Where does all the OBJ hate stem from?

I agree that Brown is the slightly better WR, but much of that stems from him being 4 years wiser, playing in a much better offense, and having more playoff opportunities to showcase.

But head to head all things being even, Beckham is the more explosive player and is a much better WR than brown was at 24/25.

In comment 13889284 Brown Recluse said:

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In comment 13889260 Giants in 07 said: Quote: In comment 13889214 JonC said: Quote: seemed to serve as a flashpoint for much of the opinion swing against him. You mean the game where our Top 5 defense gave up 38 points? People make it seem like we had the game won and Beckham fucked it up. The whole team played like shit that day. Would his dropped TD have changed the game? Of course. Not letting Randall Cobb go untouched in the endzone for a 60 yard hail mary at the end of the half could have changed the game too. A kicking net? Really? That was the media's obsession, as was Beckham's (incorrect) reaction to him being targeted in the Carolina game. Nobody is saying he's a saint, but some of these "controversies" are caused by other parties. See, you're making excuses for him. It doesn't matter what the defense gave up or how the rest of the team played. We're talking about Odell. And he came up short. Add that into everything else, and its not difficult to understand why some fans don't have a lot of patience with him. As far as the kicking net, yes the media made it into a thing. But his attention-seeking proposal (on more than one occasion - as if once wasn't bad enough) was cringeworthy, and is a perfect example of how he has to be the center of attention and put himself above everyone else. I'm sure he loves football and I'm sure his teammates enjoy him. He's an amazing talent. But he needs to grow up. Or he won't be on this team anymore. Simple as that.

I think he was trying to say that football is not an individual sport, so the Green Bay game doesn’t fall squarely on his shoulders. The boat trip thinggets magnified, but let’s be real. Is everyone here saints on their days off preparing for Monday the entire weekend. Nope your probably raging on Saturday night. They just have the means to go to Miami and do it.

The net thing was blown up by the media and he made fun of the whole situation with the proposal thing to make light of a rediculous media made controversy.

If the guy was TO and was an absolute locker room cancer I would 100% get the hate. He isn’t even remotely close. He’s an exceptional worker and teammate by all accounts. His teammates love him.

In comment 13889264 bhill410 said:

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of fans. And yes it’s with out a doubt generational. People like LT, Jim Brown, or even a more recent example like Marvin Harrison were all genuine pieces of garbage humans but because they acted professional on the field people gave them a pass. Whereas OBJ is flamboyant and at times immature and the older generation views that as the most unforgivable sin of all despite the fact reports have him being a genuinely nice human.

Ding Ding Ding!

I love OBJ as a player. But his contract demands and his ultra large ego is a concern for me. Give me the more humble rookie version pre "The Catch" any day of the week. This new ultra ego version of OBJ is for the birds. Don't like it. It's like Deshaun Jackson 2.0 but worse. Demanding QB $ and threatening a hold out when you just got a 5th year option raise is hard to swallow. Be reasonable on your contract demands and show up for team events and he'll have my respect back. This isn't the year to hold out. We have a new offense to learn and he needs to get the timing back with Eli since he missed almost all of last season. I don't like me first players.

In comment 13889304 pjcas18 said:

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the most are people like Cris Carter, but sure, it's old white dudes. sometimes people are so blinded by their own racist thoughts or tendencies they project it on everyone else. Yes, I'm calling you out adamg. Not everything is about race. I am a Beckham fan, I don't care about the off-field stuff, I don't care if he's a saint, I don't care if he visits hospitals or donates a kidney to a sick kid, or if he's having jumpsuit parties with Drake or Gronk or snorting lines off a hookers ass, goes on boat trips or anywhere else. Don't care. I care only about the on-field performance. period. with Beckham, with Eli, and everyone else while they're in a Giants uniform. I'd like the Giants to re-sign Beckham, I want him to end his career has an all-time Giants great and all time NFL great and eventually make it to the HOF as a career Giant with some super bowl rings. I prefer when he plays his emotions don't cost the team field position like when he pees like a dog after a TD catch, or spears defenseless players in the head, but if he doesn't draw a flag for it, I don't care how he celebrates or how emotional he is. I don't care what color my skin is or his is, I doubt my philosophy of rooting for laundry ever changes.

