then DG isn’t the GM we hope he is. Eli, while playing well on the whole that day, did throw a momentum shifting brutal INT. A clsssic “wtf Eli?” throw that turned the game around.
a goddamn disappointment the rest of the NFC was. That Eagles couldn't cover street free agents with Eli that day. Yet two dome teams score 20 points in two games against it. Terrible year for Aarpn Rodgers to get hurt. Then Belichick takes a hatchet to his secondary minutes before the Superbowl.
RE: I really wonder if Eli has naked pics of Brit in VA Â
was canned, I actually thought Eli and the Offense looked better in the three home games. The road game in Arizona was a broken team going out west to play a good defense. The Giants were likely sleepwalking in that one.
The first game post McAdoo against Dallas the offense seemed more competent and there were three key drops late that were critical. The passing game looked good against the Eagles and produced in week seventeen throwing to scrubs and there was a dropped TD as well.
I think the offense will improve simply because McAdoo is gone.
It is great to see Eli showing some signs of how we all will chose to remember him. Unfortunately there are also plenty of counter examples to this game over the past few years.
I will suggest Eli will play a big role in returning this team to greatness. However that role is more likely be about mentoring the next guy.
can anyone name the receivers that Eli was throwing to that day? Can anyone name the players protecting Eli on the offensive line? Do you think they were the same groups from the previous week? I think what Eli accomplished that day was very inspiring and should be ONE OF the reasons that we let him continue to start this year. It's been painfully obvious that he needs protection and he can be very effective.
Let's not put the blame for that loss on Eli. He played his fucking heart out that game. Are there examples where Eli shit the bed in games that absolutely cost us a W? Of course, as with any other QB in the NFL.
The Giants fixed the entire defense in one offseason. Let's try and fix the OL. I'm confident that you'll see a much better Eli Manning if they do.
... the "Eli still has it" stuff is a smokescreen
... the Norwell desire was a smokescreen
and Gettleman really wants to clean up the cap and start fresh by grabbing his QB at #2, building with cheaper, young, OL
It’s a movie that I’d be more than willing to watch, but it doesn’t mesh with trading away draft picks for an above average LB already making what would appear to be every penny of his market value, or maybe more.
... the "Eli still has it" stuff is a smokescreen
... the Norwell desire was a smokescreen
and Gettleman really wants to clean up the cap and start fresh by grabbing his QB at #2, building with cheaper, young, OL
It’s a movie that I’d be more than willing to watch, but it doesn’t mesh with trading away draft picks for an above average LB already making what would appear to be every penny of his market value, or maybe more.
But would we get anywhere near as talented of an LB in the 4th round? I'd understand if we were talking about a 2nd or maybe even 3rd round pick. But the highest pick was only a 4th round pick
We have not had a 1,000 yard rusher since 2012. We have had a joke of an offensive line since 2013. You knuckleheads understand very little about football.
We have not had a 1,000 yard rusher since 2012. We have had a joke of an offensive line since 2013. You knuckleheads understand very little about football.
I will wager I know more than you do. And I am 100% sure Eli's cooked. He has been for two seasons and it's going to get worse. The guy got away with dopey errors because of his defense and his running game. Without them he's exposed as a journeyman QB who had two excellent playoff runs...over 7 years ago.
Probably not. I’m not bashing the trade, I’m saying that it doesn’t appear to indicate cleaning up the cap or starting fresh. It seems more in line with getting the band back together for one more tour with Eli as the head-man.
Maybe it makes sense, maybe it doesn’t. To my eye, there don’t seem to be enough resources available to patch the holes for the “one more try” path. But what do I know.
You can’t improve your luck with lower round picks if you don’t have your lower round picks.
Put up the Arizona Cardinal game on your next thread Â
The dude was playing with essentially a bunch of nobodies against the eventual SB champions late in the season, and he's slinging it around the field, hitting perfect passes to Roger Lewis....
Meanwhile we have a missed extra point, a blocked punt, a blocked FG, but it's Eli's backbreaking "momentum shifting" INT when up 20-7 in the 2nd quarter that did the Giants in... Not to mention the false start on the final drive when they were looking to score the walkoff TD from the five yard line.
