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NFT: 20 Years Ago Today: Mets Acquire Mike Piazza

PatchoguePete : 5/22/2018 3:33 pm
The day that changed a franchise. Best hitting catcher of all time. 2nd best Met of all time. Best NY Baseball player of his time period.
You're welcome  
YAJ2112 : 5/22/2018 3:35 pm : link
RE: You're welcome  
madgiantscow009 : 5/22/2018 3:37 pm : link
In comment 13971545 YAJ2112 said:
Quote:


wow, Piazza hasn't aged well at all.
"Best NY Baseball player of his time period. "  
Stan in LA : 5/22/2018 3:53 pm : link
Mr. Jeter begs to differ...
Piazza in his prime  
PatchoguePete : 5/22/2018 3:56 pm : link
was a more impactful player then Jeter. Not taking anything away from Jeter. He's great, but he had a better surrounding cast. If you switch Piazza for Jeter, those Mets teams in 1999 and 2000 don't make the playoffs
...  
christian : 5/22/2018 4:12 pm : link
1999 Jeter was +8.0 WAR. He had one of the great seasons ever for a position player.
is it possible for anyone to look dummer than Russo?  
Victor in CT : 5/22/2018 4:15 pm : link
or that 20 years have gone by so fast?

Why is it mecessary to knock a great player in order to praise another?
RE: is it possible for anyone to look dummer than Russo?  
YAJ2112 : 5/22/2018 4:22 pm : link
In comment 13971610 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
or that 20 years have gone by so fast?

Why is it mecessary to knock a great player in order to praise another?


Because it's dupe and Stan
Piazza WAR 1999-2000: 9.4  
Greg from LI : 5/22/2018 4:25 pm : link
Jeter: 12.6
RE: ...  
Section331 : 5/22/2018 4:26 pm : link
In comment 13971607 christian said:
Quote:
1999 Jeter was +8.0 WAR. He had one of the great seasons ever for a position player.


Piazza was 8.7 in 1997. It was with LA, tho.
RE: Piazza in his prime  
Victor in CT : 5/22/2018 4:36 pm : link
In comment 13971582 PatchoguePete said:
Quote:
was a more impactful player then Jeter. Not taking anything away from Jeter. He's great, but he had a better surrounding cast. If you switch Piazza for Jeter, those Mets teams in 1999 and 2000 don't make the playoffs


Jorge Posada (5.5) had a higher WAR than Piazza (5.1)in 2000. Would you make that trade? Jeter was an 8.o WAR in 1999, Piazza 4.3.

I don't particluarly care to go to war over WAR. I don't believe in it if I can see the players regularly. It helps scouting players you don't see.THey're all great players, 2 HOFers. My point is you don't need to dengrate 1 HOFer to prop up another. And guess what, Jeter would hjave made the Mets infinitely better with or without Piazza. Because truly great players make their teams better. .349 24HR and 102 RBI at SS? Yeah, I'll buy.
yes, Piazza's best seasons were in LA  
Greg from LI : 5/22/2018 4:36 pm : link
Still excellent with the Mets, just not quite as good as with the Dodgers.
Not sure how a thread about Piazza  
pjcas18 : 5/22/2018 4:36 pm : link
became a pissing contest with Yankees fans, but not surprised either.

I don't think if any GM was offered Piazza straight up for Jeter they turn it down.

Given the quality of catching or lack thereof, I wouldn't even be surprised if the Jeter side had to sweeten the trade to get Piazza.

He's the greatest hitting catcher of all time (based on FG OFF rating) and 6th most valuable catcher overall (WAR).

Jeter 4th best offensive SS all time, and also 6th best overall at his position.

But Piazza's OFF rating is higher so there's some DEF in there impacting the WAR which I'm skeptical of.

And even though WAR is position adjusted I think that catcher is probably more valued.

It's not a discussion anyone will change anyone's mind about though, so I won't debate people who feel differently.

We were fortunate to be able to see both players play their careers during our lifetimes (those of us who did).

RE: RE: ...  
christian : 5/22/2018 4:39 pm : link
In comment 13971641 Section331 said:
Quote:
In comment 13971607 christian said:


Quote:


1999 Jeter was +8.0 WAR. He had one of the great seasons ever for a position player.



Piazza was 8.7 in 1997. It was with LA, tho.


Jeter in 99 is one of the most criminally underrated seasons in modern baseball. His offense WAR was a 1.1 wins better than the next player.

He had 219 hits. He hit .371 on 0-2 counts.

I could go on for hours about 99. It was a rediculous year in baseball, and Jeter was plainly robbed of MVP.
RE: RE: RE: ...  
Section331 : 5/22/2018 4:41 pm : link
In comment 13971657 christian said:
Quote:

Jeter in 99 is one of the most criminally underrated seasons in modern baseball. His offense WAR was a 1.1 wins better than the next player.

He had 219 hits. He hit .371 on 0-2 counts.

I could go on for hours about 99. It was a rediculous year in baseball, and Jeter was plainly robbed of MVP.


Certainly not arguing Jeter's greatness, but in '97, Piazza had a near 1.100 OPS as a catcher! Ridiculous.
How did trading for Piazza change the franchise, anyway?  
Greg from LI : 5/22/2018 4:47 pm : link
He carried them to one World Series, in which they eked out one win on the backs of the overpowering duo of Benny Agbayani and Bubba Trammell.
...  
christian : 5/22/2018 4:47 pm : link
No one is knocking Piazza but when the thread starter says:

"If you switch Piazza for Jeter, those Mets teams in 1999 and 2000 don't make the playoffs."

And Jeter had a unequivocally better year in one of those years that's going to get a laugh.
RE: Not sure how a thread about Piazza  
Victor in CT : 5/22/2018 4:48 pm : link
In comment 13971654 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
became a pissing contest with Yankees fans, but not surprised either.

I don't think if any GM was offered Piazza straight up for Jeter they turn it down.

Given the quality of catching or lack thereof, I wouldn't even be surprised if the Jeter side had to sweeten the trade to get Piazza.

He's the greatest hitting catcher of all time (based on FG OFF rating) and 6th most valuable catcher overall (WAR).

Jeter 4th best offensive SS all time, and also 6th best overall at his position.

But Piazza's OFF rating is higher so there's some DEF in there impacting the WAR which I'm skeptical of.

And even though WAR is position adjusted I think that catcher is probably more valued.

It's not a discussion anyone will change anyone's mind about though, so I won't debate people who feel differently.

We were fortunate to be able to see both players play their careers during our lifetimes (those of us who did).


That's my point. They're both terrific players.

And truthfully, I think Piazza was unfairly maligned as a defensive player. He moved pretty well, called a good game and framed pitches well. He just couldn't throw at all.
RE: Piazza WAR 1999-2000: 9.4  
weeg in the bronx : 5/22/2018 8:33 pm : link
In comment 13971638 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Jeter: 12.6


WAR is a joke, Jeter was never the best player on his team.
Oh? Who was the best player on the 1999 Yankees then?  
Greg from LI : 5/23/2018 12:51 am : link
Bernie was the only one close to him at the plate, but Jeter had the slight edge in every offensive category, was much better on the bases, and played an average SS while Bernie was a terrible centerfielder.
OP is a troll  
moespree : 5/23/2018 12:56 am : link
Who knew exactly what he was doing with that comment.
it became a pissing contest when....  
BronxBombers : 5/23/2018 9:18 am : link
the title closed with, "best player in NY at that time."
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