Fanning the flames was a better take. When you get into the psychobabble bullshit about projection, you're way off. I'm white. And I absolutely think some of the hate for Beckham is based on race. I don't think that's a stretch. If calling that out reveals some underlying racism, that's beyond reaching for you to say.

In comment 13889250 AnnapolisMike said:

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of the shut up and play the game crowd that I am a part of. He is one of the greatest WR's to ever play for the Giants. At the same time he is a distraction and a bit too much of a 'me' player. He likes his celebrity status a bit too much. He would rather train by himself as well. I don't think he is worth a 18M AAV contract from the Giants. Assuming salary cap around $180M...that is 10% of the Giants cap space. I don't think a WR (any WR) is worth that much. I'd rather that cap space be divided up between 3-4 players who can fill holes and provide needed depth.

People throw the distraction thing around a lot, but who exactly is getting distracted? The team plays better when he's on the field, the locker room didn't implode until he was on IR and away from the team, his teammates universally seem to like him and respect him.

Are fans just projecting that they think it would be a distraction to them? Because there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of evidence that the players are distracted by OBJ. And quite honestly, if professional athletes are getting distracted by some of the stuff that goes on with him, that's also an indictment on them, IMO.

I would probably agree there's an element of the media coverage of him that might be distracting, but do you think the Pat Leonards of the world aren't going to find someone else to be their clickbait target even if OBJ is gone? That's the way some of the media does business right now, and their business model isn't likely to change just because you take away their lowest hanging fruit.

Has had multiple personal foul penalties in a single game which directly led to his suspension and a change in the rules.

He has taken multiple 15 yard penalties for celebration/conduct. His most notable, the actual act of mimicking a dog peeing, is far less important than the fact that afterwards he basically told everyone he doesnt give a shit and would do it again without hesitation.

He takes a day trip to Miami 6 days before a playoff game in which he laid an egg.

Jerry Reese said Beckham needed to grow up. I guess he's racist!

In comment 13889328 Gmen86900711 said:

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I love OBJ as a player. But his contract demands and his ultra large ego is a concern for me. Give me the more humble rookie version pre "The Catch" any day of the week. This new ultra ego version of OBJ is for the birds. Don't like it. It's like Deshaun Jackson 2.0 but worse. Demanding QB $ and threatening a hold out when you just got a 5th year option raise is hard to swallow. Be reasonable on your contract demands and show up for team events and he'll have my respect back. This isn't the year to hold out. We have a new offense to learn and he needs to get the timing back with Eli since he missed almost all of last season. I don't like me first players.

All valid points.

In comment 13889284 Brown Recluse said:

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In comment 13889260 Giants in 07 said: Quote: In comment 13889214 JonC said: Quote: seemed to serve as a flashpoint for much of the opinion swing against him. You mean the game where our Top 5 defense gave up 38 points? People make it seem like we had the game won and Beckham fucked it up. The whole team played like shit that day. Would his dropped TD have changed the game? Of course. Not letting Randall Cobb go untouched in the endzone for a 60 yard hail mary at the end of the half could have changed the game too. A kicking net? Really? That was the media's obsession, as was Beckham's (incorrect) reaction to him being targeted in the Carolina game. Nobody is saying he's a saint, but some of these "controversies" are caused by other parties. See, you're making excuses for him. It doesn't matter what the defense gave up or how the rest of the team played. We're talking about Odell. And he came up short. Add that into everything else, and its not difficult to understand why some fans don't have a lot of patience with him. As far as the kicking net, yes the media made it into a thing. But his attention-seeking proposal (on more than one occasion - as if once wasn't bad enough) was cringeworthy, and is a perfect example of how he has to be the center of attention and put himself above everyone else. I'm sure he loves football and I'm sure his teammates enjoy him. He's an amazing talent. But he needs to grow up. Or he won't be on this team anymore. Simple as that.

