All you "Draft QB at #2" guys put it in writing. You are all writing Eli off for dead - or, at most, giving him a one year pity fuck.
I say Eli has 3 years of productive football left in him. I say our future franchise QB will still be playing college football next year, if not already on the roster. I say we draft Saquon Barkley to give Eli some F'n help and extend his career.
Put it down in writing, right now, if you have the guts. Giants34 (Greg) already has from another thread.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
protection to function at a high level, and that won't be available next year. Time for a fresh, new young QB to take over for Eli. Someone who's not afraid to hang in the pocket when the heat is on or take off and scramble for a first down when need be.
Eli was great. Time to move on.
Ps if Acorsi says the Giants have at least two more good years out of Eli, then depend upon it... they are going QB at #2.
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In comment 13921273 Britt in VA said:
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
I think it matters if for no other reason than it is one of the few ways that everyone can stay grounded regarding what Eli is as a player at this point. Certainly if there were reports swirling all winter that other teams were very interested in Eli (as there clearly were for Beckham), those who are adamant about not "quitting" on Eli would be using that as support for their position that Eli still has good years left. So why is the apparent absence of interest any less valid support for those who believe he's probably done?
Also, when you talk about his "value to the Giants," unless you are referring to some unique offensive scheme they run particularly suited to Eli's skills, which I do not believe to be the case, then I can only assume you are referring to some sort of sentimental value. I think that should not matter at all, especially when it comes to what the Giants decide to do with the second pick.
One more ring!
Eli Manning is finished as a starting NFL QB. He has been deteriorating for two, maybe three years. Of course, the cast of characters throws a spotlight on and highlights his preexisting weaknesses - immobile, below average avoiding the sack, happy feet, misses high a lot.
Don't get me wrong. I go back to 1956, to Charley Conerly, to Y.A. Tittle. Eli was good, just sub-elite. The two championships were great.
But it's over and it has been over for a while.
If Webb is not starting by week six-eight I will be very surprised. And if I'm wrong you can come back and rag on me right here.
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In comment 13921273 Britt in VA said:
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
Of course it matters, value is what you are willing to pay for something. Of course Eli has value to the Giants, but it is increasingly sentimental.
I'll ask you this question again, if the Giants go 7-9 or 8-8 next year and the year after, featuring another Eli medicore season, are you going to consider that a comeback and use that as evidentiary support that Eli rebounded? What should my expectation be, I am willing to adjustment my realm of thinking? What I'm hearing from the Eli has years left crowd is that I should expect him to lead us to a super bowl over the next two seasons. In order to accomplish that, Eli is going to need to play at a super bowl level for an entire season. He simply cannot be a bystander on a ride to the SB. So should that be my expectation? I have very little interest in personal success, but it's hard not to tie Eli's success to that of the team.
So is 7-9 or 8-8 or even 9-7 good enough for you? Because now we've taken ourselves out of the running for a blue chip qb prospect, in what will be weak qb drafts anyway, and passed on a blue chip prospect in 2018 because Eli has years left.
"I am Eli Manning"
"I am Eli Manning"
Will the REAL Eli Manning please stand up?
That is the question.....
Because of the injuries, the OL, and the system Eli played under these last two seasons, I have no idea of how good or how bad he actually is....
Anyone just looking at stats, is just crazy......Eli is getting older.....he will never be the Eli of 2011 ever again....I have seen him go down because he senses something that isn't there......The pounding he has taken over these last 7 seasons, because we failed to put an OL in front of him, has taken it's toll.....I don't see this OL being fixed in one season.....can it be better? How can it not be? But will it be enough, to give Eli the confidence to hang in there to complete a throw.....no one has a crystal ball that can predict that......
I would like to think, if this line can protect him better, if it can start to convert 3rd and short runs, if it can finally learn to run a screen play, if OBj can still be the pre injury OBj, if SS and EE can take that next step, and if we can find a RB that can be a starter and carry the load, and another WR to compliment the rest of the offense, then there are no more excuses for Eli......he either performs like we hope he can, or else the spiral will continue.....
I want him to have another shot with a decent offense.....if he doesn't pan out, so be it......but we also have to have a backup plan in case this doesn't go as expected....at #2, you take a QB, if you think he is the guy of the future......if he isn't you don't......there are multiple ways this can go, but just about every scenario has been already posted......the day of the draft can't come soon enough....
