From a strictly practical standpoint, the bridge in the water is blocking a very busy harbor, and the million plus cars a year that cross that bridge have to find alternate routes. It's going to be chaos for a long time.
20+ construction workers on the bridge at the time. Horrific.
I live in Florida and it's reminiscent of the Sunshine Skyway bridge in St. Pete disaster from years ago (well before I moved here), but that story is that the weather produced a zero visibility event and totally got the captain turned around.
This looked like a clear night from the videos. Absolutely horrifying.
and I can only imagine what it's going to do to traffic and commuters in that area for awhile.
It will be bad, tunnels will be packed. Also any vehicle with hazmat will have to drive around the other side of the beltway. Port will be shut down for weeks.
with what you read and what you believe. this is the time people seize on emotions, when something happens that is bewildering and tragic, and people are susceptible. in any way and from any source.
prayers for the victims, who sound mostly like construction workers on the bridge.
RE: RE: From the live feed video, it looked like the ship purposely hit
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
Horrible tragedy … aside from the human elemen, 2 immediate questions.
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
The bridge is over a mile long. Somebody did some quick thinking
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
RE: RE: Horrible tragedy … aside from the human elemen, 2 immediate questions.
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
West side of the beltway or eastern shore to Annapolis bay bridge
RE: RE: RE: Horrible tragedy … aside from the human elemen, 2 immediate questions.
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
West side of the beltway or eastern shore to Annapolis bay bridge
Annapolis bridge to Kent Island...yeah, could not remember the name -
But how close was the part of the bridge that it was supposed to go under, or over I guess if there are tunnels. I can’t get a grasp on how far off target this thing was.
But how close was the part of the bridge that it was supposed to go under, or over I guess if there are tunnels. I can’t get a grasp on how far off target this thing was.
have you seen the video, looks like it was supposed to go between the stanchions and it hit a stanchion (or whatever they are called for bridges - stanchion is the hockey rink term).
The ship lost power... regained power started steering past the support, then lost power again, regained power then lost it and regained power just as it hit the support. You could see smoke coming out of the back of the ship before it lost power the 2nd time.
But how close was the part of the bridge that it was supposed to go under, or over I guess if there are tunnels. I can’t get a grasp on how far off target this thing was.
The support section is caller a pier...simply the ship lost power(generators shut down for some reason which will come out) and drifted out of the channel and hit the pier causing the whole thing to collapse.
live near Baltimore. It's a terrible tragedy. Rescue operations are underway in a desperate search for survivors. Prayers to them and their families and friends.
But how close was the part of the bridge that it was supposed to go under, or over I guess if there are tunnels. I can’t get a grasp on how far off target this thing was.
to stop the traffic, or there would have been hundreds of cars in the water.
There's a big Transit Police Station right on the East side of the bridge, so traffic could be shut off very quickly on that end. The other side is a different story.
Once it lost power, it lost any ability to control its movements. There's no way to stop it. The crewmen must have been absolutely sick, knowing what was going to happen and being powerless to do anything about it.
RE: RE: The bridge is over a mile long. Somebody did some quick thinking
to stop the traffic, or there would have been hundreds of cars in the water.
There were still sporadic cars going over right before the ship hit it.
Yeah at 1:30 there weren't that many cars and it is doubtful anybody(cops) were even notified of imminent accident. Perhaps USCG was notified of power outage, but I doubt it happened as pilot and crew were scrambling to do something effective.
It's going to be a massive bill for someone. Probably an insurance company. This might put them out of business.
Without getting too knee deep into maritime law, the moving ship is responsible when it hits a stationary object. Owner of at-fault vessel will be responsible (and thus their insurer).
It's going to be a massive bill for someone. Probably an insurance company. This might put them out of business.
Without getting too knee deep into maritime law, the moving ship is responsible when it hits a stationary object. Owner of at-fault vessel will be responsible (and thus their insurer).
Yep all proportional to amount of the fault of each party in the incident that the court assigns...
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
Good info - EDG kicking in would explain the thick smoke.
RE: RE: RE: RE: From the live feed video, it looked like the ship purposely hit
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
Good info - EDG kicking in would explain the thick smoke.
No EDG is small, maybe a V-8 truck size engine about 300kw. That big plume was either the main generators starting or the main engine starting. My guess is the main (propulsion) engine as the lights were already back on and the size of the plume.
The main generators are the size of locomotive engines - about 3000kw (IIRC) - varies according to design and expected load of ship.
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
The ship definitely lost power a couple of times before hitting the stanchion. It also appeared like there was smoke billowing out of the rear of the ship. Awful tragedy.
