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Article on draft RBs rushing explosiveness

gogiants : 3/21/2018 2:48 pm
Not very positive on Barkley. He had a better sophomore season. In 2017 Barkley was good at really breaking one open. He had 11 rushing plays of 30+ yards which was good for 3rd among draft RBs. However on 10+ yards just so so. As the article points out his plays of lost yardage are concerning.

ProFootball Weekly - ( New Window )
Ha ha ha.  
Ira : 3/21/2018 2:51 pm : link
Watch some of his games. The ol was so bad, there were often 2 or 3 defenders who already crossed scrimmage before he got the ball.
Excerpt on Barkley  
Peppers : 3/21/2018 3:15 pm : link
Quote:
Surprisingly, the top running back in this class has some concerns in regards to his big-play ability. We have all seen the amazing highlights of Barkley’s big runs, but those didn’t happen as frequently as we want to believe. What is the most concerning is the staggeringly high number of negative runs. Barkley was always looking to hit a big play — and that often resulted in big losses.

Anytime numbers like these are presented against Barkley, the response that comes back is that Penn State’s offensive line played poorly this season. That may be true, but many of these other running backs played behind weak offensive lines as well. Barkley also had the benefit of playing against light fronts as he had just an average of 6.29 defenders in the box, the fewest in the class. Truth be told, Barkley is a boom-or-bust runner who relies on his athleticism to beat defenses. He will always be a threat in the receiving game to create big plays, but his resume as a big-play runner leaves a lot to be desired.


I shake my head every time I read a fan post about the "stacked box" Barkley had to face..

Barkleys value is in his receiving ability out of the back field. If you think you're getting a guy who is going to get the tough yards inside the tackles like Zeke, Gurley, or Fournette you're mistaken.

Everyone loves Pro Comps.. My comp is a more explosive Matt Forte.

There are no concerns about his  
KWALL2 : 3/21/2018 3:16 pm : link
big play ability.
Peppers  
ryanmkeane : 3/21/2018 3:18 pm : link
i disagree. Barkley is 233 pounds. Just because there's not a ton of clips of him plowing through defenders doesn't mean he can't get the tough yardage inside the tackles.
RE: Ha ha ha.  
Victor in CT : 3/21/2018 3:21 pm : link
In comment 13878123 Ira said:
Quote:
Watch some of his games. The ol was so bad, there were often 2 or 3 defenders who already crossed scrimmage before he got the ball.


then he will be right at home with the Giants. :-)
RE: Peppers  
Greg from LI : 3/21/2018 3:23 pm : link
In comment 13878244 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
i disagree.


RE: Excerpt on Barkley  
allstarjim : 3/21/2018 3:24 pm : link
In comment 13878228 Peppers said:
Quote:


Quote:


Surprisingly, the top running back in this class has some concerns in regards to his big-play ability. We have all seen the amazing highlights of Barkley’s big runs, but those didn’t happen as frequently as we want to believe. What is the most concerning is the staggeringly high number of negative runs. Barkley was always looking to hit a big play — and that often resulted in big losses.

Anytime numbers like these are presented against Barkley, the response that comes back is that Penn State’s offensive line played poorly this season. That may be true, but many of these other running backs played behind weak offensive lines as well. Barkley also had the benefit of playing against light fronts as he had just an average of 6.29 defenders in the box, the fewest in the class. Truth be told, Barkley is a boom-or-bust runner who relies on his athleticism to beat defenses. He will always be a threat in the receiving game to create big plays, but his resume as a big-play runner leaves a lot to be desired.



I shake my head every time I read a fan post about the "stacked box" Barkley had to face..

Barkleys value is in his receiving ability out of the back field. If you think you're getting a guy who is going to get the tough yards inside the tackles like Zeke, Gurley, or Fournette you're mistaken.

Everyone loves Pro Comps.. My comp is a more explosive Matt Forte.


Who wrote that junk?

