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What is your draft strategy for improving the Giants?

wgenesis123 : 4/22/2018 6:47 am
It doesn't have to be complex but please no BPA. Any knucklehead can go BPA and end up with 5 or 6 new running backs for the Giants. My preference for round one is trading down and getting Nelson or Chubb. If Cleveland takes Chubb with one of their picks, make it Barkley or Nelson. So if your taking a QB or Barkley at 2, what else are you doing with the remaining picks to improve the team? Your pick at 2 can limit the Giants this year and next year in improving the team. For example Barkley at 2, how are you going to solve the QB problem? You have limited picks and no ammo to go get a QB next year. Do you think Barkley makes Eli and Webb better for the next 2 to 4 years to solve that issue? If you go QB you also have very limited picks to improve the team but you have maybe solved the number one issue for the Giants. How will you build around your young QB this year and next? If you have thought these things out, I am interested in what you think. Please post it.
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All Things Being Unequal...  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/22/2018 8:10 am : link
1. Rosen
2. Daniels/Price/Wynn -- one of those three OL should be there
3. Braden Smith OG/OT
3. Darius Leonard LB
4. Royce Freeman RB
5. Tre'Quan Smith WR
If you love a qb, stay put and grab him  
dd in Mass : 4/22/2018 8:14 am : link
However if Cleveland picks him your basically left with 2 choices. Take Barkley or trade down.

I would trade down with Chubb as my target and Barkley as my fall back. So I don't think you can go lower than #5.

Compile as many picks as you can with at least a first or second rounder in the 2019 draft.

The 2nd and 3rd rounds should focus on OL, CB, and a RB. That's assuming we land Chubb with the 5th pick. If it's Barkley, then go DL along with OL and a CB.

That should set us up pretty well. I would also consider trading one of our 3rd, plus our 4th and 5th picks to move up into the top 50.
I agree with the OP except  
Jay in Toronto : 4/22/2018 8:18 am : link
name one position where we can't use a BPA???

I would favour getting Cleveland's top third round picks, which will likely leave guys with a first round grade.

Where there is a real tie on grade I would prioritize OL, DB (esp free safety and nickel corner) and later on RB.
My ideal scenario on a trade down  
gggggggmen : 4/22/2018 8:20 am : link
I would just take a haul from the Bills then put that draft capital to work during the draft. The Bills would have to pay a premium of something like -

12 22 53 56 65 2019 1st

Not saying I would do it, but for the ambitious - With that haul, plus our original picks and the willingness of the Colts and Broncos, we could in theory move up twice for 2 blue chippers -

Colts get 22, 34, 69 for 6
Broncos get 12, 53, 104, 130 for 5

That would leave us with 5,6,56,65 allowing us to get 2 of Chubb/Nelson/Barkley
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/22/2018 8:22 am : link
I think the pick is Darnold, provided he's there.

If he's gone, I'd be thrilled with Barkley.
If staying at 2  
mai71 : 4/22/2018 8:22 am : link
love the QB and RB or any position player with the same or very close grade you take the QB. Round two to five, same strategy , same grade take the guy that best fills the need of the team. Stay true to your board.

If the team wants multiple players and believes in good quantity over a gold coat potential player trade out or down from pick 2.
Pick one of the LA QBís and go from there  
The_Boss : 4/22/2018 8:24 am : link
Eliís time here is almost up.
RE: My ideal scenario on a trade down  
Jay in Toronto : 4/22/2018 8:24 am : link
In comment 13924744 gggggggmen said:
Quote:
I would just take a haul from the Bills then put that draft capital to work during the draft. The Bills would have to pay a premium of something like -

12 22 53 56 65 2019 1st

Not saying I would do it, but for the ambitious - With that haul, plus our original picks and the willingness of the Colts and Broncos, we could in theory move up twice for 2 blue chippers -

Colts get 22, 34, 69 for 6
Broncos get 12, 53, 104, 130 for 5

That would leave us with 5,6,56,65 allowing us to get 2 of Chubb/Nelson/Barkley


I would go for more future picks for signability room this year and quality.
Fantastic Question  
Giants34 : 4/22/2018 8:26 am : link
At 2, I am picking Rosen. If he is not there I am picking Darnold.

In Round Two, I am picking Will Hernandez if he falls. If not, give me Billy Price.

In Round Three, give me a RB (Penny preferably, Chubb, etc.) with the first pick, and then CB with the 2nd pick.