I'm not, and I don't think anybody else is, saying he's an angel, just that a lot of these so-called "distractions" are media driven. And of course when you're an outspoken superstar you're going to get part of the blame whether it's warranted or not.

But if Odell goes for 150 and a TD in that Packers playoff game and we lose 38-20 instead of 38-13, you think people wouldn't still use the boat as an excuse as to why the Giants lost? Of course they would.

Some people can do nothing right no matter what they do in the eyes of some, and Odell is definitely in that territory. You don't trade generational superstars because they are cringeworthy. Half the things that happen on the football field is cringeworthy these days.

In comment 13889179 adamg said:

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who don't remember that they rooted for LT

It's much easier to attack the critics than address Beckham"s boorish behavior and all-about-me attitude. (when asked about hurting his team and 15 yard penalty he said "I don't care if we kick from the 5 yard line!)

In comment 13889317 Gmen88 said:

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In comment 13889264 bhill410 said: Quote: of fans. And yes it’s with out a doubt generational. People like LT, Jim Brown, or even a more recent example like Marvin Harrison were all genuine pieces of garbage humans but because they acted professional on the field people gave them a pass. Whereas OBJ is flamboyant and at times immature and the older generation views that as the most unforgivable sin of all despite the fact reports have him being a genuinely nice human. Ding Ding Ding!

Way to stereotype this. You couldn't be more wrong. I'm a stand on 3rd down kind of guy and I'm 39. That doesn't mean I have to like Diva type players. I like the player OBJ is but I don't like his antics. Why would anyone approve of his request for QB type $ when Antonio Brown who is unquestionably the best WR in football is at $17 million per year. And by the way Brown just gave money back to the Steelers to help their cap situation. Accept 17-18 million a year and count your blessings. No sports athlete should be making this kind of $. Sad world we live in.

LT's transgressions happened (aside from the suspension) off the field and with no social media so fans could just ignore them and focus on the player. What Odell does happens on the field during the games, so everybody sees it.

Fact is that you can find people on BBI that hate every single player, and since they are usually the squeeky wheels and post on that topic more than other people, it gives a false impression. You see it with OBJ, Eli, any QB coming out, Barkley, Pugh, Solder (even though he didn't even get here yet), etc.

And to make it worse they all are convinced they are spouting facts, even though its just their opinion, and people who disagree with them are idots.

In comment 13889330 adamg said:

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In comment 13889304 pjcas18 said: Quote: the most are people like Cris Carter, but sure, it's old white dudes. sometimes people are so blinded by their own racist thoughts or tendencies they project it on everyone else. Yes, I'm calling you out adamg. Not everything is about race. I am a Beckham fan, I don't care about the off-field stuff, I don't care if he's a saint, I don't care if he visits hospitals or donates a kidney to a sick kid, or if he's having jumpsuit parties with Drake or Gronk or snorting lines off a hookers ass, goes on boat trips or anywhere else. Don't care. I care only about the on-field performance. period. with Beckham, with Eli, and everyone else while they're in a Giants uniform. I'd like the Giants to re-sign Beckham, I want him to end his career has an all-time Giants great and all time NFL great and eventually make it to the HOF as a career Giant with some super bowl rings. I prefer when he plays his emotions don't cost the team field position like when he pees like a dog after a TD catch, or spears defenseless players in the head, but if he doesn't draw a flag for it, I don't care how he celebrates or how emotional he is. I don't care what color my skin is or his is, I doubt my philosophy of rooting for laundry ever changes. Fanning the flames was a better take. When you get into the psychobabble bullshit about projection, you're way off. I'm white. And I absolutely think some of the hate for Beckham is based on race. I don't think that's a stretch. If calling that out reveals some underlying racism, that's beyond reaching for you to say.

Way off!! 60-70% of the league is black. Most of my favorite Giants of all-time are black. Most of my favorite current Giants are black minus Eli. This is not a race thing. I just don't like his antics. I prefer a classy player that knows he's good and doesn't have to strut his stuff constantly. Sorry if I prefer Amani Toomer's style to OBJ's behavior. By the way Amani Toomer was black and is a Super Bowl Champion. OBJ has a long was to go before he is as revered as much as Toomer. And it has nothing to do with stats/race.

it means he showed up and did his job well, most likely. And that's the point, he didn't do that. None of them did, but we're talking abot OB here.

