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Rams trade LB Alec Ogletree to Giants

OdellBeckhamJr : 3/7/2018 3:56 pm
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RE: I actually wonder if this confirms that we're sticking with the 4-3  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:35 pm : link
In comment 13853741 widmerseyebrow said:
Quote:
Ogletree's best years were as a MLB in a 4-3. He slipped a little this year as an outside linebacker in a 3-4.


Thinking Moneybacker here. He certainly is not an outside LB in a 3-4.

Bettcher will be multiple.
A lot of people here seem to love this trade  
illmatic : 3/7/2018 4:36 pm : link
but based only on some quick browsing online, Rams fans don't seem very upset that he's gone. A lot of them were upset with his play, mainly all the missed tackles. I liked him coming out of college but haven't seen much of him on the Rams so I'm neutral on the trade assuming it's not a huge cap hit. But Bettcher must see something in him and the way he would fit in the defense and I'm happy about that. Draft pick wise, they didn't give up much. The cap is the main concern with this trade.
RE: RE: What two picks?  
81_Great_Dane : 3/7/2018 4:36 pm : link
In comment 13853652 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
Do teams need to have a minimum number of picks in each draft? The goal is to acquire talent, not bodies.
The Giants are rebuilding. They seem to want to turn over the roster quite a bit to get "professional football players" and "hog mollies" that fit what the new GM and coaches are trying to do. In that situation, you want picks. It's not like they have a loaded roster and are trying to fill a single weak spot. They have plenty of needs.
I dream of the day that the G-men  
Beer Man : 3/7/2018 4:37 pm : link
Have a dominating LB core again
Looks like Bettcher  
TMS : 3/7/2018 4:37 pm : link
may have pushed for this trade early on. Sounds like LT yelling at his mates in that highlight tape. All offense from here on out.
Nice trade  
Matt in SGS : 3/7/2018 4:38 pm : link
Ogletree was also the guy who hit Odell out of bounds and started the fight in St. Louis years ago as well, so he has an edge to him too.
RE: Sys comments  
AcesUp : 3/7/2018 4:38 pm : link
In comment 13853789 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
No way in round 1
Sy'56 : 3/8/2013 9:40 am : link
He is NOT a run defender. He can't take on blocks. His effort isn't always there. Not a physical presence.


I imagine Bettcher plans to use him like he previously used Buchanon in Arizona, kind of a LB/S hybrid role.
I think its a good trade  
RobCarpenter : 3/7/2018 4:38 pm : link
Just pointing out how much doubt was expressed by fans in a year when the Giants could have drafted him, but drafted ...

Justin Pugh.
RE: RE: Sys comments  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:38 pm : link
In comment 13853802 AcesUp said:
Quote:
In comment 13853789 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


No way in round 1
Sy'56 : 3/8/2013 9:40 am : link
He is NOT a run defender. He can't take on blocks. His effort isn't always there. Not a physical presence.



I imagine Bettcher plans to use him like he previously used Buchanon in Arizona, kind of a LB/S hybrid role.


I agree. At 6'3" 235 he's built more like a big safety anyway
Vander Esch  
ryanmkeane : 3/7/2018 4:39 pm : link
could be a target in round 2. That would really transform the LB group
RE: Time warp to 2013  
Mike from Ohio : 3/7/2018 4:39 pm : link
In comment 13853782 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
To an earlier thread on him. I wonder if Sy still feels the same way as he did in 2013. Link - ( New Window )


Ooof! Lots of people on that thread high on Arthur Brown as a better LB than Ogletree.
We have 5 draft picks  
Rjanyg : 3/7/2018 4:39 pm : link
We traded the 4th round comp and our 6th rounder.

We got a 2019 7th round pick and one hell of a LB. Abrams will figure out the cap stuff.

This is a good move by Gettlemen. I do think this increases our chances of trading back a little and picking up some picks.

RE: I was not happy  
mfsd : 3/7/2018 4:39 pm : link
In comment 13853786 13ODB said:
Quote:
About hiring Gettleman at first but that all changed a few days later when he cut hart and fired Ross. This guy is a completely different GM then Reese and I love it. Reese would never ever made a trade like this never.


