From @gmfb: My understanding is that #Giants WR Odell Beckham Jr will not set foot on a field without a new contract extension agreed to — with the #Giants or any team. ... This comes a day after owner John Mara said no one is “untouchable” in trade talks.
The Giants need to make a decision to trade or sign him sooner rather that later. Otherwise he will continue to be a huge distraction.
I said it last night. I pay him. He’s not going to stop producing because he got paid. Not that kind of player. 5 year deal 18 mil per. Use the franchise tag on Collins if you have to. It’s cheaper for a safety than a WR anyway.
He might be. He's been making a lot more from endorsements for a while now. Nike alone pay him $5.8 million a year. A few sites put his non football earnings at about $9 million a year (but that would seem to be guess work). Although ultimately his injury last year may make that less likely. Out of sight out of mind is the phrase that comes to mind.
The problem for the team is that we simply don't have the cap room to facilitate a new contract for him this year.
Is he under contract now?
The Giants need to make a decision to trade or sign him sooner rather that later. Otherwise he will continue to be a huge distraction.
That seems like Odell’s thinking too. I’d pay him. No hesitation. You are not going to get whet his value is in a trade and this draft is a poor one for WRs.
This is all a game of leverage and Odell is using his.
.... you can't dismiss the Fact that he does not have a long term deal that was in the news last year---He has been "Bad News" for almost a Year---The Owner has spoken Publicly about the Organization's frustration with Odell.
I don't believe that Odell will play thru this disagreement, and I don't blame the Giants if they decide to move away from Him. Also, the Present Cap Situation may force the team away from an ability to sign a lucrative deal No.
True to his word? I must of missed the direct quote from beckham
Beckham to Cleveland for #4 overall.
Giants pick twice in top 5.
Beckham is reunited with Jarvis Landry and can spend his down time following LeBron around Cleveland.
Win win.
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Should.
Is he under contract now?
He is. Could the team not cut him at the first sign of a production slip? It goes both ways.
That certainly could happen. Or the Giants pay the best offensive player in franchise history, unless Gettleman wants to pick in the top 5 again next year.
I understand the reservations, but if Watkins and Evans deserved their money then so does OBJ.
.... you can't dismiss the Fact that he does not have a long term deal that was in the news last year---He has been "Bad News" for almost a Year---The Owner has spoken Publicly about the Organization's frustration with Odell.
I don't believe that Odell will play thru this disagreement, and I don't blame the Giants if they decide to move away from Him. Also, the Present Cap Situation may force the team away from an ability to sign a lucrative deal No.
When they dealt JPP, it opened the door for more money allocated to Beckham and Landon.
He lost the 2017 to a meaningless play. I don't blame him at all.
Did you bring this same energy when Aaron Donald held out last year?
You know, you really are the worst.
It gives the front office more time to evaluate whether to commit a long term contract to OBJ.
I said the same thing back in January when Eric was doing his "Year in Review" posts. Many talk in absolutes that OBJ will never be traded/not signed when the reality is that despite his great talent, we still lose. Even in the one winning season, he was the best offensive player which couldn't top 20 points in a game. When the game matters most (playoffs), he came up small. I'm pretty sure we are capable of losing seasons without him.
Because it saves the Giants 20 million next year.
It gives the front office more time to evaluate whether to commit a long term contract to OBJ.
Giants don’t need to. He’s under contract, we picked up his option for 8.5m.
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primarily because he wasn’t a fit for this defense. They didn’t save much money this year, so how can anyone suggest it was about money?
Because it saves the Giants 20 million next year.
Then they would have traded him next year. Jpp is a bad for for the direction of the team.
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So if he is true to his word, then he is willing to lose $4.75M in game checks. I'm not even considering potential fines for missing training camp as often times they are threatened, but often waived.
He might be. He's been making a lot more from endorsements for a while now. Nike alone pay him $5.8 million a year. A few sites put his non football earnings at about $9 million a year (but that would seem to be guess work). Although ultimately his injury last year may make that less likely. Out of sight out of mind is the phrase that comes to mind.
The problem for the team is that we simply don't have the cap room to facilitate a new contract for him this year.
Actually, I hadn't factored in he's earning this year, I'm sure we could come up with something but we'd still have to make another couple of moves to do it.
He's earning $8,459,000 this year.
Beckham to Cleveland for #4 overall.
Giants pick twice in top 5.
Beckham is reunited with Jarvis Landry and can spend his down time following LeBron around Cleveland.
Win win.
Cleveland is not trading pick 4 for one player. They also are set at WR.
People forget JPP was a declining pass rusher with one good hand about to turn 30. Trading him was smart. OBJ is a young, game changing offensive talent. You don’t just trade that away for unknowns.
I was told for the past few years that OTAs don't matter. OBJ is better off jumping rope with Carter. I would presume that OBJ won't be showing up at OTAs this year either even before the latest proclamation of "holding out".
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Or is he not yet a distraction? What will it take, people???????
You know, you really are the worst.
That's because I am right.
I said it last night. I pay him. He’s not going to stop producing because he got paid. Not that kind of player. 5 year deal 18 mil per. Use the franchise tag on Collins if you have to. It’s cheaper for a safety than a WR anyway.
100% agree. With JPP being traded, a bunch of money was cleared from next years cap so this is doable. It is all about OBJ showing a tad more maturity. He will always be a diva, so that is not the issue. He is a competitor so that is not the issue. You just don't want major distractions and for the focus to be on the game and not the off field BS. That is what Mara is concerned with and rightly so.
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Or is he not yet a distraction? What will it take, people???????
Did you bring this same energy when Aaron Donald held out last year?
No. Because I dont follow Rams Interactive. We are Giants fans here.
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Should.
Is he under contract now?
Yes.
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In comment 13886271 Frankie in Flushing said:
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Or is he not yet a distraction? What will it take, people???????
You know, you really are the worst.
That's because I am right.
Nope because you have one note and you play it over and over again.
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New offense, new system. He needs to be at everything.
I was told for the past few years that OTAs don't matter. OBJ is better off jumping rope with Carter. I would presume that OBJ won't be showing up at OTAs this year either even before the latest proclamation of "holding out".
What proclamation are you talking about? Beckham has not said shit
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Maybe it will get NYG around to trading this guy BEFORE the draft where they can get some immediate compensation.
Beckham to Cleveland for #4 overall.
Giants pick twice in top 5.
Beckham is reunited with Jarvis Landry and can spend his down time following LeBron around Cleveland.
Win win.
Cleveland is not trading pick 4 for one player. They also are set at WR.
People forget JPP was a declining pass rusher with one good hand about to turn 30. Trading him was smart. OBJ is a young, game changing offensive talent. You don’t just trade that away for unknowns.
Why wouldn't they trade the 4 pick for him? Aside from Landry, they have Gordon, who could blow up at any time, and Coleman who's been a bust so far. They might make the deal to reunite Beckham with Landry.
What would it take? I think it starts with the # 4 pick. I'd then want one other premium pick i.e. # 35 and Corey Coleman. We then walk out of the draft w something like:
RD1, Pick - 2 QB Rosen
RD1, Pick - 4 RB Barkley (replaces OBJ as the star or focal point of the Offense)
RD2, Pick - 34 OG Will Hernandez
RD2, Pick - 35 WR DJ Moore
RD3, Pick - 66 CB MJ Stewart
RD3, Pick - 69 OG Braden Smith
RD4, Pick - 108 LB Josey Jewell
RD5, Pick - 139 S/CB Kameron Kelly
+ Corey Coleman
I saw the same shit about Goff.
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why? As talented as he is, he generates penalties and bad press. Just had a video come out of you smiling a joint, a girl doing lines and oh by the way you missed 11 games in 2017. Shut up and play
Because his career can be cut short at any moment and he can get cut on the spot. It's called securing your future.
I'll believe this when OBJ or his agent comes out and publicly states this. Til then it's just more bs to make headlines and click bait.
2 simple questions since you bring up culture...
Who was the first player to call ogletree and welcome him to the giants?
When did the locker room start going to shut last year? Seems to me it was after Beckham was hurt and not around as much
Give me a couple high draft picks, maybe a 1 and a 3 and away we go.
Last year wasn't much better with him...
The guy is one of the best offensive players in the league.
He'll be a young QBs best friend, turning 6 yard slants into 65 yard touchdowns
Its all just posturing on both sides.
Aren't the fines for missing camp extreme?
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Offensive talent this franchise has ever had is beyond me. It’s as tho people forget what last year was like without him. (Yes they also lost the corpse of Marshall but if you think he was going to change things you are delusional). So what is the plan then? You are going to trade him to create a new wr1 hole? If you think that whoever you draft in mid to late first round is going to seemlessly step into that you are insane. Then regardless of what they do at 2 it’s a moot point because this offense is going to be the same without him.
Last year wasn't much better with him...
You mean 2017 when he barely played because of a preseason injury and then broken ankle?
Or 2016 when the team went 11-5 and he single handily won the team 3-4 games.
Its all just posturing on both sides.
Concur
The issue is, he has turned off ownership by his lack of growing up this off season. Now I can see ownership refusing to pay him, especially the rate he is demanding.
What week does he rejoin the team? The question is, when does he need to rejoin the team so that he doesn't lose a year of eligibility?
Another lost year at the WR position for the Giants.
Do they trade him, let him hold out, or sign him to a huge deal?
Sounds like a good BBI poll.
That was my thought last night.
Well, I'm in my mid 40's and I don't see things the way you do and neither do any of my 40-50 year old friends. I think you need a bigger sample size. The guy is loving life and playing his way without being a locker room issue (any quote from his teammates are positive) He is super passionate about his job. I don't think many people can say that.
whats fair 16?
Antiono browns contract:
Hes not as good as brown
whats fair 16?
Antiono browns contract:
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The deal is for four years and $68 million, which will pay Brown $17 million annually over four years and $18.5 annually for three years. The extension keeps him in Pittsburgh through the 2021 season.
Hes not as good as brown
Doesn't matter. He will get more money. It's hte way the NFL works. Solder isn't as good as Joe Thomas either, but he still got more money.
The next elite receiver will get more than Odell even i he is not as good.
1 example?
How about snacks Harrison letting Beckham babysit his newborn..
How about shephard having him be a groomsman in his wedding..
How about all of the charity work he does...
How about exec's at the pro bowl being impressed with how great he was with the fans and the whole experience...
But because hedances and has crazy hair, proposed to a kicking net, he is a cancer?
Rob.
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Some of the worst people you will encounter. Can literally buy you dinner and turn around and stab you in the back later. Just because he did 1 good thing does not excuse the bad behavior and everything else. No, I'm not calling him a sociopath, just using that as an example. Another example is the guy who is the nicest to his wife and then goes around cheating on her. I don't think I would put him in the good husband category.
1 example?
How about snacks Harrison letting Beckham babysit his newborn..
How about shephard having him be a groomsman in his wedding..
How about all of the charity work he does...
How about exec's at the pro bowl being impressed with how great he was with the fans and the whole experience...
But because hedances and has crazy hair, proposed to a kicking net, he is a cancer?
You forgot lifting his leg and peeing like a dog.
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It's past time.
huh?
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I’m guessing his bullshit hurts, but there has to be someone out there willing to part with a 1.
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Rob.
Oh, damn. You went there.
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Of course it is, what GM wouldn’t want to try to bend us over in a trade negotiation?
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Rob.
Sorry, I was laughing at this.
Only reason I'd think of trading OB is that he wants too much money.
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In comment 13886351 Boy Cord said:
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.
Rob.
Sorry, I was laughing at this.
I would give Rob a chance to beat out Eli for the starting job. I think he could do it.
It stretches credulity to believe Mara’s statement was made in a vacuum. It is a virtual certainty Beckham’s position was privately made known to Gettleman and ownership for some time now - and Mara was the one who decided to go public to create negotiating leverage - putting Beckham’s agent in a position of having to either back do2n or respond to Mara’s ploy. An asshole negotiating move by Mara as far as I am concerned.
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
JonC that’s my problem with Odell, he doesn’t try to hide it. As a matter of fact I think he entertains it.
Only reason I'd think of trading OB is that he wants too much money.
Bunch of kids. The fan base is marginally split on Beckham. Most of us that aren’t kids are tired of him and his nonsense.
I’d trade him for a couple 2s.
...DOESN'T need!
My poor Giants just can't seem to catch a fucking break.
It would hurt very much if we traded him, but he very well could force the team's hand.
A boat trip that by several reports was far more tame than the partying the defense did that same weekend in NY. But Instagram wasn't there, so people don't give a fuck.
The boat trip is one of those IQ tests many people fail.
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A potential generational player in OB who has nowhere to hide in the modern social media world catching his every move and can't stop effing up, and potentially hanging onto Eli a bit too long.
JonC that’s my problem with Odell, he doesn’t try to hide it. As a matter of fact I think he entertains it.
I just dnt think he cares about optics...
Cruz was on talking about boat trip, and he said when one of the rappers tweeted the picture out he immediately got mad and nervous, he showed Beckham and basically Beckham was like who cares...