After the first two days of the draft and FA, we will then have added a new QB, RB, three new pieces along the OL, two new LBs (Ogletree and Martin), and a new CB). Why would we not be able to try to win now, while also having secured our QB for the future? And that is what I don't get. We can get a QB in Round 1 and still be considered to be giving Eli a chance to win now.
RE: RE: Good answers so far but my favorite is  
Jay in Toronto : 4/22/2018 8:26 am : link
In comment 13924716 thomasa510 said:
Quote:
In comment 13924713 wgenesis123 said:



Without any snacks this is a really unbalanced strategy.


What would your BSA be???



Mine always would have tyo have chocolate (probably helps that I skip the beer).
......  
CoughlinHandsonHips : 4/22/2018 8:33 am : link
Outside of Tight End, I don't think the Giants are set anywhere, so BPA
RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 4/22/2018 8:58 am : link
In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
Is a false premise.


We had a SB winning OC, DC, coaching, and QB problem the last 5 years obviously.
My strategy  
joeinpa : 4/22/2018 9:04 am : link
Trust Gettleman

But I want it to be a quarterback he trusts:)
RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Jim in Tampa : 4/22/2018 9:10 am : link
In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
Is a false premise.


Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.
RE: ...  
Sean : 4/22/2018 9:11 am : link
In comment 13924746 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
I think the pick is Darnold, provided he's there.

If he's gone, I'd be thrilled with Barkley.


I think this is it. No need to overthink it.
Ideally we trade with Buffalo  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 4/22/2018 9:11 am : link
Get a ass load of picks and Vea or maybe even Fitz falls.

But that's getting too cute, just run to the podium and pick Barkley already ffs.
RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
RobCarpenter : 4/22/2018 9:19 am : link
In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.


The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.
RE: RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Jim in Tampa : 4/22/2018 9:32 am : link
In comment 13924795 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.



The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.


You can make excuses for Eli all you want, but again, even if you're blind to his poor play for two years (not just last year) Eli is 37 and doesn't have much time left anyway.

And why is taking a QB at the top of the draft "forcing a pick"?

If the Giants made the trade with Buffalo then it's a virtual guarantee that QBs would go 1-2-3 in the draft.

Would all those teams be forcing a pick or would it be much more logical to assume that the QBs in this draft are considered worthy of being "top-of-the-draft" choices?
RE: RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 9:32 am : link
In comment 13924795 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.



The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.


Eli wasnt the problem. Mac, the system and horrible OL play were.

With that said, Eli is 37. He has been a model of health but QBs generally start to slow down in their very late 30's. He likely has a couple more years left at championship level football (with right system /talent around him) as Accorsi said.

This makes QB still a potential smart move considering we are picking so high (rare occurance to be top 5) and there are quality to elite QBs this draft.

I can only see the other side of the coin with a rare player of Barkleys talent if they believe they can compete for a championship of they bypass QB with Elis 2-3 window. Perhaps they believe this.

They may also hedge their bet with a Lauletta type since this draft is super deep with toolsy QBs
I don't know what Eli has left but I am convinced he has more than  
wgenesis123 : 4/22/2018 9:33 am : link
what we have seen the last two years. I also refuse to ignore his age of 37, no matter what he has left he could decide to retire after this year or next and the Giants need to be prepared for that scenario. I do however believe DG has one year he can wait, assess Webb, if he is prepared to trade up next year. That means at some point in this draft trading down and taking picks for next year. I honestly hope we get our guy this year whether its Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, or Webb. I just don't believe in any of them right now.
Several days away from the Draft and several on BBI  
Jimmy Googs : 4/22/2018 9:35 am : link
are talking "championship" for Giants in 2018.

delusional...

RE: RE: RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 9:36 am : link
In comment 13924799 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 13924795 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.



The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.



You can make excuses for Eli all you want, but again, even if you're blind to his poor play for two years (not just last year) Eli is 37 and doesn't have much time left anyway.

And why is taking a QB at the top of the draft "forcing a pick"?

If the Giants made the trade with Buffalo then it's a virtual guarantee that QBs would go 1-2-3 in the draft.

Would all those teams be forcing a pick or would it be much more logical to assume that the QBs in this draft are considered worthy of being "top-of-the-draft" choices?


To your point regardless of whether Eli still has it or not even if he does it wont by for too much longer. I beleive he has a solid 2-3 year window though.