If you are very generous in your interpretation of a box. You can see as soon as the ball is snapped the safeties come crashing down on him unless it's an obvious pass situation. Might not be technically "8 in the box" in a lot of cases, but when you watch his 2018 tape you see that defenses were throwing the kitchen sink at Barkley, and McSorley was an afterthought. Obvious to see on tape. Difference between just looking at stats and watching the games.
Barry Sanders Part 2?  
JohnB : 3/21/2018 3:33 pm : link
.
Some thought Penn State had a decent O-Line  
gogiants : 3/21/2018 3:45 pm : link
Ranked 27th on list of top 50 O-lines going into 2017

https://athlonsports.com/college-football/college-footballs-top-50-offensive-lines-2017 - ( New Window )
Matt Forte could only dream  
Bluesbreaker : 3/21/2018 4:05 pm : link
of having the feet and stop on a dime go speed that
Barkley has .. He will have to get use to the speed and the quick decisions he has to make and cut down on the
negative runs also the leaping ability at the goal line .
Nelson in the 1st  
Emlen'sGremlins : 3/21/2018 4:37 pm : link
Michel in the 2nd
RE: Barry Sanders Part 2?  
Greg from LI : 3/21/2018 4:37 pm : link
In comment 13878290 JohnB said:
Quote:
.


Again - Barry Sanders in 1988 put up virtually identical stats to Barkley's last two seasons combined. Stop comparing him to Barry Sanders. He isn't close to the player Sanders was.
RE: RE: Barry Sanders Part 2?  
allstarjim : 3/21/2018 4:46 pm : link
In comment 13878461 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13878290 JohnB said:


Quote:


.



Again - Barry Sanders in 1988 put up virtually identical stats to Barkley's last two seasons combined. Stop comparing him to Barry Sanders. He isn't close to the player Sanders was.


He ran the ball 344 times that year. Personally I believe Barry Sanders is the best RB of all time, but I think Saquon is going to be as good as anyone since Tomlinson and I think he has a very good chance to be as good or better than him.
RE: RE: RE: Barry Sanders Part 2?  
firedbytheboss : 3/21/2018 6:04 pm : link
In comment 13878477 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 13878461 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


In comment 13878290 JohnB said:


Quote:


.



Again - Barry Sanders in 1988 put up virtually identical stats to Barkley's last two seasons combined. Stop comparing him to Barry Sanders. He isn't close to the player Sanders was.



He ran the ball 344 times that year. Personally I believe Barry Sanders is the best RB of all time, but I think Saquon is going to be as good as anyone since Tomlinson and I think he has a very good chance to be as good or better than him.


Better than Peterson? really? cmon. highly doubtful
RE: RE: RE: RE: Barry Sanders Part 2?  
allstarjim : 3/21/2018 6:18 pm : link
In comment 13878594 firedbytheboss said:
Quote:
In comment 13878477 allstarjim said:


Quote:


In comment 13878461 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


In comment 13878290 JohnB said:


Quote:


.



Again - Barry Sanders in 1988 put up virtually identical stats to Barkley's last two seasons combined. Stop comparing him to Barry Sanders. He isn't close to the player Sanders was.



He ran the ball 344 times that year. Personally I believe Barry Sanders is the best RB of all time, but I think Saquon is going to be as good as anyone since Tomlinson and I think he has a very good chance to be as good or better than him.



Better than Peterson? really? cmon. highly doubtful


Yes. Different kind of RBs. Saquon is more of a complete back than Peterson.
RE: Peppers  
Peppers : 3/21/2018 6:19 pm : link
In comment 13878244 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
i disagree. Barkley is 233 pounds. Just because there's not a ton of clips of him plowing through defenders doesn't mean he can't get the tough yardage inside the tackles.


Ryan, I hope you're not insinuating his size indicates he's a successful runner inside the tackles.. I think people assume because of his size he can be a power back but that's just not his style.

When you watch him you'll see his hesitation hitting the crease. He'll stop and stutter his feet. To be an inside runner you have to be decisive and hit the crease hard. Barkley doesn't do that. He almost always looks for the cutback lane (reminds me of Shady this way) or he's trying to bounce it outside. That's who Barkley is as runner.
RE: RE: Excerpt on Barkley  
Peppers : 3/21/2018 6:22 pm : link
In comment 13878267 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 13878228 Peppers said:


Quote:




Quote:


Surprisingly, the top running back in this class has some concerns in regards to his big-play ability. We have all seen the amazing highlights of Barkley’s big runs, but those didn’t happen as frequently as we want to believe. What is the most concerning is the staggeringly high number of negative runs. Barkley was always looking to hit a big play — and that often resulted in big losses.