Shipping Cargo will go through either Philly or Norfolk until the bridge remnants are removed from the channel. Some may go through Wilmington Delaware - depends on size of ship and draft....
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
From a strictly practical standpoint, the bridge in the water is blocking a very busy harbor, and the million plus cars a year that cross that bridge have to find alternate routes. It's going to be chaos for a long time.
20+ construction workers on the bridge at the time. Horrific.
I live in Florida and it's reminiscent of the Sunshine Skyway bridge in St. Pete disaster from years ago (well before I moved here), but that story is that the weather produced a zero visibility event and totally got the captain turned around.
This looked like a clear night from the videos. Absolutely horrifying.
It will be bad, tunnels will be packed. Also any vehicle with hazmat will have to drive around the other side of the beltway. Port will be shut down for weeks.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
prayers for the victims, who sound mostly like construction workers on the bridge.
Quote:
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
Quote:
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
West side of the beltway or eastern shore to Annapolis bay bridge
Quote:
In comment 16446264 Spider56 said:
Quote:
1. Don’t large ships use tugs to guide them until they’re out of the harbor?
2. What will be the re-routing options for HAZMAT and other vehicles that can’t take the tunnels? Major traffic implications.
No, tugs are released once the ship is faired up in the channel.
Yes, that is a major re-routing - Rte 50 bridge? Around I-95?
West side of the beltway or eastern shore to Annapolis bay bridge
Annapolis bridge to Kent Island...yeah, could not remember the name -
have you seen the video, looks like it was supposed to go between the stanchions and it hit a stanchion (or whatever they are called for bridges - stanchion is the hockey rink term).
Link - ( New Window )
The support section is caller a pier...simply the ship lost power(generators shut down for some reason which will come out) and drifted out of the channel and hit the pier causing the whole thing to collapse.
An illustration:
There were still sporadic cars going over right before the ship hit it.
There's a big Transit Police Station right on the East side of the bridge, so traffic could be shut off very quickly on that end. The other side is a different story.
Quote:
to stop the traffic, or there would have been hundreds of cars in the water.
There were still sporadic cars going over right before the ship hit it.
Yeah at 1:30 there weren't that many cars and it is doubtful anybody(cops) were even notified of imminent accident. Perhaps USCG was notified of power outage, but I doubt it happened as pilot and crew were scrambling to do something effective.
Without getting too knee deep into maritime law, the moving ship is responsible when it hits a stationary object. Owner of at-fault vessel will be responsible (and thus their insurer).
Quote:
It's going to be a massive bill for someone. Probably an insurance company. This might put them out of business.
Without getting too knee deep into maritime law, the moving ship is responsible when it hits a stationary object. Owner of at-fault vessel will be responsible (and thus their insurer).
Yep all proportional to amount of the fault of each party in the incident that the court assigns...
Link - ( New Window )
Seriously??
Quote:
In comment 16446224 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
Good info - EDG kicking in would explain the thick smoke.
Quote:
In comment 16446247 M.S. said:
Quote:
In comment 16446224 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
That is exactly what happened. They lost the generators for some reason. I have had it happen several times. Lose electricity and you lose everything.. steering, main engine, lights. Totally helpless. Takes several minutes to get the generators on line, reset the pumps and machinery and get the main engine to restart. And it is pitch dark in the engine room until the EDG comes on line (emergency Diesel generator).
The emergency Diesel generator takes about 20-30 seconds to sense total electrical failure and powers ups some essential machinery, like lights and the smaller machines necessary to restart the main gennies....
Good info - EDG kicking in would explain the thick smoke.
No EDG is small, maybe a V-8 truck size engine about 300kw. That big plume was either the main generators starting or the main engine starting. My guess is the main (propulsion) engine as the lights were already back on and the size of the plume.
The main generators are the size of locomotive engines - about 3000kw (IIRC) - varies according to design and expected load of ship.
I am not sure if you are serious...but the video is sped up as you can see by the traffic on the bridge. It is likely a helicopter or plane.
Quote:
the support beam. It was almost a direct hit. I don't see how anyone steering the ship could be that off.
The bridge immediately came down. Those poor people driving on the bridge at that time.
Is it possible the container ship lost power? No steering?
The ship definitely lost power a couple of times before hitting the stanchion. It also appeared like there was smoke billowing out of the rear of the ship. Awful tragedy.
If bridge broken, car no go.
Quote:
Is what this means for cargo on the East Coast.
If bridge broken, car no go.
Well done!
Shipping Cargo will go through either Philly or Norfolk until the bridge remnants are removed from the channel. Some may go through Wilmington Delaware - depends on size of ship and draft....