It's best to zag. Why not trade down with Minnesota? Grab 11 and 23 for 6. Get the best DB on the board and a tier-2 WR in a deep class. Trade a mid-round pick for Fields.
wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
I disagree. The Giants will be pretty bad too plus 6 vs 11 is a big drop-off in this draft. Plus the Giants *have* more they could add in that Minnesota doesn't. Minnesota is out a 2nd and 3rd this year and a 2nd next year. Doesn't mean the Giants should or will do it, but they could easily top Minnesota's best offer.
Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
You're ignoring the fact that even if you're right and those 3 picks are more valuable than the Giants' 3 picks, the Giants can add to their offer in ways the Vikings can't.
I got heat for saying the Giants would be fine with getting jumped. But IMO there is so much smoke around JJ, and “moving on from Jones”. At this point, it’s almost like the Giants wanted those narratives to get out there. Remember, Schoen is a smart guy - he’s not DG.
Seems like the target for Minn is #4. Wouldn’t make sense for it to be #5 this far out, as they could get jumped.
Wonder if the Chargers also knew the Minn trade as going to happen, and knew they’d get Harrison - which led to them being more comfortable trading Allen. I’m sure they’ve had discussions with Minnesota about #5, so wouldn’t be too far fetched for them to have an inside scoop.
that big things are happening right now in terms of draft positioning.
The biggest thing we have going for us is that we still provide the softest landing for anyone in the top 5, all they have to do is move back to 6 and you're still getting a top 3 OT or WR or the best defensive player in the draft.
I got heat for saying the Giants would be fine with getting jumped. But IMO there is so much smoke around JJ, and “moving on from Jones”. At this point, it’s almost like the Giants wanted those narratives to get out there. Remember, Schoen is a smart guy - he’s not DG.
Seems like the target for Minn is #4. Wouldn’t make sense for it to be #5 this far out, as they could get jumped.
Wonder if the Chargers also knew the Minn trade as going to happen, and knew they’d get Harrison - which led to them being more comfortable trading Allen. I’m sure they’ve had discussions with Minnesota about #5, so wouldn’t be too far fetched for them to have an inside scoop.
So Arizona is going to give up the chance to take Harrison?
wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
that big things are happening right now in terms of draft positioning.
The biggest thing we have going for us is that we still provide the softest landing for anyone in the top 5, all they have to do is move back to 6 and you're still getting a top 3 OT or WR or the best defensive player in the draft.
Need to get to 3 now. This idea some other posters talk about waiting until NE is on the clock is wrong. They need to get it done now and eliminate doubt of getting jumped.
The Giants need a QB. So do the Vikings - see how aggressive they are? There is no reason for the Giants to not come away with a QB.
Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
You're ignoring the fact that even if you're right and those 3 picks are more valuable than the Giants' 3 picks, the Giants can add to their offer in ways the Vikings can't.
I'm not ignoring it, I'm assuming that #6, #47, and next year's #1 is the most Schoen would offer to move up.
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
Vegas disagrees with you btw and the Vikings currently have Darnold playing QB. Minnesota has had a good offseason. They lost Hunter but added Greenard, Van Ginkel, Blake Cashman, and Aaron Jones so far. Their OL is already very solid and they're loaded at the skill positions.
wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
You think Vikings are gonna offer their 1 next year when they just gave away their 2 next year? Definitely possible but a lot to give up to move up 5-8 spots IMO. I hope JS gets his guy
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
Vegas disagrees with you btw and the Vikings currently have Darnold playing QB. Minnesota has had a good offseason. They lost Hunter but added Greenard, Van Ginkel, Blake Cashman, and Aaron Jones so far. Their OL is already very solid and they're loaded at the skill positions.