If a guy has a franchise QB grade on the board he should be the pick. But if only one does and he goes 1st to the Browns it becomes either a smart move to go elsewhere or the Giants missed the boat grading some of these other QB prospects.
O-line, O-line, O-line...  
M.S. : 4/22/2018 9:41 am : link


...we've got a jittery old QB that needs his pocket to calm down.

Seriously calm down.

It's time to find out if Eli has anything left in the gas tank.

We need to draft O-line early and often.

It will help Eli, help the run game and keep our defense on the sideline enjoying the view.


RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Jim in Tampa : 4/22/2018 9:50 am : link
In comment 13924806 Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx said:
Quote:
In comment 13924799 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924795 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.



The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.



You can make excuses for Eli all you want, but again, even if you're blind to his poor play for two years (not just last year) Eli is 37 and doesn't have much time left anyway.

And why is taking a QB at the top of the draft "forcing a pick"?

If the Giants made the trade with Buffalo then it's a virtual guarantee that QBs would go 1-2-3 in the draft.

Would all those teams be forcing a pick or would it be much more logical to assume that the QBs in this draft are considered worthy of being "top-of-the-draft" choices?



To your point regardless of whether Eli still has it or not even if he does it wont by for too much longer. I beleive he has a solid 2-3 year window though.


What have you seen in Eli's play over the last few years that makes you think he has "a solid 2-3 year window" (which I assume you mean of good play)?

He hasn't played well for years. He's 37. 37 yr old QBs don't have bounce-back seasons after a couple of years of crappy play. They just don't.

Draft gurus like Colin and Sy have noted that Eli has been playing poorly for years, as have numerous other knowledgeable football posters on this site. And yet so many BBIers think, like you do, that Eli can somehow bounce back and be good again. The odds are pretty high that it's not going to happen.
Taking a QB when a better player is on the board  
RobCarpenter : 4/22/2018 9:53 am : link
Is what I mean by forcing a pick.

Darnold is the only QB who should be picked at #2. Just because the Bills and Jets are desperate to take a QB doesnít mean the Giants should be.

Personally I think the Browns take Darnold and the Giants take Barkley. If the Browns are stupid enough to take Allen at #1 then Darnold will probably be the pick. Though I can see the Giants still taking Barkley in that scenario.
So... I've given this a lot of thought  
Tim in Eternal Blue : 4/22/2018 9:56 am : link
There are so many ways for this to go. I'm in the pro-Eli camp but I'm also in the realistic camp. Next year's QB crop is trash. That coupled with the very evident decline of Eli and his age makes me think we have to go QB here.

Each QB has their question marks.

I can see why certain people like different candidates. I personally love Mayfield. He's a winner. He's good and he's a natural leader. I think sitting behind Eli for a year or so will help his maturity.

2-3-4. RB, OL and CB in no particular order. Love the idea of adding a Sony Michel.
The best strategy is to draft a QB  
giantstock : 4/22/2018 10:08 am : link
If you think the QB is good. I do.

SO

rd 1 take Rosen or Mayfield.

Rd 2 take on OL -- he should be good enough to start.

Rd 3a take a DL. -- he should be good enough to start.I think between Settle, Mcintosh, or BJ Hill they can start and one would probably be available to draft.

Rd 3b take a CB -- he might be good enough to supplant Apple. Or at least be a solid nickle.

Rd 4 either OL or RB -




RE: All Things Being Unequal...  
giantstock : 4/22/2018 10:11 am : link
In comment 13924736 Nomad Crow on the Madison said:
Quote:
1. Rosen
2. Daniels/Price/Wynn -- one of those three OL should be there
3. Braden Smith OG/OT
3. Darius Leonard LB
4. Royce Freeman RB
5. Tre'Quan Smith WR


I'd be shocked if SMith is available in RD 3.
Strategy?  
oldog : 4/22/2018 10:15 am : link
Simple, just deal with reality. Let the Browns decide, if they take anybody but Barkley or Darnold, just take the QB. Time to let Eli have his victory lap after his hall of fame career, and then move on. If Browns take Darnold, then bide our time and take Barkley, and let Webb or some other lower QB pick try to develop behind Eli.
To Trade or Not To Trade  
the mike : 4/22/2018 10:41 am : link
I am sure that Gettleman will have several trade options but I think it is unlikely the "king's ransom" fantasy will materialize. But I am sure that Gettleman is well prepared for all possibilities because they will happen when we are on the clock and decision making speed will be paramount.

