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Kay Adams: "Giants over-hyping Saquon Barkley"

Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/15/2018 12:19 pm
I'm paraphrasing, but she raised an interesting point that I think some folks on BBI have mentioned. She thinks the Giants are doing a disservice to Barkley and the team by over-hyping Barkley. My guess is she was mostly talking about Gettleman's comments, but it raises an interesting question.

Would a 1,200 yard rookie season be a disappointment for most fans? How about 10 touchdowns?

What is YOUR expectation level with Barkley.
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1,200 yards rushing  
ryanmkeane : 5/15/2018 12:21 pm : link
and 10 touchdowns as a rookie? That would be pro bowl level, not a let down. Add in the catches and other yards...
1200/10 would be a terrific start  
JonC : 5/15/2018 12:21 pm : link
but I do think he's more talented then Elliott, Fournette, Gurley, etc.
Somewhere around  
dep026 : 5/15/2018 12:21 pm : link
11-1200 yards rushing
60 catches for 550 yards
12 TDs
My expectation is...  
ryanmkeane : 5/15/2018 12:22 pm : link
250 carries, 1300 yards, 9 rushing TD

65 catches for 500 yards, 2 TD
Are the 1200 yards total yards from scrimmage?  
NorwoodWideRight : 5/15/2018 12:23 pm : link
If so, I'd say yes, absolutely that would be a disappointment.

I think Barkley is going to rack up a lot of yards in the passing game. It's this versatility that makes him an immense prospect for the Giants, IMO.

If he gets 1,200 on the ground and another 500-700 in the passing game, I'd be more than satisfied.
I agree  
jcn56 : 5/15/2018 12:23 pm : link
not that I don't expect Barkley to do well - but I think they hyped him up to almost unattainable expectations.

Best prospect since Peyton Manning?

Kind of unfair to the kid.
RE: 1200/10 would be a terrific start  
barens : 5/15/2018 12:24 pm : link
In comment 13964283 JonC said:
Quote:
but I do think he's more talented then Elliott, Fournette, Gurley, etc.


Disagree with you about Elliott, who was also called a once in a generation running back. If he's on par with Elliott(minus the off the field), that would be spectacular.
Well, when you prattle on with that "touched by the hand of God"  
Greg from LI : 5/15/2018 12:24 pm : link
nonsense that Gettleman was dishing out, a 1200 yard season looks pretty ordinary.
You had me at Kay Adams  
Danny Kanell : 5/15/2018 12:24 pm : link
I'm looking for Marshall Faulk type production  
PatchoguePete : 5/15/2018 12:24 pm : link
1300 yards rushing, 800 yards receiving. 15-20 combined TDs
I would expect much more than that  
Bill L : 5/15/2018 12:25 pm : link
since we play out doors on an artificial field and should get some games with lots of torrential rain. Since he's the only player who can run on water, he'll accumulate ridiculous yardage.
I think he'll be  
Phil in LA : 5/15/2018 12:27 pm : link
historically good right off the bat, like OBJ was.
I didn't know Michael Corleone's wife was a football scout.  
Victor in CT : 5/15/2018 12:28 pm : link
...............
BBI gutcheck  
UConn4523 : 5/15/2018 12:29 pm : link
who actually cares or pays attention to "hype"? I never understood this phenomenon, whether it be sports, movies, etc.

If Barkley fails I won't bitch and moan about the "hype train". I'll be disappointed the #2 overall pick wasn't good.
.  
fanofthejets : 5/15/2018 12:30 pm : link
Barkley is very talented. I wouldn't put him above Gurley or pre injury Dalvin Cook though. Cook was on his way to being incredible though. We'll see how he recovers
Greg  
ryanmkeane : 5/15/2018 12:30 pm : link
are you still going to hate Barkley now that he's a Giant?
RE: RE: 1200/10 would be a terrific start  
JonC : 5/15/2018 12:31 pm : link
In comment 13964292 barens said:
Quote:
In comment 13964283 JonC said:


Quote:


but I do think he's more talented then Elliott, Fournette, Gurley, etc.