Darnold is on a one year deal and is the ultimate journeyman QB. Isn't Minnesota his fourth team? My guess is the Vikings want a rookie QB who can sit behind Darnold for a year before taking over in 2025. They know the Giants are in the same situation. Lock is also on a one year deal and will likely start while a rookie QB learns before taking over next season. So the Vikings make this move to try and package #11 and #23 to move up ahead of the Giants.
not sure who in the top 5 is signing up for that. Vikings may just want first crack at QB5 or if QB4 drops.
Why would they do that now?
Good offer, and those don’t always stay in perpetuity. They liked the value and jumped on it. Why else would they have done it?
I don't buy that for a second because teams would not be looking for the 23rd pick unless they had a plan to use the 23rd pick. Why not wait until draft day and see how it is going. 23rd is so far out of the view that it almost makes no sense to trade for that now. My hunch is they have a second deal in place and were told that this is what they needed--so they had to go out and get something of this value and they looked for partners and here we are. There is no way they are saying, well if QB 4 or QB 5 slips to 23 a month out. They are not Houdini or Nostrodamus.
Since 2012. They still have a good OL and Justin Jefferson, Jordan Addison & TJ Hockenson on offense. They upgraded their RB position from Alex Mattison to Aaron Jones. Assuming they're going to be worse than the Giants is a stretch.
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
·
9m
If you're the Patriots or the Cardinals, would you rather have No. 6 and 2025 1st rounder from Giants or No. 11 and No. 23 this year from Vikings?
If Giants want their QB bad enough and it takes their 1 from next year, do it.
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
Jones averaged 4.6 ypc this past year. What does how much Jefferson makes have to do with his talent? Addison is a star in the making, better than anything the Giants have and Hockenson for half a season is also better than anything the Giants have at TE.
Their OL is easily better. It's not even close. They were 3rd in pass block win rate this past season in the NFL and 19th in run block win rate. The Giants were 24th and 31st. I don't subscribe to PFF to see overall ranking but these are their tackles: Darrisaw's grade = 82.4 and O'Neill's = 74.5.
wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
Allen coming out of college was not Caleb Williams.
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
Jones averaged 4.6 ypc this past year. What does how much Jefferson makes have to do with his talent? Addison is a star in the making, better than anything the Giants have and Hockenson for half a season is also better than anything the Giants have at TE.
Their OL is easily better. It's not even close. They were 3rd in pass block win rate this past season in the NFL and 19th in run block win rate. The Giants were 24th and 31st. I don't subscribe to PFF to see overall ranking but these are their tackles: Darrisaw's grade = 82.4 and O'Neill's = 74.5.
wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
But you are forgetting that if that's the offer, then trading with the Giants, you only have to move down 1, 2 or 3 spots.
very possibly.. However, I am starting to think that maybe they are looking to a team that is dumping their players (LAC)- JJ and two #1's for Herbert???
A guy can wish, right..
Maybe you're right...and Harbaugh wants a full reset, he's taking JJ at 5 and best WRs at 11 or 23.
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
·
9m
If you're the Patriots or the Cardinals, would you rather have No. 6 and 2025 1st rounder from Giants or No. 11 and No. 23 this year from Vikings?
If Giants want their QB bad enough and it takes their 1 from next year, do it.
That First Rounder next season could be the #1 overall pick in the Draft!
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In comment 16432890 Strahan91 said:
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In comment 16432884 AcidTest said:
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wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
I disagree. The Giants will be pretty bad too plus 6 vs 11 is a big drop-off in this draft. Plus the Giants *have* more they could add in that Minnesota doesn't. Minnesota is out a 2nd and 3rd this year and a 2nd next year. Doesn't mean the Giants should or will do it, but they could easily top Minnesota's best offer.
Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
TBH.
If you think Minnesota is going to suck this year that's a top 40 pick next year.
Or am I incorrect?
Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
You're ignoring the fact that even if you're right and those 3 picks are more valuable than the Giants' 3 picks, the Giants can add to their offer in ways the Vikings can't.