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Feelings about OBJ really depend on your age. The younger fans want to keep him and the older ones want to get rid of him. Interesting and I think true. My friends and I in our fifties all feel he is a head case and an attention whore. Our belief is you can't win with this type of player except maybe in basketball. We all remember great Giants teams that had only average receivers, not only won, but were fun to watch. We all don't think it makes any sense to tie up any where close to the money he wants in a WR. Only a QB. Give us 2 reasonable picks and don't let the door hit you in the ass. You are another teams problem problem. If you want a culture change, does OBJ really fit with that? Culture is so important in football as last season showed. Anyway, even if we wanted to extend him, how can you do it cap wise? Any extension is going to cost more than his current cap hit. We need to sign our rookies and honestly need a few more vet pieces to be competitive this year, which I beleive they feel they can be.
2 simple questions since you bring up culture...
Who was the first player to call ogletree and welcome him to the giants?
When did the locker room start going to shut last year? Seems to me it was after Beckham was hurt and not around as much
HUH?? Ummm, no... I think you are taking two pieces, not even remotely related and drawing a conclusion from them.
So when Aaron Donald held out, did you say the Rams should cut him?
A boat trip that by several reports was far more tame than the partying the defense did that same weekend in NY. But Instagram wasn't there, so people don't give a fuck.
The boat trip is one of those IQ tests many people fail.
It certainly is.
OMG, settle down. Nobody says OBJ sucks. But, if you can't see the potential issues here then you are a blind fan.
It would hurt very much if we traded him, but he very well could force the team's hand.
Although I would much rather resign him to a 2 year deal that gives him a modest raise, with a promise to revisit this next offseason.
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
Amazing post and a 100% true.
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Are prepared to watch him have a hall of fame career somewhere else while the giants struggle to replace him at wide receiver
OMG, settle down. Nobody says OBJ sucks. But, if you can't see the potential issues here then you are a blind fan.
What potential issues?
There are 2 things I can never defend, norman and dog peeing..
Do those 2 things stop you from signing Beckham? If so then no reason to debate
It could. If it wasn't for yesterday's mind numbing threads I'd say yes but i'm not sure right now. I see a few are going to fight this one to the death so its certainly possible.
Beckham can be annoying with some of his antics, but I don't think he's an evil person or anything. He's also pretty talented.
All of that having been said, I will understand if the Giants trade him. It's becoming a mini version of what happened with Shockey. The problem is that his value is probably at its lowest now because of the holdout, missing most of last season with an injury, and his "antics."
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Are prepared to watch him have a hall of fame career somewhere else while the giants struggle to replace him at wide receiver
OMG, settle down. Nobody says OBJ sucks. But, if you can't see the potential issues here then you are a blind fan.
I don't "want him traded". But I am not opposed to trading anybody if at the right price. If I can get Barkley for OBJ, its merely one exceptional talent for another. However, Barkley is more attractive because he'd be cost controlled for 5 years.
Now imagine if we draft a QB at #2. Then you can just pencil in the inevitable - the QB controversy. Especially if Eli struggles early...
This is setting up to be one helluva year at Jints Central. A grand soap opera - “As Jints Central Turns”...
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Raanan linked to ESPN insider which I'm not paying for. Any chance you could tell us what the consensus is that they are saying he's worth?
LOL. Maybe he secretly is one?
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Interesting. Apparently lower than most believe, according to NFL execs
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Raanan linked to ESPN insider which I'm not paying for. Any chance you could tell us what the consensus is that they are saying he's worth?
No. I'm not paying for it either.
Apply that to every WR that got paid before him. For Antonio Brown, Julio Jones, etc. the answer is yes.
Yes and yes.
Talent wise, OBJ should be paid top Wr dollar.
But he’s replaceable - to an extent - and this team has a lot of holes that need repairing....
his value is down due the injury but he wants his extension now. timing isn't right
There is no way to really enforce that. Do the benefits of having OBJ on the team outweigh the loss of talent elsewhere on the roster. It really is as simple as that.
hhmm, I wonder if this ever happened in the NFL before...
I'll be 58 soon and I agree. The team is kind of screwed if OBJ holds out. The Giants won't have the coin to give him a jackpot until next year. Sucks but bye-bye.
By his 4th season, Lawrence Taylor had already been smoking fucking crack daily for a while, to pick one example out of a hundred for the best defensive talent this team ever had.
There are levels to things we should be outraged about and people need to take a little time before picking their battles.
The problem isn't the partying, it isn't going on vacation with his friends on an off day before a game, it isn't that he has a really good time as a young single famous guy, it's that everything has to be filmed and put on social media. He's just giving all the drama queens something to freak out about. Plenty of guys do what Odell does, but nobody knows becuase their whole lives aren't documented.
Odell is making the right decision by holding out. He played last year on good faith that he'd be taken care of and he sustained a season ending injury. He deserves to get paid. Doesn't mean we have to cater to his demands. If he's expecting 20M per, it's going to be a battle.
The only issue is whether you want to commit the amount of financial resources to a WR, especially to one coming off an injury.
Everything else is busybody nonsense.
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With 18-19 mill a year as long as the contract stipulates that if he is suspended or his behavior becomes a distraction or detrimental to the team in any way he loses a few mill off the top. Make him realize it’s time to grow up or his wallet will feel it.
There is no way to really enforce that. Do the benefits of having OBJ on the team outweigh the loss of talent elsewhere on the roster. It really is as simple as that.
Actually, there is a way to enforce such behavior. Every player's contract has a forfeiture clause that was negotiated with the latest CBA. Certain distinctions must be made to enable the team to enforce the clause. A suspension by the league or team is not enough. Now, if he is suspended by the team with Conduct Detrimental to the Team, then the team has the option to void future guarantees and allow for the them to seek repayment of the pro-rated signing bonus. All of this is just a technical distinction as the Giants have proven that they weren't willing to enforce the clause with Eli Apple's contract so they likely would not with OBJ's future contract.
Meh, I can guarantee this was 100% expected by our FO. DO you really think Mara and co woke up this morning shocked by this news?
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
Good comment. I don't "like" or "dislike" ODB, FWIW I would keep him on the team at almost any price.
However, it is still the case that ownership seems to believe that there are expectations of a "New York Football Giant" player that other teams may not have.
I suspect that, in John Mara's mind anyway, a New York Football Giant does not pee like a dog on another team's logo, not even the Eagles.
Whether this view carries the day or not remains to be seen.
Nothing OBJ has done even comes close to 'Conduct Detrimental'. It's little stupid shit with him that is magnified by the glare of the spotlight he craves. What you see is always what you are going to get.
That's not really how things work, nor should it. Clearly that's a bargaining chip for the Giants, but why would they want a disgruntiled star? That doesn't do anyone good. The Giants will take care of OBJ if he's being reasonable.
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Actually, there is a way to enforce such behavior. Every player's contract has a forfeiture clause that was negotiated with the latest CBA. Certain distinctions must be made to enable the team to enforce the clause. A suspension by the league or team is not enough. Now, if he is suspended by the team with Conduct Detrimental to the Team, then the team has the option to void future guarantees and allow for the them to seek repayment of the pro-rated signing bonus. All of this is just a technical distinction as the Giants have proven that they weren't willing to enforce the clause with Eli Apple's contract so they likely would not with OBJ's future contract.
Nothing OBJ has done even comes close to 'Conduct Detrimental'. It's little stupid shit with him that is magnified by the glare of the spotlight he craves. What you see is always what you are going to get.
I'm not insinuating he has. My response was to your response that was to another poster who mentioned the conduct detrimental distinction.
Should I marry her?
Get rid of this guy and don't look back.
Trade him for picks now. Package our second round pick (and whatever) with OBJ and get Cleveland's #4.
My 13 year old son loves him, talks about his talent all the time. Makes excuses for his poor decisions and actions. Has always wanted to keep him, until now.
I wonder if the Jags would trade for him, it would really make them a great team.
Very good point Will.
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is the culture we live in today where news is craved 24/7, whether it is good news, bad news, legitimate news or fluff drivel to drive clicks.
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
Amazing post and a 100% true.
Excellent and spot on post, imv. He’ll get signed. Hopefully it’s a few weeks before the season opener to preserve his body.
Excellent and spot on post, imv. He’ll get signed. Hopefully it’s a few weeks before the season opener to preserve his body.
Nice to have you posting again BB56. You think he is worth the cap hit?
He'll hold out.
They'll listen to offers, but unless its a blowaway one,even with a declining trade value with every negative comment or action, he's here. Likely so is Marshall because of this.
With or without him they'll practice, play preseason, negotiate along the way, play the games.
Wait for which side blinks first.
We need to just let it play out.
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Excellent and spot on post, imv. He’ll get signed. Hopefully it’s a few weeks before the season opener to preserve his body.
Nice to have you posting again BB56. You think he is worth the cap hit?
Thanks. I think he’s worth it. Only 25, already entrenched as one of the league’s best. The proverbial difference-maker. This is the social media age. Some take it in stride, others thrive in it. As a fan, I couldn’t care less about his antics moving forward. He is who he is. If it legitimately affects the team in a negative way, he shouldn’t be here. Only ownership and the new regime will determine that. I hope he shines HERE for years to come
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If he wants a new deal he’s going to have to accept something below market. The Giants control him at 8.5 this year and around 17 next year under the franchise tag. If he’s demanding 18 or 19 per it makes zero sense for the Giants to simply cut a check right now.
That's not really how things work, nor should it. Clearly that's a bargaining chip for the Giants, but why would they want a disgruntiled star? That doesn't do anyone good. The Giants will take care of OBJ if he's being reasonable.
Not how things work? Look what Wash did with Cousins. They didn’t believe in him long term so they franchised him a few years running before trading him.
If OBJ expects to be the highest paid WR in the game he’s going to have to wait at least one year, possibly two. The Giants would basically be giving him an extra 14 mil over the next two years when they don’t have to. And they’d be stuck with a huge dead money hit if he got hurt or did something stupid.
If he wants the big contract, be a good soldier this year and produce on the field. He’ll get paid in ‘19. Makes no sense for the Giants to sacrifice value under the CBA that the players collectively bargained.
Also, if you are an Eli proponent and support giving Collins and Beckham new deals essentially fully guarantees Eli is cut and gone after this season.
Gettleman is prepping to go shopping next offseason, not tie up his cap.
Sammo85 : 9:55 am : link : reply
aren’t giving this guy what he thinks he’s worth. I don’t see them giving more than Watkins or Evans got.
They might not offer more than what Watkins or Evans got. However, he does deserve more than both Watkins and Evans.
I really don't care what they do with him. Pay him or trade him. It'd be great to have a guy with his talent, but I also like players that don't choke in the playoffs.
Fantastic talent, but it's not like I own his jersey or anything.
It's worked with the Steelers & Lev Bell.
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In comment 13886484 WillVAB said:
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If he wants a new deal he’s going to have to accept something below market. The Giants control him at 8.5 this year and around 17 next year under the franchise tag. If he’s demanding 18 or 19 per it makes zero sense for the Giants to simply cut a check right now.
That's not really how things work, nor should it. Clearly that's a bargaining chip for the Giants, but why would they want a disgruntiled star? That doesn't do anyone good. The Giants will take care of OBJ if he's being reasonable.
Not how things work? Look what Wash did with Cousins. They didn’t believe in him long term so they franchised him a few years running before trading him.
If OBJ expects to be the highest paid WR in the game he’s going to have to wait at least one year, possibly two. The Giants would basically be giving him an extra 14 mil over the next two years when they don’t have to. And they’d be stuck with a huge dead money hit if he got hurt or did something stupid.
If he wants the big contract, be a good soldier this year and produce on the field. He’ll get paid in ‘19. Makes no sense for the Giants to sacrifice value under the CBA that the players collectively bargained.
What Synder did with Cousins is not a good example for anybody to follow - they also got bupkis for Cousins.
Beckham is doing the right thing for Beckham here, but the team doesn't have the cap room. We'll see how Gettleman handles it.
Released, whatever. The point remains. Makes no sense for the Giants to gift OBJ the top WR deal at this juncture.
Here is a guy who got hurt last year (no fault of his own) who literally mimicked taking a piss on the field prior to injury. Against a team who has pissed all over his since he entered the league. He then double downed on it after the game offering no apologies and promising to do it again.
Over the off season a video surfaces in which he's clearly smoking a blunt. A week later a story, likely BS, surfaces about him being sued.
Ownership, who have been nothing but patient, coddling, and fair towards the kid finally shows some sort of push back and frustration with an ever growing list of unusual incidents (punching a wall in GB, norman incident, etc etc) and the very next day, in an act of defiance, him and his people leak that he's not stepping foot on the field without a new contract.
This isnt a guy with Giants DNA.
Targeting Odell Beckham: 63%; 35-7 TD-INT; QB rating 111.4
Targeting anyone else: 59.5%; 285-209; QB rating 79.9
Yeah, lets trade that guy. It is just nonsense. He has never been arrested, and by all accounts is beloved by his teammates in the locker room. Then add to the fact that he is one of the best players in the entire NFL. How would you ever get value in a trade?
