NFL bans the hip drop.

Only are acceptable to it if you feel these penalties and injuries happen because the defensive players do it deliberately.

League wants more scoring. And they didn't have that in 2023.

are not bad plays- rapping and rolling will be called a hip drop in live speed- they need to make it reviewable the first year and these guys suck at calling false starts i cant imagine how bad this is

I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind.

As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off.

I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul.

There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety.

In comment 16445383 christian said:

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I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind. As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off. I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul. There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety.

You can catch a defender from behind still. You just can't catch him and roll him under your body.

In comment 16445380 hitdog42 said:

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are not bad plays- rapping and rolling will be called a hip drop in live speed- they need to make it reviewable the first year and these guys suck at calling false starts i cant imagine how bad this is

I agree with this. They should be able to call a review on every called penalty.

In comment 16445389 Jerz44 said:

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In comment 16445380 hitdog42 said: Quote: are not bad plays- rapping and rolling will be called a hip drop in live speed- they need to make it reviewable the first year and these guys suck at calling false starts i cant imagine how bad this is I agree with this. They should be able to call a review on every called penalty.

It is not practical to have something like "material restriction" element being reviewable because that is subjective. However, objective elements of a penalty should be reviewable.

Imho

because one team can do it better than the others or at least that is how that team has spinned it.

for an ugly September of football. Missed tackles galore.

This is going to be a nightmare to officiate. Anther own goal but the nfl.

is now a 15-yard penalty and automatic first down.

There are going to be zillions of plays in which a defender gets 2 hands on the ball carrier but never brings him down.

asking officials to enforce this in a league full of bad tackling.

meaning if you use your body on his legs as dead weight to get the runner down, it is a hip drop tackle. I am not saying I agree with the new rule, but I do not think it will be hard to call or spot.

In comment 16445438 Festina Lente said:

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This is going to be a nightmare to officiate. Anther own goal but the nfl.

This is where I'm at with this. Adds more subjectivity into officiating, in a league where officiating is already questionable at best on most days.

The officials certainly gave everything under control now, I'm sure they'll manage this seamlessly. Fucking clowns.

Where is the league at with short rest weeks and extending the schedule. I mean it's the same topic right?

If the rule is anything like this, it will be easy to enforce like a horse collar. The critical point is dropping your weight on the ball carrier's legs. That's what creates the unsafe movement.
link - ( New Window )

In comment 16445383 christian said:

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I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind. As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off. I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul. There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety.

The 15 yards on PI is a TERRIBLE idea. It incentives a DB to just grab any receiver who blows by him to prevent a big play. In other words, you are penalizing the receiver from making a move to juke the defender and get by him.

Despite what you and others think, NO ONE under the age of 30 is going to watch a defensive slug fest. If you want to kill the game by making bad decisions that hurt the long term viability of the game, be my guest. But the NFL has correctly determined that to survive, it needs to appeal to the under 30 crowd. If you don't like that, too bad- the game isn't targetted at you anymore.

I agree with it.

One thing I will say is that no matter what rules they change, the defenses always catch up.

It won’t effect the play in the long run but the refs maybe will just stink some more.

where you grab the player from the hips, from behind, and land on the back of the lower legs and ankles, looked dangerous. Not sure how defenders avoid such tackles in the heat and speed of action though.

This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles.

In comment 16445554 JOrthman said:

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This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles.

The league and their partners in the gambling ventures are banking on it.

In comment 16445554 JOrthman said:

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This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles.

This isn't true. This doesn't happen by accident. Just watch the rugby league video. You are purposley dropping your weight on the legs of a carrier to bring them down.

In rugby's case, you can still use your body weight to bring someone down, it's just avoiding trapping of the legs.

Think of it similar to the driving the QB into the ground rule. It wasn't a hard adjustment for players to not drive their full body weight into the ground.

It’s obvious what a hip drop is. It’s not hard to officiate. It’s a very dangerous play. I assume you want the horse collar tackle back as well? A hip drop tackle is wrapping and using your body weight to slide under the ball carrier pulling downward while getting his legs caught up under you. It’s a guaranteed high ankle sprain or broken leg. Anyone who disagrees with this just doesn’t understand what it is. How about form tackling as opposed to wrap and drag

In comment 16445554 JOrthman said:

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This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles.

Red Grange, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell etc etc etc all survived the "hip drop" but now it's a problem.

Put flags on them and be done with it.

Eagles GM Howie Roseman knew this hip drop tackle rule change was coming.

He knew the NFL was going to make it tough to tackle players in 2024 and beyond.

…which is exactly why he broke his tendency and finally paid a lot of money to a RB in Saquon Barkley this offseason.

But you must be delicate while doing so….ok

it will be 2-hand touch!

