im more interested in mckinnon though...younger, healthier, more of a receiving threat (plus he knows shurmurs off) seems like a no brainer to me over lewis.
Man just take your money and go home what the hell does Lewis do for this team? What line is he going to be running behind and hes so tall Eli will never overthrow him. Who in the hell is signing a 28 year old small situational HB on a loosing team? DG it's ok to come home with all the money you went out with if things just did not go your way Daddy will understand.
about 4 years ago he was visiting the Giants, had a work out and was about to sign a contract. He was told to wait in the cafeteria for a little while and they would come down to get him to sign the deal. A lot of time goes by and then a rep from the Giants comes down and tells Dion that they are going with a different running back.
That running back was Orleans Darkwa. So while the Giants are interested, and even though it is a different regime running the team, he may not have much interest coming here.
I like him, but what he can do can be replicated by a rookie or even someone already on the roster. I'd rather see what we can get out of Gallman/Perkins/rookie.
because of his thus far lack of pedigree and performance, but you can use Paul Perkins the exact same way you would Dion Lewis, and he'd be a helluva lot cheaper than what Lewis is likely to get.
I know, I know...Perkins hasn't done anything. But while we're giving out passes for McAdoo's shit offense, perhaps Perkins has a chance to restore his value. The point being that the skill set is there, he has quickness and shiftiness. He's obviously not lead-back material, but neither would Lewis be.
I've pointed out several times that he played behind probably the worst OL configuration we put on the field before he was injured, and that he was also the starter before McAdoo gave up playcalling - and at that point, we basically refused to try committing to running the football.
So, there are reasons to believe he's not as bad as what we saw last season. But he also did nothing to help his case.
Lewis is better/quicker in space and has more experience as a pass catching back.
Perkins is a complete unknown at this point. There's a better chance of him being a complete non-factor than matching the production of someone like Lewis.
I really like what I saw from Gallman - but again, that's not a guy who is an every down player.
We need another RB one way or another. I'm fine drafting one, it's a great draft for RB's - but then that's one less pick we have to use elsewhere.
because of his thus far lack of pedigree and performance, but you can use Paul Perkins the exact same way you would Dion Lewis, and he'd be a helluva lot cheaper than what Lewis is likely to get.
I know, I know...Perkins hasn't done anything. But while we're giving out passes for McAdoo's shit offense, perhaps Perkins has a chance to restore his value. The point being that the skill set is there, he has quickness and shiftiness. He's obviously not lead-back material, but neither would Lewis be.
this too. And Gallman.
the Giants don't need another support RB. They need a # 1 Â
not the type of move we need. rather see what shurmur could do with what we have on the roster already.. we were promised similar big things with the Vereen signing and that was largely underwhelming.
Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.
Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.
Barkley is the only guy who I'd maybe consider over a QB, just because he is so damn good and he really can help carry the offense for the next 6,7 years.
What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
RB when your QB is not, nor has he ever been, a strong short passer. Eli's strength was always the medium to deep ball. If you draft a QB, will he be a good short range passer? And arc is right, Perkins can catch it. And so can Gallman. This would be wasted $$ and roster space. And Ellison, Engram and Adams all can catch it.
I'd love to see Engram at TE with Ellison in the old Bear Pascoe FB role on the field at the same time.
What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
this is the best point made yet: "this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season."
What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
It's not a luxury - it's a component of the offense this coach is going to run and a component of most successful NFL offenses.
You need a RB who plays well in the pass game.
Vereen actually did this quite well in 2015 and had more to do with Eli's strong year than people realize.
Not having a reliable safety valve out of the backfield can be a major detriment - which is exactly what we've seen recently when Vereen was either injured or not utilized.
This football team has several needs and I'd consider this one of them. They obviously feel the same way.
Vereen was an invaluable piece when the offense last showed flashes. Gallman might be a decent receiving threat out of the backfield but he's not Vereen. Lewis would be a great complement to Gallman. Ideally, we get a Lewis or McKinnon type and then can draft a day 2 or day 3 RB to add to the stable.