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Giants
Sammo85 : 9:55 am : link : reply
aren’t giving this guy what he thinks he’s worth. I don’t see them giving more than Watkins or Evans got.
They might not offer more than what Watkins or Evans got. However, he does deserve more than both Watkins and Evans.
That’s subjective. Being deserving of something doesn’t mean you actually get it.
Targeting Odell Beckham: 63%; 35-7 TD-INT; QB rating 111.4
Targeting anyone else: 59.5%; 285-209; QB rating 79.9
Yeah, lets trade that guy. It is just nonsense. He has never been arrested, and by all accounts is beloved by his teammates in the locker room. Then add to the fact that he is one of the best players in the entire NFL. How would you ever get value in a trade?
More of an indictment on Eli than anything else.
Hardest Worker in the room.
Not a distraction at all.
Also, if you are an Eli proponent and support giving Collins and Beckham new deals essentially fully guarantees Eli is cut and gone after this season.
Gettleman is prepping to go shopping next offseason, not tie up his cap.
That doesn't make sense. If you are going to pay him it has to be more than 2 WR's who aren't as good. Why would the Giants be ok risking $16 million and not $18 million? If he's getting a contract from the Giants it will be as the highest paid WR or no contract at all.
"Strahan this week accused the team of making trade inquiries about him in early February, before it offered him a new contract reportedly worth about $58 million over seven years, which he did not accept. He also said the Giants refused to negotiate after making the offer in late February, and suggested they merely tried to make him look greedy and never intended to sign him to a huge new deal."
This is how the NFL is. It is not my favorite part of it but people care more about all this stuff because it is constantly put in our faces.
Sign Odell and move on. When he is on the field the Giants can score on any play. How many players in the league can you say that about.
Strahan trade, big contract, issues - ( New Window )
Hardest Worker in the room.
Not a distraction at all.
Nail on head TLG, nail on head.
Hardest Worker in the room.
Not a distraction at all.
Bingo, nuff said
Targeting Odell Beckham: 63%; 35-7 TD-INT; QB rating 111.4
Targeting anyone else: 59.5%; 285-209; QB rating 79.9
Yeah, lets trade that guy. It is just nonsense. He has never been arrested, and by all accounts is beloved by his teammates in the locker room. Then add to the fact that he is one of the best players in the entire NFL. How would you ever get value in a trade?
Eh, those statistics came from a broken offense.
Odell Beckham has been in the league 4 years, and teams have made the playoffs and won championships without him. The Giants actually did make the playoffs one year with him, but he was one of the reasons they lost. Go figure.
There's no denying his talent. But the team can do fine without him. Others are doing fine without him. If they trade him, so be it.
Eli, Beckham, Vernon, Harrison, Jenkins
I would limit:
Landon Collins
N. Solder (only because the line needs time to gel)
Sterling Shepard
Has there been a player that has held out into the regular season since the 2011 agreement?
OBJ is doing this for a few reasons. First, so he doesn't have to play in the preseason and risk injury. Second, to maybe get a new contract early.
But is very unlikely he holds out into Game 1 in September.
That’s subjective. Being deserving of something doesn’t mean you actually get it.
Nothing subjective about saying OBJ is a better receiver and has had a better career so far than Watkins or Evans. I don't see how anyone could argue for the other guys.
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In comment 13886245 ajr2456 said:
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Should.
Is he under contract now?
He is. Could the team not cut him at the first sign of a production slip? It goes both ways.
Honor the contract that you signed. He may have out produced his rookie contract but he also sat out quite a few games. The move is not a smart one on his part. It is adding to the negativity that has been around him.
His injuries (rookie year and in ‘17) could have and often do, happen to many around the league through the years. Nothing unusual or indicative of proneness. No risk there, imo
Hardest Worker in the room.
Not a distraction at all.
Boat trip was a distraction. Entire team had to answer question about it all week.
Norman fiasco was a distraction. Team had to answer questions about it all season. He was selfish on the field.
Fake pissing like a dog was extremely unprofessional and embarrassing. Teammates left answering questions about it. He said he would do it again. The contract negotiation is going to be a shitshow.
There is more.
That said, I would only trade him if we are blown away by the offer. It would be reasonable to expect he will become more of a distraction with a huge contract combined with lots of guaranteed money. Not OBJs biggest fan but do not hate him either.
This is how I remember it as well as was wondering if there was anyone else who remembered it too.
Beckham just doesn't seem like the type to hold out to me. I know that's probably being a little naive but I think he's just one of those rare guys who actually loves playing the game too much to holdout. Matter of fact, I thought he had a quote out there where even he laughed off the idea of holding out because that would mean he wouldn't be able to play. The man just lost a majority of the previous season and now he's going to hold out even more and miss more playing time?
I don't know. I just don't see it with him. I could be wrong but as has been asked already a few times in this thread, has Beckham actually come out and said this?
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
I couldn't have said this any better. Great Post!! This absurd witch hunt is ridiculous and if it continues we will lose one of the most talented players in Giants history.
I swear that celebration has taken more flack than almost anything else. People don't use it to just mock the celebration, but to make assumptions about OBJ as a person too.
It's insanity.
Didn't they play the Panthers week 15??
Must have been a brutal 2 weeks.....
...made such a statement.
But this is a "what have you done for me lately league", and if OBJ thinks the Giants will open the floodgates without verifying he is back to his former greatness, I'm afraid OBJ is gonna be left pounding sand.
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Sammo85 : 10:09 am : link : reply
That’s subjective. Being deserving of something doesn’t mean you actually get it.
Nothing subjective about saying OBJ is a better receiver and has had a better career so far than Watkins or Evans. I don't see how anyone could argue for the other guys.
No, my subjectivity point was about getting the $ allocation or assigned value one thinks he deserves. It’s largely situational. Actual allocations
valuation metrics are not done in a vacuum. Just because player X got 17m doesn’t mean player Z will automatically get 18m.
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Eli Manning career stats as of week 2 2017
Targeting Odell Beckham: 63%; 35-7 TD-INT; QB rating 111.4
Targeting anyone else: 59.5%; 285-209; QB rating 79.9
Yeah, lets trade that guy. It is just nonsense. He has never been arrested, and by all accounts is beloved by his teammates in the locker room. Then add to the fact that he is one of the best players in the entire NFL. How would you ever get value in a trade?
Eh, those statistics came from a broken offense.
Odell Beckham has been in the league 4 years, and teams have made the playoffs and won championships without him. The Giants actually did make the playoffs one year with him, but he was one of the reasons they lost. Go figure.
There's no denying his talent. But the team can do fine without him. Others are doing fine without him. If they trade him, so be it.
I think you misread the stat. Those are Eli's career numbers, not just over the last 4 years.
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Here is a guy who got hurt last year (no fault of his own) who literally mimicked taking a piss on the field prior to injury.
I swear that celebration has taken more flack than almost anything else. People don't use it to just mock the celebration, but to make assumptions about OBJ as a person too.
It's insanity.
Would you ever do something like that? Would anyone you know that you consider to be a mature adult who makes good decisions do that?
Giants GM Dave Gettleman politely declined comment on this story this morning, but promised to address it when he meets the press tomorrow ....
In comment 13886642 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Here is a guy who got hurt last year (no fault of his own) who literally mimicked taking a piss on the field prior to injury.
I swear that celebration has taken more flack than almost anything else. People don't use it to just mock the celebration, but to make assumptions about OBJ as a person too.
It's insanity.
Would you ever do something like that? Would anyone you know that you consider to be a mature adult who makes good decisions do that?
Yes.
I'm on the side of the aisle where I do NOT want him to leave the NYG. He's a generational talent who, if healthy, can put up all-time great numbers.
However, Beckham catches his fair share of criticism mostly for decisions and things HE does and brings upon HIMSELF. Odell is in the same category of stardom millennial (a term I use lightly because I am one as well) as the Paul Pogba's, and those athletes that have superstar talent but portray themselves as the prototypical millennial. I'm sorry, you want to get paid and yet you get caught on video in Paris with some Instagram model while she's doing coke and you're clearly smoking a roach? Or, just take a look through his social media feed and compare it to Antonio Brown's. You know what Antonio Brown was doing on March Break? His Instagram shows you: working out, working at getting better, commitment and dedication to his craft. Odell's is him posing like a model, in various nice cars or with his friends. Which is all fine, but your truth is exposed nowadays in the modern state of the internet. Odell's truth is he's an immature person who has incredible athletic talent, but seems to be more concerned with the "coin" and not the "kwan" (Jerry Maguire reference - but I think it's accurate).
If you want a raise and to be the highest paid non-QB, act like it. Don't be a jackass off the field, don't be a jackass on the field either. Get ahold of yourself and grow the fuck up. Different era's or not, you don't see Eli or Derek Jeter being careless with their public exposure, do you?
If Odell plans on holding out, I don't blame him one bit especially after losing a season to serious injury. But I also think he needs to reel in his need for attention and improve his decision-making. If you've got the wrong friends in your life, which he very well may since he's shot into superstardom, he needs to fix that. Show your employer that their investment in you is well-founded and will result in positive ROI.
Should I marry her?
Get rid of this guy and don't look back.
Trade him for picks now. Package our second round pick (and whatever) with OBJ and get Cleveland's #4.
Yeah, except you aren’t fucking OBJ and there is zero chance he plays for another team if we commit so this analogy doesn’t work.
With all the celebrations people have done, didn't somebody poop out a ball once too?
I'm not looking at him as a mature adult. I'm looking at him as a football player who scored a TD and attempted to entertain. I mean, he's done a ton of different celebrations. I'm supposed to parse out what ones make him a despicable person?
If he just did a salsa and NBC piped in cool music for it......
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Would you ever do something like that? Would anyone you know that you consider to be a mature adult who makes good decisions do that?
With all the celebrations people have done, didn't somebody poop out a ball once too?
I'm not looking at him as a mature adult. I'm looking at him as a football player who scored a TD and attempted to entertain. I mean, he's done a ton of different celebrations. I'm supposed to parse out what ones make him a despicable person?
If he just did a salsa and NBC piped in cool music for it......
If somebody pooped out a football they would be a moron also.
I dont mind people celebrating after they score...they should. But taking a theoretical piss on the field shows a lack of intelligence. What would make him think that's a good decision? And then to double down and say he'd do it again (even after being penalized) shows that this guys agenda is Odell Beckham.
We'll probably have to agree to disagree here. I just dont see why people justify this crap. Guys like this never last in one place. Right or wrong this guy wont be a giant in 3 years
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In comment 13886586 NYG07 said:
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Eli Manning career stats as of week 2 2017
Targeting Odell Beckham: 63%; 35-7 TD-INT; QB rating 111.4
Targeting anyone else: 59.5%; 285-209; QB rating 79.9
Yeah, lets trade that guy. It is just nonsense. He has never been arrested, and by all accounts is beloved by his teammates in the locker room. Then add to the fact that he is one of the best players in the entire NFL. How would you ever get value in a trade?
Eh, those statistics came from a broken offense.
Odell Beckham has been in the league 4 years, and teams have made the playoffs and won championships without him. The Giants actually did make the playoffs one year with him, but he was one of the reasons they lost. Go figure.
There's no denying his talent. But the team can do fine without him. Others are doing fine without him. If they trade him, so be it.
I think you misread the stat. Those are Eli's career numbers, not just over the last 4 years.
It doesn't matter. Eli won 2 Super Bowls with lesser recievers than Beckham. Other teams win with lesser recieves than Beckham. The Giants don't *need* him in order to be successful, and thats my point. If they can get him signed then fine, but if not - trading him won't break their back.
No one on this team should be off limits to trade.
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In comment 13886484 WillVAB said:
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If he wants a new deal he’s going to have to accept something below market. The Giants control him at 8.5 this year and around 17 next year under the franchise tag. If he’s demanding 18 or 19 per it makes zero sense for the Giants to simply cut a check right now.
That's not really how things work, nor should it. Clearly that's a bargaining chip for the Giants, but why would they want a disgruntiled star? That doesn't do anyone good. The Giants will take care of OBJ if he's being reasonable.
Not how things work? Look what Wash did with Cousins. They didn’t believe in him long term so they franchised him a few years running before trading him.
If OBJ expects to be the highest paid WR in the game he’s going to have to wait at least one year, possibly two. The Giants would basically be giving him an extra 14 mil over the next two years when they don’t have to. And they’d be stuck with a huge dead money hit if he got hurt or did something stupid.
If he wants the big contract, be a good soldier this year and produce on the field. He’ll get paid in ‘19. Makes no sense for the Giants to sacrifice value under the CBA that the players collectively bargained.
LOL, is that really what we want to do? Really? The Skins bungled the Cousins situation so freaking bad. Unvelievable.
Should I marry her?
Get rid of this guy and don't look back.
Trade him for picks now. Package our second round pick (and whatever) with OBJ and get Cleveland's #4.
This is the strangest and most baffling analogy I have seen in a while. It sounds like you may have some issues you want to share that have nothing to do with OBJ.
Please don't share them here.
Brady takes less money while he is winning championships and OBJ is going to sit out right after the Giants had a historically bad year.