Disagree with you about Elliott, who was also called a once in a generation running back. If he's on par with Elliott(minus the off the field), that would be spectacular.


Elliott is a very good pro tailback, a throwback of sorts. But, he lacks the explosion, change of direction, and top gear s SB has.
Based upon the photo above, she can . . . .  
TC : 5/15/2018 12:32 pm : link
say anything she wants!

But think about it: the Giants draft the #2 pick, all the writers ask constantly about him, so the Giants say, yeah, they like him a lot and think he's going to be good. So then they're over-hyping him. I think that's a bunch of crap.

The NFL will knock the "new" off Barkley quickly enough, but I think he's got enough mental fortitude to weather through it and make his presence known. It's only the fans who may be disappointed by their own unrealistic expectations.
and, I think SB has better hands  
JonC : 5/15/2018 12:32 pm : link
and will prove to be more versatile in the passing attack.
RE: BBI gutcheck  
DanMetroMan : 5/15/2018 12:33 pm : link
In comment 13964304 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
who actually cares or pays attention to "hype"? I never understood this phenomenon, whether it be sports, movies, etc.

If Barkley fails I won't bitch and moan about the "hype train". I'll be disappointed the #2 overall pick wasn't good.


I think the more valid question is if the Giants might be doing him a disservice focusing on him so much. It's a lot of pressure and if he's merely a top 10 back it might cause some idiots to knock him. I guess on the field concern would be him trying to do too much.
RE: I'm looking for Marshall Faulk type production  
njm : 5/15/2018 12:35 pm : link
In comment 13964295 PatchoguePete said:
Quote:
1300 yards rushing, 800 yards receiving. 15-20 combined TDs


Faulk's rookie year he rushed 314 times for 1282 yds. and caught 52 passes for 522 yds. I don't expect him to get 314 carries, so 1100 rushing and 522 passing would be just fine with me.
I don't care about hype  
Sneakers O'toole : 5/15/2018 12:35 pm : link
and I don't care about cumulative stats. Just make a positive impact, and contribute to wins and be part of what turns this thing around.

The rest is just fodder for talking heads
800-900 yds and 500 yds receiving  
Alex_Webster : 5/15/2018 12:36 pm : link
would be benchmark. Anything less they will call him a bust. 1100-1300 yds with 600-800 receiving and he will be second coming.
RE: My expectation is...  
Eman11 : 5/15/2018 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13964287 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
250 carries, 1300 yards, 9 rushing TD

65 catches for 500 yards, 2 TD


That would be almost what the entire RB Corp put up last year and even better as far as TDs go.

They ran for 1549 yds with 6 rushing TDs, and had 608 receiving yds with only 1 TD.

Sign me up for your numbers right now.
My expectation is 15-20 touches, 80-90 ypg, 8 td (every other gm)  
Eric on Li : 5/15/2018 12:37 pm : link
So about 1400 total yards. I think that's pretty fair and realistic. He'll almost definitely lead the backfield in overall touches, so 15-20 is pretty reasonable. Dalvin Cook averaged 21.5 touches in his 4 games under Shurmur. He also averaged over 100 total yards per game, so there's definitely upside beyond my expectations.
RE: Greg  
Greg from LI : 5/15/2018 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13964309 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
are you still going to hate Barkley now that he's a Giant?


Are you still going to have your lips surgically attached to his ass if he is a fairly ordinary back?
Is it fair to have ANY expectations from Barkley UNLESS  
Marty in Albany : 5/15/2018 12:37 pm : link
you also have expectations of an O-line that can both pass & run block? Well do you?

"Are ya feelin' lucky?" -- C.E.
People want to make a big deal about DG's comment...  
Chris684 : 5/15/2018 12:39 pm : link
What he said about Barkley is true regardless of the type of career he has.

Looking through the lens of a talent evaluator, there isnt a box Barkley didnt check. I would imagine those are hard to come by for people in that profession.

If you're scouting Barkley, where is his weakness? It's not size, speed, athleticism, production, character, work ethic, health, pass pro, catching the ball, vision.