In comment 13889383 Gmen86900711 said:

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In comment 13889330 adamg said: Quote: In comment 13889304 pjcas18 said: Quote: the most are people like Cris Carter, but sure, it's old white dudes. sometimes people are so blinded by their own racist thoughts or tendencies they project it on everyone else. Yes, I'm calling you out adamg. Not everything is about race. I am a Beckham fan, I don't care about the off-field stuff, I don't care if he's a saint, I don't care if he visits hospitals or donates a kidney to a sick kid, or if he's having jumpsuit parties with Drake or Gronk or snorting lines off a hookers ass, goes on boat trips or anywhere else. Don't care. I care only about the on-field performance. period. with Beckham, with Eli, and everyone else while they're in a Giants uniform. I'd like the Giants to re-sign Beckham, I want him to end his career has an all-time Giants great and all time NFL great and eventually make it to the HOF as a career Giant with some super bowl rings. I prefer when he plays his emotions don't cost the team field position like when he pees like a dog after a TD catch, or spears defenseless players in the head, but if he doesn't draw a flag for it, I don't care how he celebrates or how emotional he is. I don't care what color my skin is or his is, I doubt my philosophy of rooting for laundry ever changes. Fanning the flames was a better take. When you get into the psychobabble bullshit about projection, you're way off. I'm white. And I absolutely think some of the hate for Beckham is based on race. I don't think that's a stretch. If calling that out reveals some underlying racism, that's beyond reaching for you to say. Way off!! 60-70% of the league is black. Most of my favorite Giants of all-time are black. Most of my favorite current Giants are black minus Eli. This is not a race thing. I just don't like his antics. I prefer a classy player that knows he's good and doesn't have to strut his stuff constantly. Sorry if I prefer Amani Toomer's style to OBJ's behavior. By the way Amani Toomer was black and is a Super Bowl Champion. OBJ has a long was to go before he is as revered as much as Toomer. And it has nothing to do with stats/race.

Exactly, this is not a racial debate. The guy acts like a clown half the time. If Rhett Ellison was doing this stuff we would all say the same thing.

on this site.

I'm in my early 30's, white, and I'm not a racist.

If anyone were to know me based on my positions on different topics on BBI, they'd know that I was one of the most ardent supporters of JPP, before, during and after his accident, which is exactly what that was, an accident.

It has always been my opinion that JPP was misunderstood by the Giant fanbase and inaccurately categorized as lazy.

But I'm just an old, racist white guy!

Newspapers, Josh Norman, Alec Ogletree, Duke Williams, Xavier Rhodes, social media, fans, refs, old white dudes, French models, kicking nets, Gronk, dogs that pee, and on and on and on.

In comment 13889396 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

In comment 13889383 Gmen86900711 said: Quote: In comment 13889330 adamg said: Quote: In comment 13889304 pjcas18 said: Quote: the most are people like Cris Carter, but sure, it's old white dudes. sometimes people are so blinded by their own racist thoughts or tendencies they project it on everyone else. Yes, I'm calling you out adamg. Not everything is about race. I am a Beckham fan, I don't care about the off-field stuff, I don't care if he's a saint, I don't care if he visits hospitals or donates a kidney to a sick kid, or if he's having jumpsuit parties with Drake or Gronk or snorting lines off a hookers ass, goes on boat trips or anywhere else. Don't care. I care only about the on-field performance. period. with Beckham, with Eli, and everyone else while they're in a Giants uniform. I'd like the Giants to re-sign Beckham, I want him to end his career has an all-time Giants great and all time NFL great and eventually make it to the HOF as a career Giant with some super bowl rings. I prefer when he plays his emotions don't cost the team field position like when he pees like a dog after a TD catch, or spears defenseless players in the head, but if he doesn't draw a flag for it, I don't care how he celebrates or how emotional he is. I don't care what color my skin is or his is, I doubt my philosophy of rooting for laundry ever changes. Fanning the flames was a better take. When you get into the psychobabble bullshit about projection, you're way off. I'm white. And I absolutely think some of the hate for Beckham is based on race. I don't think that's a stretch. If calling that out reveals some underlying racism, that's beyond reaching for you to say. Way off!! 60-70% of the league is black. Most of my favorite Giants of all-time are black. Most of my favorite current Giants are black minus Eli. This is not a race thing. I just don't like his antics. I prefer a classy player that knows he's good and doesn't have to strut his stuff constantly. Sorry if I prefer Amani Toomer's style to OBJ's behavior. By the way Amani Toomer was black and is a Super Bowl Champion. OBJ has a long was to go before he is as revered as much as Toomer. And it has nothing to do with stats/race. Exactly, this is not a racial debate. The guy acts like a clown half the time. If Rhett Ellison was doing this stuff we would all say the same thing.