What do I have to be irritated by? This is all playing out exactly how I said it would all season.
Looked a lot like the Green Bay playoff game last season..... Â
let's keep trotting him out there like we have the last FIVE YEARS and hope that he somehow gets halfway decent again.
Good plan.
I love Eli too, but he's just not a good player anymore. I mean he's really bad. And he stunk at the end of 2016 too when he had an okay line and decent receivers, so I'm not buying the "he was playing alone" crap. He has been - at BEST - average for the past five years.
Your devotion is kinda cute, Britt, but also misguided if you think that what he's done in the distant past is reason to plan or hope for the future.
We have not had a 1,000 yard rusher since 2012. We have had a joke of an offensive line since 2013. You knuckleheads understand very little about football.
Yes yes. Eli only needs a good OL, a good running game, a set of good WRs, a good catching TE, a good in-line blocking TE, and a solid D, then he’ll show us how good he really is.
Do I seem to understand football — Eli’s football — correctly with the list above? I do understand other QBs would need a lot more than these to be successful, such as strong ownership support and being extremely well paid.
We have not had a 1,000 yard rusher since 2012. We have had a joke of an offensive line since 2013. You knuckleheads understand very little about football.
I will wager I know more than you do. And I am 100% sure Eli's cooked. He has been for two seasons and it's going to get worse. The guy got away with dopey errors because of his defense and his running game. Without them he's exposed as a journeyman QB who had two excellent playoff runs...over 7 years ago.
Oh COME ON!
Journeyman my asshole. He looked damn good in 14-15 and along with Beckham...oh fuck it I give up. Just a stupid fucking thing to say. And I don't care if you literally shit smart little footballs. You're nuts.
His entire comment was that Eli is a journeyman QB with two excellent playoff runs.
Those two runs constituted 8 weeks of his career, in which his defense never gave up more than 20 points, including the game in Dallas which, coming off a tie at half time, the Eli-led offense [b]gained a grand total of 53 yards in the entire second half, and won[/ b], including the two Super Bowls, in which his defense gave up a net of 17 points and 15 points, against the greatest scoring offense. Do you know the last team who D gave up less points, and still failed to win the Super Bowl? The 1970s, the dead ball era.
Now, let’s look at the rest of Eli’s career outside of those 8 weeks. In those 14 years, he won a grand total of 8 more games than he lost.
So tell us, exactly what was funny or inaccurate in Joey’s comment??
You're taking his two Superbowl runs away from him now? Â
let's keep trotting him out there like we have the last FIVE YEARS and hope that he somehow gets halfway decent again.
Good plan.
I love Eli too, but he's just not a good player anymore. I mean he's really bad. And he stunk at the end of 2016 too when he had an okay line and decent receivers, so I'm not buying the "he was playing alone" crap. He has been - at BEST - average for the past five years.
Your devotion is kinda cute, Britt, but also misguided if you think that what he's done in the distant past is reason to plan or hope for the future.
Eli's "decline" is overstated. My recollection of the end of 2016 was Eli Manning flinging the ball around Lambeau and his receivers dropping TD's.
Looked similar to how he looked in the Eagle game at the end of this year, too. Playing well enough to win with a poor supporting cast. Dare I say "elevating" the players around him? Which everybody seems to say he can't do anymore?
It's not just me.... Gilbride saw it, Greg Cosell saw it and stated it mid season, Gettleman saw it, and Shurmur all see the same thing.
Whose outlook is more in line with the reality of the situation right now? Those that think Eli can still contribute, or those that think he's cooked/done?
Those that think Eli can still contribute, or those that think he's cooked/done?
Seems more like it's a constant argument of those that still think Eli is our future (you) or those that think it's time to plan ahead while we have the extremely rare opportunity to do so.
And if you don't think he is our future then you have fooled us all.
You're taking his two Superbowl runs away from him now?
MetsAreBack : 10:58 am : link : reply
Holy fucking shit.
To be fair, Britt and others took away Kurt Warner's MVP to help Eli's case last week.