OFC there is more to it than that. But let him sit out if he feels that way. The team is not projected to be championship caliber.
Much better to fuck random people and leave a gift basket. What if that kind of stuff was captured by a TMZ hidden camera or Instagram?
Being paid really doesn't matter - and public perception is easily manipulated. Do people think Brett Favre is a despicable guy for taking dick pics? What if ESPN glommed onto that instead of having helicopters follow him on FA visits?
This isn't an issue of Beckham either being a choir boy or a complete punk. It's that some people can reasonably see that what people record on Instagram and what they do for celebrations shouldn't lead to the perception they are terrible people or teammates. We keep hearing about distractions, boat trips, kicking nets, etc, but as I said above, it all leads to just one rationalization - to some people OBJ is unlikeable and people don't want to root for him.
So instead of just saying, "I don't want to root for a dick", they try to legitimize their dislike by overblowing a tweet, or making some parallel to a TD celebration as to what type of human he is.
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Another point that hasn’t been discussed is the amount of games he’s missed so far in his career. 4 in his rookie year, 1 in 15, and 12 last year. He’s missed an entire season worth of games over the course of a 4 year career. Is he willing to take less money in exchange for the risk the Giants assume in a long term deal with guaranteed money?
His injuries (rookie year and in ‘17) could have and often do, happen to many around the league through the years. Nothing unusual or indicative of proneness. No risk there, imo
It’s a factor in negotiations, along with the fact that the Giants control him below market for two more years. If he’s not willing to budge off being the highest paid WR w the guaranteed money that comes along with that, there’s no motivation for the Giants to get a long term deal done now.
If they do not react...
If he is forced to come in week three without a deal...
If he is franchised....
You want Mara to trade him and Mara hold out for the right offer?
You want to keep him, hold firm, to grin it and bear it because OBJ is OBJ, start managing the fallout now!!!
If he is a no show for OTAs I will bet that DG will deal him w Mara’s blessing..
If he can not show up and just decide no contact but he shows if not, then we will not see him here again... in a Giant jersey...
DG will not let him sit out into August.
Cleveland has huge cap room this year to front load a deal but will they gamble on him?
Once again, I agree with you.
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Would you ever do something like that? Would anyone you know that you consider to be a mature adult who makes good decisions do that?
With all the celebrations people have done, didn't somebody poop out a ball once too?
I'm not looking at him as a mature adult. I'm looking at him as a football player who scored a TD and attempted to entertain. I mean, he's done a ton of different celebrations. I'm supposed to parse out what ones make him a despicable person?
If he just did a salsa and NBC piped in cool music for it......
I'm with the other poster tha disagees with you. Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting. I still want him ofc-- but this bullshit has to stop. He is okay with penalizing his team? That's winning football? Where do you draw the line on the obscenity and the okay to penalize his team?
Link - ( New Window )
My point as well. Teams don't often trade first round picks, even for all pro veteran players. Especially for players coming off an injury with some baggage. The Giants are not going to trade OBJ for a second round pick or later.
No one should be surprised by any of this. The negotiations between the Giants and OBJ have begun, and they have begun in a very public manner.
We have seen who OBJ is. Backing up the Brinks will not change anything, it will just add fuel to OBJ's act. He will feel fully liberated to ratchet up the act...
Either you play this smart and execute a trade, or buckle in for this to continue ad infinitum.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
However, the other situations were blown out of proportion by the media. The Norman incident? Norman went after him, threatened to end his career and had the bat. Refs did not throw the flag, OBJ took matters into his own hands.
The kicking net? I do not understand why that was a headline. He showed he cared? That is called passion.
The celebrations? I wish he would tone it down to not get flagged, but that is who he is.
Yes, he needs to do a better job with putting himself in some situations and he needs to lay low. But I believe the media and others have it out for him. He is a flashy 25 year old with all the money and power in the world. He has a target on his back, some of it he deserves but some of it is overblown. With that, you do not trade a top five talent at the age of 25 unless you get the craziest offer the NFL has ever seen. His teammates love him, and its not like he is beating his wife or kids and failing drug tests.
Stop this nonsense that Taylor was a model citizen during his playing days.”
BigBlueHens : 10:58 am : link : reply
Granted, OBJ was in the wrong with the coke video. He should not have put himself in that situation.
However, the other situations were blown out of proportion by the media.
They prey on the weak fish. BBI is a barrel full of 'em.
The only number of those he's reached is 100 catches, once.
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This is the media's fault
BigBlueHens : 10:58 am : link : reply
Granted, OBJ was in the wrong with the coke video. He should not have put himself in that situation.
However, the other situations were blown out of proportion by the media.
They prey on the weak fish. BBI is a barrel full of 'em.
Ain't that the truth!
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
Fatman: Is there something we don't know about you and Odell? It seems you're in love with him or something? Be honest
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
I bet its a similar result.
You really want to see him go to a team like the Eagles or Cowboys and torch us for 175 yards and 2 TDs per game? Really?
Some of you people really need a reality check.
Sign the man and pay him like the top WR that he is (contingent on physical health after his injury, of course).
These threads are unreal.
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
This is exactly right.
IMO this is a perfect scenario for the giants. From a cost perspective extension is much better than allowing him to reach free agency. And if negotiations cause him to miss a big chunk of camp so much the better.
Its ridiculous. I've got 11 friends in a group chat. I'm the only Giant fan in it and its nothing but football banter. The dog thing was made fun of and then quickly forgotten. Not a single one of them brings it up as ammo to describe how awful he is. Everyone agreed it was dumb and moved on.
Its crazy that in a chat of Jets, Cowboys, Eagles and Pats fans, that this incident is an afterthought but not on a Giants message board.
As far as compensation,what may help the Giants is the wide receivers in this years draft.You may find a team willing to deal rather than take one of these guys with a 1st round pick.
That's all this boils down to. The rest is just a rationalization trying to find the logic behind getting rid of him.
Again - you are recommending personnel decisions based on a TD celebration. If you don't see that as being ludicrous, I don't know how else to illustrate it.
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It's sad. Kid puts up 100-1400-13 per season and the focus is on a penalty that he takes. It's sad. I'm hoping they can work this contract out and he gets to grow with a young QB.
Its ridiculous. I've got 11 friends in a group chat. I'm the only Giant fan in it and its nothing but football banter. The dog thing was made fun of and then quickly forgotten. Not a single one of them brings it up as ammo to describe how awful he is. Everyone agreed it was dumb and moved on.
Its crazy that in a chat of Jets, Cowboys, Eagles and Pats fans, that this incident is an afterthought but not on a Giants message board.
My brother is like this. He's always hated every star player in NY. He knows sports very well. Hated Ewing, hated Eli, hates Odell, turning on KP. This is just how some people are. If a player isn't perfect, they get turned on. I don't think my brother is a bad fan, he knows sports, he just has unfair expectations of star players. He's dying to trade OBJ.
I bet its a similar result.
It's not. Gatorade Dunk dug into this when I posted this in another thread. Odell has bumped up Eli's career passer rating by 31 points while Julio Jones has only boosted Matt Ryan's by 7 points.
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Fatman, just curious: Would you say yea or nay to the fact that he's somewhat of a risk-taker and magnet for negative publicity and puts his own needs (for gameday revenge or hijinks, partying, etc.) above the teams? Would you consider him a team player? A prima donna?
Again, just curious. I don't have a horse in this race.
That's all this boils down to. The rest is just a rationalization trying to find the logic behind getting rid of him.
Again - you are recommending personnel decisions based on a TD celebration. If you don't see that as being ludicrous, I don't know how else to illustrate it.
I don't buy that. It's a cost-benefit analysis, too. There is a working model in the NFL where you don't need the super-diva WR to compete - see the Packers, Saints, Pats, Minnesota, Philly, etc. So use those cap dollars for other needs; and jettison a major pain in the ass...
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That's all this boils down to. The rest is just a rationalization trying to find the logic behind getting rid of him.
Again - you are recommending personnel decisions based on a TD celebration. If you don't see that as being ludicrous, I don't know how else to illustrate it.
I don't buy that. It's a cost-benefit analysis, too. There is a working model in the NFL where you don't need the super-diva WR to compete - see the Packers, Saints, Pats, Minnesota, Philly, etc. So use those cap dollars for other needs; and jettison a major pain in the ass...
This is true. You don't need OBJ to compete. He certainly helps though. Especially if you are breaking in a new QB, he will help with his development a ton.
Ding ding. Just wait until Eli is gone. You all who want to trade Beckham will be extremely thankful that Darnold/Rosen/Webb, whoever has a player like Odell to throw to.
But the problem is that part of the "New York Football Giant" mystique is the multi-generational involvement of the Mara family and the cultish idea that they are representing, and sticking up for, something "better" than the others, win or lose.
In this light, John Mara getting involved like this was perfectly predictable.
You really want to see him go to a team like the Eagles or Cowboys and torch us for 175 yards and 2 TDs per game? Really?
Some of you people really need a reality check.
Sign the man and pay him like the top WR that he is (contingent on physical health after his injury, of course).
I'm okay with having him stay. But you realize the Giants won championships without OBJ or having the best wide receiver in their history prior, right?
I think some of you need to drop the hero-worship. The world of football doesn't have to revolve around OBJ.
No need to pay him until eh shows something this year. You want to make a bet even if he signs Giants aren't going to the SUper Bowl? Let's tone down the hero-worship.
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Who said it's a simple TD Celebration only, I sure didn't? The man has a history, plain and simple. Does this history involve bad things like drugs/DWI's's/ beating women, no it doesn't. However, it's always something stupid, or else we wouldn't even bee having this conversation, now would we?
Let me ask you this, if this was few years ago and extension talk came up about AJ Green and Julio Jones (providing they were Giants), would any of this even be a topic?
If I'm the owner of the Giants and am about to sign a player to the highest paid contract for a WR in NFL history, I would definitely have concerns with this guy, no doubt.
As for this idiot "Jay on the Island" comparing AJ Green to OBJ, it's not close. Green got into a fight because he was hot headed, once. AJ Green is a consummate professional and in NO WAY does OBJ deserve to be compared to him.
Your defense of Odell Beckham is utterly idiotic
Just because people like yourself are distracted doesn't mean he's an actual distraction to the team.
MAra will be fine too.
That is laughable.
What the fuck are you talking about. Don't even answer.
That is laughable.
Isn’t it fun to make shit up? I’m starting to warm up to doing it myself since it’s all the rage around here.
Personally I’d want to know he is 100% healthy.
Personally I’d want to know he is 100% healthy.
Actually he didn't say anything but carry on
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
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of the above post, all you need to know is that some people still are talking about a boat trip, a couple of years later.
A boat trip that by several reports was far more tame than the partying the defense did that same weekend in NY. But Instagram wasn't there, so people don't give a fuck.
The boat trip is one of those IQ tests many people fail.
It certainly is.
You would have cut Witten and Romo after Cabo 2008.
You would passed on drafting LT in 1981.
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Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
That's all this boils down to. The rest is just a rationalization trying to find the logic behind getting rid of him.
Again - you are recommending personnel decisions based on a TD celebration. If you don't see that as being ludicrous, I don't know how else to illustrate it.
No, you're simplifying it. It's about an overall attitude that isnt good for the team.
The Norman Incident
The Boat Trip
Punching hole in the wall vs GB
Slamming his head against walls post game @ philly in 16
punching the net and hitting himself in the face
proposing to the net
urinating on the field and not apologizing for the penalty
crying in the middle of football games on the sidelines
Getting caught smoking a blunt on video (dont care if he smokes but dont get caught on video)
Easy to minimize them individually but when you start adding them all up I fail to see how anyone cant recognize that this is an issue. My only guess would be those people didnt play competitive sports at any level.
I've been telling you for a while now how this was going to go with Beckham. What the hell do you want from me?
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In comment 13886788 giantstock said:
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Your opinion is based in part on delusion and part in hero-worship. Are you trying to say if you got a super value -- more than what OBJ's value you wouldn't take it? Do you understand that we were 3-13 and the year before we only got tot the playoffs and have not won a super bowl recently?
I find it unfathomable that any Giant fan would think anyone on the team is untouchable after the season we just had and especially the player we are talking about so far has led the giants basically nowhere.
I don't want him traded but fans like you worship OBJ like he is some type of God. Tone it down.
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above then just say you hate rooting for the guy and that's why he should be traded:
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Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
That's all this boils down to. The rest is just a rationalization trying to find the logic behind getting rid of him.
Again - you are recommending personnel decisions based on a TD celebration. If you don't see that as being ludicrous, I don't know how else to illustrate it.
No, you're simplifying it. It's about an overall attitude that isnt good for the team.
The Norman Incident
The Boat Trip
Punching hole in the wall vs GB
Slamming his head against walls post game @ philly in 16
punching the net and hitting himself in the face
proposing to the net
urinating on the field and not apologizing for the penalty
crying in the middle of football games on the sidelines
Getting caught smoking a blunt on video (dont care if he smokes but dont get caught on video)
Easy to minimize them individually but when you start adding them all up I fail to see how anyone cant recognize that this is an issue. My only guess would be those people didnt play competitive sports at any level.