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
So then they shouldn't sign anyone.
No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.
By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
So then they shouldn't sign anyone.
No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.
your point is taken, they are different players but you are certainly insufferable. In no way am i saying taht they shouldnt sign anyone. at this point in time, that money would benefit these much better in other areas of need.. i.e. offensive line. really hope you dont die up on that hill looking for our savior in dion lewis. Jeeze seriously.
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.
I'm insufferable because I'm presenting an opinion that doesn't jive with yours? Okay!
You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.
This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.
We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.
Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.
I'm insufferable because I'm presenting an opinion that doesn't jive with yours? Okay!
You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.
This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.
We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.
Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.
ok cool, so after all we do agree, that money is better spent elsewhere...
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.
It's possible he won't be as good elsewhere - sure. The first thing I said was that I'd want him if the price was reasonable. I'm not sitting here saying "let's go all out to land Lewis!"
Not at all.
For me, it's more about needing to fill that role. It doesn't have to be Lewis. But I'm not sold that Perkins can do it and I don't think it's Gallman's forte, either.
A safety valve out of the backfield is a tremendous help for a QB - vet or rookie.
We can go the draft route as well, and that's fine.
I am just of the belief that the more holes you can fill via FA, the more options that will present themselves on draft day.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
Another ex-patriot who we overpay to do next to nothing for us. When will we learn that it's the team, not the player. Meanwhile the few decent O-linemen who were available sign elsewhere while we talk about collecting more skill position players.
it needs to be solder not lewis there is plenty of RB anywhere upto around 4 probably but OT and in particular guys that will be a good LT very few more RT types again this this draft and much stronger at OG
there need to sign some solid OL and LB not RB in FA this draft is deep at RB,and with the browns trading for taylor it looks like he is the bridge for the QB they take at 1 which will leave barkley on the board for the giants if they choose to take him,if they take a move back they can still add someone lie guice or michel in the second round so no thank on lewis
Another ex-patriot who we overpay to do next to nothing for us. When will we learn that it's the team, not the player. Meanwhile the few decent O-linemen who were available sign elsewhere while we talk about collecting more skill position players.
You guys can stop whining, now - we got 80 year old Jonathan Stewart instead.
The Titans have a good offensive line. The Giants don't have a single position out of the five locked down by anyone with any degree of certainty. We are a mess.
Gets banged up though. Would not overuse him. I think Shurmur could do a lot of things with him.
An overpay is certainly out of the question which means with so many teams chasing we'll almost certainly be outbid.
thank you. useful player on a great team, overwhelmed player on a bad team.
That running back was Orleans Darkwa. So while the Giants are interested, and even though it is a different regime running the team, he may not have much interest coming here.
We were already burned on Shane Vereen IMO.
Also didn't miss a game last season.
Surprised so many people would be against this.
Lewis' skillset plays extremely well in the type of offense Shurmur is going to run here and is a player type that we'll need.
I wouldn't pay a ton of money for him, but he's a good player.
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Vereen?
thank you. useful player on a great team, overwhelmed player on a bad team.
Vereen was overwhelmed? Where do you come up with this? He had a good first year with us then got hurt then just wasn't used effectively.
Haha. I recall one poster that was in love with Dion Lewis during the draft...probably more than Milton loves Josh Rosen. Was that Scott?
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In comment 13862284 superspynyg said:
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Vereen?
thank you. useful player on a great team, overwhelmed player on a bad team.
Vereen was overwhelmed? Where do you come up with this? He had a good first year with us then got hurt then just wasn't used effectively.
I'm talking about Lewis. He's good with the PAts, doubt he woudl be with these Giants.
I know, I know...Perkins hasn't done anything. But while we're giving out passes for McAdoo's shit offense, perhaps Perkins has a chance to restore his value. The point being that the skill set is there, he has quickness and shiftiness. He's obviously not lead-back material, but neither would Lewis be.
