change diets and omit necessary things because they *may* be prone to an allergy. *May* is not *is*, is what I’m saying. Combine that with the fact that people are dumb and you can cause real damage. Heck, we’re in the midst of a ridiculous gluten-free fad for no reason. And that’s with no commercial test involved. Tell poeple that they may have a higher than average risk to have a disease and who knows what panic things they do to be proactive.

And I’m not calling genetic analysis pseudo -science. There’s actual labs that do that to diagnose diseases. Heck, where I work every newborn born in NY gets tested by genetic analysis for disease. But that’s a real public health lab.
Never had my DNA tested  
Milton : 2/16/2018 6:51 pm : link
The funny thing is that growing up in the 70's we always thought of Russia and the Soviet Union as synonymous. So I thought I was 75% Russian and 25% Austrian based on my four grandparents. Turns out I'm not Russian at all (50% Ukrainian, 25% Lithuanian) and some in the family say the grandparent from Austria was actually from Poland (something to do with changing borders).
p.s.--I only knew one of my grandparents and she didn't speak English (the only words I recall from her were "meshugener kinder").
MTN-G-man  
Jalapeno : 2/16/2018 9:06 pm : link
You likely received Elizabeth Warrens test.
Where did your family come from in Ireland?  
Vanzetti : 2/16/2018 9:45 pm : link
The English have ruled the pale around Dublin for 800 years. If they came from thew West, it would be more surprising.
45% Italian  
Bubba : 2/17/2018 6:47 am : link
25% German 15% Asian 15% Sheep...........wait what?
RE: RE: Those tests are ...  
BronxBob : 2/22/2018 3:32 pm : link
In comment 13834765 njm said:
Quote:
In comment 13834739 BronxBob said:


Quote:


... like Reese's draft picks: not always precisely accurate. My grandparents family names are McCormick, Scott, Alcott - and a German name. My test came back with -- like others have said theirs did -- Ireland/Scotland/Wales: 45% (Ulster, Ireland); Great Britain, 34%; Scandinavia, 5%; and just 3% Western Europe.



But go back a few generations farther and there might be ancestors with other names/ancestries. That's particularly true if they'd been in the US for a long time or married someone from a family that was.



As far as I know -- and we have "recent" history for three-quarters of the group I mentioned above -- no one got to this country before 1850, so most of whatever intermingling occurred would have happened somewhere somehow over in "the old country."
Just got mine back last week it identified my Brother and Nephew  
montanagiant : 2/22/2018 4:44 pm : link
It identified my Brother and Nephew who had done their tests a few years ago as direct relations as well as a 2nd cousin of mine. One thing I never realized is that even if you are brothers each of you has different percentages of where you're from (Mine came back as 68% Italian my brothers came back at 61%).
56% mydrumpus  
idiotsavant : 2/22/2018 5:25 pm : link
24% Neanderthal.

20% elven.

All in the wrong places

Typo. Mudrumpus  
idiotsavant : 2/22/2018 5:27 pm : link
Grandma would kill me for spelling her wrong like
RE: Just got mine back last week it identified my Brother and Nephew  
njm : 2/22/2018 5:49 pm : link
In comment 13839469 montanagiant said:
Quote:
It identified my Brother and Nephew who had done their tests a few years ago as direct relations as well as a 2nd cousin of mine. One thing I never realized is that even if you are brothers each of you has different percentages of where you're from (Mine came back as 68% Italian my brothers came back at 61%).


Similar. My niece did the test using her married name and was identified on my results as a niece. When my brother took did his results also differed from mine with respect to percentages. My Western European % was higher and Scandinavian and Italian lower.
With Ancestry DNA  
ArtVandelay : 2/22/2018 9:53 pm : link
I just found out that I have a half brother on my father's side. His mother never married and never told him who his father was. He was born about 8 months after my parents got married.

The results have been confirmed. We exchanged some old photos. His mother and my parents are still alive. His mother saw the photos then finally stated after all these years that my dad is the father. My dad, who is 79 now, said that he knows her and that they used to date. My mom wasn't present during this conversation.

You can learn a lot from these online DNA test but beware of what you might find. My half brother is very excited about the news. I'm happy for him and excited as well but I have a feeling my mom wouldn't be too thrilled about it.










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