If there are no trades, then take Barkley and BPA where primary needs by round should be OL, OL, DB, WR, LB...

For straight up trades, if we trade our second pick with Cleveland, it must get us at least #4, #33 and #35. Assuming they take Barkley, we take Chubb, Hernandez/Wynn/Ragnow and Michel. If we trade with Denver, it must get us #5, #40, #71 and a 2019 second round pick. Assuming Barkley and Chubb taken, we take Nelson, Michel, Wynn/Ragnow/Price with first three pics. And if we trade with Buffalo, it must be #12, #22, #53 and 2019 first round pick. This would then be something like Vea, McGlinchey, Michel, Ragnow/Price in our first four pics.

The three way CLE-BUF trade nets us #4, #22 and possibly #64. This would be Chubb, McGlinchey, Michel, Ragnow/Price in our first four pics.

Best of all worlds is a process of sequential trades with four teams. Assuming Browns open with Darnold, we then trade first with Cleveland when we are on the clock sending our second pick for #4, #33 and #35. Then after Barkley and Mayfield are taken, Denver wants to move up to get Rosen and we trade #4 for #5 and #40. When we are on the clock, Buffalo wants to get Allen so for the #5, they trade us #12, #22 and #53. Indianapolis is then on the clock and we trade up to #6 by sending #12, #35 and #53. That leaves us with: #6, #22, #33 and #40 for the second pick. So we then take with our first five picks Chubb, McGlinchey, Michel, Wynn/Ragnow, Landry.

Thursday can't get here soon enough!
One mo' time...  
M.S. : 4/22/2018 10:43 am : link


...we've got to cluster draft offensive lineman.

Must come out of this draft with one immediate starter at either RG or RT and one high quality back-up who can step-in when called upon in Year One.

If we fail at this, no high quality running back, cornerback or anyone else will turn this big ugly ship around.

RE: Taking a QB when a better player is on the board  
Jimmy Googs : 4/22/2018 10:46 am : link
In comment 13924832 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
Is what I mean by forcing a pick.



So where does your team ever find a QB?
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 10:47 am : link
In comment 13924828 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 13924806 Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx said:


Quote:


In comment 13924799 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924795 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


In comment 13924783 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



Thinking that the Giants do NOT have a QB problem is actually the false premise.

Even if you're too blind to see that Eli has played poorly the last couple of years...Eli is 37. I'm guessing that the list of 37 yr old QBs that have had bounce-back seasons after two crappy ones is a very short list...and it's entirely possible that no QB has ever had a career revival at 37. So yes, the Giants have a QB problem.

And since the QBs in next year's draft are not projected to be as strong as this year's class...combined with the likelihood that the Giants won't be picking near the top of the draft again...My draft strategy is trust the feedback you get from Shumur/Shula and pick the best QB at 2.

Then choose the best value in the remaining rounds, regardless of position.



The last two years the HC was a joke and the OL was horrible. And the new coach got to the NFC championship with Case Keenum. No, Eli canít win all by himself like he did in 2011. But yes, he can be very effective if the running game is decent. Shurmur knows this fact.

Forcing picks is a horrible strategy.



You can make excuses for Eli all you want, but again, even if you're blind to his poor play for two years (not just last year) Eli is 37 and doesn't have much time left anyway.

And why is taking a QB at the top of the draft "forcing a pick"?

If the Giants made the trade with Buffalo then it's a virtual guarantee that QBs would go 1-2-3 in the draft.

Would all those teams be forcing a pick or would it be much more logical to assume that the QBs in this draft are considered worthy of being "top-of-the-draft" choices?



To your point regardless of whether Eli still has it or not even if he does it wont by for too much longer. I beleive he has a solid 2-3 year window though.



What have you seen in Eli's play over the last few years that makes you think he has "a solid 2-3 year window" (which I assume you mean of good play)?

He hasn't played well for years. He's 37. 37 yr old QBs don't have bounce-back seasons after a couple of years of crappy play. They just don't.

Draft gurus like Colin and Sy have noted that Eli has been playing poorly for years, as have numerous other knowledgeable football posters on this site. And yet so many BBIers think, like you do, that Eli can somehow bounce back and be good again. The odds are pretty high that it's not going to happen.


Jim Mac wasnt just a bad coach he was historically bad. You know Handley level bad. This was a team coming in with actual Super Bowl aspirations. And we finished 3-13. Eli showed plenty of flashes after Mac was gone. He has plenty of life in his arm left but needs the proper system and OL to be successful.