Stating that Kurt Warner was only one of ten players in history to have an MVP during a Superbowl season, which is a rarity, doesn't qualify as taking it away from him, does it?
RE: You're taking his two Superbowl runs away from him now? Â
I understand the debate about his past two years - When you start to minimize his 2007 and 2011 accomplishments you really do sound like a moron.
Who minimized his 2007 and 2011 titles? Which facts in my 10:12am post about those two title runs weren’t significant, and accurate?
The Giants would not have won the title in either year, if they had any of the other 31 teams’ defense during those 8 weeks. Can we agree to that assessment, or is it just another outrageous attempt to minimize Eli’s accomplishment??
EVERY year Eli has been in the league after 2004--EVERY SINGLE ONE, save for 2013, which was bad, Eli has led an above average offense. EVERY. SINGLE. YEAR. The only time the offense slipped to unacceptable levels was in 2016 and 2017. In 2016 the team won 11 games and in the biggest one, against GB, Eli played well enough to win.
So since 2004 we are talking about 3 bad seasons. 3. Out of 13. 2013 was awful. Eli has always needed a little help. Less than most QBs need but more than some of the select few need. Guys like Rodgers could sover up more warts than Eli. OK. Fine. So 2013 we agree the O was god awful. Every other year under Coughlin Eli led an above average or better offense. So what changed in 2016 and 2017? McAdoo. He was not a professional head coach. Eli needs a little help--and that included the coaching.
3 out of 13 seasons Eli has led an abvove average or better offense and in 2 of those years Mcadoo was the HC.
Eli is not done. He just needs a little help. Most QBs do. I guarantee it right now...if the offense is somewhat capable, and it will be under Shurmur, Eli will lead an above average attack. I fucking guarantee it. Why? Because i've seen it happen every single season Eli has been a live bodied starter in a live bodied offense.
And again, 2016 Eli still gave this team a chance to win offensively.
calling the MVP a stats contest only and pointing out that Eli beat the MVP (though I don't recall how many passes he deflected or sacks Eli got in those games) as a way of saying the league MVP is pretty worthless compared to individual games does take it away from him, yeah.
Speaking of those MVPs, they would be Brady and Rodgers. Do we really want to get into a discussion comparing Eli with them?
as a slightly lesser Drew Brees if you can wrap your melons around that...Brees didn't win jack shit for a number of years in NO but still stat padded. Eli did the same fucking thing in 2014-2015. Big numbers little wins. Then 2016 he won 11 and still posts 26 TDs..then shit falls apart in 2017. Why? He's NOT much older. His physical skill are not in decline. If he can do it sometimes he can do it all the time. The offense was broken. Maybe Drew Brees in a dome with MCAdoo calling plays puts up slightly better numbers...same with Rodgers...and maybe even Big Ben does a little more...fine...have at it...but Eli STILL resembled a pro presence last year. He still didn't look like a complete mess...even if you think he did, he didn't. His numbers actually look merely pedestrian...despite the world ending around Eli, he posted 3500 yards--19 tds and 13 ints..IN THAT OFFENSE??? Trust me, if Eli or any QB was done in that mess? The numbers would be much worse.
You can't tell me that Eli won't dramatically improve if the OL is 10% better, the RBs are 10% better and the coaching goes from a 0 to a 7. Think about it...how much better did the 93 Giants look compared to 92? That's what will happen here. Just watch.
calling the MVP a stats contest only and pointing out that Eli beat the MVP (though I don't recall how many passes he deflected or sacks Eli got in those games) as a way of saying the league MVP is pretty worthless compared to individual games does take it away from him, yeah. And included Warner (which I bet nobody knew that little stat prior to me saying it, which was actually supporting Warner's case).
Speaking of those MVPs, they would be Brady and Rodgers. Do we really want to get into a discussion comparing Eli with them?
The MVP is a regular season stats contest. Is it not? My point then, as it is now, is that being the MVP does not translate to championships, which is why I noted that only ten players in history have had an MVP campaign and won a championship in the same year.
