I know there was a thread already on Casserly's earlier comments (about Lauletta being his favorite pick of the draft), but he made more yesterday. And Billick's comments were pretty shocking (in a good way), at least to me.
On NFL network, the panel was talking about the QBs drafted in order, where they were going, etc.
Billick was on a remote feed and when they got to Lauletta, I believe his exact words were:
"oh my gosh, this might be the best QB pick of the draft".
I just about crapped myself, rewound it and listened again.
Meanwhile, they're showing highlights and Lauletta is throwing perfect passes, to receivers in stride, even one for about 35-40 yards (I know they're highlights, but still looked impressive).
Then someone on the panel mentioned that the Ravens and Giants both had rookie QBs last year and mentioned Woodrum? and Webb.
Casserly said something to the effect that they will both be "forgotten" in time, "trust me".
FWIW.
Don't you actually have to know about somebody before you can forget them?
Zog, you're right, they mentioned Dobbs. Thanks for correction.
who do you forget something you've never seen?
Lauletta's accuracy and legs seem pretty solid so this was a good pick.
It's one thing to not have a functional arm. That isn't the case with Lauletta. Take the guy with accuracy, a quick release, and a quick mind to make his reads ten times out of ten.
If Webb can become the starter and Lauletta the backup, great.
Lauletta will not make it as a starter and he will never have any real trade value because of the lack of velocity.
Over 55 mph doesnt guarantee success, but under it pretty much guarantees failure
— Benjamin Allbright (@AllbrightNFL) March 10, 2017
And an aside to those who have been looking at the historical combine velocity numbers: the Ourlads numbers for 2017 are off, for some reason, understating by 3-4 mph.
The 2017 numbers in the linked article (which include Webb) are, I believe, the accurate ones.
Link - ( New Window )
Hopefully he or Webb turn into a starter.
You know that Casserly was a really terrible GM, right?
Oh well, the excitement was fun while it lasted.
Oh well, the excitement was fun while it lasted.
I'm not making this up. 55 mph is a real threshold used by NFL teams. The poster 1st and 10 mentions it above (thank you).
And Rudolph throwing 52 mph at the combine is undoubtedly a big reason he dropped to the third round after so much talk of him going in the first.
Watson has a few attributes Lauletta doesn't have
We go through this every year. Fans always think their team got a "steal," especially with late round QBs. It's natural, but rarely true.
If you want to say he'll beat out Webb, I won't disagree. Webb has a bigger arm, but Lauletta has enough arm strength to operate in Shurmur's system. That's all that matters. But the most likely ceiling for him is backup. Last year it was Peterman. This year it's Lauletta. Next year it will be someone else. Rinse. Repeat.
Quote:
.
Watson has a few attributes Lauletta doesn't have
Well, sure. But I was told that under 55 guarantees failure. Perhaps there's more to it than one simple metric? I mean, I'm an engineer and a math nerd but there's a lot of causation/correlation problems in the way that statistics are tossed around on blogs and twitter.
This guy is going to ride the pine for two years minimum.
Casserly's drafts might be spotty but he did draft quite a few pro bowlers over the years and as a scout he discovered some of the original Skins OL "hogs" as UDFA. What's your record?
Casserly's drafts might be spotty but he did draft quite a few pro bowlers over the years and as a scout he discovered some of the original Skins OL "hogs" as UDFA. What's your record?
Ok. Let's shut down BBI. No need for further discussion.
This guy is going to ride the pine for two years minimum.
Yes, riding the pine for two years will surely mean it was a wasted pick. Just ask Aaron Rodgers (not comparing the two, but it's not a good argument, to put it nicely).
Not to mention that Phil Simms and Joe Flacco (though higher picks) and other successful QBs played at the FCS level.
Quote:
about a 4th round selection that played at the FCS level.
This guy is going to ride the pine for two years minimum.
Yes, riding the pine for two years will surely mean it was a wasted pick. Just ask Aaron Rodgers (not comparing the two, but it's not a good argument, to put it nicely).
Not to mention that Phil Simms and Joe Flacco (though higher picks) and other successful QBs played at the FCS level.
And some dude named Carson Wentz that BBI loves.
That's all.
Like the screen to Barkley, for example
Because some BBIers like to nitpick about unimportant bullshit.
Quote:
.
Watson has a few attributes Lauletta doesn't have
Awe, are you still butt hurt that they didn’t take a QB at 2, doesn’t matter which QB, just any QB, damn it! Your rants are pure entertainment.
Link - ( New Window )
Because some BBIers like to nitpick about unimportant bullshit.
