his top QB coming out is Josh Allen. He talked about his size, his mobility, weather conditions etc. and he mentioned that his offense wasn't QB friendly, alignment, routes etc, no screens, lots o back shoulder 20 yard throws etc.
His points- he will not get smaller, will not have minimal arm strength , won't lose his mobility so maybe he doesn't become the highest % passer he will still be a VERY good QB.
Not taking sides here, just writing what I just heard.
Agreed
Sam Darnold- he is talking about the BIG motion in his throws and he doesn't see Darnold in Cleveland as the winds adn cold would work against his throwing motion where Allen will not have that issue. Not saying he thinks Browns will take him just that he feels that Allen is better for Cleveland and the playing environment.
Lamar Jackson- he believes will go in 1st round, electric, one of the best players you saw this past year, quickness and running ability but his throwing is better in games vs the pro day and combine. Said his throwing at the Combine was AWFUL, without question awful. Still believes he can be a QB in the league-lots of arm power and if someone just teaches him the QB role he will be dangerous. Phil thinks he goes in top 20-23 picks...
Now Josh Rosen joining the show.
He did make one good point....Josh Allen did not throw screens....if he threw as many screen as Mayfield assuming a high percentage....his completion would equal to the other guys.
Phil and his son are both utterly besotted by arm strength.
Talking about meeting teams. Bob mentioned seeing him at the Giants facility- mentioned seeing Paul Perkins again at the Giants facility.
Phil about Josh Rosen- saying it to him, Rosen was only QB who played PRO Football in college. Only QB who did. He is asking Josh Rosen about changing his motion between end of the season and then Combine. He talked about John Beck working with him on his footwork and waist to help be able to throw the ball over a long season. Rosen just stated that he has NEVER had a QB coach at any point in his career.
Now Ed McCaffrey with last question- craziest questions you have been asked- including about his interest in the game, what he knows, the love of the game and what kind of PRO he wants to be. He gave up his first true love (Tennis) for Football. He has wanted to convey that message- he loves the team game and the group wins etc. (Old Spice is why he was on the show).
Phil now back as focus:
Now ranking accuracy and progression use- best of the group- Josh Rosen is the best there and it is not even close. He can start for someone tomorrow because he knows the PRO style and the game. He goes through progressions naturally and gets himself in the best position to make a throw (he and Mayfield) but Rosen ahead by a mile there. His only complaint about Rosen is that sometimes he needs to move out of the pocket quicker to avoid taking so many hits in the pocket. His toughness and stand in style sometimes needs to be a tad quicker in getting out of the pocket. Rosen is most prepared to play NOW.
Talking about Vet and the Rookie who is picked high working together- the VET knows he has to play WEll and they have to win and they still may not keep their jobs. It is the way things work.
The Jets in a word position as they have to wait for teams to pick their QB's before they get their guy. He feels Jets would be the best spot for Mayfield.
Simms says- he does not see the Giants taking a QB. The way the Giants have gone about offseason and because if after two games the Giants are 0-2 the yelling for the rookie will become quite loud. Doesn't see the Giants going that way.
He does see 5 QB's going in Rd 1.
I think you missed the point. His point was that was the bulk of the passing game where others had a LOT of screens, short passed to backs.
I will say, he sure believes Rosen is the most PRO ready guy there. He was less as enthusiastic about Darnold. In fact while he didn't say it I would say he has the QB's like this:
Allen
Rosen
Mayfield
Darnold
Jackson
First he takes his analysis very seriously.
He does his homework and does not make flippant comments.
Unlike many other pundits he does his research.
To paraphrase what he said about Allen;
" I went back and watched all of Allen's games. I noticed that the Wyoming offense was not QB friendly. Allen threw 7-9 screen passes the entire year. Most teams do this in one game. Allen's lack of accuracy is related to the play calling and the low percentage throws Allen had to make. "
This is the one and only reason I do not want Rosen. Everyone and their brother says he is the best QB, but he takes too many hits. Can’t do that at any level, especially the NFL.
In 2016, Josh Allen had 3 senior receivers. WR were Tanner Gentry and Jake Maulhardt and his TE was Jacob Hollister.
Fast forward and you see that Gentry is an NFL receiver with the Bears, and Hollister is a TE for the Patriots (Maulhardt was released by the Saints and never played in the NFL). Obviously Josh Allen had great receivers as in their senior years Gentry caught 72, Maulhardt caught 39 and Hollister had 32.
Its not an excuse. Its a valid reason why Josh Allen was better in 2016 than in 2017.