None of that means he's a lock in the pros. It just means he was the smart, obvious pick to make.
You can't put a number to it  
UberAlias : 5/15/2018 12:40 pm : link
Look, let's he honest here. Unless none of these quarterbacks excluding Mayfield fail to be franchise guys, or we get really lucky with one of the young QBs on the roster, there is going to be a ton of pressure on Barkely to not just be very good, but to be an all time great. If you pass on a franchise QB for a RB, you basically set the expectation that the RB to carry a similar impact (as the QB would). If not, then there are going to be legitimate questions -did DG blow it. In particular, if Sam Darnold is the real deal, we sure hope SB is like something we haven't seen in a long time, because that's the story they've all sold us on -SB was too good to pass up, gold jacket, sent down from the heavens, etc.
RE: and, I think SB has better hands  
barens : 5/15/2018 12:40 pm : link
In comment 13964313 JonC said:
Quote:
and will prove to be more versatile in the passing attack.


He does have better hands, but didn't Elliott run a similar 40 time? Coming out of OSU, Elliott was known for being great with and without the ball in his hands. A great blocker, an extremely physical back, and he was/is able to go the distance.

All I'm saying is if you really think he's gonna be better than Elliott, those are some pretty high expectations.

Cook  
Phil in LA : 5/15/2018 12:41 pm : link
was getting a lot of easy runs in that Shurmur O. Saquon will take those to the house.
I don't care about the hype either - and hopefully, Barkley  
jcn56 : 5/15/2018 12:41 pm : link
doesn't listen to any of it.

But there's a chance he does, and if he struggles people are going to be regurgitating those lines repeatedly. He's still a human being, regardless of which hand God decided to molest him with.
He needs  
larryinnewhaven : 5/15/2018 12:42 pm : link
to be Leveon Bell/Zeke good to justify that pick. We shall see. Seems like a great kid. I was on the take a QB train. But really pulling for SB.
40 times don't tell the whole story  
JonC : 5/15/2018 12:42 pm : link
look no further than OB, it's about playing fast in pads and I don't think EE has the same level of explosion in those small spaces just before breaking off a run.
the point is.....  
Greg from LI : 5/15/2018 12:42 pm : link
....when you pick a back #2 overall, he needs to be truly amazing to be worth the pick when the league is littered with very good RBs taken after the first round.
Gurley and Cook  
JonC : 5/15/2018 12:43 pm : link
are straight line runners, no wiggle, just run downhill.
RE: RE: BBI gutcheck  
UConn4523 : 5/15/2018 12:43 pm : link
In comment 13964314 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13964304 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


who actually cares or pays attention to "hype"? I never understood this phenomenon, whether it be sports, movies, etc.

If Barkley fails I won't bitch and moan about the "hype train". I'll be disappointed the #2 overall pick wasn't good.



I think the more valid question is if the Giants might be doing him a disservice focusing on him so much. It's a lot of pressure and if he's merely a top 10 back it might cause some idiots to knock him. I guess on the field concern would be him trying to do too much.


He seems like a guy who can handle himself well when criticized. If he can't, then we have bigger problems than hype.
Too late now.  
Dave in Hoboken : 5/15/2018 12:47 pm : link
The Giants talked him up big time, and it's time for him to perform Week 1. No excuses now.
I care about wins, not Barkley’s stats  
Vanzetti : 5/15/2018 12:49 pm : link
If Barkley leads the league in rushing and Giants win 7 games, who cares about his numbers? Odell put up historic numbers. , his first three years, does anybody 2014-7 as the golden years of Giants football?

RE: 40 times don't tell the whole story  
barens : 5/15/2018 12:49 pm : link
In comment 13964336 JonC said:
Quote:
look no further than OB, it's about playing fast in pads and I don't think EE has the same level of explosion in those small spaces just before breaking off a run.