Rams in a pinch and need to create cap room...what a difference having a GM ready to act and take advantage. Locking down a good new starting LB before free agency and the draft. Love it.
RE: RE: RE: Sys comments  
mfsd : 3/7/2018 4:40 pm : link
In comment 13853805 Emil said:
Quote:
In comment 13853802 AcesUp said:


Quote:


In comment 13853789 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


No way in round 1
Sy'56 : 3/8/2013 9:40 am : link
He is NOT a run defender. He can't take on blocks. His effort isn't always there. Not a physical presence.



I imagine Bettcher plans to use him like he previously used Buchanon in Arizona, kind of a LB/S hybrid role.



I agree. At 6'3" 235 he's built more like a big safety anyway


Pretty sure Ogletree played safety in college, right? Point being, he fits what modern LBs are evolving into
Look, I dont trust anything....  
bw in dc : 3/7/2018 4:40 pm : link
Jints Central does.

So if I like this trade, then you know its a real good day... ; )
Keep in mind  
Jay on the Island : 3/7/2018 4:41 pm : link
Ogletree will be playing behind Snacks and Tomlinson vs. Donald and Brockers. While Donald is arguably the best DT in football he is a at his best penetrating the OL where Snacks and Tomlinson tie up OL keeping the LB's relatively clean.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Sys comments  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:41 pm : link
In comment 13853810 mfsd said:
Quote:
In comment 13853805 Emil said:


Quote:


In comment 13853802 AcesUp said:


Quote:


In comment 13853789 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


No way in round 1
Sy'56 : 3/8/2013 9:40 am : link
He is NOT a run defender. He can't take on blocks. His effort isn't always there. Not a physical presence.



I imagine Bettcher plans to use him like he previously used Buchanon in Arizona, kind of a LB/S hybrid role.



I agree. At 6'3" 235 he's built more like a big safety anyway



Pretty sure Ogletree played safety in college, right? Point being, he fits what modern LBs are evolving into


I think you are right. To me, this move has Bettcher written all over it. It's the chess piece he needs.
The Rams also got rid of Robert Quinn  
Rjanyg : 3/7/2018 4:41 pm : link
in the trade for KC's Marcus Peters. They also tagged Joyner.

Lots of changes in LA.
RE: Number  
TheMick7 : 3/7/2018 4:41 pm : link
In comment 13853736 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
of draft picks is sort of meaningless.

I'd take an Ogletree (or plug in any established veteran even if he's only league average) over any pick after a 2nd round pick.

Just for reference, this is the success of a ten year study of draft picks by position and "success" was very easily defined as "starting more than half their games".

When I see these numbers for 4th and 6th round picks, and I see fans fret the Giants only have 5 picks and no 6th or 7th round pick. SO WHAT? The odds of hitting on those picks are remote, the odds of the player being at least decent is likely. Trade away.

And no don't trade down to accumulate more useless picks just to have more picks. That's a stupid strategy.



Quote:


Historic Success Chart

The numbers show us the following outline for finding consistent starters:

1st Round - OL (83%) LB (70%) TE (67%) DB (64%) QB (63%) WR (58%) RB (58%) DL (58%)

2nd Round - OL (70%) LB (55%) TE (50%) WR (49%) DB (46%) QB (27%) DL (26%) RB (25%)

3rd Round - OL (40%) TE (39%) LB (34%) DL (27%) WR (25%) DB (24%) QB (17%) RB (16%)

4th Round - DL (37%) TE (33%) OL (29%) LB (16%) WR(12%) DB (11%) RB (11%) QB (8%)

5th Round - TE (32%) DB (17%) WR (16%) OL (16%) DL (13%) RB (9%) LB (4%) QB (0%)

6th Round - TE (26%) OL (16%) DL (13%) WR (9%) DB (8%) RB (6%) LB (5%) QB (0%)

7th Round - DB (11%) OL (9%) QB (6%) WR (5%) DL (3%) LB (2%) RB (0%) TE (0%)



+1
Might have started as a safety  
jeff57 : 3/7/2018 4:42 pm : link
But finished as a LB. Listed as 6-2 235.
According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
cjac : 3/7/2018 4:43 pm : link
The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick
RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
cjac : 3/7/2018 4:44 pm : link
In comment 13853820 cjac said:
Quote:
The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick


You know what I meant
i think it means more 3-4  
Joey in VA : 3/7/2018 4:44 pm : link
Actually. Ogletree played inside last year and was there through the transition from the 4-3 to Wade Phillips' 3-4. This is a money move I think, Donald has to be paid and the Rams have tagged one DB and another that is hitting UFA.