Exactly. And just to support that point I loved Shockey as a player. But once his antics started to hurt the team and Eli's progression I was ready to move on from him. Guess what he's white!!!!

We all like different things. I certainly don’t hate Odell, I don’t even dislike him. I don’t like some of his on field actions. I would like him to retire as a Giant. I hope the Giants make him the highest paid receiver ever.

I would rather trade him, ONLY, if his demands exceed 18.5 million a year and more than 60m guaranteed. I believe opposing players want to hurt him. I think he is going to get injured again. If he really wants Garrapolo money I hope we trade him instead. That doesn’t make racist, it doesn’t make me a hater, it makes me pragmatic.
Long contentious holdouts by a teams’ best player can damage a team. Coming off 3-13, if we could get 2 number ones(Galloway deal) and if his contract demands exceed what I talked about earlier, I hope the Giants seriously consider it. Lot of ifs there.

More ifs. If his contract demands are ridiculous but we don’t get at an offer of least 2 number ones, I would let him hold out, fine him the max, then franchise him for 2 years. His game is largely based on explosion, 3 years from now he might be the guy he is now anymore.

I'm so, so grateful the Giants drafted a player with that kind of talent. And he gets along with his teammates. These are the only things that matter. I think there's a lot of overreaction to his antics. To answer your question, the tipping point seemed to be the boat ride, but I thought the hyperventilation around that was BS.

-- old white lady

Just to show you that racism is not the issue here my preference is not to trade OBJ. It's for OBJ to grow up and come back to reality in his contract negotiations. I want him to be the best WR in Giants history. Take less money to stay in NY. Your endorsements here far out weigh anything you'll get elsewhere. Help Eli and the Giants get the 5th ring. Stop being so selfish and fully buy in to this great organization and city. It's not always greener on the other side. You got it good here. Change your reputation and make it a goal to be a better person. Stay out of the public eye. I really don't care what you do in private. But keep it private.

Blind fanboys who fail to see that the kid has issues and a lot of maturing to do

In comment 13889416 exiled said:

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I'm so, so grateful the Giants drafted a player with that kind of talent. And he gets along with his teammates. These are the only things that matter. I think there's a lot of overreaction to his antics. To answer your question, the tipping point seemed to be the boat ride, but I thought the hyperventilation around that was BS. -- old white lady

I agree some of the antics are blown out of proportion. That being said a boat trip to Miami was not the brightest idea playoff week. You have all offseason for boat rides. Focus on game planning and game prep. Boat rides and trips to Miami is celebrating before the job is done. And whether we want to admit it or not it impacted the game. That's the worst game the WR's played all year. That's immaturity rearing it's ugly head. Hopefully OBJ and Shep learned their lesson here.

No one is excluded, we've even seen a number of fans turn on the face of the franchise.