Anytime numbers like these are presented against Barkley, the response that comes back is that Penn State’s offensive line played poorly this season. That may be true, but many of these other running backs played behind weak offensive lines as well. Barkley also had the benefit of playing against light fronts as he had just an average of 6.29 defenders in the box, the fewest in the class. Truth be told, Barkley is a boom-or-bust runner who relies on his athleticism to beat defenses. He will always be a threat in the receiving game to create big plays, but his resume as a big-play runner leaves a lot to be desired.



I shake my head every time I read a fan post about the "stacked box" Barkley had to face..

Barkleys value is in his receiving ability out of the back field. If you think you're getting a guy who is going to get the tough yards inside the tackles like Zeke, Gurley, or Fournette you're mistaken.

Everyone loves Pro Comps.. My comp is a more explosive Matt Forte.




Who wrote that junk?

If you are very generous in your interpretation of a box. You can see as soon as the ball is snapped the safeties come crashing down on him unless it's an obvious pass situation. Might not be technically "8 in the box" in a lot of cases, but when you watch his 2018 tape you see that defenses were throwing the kitchen sink at Barkley, and McSorley was an afterthought. Obvious to see on tape. Difference between just looking at stats and watching the games.


Marcus Mosher is actually well respected.

Watching the games only helps if you know what you're watching..
RE: RE: RE: Excerpt on Barkley  
allstarjim : 3/21/2018 6:36 pm : link
In comment 13878617 Peppers said:
Quote:
In comment 13878267 allstarjim said:


Quote:


In comment 13878228 Peppers said:


Quote:




Quote:


Surprisingly, the top running back in this class has some concerns in regards to his big-play ability. We have all seen the amazing highlights of Barkley’s big runs, but those didn’t happen as frequently as we want to believe. What is the most concerning is the staggeringly high number of negative runs. Barkley was always looking to hit a big play — and that often resulted in big losses.

Anytime numbers like these are presented against Barkley, the response that comes back is that Penn State’s offensive line played poorly this season. That may be true, but many of these other running backs played behind weak offensive lines as well. Barkley also had the benefit of playing against light fronts as he had just an average of 6.29 defenders in the box, the fewest in the class. Truth be told, Barkley is a boom-or-bust runner who relies on his athleticism to beat defenses. He will always be a threat in the receiving game to create big plays, but his resume as a big-play runner leaves a lot to be desired.



I shake my head every time I read a fan post about the "stacked box" Barkley had to face..

Barkleys value is in his receiving ability out of the back field. If you think you're getting a guy who is going to get the tough yards inside the tackles like Zeke, Gurley, or Fournette you're mistaken.

Everyone loves Pro Comps.. My comp is a more explosive Matt Forte.




Who wrote that junk?

If you are very generous in your interpretation of a box. You can see as soon as the ball is snapped the safeties come crashing down on him unless it's an obvious pass situation. Might not be technically "8 in the box" in a lot of cases, but when you watch his 2018 tape you see that defenses were throwing the kitchen sink at Barkley, and McSorley was an afterthought. Obvious to see on tape. Difference between just looking at stats and watching the games.



Marcus Mosher is actually well respected.

Watching the games only helps if you know what you're watching..


Do we have any idea by whom?

Seriously, if you want to talk about pre-snap boxes, perhaps that number is right. But in my study, as soon as the ball was snapped, you had linebackers and safeties crashing down.

If the argument is that Saquon Barkley DIDN'T face a great deal of stacked boxes, then I would argue that the person making that statement doesn't know what they are watching OR they haven't even watched.
RE: RE: Barry Sanders Part 2?  
bw in dc : 3/21/2018 6:42 pm : link
In comment 13878461 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13878290 JohnB said:


Quote:


.



Again - Barry Sanders in 1988 put up virtually identical stats to Barkley's last two seasons combined. Stop comparing him to Barry Sanders. He isn't close to the player Sanders was.