Well they can look at this list before commenting on that:
North Dakota State played JMU in the National Championship last year, and JMU is in the CAA with Richmond.
List of NCAA Division I FCS football programs - ( New Window )
Even if that's all anyone gets from my posts, that's more than anyone has ever taken from any of your posts, which have never been either entertaining, informative, insightful, perceptive, or anything else other than a waste of characters on a screen.
But I'll answer your question anyway. If you're going to make the short-term play by picking a running back at #2, and you have a roster riddled with holes, picking a second developmental QB in the fourth round is a poor allocation of resources.
I actually feel more confident in him than I do with Webb even for the lack of tape we've all seen on Webb. Boy the irony of ALL the BBI discussion of which QB, imagine this kid is the best of the bunch.
Excellent article, everybody here should read it:
Been saying that for months. THAT is why mid round pro style QB's are having success over highly touted spread QB's these days.
And before anybody rips the competition as being JMU, they should do a little research into JMU football.
The old regime were all professionals too - did that mean that everyone should have just blindly accepted everything they said?
Quote:
Awe, are you still butt hurt that they didn’t take a QB at 2, doesn’t matter which QB, just any QB, damn it! Your rants are pure entertainment.
Even if that's all anyone gets from my posts, that's more than anyone has ever taken from any of your posts, which have never been either entertaining, informative, insightful, perceptive, or anything else other than a waste of characters on a screen.
But I'll answer your question anyway. If you're going to make the short-term play by picking a running back at #2, and you have a roster riddled with holes, picking a second developmental QB in the fourth round is a poor allocation of resources.
No, its not. Its the right way to do it. If you have a veteran QB who has never been injured, who can read defenses, line everyone up,and generally run the offense, taking a QB you dont hqve graded very high at #2 overall is a poor allocation of resources. It would be much smarter to find a QB later where you can get the value youre looking for. Like a postential 1st or 2nd rd pick that drops, that you like, and think can run your offense. Youre trying to build a team, not a QB.
Forget the other teams that passed on him - we didn't touch him until the 4th. If we were that convinced this guy has what it takes to be a starting QB, would we have let him go that far?
I don't think there's a good answer to that. If the answer is yes, then you've got a guy you think is just as good as a 1st round drafted QB and you're playing cute to see if you can get him in the 4th instead of the 3rd.
Forget the other teams that passed on him - we didn't touch him until the 4th. If we were that convinced this guy has what it takes to be a starting QB, would we have let him go that far?
I don't think there's a good answer to that. If the answer is yes, then you've got a guy you think is just as good as a 1st round drafted QB and you're playing cute to see if you can get him in the 4th instead of the 3rd.
No one guaranteed he was Peyton Manning. People think he could probably develop in this system with these coaches to be a decent QB. No reason to think otherwise he has a full toolbox, and fell right in your lap, because teams that run different offensive systems need a "cannon." This guy is very close to Case Keenum
Forget the other teams that passed on him - we didn't touch him until the 4th. If we were that convinced this guy has what it takes to be a starting QB, would we have let him go that far?
I don't think there's a good answer to that. If the answer is yes, then you've got a guy you think is just as good as a 1st round drafted QB and you're playing cute to see if you can get him in the 4th instead of the 3rd.
This is the correct thinking IMO. Odds are he will not become a starter, just like Webb will not become a starter.
The odds are that the Giants replacement for Eli is not on the roster yet.
Of course either could surprise, but history tells us that while it is possible it is not likely.
Hope for the best, expect the expected (career backups at best).
And Steve McNair and Romo.
High quality NFL arms.
About 20 seconds later, I realized its the 4th round. I also remembered how much I hated it when Reese would reach for need with raw picks that never amounted to anything.
Most of these players won't amount to anything in the league anyway. There's just as much of a chance that Lauletta and/or Webb show enough to stick around as anyone else we'd pick, especially with a QB-friendly coaching staff. And maybe we flip one of them for a high draft pick down the road. Who knows.
I'm choosing to be optimistic for now. We'll see what happens.
Do any of you critics wonder why Bellichick wanted him?
Why wasn't Brady picked in the first round? (not comparing the 2)
The Giants didn't pick Lauletta earlier because they had higher needs/grades and yes, small school competition is part of the value equation.
Lauletta played at a small school and wasn't on most peoples radars until recently.... so he must suck according to some on BBI.
It's one thing to not have a functional arm. That isn't the case with Lauletta. Take the guy with accuracy, a quick release, and a quick mind to make his reads ten times out of ten.
