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The Clue of Pat Mahomes to this years draft

twostepgiants : 4/21/2018 6:16 pm
I think its always important to look big picture rather than the current hubbub by the media over the pick.

When we look big picture at the Giant organizations intentions rather than the current maneuverings of the GM and remember the condition in which he was hired under.

Lets look back to last year and we find that the Giants actually tried trading UP in the draft for QB Pat Mahomes.

ESPN's Anita Marks reported Friday that the Giants tried to trade up for Mahomes, but ultimately failed in that endeavor. Now, the Giants are "very upset."

What we found is that the Giants were in a trade competition for Mahomes and lost

“Last year with Patrick (Mahomes), there were four or five teams that desperately wanted him, so it just set up a trade scenario. It was just a function of how high would Kansas City go above Arizona and the New York Giants and different teams who were interested to get him. So Nic’s job is to impress an individual team in this process.”

This should be an important lesson for the Giants as well. Its not so easy to just get a QB any year and especially if you need to move up and get.

So, what did the media know beforehand as the Giants obviously were heavily interested in Mahomes to attemp a trade up.

I linked an article by Paul Schwartz of the New York Post as he has been a name heavily involved in this years media narrative of Giants draft plans.

Schwartz did not cite a source in the article but was tipped off by the fact that McAdoo attended Mahomes Pro Day, had a private meeting with him and interviewed him at Combine. This was only QB we did that with.

This should tell us that interest level at these events is more than “due diligence” and does mean something.

In addition. Schwartz misread the signal and downplayed the Giants interest as only being if Mahomes fell all the way to Giants pick at 23, if which there was no chance with 4-5 teams attempting a trade up.

“Though it does not necessarily mean the Giants are hot after Mahomes or they are intent on taking a quarterback early in this year’s draft, they could select a quarterback in the first few rounds, if things fall a certain way.”

Mara said of the draft ‘I Was hoping we would draft a QB at some point” and referred to a Parcells quote about Webb “lets not get his bust ready for Canton yet” and having to see him play on the field until you know what you have.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-york-giants/0ap3000000807371/Mara-I-was-hoping-Giants-would-draft-a-QB-at-some-point

So if we frame this failed attempt to get a QB as a picture we also see that the Giants ownership did this is in November as Mara directed his staff to look at the QBs in this Draft.

“There was a directive given several weeks back by co-owner John Mara to start looking closely at the top college quarterbacks, multiple sources told ESPN.”

http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-giants/post/_/id/54741/sources-giants-looking-closely-at-sam-darnold-top-qb-prospects

Mara as we know is the one who initiated what became the Eli benching.


Mara said a few weeks ago he mentioned to Jerry Reese the team should be thinking about getting a look at QBs Geno Smith and Davis Webb. Mara hoped Eli would agree to start the games and then come out.
4:49 PM - Nov 29, 2017

This should also be looked at in recognition of the fact that HC Ben McAdoo actually thought Geno Smith could replace Eli Manning. As cracy as it sounds he did. No one took him seriously when he said it.

McAdoo also said “I don’t see why not’’ when asked if newly acquired Jets castoff Geno Smith could be the heir apparent to Manning, and proceeded to laud Smith’s physical skill set. First, Smith has to make the roster.

So obviously when Mara gave that directive about Geno he knew that that his HC actually did think he was a potential replacement.

https://nypost.com/2017/03/28/mcadoo-with-jaw-dropper-geno-smith-can-be-giants-future/

Lastly, we see this quote from Mara on “wholesale changes”.

"When was the last time we changed a general manager and a head coach in the same year? It was 1979, and there might be another change or two or three happening in the future. For me, that's pretty wholesale."

1979 is a big hint. The Giants drafted Phil Simms in the 1st round. He is saying GM/HC/QB equal “wholesale changes”. He was hinting more coming which is QB.

The picture is clear. The Giants pursued a replacement to Eli Manning in last years draft. To the point they attempted to trade UP and lost a 4 way competition for him. They benched him at mid-year at Mara’s initiation. Mara directed his staff to look at this years draft for a QB replacement. Mara promised wholesale changes and hinted QB is part of that mix and coming.

This is all coming from ownership. John Mara. This is the condition of which Dave Gettleman is hired.

In the video clip I posted of last years draft Mara was very clear. He is in room for every pick and has “final approval” over every draft pick. I know people are going to say Gettleman may do things differently or its his ideas now but he was hired by Mara. Mara obviously hired him under a certain direction. That direction is clear as day for anyone to see when looking at the timeline of the past year.

The Giants are drafting QB at the 2 pick.




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RE: I do accept Mara wasnt trying to get Mahomes  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 11:22 am : link
In comment 13924944 twostepgiants said:
Quote:
That does undermine my premise

Thsnks Hitdog for weighing in


There was enough chatter to figure there had to be a few voices within the organization that wanted him.

At the forefront was likely MacAdoo who almost never gave Eli praise publicly and when he did it looked like removing teeth to do so.
Why Clues  
Bavaro_the_Mafioso : 4/22/2018 11:41 am : link
I find all the subject and background very interesting but why do we need clues that the organization (last year and this year) did and can go QB to draft the heir apparent to the 37 year old Manning?

