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Giants one of 7 teams pursuing Dion Lewis

jeff57 : 3/13/2018 1:50 pm
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RE: the Giants don't need another support RB. They need a # 1  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 2:46 pm : link
In comment 13862391 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
a stud battering ram who can play 3 downs.


Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
We should've targeted him the first time around  
SHO'NUFF : 3/13/2018 2:46 pm : link
now? no thanks...Just get Saquon.
doesnt move the meter at all  
2cents : 3/13/2018 2:48 pm : link
not the type of move we need. rather see what shurmur could do with what we have on the roster already.. we were promised similar big things with the Vereen signing and that was largely underwhelming.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 2:49 pm : link
What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.

They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
RE: RE: the Giants don't need another support RB. They need a # 1  
Victor in CT : 3/13/2018 2:56 pm : link
In comment 13862416 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 13862391 Victor in CT said:


Quote:


a stud battering ram who can play 3 downs.



Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.


I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.
he's had a good career  
bc4life : 3/13/2018 2:57 pm : link
lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?
.....  
CoughlinHandsonHips : 3/13/2018 2:57 pm : link
I’d hope we learned our lesson with free agent running backs
RE: RE: RE: the Giants don't need another support RB. They need a # 1  
Breeze_94 : 3/13/2018 2:58 pm : link
In comment 13862443 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
In comment 13862416 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 13862391 Victor in CT said:


Quote:


a stud battering ram who can play 3 downs.



Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.



I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.


Barkley is the only guy who I'd maybe consider over a QB, just because he is so damn good and he really can help carry the offense for the next 6,7 years.
only if he's cheap  
GiantsFan84 : 3/13/2018 2:58 pm : link
he's not anything special. every RB in new england looks good when they are on the pats
RE: .  
2cents : 3/13/2018 3:00 pm : link
In comment 13862424 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.

They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.


i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.

i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
I'm sure it's a long shot  
McNally's_Nuts : 3/13/2018 3:05 pm : link
but what would be the point?

I want to see Perkins and Gallman get as many reps as possible.

At the end of 2016 we were saying many of the same things about Perkins as we are saying about Gallman this past season.
the other thing is, your bringing in a specialty short pass catching  
Victor in CT : 3/13/2018 3:05 pm : link
RB when your QB is not, nor has he ever been, a strong short passer. Eli's strength was always the medium to deep ball. If you draft a QB, will he be a good short range passer? And arc is right, Perkins can catch it. And so can Gallman. This would be wasted $$ and roster space. And Ellison, Engram and Adams all can catch it.

I'd love to see Engram at TE with Ellison in the old Bear Pascoe FB role on the field at the same time.
RE: RE: .  
Victor in CT : 3/13/2018 3:06 pm : link
In comment 13862454 2cents said:
Quote:
In comment 13862424 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.

They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.



i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.

i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.


this is the best point made yet: "this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season."
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 3:17 pm : link
In comment 13862454 2cents said:
Quote:
In comment 13862424 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.

They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.



i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.

i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.


It's not a luxury - it's a component of the offense this coach is going to run and a component of most successful NFL offenses.

You need a RB who plays well in the pass game.

Vereen actually did this quite well in 2015 and had more to do with Eli's strong year than people realize.

Not having a reliable safety valve out of the backfield can be a major detriment - which is exactly what we've seen recently when Vereen was either injured or not utilized.

This football team has several needs and I'd consider this one of them. They obviously feel the same way.
RE: Didnt we say the same about  
WillVAB : 3/13/2018 3:21 pm : link
In comment 13862284 superspynyg said:
Quote:
Vereen?


Bingo.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 3:27 pm : link
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
I agree with arc  
adamg : 3/13/2018 3:39 pm : link
Vereen was an invaluable piece when the offense last showed flashes. Gallman might be a decent receiving threat out of the backfield but he's not Vereen. Lewis would be a great complement to Gallman. Ideally, we get a Lewis or McKinnon type and then can draft a day 2 or day 3 RB to add to the stable.
Probably  
AcidTest : 3/13/2018 3:43 pm : link
pass, but it's all about the money. I agree that I'd rather just try and get something similar from Perkins.
For what they paid vs result, you can't speak well of that signing  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/13/2018 3:44 pm : link
either.
RE: .  
2cents : 3/13/2018 3:45 pm : link
In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.


2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.

either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 3:51 pm : link
In comment 13862570 2cents said:
Quote:
In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.



2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.

either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.


Not sure what your point is.

We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?

A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.

Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
RE: RE: RE: .  
2cents : 3/13/2018 3:57 pm : link
In comment 13862590 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 13862570 2cents said:


Quote:


In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.



2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.

either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.



Not sure what your point is.

We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?

A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.

Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.


my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 3:57 pm : link
BTW, Lewis can run the ball.

He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.

He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.

He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.

Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 3:59 pm : link
In comment 13862603 2cents said:
Quote:
In comment 13862590 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 13862570 2cents said:


Quote:


In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.



2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.

either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.



Not sure what your point is.

We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?

A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.

Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.



my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.


So then they shouldn't sign anyone.

No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
2cents : 3/13/2018 4:06 pm : link
In comment 13862611 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 13862603 2cents said:


Quote:


In comment 13862590 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 13862570 2cents said:


Quote:


In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.

He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.

He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.

This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.



2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.

either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.



Not sure what your point is.

We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?

A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.

Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.



my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.



So then they shouldn't sign anyone.

No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.



your point is taken, they are different players but you are certainly insufferable. In no way am i saying taht they shouldnt sign anyone. at this point in time, that money would benefit these much better in other areas of need.. i.e. offensive line. really hope you dont die up on that hill looking for our savior in dion lewis. Jeeze seriously.
Yawn  
ZogZerg : 3/13/2018 4:09 pm : link
This FA crops sucks
RE: .  
allstarjim : 3/13/2018 4:09 pm : link
In comment 13862604 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
BTW, Lewis can run the ball.

