If your Eli Manning who do you want in the draft at pick two

The QB will always choose a weapon first before a guard.

Munoz 😁

but if we are basing a once in a generation #2 pick in the draft on a 37 year old QB we are fucked. Better be thinking longer term.

But my preference is to make everyone happy and draft Barkley and pick Jackson at 34 Everyone�s wishes get filled.

Is a sucker�s bet.

Maybe a wide receiver who plays preseason games?

They need to do what�s best for the team. Will always love Eli but he won 3 freaking games last year, and the locker room fell apart. There has been a lot of ugliness since �11. You can blame Reese etc. for failing to build an OLine, but it�s not like we saw Eli calling folks out or beating down doors to fix the line or get a running game. Eli was complacent is all this.

In comment 13842203 WillVAB said:

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Is a sucker�s bet.

hes got the least amount of risk of any of the top candidates. That�s the least appropriate definition of suckers bet. The sexy qb who will retire the season after he starts? Now that�s a suckers bet. The other qb is meh so not a suckers bet because not so much is promised.

In comment 13842206 UberAlias said:

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They need to do what�s best for the team. Will always love Eli but he won 3 freaking games last year, and the locker room fell apart. There has been a lot of ugliness since �11. You can blame Reese etc. for failing to build an OLine, but it�s not like we saw Eli calling folks out or beating down doors to fix the line or get a running game. Eli was complacent is all this.

Holy shite are you serious...

And Giant fans like to think we are more knowledgeable and rational than Eagle fans...

Luckily we have professional adults making the personnel decisions...

complain about the rest of the team and point fingers to assign blame. Well yes, your probably right. That does sound like Eli.

Locker room was dysfunctional. The QB is supposed to be the leader of the team and Eli sure as hell was paid enough to expect as much. I�m sorry but that is not good enough. The team needs to do what�s best for the franchise, not for Eli. Sorry if this offends some.

In comment 13842256 wgenesis123 said:

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complain about the rest of the team and point fingers to assign blame. Well yes, your probably right. That does sound like Eli.

Eli has leverage in the organization. I want our $100M QB to be a leader.

Things were a mess least year.

In comment 13842256 wgenesis123 said:

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complain about the rest of the team and point fingers to assign blame. Well yes, your probably right. That does sound like Eli.

Yes you can call people out. You can hold player only meetings. You can demand accountability. ... or you can sit back and, we�ll, let things continue.

And I consider Eli one of them, I can t remember another where a large percentage of the fan base were as loyal as they are to Eli.

I love having Eli as quarterback of the Giants and am thrilled he gets to stay on as the starter. I want one of these young quarterbacks be the guy, and I want the Giants to draft him. But I always wanted them to sit at least next season behind Eli.

But having said that, Eli has been part of the problem. To think otherwise seems to lack objectivity

I'd want to improve the Oline's blocking ability most of all.

In comment 13842211 Bill L said:

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In comment 13842203 WillVAB said: Quote: Is a sucker�s bet. hes got the least amount of risk of any of the top candidates. That�s the least appropriate definition of suckers bet. The sexy qb who will retire the season after he starts? Now that�s a suckers bet. The other qb is meh so not a suckers bet because not so much is promised.

It�s not about risk (and least amount is your subjective opinion) it�s about ROI. He�s the worst at 2 from a ROI perspective.

In comment 13842291 WillVAB said:

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In comment 13842211 Bill L said: Quote: In comment 13842203 WillVAB said: Quote: Is a sucker�s bet. hes got the least amount of risk of any of the top candidates. That�s the least appropriate definition of suckers bet. The sexy qb who will retire the season after he starts? Now that�s a suckers bet. The other qb is meh so not a suckers bet because not so much is promised. It�s not about risk (and least amount is your subjective opinion) it�s about ROI. He�s the worst at 2 from a ROI perspective.

ahh, that�s objectively speaking of course.

at draft time. He has a 5 million dollar roster bonus due in a few days. He could be hoping the Giants rot in hell.

just saying

not who I am. We don't know what Eli did or did not do behind closed doors. What I do feel sure of though is Eli was the same guy who lead this team to two Super Bowls. I see nothing to gain by being hypercritical of Eli. I could be but I would lose respect for Eli and I don't want to do that to myself. Eli never was one to scream and holler at his teammates and I always respected him for that. Can't be critical of him now for that, I would be two-faced. He also was never one to try and run the team like Peyton did. the only reason Eli survived in New York is because he is easy Eli. I don't want him to change that now, really with all that was wrong it would not have helped. It just would have made things look like Eli was losing it and looking for someone to blame. Sometimes you can tell a team is destined to win. Sometimes a team is destined to suck, that was the Giants in 2017.

