Lock becomes our starting quarterback and no first round qb.

of 7 or 8 wins

I don't think they'll be all that much better or worse than they were last year.

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Probably a season over by October 1st, per usual. That said, I’d rather see Lock out there if no QB is drafted. Fuck it.

We’re a 4-6 win. Obviously not the greatest outcome, but it gives a chance to get a top pick in 2025 for a QB.

there is no guarantee we are going to be starting a rookie draft pick or that we will take one in the 1st round.

but a better than average offensive line means you always have a shot. Expect 6 or 7 wins, with an outside chance at the playoffs. A healthy DJ all year and I expect 8 to 9 wins with a good chance at the playoffs, and a marginal chance at being an actual contender.

Anywhere from 4-13 to 7-10.

The question of what the QB plan is if they didn't draft one probably deserves its own thread.

I think if they draft a QB and start him from day one there's a potential for more than 7 wins.

In comment 16466476 Go Terps said:

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I think if they draft a QB and start him from day one there's a potential for more than 7 wins.

I don't think they would start him from day, whether it's Maye or Daniels.

In comment 16466465 DefenseWins said:

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there is no guarantee we are going to be starting a rookie draft pick or that we will take one in the 1st round.

There is no guarantee they will draft a rookie in round 1?

In comment 16466476 Go Terps said:

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I think if they draft a QB and start him from day one there's a potential for more than 7 wins.

I agree on the roster part. There are too many folks here acting like this roster is just empty. In fact it is better at many spots than it was in 2022.

Someone else pointed out how the Giants of the past had great Dlines and Lb's but not necessarily the best CB's or S's.. Every team has areas of weaknesses. Our defense has some holes but the talent and the youth, is there.

Offense, assuming the Oline is better needs a QB.. Adding WR's to an average to very below average QB group doesn't move the needle.

which QB needy teams will have a worse record next year is another interesting question?

In comment 16466483 k2tampa said:

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In comment 16466465 DefenseWins said: Quote: there is no guarantee we are going to be starting a rookie draft pick or that we will take one in the 1st round. There is no guarantee they will draft a rookie in round 1?

I believe it's guaranteed they will draft a rookie in round 1 because veterans aren't eligible for the draft.

And transform Josh Allen into an accurate passer, why can't he substantially elevate Drew Lock, who has had precisely the same problems as Josh Allen in terms of a cannon arm limited by accuracy issues? So I am actually guardedly optimistic that Lock can actually be a competent starter for this team in 2024. Naturally, I'd prefer Maye or Daniels starting, but if not, a Lock to Nabers/Slayton/Hyatt vertical passing game could he interesting.

Either way, I am expecting this team to win 5-7 games as year zero in the "post DJ Era" rebuild, no matter who the quarterback is. And likely getting a top ten draft pick again in 2025.

I'll carry over the logic from the Daboll thread since it's more applicable here -- I'd project the offense to be about as potent as it was the last 2/3 of 2023. Somewhere around 18 PPG.

I think the incremental improvements to the offensive line and blocking TEs are roughly offset by losing Barkley, losing Taylor's running ability, and potentially losing Waller.

If the Giants are scoring 18 PPG my guess is they are in the 5-7 won category.

But directionally it’s conceivable that the Giants win more games with Lock starting vs. a rookie QB starting who was drafted in Round One.

In comment 16466513 Gman11 said:

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In comment 16466483 k2tampa said: Quote: In comment 16466465 DefenseWins said: Quote: there is no guarantee we are going to be starting a rookie draft pick or that we will take one in the 1st round. There is no guarantee they will draft a rookie in round 1? I believe it's guaranteed they will draft a rookie in round 1 because veterans aren't eligible for the draft.

You are adding your TYPICAL valuable insight.

I hope that they at least settle on who's going to play in camp and give the players some serious experience in the pre-season. If you play them in pre-season you risk injury, but if you don't play them they you see them learning in games that count what to what the left side of the line does when the defensive line runs a twist at them.

Going out there and balling out just for all the unlocked puns

He is the starter.
With a better roster, we can get to 9 wins.
Book it!

Loved him at Mizz; had him ranked as the second best QB in that draft ahead of Jones. I suspect the Bills front office had it that way as well, hence not a coincidence he’s here. People in Denver wanted him back and people in Seattle ALSO wanted him back. I think this kid is a hidden gem and when he takes over this offense is going to EXPLODE!!!