If anyone hasn't looked at the BBI discussion on Ogletree vs. Arthur Brown, it's worth a look and a chuckle. Arthur WHO you may ask? The Arthur Brown many clamored as being the superior LB to Ogletree in the 2013 draft. The Arthur Brown who has 20 career tackles, is a street free agent and has been on 4 teams in 5 years. THAT Arthur Brown.
It'll be interesting to see how Bettcher uses him  
AdamBrag : 3/7/2018 4:44 pm : link
I think the $backer role is a strong possibility.
The 4th comp  
Peppers : 3/7/2018 4:44 pm : link
is basically a 5th.. the 6 carries little weight. This is great value. NYG got this deal because the Rams are backed against the cap with important pieces in need of new contracts.

Very good trade for Gettleman.
RE: Keep in mind  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:44 pm : link
In comment 13853815 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
Ogletree will be playing behind Snacks and Tomlinson vs. Donald and Brockers. While Donald is arguably the best DT in football he is a at his best penetrating the OL where Snacks and Tomlinson tie up OL keeping the LB's relatively clean.


Exactly

As I said earlier, one of the reasons his PFF grade slipped. The Rams scheme shifted dramatically last year. Ogeltree is not an edge guy in the 3-4, not big enough and he's too small to MLB in a scheme that asks the DTs to penetrate.

Giants fans should be pleased with the idea of the four starting LBs potentially being OV, Ogletree, BJ Goodson, and Kennard. And that list still has room for improvement.
Probably going to play  
Jon in NYC : 3/7/2018 4:45 pm : link
the Deone Buchanon role. Seems to be a good fit next to Goodson, who is a thumper.
.  
Ryan in Albany : 3/7/2018 4:46 pm : link
Pat Kirwan

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@PatKirwanRFN
5m5 minutes ago
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really like Ogeltree to the Giants-7mil roster due 3/16 time to convert it to a signing bonus and getting 5.25 cal space back
RE: The Rams also got rid of Robert Quinn  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:46 pm : link
In comment 13853817 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
in the trade for KC's Marcus Peters. They also tagged Joyner.

Lots of changes in LA.


Quinn didn't fit their new scheme either. The Rams had paid a lot for good defensive talent that ended up not fitting Wade Philips scheme.
RE: .  
Emil : 3/7/2018 4:46 pm : link
In comment 13853830 Ryan in Albany said:
Quote:
Pat Kirwan

Verified account

@PatKirwanRFN
5m5 minutes ago
More
really like Ogeltree to the Giants-7mil roster due 3/16 time to convert it to a signing bonus and getting 5.25 cal space back


Genius
RE: Love the move...  
ThatLimerickGuy : 3/7/2018 4:47 pm : link
In comment 13853690 Saos1n said:
Quote:
Remember, though, he and Odell are what started the sideline brawl when we played the Rams...

Ogletree tackled Odell late, out of bounds and Odell threw the ball at him, starting everything


I'm the president of the Odell hater fan club but I don't think that means anything. That was a long time ago.
Bettcher should know him well.....in same division.  
George from PA : 3/7/2018 4:48 pm : link
This should work out great....
Wow great move!!!!!  
BigBlue4You09 : 3/7/2018 4:48 pm : link
And for just the case no pick and a 6th!!!
RE: RE: I love moves like this...  
Victor in CT : 3/7/2018 4:49 pm : link
In comment 13853790 Mr. Nickels said:
Quote:
In comment 13853785 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


something that Reese would never, ever do. Take a sure thing at LB instead of a shot in the dark in rounds 4-6.



