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What are everyone's thoughts on Evan Engram?

BestFeature : 5/2/2018 1:55 pm
I checked out his stats the other day and if I remember correctly they're on par in terms of yardage and superior in terms of TDs to Shockey's rookie season. Now mind you 15 years later it's a different league with different passing stats and way more pass catching TEs. But EE had a 3-13 team to Shockey's 10-6 team so we'll call it even. Thoughts on Engram's play last season and potential going forward?
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Best young TE...  
bw in dc : 5/2/2018 3:22 pm : link
in the league.

I expect him to catapult from last year's initiation and have a big year.
RE: RE: A very good tight end,  
Brown Recluse : 5/2/2018 3:26 pm : link
In comment 13951061 QB Snacks said:
Quote:
In comment 13950968 NorwoodWideRight said:


Quote:


good blocker. Potential to be a superior tight end, but probably fall short of that elite level.



He is not a good blocker.


He'll never be a dominating blocker. But he sticks his nose in there, gives good effort and at least ties up the defender long enough for the play to happen.
I really like Engram but highlighting his receiving stats "as a TE"  
NoGainDayne : 5/2/2018 3:26 pm : link
isn't the most accurate comparison. He isn't and won't be the blocker that Shockey was. He's somewhere in between a TE and a WR.

Look at his PFF rating, it isn't perfect but the low rating certainly isn't a reflection of who he is as a receiver. I don't take these as the gospel but their methodology is solid, it isn't junk. Think he has a long way to go as a blocker. (His effort is there though)
RE: Best young TE...  
Big Blue '56 : 5/2/2018 3:27 pm : link
In comment 13951180 bw in dc said:
Quote:
in the league.

I expect him to catapult from last year's initiation and have a big year.


Wait! Why TF are you saying something nice about a Giants’ player? That is NOT in your contract
He will be what we wanted Brandon Marshall to be  
Giantimistic : 5/2/2018 3:29 pm : link
I think he will be used more as a wide receiver this year and will be the big target that Eli likes.
Engram played as expected for me  
KWALL2 : 5/2/2018 3:33 pm : link
Excellent pass catching TE with a speed mismatch.

Not in Shockey league at this point. Still a long way to go to reach Shockeys level.
RE: RE: Best young TE...  
bw in dc : 5/2/2018 3:38 pm : link
In comment 13951188 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:

Wait! Why TF are you saying something nice about a Giants’ player? That is NOT in your contract


I get so mischaracterized around here...
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 5/2/2018 4:11 pm : link
Needs to work on the drops, but the talent is undeniable.
A bit of a reach when drafted  
Jimmy Googs : 5/2/2018 4:17 pm : link
but he is a talented young man for sure...
Played with a lot fire and aggression.  
bceagle05 : 5/2/2018 4:25 pm : link
That stood out last year on a team of quitters.
RE: I think  
Thegratefulhead : 5/2/2018 4:54 pm : link
In comment 13950980 allstarjim said:
Quote:
everyone is pretty bullish on Engram. Personally, I would play him on the boundary a lot more (as a WR). He has the speed to take the top off the defense and draw safety coverage, and he's a size mismatch. He's going to probably be the 3A option in the offense (Shepard 3B). We all know the other 2 guys. With just Beckham and Barkley, the offense would work well with JAGS around it. But it's the presence of Engram and Shepard that will truly help this offense reach new heights. It's up to Eli to stir the drink.

But specifically speaking of Engram, I think he has the potential to be the best receiving TE in football, I do believe that.
Agreed
Tons of potential  
Keith : 5/2/2018 4:56 pm : link
as a pass catcher. Elite skillset and I'm excited to see what he does in the new system. Lots of upside with Engram.
He'll be a great...  
M.S. : 5/2/2018 4:59 pm : link

...wide receiver one day!
As a pass catcher,  
Don in DC : 5/2/2018 5:01 pm : link
he's not much more than a possession receiver. Never seems to make big gains after the catch. Seems to get dropped by first contact more often than not.

Decent blocker from what I could tell, but I am hardly an expert.
My thoughts are:  
CT Charlie : 5/2/2018 5:19 pm : link
1) I hope he spent 45 minutes a day during the offseason, working with a Jugs machine.