Im sure some of these things would be overlooked. Ive never seen a more talented receiver woth so many concentration drops. Dropping wide open touchdowns is inexcusable

In comment 13889179 adamg said:

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who don't remember that they rooted for LT

Ding, ding, ding. I know its still early, but I think we have a winner for the "Daily Ass Hole" award

In comment 13889357 Gmen86900711 said:

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In comment 13889317 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889264 bhill410 said: Quote: of fans. And yes it’s with out a doubt generational. People like LT, Jim Brown, or even a more recent example like Marvin Harrison were all genuine pieces of garbage humans but because they acted professional on the field people gave them a pass. Whereas OBJ is flamboyant and at times immature and the older generation views that as the most unforgivable sin of all despite the fact reports have him being a genuinely nice human. Ding Ding Ding! Way to stereotype this. You couldn't be more wrong. I'm a stand on 3rd down kind of guy and I'm 39. That doesn't mean I have to like Diva type players. I like the player OBJ is but I don't like his antics. Why would anyone approve of his request for QB type $ when Antonio Brown who is unquestionably the best WR in football is at $17 million per year. And by the way Brown just gave money back to the Steelers to help their cap situation. Accept 17-18 million a year and count your blessings. No sports athlete should be making this kind of $. Sad world we live in.

So the fact that he wants to get paid as one of the best players in the league (which he is one) is a negative? This is clearly all negotiating through the media. Start high and meet somewhere reasonable.

In comment 13889477 nyballa0891 said:

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Im sure some of these things would be overlooked. Ive never seen a more talented receiver woth so many concentration drops. Dropping wide open touchdowns is inexcusable

Honestly, even if the guy was a complete saint on and off the field his contract demands are a little ridiculous and could really set us back as a franchise. You have to be careful shelling out tons of cash to non-QB’s outside of left tackle and maybe defensive end. I would just hate to see us pay him a ton and then suffer at other key positions due to cap limitations. It’s an easy way to become a mediocre team with some highlight TD’s from time to time.

..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me.

If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that.

We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ.

I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson.

OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao)

In comment 13889573 dank41 said:

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..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao)

See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that.

He drops passes, disappears from big games, generates penalties and generally gets bad press. He is more into his brand then being a football player.

Bad press happens, but he is gets in fights, gets penalties and yet is never seen in the community, working charities etc. He is more concerned with his persona then his team, thus people don't like him.

In comment 13889611 djstat said:

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He drops passes, disappears from big games, generates penalties and generally gets bad press. He is more into his brand then being a football player. Bad press happens, but he is gets in fights, gets penalties and yet is never seen in the community, working charities etc. He is more concerned with his persona then his team, thus people don't like him.

Link - ( New Window )

and I love the kid. He's a game changer, and in spite of the sideshow, he's good for this offense. I long ago got over the "Sportscentering" of NFL games. He's not a thug, he's not constantly in trouble with the law, and he's not constantly being suspended for drugs. I'll take him any day.

In comment 13889517 Gmen88 said:

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In comment 13889357 Gmen86900711 said: Quote: In comment 13889317 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889264 bhill410 said: Quote: of fans. And yes it’s with out a doubt generational. People like LT, Jim Brown, or even a more recent example like Marvin Harrison were all genuine pieces of garbage humans but because they acted professional on the field people gave them a pass. Whereas OBJ is flamboyant and at times immature and the older generation views that as the most unforgivable sin of all despite the fact reports have him being a genuinely nice human. Ding Ding Ding! Way to stereotype this. You couldn't be more wrong. I'm a stand on 3rd down kind of guy and I'm 39. That doesn't mean I have to like Diva type players. I like the player OBJ is but I don't like his antics. Why would anyone approve of his request for QB type $ when Antonio Brown who is unquestionably the best WR in football is at $17 million per year. And by the way Brown just gave money back to the Steelers to help their cap situation. Accept 17-18 million a year and count your blessings. No sports athlete should be making this kind of $. Sad world we live in. So the fact that he wants to get paid as one of the best players in the league (which he is one) is a negative? This is clearly all negotiating through the media. Start high and meet somewhere reasonable.