Only 2 of those things I have issues with, norman and peeing like a dog..
You are going to criticize him for getting mad about losing? You know how many players probably have punched the wall or thrown their helmet when they are mad about losing?
And the kicking net was a fucking joke, he was making fun of the media for making such a big deal about him getting hit in the face...how many penalties did he accrue with the net stuffM
That is laughable.
Why? Odell is even better. Oh wait, Odell distracts the fans too much and forces the media to ask poor John Mara too many questions. And he took a boat ride once that the media went ape shit over.
You guys are distracted. And you literally want to trade an excellent player because of social media blip or two and one or two 15 yard penalties.
You don't have your priorities in order. It's as simple as that. You suck this shit up like a sponge and hold these players to standards that aren't necessarily vital to winning or even attainable.
Go ahead and trade him for shit on a shingle. Trade a lexus for a honda accord. You're nuts to even entertain this notion. Completely fucking nuts.
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In comment 13886816 I love liverwurst said:
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In comment 13886788 giantstock said:
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
You have me confused with someone else.
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In comment 13886816 I love liverwurst said:
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In comment 13886788 giantstock said:
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
Quote:
Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
And what da hell does that have to do with anything?
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this fucking tool:
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Your opinion is based in part on delusion and part in hero-worship. Are you trying to say if you got a super value -- more than what OBJ's value you wouldn't take it? Do you understand that we were 3-13 and the year before we only got tot the playoffs and have not won a super bowl recently?
I find it unfathomable that any Giant fan would think anyone on the team is untouchable after the season we just had and especially the player we are talking about so far has led the giants basically nowhere.
I don't want him traded but fans like you worship OBJ like he is some type of God. Tone it down.
Tone it down? Have some self awareness and realize your entire post is complete hyperbole cranked up to 12. Who is worshiping anyone? Smart people don’t want to trade our best player. They realize that maybe not having said best player on the field was a big reason we went 3-13.
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this fucking tool:
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Your opinion is based in part on delusion and part in hero-worship. Are you trying to say if you got a super value -- more than what OBJ's value you wouldn't take it? Do you understand that we were 3-13 and the year before we only got tot the playoffs and have not won a super bowl recently?
I find it unfathomable that any Giant fan would think anyone on the team is untouchable after the season we just had and especially the player we are talking about so far has led the giants basically nowhere.
I don't want him traded but fans like you worship OBJ like he is some type of God. Tone it down.
He is untouchable. He is the greatest receiver in NFL history through the first 3 years of his career. I was not around for the LT days but would you have traded him? It makes no sense. He is immature, but he is one of the best players in the NFL and deserves to be paid. I for one thought the JPP trade was made simply to make room for Odell's impending contract extension. I hope I am right.
Joe Benigno is a perfect example of why WFAN has sucked for a long time. This illiterate asshole won a fucking contest and is now talking about sports in a major market. He has what seems to be a 3rd grade understanding of the English language.... and obviously a similar understanding of the NFL.
Step away from the PCs and phones and twitters and watch the games! Watch him play!
If Beckham is never drafted by the Giants, Coughlin is fired before January 2016. McAdoo never even sniffs a head coaching job and Eli is likely earning a paycheck in another city or is calling games for Fox.
Beckham is an idiot sometimes. He is immature at times. maybe he grows up. Maybe he doesn't. But I know one thing for certain, the guy rarely gets in any trouble on or off the field, EVER, and he plays harder and better than anyone. He's that good. Even if you want to split hairs and say he's not legendary good and only good, fine, you still keep him at all costs.
We're in this to win. We're not in this to field a team of quiet choir boys. Stop worrying so much about BULLSHIT. Did Beckham get suspended for PEDS? Did he get suspended for that grainy stupid video with the pizza? NOPE.
Stop worrying about bullshit. Let the Giants worry.
Again, just curious. I don't have a horse in this race.
There's a fine line that a lot of elite athletes walk between cockiness, arrogance, assholery and that competitive edge that makes them elite. Probly a little like the line artists and performers have between genius and bat-shit crazy madness.
I would call Beckham a diva who is a team player. The guy is one of the first in the building to work out. He's constantly catching passes and working on technique. He's mentored the other WR's and to a man the players look at him as a great teammate and a positive influence.
And there's a dirty little secret most here don't want to accept - a lot of guys use the platform of the sport to entertain. To create an image or a persona. Not unlike the WWE. It is branding of sorts. Now I get why some don't like his antics or the "brand", so why not just come out and fucking say that?
There's actually rational debate to be had on trading him, especially when discussing the return he could get, but people who think he should be let go because he's a negative influence or a distraction need to just man up and say they want him gone because they don't like him.
Just like when JPP blew off his fingers, I said I didn't want him around because he's a moron. Not because of some cost/performance metric. Not because of made-up distractions of a boat trip. Because the guy decided that his hand wasn't all that valuable for success. Beckham kicking a net or celebrating a TD is just theatrics. If he blew off his hand, I'd say get rid of him too, and I'd say it was because I didn't like him and that he was a moron for maiming himself.
Trying to dress it up as being a rational move to make because subtraction of distractions = a better tram is horseshit.
And not even the happy horseshit kind...
UConn4523 : 11:39 am : link : reply
Fitzgerald has allegedly done something way, way worse than anything OBJ has ever been accused of. Something that Mara seems to be ok with.
Contract demands, does he really want to be paid like a QB?
Hold Out? It looks like he will hold out.
Offers? If we are truly blown away.. 2 number ones like Galloway
If we were offered at least 2 number ones or the equivalent and OBJ wanted more than 6 years/100 million 55 guaranteed AND it looked like we were going to have to deal with a holdout situation. I would trade him. I do think some of his shit is overblown but I also recognize he can also be tiresome for ownership/management.
Have you ever heard the old saying "He who controls the money controls everything?"
The Giants are probably the most conservative org in the NFL. They aren't giving that contract to Beckham. Notice how this is all floated pre-draft?
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In comment 13886948 T-Bone said:
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In comment 13886816 I love liverwurst said:
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In comment 13886788 giantstock said:
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
And what da hell does that have to do with anything?
We're talking about being grown ups. Most grown ups have credit cards, do you?
There's a fine line that a lot of elite athletes walk between cockiness, arrogance, assholery and that competitive edge that makes them elite. Probly a little like the line artists and performers have between genius and bat-shit crazy madness.
I appreciate the detailed response and don't disagree with what you say about brilliance and bat-shit crazy madness.
And your statement of "the Giants aren't giving that contract to Beckham" ...how exactly do you know that? I'm sure John Mara is just thrilled with letting someone who, before being hurt, was on pace to break every NFL receiving record that exists.
This is simply not even close to being true...
We need him.
Not really sure why a whole page of quoted text has to be used for that side conversation.
Not only is liverwurst a terrible poster, he fucking sucks at the quote feature.
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In comment 13886966 I love liverwurst said:
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In comment 13886948 T-Bone said:
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In comment 13886816 I love liverwurst said:
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In comment 13886788 giantstock said:
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In comment 13886750 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Quote:
Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
And what da hell does that have to do with anything?
We're talking about being grown ups. Most grown ups have credit cards, do you?
That's how you equate a person acting like an adult? Whether they have a credit card or not?
Wow.
Not really sure why a whole page of quoted text has to be used for that side conversation.
Not only is liverwurst a terrible poster, he fucking sucks at the quote feature.
I thought you guys said you had it?! *grin*
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Only that I'm more horrified that intelligent people such as yourself excuse/justify this poop and piss behaviour. It's disgusting.
What is being excused or justified? It is a TD celebration. Thionk about that for a second. You have people making assumptions about Beckham the person based on a celebration he's done. And you guys are dead serious!
Using words like "horrified" and "disgusting" in the aftermath of a TD celebration?
The society-degrading poop and piss behavior!! Oh the humanities.
Did he get penalized? WHy? How can you say you aren't justifying it? Why did he get penalized? And is it good for the team that he gets penalized? SO if it is good for OBJ then it's okay for Flowers to clebrate a good block - or he picked up stunt while the team got a tD and he celebrates along with OBJ celebrating in which they both get penalized? WHere do you draw the line?
Hey-- why not EVERY TD - let's celebrate and get a penalty and afterwards say its okay.
Did he pretend like he was a dog and pretend like he was peeing in the end zone? So you think I should accept someone pretending to be a dog and pee in the end zone is okay? I can't call it disgusting? There comes a point where you would say "enough is enough" but "the next guy" would be okay with it.
Did the owner afterwards
Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
And THESE are the folks who are suggesting that it's Odell that needs to grow up.
Think about that.
That's what I find so funny about these kinds of threads.
T-Bone: Did you get a credit card yet? I remember about 15 years ago you claimed that you never owned a credit or debit card?. We've been in the 21st century for awhile now, just saying
And what da hell does that have to do with anything?
We're talking about being grown ups. Most grown ups have credit cards, do you?
Mines maxed out, does that still count?
Have you ever heard the old saying "He who controls the money controls everything?"
The Giants are probably the most conservative org in the NFL. They aren't giving that contract to Beckham. Notice how this is all floated pre-draft?
Most conservative? They have paid druggies and women beaters and they are not going to pay Odell? Hahahahahaha
And you know this! MAAAAN!
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They need to pay him.
This is simply not even close to being true...
Yes it is. Numbers stats eye test all scream that it's true.
LT, Strahan, Beckham. There's your 3 best NYG players over the last 30 years--QBs excluded.
Actually though.. that was going to be my last response to that particular poster. Anyone who equates whether a person has a credit card or not to their level of maturity is not really worth having a conversation about this with.
That said, I apologize for the length of that post.
Lemme ask my daddy...
To me...Larry Fitzgerald is the type of player you build a team around...Randy Moss is the type of player a team takes on when they're making a run for the Super Bowl. Moss really had no issues off the field either but for one reason or another found himself on multiple teams because he was a distraction.
I think OBJ is Randy Moss, however, I'd only trade him if I could get a draft pick in the top 6 for 2018 or multiple picks in 2019. I would let him hold out if I'm Mara.
Which by the way...can't Mara keep his mouth shut? Why stir the pot with "I'm sick of talking about OBJ". He's been less than impressive as an owner IMO.
beckham is a great player but he's got a bit of diva in him, with an air of mental torment (that he's toned down since his first 2 years in the league), which many fans seem to laud and chalk up to him being a firey competitor.
not sure if giving him 20k per year following a season where he managed to play all of 4 games (because he was targeted preseason) is a wise move.
To me...Larry Fitzgerald is the type of player you build a team around...Randy Moss is the type of player a team takes on when they're making a run for the Super Bowl. Moss really had no issues off the field either but for one reason or another found himself on multiple teams because he was a distraction.
I think OBJ is Randy Moss, however, I'd only trade him if I could get a draft pick in the top 6 for 2018 or multiple picks in 2019. I would let him hold out if I'm Mara.
Which by the way...can't Mara keep his mouth shut? Why stir the pot with "I'm sick of talking about OBJ". He's been less than impressive as an owner IMO.
You do know Larry Fitzgerald has a domestic violence right? No one talks about it because it was 10 years ago
no championships
no show in big games
ho's flashing mirrors/lines
hype
Yeah that demands big money. Need to find tough guys that can actually beat tough guys. I guess into year 3 he has probably lost some quickness with injuries anyway.
no championships
Dishonest as fuck take here.
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OBJ will be for our rookie QB. You need to give the rookie weapons, why trade the best WR in football? I pray Odell is being realistic with his demands.
Why would you think he would be realistic. He is a guy who believes he is the best with a big ego and will want to be paid like the best. I worry more about his ability to stay healthy. He is always going to be targeted by the DBs and LBs who want to take him out and shut him up. Big gamble to make if he wants QB money which he probably does. DG and the owners will make that call.
He is the best. In typical NY fan history, what have you done for me lately. He's out last year so people forget what he means to the team. He's had the best first 3 years of his career than any WR in history. OBJ is the best WR in football.
I'd love to hear from all the bbi posters who signed a contract at 22, then when they found out they were one of the most talented people in the world at their jobs, but never asked for a raise, and instead said, that's ok, you don't need to pay me any more money for the next few years. it's cool. come one.
you know why odell's on social media all the time? because it's worth a lot of money - and because he's grossly underpaid for what he does, in a sport where he could be injured any minute, any competent financial advisor would tell him the same thing - you better maximize your value while you can. remember hakeem nicks and steve smith? boy, those second contracts really paid off for them didnt' they? the same people screaming to trade odell are going to be all over this site bitching and moaning when the draft pick the giants get back turns out to the league average player he's likely to be, and when the giants take the money they would've used on odell for some free agent that everyone is going to scream is overpriced.
you know who's an overpaid giant? mark herzlich. someone ought to ask john mara about that contract.
But OBJ is much younger and can overtake that throne pretty easily if he stays healthy.
...can have a series of heart-to-heart talks and put all of this behind them.
This team can ill-afford a huge, gaping hole at #1 receiver. And OBJ needs to reassure the Giants that he's more-or-less the same receiver pre-injury.