2) I hope he spent 10 minutes 3 times a day, watching videos of Plaxico or Gronk blocking.

Seems like an easy guy to root for.
Get a life of your own  
Howyadoin : 5/2/2018 5:30 pm : link
Only God can judge
Run blocking vs defensive backs  
idiotsavant : 5/2/2018 5:42 pm : link
He could be used to help barkely along the way to the end zone.

As 2nd TE, Slot, Wide.

I still don't see your 'extra OL type TE ' on the roster.

But seriously, I do expect him to have significantly more running room (after catch stuff) in the new system ....and also assumung the RBs get going.
Makes you wonder  
mikeygiants : 5/2/2018 5:46 pm : link
what last year‘s team could’ve done with this year’s offensive line.
Still has huge upside for  
Phil in LA : 5/2/2018 5:46 pm : link
a creative coach.
11 dropped passes?  
XBRONX : 5/2/2018 5:57 pm : link
Where did that bogus number come from?
I want to see him in a 2 TE set with Ellison and . . . .  
TC : 5/2/2018 6:39 pm : link
with OBJ and Shepard, and Barkley in the backfield. How'd you like to be the DC that had to defend that!?
I've always seen him as a ...  
Manny in CA : 5/2/2018 6:56 pm : link

Plaxico Burress/ Kelvin Benjamin type. A big wide receiver with superior blocking skills in the intermediate and deep zones.

With a running start, I've NEVER seen anybody destroy so many corners and safeties blocking for our RBs (as Plaxico did)

In-line blocking, I just don't want to Engram clobbered by 300+ linemen.
EE wide left  
idiotsavant : 5/2/2018 7:05 pm : link
Ellison in line left, adams or whomever, in line right (no slot)

RB run outside left. Beck's wide right.

Play action right maybe.QB run right. Beck's cross leftwards.


I think he still needs to go to  
Bill in UT : 5/2/2018 7:06 pm : link
another level to match the hype. Not a great blocker, too many drops, and I don't see him running away from defenders. Still young, hopefully he'll continue to grow as a player.
Well, that figures.  
Klaatu : 5/2/2018 7:36 pm : link
The two guys who gave me the most grief when I had the Giants drafting him in the first round last year are still down on him. He's still a reach for Jimmy, and he still hasn't impressed Bill.

Engram was robbed of a spot at the Pro Bowl. I know, it's a popularity contest, but still. He put up better numbers than the three NFC TEs who bot chosen: Greg Olsen, Jordan Reed, and Jimmy Graham.
The drops are very concerning  
GMen23 : 5/2/2018 7:49 pm : link
I'm hoping for the big leap from year 1, to year 2. And he was one of the youngest players in the league. But as much as EE looks the part, he had quite a few drive stopping drops. And I don't recall any spectacular grabs. For much of last year I wondered, would we have been better off with Ryan Ramcyck?

Not drafting any WR's or TE's, he definitely is an important piece to this Giant resurrection.
RE: A very good tight end,  
djm : 5/2/2018 7:58 pm : link
In comment 13950968 NorwoodWideRight said:
Quote:
good blocker. Potential to be a superior tight end, but probably fall short of that elite level.


THats my take as well. He will be a very good player occasional wow plays with that speed of his. So so blocker but he will have a nice career. Not sure he will be the toughest bad ass TE ever but he will be a valuable cog here.
He was one of the few bright spots from last year  
UberAlias : 5/2/2018 8:06 pm : link
Check out some of the highlights.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Well, that figures.  
Jimmy Googs : 5/2/2018 8:10 pm : link
In comment 13951635 Klaatu said:
Quote:
The two guys who gave me the most grief when I had the Giants drafting him in the first round last year are still down on him. He's still a reach for Jimmy, and he still hasn't impressed Bill.

Engram was robbed of a spot at the Pro Bowl. I know, it's a popularity contest, but still. He put up better numbers than the three NFC TEs who bot chosen: Greg Olsen, Jordan Reed, and Jimmy Graham.


I didn't give you any grief on Engram. I have been consistent from start that I really liked him (and still really do). But to me he was a guy that could have been had in the beginning of Rd 2 and maybe mid Rd 2.