+1
About 20 seconds later, I realized its the 4th round. I also remembered how much I hated it when Reese would reach for need with raw picks that never amounted to anything.
Most of these players won't amount to anything in the league anyway. There's just as much of a chance that Lauletta and/or Webb show enough to stick around as anyone else we'd pick, especially with a QB-friendly coaching staff. And maybe we flip one of them for a high draft pick down the road. Who knows.
I'm choosing to be optimistic for now. We'll see what happens.
+1
No one said anything like that, but I hope you feel better.
Quote:
Webb sucks because 32 teams passed on him over and over, including the Giants...but Lauletta is the goods, even though 32 teams, including the Giants, passed on him one additional round more than Webb?
No one said anything like that, but I hope you feel better.
Lol, have you read any of the Webb threads?
Do any of you critics wonder why Bellichick wanted him?
Why wasn't Brady picked in the first round? (not comparing the 2)
The Giants didn't pick Lauletta earlier because they had higher needs/grades and yes, small school competition is part of the value equation.
Lauletta played at a small school and wasn't on most peoples radars until recently.... so he must suck according to some on BBI.
Actually, never heard of Lauletta before BBI clamored for him. I was sold then and like the insurance pick.
One good thing is he's more likely than Webb to be a quality backup due to his accuracy. Webb is more boom or bust. We've been spoiled by Eli playing every game but a good backup is nice to have. Green Bay found that out the hard way last year. Philly won a title due to a good backup as we did once upon time as well.
Regardless, we now have Lauletta and I would be fine if we draft a different QB in the 3rd or 4th round each year and keep the best two each year. What I like about Webb and Lauletta is that they both have some mobility, are pocket qbs but have completely different throwing styles. Webb more umph and Lauletta more touch. Watching Lauletta throw the ball, I was impressed with his touch/accuracy hitting people in stride.
Regardless, we now have Lauletta and I would be fine if we draft a different QB in the 3rd or 4th round each year and keep the best two each year. What I like about Webb and Lauletta is that they both have some mobility, are pocket qbs but have completely different throwing styles. Webb more umph and Lauletta more touch. Watching Lauletta throw the ball, I was impressed with his touch/accuracy hitting people in stride.
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
I'm NOT comparing Lauletta to Montana at all. Just saying that all one needs is enough arm.
If Lauletta has enough arm, great. If not, he'll never be more than Chad Pennington -- a guy who totally "got it" between the ears, but who's noodle arm told defenders they didn't have to defend the area between the numbers and the sidelines. You can have that in a backup, but not in a starter.
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
That is what I thought I wonder if it was done again if the Patriots would have stayed at the 5th pick of the 4th round and took Lauletta. I don't think the giants thought he would make it to the 5th round.
Quote:
Living up in New England, there was a lot of talk that the Patriots loved Lauletta. Would make since with the comparisons to Garappolo. New England had the 5th pick in the 4th round and traded down and then the Giants took Lauletta. I wonder if the giants didn't take him would the Pats have in the 4th with their trade down. They ended up trading all the way out of the 4th round after.
Regardless, we now have Lauletta and I would be fine if we draft a different QB in the 3rd or 4th round each year and keep the best two each year. What I like about Webb and Lauletta is that they both have some mobility, are pocket qbs but have completely different throwing styles. Webb more umph and Lauletta more touch. Watching Lauletta throw the ball, I was impressed with his touch/accuracy hitting people in stride.
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
I think so. This kid is about as "Belichick Guy" as you can find.
Quote:
In comment 13947034 Giantimistic said:
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
That is what I thought I wonder if it was done again if the Patriots would have stayed at the 5th pick of the 4th round and took Lauletta. I don't think the giants thought he would make it to the 5th round.
Yes, I believe so.
Quote:
In comment 13947035 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 13947034 Giantimistic said:
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
That is what I thought I wonder if it was done again if the Patriots would have stayed at the 5th pick of the 4th round and took Lauletta. I don't think the giants thought he would make it to the 5th round.
Yes, I believe so.
Pats picked before the Giants in the 4th. They traded out before the Giants picked Lauletta.
Good. Haven't felt that way in years outside the OBJ draft class - with the exception of another Syracuse/BC Bromley.
Quote:
In comment 13947034 Giantimistic said:
The Patriots traded down after the Giants took Lauletta, presumably because they took him.
But what does Belichick know and what's he ever done?
I'm leaving it to Shurmur and staff to do that.
Some people on BBI are going through the "our scouts, GM and HC are idiots and those professionals should've listened to my amateur ass" phase.