I got heat for saying the Giants would be fine with getting jumped. But IMO there is so much smoke around JJ, and “moving on from Jones”. At this point, it’s almost like the Giants wanted those narratives to get out there. Remember, Schoen is a smart guy - he’s not DG.
Seems like the target for Minn is #4. Wouldn’t make sense for it to be #5 this far out, as they could get jumped.
Wonder if the Chargers also knew the Minn trade as going to happen, and knew they’d get Harrison - which led to them being more comfortable trading Allen. I’m sure they’ve had discussions with Minnesota about #5, so wouldn’t be too far fetched for them to have an inside scoop.
I can't imagine the Pats moving out of 3 *until* they know they're not going to get their guy. They don't have a QB right now.
I suspect the Giants have a deal for that pick ready to go but they won't be able to pull the trigger until draft night.
The biggest thing we have going for us is that we still provide the softest landing for anyone in the top 5, all they have to do is move back to 6 and you're still getting a top 3 OT or WR or the best defensive player in the draft.
Also, The Giants could trade with SD and still get #4 QB.
I got heat for saying the Giants would be fine with getting jumped. But IMO there is so much smoke around JJ, and “moving on from Jones”. At this point, it’s almost like the Giants wanted those narratives to get out there. Remember, Schoen is a smart guy - he’s not DG.
Seems like the target for Minn is #4. Wouldn’t make sense for it to be #5 this far out, as they could get jumped.
Wonder if the Chargers also knew the Minn trade as going to happen, and knew they’d get Harrison - which led to them being more comfortable trading Allen. I’m sure they’ve had discussions with Minnesota about #5, so wouldn’t be too far fetched for them to have an inside scoop.
So Arizona is going to give up the chance to take Harrison?
They need to get a guy like Odunze, Nabors or Harrison. Those guys aren't falling to 11.
Correct
Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
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In comment 16432890 Strahan91 said:
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In comment 16432884 AcidTest said:
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wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I thought it was implied, but here:
Giants: #6, #47, #1 (2025).
Minnesota: #11, #23, #1 (2025).
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
The biggest thing we have going for us is that we still provide the softest landing for anyone in the top 5, all they have to do is move back to 6 and you're still getting a top 3 OT or WR or the best defensive player in the draft.
Need to get to 3 now. This idea some other posters talk about waiting until NE is on the clock is wrong. They need to get it done now and eliminate doubt of getting jumped.
The Giants need a QB. So do the Vikings - see how aggressive they are? There is no reason for the Giants to not come away with a QB.
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Agree to disagree. I think most teams would be willing to drop from #6 to #11 to get #23 and a #1 next year instead of #47. Six to eleven is only five spots.
But I also don't think Minnesota does this unless they are confident that doing so means they can move ahead of the Giants.
You're ignoring the fact that even if you're right and those 3 picks are more valuable than the Giants' 3 picks, the Giants can add to their offer in ways the Vikings can't.
I'm not ignoring it, I'm assuming that #6, #47, and next year's #1 is the most Schoen would offer to move up.
Why would they do that now?
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Going to have to make an offer they can't refuse. It's gotta get done now.
I can't imagine the Pats moving out of 3 *until* they know they're not going to get their guy. They don't have a QB right now.
I suspect the Giants have a deal for that pick ready to go but they won't be able to pull the trigger until draft night.
Probably true.
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
Vegas disagrees with you btw and the Vikings currently have Darnold playing QB. Minnesota has had a good offseason. They lost Hunter but added Greenard, Van Ginkel, Blake Cashman, and Aaron Jones so far. Their OL is already very solid and they're loaded at the skill positions.
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not sure who in the top 5 is signing up for that. Vikings may just want first crack at QB5 or if QB4 drops.
Why would they do that now?
It's possible Houston had another similar offer they would've taken
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Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
Thats highly questionable.
Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
Thats highly questionable.
How do you figure? Their OL is better and they have one of the best groups of skill position guys in the NFL. I don't even think it's close tbh
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TBH.
If you think Minnesota is going to suck this year that's a top 40 pick next year.