Sometimes I wonder if some people on this board truly get it or just want to complain and talk doom all the time. So I see some think we are a 4-5 win team. Ok short memory. Do you realize that last season we won 6 games with basically no offensive line and a 3rd string QB. We easily could have won 8-9 games with a bit of luck. Jet game if SB does not fumble or Gano did not have a bad knee. The Buffalo game cam down to one play and so did the Ram game. So we improve the OL, maybe get a stud receiver and improve our pass rush at a minimum and we are going to be worse than last year? Not saying we are going to win 11-12 games but winning 9 or so is not out of the question.

Quarterback position, we lose more and more fans to other teams.

When we had Eli, we were a team to watch, to play on prime time even during the bad years. Since then, we have been uninspiring, flat and stale. Reese and Gettleman stewarded us through some pretty terrible years of embarrassment and embarrasing football.

To set that straight, we need to get a signal caller that will bring back the thrill of watching Giants football. I don't know who that is......but I remember the horror of Dave Brown, Danny Kanell & Kent Graham and it is hard to believe that we are back in that QB Hell again.

In comment 16466697 Bruner4329 said:

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Sometimes I wonder if some people on this board truly get it or just want to complain and talk doom all the time. So I see some think we are a 4-5 win team. Ok short memory. Do you realize that last season we won 6 games with basically no offensive line and a 3rd string QB. We easily could have won 8-9 games with a bit of luck. Jet game if SB does not fumble or Gano did not have a bad knee. The Buffalo game cam down to one play and so did the Ram game. So we improve the OL, maybe get a stud receiver and improve our pass rush at a minimum and we are going to be worse than last year? Not saying we are going to win 11-12 games but winning 9 or so is not out of the question.

So now we count losses as wins? Could we not have also lost to Arizona, New England, Green Bay or does this curve only work for Giants?

In comment 16466699 GiantBlue said:

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Quarterback position, we lose more and more fans to other teams. When we had Eli, we were a team to watch, to play on prime time even during the bad years. Since then, we have been uninspiring, flat and stale. Reese and Gettleman stewarded us through some pretty terrible years of embarrassment and embarrasing football. To set that straight, we need to get a signal caller that will bring back the thrill of watching Giants football. I don't know who that is......but I remember the horror of Dave Brown, Danny Kanell & Kent Graham and it is hard to believe that we are back in that QB Hell again.

Giants are going to win just enough games this season to be out of range of a top 2025 QB, same as this year.

Is the new OL coach able to “fix” Neal and select the starting 5 early so they can develop some cohesion?

Is the new DC able to develop a pass rush without regularly blitzing and able to regularly stop the run?

The above are worth 2 to 5 wins above last year’s total.

With better OL play and a true #1 receiver are the Giants able to put a significant number of add’l points per game on the board (6 to 12 pts)?

In many ways, I think Locke fits what Daboll wants to do, which is stretch the field, vertically.
Jones can't and won't (for several reasons, getting the snot beaten out of him is one).
Locke is going to make more mistakes than you want, but he'll make big plays down the field too.
How many games won?? I hate predictions, but I would think the passing game will be more productive.
If they can get to even 21 points per game avg. they should be competitive all year.

In comment 16466458 Sean said:

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You can't force a QB pick! If one is not there this year, you just take a WR and get one in 2025...when for some reason that is no longer forcing a QB pick???

/s

no matter who is at qb - 8-9 wins. outside chance at wild card

Year: 2018

Josh Allen Wyoming 62 (Left) 62 (Right) (a-t record)
Baker Mayfield Oklahoma 59 (Left) 60 (Right)
Josh Rosen UCLA 57 (Left) 59 (Right)
Tanner Lee Nebraska 56 (Left) 57 (Right)
Kurt Benkert Virginia 55 (Left) 56 (Right)
Danny Etling LSU 54 (Left) 56 (Right)
Nic Shimonek Texas Tech 55 (Left) 55 (Right)
Chase Litton Marshall 53 (Left) 55 (Right)
Mike White Western Kentucky 53 (Left) 55 (Right)
Austin Allen Arkansas 53 (Left) 54 (Right)
Riley Ferguson Memphis 52 (Left) 54 (Right)
JT Barrett Ohio State 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Luke Falk Washington State 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Kyle Lauletta Richmond 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Mason Rudolph Oklahoma State 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Logan Woodside Toledo 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Quinton Flowers South Florida 49 (Left) 49 (Right)
Lamar Jackson Louisville 49 (Left) 49 (Right)
Sam Darnold Southern Cal did not throw


