If the accuser goes public and reiterates the charges he could have big problems. If not this will go away.
Totally agree. If she goes on the interview circuit I don't think he survives. It'd be he said/she said, and nowadays she said holds substantial weight.
I didn't see anything wrong with it, but it's clear the brass needs to leave itself an out, in case this revelation should open a floodgate of accusers whose claims can be better substantiated.
If the statement seems like less than a 100% endorsement of Patricia, I can't say I blame them.
"A good prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich." An indictment means very little in the grand scheme of things. Innocent people go to trial all the time. More than most people care to admit, innocent people go to prison.
This goes beyond "innocent until proven guilty". This is "innocent until anyone even attempted to prove him guilty". It's a reprehensible mindset. I weep for the state of civil liberty in this country.
This goes beyond "innocent until proven guilty". This is "innocent until anyone even attempted to prove him guilty". It's a reprehensible mindset. I weep for the state of civil liberty in this country.
With respect, I disagree about what's happening here.
The presumption of innocence has to do with how you're treated by the government. You cannot suffer punishment at the hands of the government until you are proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It doesn't have to do with what we say on a bulletin board, or what the Detroit Lions can do with their hiring policy. Nobody's talking about putting Matt Patricia in prison, or having the government take his property. We're talking about whether he can keep his very public, high-profile job. Anybody with a skeleton in their closet who is in a public-facing job runs the risk of being let go because their employer doesn't want the bad press.
If he nothing happened, that's unjust, but it's not because he didn't get the benefit of the presumption of innocence. He will walk away a free man, regardless.
I had to read a few stories before finally finding out what Patricia Â
Was accused of. Groping? Vague inappropriate behavior? No, he was accused of breaking into a woman’s room with a friend and - I’m guessing from what wasn’t said - raping her. Read the SI link below and tell me if you draw the same conclusions. This looks awful.
The Lions denials are worded idiotically (are criminal laws suspended on spring break). Patricia’s claims of innocence sound weasel-like. I don’t think Patricia makes it to week 1 as head coach. Sports Illustrated story - ( New Window )
About MeToo, I think like a lot of people I occupy a middle ground Â
On the movement. Some of the accusations are appalling - I’m very surprised Harvey Weinstein hasn’t been inducted - the man should end his days in jail. The accusations against Charlie Rose or Matt Lauer are disturbing. But then there are other accusations that sound overblown.
So my reaction to the Patricia story was to look for what he had been accused of. It sounds very serious, he may have committed a felony and skated.
if the woman chooses to come forward and repeats the same story then he's toast. Especially since the owner is known for her tough stance on stuff like this. Doesn't sound like the alleged victim has any interest in bringing this back up though.
"A good prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich." An indictment means very little in the grand scheme of things. Innocent people go to trial all the time. More than most people care to admit, innocent people go to prison.
This goes beyond "innocent until proven guilty". This is "innocent until anyone even attempted to prove him guilty". It's a reprehensible mindset. I weep for the state of civil liberty in this country.
+1. Anyone can accuse anyone of any thing. Then the cops look into it. People are now "Convicted" on just being accused, which is ridiculous. Maybe the lady didn't come forward because it didn't happen, ever think about that? How would you like to be accused of something you didn't do, but yet lose your job etc.? If he wasn't convicted, and not even charged, then from the point of society there should be no consequences.
standard of conduct investigation on its own as it did with Zeke Elliott and others. It will seem like a double standard if they do not... And I assume there is an even higher standard of conduct for a head coach as compared to a player given the leadership requirements of the role...
I recognize this was twenty years ago, but this is not a statute of limitations issue in a court of law. This is a character issue that plays out in both the court of public opinion and in the minds of the players in the locker room. Will likely continue to be a huge distraction....
Anyone who thinks this is going away is deluding themselves. This isn't some B.S. accusation of him mooning some girl at a frat party, what he is accused of is horrible. According to the Detroit press article, there's an awful lot of smoke here. Patricia and this other guy were arrested right way and indicted. Its also curious how no one "remembers" what happened. If the girl's id was shaky we would have heard about it. If the girl was thought to be lying or lacking in credibility we would have heard about it.
Another thing. Even while the NFL or whoever investigates this incident, they'll be going over Patricia's history with women since then. If he so much as broke wind in the direction of a female since this incident, he's toast
Anyone who thinks this is going away is deluding themselves. This isn't some B.S. accusation of him mooning some girl at a frat party, what he is accused of is horrible. According to the Detroit press article, there's an awful lot of smoke here. Patricia and this other guy were arrested right way and indicted. Its also curious how no one "remembers" what happened. If the girl's id was shaky we would have heard about it. If the girl was thought to be lying or lacking in credibility we would have heard about it.