This is so right. I have NEVER seen a back anywhere comparable to Sanders. A total freak...the natural.
Rodney Hampton also  
Somnambulist : 3/21/2018 6:55 pm : link
Wasn't a power inside runner, until the Giants turned him into one. IMO it would be a waste of Barkley's talents, but perhaps when he slows down in a few years.
Yards per carry when contacted at or behind  
shyster : 3/21/2018 7:01 pm : link
line of scrimmage (2017):

Rashaad Penny: 3.32 (1st of 58)
Saquon Barkley; 0.46 (57th of 58)

The comparison to McKoy is made in the comments.







Link - ( New Window )
Sanders just had inhumane leg flexibility and strength  
santacruzom : 3/21/2018 7:07 pm : link
That allowed him to almost constantly be in a slightly crouched position, which would in turn allow him to launch himself in bizarre directions at a split second's notice.

To me it looks like Barkley has that same characteristic.
er  
santacruzom : 3/21/2018 7:08 pm : link
inhuman
.  
arcarsenal : 3/21/2018 7:09 pm : link
Peterson is one of the greatest runners ever, but he wasn't a major pass game weapon the way Barkley will be. He did have good years catching the football - but I think Barkley is a guy who will catch 60+ balls out of the backfield.
so far on this board i have heard that Barkley is better than:  
firedbytheboss : 3/21/2018 7:17 pm : link
Adrian Peterson
Barry Sanders
Zeke Elliott
Todd Gurley
Matt Forte


They're already inducting this guy in the Hall of Fame..

This crowd knows nothing about Football. You know how many elite backs win championships? Close to zero. Know how many elite QBs win Super Bowls? Almost all of them. We should be finding an elite replacement to Eli and stop obsessing over a 6 year battering ram.

lol you guys crack me up.
The problem with the PFW analysis...  
bw in dc : 3/21/2018 7:17 pm : link
is that it assumes all levels of competition are equal.

Somehow that would need to be smoothed out.

If back X has five 50+ runs against the Mercers of the world that isn’t as impressive as back Y getting 20+ yard runs against, say, a Tennessee, Auburn, Florida.

In other words, all breakaway runs in college are not created equal...
RE: so far on this board i have heard that Barkley is better than:  
arcarsenal : 3/21/2018 7:23 pm : link
In comment 13878695 firedbytheboss said:
Quote:
Adrian Peterson
Barry Sanders
Zeke Elliott
Todd Gurley
Matt Forte


They're already inducting this guy in the Hall of Fame..

This crowd knows nothing about Football. You know how many elite backs win championships? Close to zero. Know how many elite QBs win Super Bowls? Almost all of them. We should be finding an elite replacement to Eli and stop obsessing over a 6 year battering ram.

lol you guys crack me up.


Sure, it's so simple - that's why Aaron Rogers, the best QB in the sport, has only been to one Super Bowl in a decade of being a starter.

Just get an elite QB and you're there!

And boy, that Nick Foles... he sure is elite.
RE: RE: so far on this board i have heard that Barkley is better than:  
firedbytheboss : 3/21/2018 11:24 pm : link
In comment 13878704 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 13878695 firedbytheboss said:


Quote:


Adrian Peterson
Barry Sanders
Zeke Elliott
Todd Gurley
Matt Forte


They're already inducting this guy in the Hall of Fame..

This crowd knows nothing about Football. You know how many elite backs win championships? Close to zero. Know how many elite QBs win Super Bowls? Almost all of them. We should be finding an elite replacement to Eli and stop obsessing over a 6 year battering ram.

lol you guys crack me up.



Sure, it's so simple - that's why Aaron Rogers, the best QB in the sport, has only been to one Super Bowl in a decade of being a starter.

Just get an elite QB and you're there!

And boy, that Nick Foles... he sure is elite.


right.. and one super bowl is more than all those guys put together.
Not one running back you guys mentioned in this thread could wear  
NikkiMac : 3/22/2018 7:50 am : link
Walter Payton’s shoes or Emmit Smith or Gayle Sayers or Eric Dickerson

Maybe I’m old school but anyway give me the QB at #2 most likely Rosen

Or trade down this talk of Barkley is ridiculous Take the picks and you want

A bell cow? How about Nick Chubb in the 3rd round ?
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