He's not even the best player at his position. He's potentially top 10 player in the league which is always up for debate a year after injury. But WR's are not as important to a team as a QB. That is a fact. Star WR's are a nice to have. The one year the Patriots had a start WR they went 18-0 and then whoops!!! Lost the Super Bowl. How many Championships do the Pats have without star WR's? Under no circumstance is OBJ worth 20+ million a year. Should he be the highest paid WR at 17-18 million? Yes but no more. If he won't agree to that then don't let the door hit you on the way out!!!!

In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said:

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In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that.

I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings.

But, you did got me thinking.

You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it.

This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end?

I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better?

You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room"

He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet.

I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true).

In comment 13889720 dank41 said:

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In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true).

That Carolina game was more than just the penalties. He allowed Norman to get into his head. He dropped a perfectly thrown deep ball from Eli that would have changed the outcome of the game. He was non-existent in the 1st half because of the fighting. Only a big 4th quarter made his stat line look good. He really could have had a huge game changing performance but his antics got in the way. Had we won that Carolina game we would have been tied for 1st place and could have won the division. Instead we were 6-7 and he was suspended the next game that we lost. He cost us that season with his antics. People forget that. I don't. He can't control his emotions. You can't count on a guy like that.

He also cost me a Fantasy Football Championship because that suspension was during my Championship game and I lost by 2 points. Yes, I still a little salty about that as well.

In comment 13889720 dank41 said:

Quote:

In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true).

I never mentioned anything about race or color in my OP or anywhere there after.

In comment 13889720 dank41 said:

Quote:

In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true).

I absolutely feel he needs to mature, but this has been the case with many athletes thrown into the spotlight at such a young age. The Josh Norman situation didn't make anything better, but I don't think we come back in that game without that fuel to the fire.

Also, I absolutely think he has a right to hold out. He's being severely underpaid as one of the best players at his position, and is coming off an injury. Your career can be diminished at any moment in this sport and any good financial advisor would suggest the hold out.

Aaron Donald held out last year and there wasn't near as much public outcry because he isn't the polarizing figure Odell is.

In comment 13889782 BigBlueDownTheShore said:

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In comment 13889720 dank41 said: Quote: In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true). I never mentioned anything about race or color in my OP or anywhere there after.

Yeah I should of worded that part better, first part was directed at you and second part was just poking fun at a few comments I read in other threads. And when I say the first part, I mean the subject sounds to me like any negative feedback on OBJ is coming from left field.

I think it's very unfair to even mention race, but I just can't understand why he's hated so much. I feel like I'm in the minority loving this kid and he's the best WR in football! Without him Eli is putrid. If for some crazy reason this does come to fruition, I think this will be one of those moves we regret.

That being said, I don't think this will come to fruition unless OBJ gets realistic with his contract asks. I think this is just the Giants negotiating.

of it is pure BS.

1. He's not a winner, look at the ONE playoff game he played. Anyone suggesting this should never be taken seriously. It's so absurd that it's not even worth discussing.

2. The boat trip. BFD. Didn't miss practice, didn't miss any meetings. He went on a trip with his boys on an off day 6 days before the playoff game. It had absolutely no effect on the game. Why was it a big deal? The drama queens made it a big deal.

3. The holdout. That's how it works in the NFL. It's the one bargaining chip that the players have and its crap for people to complain about it. Players will get released in a second if they aren't producing. Here you have a kid who has had the best 3 years to start his career in the sport and he's made pennies. There is nothing wrong with him holding out, especially after the team made it clear last offseason that they will resign him sooner rather than later. Then he shows up and breaks his ankle.

4. Now some schlub is saying that he wasn't really that hurt. What a load of crap. It's getting ridiculous with the amount of crap this kid gets. Yet because people love Eli and he says all the right things, he gets 1000 excuses. Its gillbrides fault for all the INTs, then its MacAdoos fault. Its the WR's fault. Its the OL fault. Its the TE fault. Give me a freaking break.

In comment 13889824 dank41 said:

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In comment 13889782 BigBlueDownTheShore said: Quote: In comment 13889720 dank41 said: Quote: In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true). I never mentioned anything about race or color in my OP or anywhere there after. Yeah I should of worded that part better, first part was directed at you and second part was just poking fun at a few comments I read in other threads. And when I say the first part, I mean the subject sounds to me like any negative feedback on OBJ is coming from left field.