I guess. But they are dropping 20 spots to get a 2 next year? Fuck that
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not sure who in the top 5 is signing up for that. Vikings may just want first crack at QB5 or if QB4 drops.
Why would they do that now?
Good offer, and those don’t always stay in perpetuity. They liked the value and jumped on it. Why else would they have done it?
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In comment 16432890 Strahan91 said:
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wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I thought it was implied, but here:
Giants: #6, #47, #1 (2025).
Minnesota: #11, #23, #1 (2025).
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
You think Vikings are gonna offer their 1 next year when they just gave away their 2 next year? Definitely possible but a lot to give up to move up 5-8 spots IMO. I hope JS gets his guy
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I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
Vegas disagrees with you btw and the Vikings currently have Darnold playing QB. Minnesota has had a good offseason. They lost Hunter but added Greenard, Van Ginkel, Blake Cashman, and Aaron Jones so far. Their OL is already very solid and they're loaded at the skill positions.
Darnold is on a one year deal and is the ultimate journeyman QB. Isn't Minnesota his fourth team? My guess is the Vikings want a rookie QB who can sit behind Darnold for a year before taking over in 2025. They know the Giants are in the same situation. Lock is also on a one year deal and will likely start while a rookie QB learns before taking over next season. So the Vikings make this move to try and package #11 and #23 to move up ahead of the Giants.
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Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
Thats highly questionable.
How do you figure? Their OL is better and they have one of the best groups of skill position guys in the NFL. I don't even think it's close tbh
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
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not sure who in the top 5 is signing up for that. Vikings may just want first crack at QB5 or if QB4 drops.
Why would they do that now?
Good offer, and those don’t always stay in perpetuity. They liked the value and jumped on it. Why else would they have done it?
I don't buy that for a second because teams would not be looking for the 23rd pick unless they had a plan to use the 23rd pick. Why not wait until draft day and see how it is going. 23rd is so far out of the view that it almost makes no sense to trade for that now. My hunch is they have a second deal in place and were told that this is what they needed--so they had to go out and get something of this value and they looked for partners and here we are. There is no way they are saying, well if QB 4 or QB 5 slips to 23 a month out. They are not Houdini or Nostrodamus.
6>11
47<23
Giants 1st>Vikings 1st
@art_stapleton
·
9m
If you're the Patriots or the Cardinals, would you rather have No. 6 and 2025 1st rounder from Giants or No. 11 and No. 23 this year from Vikings?
If Giants want their QB bad enough and it takes their 1 from next year, do it.
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
Jones averaged 4.6 ypc this past year. What does how much Jefferson makes have to do with his talent? Addison is a star in the making, better than anything the Giants have and Hockenson for half a season is also better than anything the Giants have at TE.
Their OL is easily better. It's not even close. They were 3rd in pass block win rate this past season in the NFL and 19th in run block win rate. The Giants were 24th and 31st. I don't subscribe to PFF to see overall ranking but these are their tackles: Darrisaw's grade = 82.4 and O'Neill's = 74.5.
Allen coming out of college was not Caleb Williams.
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Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
Jones averaged 4.6 ypc this past year. What does how much Jefferson makes have to do with his talent? Addison is a star in the making, better than anything the Giants have and Hockenson for half a season is also better than anything the Giants have at TE.
Their OL is easily better. It's not even close. They were 3rd in pass block win rate this past season in the NFL and 19th in run block win rate. The Giants were 24th and 31st. I don't subscribe to PFF to see overall ranking but these are their tackles: Darrisaw's grade = 82.4 and O'Neill's = 74.5.
I stand corrected on the OL.
@JordanRaanan
·
13s
As one GM told me after the combine: There are four Top 10 QBs in this draft (including J.J. McCarthy).
The Minnesota Vikings are loading up with ammunition to make sure they get one.
The No. 4 pick, owned by the Arizona Cardinals, is one to watch. Maybe No. 3 (Patriots) too?