I have an open mind an I'm just pointing out some positive comments made by people that know more than I do.
you're right. If you google it though, you will find a lot of speculative links between the Pats and Lauletta. FWIW, Todd McShay in a mock had the Pats taking him in the 3rd rd (# 95).
I personally don't care and know it won't matter to the skeptics here.
I didn't like Webb from the moment we drafted him: mechanically he was just a mess at Cal. Lauletta is the opposite - he's as clean as you could hope for.
I liked the pick. Picking quarterbacks is never a bad thing from an asset allocation perspective; hopefully Shurmur isn't as poor as his predecessors Coughlin and McAdoo at coaching them.
The Giants, who had a heck of a second day in Dave Gettleman's first draft running the team, used the 108th overall pick to nab the Richmond Spiders quarterback, a player who many believed was scientifically engineered to play for Bill Belichick.
ha ha: "many believed was scientifically engineered to play for Bill Belichick"? berry interesting.
scientifically engineered to play for Belichick - ( New Window )
In comment 13946964 Beer Man said:
Fwiw (probably not much), Lamar Jackson velocity was clocked at 49 mph at the combine.
Quote:
He traded out before we picked (to Cleveland, at 105). We picked at 108.
you're right. If you google it though, you will find a lot of speculative links between the Pats and Lauletta. FWIW, Todd McShay in a mock had the Pats taking him in the 3rd rd (# 95).
I personally don't care and know it won't matter to the skeptics here.
Speculative links don't matter though - this is Belichick we're talking about, the dark master himself. Unlike the Giants, he's not going to broadcast interest on players before the draft.
If the Pats wanted Lauletta, they had a pick just before us (and far fewer holes to fill). They opted instead to trade out of it.
Like the pick or don't for whatever reason, fine by me, but let's not call it sanctioned by Belichick himself when the guy traded away his opportunity to draft him at low cost.
He's an all time great coach, not sure about his draft handling. He seems to win despite spotty drafting and seems to like quantity of picks over quality (maybe it's smart because it is a crap shoot).
Time will tell for all these picks including Lauletta.
maybe no one noticed that I finished the OP with FWIW. Only time will tell what it's worth.
Every throw I've seen on his film seems to be perfectly placed. Perfectly. Fades, posts, crossing patterns, etc. Every throw. Obviously, there are plenty of throws that were not perfect and I do see where some critics say too much air is under the deep throws. But, every throw seems to hit the receiver in stride or at the correct point in his break, etc.
As I have said with every other pick this draft, the overall draft and FA process, etc. I will trust Gettleman and Shurmur until they prove otherwise. Both are professional and seem very sure of themselves (in a good way). I am willing to wait and see,.
My son is a Richmond grad, so I have seen Kyle play a lot. Nothing he does going forward will surprise me. He is very smart and has a lot of ability.
My son is a Richmond grad, so I have seen Kyle play a lot. Nothing he does going forward will surprise me.
Oh well, the excitement was fun while it lasted.
Also, if you watch the series of Kirk Cousins' interviews with Lauletta, that were posted on BBI yesterday, Cousins tells Kyle that arm strength is not as important as several other pro QB attributes that Lauletta does possess. IMO, those interviews were excellent. I especially liked the episode where Cousins has Lauletta diagram a play on the whiteboard and they then analyze it. Really interesting insights from Cousins and shows Lauletta to be really technically sharp.
Round 4
101. Carolina Panthers: TE Ian Thomas, Indiana
102. Minnesota Vikings: DL Jalyn Holmes, Ohio St
103. Houston Texans: WR Keke Coutee, Texas Tech
104. Indianapolis Colts: RB Nyheim Hines, NC State
105. Cleveland Browns (via New England Patriots): WR Antonio Callaway, Florida
106. Denver Broncos: LB Josey Jewell, Iowa
107. New York Jets: TE Christopher Herndon, Miami
108. New York Giants: QB Kyle Lauletta, Richmond
NOTE: NE had the 105th pick which they traded to CLE. 3 picks BEFORE the Giants picked Lauletta at 108th overall. Come on man!