I understand there are reasons to hate him. I just don't think they would be as magnified if it wasn't for the one very public on the field incident (We haven't seen him act like that since, might I add).

In comment 13889797 Gmen88 said:

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In comment 13889720 dank41 said: Quote: In comment 13889587 Gmen88 said: Quote: In comment 13889573 dank41 said: Quote: ..the second Norman game is when it started to get embarassing and go downhill for me. If he becomes the highest paid player in the league, or even just highest paid WR, it will just make him a bigger target for defenders and I don't think I am comfortable with that. We won before OBJ and we can win after OBJ. I don't correlate OBJ with winning. Right now I lump him into the same category as Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, DeSean Jackson. OP subject insinuates that their are no valid reasons to have a dislike for him (unless your an old white guy lmao) See this is ridiculous. The 3 players mentioned all have detailed pasts of being locker room cancers. By all accounts, Odell is not that. I was more talking about the winning aspect of things, these attention seeking (on or off the field) WR rarely ever bring home trophies for the team. To me, that's the type of WR he is until he proves otherwise. You can even throw Randy Moss in that conversation. Show me the rings. But, you did got me thinking. You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it. This should of all been squashed after the first Norman incident. Here we are, few incidents later, possibly wants to be highest paid player and he's hanging on instagram with a blunt and cocaine. When does it end? I would feel differently if the Giants bounced back from his on field meltdowns, but tell me how it made anything better? You can be a cancer to your team but not neccesarily be a "cancer in the locker room" He might be a great guy to have around, but can he handle the pressure? Hasn't proven it yet. I'm not giving up on O'Dell, he just has to prove that he can mature. I don't think he has any right to hold out (if true). I absolutely feel he needs to mature, but this has been the case with many athletes thrown into the spotlight at such a young age. The Josh Norman situation didn't make anything better, but I don't think we come back in that game without that fuel to the fire. Also, I absolutely think he has a right to hold out. He's being severely underpaid as one of the best players at his position, and is coming off an injury. Your career can be diminished at any moment in this sport and any good financial advisor would suggest the hold out. Aaron Donald held out last year and there wasn't near as much public outcry because he isn't the polarizing figure Odell is.

Aaron Donald is the perfect example of someone who should of gotten paid. He is an animal on the field but also not raised many red flags.

Yeah, makes perfect sense to hold out on his end. But to what extent? If he doesn't get a new deal, he doesn't play?

I guess what it boils down to is I don't think that the Giants should make him the highest paid WR or player in the league based on what he has accomplished so far.

I imagine everyone here who follows the NBA hates him, because they're not Warriors fans.

But Green is often referred to as the heart and soul of the Warriors team. He has a clear leadership/mentoring role for a team that is generally considered to be one of the best in recent NBA history.

Absent that sort of intangible but considerable contribution to a winning team's culture, it makes it tougher to look past Beckham's seemingly me-first impulses.

In comment 13889720 dank41 said:

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You don't think his antics impacted the locker room at all? I know players are vouching for him and saying nothing is wrong with him, but I'll believe it when I see it.

That, and the fact that an "endorsement" from our locker room isn't terribly a ringing one these days.

because most critics are cynical assholes.

but I have this strange view that a person who wants to be the best paid wr in the league ought to be able to show the leadership skills/maturity associated with:

--Not acquiring personal foul penalties on really stupid TD celebrations;

--Controlling his temper after a marginal call;

--Supporting his teammates in any and all situations;

--Staying out of pictures that would appear to involve French models and drugs.

Personally, I am not looking to get rid of him. I am looking for him to respond to the loud and clear message from the Maras and others in management by showing some more maturity and some behaviors that are associated with leadership. Unfortunately, I am not particularly confident that this will happen.

In comment 13889982 ShocknAwe80 said:

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because most critics are cynical assholes.

People hate Styx because Sail Away is objectively a bottom 10 song of all time.