The point was in response to another poster saying that MVP is a very important box to have to check in order to get into the HOF, and I was countering that not having one didn't automatically disqualify you from consideration. And that's when I mentioned that Eli's team beat the MVP's team during both of those runs on the way to winning the Superbowl.
Or, since 2004 we are talking about 2 playoff-winning season’s over 14 years
2 out of 14, with a regular season record of 8 games over .500.
Quote:
And again, 2016 Eli still gave this team a chance to win offensively.
... By directing hus offense to a league-leading — the 2nd place team want even close — 22 consecutive games without scoring more than 20 points? Okay.
as a slightly lesser Drew Brees if you can wrap your melons around that...Brees didn't win jack shit for a number of years in NO but still stat padded. Eli did the same fucking thing in 2014-2015. Big numbers little wins. Then 2016 he won 11 and still posts 26 TDs..then shit falls apart in 2017. Why? He's NOT much older. His physical skill are not in decline. If he can do it sometimes he can do it all the time. The offense was broken. Maybe Drew Brees in a dome with MCAdoo calling plays puts up slightly better numbers...same with Rodgers...and maybe even Big Ben does a little more...fine...have at it...but Eli STILL resembled a pro presence last year. He still didn't look like a complete mess...even if you think he did, he didn't. His numbers actually look merely pedestrian...despite the world ending around Eli, he posted 3500 yards--19 tds and 13 ints..IN THAT OFFENSE??? Trust me, if Eli or any QB was done in that mess? The numbers would be much worse.
You can't tell me that Eli won't dramatically improve if the OL is 10% better, the RBs are 10% better and the coaching goes from a 0 to a 7. Think about it...how much better did the 93 Giants look compared to 92? That's what will happen here. Just watch.
Journeymen QBs are something you look to upgrade, Eli Manning by no way defines journeyman, it's quite ridiculous. And spare me the stats, stats can be used both ways.
If you need it explained in detail to you I'd say you don't know much about the position of qb. Maybe someone else has the mental energy to meticulously explain to you why he isn't a journeyman qb.
But does anyone have faith he can play 16 good games?
And if The Org passes on a QB at #2, then we are relying on him for another 32 starts. Without a long-term solution at the position.
You can like Eli or even love him like a son, but even his biggest fans have to admit that's not a good proposition.
The differences between the Eagles and Giants can be corrected.....there are no Dynasties, outside of NE, which is coming to the end
Many of us do. You're just not in our special club.
The first game post McAdoo against Dallas the offense seemed more competent and there were three key drops late that were critical. The passing game looked good against the Eagles and produced in week seventeen throwing to scrubs and there was a dropped TD as well.
I think the offense will improve simply because McAdoo is gone.
I will suggest Eli will play a big role in returning this team to greatness. However that role is more likely be about mentoring the next guy.
Let's not put the blame for that loss on Eli. He played his fucking heart out that game. Are there examples where Eli shit the bed in games that absolutely cost us a W? Of course, as with any other QB in the NFL.
The Giants fixed the entire defense in one offseason. Let's try and fix the OL. I'm confident that you'll see a much better Eli Manning if they do.
... the "Eli still has it" stuff is a smokescreen
... the Norwell desire was a smokescreen
and Gettleman really wants to clean up the cap and start fresh by grabbing his QB at #2, building with cheaper, young, OL
... the "Eli still has it" stuff is a smokescreen
... the Norwell desire was a smokescreen
and Gettleman really wants to clean up the cap and start fresh by grabbing his QB at #2, building with cheaper, young, OL
It’s a movie that I’d be more than willing to watch, but it doesn’t mesh with trading away draft picks for an above average LB already making what would appear to be every penny of his market value, or maybe more.
Quote:
... the "Eli still has it" stuff is a smokescreen
... the Norwell desire was a smokescreen
and Gettleman really wants to clean up the cap and start fresh by grabbing his QB at #2, building with cheaper, young, OL
It’s a movie that I’d be more than willing to watch, but it doesn’t mesh with trading away draft picks for an above average LB already making what would appear to be every penny of his market value, or maybe more.