He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.

He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.

He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.

Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.


Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 4:11 pm : link
I'm insufferable because I'm presenting an opinion that doesn't jive with yours? Okay!

You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.

This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.

We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.

Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.
RE: .  
2cents : 3/13/2018 4:12 pm : link
In comment 13862637 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
I'm insufferable because I'm presenting an opinion that doesn't jive with yours? Okay!

You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.

This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.

We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.

Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.



ok cool, so after all we do agree, that money is better spent elsewhere...
Wow  
adamg : 3/13/2018 4:14 pm : link
That sounds like agreement to me. You guys are two sides of the same coin. You complete each other.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 4:14 pm : link
In comment 13862635 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 13862604 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


BTW, Lewis can run the ball.

He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.

He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.

He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.

Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.



Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.


It's possible he won't be as good elsewhere - sure. The first thing I said was that I'd want him if the price was reasonable. I'm not sitting here saying "let's go all out to land Lewis!"

Not at all.

For me, it's more about needing to fill that role. It doesn't have to be Lewis. But I'm not sold that Perkins can do it and I don't think it's Gallman's forte, either.

A safety valve out of the backfield is a tremendous help for a QB - vet or rookie.

We can go the draft route as well, and that's fine.

I am just of the belief that the more holes you can fill via FA, the more options that will present themselves on draft day.
RE: he's had a good career  
One Man Thrill Ride : 3/13/2018 4:21 pm : link
In comment 13862447 bc4life said:
Quote:
lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?


BRO.

Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?

329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.

Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.


TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.

Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
RE: RE: he's had a good career  
McNally's_Nuts : 3/13/2018 4:24 pm : link
In comment 13862673 One Man Thrill Ride said:
Quote:
In comment 13862447 bc4life said:


Quote:


lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?



BRO.

Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?

329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.

Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.


TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.

Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.


I love this guy!
RE: RE: he's had a good career  
2cents : 3/13/2018 4:26 pm : link
In comment 13862673 One Man Thrill Ride said:
Quote:
In comment 13862447 bc4life said:


Quote:


lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?



BRO.

Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?

329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.

Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.


TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.

Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.



comic relief, i love it.
RE: RE: he's had a good career  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 4:30 pm : link
In comment 13862673 One Man Thrill Ride said:
Quote:
In comment 13862447 bc4life said:


Quote:


lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?



BRO.

Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?

329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.

Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.


TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.

Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.


Thank you.

Sanity.
RE: .....  
giantsFC : 3/13/2018 5:02 pm : link
In comment 13862448 CoughlinHandsonHips said:
Quote:
I’d hope we learned our lesson with free agent running backs


.
RE: scott in albany  
Rflairr : 3/13/2018 5:15 pm : link
In comment 13862346 JonC said:
Quote:
is his agent.


That dude has been pushing Lewis since he was a freshman at Pitt
Hooray!!  
GeorgeAdams33 : 3/13/2018 5:36 pm : link
Another ex-patriot who we overpay to do next to nothing for us. When will we learn that it's the team, not the player. Meanwhile the few decent O-linemen who were available sign elsewhere while we talk about collecting more skill position players.
BUT CAN HE HELP OUR TEAM??  
One Man Thrill Ride : 3/13/2018 5:40 pm : link
Is this good?  
One Man Thrill Ride : 3/13/2018 5:42 pm : link
if you sign an ex-pat  
msh : 3/13/2018 5:45 pm : link
it needs to be solder not lewis there is plenty of RB anywhere upto around 4 probably but OT and in particular guys that will be a good LT very few more RT types again this this draft and much stronger at OG

there need to sign some solid OL and LB not RB in FA this draft is deep at RB,and with the browns trading for taylor it looks like he is the bridge for the QB they take at 1 which will leave barkley on the board for the giants if they choose to take him,if they take a move back they can still add someone lie guice or michel in the second round so no thank on lewis
....  
BleedBlue : 3/13/2018 6:01 pm : link
prob can unpin this now....wont happen with stewart signing and a deep RB class
RE: Hooray!!  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 6:28 pm : link
In comment 13862810 GeorgeAdams33 said:
Quote:
Another ex-patriot who we overpay to do next to nothing for us. When will we learn that it's the team, not the player. Meanwhile the few decent O-linemen who were available sign elsewhere while we talk about collecting more skill position players.


You guys can stop whining, now - we got 80 year old Jonathan Stewart instead.

Enjoy.
arc  
GeorgeAdams33 : 3/13/2018 6:34 pm : link
You are sadistic
RE: BUT CAN HE HELP OUR TEAM??  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/13/2018 7:42 pm : link
In comment 13862825 One Man Thrill Ride said:
Quote:


No, because Eli sails that pass.
Lewis is good.  
Tom in DC : 3/13/2018 9:08 pm : link
but I would let some one else overpay for him and worry about the O-Line
Lewis to Tenn  
Mdgiantsfan : 3/13/2018 9:20 pm : link
Per Schefter
Former Patriots’ RB Dion Lewis intends to sign a 4-year deal with Tennesee, source tells ESPN.
Joins Butler in TENN, 4 year deal  
BigBlue4You09 : 3/13/2018 9:25 pm : link
Another target gone
.  
arcarsenal : 3/13/2018 9:28 pm : link
Excellent move for TEN - he pairs perfectly with Henry.

Excellent move by Lewis  
GeorgeAdams33 : 3/13/2018 11:21 pm : link
The Titans have a good offensive line. The Giants don't have a single position out of the five locked down by anyone with any degree of certainty. We are a mess.
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