.

In comment 13842264 UberAlias said:

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In comment 13842256 wgenesis123 said: Quote: complain about the rest of the team and point fingers to assign blame. Well yes, your probably right. That does sound like Eli. Eli has leverage in the organization. I want our $100M QB to be a leader.

Well, he is not a leader - not in the traditional sense. He is not one of those motivational speaker types who can command a room ... or a locker room. I remember there was a lot talk about this when he was drafted. I think Tiki started some controversy when he commented on this. If there was multiple sources of the dysfunction - Eli does not have the personality type to rally everyone.

Looks like we didn't get our 100 million dollars worth ...

.

you meant to say complicit or complacent and I still don't really know what you're getting at:

Quote:

You can blame Reese etc. for failing to build an OLine, but it�s not like we saw Eli calling folks out or beating down doors to fix the line or get a running game. Eli was complacent is all this.

If you mean complacent, how do you know what Eli has or hasn't done? Have we heard any players publicly call for a better OL or even throw reese under the bus? We don't know what eli says to others in the organization, but playing things out in the media isn't really the Manning way, either Eli or his brother. Insinuating he isn't a leader because he's not screaming for change goes against what people surrounding the team say about him. Just like people saying Beckham is selfish clearly ignore all the things said about his hard work and how good a teammate he is. Narratives get created without anything more than insinuation sometimes.

If you mean complicit I'll just say holy shit and leave it at that.

And holy shot indeed...

In comment 13842325 wgenesis123 said:

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not who I am. We don't know what Eli did or did not do behind closed doors. What I do feel sure of though is Eli was the same guy who lead this team to two Super Bowls. I see nothing to gain by being hypercritical of Eli. I could be but I would lose respect for Eli and I don't want to do that to myself. Eli never was one to scream and holler at his teammates and I always respected him for that. Can't be critical of him now for that, I would be two-faced. He also was never one to try and run the team like Peyton did. the only reason Eli survived in New York is because he is easy Eli. I don't want him to change that now, really with all that was wrong it would not have helped. It just would have made things look like Eli was losing it and looking for someone to blame. Sometimes you can tell a team is destined to win. Sometimes a team is destined to suck, that was the Giants in 2017.

I'm not an Eli defender at all. To me I believe the end is nigh when it comes to him being a QB you can win with. However, this was a great post and I agree wholeheartedly. You said it beautifully and we all owe Eli a lot of graciousness.

if that's what you want to call it. I don't know wtf you guys that want him gone are looking at. Eli was the best player on the Giants for our most recent playoff game in Green Bay. He has never had any kind of career threatening injury. He has plenty of arm strength. It's very difficult to throw accurately when you cannot step into your throws because your interior linemen are getting thrown back on every pass play. They get no push on running plays. Nobody respected our running game. I can't believe we might sign Pugh back. We need to start over because nobody on the offensive line is worth keeping.

We also had a stubborn moron for a head coach who didn't know wtf was going on and just had tunnel vision. Wait until we get some competent coaching, effective O-line play, and a running game that can actually gain yardage when it's really needed. Eli could play for another 3, 4, even 5 years at a high level if he has the right support team around him. Anyone who thinks that we aren't getting our money's worth out of Eli has not evaluated this team honestly & objectively. I want the Giants to get every ounce of whatever it is Eli has out of him in a Giant uniform.

Do you think Eli wants Barkley at pick two?

Thank you

In comment 13842206 UberAlias said:

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They need to do what�s best for the team. Will always love Eli but he won 3 freaking games last year, and the locker room fell apart. There has been a lot of ugliness since �11. You can blame Reese etc. for failing to build an OLine, but it�s not like we saw Eli calling folks out or beating down doors to fix the line or get a running game. Eli was complacent is all this.

Maybe the worst post I�ve read in my entire time on Bbi dating back to 2002 when I was a lurker and �mofti� told me to check out this site.

A rookie OL might solve that problem in 2-3 seasons not year 1

Eli would want Barkley

It's probably easier to respond to all at once.

We know what Eli is, he's exceedingly loyal hard working, etc. He's not a rah rah guy, he leads by example, and in any normal circumstances, that's more than enough. He's also $100M QB and the face of the franchise.

The inadequacy since the two superbowls has seen the team moving on from the GM and VP of player evaluations. They've moved on at Head coach, twice. The number of players remaining from the last SB can be counted on one hand. What remains is Eli.