But would we get anywhere near as talented of an LB in the 4th round? I'd understand if we were talking about a 2nd or maybe even 3rd round pick. But the highest pick was only a 4th round pick
Maybe it makes sense, maybe it doesn’t. To my eye, there don’t seem to be enough resources available to patch the holes for the “one more try” path. But what do I know.
You can’t improve your luck with lower round picks if you don’t have your lower round picks.
He is probably thinking about how good his Defense is going to look this summer at practice...
You do realize that the very same is true of you if you change just one or two words of what you typed, right?
The comments get funnier and funnier.
The dude was playing with essentially a bunch of nobodies against the eventual SB champions late in the season, and he's slinging it around the field, hitting perfect passes to Roger Lewis....
Meanwhile we have a missed extra point, a blocked punt, a blocked FG, but it's Eli's backbreaking "momentum shifting" INT when up 20-7 in the 2nd quarter that did the Giants in... Not to mention the false start on the final drive when they were looking to score the walkoff TD from the five yard line.
What do I have to be irritated by? This is all playing out exactly how I said it would all season.
But so have many people. The disagreements mostly come into play when we get to discussing whether it’s a shitty plan or not.
Good plan.
I love Eli too, but he's just not a good player anymore. I mean he's really bad. And he stunk at the end of 2016 too when he had an okay line and decent receivers, so I'm not buying the "he was playing alone" crap. He has been - at BEST - average for the past five years.
Your devotion is kinda cute, Britt, but also misguided if you think that what he's done in the distant past is reason to plan or hope for the future.
Yes yes. Eli only needs a good OL, a good running game, a set of good WRs, a good catching TE, a good in-line blocking TE, and a solid D, then he’ll show us how good he really is.
Do I seem to understand football — Eli’s football — correctly with the list above? I do understand other QBs would need a lot more than these to be successful, such as strong ownership support and being extremely well paid.
Quote:
We have not had a 1,000 yard rusher since 2012. We have had a joke of an offensive line since 2013. You knuckleheads understand very little about football.
I will wager I know more than you do. And I am 100% sure Eli's cooked. He has been for two seasons and it's going to get worse. The guy got away with dopey errors because of his defense and his running game. Without them he's exposed as a journeyman QB who had two excellent playoff runs...over 7 years ago.
Oh COME ON!
Journeyman my asshole. He looked damn good in 14-15 and along with Beckham...oh fuck it I give up. Just a stupid fucking thing to say. And I don't care if you literally shit smart little footballs. You're nuts.
The comments get funnier and funnier.
His entire comment was that Eli is a journeyman QB with two excellent playoff runs.
Those two runs constituted 8 weeks of his career, in which his defense never gave up more than 20 points, including the game in Dallas which, coming off a tie at half time, the Eli-led offense [b]gained a grand total of 53 yards in the entire second half, and won[/ b], including the two Super Bowls, in which his defense gave up a net of 17 points and 15 points, against the greatest scoring offense. Do you know the last team who D gave up less points, and still failed to win the Super Bowl? The 1970s, the dead ball era.
Now, let’s look at the rest of Eli’s career outside of those 8 weeks. In those 14 years, he won a grand total of 8 more games than he lost.
So tell us, exactly what was funny or inaccurate in Joey’s comment??
I understand the debate about his past two years - When you start to minimize his 2007 and 2011 accomplishments you really do sound like a moron.
Good plan.
I love Eli too, but he's just not a good player anymore. I mean he's really bad. And he stunk at the end of 2016 too when he had an okay line and decent receivers, so I'm not buying the "he was playing alone" crap. He has been - at BEST - average for the past five years.
Your devotion is kinda cute, Britt, but also misguided if you think that what he's done in the distant past is reason to plan or hope for the future.
Eli's "decline" is overstated. My recollection of the end of 2016 was Eli Manning flinging the ball around Lambeau and his receivers dropping TD's.
Looked similar to how he looked in the Eagle game at the end of this year, too. Playing well enough to win with a poor supporting cast. Dare I say "elevating" the players around him? Which everybody seems to say he can't do anymore?