I've pointed out several times that he played behind probably the worst OL configuration we put on the field before he was injured, and that he was also the starter before McAdoo gave up playcalling - and at that point, we basically refused to try committing to running the football.
So, there are reasons to believe he's not as bad as what we saw last season. But he also did nothing to help his case.
Lewis is better/quicker in space and has more experience as a pass catching back.
Perkins is a complete unknown at this point. There's a better chance of him being a complete non-factor than matching the production of someone like Lewis.
I really like what I saw from Gallman - but again, that's not a guy who is an every down player.
We need another RB one way or another. I'm fine drafting one, it's a great draft for RB's - but then that's one less pick we have to use elsewhere.
I know, I know...Perkins hasn't done anything. But while we're giving out passes for McAdoo's shit offense, perhaps Perkins has a chance to restore his value. The point being that the skill set is there, he has quickness and shiftiness. He's obviously not lead-back material, but neither would Lewis be.
this too. And Gallman.
I'd pass, but wtf do I know?
Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
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a stud battering ram who can play 3 downs.
Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.
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In comment 13862391 Victor in CT said:
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a stud battering ram who can play 3 downs.
Then they should draft Barkley because that player is not here, nor is he available via FA.
I would not be upset at that. As long as they get a true impact player I don't care about the position so much. Just get it right whether it's BArkely, one of the QBs or somebody else.
Barkley is the only guy who I'd maybe consider over a QB, just because he is so damn good and he really can help carry the offense for the next 6,7 years.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
I want to see Perkins and Gallman get as many reps as possible.
At the end of 2016 we were saying many of the same things about Perkins as we are saying about Gallman this past season.
I'd love to see Engram at TE with Ellison in the old Bear Pascoe FB role on the field at the same time.
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What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
this is the best point made yet: "this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season."
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What happened with Vereen here is largely irrelevant.
They're not the same player and they're not going to be playing for the same coach here.
i would argue against that, very similar type player. injury prone; "3rd down" back, toted to be a good receiver out of the back field. this is a luxury move for a contending team not team trying to shake a 3-13 season.
i wont argue the coaching aspect, can only expect that change to help. but i still stand by the point, luxury pickkup, wont change much at all.
It's not a luxury - it's a component of the offense this coach is going to run and a component of most successful NFL offenses.
You need a RB who plays well in the pass game.
Vereen actually did this quite well in 2015 and had more to do with Eli's strong year than people realize.
Not having a reliable safety valve out of the backfield can be a major detriment - which is exactly what we've seen recently when Vereen was either injured or not utilized.
This football team has several needs and I'd consider this one of them. They obviously feel the same way.
Bingo.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
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By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
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In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:
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By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
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In comment 13862570 2cents said:
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In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:
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By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
So then they shouldn't sign anyone.
No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.
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In comment 13862590 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13862570 2cents said:
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In comment 13862511 arcarsenal said:
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By the way, Vereen was quite good the first year he was here.
He caught a career-high 59 passes in 2015 and was a big part of a productive offense.
He was injured almost all of 2016 and I'm not sure anyone's going to be able to evaluate a whole lot from the disaster that was the 2017 season.
This idea that he was a major bust signing or never produced here isn't true.
2015 offense was a result of 1 thing. Odell Beckham. His 96 catches, 1,400 yards andn 13 tds. Vereen and his 4tds and 750 ish yards accounted for about 10% of the total offense.
either way, 2015 should not the example of a team we are trying to re recreate.
Not sure what your point is.
We should keep relying on Odell Beckham to be like 70% of the team's offensive output?
A pass catching scatback isn't a luxury. It's something most teams in this league use regularly.
Look at the way Shurmur used McKinnon last year. If he was limited to Murray and Ham, the MIN backfield would have been far less productive.
my point is that money is needed elsewhere, man, you got a hard on for this guy. you are trying to say Vereen was huge part of their "success" in 2015, and i am saying even if you were some how able to garuntee me that same production from lewis, nothing at all will change. We will have 7-8 mil less in cap room and still be a shitty football team.