But last season was not the normal run of the mill suckiness the team has endured of late. It was dysfunctional and, frankly, embarrassing to the franchise. As I said, Eli leads by example, but there is also responsibility that comes along with being the face of the franchise. So when it gets so ugly that it reaches the point of embarrassment --3 wins, an offense that can't score 30 points in multiple seasons, star defensive players getting suspended, linemen getting reportedly checking out and getting benched and cut, the buffoon of a head coach taking routine jabs at you in the press and benching you for Geno freaking Smith-- when it gets that ugly, and you are the $100M SB winning face of the franchise, touting the BS company line is not good enough.

There are times when you need your leaders to lead, not just set an example when it is painfully obvious no one else cares to follow. Because that company whose line you are spitting out is sending a message that you, as the leader of the franchise, are on board with it.

So I still love Eli and I will be wearing his jersey on opening day as I always do and rooting for him to have a rebound. But in terms of accountability for the mess of last season, and the losing and inadequacy since '11, the GM has been held accountable, the head coach has been held accountable, the owner has been ripped in the press and has been held accountable --everyone has been held accountable except the QB.

Right or wrong, the QB gets the credit when things are good, and their share of blame when things go bad. And if I wish to give Eli credit for '07 in the face of what the defense did in good conscience, if I'm going to be consistent, I need to give him his share of the blame for the 3 wins and the ineffectiveness of the offense in '17.

The guy is 37 years old, only going to be here for a couple more years. The player they draft @ #2 this year needs to be foundational player for next generation of Giants. So when asked the question, quite frankly, I don't care who Eli wants with the pick.

If this POV is so irrational and offends anyone, my apologies in advance. It's how I feel.

for The Who Cares what Eli Thinks. Of course we care because he has been a winner for this franchise for a good while and knows what we need to do to right the ship probably more than anybody.

But my guess is you won�t have to wait long for when Eli is held accountable...

Eli was also sniped at by the HC, and eventually used by the HC to try and shift blame from a shitty system to the QB being the scapegoat, eventually leading to a benching for Geno Smith.

Nobody looked like a leader last year. Collins was taking daily potshots at Apple and Snacks sulked at the dysfunctional situation around him.

Even while getting dragged around, Eli kept his emotion in check and was very measured. Sort of the way the Mannings handle every situation.

If you expected him to lash out at the FO for the OL or snipe at people in the media then you really haven't seemed to understand Eli all that well.

Hell, he probably has a shitload of disdain for Mac and he won't even publicly trash him.

And again - you don 't know what he says away from the mic.

Quote:

everyone has been held accountable except the QB

Who held the OL accountable? Who held Tom Quinn accountable?

What accountablilty were you looking for? He was benched. He was insinuated to be the reason for the offense failing by the HC. A number of people have said eli is holding the offense back. What else were you looking for?

with.

In comment 13842504 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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Even while getting dragged around, Eli kept his emotion in check and was very measured. Sort of the way the Mannings handle every situation. If you expected him to lash out at the FO for the OL or snipe at people in the media then you really haven't seemed to understand Eli all that well. And again - you don 't know what he says away from the mic.

I think I do understand Eli. I also happen to think it is a limitation in his abilities as a leader. 99% of the time, his leading by example should be enough. But in the ugliness of last year, the face of the franchise leading by example, when it is painfully obvious no one cares to follow that example, it wasn't enough. Eli did as he usually does, which was to loyally go along with the organization. But when that organization is fucking things up as miserably as they did last year, that's not what was needed.

I don't know what he did behind the scenes. But he is the face of the organization and I can only go by what was projected in the media and what his message was to the fans.

to any players who publicly trashed team ownership or the coaching staff and came away with a better team in the end?

Usually when that happens, the player is sent away. Didn't Favre trash some of the things with the Jets? That didn't turn out well. Cutler took shots a couple of times after bad seasons for his teams. Is he looked at favorably? Did things turn around? When Moss and Owens complained about powers above, they saw just how unnecessary they were for the teams to still field units.

I don't know what was said behind the scenes last year, but the coach and GM were fired during the season after grossly mishandling the Eli situation. That's not something the Giants do, and they did it. Maybe eli was part of that decision process.

I think he leads in ways you aren't seeing. Mainly because it isn't his way, but also because it never seems to turn out well when a player goes off the rails.

especially since he contributed to the entire starting WR corps going on IR...

In comment 13842562 Jimmy Googs said:

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especially since he contributed to the entire starting WR corps going on IR...

And he caused three different terror attacks along with making the earth's core temp rise 3 degrees.