Reese would trade the picks to move up to take some scrub a little bit earlier


Ryan Nassib if I recall
He had twice as many  
Koffman : 3/7/2018 4:50 pm : link
tackles as any of our LB's last year. Glad we finally addressed a long-standing area of need.
Tree  
Miamijints : 3/7/2018 4:50 pm : link
is going to LOVE playing behind Snacks!
RE: RE: The Rams also got rid of Robert Quinn  
jeff57 : 3/7/2018 4:51 pm : link
In comment 13853831 Emil said:
Quote:
In comment 13853817 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


in the trade for KC's Marcus Peters. They also tagged Joyner.

Lots of changes in LA.



Quinn didn't fit their new scheme either. The Rams had paid a lot for good defensive talent that ended up not fitting Wade Philips scheme.


Donald doesnt really fit the scheme either. But the guys so good it didnt matter.
I guess the Giants really are moving to a 3-4  
Vanzetti : 3/7/2018 4:51 pm : link
So they have Goodson and Ogletree inside.

Who are the outside LBers?



RE: I guess the Giants really are moving to a 3-4  
Jon in NYC : 3/7/2018 4:52 pm : link
In comment 13853840 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
So they have Goodson and Ogletree inside.

Who are the outside LBers?




Probably Vernon and JPP. Maybe Kennard.
am I wrong thinking that the picks in part get made up as compensatory  
Victor in CT : 3/7/2018 4:53 pm : link
picks if Pugh and/or Richburg sign elsewhere, especially at the inflated $$s being bandied about? Anybody know for sure? If so, that almost makes this a freebie.
RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/7/2018 4:53 pm : link
In comment 13853820 cjac said:
Quote:
The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick


So they got him for a sixth. Teams don't dump good players for a compensatory 4th and a sixth.
RE: am I wrong thinking that the picks in part get made up as compensatory  
jvm52106 : 3/7/2018 4:54 pm : link
In comment 13853843 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
picks if Pugh and/or Richburg sign elsewhere, especially at the inflated $$s being bandied about? Anybody know for sure? If so, that almost makes this a freebie.


Comp picks are figured out after the season. So any comp picks for Pugh and Richburg would be figured out after 2018 season for the 2019 draft.
2nd team All-Pro in 2016  
figgy2989 : 3/7/2018 4:54 pm : link
You have to think Betcher saw enough of him in the division to sign off on this deal. He is only 26.
RE: RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
Jon in NYC : 3/7/2018 4:54 pm : link
In comment 13853844 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13853820 cjac said:


Quote:


The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick



So they got him for a sixth. Teams don't dump good players for a compensatory 4th and a sixth.


Better players have been traded for less.
RE: RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
BillKo : 3/7/2018 4:54 pm : link
In comment 13853844 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13853820 cjac said:


Quote:


The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick



So they got him for a sixth. Teams don't dump good players for a compensatory 4th and a sixth.


I thought you couldn't trade compensatory picks. Did the rule change?
RE: am I wrong thinking that the picks in part get made up as compensatory  
mfsd : 3/7/2018 4:55 pm : link
In comment 13853843 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
picks if Pugh and/or Richburg sign elsewhere, especially at the inflated $$s being bandied about? Anybody know for sure? If so, that almost makes this a freebie.


Good question - could be offset by FAs we sign, right?
His contract is reasonable too  
BigBlue4You09 : 3/7/2018 4:55 pm : link
love love love
RE: RE: RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/7/2018 4:55 pm : link
In comment 13853847 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 13853844 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 13853820 cjac said:


Quote:


The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick



So they got him for a sixth. Teams don't dump good players for a compensatory 4th and a sixth.



Better players have been traded for less.


Like who? Not sarcasm, trying to think of an example.
RE: RE: RE: According to Schwartz and Tom Rock  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/7/2018 4:55 pm : link
In comment 13853848 BillKo said:
Quote:
In comment 13853844 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 13853820 cjac said:


Quote:


The 4th rounder they traded is the company pick



So they got him for a sixth. Teams don't dump good players for a compensatory 4th and a sixth.



I thought you couldn't trade compensatory picks. Did the rule change?


It did.
*Bettcher  
figgy2989 : 3/7/2018 4:55 pm : link
.
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