It's not just me.... Gilbride saw it, Greg Cosell saw it and stated it mid season, Gettleman saw it, and Shurmur all see the same thing.
Whose outlook is more in line with the reality of the situation right now? Those that think Eli can still contribute, or those that think he's cooked/done?
Seems more like it's a constant argument of those that still think Eli is our future (you) or those that think it's time to plan ahead while we have the extremely rare opportunity to do so.
And if you don't think he is our future then you have fooled us all.
MetsAreBack : 10:58 am : link : reply
Holy fucking shit.
To be fair, Britt and others took away Kurt Warner's MVP to help Eli's case last week.
Quote:
You're taking his two Superbowl runs away from him now?
MetsAreBack : 10:58 am : link : reply
Holy fucking shit.
To be fair, Britt and others took away Kurt Warner's MVP to help Eli's case last week.
Stating that Kurt Warner was only one of ten players in history to have an MVP during a Superbowl season, which is a rarity, doesn't qualify as taking it away from him, does it?
I understand the debate about his past two years - When you start to minimize his 2007 and 2011 accomplishments you really do sound like a moron.
Who minimized his 2007 and 2011 titles? Which facts in my 10:12am post about those two title runs weren’t significant, and accurate?
The Giants would not have won the title in either year, if they had any of the other 31 teams’ defense during those 8 weeks. Can we agree to that assessment, or is it just another outrageous attempt to minimize Eli’s accomplishment??
Feeling pretty good/confident about having the opposite stance, here.
So since 2004 we are talking about 3 bad seasons. 3. Out of 13. 2013 was awful. Eli has always needed a little help. Less than most QBs need but more than some of the select few need. Guys like Rodgers could sover up more warts than Eli. OK. Fine. So 2013 we agree the O was god awful. Every other year under Coughlin Eli led an above average or better offense. So what changed in 2016 and 2017? McAdoo. He was not a professional head coach. Eli needs a little help--and that included the coaching.
3 out of 13 seasons Eli has led an abvove average or better offense and in 2 of those years Mcadoo was the HC.
Eli is not done. He just needs a little help. Most QBs do. I guarantee it right now...if the offense is somewhat capable, and it will be under Shurmur, Eli will lead an above average attack. I fucking guarantee it. Why? Because i've seen it happen every single season Eli has been a live bodied starter in a live bodied offense.
And again, 2016 Eli still gave this team a chance to win offensively.
Speaking of those MVPs, they would be Brady and Rodgers. Do we really want to get into a discussion comparing Eli with them?
You can't tell me that Eli won't dramatically improve if the OL is 10% better, the RBs are 10% better and the coaching goes from a 0 to a 7. Think about it...how much better did the 93 Giants look compared to 92? That's what will happen here. Just watch.
Speaking of those MVPs, they would be Brady and Rodgers. Do we really want to get into a discussion comparing Eli with them?
The MVP is a regular season stats contest. Is it not? My point then, as it is now, is that being the MVP does not translate to championships, which is why I noted that only ten players in history have had an MVP campaign and won a championship in the same year.
The point was in response to another poster saying that MVP is a very important box to have to check in order to get into the HOF, and I was countering that not having one didn't automatically disqualify you from consideration. And that's when I mentioned that Eli's team beat the MVP's team during both of those runs on the way to winning the Superbowl.
A little context.
So since 2004 we are talking about 3 bad seasons.
Or, since 2004 we are talking about 2 playoff-winning season’s over 14 years
2 out of 14, with a regular season record of 8 games over .500.
And again, 2016 Eli still gave this team a chance to win offensively.
... By directing hus offense to a league-leading — the 2nd place team want even close — 22 consecutive games without scoring more than 20 points? Okay.
You can't tell me that Eli won't dramatically improve if the OL is 10% better, the RBs are 10% better and the coaching goes from a 0 to a 7. Think about it...how much better did the 93 Giants look compared to 92? That's what will happen here. Just watch.
Brees is much better than Eli.
If you need it explained in detail to you I'd say you don't know much about the position of qb. Maybe someone else has the mental energy to meticulously explain to you why he isn't a journeyman qb.