So then they shouldn't sign anyone.
No singular player is gong to change the fortunes of the Giants on their own, so I guess we should just not do anything.
your point is taken, they are different players but you are certainly insufferable. In no way am i saying taht they shouldnt sign anyone. at this point in time, that money would benefit these much better in other areas of need.. i.e. offensive line. really hope you dont die up on that hill looking for our savior in dion lewis. Jeeze seriously.
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.
You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.
This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.
We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.
Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.
You must have missed the part where I said that I preferred McKinnon to Lewis.
This isn't about Dion Lewis. It's about filling a role on this offense that I personally feel is important. He's one guy who could do it. He's not the only guy.
We can add more than one player. We aren't limited to just one free agent. We have more than one need. This is one of several.
Feel free to continue telling me that I worship Lewis or something equally pointless, though... it's really convincing.
ok cool, so after all we do agree, that money is better spent elsewhere...
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BTW, Lewis can run the ball.
He averaged 5 YPC last year and was less than 150 yards away from a 1000 yard rushing season on a team that literally used 4-5 RB's in a giant rotation.
He was the best RB the Patriots had last year.
He's not a guy you bang between the tackles constantly or use a lot on early downs, but he just had a really productive season.
Shane Vereen had never even eclipsed 400 yards rushing in a season before he came here (and still hasn't) - can we stop comparing these players? The only thing they have in common is that they're Patriot RB's.
Fair points, arc...but don't we always see these guys not replicate the success they had in New England's offense elsewhere? Life is a bit easier playing with Tom Brady and that offensive system and how creative it is. Lewis is a good player, but with so many teams competing for him, I think he's the kind of player where the money exceeds the value he brings. I do believe Perkins can do everything Lewis can do, if the system and the blocking is there for him.
It's possible he won't be as good elsewhere - sure. The first thing I said was that I'd want him if the price was reasonable. I'm not sitting here saying "let's go all out to land Lewis!"
Not at all.
For me, it's more about needing to fill that role. It doesn't have to be Lewis. But I'm not sold that Perkins can do it and I don't think it's Gallman's forte, either.
A safety valve out of the backfield is a tremendous help for a QB - vet or rookie.
We can go the draft route as well, and that's fine.
I am just of the belief that the more holes you can fill via FA, the more options that will present themselves on draft day.
BRO.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
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lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?
BRO.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
I love this guy!
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lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?
BRO.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
comic relief, i love it.
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lot of mileage. what about mckinnon?
BRO.
Thrill Ride has to chime in here. Dion Lewis has had some injuries, but mileage?
329 CAREER carries. Le'Veon Bell had 321 in 2017 alone.
Jerick McKinnon, who Thrill also likes, has 474 career carries. Unfortunately he seems unlikely to follow Shurmur here since Coach kinda buried him behind Cook and Latavius.
TO ALL YOU OTHER JABRONI'S.
Dion Lewis is a proven effective running back who can impact on all 4 downs. Shurmur discussed how much he values RBs who can contribute in the passing game. This is a player who can be a contributor on our next contending team, and he does not prohibit the team from jumping on Barkley or tapping into the draft's deep RB class.
Thank you.
Sanity.
.
That dude has been pushing Lewis since he was a freshman at Pitt
there need to sign some solid OL and LB not RB in FA this draft is deep at RB,and with the browns trading for taylor it looks like he is the bridge for the QB they take at 1 which will leave barkley on the board for the giants if they choose to take him,if they take a move back they can still add someone lie guice or michel in the second round so no thank on lewis
You guys can stop whining, now - we got 80 year old Jonathan Stewart instead.
Enjoy.
No, because Eli sails that pass.
Former Patriots’ RB Dion Lewis intends to sign a 4-year deal with Tennesee, source tells ESPN.