In comment 13842555 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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to any players who publicly trashed team ownership or the coaching staff and came away with a better team in the end? Usually when that happens, the player is sent away. Didn't Favre trash some of the things with the Jets? That didn't turn out well. Cutler took shots a couple of times after bad seasons for his teams. Is he looked at favorably? Did things turn around? When Moss and Owens complained about powers above, they saw just how unnecessary they were for the teams to still field units. I don't know what was said behind the scenes last year, but the coach and GM were fired during the season after grossly mishandling the Eli situation. That's not something the Giants do, and they did it. Maybe eli was part of that decision process. I think he leads in ways you aren't seeing. Mainly because it isn't his way, but also because it never seems to turn out well when a player goes off the rails.

Clearly the locker room was a mess. I think Eli could have called some folks out, if not directly, then indirectly. He could have sent a strong message to those not prioritizing winning. We've seen teams hold player only meetings. He could have stood up to McAdoo.

He is the face of the franchise and his message matters. I don't recall his message being objectionable to any of what went on.

is that just because you didn't hear Eli making a statement, doesn't mean that he was silent.

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And with you Eli I learned that you don�t have to be outwardly excited to be internally combustible to go out there and whoop some people on the football field my friend and you have done it. You have the perfect demeanor for New York City, I will tell you that.�

-Michael Strahan, Hall of Fame Induction Speech

Except the ref didn�t stop the fight and spinks kept getting up. I don�t see how anyone can question Eli�s leadership ability...his speed and ability to make up plays on the fly once the ball is snapped, fine..but who cares?? The other 99.9% of the time he�s $$$, both on the field and in the locker room.

... you draft Barkley and don't think twice.

But obviously you can't draft for Eli in 2018.

The last draft ever.

So get your QB while they are, well, maybe they're not hot, but they're available.

In comment 13842660 Bill L said:

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The last draft ever. So get your QB while they are, well, maybe they're not hot, but they're available.

haha

In comment 13842607 YorkAveGiant said:

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Except the ref didn�t stop the fight and spinks kept getting up. I don�t see how anyone can question Eli�s leadership ability...his speed and ability to make up plays on the fly once the ball is snapped, fine..but who cares?? The other 99.9% of the time he�s $$$, both on the field and in the locker room.

Last year would not have reached the level of ugliness in the locker room it did with the '07 leadership, and the '86 guys sure as hell would not have tolerated it either. Do you not agree?

Leading by example is great, except it is not sufficient when no one is following that example. Do you disagree?

Last year was a freaking shit show mess. Do you not agree?

Sometime true leaders who are in position to influence change cannot simply sit quietly in the face of something that is wrong, they need to speak up, else they are part of the problem. Do you agree?

Eli is the face of the franchise. He has some clout in the organization. Do you agree?

If this is so objectionable to you that you disdainfully disagree, then I don't know what to tell you. But at least I'm being honest. You want to give him credit for '07, great. He deserves some of the blame for 3 wins and the mess last season as well. I'm sorry.

asking if people agree but that isn't the point.

You don't know what Eli has said to management or if he's remained silent. You basically don't know what he's done to lead or not but yet you've come to the conclusion he didn't do anything last year.

What leader did? Collins? Snacks? Pugh? For all we know, the benching of Eli ended up orchestrating events that will no doubt make us a better team, simply by ridding ourselves of Mac and Reese.

I think many people on this thread are just confused that you aren't getting the point that you don't know what eli has or hasn't done, yet came to a definitive conclusion he needs to lead better.

That there was all of this hidden behind the scenes leadership we don�t know about, then fine. We don�t know that there was either, and if it happened it never made its way to the media.

All any of us can go by is what we know. What I do know is that by all signs there was an obvious void in leadership in that locker room last year. You may not agree, and that�s fair, but those making it out as some kind of blasphemy that I am being critical of the lack of observable leadership displayed by the face of the franchise in the midst of all that dysfunction last season are being disingenuous.

I'm sure he wants Nelson, but Eli is 37. He's on the back nine of his career. And this is coming from someone who loves Eli, who has told his wife we're giving a son-if we have one-the middle name Elisha.

We need to be focus on the post Eli era, which will be here before you know it. I want Darnold. I think he's going to be a good one. Eli to Darnold, in my opinion, gives us 30 + years of a franchise QB.

In comment 13842989 FatMan in Charlotte said:

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You don't know what Eli has said to management or if he's remained silent. You basically don't know what he's done to lead or not but yet you've come to the conclusion he didn't do anything last year.

Come on man...you know Eli didn't do shit. Like he has some alter-ego behind the scenes that we never see anywhere else?

Not bloody likely...

a lot of people will be upset. It's the easiest position to make a big impact from rookie year so he will have a fast start and people will lack patience for the QB, DE, or OL.