But Reese & Co desperately needed a TE since it was one of his forgotten positions, and one who could get downfield to alleviate coverage to OBJ. So we pulled any early trigger versus making some moves to get him at a more appropriate spot and another guy to boot.

I am high on him though as we all should be.
He wasn't the only case  
idiotsavant : 5/2/2018 8:14 pm : link
Of dropsies last year. At least partially resulting from Mac Ball ...being down to limited, obvious, abbreviated routes to move the chains, DBs just waiting like vultures.

Once they get the various functions working off each other one expects people with one man to beat.. not whole parties.
Might see him flexed out  
Jesse B : 5/2/2018 9:31 pm : link
At WR even more this year with Lattimire being the second best option
RE: .  
Tuckrule : 5/3/2018 6:47 am : link
In comment 13950978 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Part of the new TE breed. Very solid rookie year. A lot to like. Need to reel in the drops and cut down on those - but he's a tremendous talent and will be a major asset going forward.


First thing I thought of was the drops. Besides the occasional concentration lapse he’s excellent and a much much better blocker than he gets credit for.
Can’t to see what he does with a legit HC  
trueblueinpw : 5/3/2018 7:14 am : link
The Giants had the worst coaching staff in the NFL last season. And McAdoof had his shitty little paws all over the offense so one can only imagine the negative impact his moronic play design and play calling and communication had on a rookie like EE. This young man can only get better with a real NFL coaching staff, OBJ back on the field, Barks out of the backfield and Eli hopefully getting better pass pro with our new OL.
RE: RE: Well, that figures.  
Cap'n Bluebeard : 5/3/2018 11:01 am : link
In comment 13951689 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:



I didn't give you any grief on Engram. I have been consistent from start that I really liked him (and still really do). But to me he was a guy that could have been had in the beginning of Rd 2 and maybe mid Rd 2.



Didn't a few teams who picked after the Giants (I believe the Falcons were one?) say they were hoping to get him in Round 1? So no, he couldn't have been gotten in the 2nd round.
at Pick 23?  
Rafflee : 5/3/2018 11:21 am : link
Give me Pick 23 every single year, and tell Me I can pick a guy with this Upside and Production.

You say you wanted to pick him in the second round??? Well, I'm even smarter---I would want to pick him in the 4th or 5th round.... but I'd be over-joyed to find a guy like this at 23 every year, forever and ever!

He's an absolute Mismatch/Field Tilter.... he doesn't need to improve to be a heckuva #23---and my bet is that he'll get a helluva lot better!

Alabama TE O.J. Howard was drafted four spots ahead of Engram.  
Klaatu : 5/3/2018 11:48 am : link
He appeared in 14 games for Tampa Bay, starting all 14, and racked up 26 receptions for 432 yards with 6 TDs.

David Njoku (The U) was drafted six spots after Engram. He appeared in 16 games for Cleveland, making 4 starts, and racked up 32 receptions for 386 yards with 4 TDs.

Evan Engram appeared in 15 games, making 11 starts, and racked up 64 receptions for 722 yards with 6 TDs.

No surprise, Engram made the PFWA All-Rookie Team, and as I said earlier, he should've made the Pro Bowl, too.

We'll never know if Engram would have been available 30 picks later. There wasn't another TE drafted until late in the 3rd round (Jonnu Smith, TN, 18, 157, 2). But for the kind of production we got from Engram in a year when everyone else seemingly crashed and burned, I don't see how anyone can label his pick a "reach."
He clearly had good production. No argument, especially  
Jimmy Googs : 5/3/2018 12:01 pm : link
since I think he was the last receiver standing come Thanksgiving.

But that has really nothing to do with what I said.
I don't get some of the people saying that he will never be elite  
Bill L : 5/3/2018 12:08 pm : link
or will never be this or that..essentially they put a cap on him.