As for OBJ's behavior?
I have zero clue what can be done... I'm just hoping that as he gets a little older OBJ will tone down some of his antics.
But unloading a player of his caliber over "antics" is sheer lunacy. Maybe someone can coach him up over the "optics" of certain behaviors.
Regrettably, OBJ's explicit threat of holding out is more than just optics, and I sure hope he does not have to be taught the hard way that NO ONE is above the team.
Argue that taking a trip 7 days before a game, on the team team day off matters.
Since Beckham is a lightening rod, he gets written about. Sometime deservedly, oftentimes not deservedly.
I'm having a difficult time seeing more hysteria about a player who has been broadly perceived as a distraction and bad teammate and a bad off the field guy with very few concrete examples to prove any of those points.
I have no clue what the outcome of Beckham will be. Traded, staying here long-term. Have no idea. but basically, the narrative that exists, the fan's perceptions that exist, basically are driving emotional reactions that really aren't based on anything of substance.
People really dislike this guy for his celebrations, for his sideline antics and for earholing a guy who bodyslammed him without any penalty. The same fanbase that openly questioned management's sanity by letting Will Hill go. The same fanbase who was hoping Adrian Peterson could get a shot here.
Basically, people want to get rid of Beckham because they dislike him. And that is the core of the issue whether you dress it up as him being a distraction or take each and every tweet and dissect it to make terrible assumptions.
It would be so much better if people just said they dislike the guy and want him gone rather than go through convoluted reasoning on why trading the best player on the team is actually a good move.
Thank you! A sensible post. I think if you listed out all of his "bad behavior" in one post people might be able to see that he really hasn't done anything so egregious that has garnered this hatred for him.
People started hating him in training camp his rookie year when he pulled his hamstring. It's obviously he doesn't appeal to the older generations because his hair keeps longer and lighter, and that he likes to dance on the field. He's going to end up getting pushed out of this town and it will be something every Giants fan has endure for the next decade as he becomes a hall of fame player.
Does it matter? Ezekiel elliot
Was just accused no charges and got 6 games
Not really sure why a whole page of quoted text has to be used for that side conversation.
Not only is liverwurst a terrible poster, he fucking sucks at the quote feature.
Fatman just needs to send pic's when he's blowing sweet nothings in OBJ's ear. This way here we'll have factual evidence it's a true bromance
...can have a series of heart-to-heart talks and put all of this behind them.
This team can ill-afford a huge, gaping hole at #1 receiver. And OBJ needs to reassure the Giants that he's more-or-less the same receiver pre-injury.
As for OBJ's behavior?
I have zero clue what can be done... I'm just hoping that as he gets a little older OBJ will tone down some of his antics.
But unloading a player of his caliber over "antics" is sheer lunacy. Maybe someone can coach him up over the "optics" of certain behaviors.
Regrettably, OBJ's explicit threat of holding out is more than just optics, and I sure hope he does not have to be taught the hard way that NO ONE is above the team.
Shurmur supposedly met with Beckham last week in California said it was a great talk
This isn’t about maturity anymore. It’s about the future of the team and the player and business decisions having to be made.
What does that really mean though? Obviously no one player makes or breaks a team, but Beckham makes up for a lot of problems and could be an integral part of a championship run. The Giants also don't need Eli to win, but they probably were better off having him in 2011.
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They need to pay him.
This is simply not even close to being true...
Agreed! Strahan comes to mind immediately!
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
How good did our offense look without him last year, though, right?
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Yeah that play against the cowboys really sucked the life out f the building and team...
How about that 220 against the ravens..
Or he about his TDs against the eagles...
Yeah the team looks done after his plays
I've always gone by the Terrell Owens A-Hole meter. As long as the overall value of the player to the team eclipses the B.S. then you keep him. Teams kept TO around until his value dropped. OBJ is a top 5 type NFL talent. We would get 50 cents on the dollar back right now. Would be idiotic to trade him.
What is also true is that you don't win by lessening your team's overall talent. Some players are not worth the headaches they bring. The question with OBJ is does the headaches he brings outweigh the value to the team?
Do you jettison an All-Pro talent because he picks up stupid personal fouls and is a prima donna, or does the talent outweigh that?
There's actually rational debate to be had on trading him, especially when discussing the return he could get, but people who think he should be let go because he's a negative influence or a distraction need to just man up and say they want him gone because they don't like him.....
.....Trying to dress it up as being a rational move to make because subtraction of distractions = a better t[e]am is horseshit.
I wonder if we'll ever be capable of that rational debate?
"Once I was afraid, I was pertrified..".
We had that same offense 2 years ago and the offense was still dogshit with Odell. The Giants need to build a better overall offense that doesnt rely on one player to succeed. I dont hate Odell at all, so this doesn't come from a place of malice. I just dont think this teams success needs to be directly related to whether Odell was here or not. Super Bowls have been one prior to him being here and Super Bowls can be won after he is gone.
HIstory will tell you that the only one position that you need to win is a franchise QB. So lets draft Barkley?
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Yeah that play against the cowboys really sucked the life out f the building and team...
How about that 220 against the ravens..
Or he about his TDs against the eagles...
Yeah the team looks done after his plays
Thanks for joining the conversation. Sad to see you can’t understand the depth of what I’m trying to convey.
Giants forced the ball to Beckham too often the last two and a half years and don’t allow the offense to spread open and breathe.
We had that same offense 2 years ago and the offense was still dogshit with Odell. The Giants need to build a better overall offense that doesnt rely on one player to succeed. I dont hate Odell at all, so this doesn't come from a place of malice. I just dont think this teams success needs to be directly related to whether Odell was here or not. Super Bowls have been one prior to him being here and Super Bowls can be won after he is gone.
Super Bowls have been won*
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
How good did our offense look without him last year, though, right?
How good was it with him?
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In comment 13887125 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Yeah that play against the cowboys really sucked the life out f the building and team...
How about that 220 against the ravens..
Or he about his TDs against the eagles...
Yeah the team looks done after his plays
Thanks for joining the conversation. Sad to see you can’t understand the depth of what I’m trying to convey.
Giants forced the ball to Beckham too often the last two and a half years and don’t allow the offense to spread open and breathe.
Spread it to who? He was the entire offense, they had no one else..
Cruz couldn't get separation, shephard worked well in the slot...
He would take slant routes 75 yards and that was the entire offense...
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Just when I thought the stupidity couldn't get any worse on this thread you bring out this gem. Well done!
We need him.
Well, there's not much reason to believe he'll be at all of them.
League history is replete with receivers who can put up a TD (or even two!) in a given game and therefore alter that particular game's score in his team's favor, but it seems as though there's more to a franchise-changing player than that. Who knows what those X-factors truly are, but my guess is that Beckham doesn't have them.
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
HIstory will tell you that the only one position that you need to win is a franchise QB. So lets draft Barkley?
Unless you think there is a QB that meets the grade.
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Just when I thought the stupidity couldn't get any worse on this thread you bring out this gem. Well done!
Oh really? How about you bring something of substance to the conversation instead of taking hollow pot shots.
I don't think people can.
Suppose Barkley really is as talented as people say he is. Is it far-fetched to think he'd contribute at least as much as -- if not more -- to wins as Beckham currently does?
I don't think so at all. Your elite RB's always account for much more of the offense's yardage, TOP, and scoring percentages than their WR counterparts do.
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
How good did our offense look without him last year, though, right?
How good was it with him?
It was 11-5 good.
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
I don't think people can.
Suppose Barkley really is as talented as people say he is. Is it far-fetched to think he'd contribute at least as much as -- if not more -- to wins as Beckham currently does?
I don't think so at all. Your elite RB's always account for much more of the offense's yardage, TOP, and scoring percentages than their WR counterparts do.
Why not have an elite RB AND an elite WR? This either-or question is stupid because it’s not one that needs to be asked.
I agree until he missed most of last year which evened the score a bit.
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In comment 13887126 732NYG said:
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
How good did our offense look without him last year, though, right?
How good was it with him?
It was 11-5 good.
How about the two years before that?
Trading Odell would be tough to swallow. Multiple 1st round picks would make it a little easier, but it doesn't seem like that return is realistic. Even if it were, it's an unknown if those draft picks will have near the impact that Odell does. Hopefully this is all noise and he gets a deal done to stay in blue for another 5-6 years.
He's not the best offensive player the Giants have had as it has no results beyond his own stats and desire to be paid as an individual (notice the term individual instead of team). Maybe he needs a team that can nurture his snowflake feelings and drama. This team needs tough guys that that can pull out wins and championships not drama queens that have parlor tricks.
Trading Odell would be tough to swallow. Multiple 1st round picks would make it a little easier, but it doesn't seem like that return is realistic. Even if it were, it's an unknown if those draft picks will have near the impact that Odell does. Hopefully this is all noise and he gets a deal done to stay in blue for another 5-6 years.
TO when he was with the eagles? but TO was a bit older and was at that point publicly feuding with various teammates in the season following the SB loss to NE where mcnabb threw three picks, so not quite comparable.
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In comment 13887166 Sy'56 said:
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In comment 13887126 732NYG said:
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
How good did our offense look without him last year, though, right?
How good was it with him?
It was 11-5 good.
How about the two years before that?
Our offense is much improved with OBJ than without OBJ, are you seriously trying to argue against that? Because you’re wrong, and that’s not an opinion.
OBJ can ask to be paid like a QB if he wants. It is never going to happen. No team in the NFL is going to give him that kind of money. This is a negotiation. He is the next receiver up, and he will be the highest paid receiver, as he deserves to be, until the next guy is due.
I just can't trust information on these types of issues. That being said my thought was more about being a distraction. All he did was dominate on the field and from what I recall was very involved with the community.
It's hard to argue that OBJ is not a distraction when our owner himself said he's sick of talking about it? Mara not being innocent in all of it...but In the middle of trying to rebuild a once proud team coming off one of the worst seasons ever? We get this?
It would appear on the surface that OBJ is more of a Randy Moss type player...once in a decade talent that may have a difficult time sticking with one team his whole career.
Yeah I heard he owes LT an 8 ball.
And do guys give money back if they are a first round bust?
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Those of you saying there is no way to justify trading OBJ, I want to ask you an honest question. Where is your contract line in the sand? 6 years 100 million 55-60 guaranteed? Are you willing to pay him like Jimmy Garrapolo? If OBJ is asking for way more than the Giants are willing to pay, would it not be wise to trade him? Or Should we let him hold out, fine him the maximum until he shows up and franchise him for the next 1-2 years? I asking what your plan is if OBJ demands are too high?
OBJ can ask to be paid like a QB if he wants. It is never going to happen. No team in the NFL is going to give him that kind of money. This is a negotiation. He is the next receiver up, and he will be the highest paid receiver, as he deserves to be, until the next guy is due.
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In comment 13887278 Thegratefulhead said:
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Those of you saying there is no way to justify trading OBJ, I want to ask you an honest question. Where is your contract line in the sand? 6 years 100 million 55-60 guaranteed? Are you willing to pay him like Jimmy Garrapolo? If OBJ is asking for way more than the Giants are willing to pay, would it not be wise to trade him? Or Should we let him hold out, fine him the maximum until he shows up and franchise him for the next 1-2 years? I asking what your plan is if OBJ demands are too high?
OBJ can ask to be paid like a QB if he wants. It is never going to happen. No team in the NFL is going to give him that kind of money. This is a negotiation. He is the next receiver up, and he will be the highest paid receiver, as he deserves to be, until the next guy is due.
IF he asks for too much, what is that number? If holds for more money than you think he deserves, should we trade him or force him to show up with fines then franchise him if his demands are still too high?
Of course he is going to ask for too much. That is part of the negotiation. My guess is with Brown currently the highest paid at $17M per year he will have to settle for $18M per year, which I am completely comfortable with. He is that damn good enough to justify it.
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He deserves to be paid.. he has yway out performed his rookie contract
And do guys give money back if they are a first round bust?
It works both ways.. If player doesn't perform NFL teams can cut him whenever they choose..
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In comment 13887301 NYG07 said:
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In comment 13887278 Thegratefulhead said:
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Those of you saying there is no way to justify trading OBJ, I want to ask you an honest question. Where is your contract line in the sand? 6 years 100 million 55-60 guaranteed? Are you willing to pay him like Jimmy Garrapolo? If OBJ is asking for way more than the Giants are willing to pay, would it not be wise to trade him? Or Should we let him hold out, fine him the maximum until he shows up and franchise him for the next 1-2 years? I asking what your plan is if OBJ demands are too high?
OBJ can ask to be paid like a QB if he wants. It is never going to happen. No team in the NFL is going to give him that kind of money. This is a negotiation. He is the next receiver up, and he will be the highest paid receiver, as he deserves to be, until the next guy is due.
IF he asks for too much, what is that number? If holds for more money than you think he deserves, should we trade him or force him to show up with fines then franchise him if his demands are still too high?
Of course he is going to ask for too much. That is part of the negotiation. My guess is with Brown currently the highest paid at $17M per year he will have to settle for $18M per year, which I am completely comfortable with. He is that damn good enough to justify it.