Shurmur by all indications should deliver that. And the OL with at least 1 plug and play starter from the draft and a sound scheme should be markedly improved.
RE: RE: Thinking that we Ďhave a QB problemí  
Rjanyg : 4/22/2018 10:48 am : link
In comment 13924778 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
In comment 13924687 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is a false premise.



We had a SB winning OC, DC, coaching, and QB problem the last 5 years obviously.


This is wrong. I wonder if people watch the games anymore.
Football, more than any major sport is one thing  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 4/22/2018 10:51 am : link
It's a game of economy.

I would conjecture, with past injury history and taking big hits, Eli likely has the most left in the tank of the old qbs.

Ergo, concordantly, vis-a-vis you don't take a flier on a qb who doesn't WOW you. You give your qb the generationally transformational weapon to form an unstoppable combined arms style attack with your other generationally transformational wr like the army of Alexander the Great.
RE: Football, more than any major sport is one thing  
the mike : 4/22/2018 10:55 am : link
In comment 13924924 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
It's a game of economy.

I would conjecture, with past injury history and taking big hits, Eli likely has the most left in the tank of the old qbs.

Ergo, concordantly, vis-a-vis you don't take a flier on a qb who doesn't WOW you. You give your qb the generationally transformational weapon to form an unstoppable combined arms style attack with your other generationally transformational wr like the army of Alexander the Great.


Herodotus could not have said it better himself!
RE: Donít reach for position at any draft spot  
sharpshooter66 : 4/22/2018 10:56 am : link
In comment 13924685 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
The only QB worth taking at #2 is Darnold. Donít panic about drafting Eliís successor.

Fortify the OL in the draft. There should be good value to be had at OL.

Donít trade down unless you are getting at least a first round pick in 2019.


This
RE: RE: Taking a QB when a better player is on the board  
RobCarpenter : 4/22/2018 11:23 am : link
In comment 13924916 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 13924832 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is what I mean by forcing a pick.





So where does your team ever find a QB?


Anywhere in the draft that the value is right.
RE: Football, more than any major sport is one thing  
Big_Blue_in_the_Bronx : 4/22/2018 11:23 am : link
In comment 13924924 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
It's a game of economy.

I would conjecture, with past injury history and taking big hits, Eli likely has the most left in the tank of the old qbs.

Ergo, concordantly, vis-a-vis you don't take a flier on a qb who doesn't WOW you. You give your qb the generationally transformational weapon to form an unstoppable combined arms style attack with your other generationally transformational wr like the army of Alexander the Great.


Lol well put. We have heard mutliple guys on the Giants talk about him having a few years left. A few more days to find out.
Strategy is largely dependent on Philosophy  
Peppers : 4/22/2018 2:32 pm : link
I think it is imperative that all analytical decision making and implementation processes are oriented to making sure that the risk can be minimized before focusing on the potential reward.

Then organize the information gathered (through film study, visits, and analytical data) to facilitate rational analysis.. Apply it with the understanding that the ultimate goal (obviously a Super Bowl), is more likely to be obtained after building a consistently winning football team. It's important not be short sighted in this process.

With the amount of holes on the roster, one strategy will not be suitable for filling all voids in one draft. So forget even attempting that lol. Most strategies I've read so far have deeply embedded bias. The draft is very unpredictable. The key here is to have a flexible strategy.

Grades on each prospects, fit with scheme, positional value, medicals, need awareness, resource allocation, and foresight are are all apart of the equation when it comes to building the board and coming away with the best possible draft.

My approach in life and coaching would carry over to the draft war room as well. Being passive will get you what's left and more often than not leave you with regrets.. While being aggressive will give you a better chance at getting you what you want. Far to often I hear "let the draft fall to you" and I can't disagree more. When you have an opportunity to dictate the results you do it. Obviously, calculated risk. Just like dialing up a blitz on the field.

I think the optimal scenario is trading down  
Go Terps : 4/22/2018 3:13 pm : link
I've gone back and forth on the "blue chip" guys, and it's tough to have conviction on any of them. I have greater conviction in the idea of increasing the number of young cost controlled talent in the roster.

In the BBI mock draft I selected for Colts, who had a slew of picks owing to their trade down with the Jets. At the top of the second round I was able to get both Sony Michel and DJ Moore, and there were a lot of other good players available. A trade down could still net us Rudolph or Lauletta, plus other prospects.