I don’t get the debate. Seems everyone I talk to and debate the pick inevitably goes back to Eli and what he has left. Eli shouldnt be a factor. Period. He’s 37 and coming off an unproductive season. Yes we can win with him. But he’s 37. 37!!!!
Scout the qb. Vet the qb. If you love the qb you take the qb. Period.
Eli may not be THE PROBLEM the last two years but he sure as hell wasnt the solution either.
Don’t be stupid or loyal here. Think damnit.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
And since this years draftable QBs suck, let’s help him out!!
With a new system, 4-5 new starters on the line or in different positions, a new no. 2 WR, coming off a year where he struggled to hold onto the ball, struggled with accuracy on short throws, struggled with zip on throws outside of the hashes, Manning playing championship-type football would be a miracle.
And after the cryfest last year from the player and the fans when he was asked to put the future well being of the organization ahead of his pride, I seriously doubt it will go well if the tides turn and he's asked to what was done for him in 2004.
And that time is now over. Eli is not going to provide us sufficient quality QB play or be a consistent winner for this team much longer, it at all.
The Giants need to draft a QB with the #2 pick and then they need to give him a real chance to win the job as soon as possible, whether Eli is still around or not.
Otherwise, the Giants are quitting on us...
So I am not giving up!! Never!!
Here is where Eli is - he's got even less mobility than ever, has happier feet than ever, still makes panicked decisions when the pocket collapses, and has never had a howitzer. Other than that, he's terrific.
Will he pull a game or two out of his arse now and again? Absolutely. And that will be the fuel the Eli is God Club needs to keep hope alive.
I have been all in for blowing the team up and trusting the process. Instead, we are postponing the inevitable with the hope that Eli will make another deal with the football devil and we make some inexplicable run through the playoffs. I really can't think of a dumber plan...
You realize you’re blasting the team for something they haven’t done yet.
Rosen will start less than 50 games in his career.
As it's always been
Not really. Most on this board place enough caveats on their posts that they never portray a true conviction one way or another.
The true minority position is either scolded or disregarded...
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
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In comment 13921157 WillVAB said:
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
To be fair, he was 33 when he was on the Giants and retired at 38. Eli is 37 now. So it isn't apples to apples. Although perhaps Eli's lack of injuries would allow him to go on longer.
I love Eli to fucking death, I grew up watching him play from 14 to 29.
But father time catches everyone. This is what's best for the franchise, and I'll always root for Eli regardless. He has nothing left to prove to me.
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I have no idea what he has left, playing behind our horrible OL leaves me in a position where I can't even speculate.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
Well you did think RG3 was going to be a stud and that he was built well to take the NFL pounding and you were wrong then. NO reason to think you suddenly reverse course and start getting anything right.
Huh?
I have never posted anything about RGIII.
But since you ask, no I am not a big fan of running QBs. QBs that can move and extend plays, sure, not running QBs.
You seem to think I am somebody... I'm not sure who...
I told you I have not posted for a number of years. Before that I was never the prolific poster that many of you are.
There is one thread that some long time BBIers might remember me from. And this should come as no shock as to the topic. People were posting how upset they were about Financial Crisis/Bailout. I spent time on the thread explaining why it was necessary and why "Too Big To Fail" mattered. I went on to explain the mechanism by which we got in trouble, and how it caused the money systems to freeze up. Why the Gov't had to step in. I also said on that thread that the US Gov't would make a ton of money out of the deal. Its too bad the archives don't go back that far.
Middle school? I thought this was pre-k.
Some teams take decades to find a quality starting QB. I believe the NYG are in a unique place in the draft to take a QB in which teams would give up 4-5 premium picks to be in.
I snag the QB and "quit" on Eli a year or two early than a year too late which may have us scrambling for years and years to find his replacement.
Do I think he can play after this season? probably. But as much as he is my favorite athlete I have ever rooted for, I believe the name on the front of the Jersey is more important than the name on the back of the Jersey and having a succession plan for the QB position is more important than just about anything at this point, IMO.
That might not be worth as much as you think.
What about dull knives?
Lol yeah look at the 4/20 thread
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In comment 13921157 WillVAB said:
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
Maybe instead of trying to make fun of "stat dorks" you could benefit from actual information. Kurt Warner did nothing from 2005 to 2007. Unless you want to tell me he passed your "eye test" with 17 touchdowns and 14 INT in 15 starts.