NFL Draft results 2018: Full list of selections for all 7 rounds - ( New Window )
Round 4
101. Carolina Panthers: TE Ian Thomas, Indiana
102. Minnesota Vikings: DL Jalyn Holmes, Ohio St
103. Houston Texans: WR Keke Coutee, Texas Tech
104. Indianapolis Colts: RB Nyheim Hines, NC State
105. Cleveland Browns (via New England Patriots): WR Antonio Callaway, Florida
106. Denver Broncos: LB Josey Jewell, Iowa
107. New York Jets: TE Christopher Herndon, Miami
108. New York Giants: QB Kyle Lauletta, Richmond
NOTE: NE had the 105th pick which they traded to CLE. 3 picks BEFORE the Giants picked Lauletta at 108th overall. Come on man! NFL Draft results 2018: Full list of selections for all 7 rounds - ( New Window )
The Pats traded pick 114 after the Giants picked the QB. I think most had the facts straight
Chris Redman and Kyle Boller.
Some of Billick's finest work.
Quote:
You're doing so at your own risk.
Chris Redman and Kyle Boller.
Some of Billick's finest work.
Elvis Grbac.
Second of all, they had the 105th pick in the draft, that's a 4th round pick. You're a team that has a 41-year old starter and no young, developmental QB behind him, if you have a 4th round pick to use on a QB that you gave a 4th round grade, you use it on him, you don't trade it away for an additional pick in the 6th round.
But let's not pretend he has the Belichick stamp of approval. As someone said earlier, if Belichick wanted Lauletta, Belichick would have Lauletta.
Exactly.
I wonder if we keep these 3 QBs or if we bring in a vet to compete with Webb for the 2 spot
Elvis Grbac.
I actually thought it was smart at the time to ditch Dilfer for Grbac. That took real balls to cut bait with your Super Bowl "winning" QB.
And Laluetta can be our Foles
Forget the other teams that passed on him - we didn't touch him until the 4th. If we were that convinced this guy has what it takes to be a starting QB, would we have let him go that far?
I don't think there's a good answer to that. If the answer is yes, then you've got a guy you think is just as good as a 1st round drafted QB and you're playing cute to see if you can get him in the 4th instead of the 3rd.
And the Round 4 fact goes to your comment about not being a good answer to that, i.e., why not Round 2 or 3, how could NYG wait until 4 if he's that good a prospect? A qualifier here: I am not taking the position that Lauletta is going to be a world beater and that we got a "steal" in Round 4 (so often touted in past drafts and more often than not those steals were waived before the season or rode the pines for two before being waived)--simply trying to respond to the no good answer part. What we do know is that, with all the swings and misses in the draft, including in Rounds 1 -3 (all we need is a Reese tutorial), it's not exact science. Teams will stay with their "board", which I assume has to mean a combination of talent, low risk/high floor, conviction in the player, scheme fit, and need, in some order. I don't find it surprising that the four players picked before this QB checked those boxes more strongly than the QB did.
I hope Gettleman is right on this pick, on all of them; I found myself in the camp of wanting a QB at 2 for the reasons so often espoused here the past three months, but it didn't go that way.
And Laluetta can be our Foles
How much does it suck to be using the Eagles as a benchmark. Maybe one day we can be like them!
Quote:
the Giants picked their latest project QB, NOT AFTER! Get the fucking facts straight before you post.
Round 4
101. Carolina Panthers: TE Ian Thomas, Indiana
102. Minnesota Vikings: DL Jalyn Holmes, Ohio St
103. Houston Texans: WR Keke Coutee, Texas Tech
104. Indianapolis Colts: RB Nyheim Hines, NC State
105. Cleveland Browns (via New England Patriots): WR Antonio Callaway, Florida
106. Denver Broncos: LB Josey Jewell, Iowa
107. New York Jets: TE Christopher Herndon, Miami
108. New York Giants: QB Kyle Lauletta, Richmond
NOTE: NE had the 105th pick which they traded to CLE. 3 picks BEFORE the Giants picked Lauletta at 108th overall. Come on man! NFL Draft results 2018: Full list of selections for all 7 rounds - ( New Window )
The Pats traded pick 114 after the Giants picked the QB. I think most had the facts straight
Can you suggest a place where I can hide?
"114. Detroit Lions from New England Patriots (via Cleveland Browns): DL Da’Shawn Hand, Alabama"
Apologies to all for that VERY poor 1:15PM post.
Barkley is already in Canton
Quote:
In comment 13946824 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
.
Watson has a few attributes Lauletta doesn't have
Well, sure. But I was told that under 55 guarantees failure. Perhaps there's more to it than one simple metric? I mean, I'm an engineer and a math nerd but there's a lot of causation/correlation problems in the way that statistics are tossed around on blogs and twitter.
Flacco was 55 mph, so he barely has the arm talent of a successful pro quarterback.
So the Mcadoo offense?
“Write this down and mark my words — this guy is the heir apparent to Eli Manning.”