Another thing. Even while the NFL or whoever investigates this incident, they'll be going over Patricia's history with women since then. If he so much as broke wind in the direction of a female since this incident, he's toast
I'm not defending Patricia but why is it hard to believe no one remembers an incident 20 years ago in a party town like that that probably has thousands of incidents a year?
And you haven't heard anything about the girl because she stopped pursuing the case shortly after and has made no comments on it since.
lend one to believe that it was rather benign and/or sketchy details? If it was a clear cut case of rape and he got off because the woman couldn't bring herself to testify, wouldn't that stick with the DA? And some of the officers at the time?
+1. Anyone can accuse anyone of any thing. Then the cops look into it. People are now "Convicted" on just being accused, which is ridiculous. Maybe the lady didn't come forward because it didn't happen, ever think about that? How would you like to be accused of something you didn't do, but yet lose your job etc.? If he wasn't convicted, and not even charged, then from the point of society there should be no consequences.
Alas, it's a new world - you are guilty until proven innocent.
You would think people - the lynch mob media types - would have learned their lesson with the Duke Lacrosse case. Instead, that was just a bump in the road, and it's full steam ahead; destroying at will.
Totally agree. If she goes on the interview circuit I don't think he survives. It'd be he said/she said, and nowadays she said holds substantial weight.
If the statement seems like less than a 100% endorsement of Patricia, I can't say I blame them.
Quote:
would there be a statute of limitations?
Not with respect to getting fired by the Lions.
This goes beyond "innocent until proven guilty". This is "innocent until anyone even attempted to prove him guilty". It's a reprehensible mindset. I weep for the state of civil liberty in this country.
The presumption of innocence has to do with how you're treated by the government. You cannot suffer punishment at the hands of the government until you are proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It doesn't have to do with what we say on a bulletin board, or what the Detroit Lions can do with their hiring policy. Nobody's talking about putting Matt Patricia in prison, or having the government take his property. We're talking about whether he can keep his very public, high-profile job. Anybody with a skeleton in their closet who is in a public-facing job runs the risk of being let go because their employer doesn't want the bad press.
If he nothing happened, that's unjust, but it's not because he didn't get the benefit of the presumption of innocence. He will walk away a free man, regardless.
The Lions denials are worded idiotically (are criminal laws suspended on spring break). Patricia’s claims of innocence sound weasel-like. I don’t think Patricia makes it to week 1 as head coach.
Sports Illustrated story - ( New Window )
So my reaction to the Patricia story was to look for what he had been accused of. It sounds very serious, he may have committed a felony and skated.
Detroit News - ( New Window )
This goes beyond "innocent until proven guilty". This is "innocent until anyone even attempted to prove him guilty". It's a reprehensible mindset. I weep for the state of civil liberty in this country.
+1. Anyone can accuse anyone of any thing. Then the cops look into it. People are now "Convicted" on just being accused, which is ridiculous. Maybe the lady didn't come forward because it didn't happen, ever think about that? How would you like to be accused of something you didn't do, but yet lose your job etc.? If he wasn't convicted, and not even charged, then from the point of society there should be no consequences.
I recognize this was twenty years ago, but this is not a statute of limitations issue in a court of law. This is a character issue that plays out in both the court of public opinion and in the minds of the players in the locker room. Will likely continue to be a huge distraction....
Another thing. Even while the NFL or whoever investigates this incident, they'll be going over Patricia's history with women since then. If he so much as broke wind in the direction of a female since this incident, he's toast
Another thing. Even while the NFL or whoever investigates this incident, they'll be going over Patricia's history with women since then. If he so much as broke wind in the direction of a female since this incident, he's toast
I'm not defending Patricia but why is it hard to believe no one remembers an incident 20 years ago in a party town like that that probably has thousands of incidents a year?
And you haven't heard anything about the girl because she stopped pursuing the case shortly after and has made no comments on it since.
DG again dodging bullets because he cant even get out of his own way.
Wanted to pay a G, OT money
Gave non probowl OT, top OT money
drafted a RB, after signing a RB to big $
I’d call you an idiot, but that’s already been done. Multiple times. Troll?
If other allegations surface, then there might be smoke, but as of right now this is a single, two decade old allegation that never went to trial.
+1. Anyone can accuse anyone of any thing. Then the cops look into it. People are now "Convicted" on just being accused, which is ridiculous. Maybe the lady didn't come forward because it didn't happen, ever think about that? How would you like to be accused of something you didn't do, but yet lose your job etc.? If he wasn't convicted, and not even charged, then from the point of society there should be no consequences.
Alas, it's a new world - you are guilty until proven innocent.
You would think people - the lynch mob media types - would have learned their lesson with the Duke Lacrosse case. Instead, that was just a bump in the road, and it's full steam ahead; destroying at will.