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May be the best offensive player we have ever had. His teammates love him. He has almost singlehandedly won games for us. Can you imagine how miserable the three seasons before this past one would have been without him? I think Odell deserves to play on a good Giants team, but when so many fans don't want him, maybe that's not going to be it. I tend to think most other fans would be pretty happy to have him.
He's not the best offensive player the Giants have had as it has no results beyond his own stats and desire to be paid as an individual (notice the term individual instead of team). Maybe he needs a team that can nurture his snowflake feelings and drama. This team needs tough guys that that can pull out wins and championships not drama queens that have parlor tricks.
Wins like 10-7 against Dallas? Torching the Rams when they were beating up on him? Against Baltimore?
Beckham has won games almost by himself when our offense has been incapable of doing anything! What team do you watch?
He made a business decision with this move
So now the Giants get to make a business decision as well.
Very very good player. Victor Cruz was a very good player
Both OBJ and the Giants remember each side of the same coin.
Its a business. Im not attaching any emotion to the outcome
He made a business decision with this move
So now the Giants get to make a business decision as well.
Very very good player. Victor Cruz was a very good player
Both OBJ and the Giants remember each side of the same coin.
Its a business. Im not attaching any emotion to the outcome
After OBj, we have Marshall, SS and Double E.....OBj makes those guys better......
Marshall does not want to be a #1 receiver because he can't be one....I don't think he can even be a #2.....SS never took that next step last year, and has a propensity for dropping passes, and has trouble staying on the field....Double E played as expected, as a rookie.....
now he has to step up his game.....
To win without OBj, you need his replacement plus a replacement for Marshall....that is not going to happen overnight....
I said this was a possibility if he did not get a contract in the off season.....but I would not sell the farm for a WR coming off an injury......the fifth year option should be used to see how well he can play this year......
Then you either sign him to a long term deal or trade him, because the franchise tag will not work next year......he won't sign it, will hold out, and if necessary do the same thing JPP did, and not join the team until mid season.....
This guy is the best receiver in the NFL when his head is on straight, and he has no physical problems.....this team needs too many players to invest a lot of cap in one player....and in fact, the offense might be better with a more diversified offense than relying on one player....
if anyone deserves to be paid on the team, its OBJ.
Vernon is overpaid, JPP was overpaid, Eli is overpaid.
OBJ is top in the entire league at his position. Who is on this team is top...lets say top 10 at their position? Collins and who else
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Offensive talent this franchise has ever had is beyond me. It’s as tho people forget what last year was like without him. (Yes they also lost the corpse of Marshall but if you think he was going to change things you are delusional). So what is the plan then? You are going to trade him to create a new wr1 hole? If you think that whoever you draft in mid to late first round is going to seemlessly step into that you are insane. Then regardless of what they do at 2 it’s a moot point because this offense is going to be the same without him.
Look it is not about his talent. It is about his attitude and behavior. As a Giant fan for over 55 years I can do without. For me, I am not a fanatic about winning being the only thing. I truly appreciate the history of this franchise. Talent comes and goes. As special as he is, give the Giants a #1 draft pick and perhaps more and I am confident they can get another receive who will be more than "adequate" enough to help the offense. Add Saquan Barkley and there are plenty of weapons. And the team's cap wouldn't hurt either. So, if I had the opportunity, I would advise Beckham as Clint Eastwood's Dirty Harry said, "Man's gotta know his limitations". In other words, grow up or get lost.
so people want Odell gone because he...
1. hit a net
2. fought Norman 3 years ago
3. ??
4. ??
How can one WR deliver championships? Jesus, a bunch of people argue that even Eli didn't win game on his own in 2007 and 2011, so how the fuck is Beckham held to a different standard? By the logic used here titles make the player, So Jake Ballard is better than Shockey. Elvis Patterson is better than Sehorn.
I also can't believe it when people say we need tough players who want to win and dismiss Beckham as being a me-first guy who doesn't care about winning.
It goes against everything you see from him on the field and in the workout room. Then again, some asswipe who uses the term "snowflake" is pretty much a useless putz anyway.
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Can somebody please explain to me how Beckham "sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field?" He had one really bad game two years ago against Carolina. He's had some bad drops. He's done some things on the sideline and end zone that have ranged from odd to inappropriate.
But none of that is enough to "suck in the oxygen from others on and off the field." He plays hard. His teammates have never questioned his drive.
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Can somebody please explain to me how Beckham "sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field?" He had one really bad game two years ago against Carolina. He's had some bad drops. He's done some things on the sideline and end zone that have ranged from odd to inappropriate.
But none of that is enough to "suck in the oxygen from others on and off the field." He plays hard. His teammates have never questioned his drive.
here's an example of OBJ sucking the oxygen out of his teammates, off the field. they clearly hate him
OBJ - ( New Window )
This hasn't been true since Odell got here.
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He's not the best offensive player the Giants have had as it has no results beyond his own stats and desire to be paid as an individual (notice the term individual instead of team). Maybe he needs a team that can nurture his snowflake feelings and drama. This team needs tough guys that that can pull out wins and championships not drama queens that have parlor tricks.
How can one WR deliver championships? Jesus, a bunch of people argue that even Eli didn't win game on his own in 2007 and 2011, so how the fuck is Beckham held to a different standard? By the logic used here titles make the player, So Jake Ballard is better than Shockey. Elvis Patterson is better than Sehorn.
I also can't believe it when people say we need tough players who want to win and dismiss Beckham as being a me-first guy who doesn't care about winning.
It goes against everything you see from him on the field and in the workout room. Then again, some asswipe who uses the term "snowflake" is pretty much a useless putz anyway.
He won't because it requires a team. He is a peacock, only out for himself. As usual, you are quick on the spot with replies and insults but no insight. Some have more courage to break the glass, you are a lazy pithy insult responder. Go the fuck away, everyone is tired of your ass.
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In comment 13887125 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Can somebody please explain to me how Beckham "sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field?" He had one really bad game two years ago against Carolina. He's had some bad drops. He's done some things on the sideline and end zone that have ranged from odd to inappropriate.
But none of that is enough to "suck in the oxygen from others on and off the field." He plays hard. His teammates have never questioned his drive.
here's an example of OBJ sucking the oxygen out of his teammates, off the field. they clearly hate him OBJ - ( New Window )
he prob fucked half the bridal party
A peacock?? And I'm the one with no insight? Fuck us all.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
A peacock?? And I'm the one with no insight? Fuck us all.
No you are just a johnny on spot asshole. That's your role.
Giant fans can be a puzzling lot.
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In comment 13887670 Bramton1 said:
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In comment 13887125 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13887111 Sy'56 said:
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NYG does not need Beckham to win
Agreed. Electric player but one who sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field.
Can somebody please explain to me how Beckham "sucks in the oxygen from others on and off the field?" He had one really bad game two years ago against Carolina. He's had some bad drops. He's done some things on the sideline and end zone that have ranged from odd to inappropriate.
But none of that is enough to "suck in the oxygen from others on and off the field." He plays hard. His teammates have never questioned his drive.
here's an example of OBJ sucking the oxygen out of his teammates, off the field. they clearly hate him OBJ - ( New Window )
he prob fucked half the bridal party
Was he playing offense or defense? Makes a difference.
No. team players. We have not seen them in quite some time. The last team that won the SB had them, who was the superstar? A backup that was almost out of the league. Think on that for a moment, and think about the fact that it was our rival the Eagles. Maybe this team needs to rethink its fucking strategy given the miscues, poor coaching, poor management, and poor contract handling.
Giant fans can be a puzzling lot.
Wonder what the demographics on this would be. Demographics go both ways.
And Odell Beckham is the root of those very real problems of poor coaching and poor management in what way again?
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
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would be much happier rooting for mediocre "lunchpail" guys than winning with more talented flamboyant guys.
No. team players. We have not seen them in quite some time. The last team that won the SB had them, who was the superstar? A backup that was almost out of the league. Think on that for a moment, and think about the fact that it was our rival the Eagles. Maybe this team needs to rethink its fucking strategy given the miscues, poor coaching, poor management, and poor contract handling.
Weird how teams that win are always "team players" and teams that lose always need a "culture change". Did the Giants stop being team players between 2016 and 2017? From 2011 to 2013?
The eagles are really talented. What wins is talent and some mindful coaching. Maybe if the Giants had some talent at offensive line they'd look more like team players. A roster full of Mark Herlichs and Zak DeOssies and David Tyrees isn't winning a lot of football games no matter how much heart and sacrifice they put out there.
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
The problem is timing. This “Looks” really bad from a team standpoint and being a part of the team. New coach, new schemes, new playbook, by holding out at this juncture he is telling everyone “screw you I just want mine”. If he attended OTA, mini camps but held out of training camp, I would be more inclined to support him.
The problem is timing. This “Looks” really bad from a team standpoint and being a part of the team. New coach, new schemes, new playbook, by holding out at this juncture he is telling everyone “screw you I just want mine”. If he attended OTA, mini camps but held out of training camp, I would be more inclined to support him.
Didn't Shurmur just leave his job for a better one with more pay? Why doesn't it look bad for him leaving a team that made the NFC title game for more prestige and a bigger paycheck?
Why does it only look bad for the players when they want to look out for their future?
The problem is timing. This “Looks” really bad from a team standpoint and being a part of the team. New coach, new schemes, new playbook, by holding out at this juncture he is telling everyone “screw you I just want mine”. If he attended OTA, mini camps but held out of training camp, I would be more inclined to support him.
But this only looks bad if you don't understand that this is a business. It seems many fans want to believe these players love the Giants just as much as they do and would play for free just to win a championship. How many of these people view their employers that way?
Odell needs to do what is best for Odell, and the Giants need to to what is best for the Giants. I don't begrudge any player for trying to get paid market price in a dangerous career with an exceptionally short timespan.
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Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
It's called negotiating. If the Giants didn't want this to come out, Mara should have said no comment yesterday.
Mara was playing the game. Odell is playing the game. Until he misses a mandatory team activity lets calm ourselves down and take a step off the ledge.
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In comment 13887802 Gmen86900711 said:
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Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
Well I can start by saying your numbers are backwards and what you have as 2017 was really 2016.
So either you're a moron or a troll.
Manning - ( New Window )
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just shake my head at drivel like this:
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He's not the best offensive player the Giants have had as it has no results beyond his own stats and desire to be paid as an individual (notice the term individual instead of team). Maybe he needs a team that can nurture his snowflake feelings and drama. This team needs tough guys that that can pull out wins and championships not drama queens that have parlor tricks.
How can one WR deliver championships? Jesus, a bunch of people argue that even Eli didn't win game on his own in 2007 and 2011, so how the fuck is Beckham held to a different standard? By the logic used here titles make the player, So Jake Ballard is better than Shockey. Elvis Patterson is better than Sehorn.
I also can't believe it when people say we need tough players who want to win and dismiss Beckham as being a me-first guy who doesn't care about winning.
It goes against everything you see from him on the field and in the workout room. Then again, some asswipe who uses the term "snowflake" is pretty much a useless putz anyway.
He won't because it requires a team. He is a peacock, only out for himself. As usual, you are quick on the spot with replies and insults but no insight. Some have more courage to break the glass, you are a lazy pithy insult responder. Go the fuck away, everyone is tired of your ass.
I agree, his schtick has gotten old.
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In comment 13887825 ajr2456 said:
Or I just had a typo. I got the comp% correct but inverted the stats. So I made a mistake but ultimately the numbers are still the same. Comp % is nearly identical. Yardage off by 375 yards but Eli was benched for a game so this is a wash. INTs is lower. TDS is the only one you could say is significantly different and I believe you could argue this is more than just losing OBJ that contributed to that. The whole WR core was hurt. I love how if someone makes a slight error you automatically assume someone is a troll. Look at the numbers they are not that different. Just an honest mistake.
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In comment 13887802 Gmen86900711 said:
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Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
Well I can start by saying your numbers are backwards and what you have as 2017 was really 2016.
So either you're a moron or a troll. Manning - ( New Window )
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In comment 13887875 Gmen86900711 said:
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In comment 13887825 ajr2456 said:
Or I just had a typo. I got the comp% correct but inverted the stats. So I made a mistake but ultimately the numbers are still the same. Comp % is nearly identical. Yardage off by 375 yards but Eli was benched for a game so this is a wash. INTs is lower. TDS is the only one you could say is significantly different and I believe you could argue this is more than just losing OBJ that contributed to that. The whole WR core was hurt. I love how if someone makes a slight error you automatically assume someone is a troll. Look at the numbers they are not that different. Just an honest mistake.
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In comment 13887802 Gmen86900711 said:
Quote:
Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
Well I can start by saying your numbers are backwards and what you have as 2017 was really 2016.
So either you're a moron or a troll. Manning - ( New Window )
If you really think his 2017 numbers are nearly on par with 2016 you're not intuitive
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In comment 13887825 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13887802 Gmen86900711 said:
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Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
Well I can start by saying your numbers are backwards and what you have as 2017 was really 2016.