Year: 2019

Will Grier West Virginia 58 (Left) 59 (Right)
Brett Rypien Boise State 59 (Left) 56 (Right)
Clayton Thorson Northwestern 58 (Left) 56 (Right)
Nick Fitzgerald Mississippi State 57 (Left) 52 (Right)
Jordan Ta'amu Mississippi 56 (Left) 55 (Right)
Gardner Minshew Washington State 55 (Left) 53 (Right)
Ryan Finley North Carolina State 55 (Left) 52 (Right)
Tyree Jackson Buffalo 54 (Left) 54 (Right)
Daniel Jones Duke 53 (Left) 54 (Right)
Drew Lock Missouri 54 (Left) 53 (Right)
Easton Stick North Dakota State 53 (Left) 54 (Right)
Jake Browning Washington 54 (Left) 52 (Right)
Trace McSorley Penn State 53 (Left) 52 (Right)
Jarrett Stidham Auburn 53 (Left) 52 (Right)
Dwayne Haskins Ohio State 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Kyle Shurmer Vanderbilt 52 (Left) 50 (Right)
Kyler Murray Oklahoma did not throw

These are the facts, jacks. Drew Lock is not Josh Allen, and it's not close.

Drew Lock is Daniel Jones. They tested as JAGs and they've been JAGs.

link - ( New Window )

Lock and DJ are basically the same, although it seems from my unofficial pov that Lock tries to throw down the field more.

injuries, lousy defense, and other issues that impacted the team last season, the Giants were a few plays away from winning nine games. With an improved offensive line, a better run defense, a few more players, and fewer key injuries, don't it's crazy to think they could make a few more plays that could win a few more games.

Lock plays the season and goes 9-8; sneaks into a WC spot and lose. Lock plays like a QB in the 16-20 range and Giants have a poor draft position for a QB and know that Lock is nothing more than a JAG, but they have to sign him to a $15M/year deal...

2025=2023

Another 5 years of mediocrity

Will Grier West Virginia 58 (Left) 59 (Right)
Josh Rosen UCLA 57 (Left) 59 (Right)
Daniel Jones Duke 53 (Left) 54 (Right)
Drew Lock Missouri 54 (Left) 53 (Right)
Lamar Jackson Louisville 49 (Left) 49 (Right)

And your correlation between throwing speed and whether a QB is a JAG or not is what exactly?

In comment 16466931 Trainmaster said:

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Will Grier West Virginia 58 (Left) 59 (Right) Josh Rosen UCLA 57 (Left) 59 (Right) Daniel Jones Duke 53 (Left) 54 (Right) Drew Lock Missouri 54 (Left) 53 (Right) Lamar Jackson Louisville 49 (Left) 49 (Right) And your correlation between throwing speed and whether a QB is a JAG or not is what exactly?

Literally the dumbest QB test ever. As if they are pitchers or something. Some of the guys with the lowest ‘velocity’ had canons. Lamar, Tyree Jackson, Haskins etc. Lock has an ROCKET I don’t care what this stupid test says.

In comment 16466931 Trainmaster said:

Quote:

Will Grier West Virginia 58 (Left) 59 (Right) Josh Rosen UCLA 57 (Left) 59 (Right) Daniel Jones Duke 53 (Left) 54 (Right) Drew Lock Missouri 54 (Left) 53 (Right) Lamar Jackson Louisville 49 (Left) 49 (Right) And your correlation between throwing speed and whether a QB is a JAG or not is what exactly?

There are a lot of QBs with strong arms who aren't successful.

QBs who don't demonstrate a strong arm when tested and turn out to be a success in the NFL are rare.

Lamar Jackson is an exception, no doubt. Obviously his running ability has been a very large part of his success.

In comment 16466476 Go Terps said:

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I think if they draft a QB and start him from day one there's a potential for more than 7 wins.

You are far too smart to not see that neither Maye nor McCarthy will be starting this year, most likely. Perhaps 4-6 starts is where they will be at best. I do see that either would be ready for the NFL.

Perhaps Penix could start earlier.

Now to the OP - without knowing the rest of the picks(RB?, OG?, DT?) and with an improved line perhaps 8-9 wins. They won 6 games last year with a vicious schedule, no QB and no Oline...

We're probably going to see DJ or Lock begin the year as the starter. They did it with Eli and DJ and it's not like a rookie is coming into an offense with a lot of continuity or stars to help him get his feet wet. Probably better to let a veteran take the early season lumps and let the kid learn on the sidelines for as long as possible.

In comment 16467224 Walker Gillette said:

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We're probably going to see DJ or Lock begin the year as the starter. They did it with Eli and DJ and it's not like a rookie is coming into an offense with a lot of continuity or stars to help him get his feet wet. Probably better to let a veteran take the early season lumps and let the kid learn on the sidelines for as long as possible.

I think it's a given that the wouldn't start a rookie to begin the season. Dane Brugler said Caleb Williams is probably the only QB that he sees with the ability to start from day one.