It's the right and prudent thing to do. Does anyone disagree?
RE: RE: RE: You guys can believe what you want  
clatterbuck : 4/22/2018 1:58 pm : link
In comment 13924582 TrueBlue56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13924515 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 13924300 twostepgiants said:


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Theres one name involved every step of way

John Mara

It wasnt McAdoo directing the staff to scout QBs in Nov and ir wasnt McAdoo talking about wholesale changes when introducing the GM

Mara wants a QB



This is the most telling thing about this draft and who we will probably pick. I think Mara sees a lot of Eli's demeanor in Darnold. I think he also sees some of the toughness of Eli in Darnold based on his days as a HS LB.


At the end of the day, the Giants are Mara's team and he is entitled to dictate in which direction the Giants go....especially when looking towards the next decade. Darnold seems like a Giants pick and I think he would do great working behind Eli for a year especially given his age



Ahhh Mara is dictating the draft now. Please tell me the last time Wellington or John have dictated any draft since George young was brought in, Is there collaboration and discussion? Sure there is, but dictating? Come on already. Does gettleman look like someone who just follows marching orders? If John wanted to play GM then he wouldn't have brought in Gettleman, he would have brought in a lackey. John Mara is not a scout and he has admitted such.

So, let's just say totally hypothetically John does like Darnold, but shurmur and gettleman don't for whatever reason. John is going to say I don't care what you think or say we are drafting him if he is there.

Some of the comments on here.....smh

And listen, I think the giants as an organization like Darnold and will probably draft him if he is there, but it won't be because John Mara is dictating anything. John Mara is not Jerry Jones


C'mon, everyone knows it'a not John Mara but the one-man deep state of the Giants organization, Chris Mara, who pulls all the strings, makes all the decisions.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: My belief  
Rjanyg : 4/22/2018 2:06 pm : link
In comment 13924521 Saos1n said:
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In comment 13924508 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


In comment 13924490 Saos1n said:


Quote:


In comment 13924469 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


In comment 13924440 Saos1n said:


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If Darnold is available, he’s the guy.... everyone thinks this.... everyone is right...

If Browns go Darnold at 1, Giants talk trades with Browns... if they don’t give up enough, Giants take Barkley

Jets take Mayfield...

Browns on the clock... DG calls Dorsey...

Now that he has Barkley, time to work out a deal...

Draft Rosen, give us #33, #35 and a 2nd next year...

QB of the future and first 3 picks of the 2nd round...

Plenty of ammo to trade back up for targets or stick around and take advantage of OL depth... rebuild OLine in 1 offseason and acquire your next QB

Don’t @ me



Interesting thoughts here. So, you say NYG drafts Barkley and trades him to Cleveland? I would be really shocked by this.



Yes... we will see... think about it... you get your next QB ANd fix this teams worst problem in 2 days.... potentially... OLine helps this team now and sets us up for the future.. plenty of picks to navigate the rest of the draft and target players you love... like one of the many good RB prospects in the draft...



I have been saying Cleveland should want to straight up trade for our pick: 4,33,35 a 4th rounder and next years 2nd rounder.

If Rosen is there then take him. I don't want Mayfield.

Thursday can't come quick enough



Would you be in favor of what I posted?

With a trade up, we could start
Josh Rosen
Tyrell Crosby
Will Hernandez

Or
Josh Rosen
Isaiah Wynn
Braden Smith


I could live with that
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: My belief  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 4:45 pm : link
In comment 13924521 Saos1n said:
Quote:
In comment 13924508 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


In comment 13924490 Saos1n said:


Quote:


In comment 13924469 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


In comment 13924440 Saos1n said:


Quote:


If Darnold is available, he’s the guy.... everyone thinks this.... everyone is right...

If Browns go Darnold at 1, Giants talk trades with Browns... if they don’t give up enough, Giants take Barkley

Jets take Mayfield...

Browns on the clock... DG calls Dorsey...

Now that he has Barkley, time to work out a deal...

Draft Rosen, give us #33, #35 and a 2nd next year...

QB of the future and first 3 picks of the 2nd round...

Plenty of ammo to trade back up for targets or stick around and take advantage of OL depth... rebuild OLine in 1 offseason and acquire your next QB

Don’t @ me



Interesting thoughts here. So, you say NYG drafts Barkley and trades him to Cleveland? I would be really shocked by this.



Yes... we will see... think about it... you get your next QB ANd fix this teams worst problem in 2 days.... potentially... OLine helps this team now and sets us up for the future.. plenty of picks to navigate the rest of the draft and target players you love... like one of the many good RB prospects in the draft...



I have been saying Cleveland should want to straight up trade for our pick: 4,33,35 a 4th rounder and next years 2nd rounder.

If Rosen is there then take him. I don't want Mayfield.

Thursday can't come quick enough



Would you be in favor of what I posted?

With a trade up, we could start
Josh Rosen
Tyrell Crosby
Will Hernandez

Or
Josh Rosen
Isaiah Wynn
Braden Smith


That is one VERY interesting scenario I hadn't thought of. May not be a high probability one but certainly in the realm of possibilities.

This nets us Rosen AND extra picks. I likee it.
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