So either you're a moron or a troll. Manning - ( New Window )
Interesting how even in my original comment I state that if you take into account that Eli was benched for a game then the numbers are almost identical. So while I apologize for the error. The point still stands and is correct. So call me all the names you like but at the end of the day your argument holds no wait. Our offense sputtered with and without OBJ the last 2 years. So maybe at the end of the day we’d be better off not spending that big of a % of our cap on a WR.
If I had to guess what the FAR bigger issue for the Giants organization is right now, I'd say it's not knowing what Odell will look like coming back from injury as opposed to the off the field stuff. I think the owners take the off the field stuff in stride as opposed to the cacophony of media and idiot fans. (One interesting addition is how the new GM and head coach view these issues. This decision will be ultimately decided over the GM's head.) I think Mara and Tisch would still give Odell a new contract before OTAs, but he would have to meet them in the middle in terms of guaranteed money.
The question then becomes whether Odell is willing to do so.
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In comment 13887885 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13887875 Gmen86900711 said:
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In comment 13887825 ajr2456 said:
Or I just had a typo. I got the comp% correct but inverted the stats. So I made a mistake but ultimately the numbers are still the same. Comp % is nearly identical. Yardage off by 375 yards but Eli was benched for a game so this is a wash. INTs is lower. TDS is the only one you could say is significantly different and I believe you could argue this is more than just losing OBJ that contributed to that. The whole WR core was hurt. I love how if someone makes a slight error you automatically assume someone is a troll. Look at the numbers they are not that different. Just an honest mistake.
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In comment 13887802 Gmen86900711 said:
Quote:
Comp % Yards Td INT
2016 63% 3468 19 13
2017 62% 4027 26 16
Not as big of a difference as you may think. Take into account Eli sat for one game the numbers are almost identical. I think people forget that Eli is a big part of OBJ’s success. Eli has consistently made WR’s around him better players. OBJ is just the most talented WR Eli has ever had. Is OBJ and a 18-20 million $ cap hit worth a few more TDS and a few more yards. I’m not so sure.
This is a perfect example of twisting stats to fit a narrative. How did that offense look last year? How many games did they win?
Eli's numbers are inflated because they were losing a lot and needed to throw.
One could argue we won 11 games in 2016 because we had a top 5 defense. Our offense sucked that year even with OBJ. No one can argue those 2 facts. Not to mention last year we weren’t just missing OBJ. Marshall and Dwayne Harris were also out all year. Let’s also not forget Shepard missed 5 games as well. So Eli was throwing to a rookie TE and WR’s from the practice squad. So go ahead and try to twist those facts and make a solid rebuttal. Some how Eli still produced a somewhat respectable stat line. Mind you no one in there right mind could expect Eli to produce wins with the oline, running game, and WR’s he had to work with last year. That is unless your completely irrational.
Well I can start by saying your numbers are backwards and what you have as 2017 was really 2016.
So either you're a moron or a troll. Manning - ( New Window )
If you really think his 2017 numbers are nearly on par with 2016 you're not intuitive
Ok moron let me make this a little simpler for you. In 2016 our prolific offense with OBJ scored a whopping 19 points a game. This was helped significantly by our opportunistic defense with 3 defensive TD’s and turnovers setting up easier scores. Our team as a whole was much healthier this year as well. In 2017 we averaged 15 points a game. This is lower but as I said we were missing our entire WR core not just OBJ and had significant oline injuries as well. So again these numbers suck both years no arguing that. But the overall difference that OBJ’s absence made be a bit overstated around here. I like OBJ and I hope he turns it around. But let’s not overstate his value to the team. He is not a one man offense.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
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People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
And apparently OBJ throws himself the ball too. Seems as though only OBJ gets credit when the offense does well. When the offense struggles it because of Eli. Go and watch the clips of OBJ on this message board. Eli makes throws where he hits OBJ in stride and this allows him to take it to the house. When they succeed they succeed together. When they fail they fail together. But your right we’ve won 2 Super Bowls with Eli and are winless in the playoffs with Odell. By the way Eli was the only one who showed up in the Green Bay playoff game. OBJ and the WR core were missing in action in that game.
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People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
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In comment 13887728 ajr2456 said:
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People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
I think you are the one with the reading comprehension problem. I was agreeing with Jcin. Pretty sure Jcin was questioning the intelligence of your comment. Maybe you should put the keyboard away for the night. Everyone on here is now dumber from reading your posts.
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In comment 13888066 JCin332 said:
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In comment 13887728 ajr2456 said:
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People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
I think you are the one with the reading comprehension problem. I was agreeing with Jcin. Pretty sure Jcin was questioning the intelligence of your comment. Maybe you should put the keyboard away for the night. Everyone on here is now dumber from reading your posts.
I was talking to Jcin who quoted my post not you?
What's to question when pointing out that people only point out wins as individual stats when it's convenient?
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In comment 13888104 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13888066 JCin332 said:
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In comment 13887728 ajr2456 said:
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People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
I think you are the one with the reading comprehension problem. I was agreeing with Jcin. Pretty sure Jcin was questioning the intelligence of your comment. Maybe you should put the keyboard away for the night. Everyone on here is now dumber from reading your posts.
I was talking to Jcin who quoted my post not you?
What's to question when pointing out that people only point out wins as individual stats when it's convenient?
So are u saying Eli wasn’t a big part of the last 2 Super Bowls wins? Are you one of those Geniuses that says the defense won both of them meanwhile it took 2 game winning drives by ELi to win the games.
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In comment 13888151 Gmen86900711 said:
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In comment 13888104 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13888066 JCin332 said:
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In comment 13887728 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
I think you are the one with the reading comprehension problem. I was agreeing with Jcin. Pretty sure Jcin was questioning the intelligence of your comment. Maybe you should put the keyboard away for the night. Everyone on here is now dumber from reading your posts.
I was talking to Jcin who quoted my post not you?
What's to question when pointing out that people only point out wins as individual stats when it's convenient?
So are u saying Eli wasn’t a big part of the last 2 Super Bowls wins? Are you one of those Geniuses that says the defense won both of them meanwhile it took 2 game winning drives by ELi to win the games.
Holy fuck. Where the fuck did I say any of that?
Let me break it down as simple as possible.
When people say Eli hasn't won anything in awhile people point to the line, the defense, the running game etc and claim it's a team game.
With Odell it's he hasn't won anything, as if this is tennis and he's the only one on the field.
Wins are an indivual stat when it's convenient and nowhere in that post is there shitting on Eli. Comprende?
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In comment 13888168 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13888151 Gmen86900711 said:
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In comment 13888104 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 13888066 JCin332 said:
Quote:
In comment 13887728 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
People say if we just get Eli this and that then he'll be fine.
But when it comes to Odell it's "he hasn't won anything"
Oh Eli hasn't won anything...?
Brilliant...
I think you need to check your reading comprehension skills.
People say that Eli just needs more help to win again.
But Odell gets ran out because he hasn't won anything.
Weird how wins are only individual stats when they want to be.
Got it, genius?
I think you are the one with the reading comprehension problem. I was agreeing with Jcin. Pretty sure Jcin was questioning the intelligence of your comment. Maybe you should put the keyboard away for the night. Everyone on here is now dumber from reading your posts.
I was talking to Jcin who quoted my post not you?
What's to question when pointing out that people only point out wins as individual stats when it's convenient?
So are u saying Eli wasn’t a big part of the last 2 Super Bowls wins? Are you one of those Geniuses that says the defense won both of them meanwhile it took 2 game winning drives by ELi to win the games.
Holy fuck. Where the fuck did I say any of that?
Let me break it down as simple as possible.
When people say Eli hasn't won anything in awhile people point to the line, the defense, the running game etc and claim it's a team game.
With Odell it's he hasn't won anything, as if this is tennis and he's the only one on the field.
Wins are an indivual stat when it's convenient and nowhere in that post is there shitting on Eli. Comprende?
I never said that you said anything. I simply asked if you are one of those guys. It’s a fair question since I see people say that on here all the time. But you’d have to agree a QB has the biggest role of any player on the field, correct? So if you want him to be successful you need to protect him, no? This is true of any QB. Would you say we’ve done a good job protecting him the last few years? The answer is no. Comprende? Other than our 11-5 year have we surrounded Eli with a good defense since 2011? Again the answer is no. Comprende! The stats don’t lie. So again people that say you need to surround Eli with talent are correct. Being that we just fired our GM I believe our owner agrees that we haven’t surrounded Eli with enough talent to make another run at a Super Bowl. Hopefully that has changed and hopefully Eli has enough in the tank for one or 2 more runs. Unfortunately we wasted some good Eli years with poor drafting and lack of talent on the team. By the way you are a condescending, vulgar, and nasty person. I would think as an adult you could be civil in your communication as a fellow Giants fan. You really should be ashamed of yourself. You really add nothing to these message boards.
for Odell to be elsewhere next year...'
I've been prepared and frankly it's time for him to go. Teams win championships, not diva superstars, as talented as he may be.
This is just another in a litany of immature behavior o his part. He expects to be rewarded after missing a season to injury all the while embarassing the franchise at every turn with his antics. Peeing on the pylon like a dog on a hydrant. That's not how Ginats players comport themselves.
Then a new regime comes in. You just know they had 'the talk' with Odell about maturity, optics and embarassing them . Literally within weeks his 'photo op' with drugs and whores goes viral. They must be livid with him.
I'll pack his bags and a sack lunch. Goodbye.
It’s actually great. Think about it - the #2 pick, a potentially QB rush draft, a very interesting QB controversy, a WR as polarizing as Trump, both owners piping up in the press, GenoGate, the Apples, a new GM handpicked by Accorsi, trading JPP, etc, etc, etc...
I'd love to hear from all the bbi posters who signed a contract at 22, then when they found out they were one of the most talented people in the world at their jobs, but never asked for a raise, and instead said, that's ok, you don't need to pay me any more money for the next few years. it's cool. come one.
you know why odell's on social media all the time? because it's worth a lot of money - and because he's grossly underpaid for what he does, in a sport where he could be injured any minute, any competent financial advisor would tell him the same thing - you better maximize your value while you can. remember hakeem nicks and steve smith? boy, those second contracts really paid off for them didnt' they? the same people screaming to trade odell are going to be all over this site bitching and moaning when the draft pick the giants get back turns out to the league average player he's likely to be, and when the giants take the money they would've used on odell for some free agent that everyone is going to scream is overpriced.
you know who's an overpaid giant? mark herzlich. someone ought to ask john mara about that contract.
THRILL RIDE LOVES YOUR STYLE.
Maybe there's an extension, maybe not. Bet anything Odell suits up Week1 for NYG.
I'd sign up for winning with flamboyant talented guys right now. The winning part would be a welcome change!
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In comment 13886839 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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this fucking tool:
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Fatman fantasizes about OBJ, that's the only legitimate reason I can think of as to why he defends him on every single instance. It's disgraceful!
You do realize that I'm not defending Beckham. I'm calling the people who think he should be traded morons.
I'm saying that if you judge somebody how they are as a person based on a TD celebration, that it is idiotic.
Like I've said numerous times - just say you hate the guy and move along. Trying to justify trading the best player on the team isn't really working.
But a boat trip......
Your opinion is based in part on delusion and part in hero-worship. Are you trying to say if you got a super value -- more than what OBJ's value you wouldn't take it? Do you understand that we were 3-13 and the year before we only got tot the playoffs and have not won a super bowl recently?
I find it unfathomable that any Giant fan would think anyone on the team is untouchable after the season we just had and especially the player we are talking about so far has led the giants basically nowhere.
I don't want him traded but fans like you worship OBJ like he is some type of God. Tone it down.
Tone it down? Have some self awareness and realize your entire post is complete hyperbole cranked up to 12. Who is worshiping anyone? Smart people don’t want to trade our best player. They realize that maybe not having said best player on the field was a big reason we went 3-13.
Anyone that isn't bright enough to realize that it's okay to trade Beckham if you get +value or if the Giants realize they can't resign him.
And for hero-worshippers such as yourself to thick to realize the Giants were 0-4 about to go 0-5 with OBJ in the lineup. But that doesn't count, right?
Trade him to the Browns for #4 and give them a 3rd or 4th round to sweeten the deal.
Barkley and Chubb? Wouldn't be too bad of a draft. A viable running game still wins championships and now they need another dominant DE.
OR, talk Eli into taking a performance based pay cut and free up some money there. But I just don't see the Giants being able to pay OBJ what he's wanting. And the farther along free agency goes along, money starts to tighten up and then teams have very unhappy dead ducks on the team that they could have profited from had they been willing to make big boy decisions earlier.
No, I don't want to see OBJ leave, that would suck. But, you still have to consider that business is the core of the NFL for everybody concerned.
The Norman spearing was good by me. The refs weren't protecting him and nice to see a guy with some fire. Fuck Norman.
People are still upset by fake dog pissing on the Eagles? Fuck the Eagles!! If that really offended you maybe golf is more your sport. (I get Mara had to reprimand him publicly)
Do I love his off the field antics, no. I'm past the instagram generation. Do I love watching him turn 6 yd passes into 75 yd TDs? Single handedly take games over? Hell yes, and I hope he does it in blue for years to come.