If we have a conviction that Darnold is a great prospect, we should take him and be happy. I personally don't feel the same conviction for him or the other guys that I did in 2004. Then, it HAD to be Eli. Now, I don't think it HAS to be anybody. Given that, I trade down.
RE: Football, more than any major sport is one thing  
giantstock : 4/22/2018 4:41 pm : link
In comment 13924924 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
It's a game of economy.

I would conjecture, with past injury history and taking big hits, Eli likely has the most left in the tank of the old qbs.

Ergo, concordantly, vis-a-vis you don't take a flier on a qb who doesn't WOW you. You give your qb the generationally transformational weapon to form an unstoppable combined arms style attack with your other generationally transformational wr like the army of Alexander the Great.


It's a game of economy which so why you take the QB. Otherwise you wind up paying $30m for a sub par QB in the future.

There is a reason why in terms of positional value the QB is so much further ahead than the RB.

ANd for anyone to suggest with sub par lousy QB play that a team can have an unstoppable offense is beyond ridiculous. This just highlights the fact there are those that have no understanding of what positional value means/ translates to ON THE FIELD.
RE: RE: RE: Taking a QB when a better player is on the board  
giantstock : 4/22/2018 4:42 pm : link
In comment 13924953 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
In comment 13924916 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


In comment 13924832 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is what I mean by forcing a pick.





So where does your team ever find a QB?



Anywhere in the draft that the value is right.


Is this a joke?
It is pretty simple...  
EricJ : 4/22/2018 4:44 pm : link
draft guys who can actually play and contribute in the NFL. Let's start with that. When you look back at Reese's player success rate through the draft, this would be ground breaking.
RE: RE: RE: Taking a QB when a better player is on the board  
Jimmy Googs : 4/22/2018 6:46 pm : link
In comment 13924953 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
In comment 13924916 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


In comment 13924832 RobCarpenter said:


Quote:


Is what I mean by forcing a pick.





So where does your team ever find a QB?



Anywhere in the draft that the value is right.


Oh, the Tom Brady approach....good luck with that.
I like your thinking there especially the Josh Jackson pick  
Bluesbreaker : 4/22/2018 6:50 pm : link
replaces DRC we need speed at DB .
Barkley by himself is good for 2-3 wins ...  
Manny in CA : 4/23/2018 12:26 am : link

That's 5-11, or 6-10;The addition of FA Nate Solder and draft picks Hernandez, Bozeman ads 3 more; that's 9-7. A big complimentary receiver like Fl. States's Auden adds 1 more, that 10-7, a big fast CB (to replace DRC adds another), that's 11-5; a solid replacement for JPP takes us to 12-4.

I know, I'm shooting for the stars, but. bottomline, if we do an OUTSTANDING job of drafting, 10 or 11 wins can get us into the dance. We still have a Super Bowl QB who knows how to win the big games, if we give him the protection and weapons.
I would go with  
illmatic : 4/23/2018 1:03 am : link
Darnold at 2 if he's there, if not then go for Barkley. BPA in the following rounds but there should be some very nice OL available in the early second and I'd look at that to help improve the line for Eli + Darnold or Barkley, whoever they went with. Get someone to help out Bettcher in the third.

I'd also strongly consider signing Dez to a reasonable one year prove it deal. Cut his ass immediately if he becomes a problem. If you have Eli, Barkley, OBJ, Dez, Shepard, Engram with an improved line, good luck trying to stop that offense next year. And I'm sure Bettcher will have those guys ready to play well on the other side of the ball. I think that's a potential playoff team if the line improves and there aren't any huge season ending Odell-like injuries early on.
RE: One mo' time...  
.McL. : 4/23/2018 1:22 am : link
In comment 13924912 M.S. said:
Quote:


...we've got to cluster draft offensive lineman.

Must come out of this draft with one immediate starter at either RG or RT and one high quality back-up who can step-in when called upon in Year One.

If we fail at this, no high quality running back, cornerback or anyone else will turn this big ugly ship around.


Agreed we need to cluster draft OL, maybe throw in a CB too.

Need to trade down for this though, need a good partner.
Do what reese and Co failed to do...  
Torrag : 4/23/2018 9:49 am : link
...draft players that are scheme comptible with what we do. They attempted to fit way too many square pegs into round holes. The other thing is to draft smart and mentally agile players.
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