Or am I incorrect?
I don't get the logic?
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In comment 16432890 Strahan91 said:
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wouldn't want them to try, but I don't think the Giants could match three #1's. My guess is the maximum the Giants would offer to move up is #47 and our #1 next year. That is a lot less than three #1's. As I said, if Minnesota wants to do this, then let them do so. Getting into bidding wars for players is a terrible draft strategy. And none of Williams, Maye, Daniels, or McCarthy should be confused with Allen, Mahomes, Herbert, or Jackson. Stay at six or trade down.
The Giants 1st and 2nd rounders are more valuable than the 2 Minnesota 1's per this chart so they wouldn't have to match 3 1's necessarily. Minnesota also doesn't have a 2nd or 3rd this year or a 2nd next year Link - ( New Window )
I don't think a draft chart really matters much in this situation. Three #1's is better than #47 and our #1 next year IMO. Minnesota is likely to be very bad this year, so their #1 next year might well be a top 10 pick. (We could be as well, but I think our roster is better.)
Why are you counting 3 1s for Minnesota and not the Giants #6 this year?
I thought it was implied, but here:
Giants: #6, #47, #1 (2025).
Minnesota: #11, #23, #1 (2025).
I'd rather have what Minnesota is offering. First round picks have a fifth year option, and I think there is a high likelihood that Minnesota's #1 could be a top five pick next year. The Giants have made additions that might well make them a middle of the pack team next year.
But you are forgetting that if that's the offer, then trading with the Giants, you only have to move down 1, 2 or 3 spots.
A guy can wish, right..
Maybe you're right...and Harbaugh wants a full reset, he's taking JJ at 5 and best WRs at 11 or 23.
@JordanRaanan
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13s
As one GM told me after the combine: There are four Top 10 QBs in this draft (including J.J. McCarthy).
The Minnesota Vikings are loading up with ammunition to make sure they get one.
The No. 4 pick, owned by the Arizona Cardinals, is one to watch. Maybe No. 3 (Patriots) too?
The Giants need a QB. There is no reason to come out of this draft with no QB. None.
[quote] In comment 16432966 Strahan91 said:
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In comment 16432963 Sammo85 said:
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Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
Thats highly questionable.
How do you figure? Their OL is better and they have one of the best groups of skill position guys in the NFL. I don't even think it's close tbh
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp. [/quote
The Giants OL allowed 85 sacks last year. The Vikings OL allowed 47 sacks.
Aaron Jones averaged 4.6 YPC in the regular season last year. Then in 2 playoff games averaged 5.8 YPC. Not sure that's considered "cooked"
TJ Hockenson probably won't miss any time next year.
And I agree the time to execute a move is sooner rather than later. There is no advantage in waiting at this point. It's a QB arms race.
@art_stapleton
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9m
If you're the Patriots or the Cardinals, would you rather have No. 6 and 2025 1st rounder from Giants or No. 11 and No. 23 this year from Vikings?
If Giants want their QB bad enough and it takes their 1 from next year, do it.
That First Rounder next season could be the #1 overall pick in the Draft!
Quote:
In comment 16432963 Sammo85 said:
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Absolutely. And not to put too fine a point on it, but the Vikings would seem to have a roster that better suits a rookie QB starter than the Giants.
Thats highly questionable.
How do you figure? Their OL is better and they have one of the best groups of skill position guys in the NFL. I don't even think it's close tbh
Aaron Jones is cooked. Hockenson is hurt and going to miss huge chunk of time. Jefferson is about to become the most overpaid WR diva in NFL history.
Their OL is not better - it sucks and got Cousins beat to a pulp.
The Giants OL allowed 85 sacks last year. The Vikings OL allowed 47 sacks.
Aaron Jones averaged 4.6 YPC in the regular season last year. Then in 2 playoff games averaged 5.8 YPC. Not sure that's considered "cooked"
TJ Hockenson probably won't miss any time next year.