Pursuit tackling from behind any more?

In comment 16445449 Gman11 said:

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is now a 15-yard penalty and automatic first down.

Ha ha! Yep

In comment 16445658 HomerJones45 said:

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In comment 16445554 JOrthman said: Quote: This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles. Red Grange, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell etc etc etc all survived the "hip drop" but now it's a problem. Put flags on them and be done with it.

Might want to take a look at Earl Campbells condition later in life. A little emphasis on player safety would have helped

In comment 16445505 rich in DC said:

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In comment 16445383 christian said: Quote: I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind. As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off. I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul. There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety. The 15 yards on PI is a TERRIBLE idea. It incentives a DB to just grab any receiver who blows by him to prevent a big play. In other words, you are penalizing the receiver from making a move to juke the defender and get by him. Despite what you and others think, NO ONE under the age of 30 is going to watch a defensive slug fest. If you want to kill the game by making bad decisions that hurt the long term viability of the game, be my guest. But the NFL has correctly determined that to survive, it needs to appeal to the under 30 crowd. If you don't like that, too bad- the game isn't targetted at you anymore.

Yeah,this thing that you have loved all your life? Give it up. It's not for you any more.

Jesus.

In comment 16445777 Blueworm said:

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In comment 16445505 rich in DC said: Quote: In comment 16445383 christian said: Quote: I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind. As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off. I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul. There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety. The 15 yards on PI is a TERRIBLE idea. It incentives a DB to just grab any receiver who blows by him to prevent a big play. In other words, you are penalizing the receiver from making a move to juke the defender and get by him. Despite what you and others think, NO ONE under the age of 30 is going to watch a defensive slug fest. If you want to kill the game by making bad decisions that hurt the long term viability of the game, be my guest. But the NFL has correctly determined that to survive, it needs to appeal to the under 30 crowd. If you don't like that, too bad- the game isn't targetted at you anymore. Yeah,this thing that you have loved all your life? Give it up. It's not for you any more. Jesus.

there's is likely something in between "give it up" and "keep it exactly the same". What Rich was saying is that there are likely analytics that clearly say what people like to watch vs what they don't like to watch. They're likely making changes that align with their long term survival. Whether or not we like it, is one thing. Whether or not it makes sense for them long term is hardly something you or I can know from this distance.

In comment 16445500 BH28 said:

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If the rule is anything like this, it will be easy to enforce like a horse collar. The critical point is dropping your weight on the ball carrier's legs. That's what creates the unsafe movement. link - ( New Window )

Bingo.

In comment 16445383 christian said:

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I'm in favor of banning the hip drop. But I hear the other side of the argument that this basically keeps a defender from catching a ball carrier from behind. As much as I love offense, the competitive balance is way off. I'd like to see defenders be able to make contact with pass catchers up to 10 yards, and I'd like to see pass interference become a 15 yard penalty, not a spot foul. There are ways to maintain balance that don't impact safety.

This is the height of stupidity. The only alternative now to tackling a guy from behind when he's running is to dive at his legs, i.e., knees. If you think the hip drop is bad, just wait.

In comment 16445597 BH28 said:

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In comment 16445554 JOrthman said: Quote: This is one of those plays where no one intends for it to happen in real time. I hate that it's going to be regulated as I think it's only going to lead to more missed tackles. This isn't true. This doesn't happen by accident. Just watch the rugby league video. You are purposley dropping your weight on the legs of a carrier to bring them down. In rugby's case, you can still use your body weight to bring someone down, it's just avoiding trapping of the legs. Think of it similar to the driving the QB into the ground rule. It wasn't a hard adjustment for players to not drive their full body weight into the ground.

I disagree. When you're chasing a guy from behind and grab him you're both running on the same plane. Even if you don't drop your hips your upper body is going to fall on his legs. This will be way more difficult to avoid than hitting the QB square and not landing on him.

I would wager there will be just as many knee injuries from guys diving at ballcarriers from behind. There is a reason you can't hit a guy below the waist, either from the front or back, when blocking. Now you will have defenders doing exactly that from behind - while grabbing the guy being hit.

they can croon about player safety all that want and it is BS.

Refs are going to be wrong plenty of times when they have to call this in live action. Just no other way around it.

Link - ( New Window )

...identifying them on the whole as, "A hip drop tackle is wrapping and using your body weight to slide under the ball carrier pulling downward while getting his legs caught up under you," is IMV inaccurate.

Usually they are done as a defender is grabbing a guy from behind and simply using their body weight to bring the ballcarrier down. Sliding under the player sometimes is the result.

While I realize that intent is not relevant when calling the foul, I'd bet that the refs have a hard time calling this one equally, play to play.