This is the one and only reason I do not want Rosen. Everyone and their brother says he is the best QB, but he takes too many hits. Can’t do that at any level, especially the NFL.
Yeah, because of all the things he cannot learn, getting rid of the ball is one of them. Excellent reason for not drafting a QB with his ability.
Not sure, but doesn't Phil still hold the NFL record for most lifetime sacks with about 495 of them?
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He also said Rosen took more hits than any college QB last year due to his willingness to stay in the pocket even when he should get out and that in the NFL you need to avoid hits to stay healthy.
This is the one and only reason I do not want Rosen. Everyone and their brother says he is the best QB, but he takes too many hits. Can’t do that at any level, especially the NFL.
Yeah, because of all the things he cannot learn, getting rid of the ball is one of them. Excellent reason for not drafting a QB with his ability.
Not sure, but doesn't Phil still hold the NFL record for most lifetime sacks with about 495 of them?
My concern with Rosen and the hits is that it may be instinctual. Nothing wrong with being a pocket guy and not being fast (eg. Manning and Brady), but those guys always seem to have a sense for where the rush is coming from and they either get down or slide out of the pocket to avoid the big hit. A guy that takes constant hits can be a real problem, he can have the greatest arm in the universe but he doesn’t help us at all sitting on the bench. This is the only reason he is not labeled as a “consensus” #1 QB.
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He also said Rosen took more hits than any college QB last year due to his willingness to stay in the pocket even when he should get out and that in the NFL you need to avoid hits to stay healthy.
This is the one and only reason I do not want Rosen. Everyone and their brother says he is the best QB, but he takes too many hits. Can’t do that at any level, especially the NFL.
Yeah, because of all the things he cannot learn, getting rid of the ball is one of them. Excellent reason for not drafting a QB with his ability.
Not sure, but doesn't Phil still hold the NFL record for most lifetime sacks with about 495 of them?
UGH, again his point was on taking hits he didn't need to.. Besides, I think Dave Kreig must be way up there sack wise.
If you play a long time, you're gonna take some sacks. The top 10 all time is Favre: 20 years, Elway: 16 years, Krieg: 19 years, Cunningham: 17 years, Simms: 15 years, Bledsoe: 14 years, Moon: 17 years, Brady: 18 years, Testeverde: 21 years
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In comment 13927876 eric2425ny said:
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He also said Rosen took more hits than any college QB last year due to his willingness to stay in the pocket even when he should get out and that in the NFL you need to avoid hits to stay healthy.
This is the one and only reason I do not want Rosen. Everyone and their brother says he is the best QB, but he takes too many hits. Can’t do that at any level, especially the NFL.
Yeah, because of all the things he cannot learn, getting rid of the ball is one of them. Excellent reason for not drafting a QB with his ability.
Not sure, but doesn't Phil still hold the NFL record for most lifetime sacks with about 495 of them?
UGH, again his point was on taking hits he didn't need to.. Besides, I think Dave Kreig must be way up there sack wise.
Taking sacks and taking big hits are not really the same. Eli has gotten sacked quite a bit too, but I can count on one hand how many of those involved big hits in the past few years. When I look at Rosen, I picture a Sam Bradford type career. The guy will come out and have a few excellent games and you are like great, he looks amazing, we are going to be good this year. Then it’s uh oh, our for the year again. Its not a question of skill with Rosen at all, it’s the way he plays.
Agreed, if the Giants do pick a QB, it means this new regime is convinced their guy is a franchise maker.
Gettlemen has been nothing but excellent with his smokescreen, so if misdirection is his intention could that mean Allen?
Odds are against it, but I really think his cold weather experience and huge arm seems to fit MetLife...and not that many talk about that part of his game.
d=567938&show_all=1#13927770]13927770[/url] Georg
e from PA said:
He did make one good point....Josh Allen did not throw screens....if he threw as many screen as Mayfield assuming a high percentage....his completion would equal to the other guys.
You watch them vs Oregon and Iowa and it was Snap, Run, and throw away. He was beat up all game. Numbers were terrible but that game was a positive for him as a prospect He showed a lot.
It’s easy to look at somie numbers and try and find a problem. But a WQB can’t do anything if the DL is all over him and that was often the case.
Allen, Rosen and Mayfield. Phil has the top 3 right.
Allen to Cleveland makes sense. Giants draft Rosen. Jets get Mayfield.
Rosen's long ball completion rate is outstanding.
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Rosen's long ball completion rate is outstanding.
Probably doesn't have a lot of passes of that type, but yeah. In terms of throwing, he's by far the best in the class. Everything else is noise.
Huge kevin boothe fan, I guess.