The kid is going into only his second year....jeepers, it's like nobody has the capacity for growth.
In my mind...  
Milton : 5/3/2018 12:15 pm : link
The jury is very much still out on him. The fact that his statistics were comparable to Shockey's rookie year goes to show how misleading statistics can be. After OBJ, Marshall, and Shepard all got hurt, Engram became the top pass receiving option by default and it's not like he was dominant in that role. Shockey was dominant!
RE: In my mind...  
Bill L : 5/3/2018 12:21 pm : link
In comment 13952652 Milton said:
Quote:
The jury is very much still out on him. The fact that his statistics were comparable to Shockey's rookie year goes to show how misleading statistics can be. After OBJ, Marshall, and Shepard all got hurt, Engram became the top pass receiving option by default and it's not like he was dominant in that role. Shockey was dominant!
Isn't that the problem though. Rookies are supposed to be weaned. Shockey was successful, in part, because he didn't have to carry everything and everyone. Engram was a freshman forced to take graduate classes. When things go to normal, we will have a fairer appreciation of what he really is or will be.
I like him, but I'm not completely sold.  
Ira : 5/3/2018 12:22 pm : link
He needs to increase his catch%.
RE: In my mind...  
Klaatu : 5/3/2018 12:25 pm : link
In comment 13952652 Milton said:
Quote:
The jury is very much still out on him. The fact that his statistics were comparable to Shockey's rookie year goes to show how misleading statistics can be. After OBJ, Marshall, and Shepard all got hurt, Engram became the top pass receiving option by default and it's not like he was dominant in that role. Shockey was dominant!


Yes, but that's not the point. Shockey was the 14th pick of the draft (the first TE chosen), Engram the 23rd (the second TE chosen). But just for a comparison, Shockey's rookie season he had 74 receptions for 894 yards with 2 TDs...on a team that was much more talented and went 10-6.

Also, Engram's production was fairly consistent from his first game to his last. It's not like he began putting up huge numbers by default.
RE: In my mind...  
BestFeature : 5/3/2018 12:31 pm : link
In comment 13952652 Milton said:
Quote:
The jury is very much still out on him. The fact that his statistics were comparable to Shockey's rookie year goes to show how misleading statistics can be. After OBJ, Marshall, and Shepard all got hurt, Engram became the top pass receiving option by default and it's not like he was dominant in that role. Shockey was dominant!


I mean Hilliard got hurt Shockey's rookie year so there were catches to go around than there would have been. And being the only option is a double edged sword, you can easily say it makes it easier to shut him down. Shockey for all his greatness also had only 2 TDs in that regular season.
Maybe for some of you 2002 is 16 years ago....  
Milton : 5/3/2018 1:28 pm : link
But it feels like just yesterday to me and you can forget the statistics, Shockey was a force his rookie year such that I had visions of him being a future league MVP. As it was, he was the rookie of the year and it wasn't even close. Unfortunately, he was never the same dominant player the rest of his career. It may not show in the statistics, but he never had the same explosiveness that he did as a rookie.
He was also a douche  
Bill L : 5/3/2018 1:36 pm : link
and that didn't help him much.
I'm not sure what Shockey's rookie season has to do with Engrams,  
Brown Recluse : 5/3/2018 1:42 pm : link
or why Shockey's success as a rookie should be used to downplay Engrams success.

They are different players and their rookie seasons also couldn't have been any different in terms of scheme, surrounding talent, coaching and chemistry.

Engram is a good player. We wanted a Jordan Reed type of player for this offense and thats what we got (he's actually a lot better than Reed.) No one should be comparing Engram to Shockey. Thats just unfair.
shurmur uses TE  
msh : 5/3/2018 2:29 pm : link
far more than mac did/would i expect him to be a key player for them this year,he is a future star the change of head coach is best news for engram and even more so for ellison they will be used the way they should have been day 1 now
Played well as a rookie in a trash offense  
Giants in 07 : 5/3/2018 2:31 pm : link
What is not to like?

Half the TE's in the league cannot block.
BTW...  
trueblueinpw : 5/3/2018 3:27 pm : link
There were a bunch of games this past season when EE was the only receiver on the field who was drafted at all. I mean, if Shockey were playing with practice squad players, would his production have been better than EEs? Idk...
Engram & Shockey are polar opposites ...  
Manny in CA : 5/3/2018 4:15 pm : link

Engram should be a receiver. Shockey was a classic "bad ass" - gave no quarter, expected none ....

Shockey was the reincarnation of Babe Ruth - ill mannered, loud, the kind of guy that would try to tear your testicles off at the bottom of the pile.



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