No, they don't tell the whole story, I can't agree with you you there regarding explosion. Barkley can definitely make sharper cuts, and he's quicker in smaller spaces, that is the strength of his game, but Elliott often looks like he's shot out of a cannon.
Haven't read what others have said yet ...  
Beezer : 5/15/2018 12:51 pm : link

... but I'm not all that interested in the numbers. In a perfect world, I imagine his numbers will be up and down, with the REAL impact coming (I hope) from the Giants' ability to take whatever the defense is willing to give.

If the Giants have at least a relatively successful season, and Barkley's numbers aren't out of this world, I'm certain that a sect of idiotic fans will be critical and not see the big picture. That'll be too bad.
My guess is if the overall Giant offense improves then SB  
Jimmy Googs : 5/15/2018 12:52 pm : link
will have a pretty damn good year. Hell...Darkwa ran for 750 yards and 5 TDs for this shitty team last year. That alone tells you Barkley should put up close to 1200 and 10.

But unless its "good yards"...meaning it happens with consistency, especially during first halves and moves the chains, it will be somewhat meaningless. Giants need to get people committed to stopping the run with more than just the 4 down-lineman. That will create an efficient passing offense that Eli should be able to handle, and put up way more points on the board.

And as to Kay Adams...if she's talking then you should be watching.
If the hype is legit  
UberAlias : 5/15/2018 12:52 pm : link
He is going to have a huge impact on Odell. Despite the numbers, Odell has not taken over games like he did in stretches his rookie year. If he can impact the way teams defense Odell, he is going to have a major impact on the offense.
For me, it is not necessarily about the production...  
EricJ : 5/15/2018 12:55 pm : link
because we all know that so much as to do with the OL and the defense getting the ball back to the offense. Not to mention our ability to convert on 3rd and long to give Barkley more carries as the possession continues.

For me, I would have a huge problem if he did not immediately become our feature back. I would also have a problem if he was splitting the touches. Even a 60/40 split in his favor is unacceptable. Why put an inferior back in there? The only answer to that question I would accept is Barkley's stamina and ability to endure a full load in a 16 game season for the first time in his life. The beating on his body will be something he has never experienced before.
I wouldn't say it's the Giants hyping Barkely  
BSIMatt : 5/15/2018 12:56 pm : link
I'd say it was Gettleman gushing over him after the pick. I think Mara and Shurmur were pretty good at deflecting that type of attention. If anything the media, and draftniks have been hyping him.

If he's healthy I'd be disappointed if he didn't break Beckham's Giants record for total yards from scrimmage as a rookie, remembering that Beckham set that while missing 4 games.
Care less about pushing yards  
Sy'56 : 5/15/2018 12:59 pm : link
More about total yards and the pressure he takes off the passing game
Every #2 overall pick is hyped before his rookie season.  
Mr. Bungle : 5/15/2018 1:03 pm : link
And there are examples at every position of later-round/undrafted steals and value picks, even at QB (Tom Brady, Russell Wilson, Tony Romo, Kirk Cousins). And there are examples of busts at #2 at all of the most coveted positions.

If Barkley makes a big, consistent contribution to the Giants winning games, then it was a great pick. It's as simple as that, whether you wanted the Giants to draft him or not. It's not about a stat line, and it's not about his reaching some non-quantifiable bar of extraordinary talent.

Tune out this nonsensical media noise.
Shockey came in as a rookie  
UberAlias : 5/15/2018 1:04 pm : link
And right away you could just see things were different with him out there. Yes, his career did not quite live up to that initial promise, but especially in that first year there was a spark the moment he stepped on the field and the offense was immediately on a different level.

With the Giants selecting a RB with the second over all pick, passing up on the potential franchise signal caller for the best player in the draft, you expect to see the offense on an all together different level, day 1.
I don't care about statistics. I want wins.  
Brown Recluse : 5/15/2018 1:14 pm : link
.
His affect...  
Brown_Hornet : 5/15/2018 1:14 pm : link
...on the offense matters (and indirectly, the defense), his personal statistics do not.
His presence changes how the OC will design plays. His overall effectiveness will dictate how the OC calls plays.

He can have a huge impact at 1,200 yards.
He could just be window dressing at 1,700 yards.
We'll see~
Looking forward to whatever it is...
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