Kerry Collins question

I was banging the table for Gallery as well! Thought we had everything but a LT and we were good to go. I also really wanted Sean Taylor as well. Good thing I'm not a GM lol.

he did get an extension before the 2002 season, it was a 2 year deal that ran through the 2004 season. But his career was really tied to Fassel.

Once Fassel was out after 2003 and Coughlin came in and Collins was turning 32 before the 2004 season. It was pretty clear to see the Giants were going to go QB in that draft so Coughlin could build around his new QB.

As I recall, Wellington wasn't happy about drafting Collins' replacement and begrudgingly told Accorsi to do what he needed to, but he liked Collins because he led the Giants to a Super Bowl and all the adversity he overcame.

I also remember the Giants offering him the chance to mentor their new QB (in this case Eli). Coming into his contract year, Collins didn't want to do that and asked for his release, so the Giants granted that, which opened the door for Kurt Warner who was a June 1st cut and was looking for a job.

Man, did he have an arm.

As one of us born in the early to mid 80s, I have a very strong appreciation for Kerry Collins. Our entire childhood was bullshit Dave Brown, Kent Graham, Danny Kannell. Just garbage. It felt like we were never, going to be good. The Kerry and Fassel came in, we were good for the first time in our lives. It always pisses me off when people shit on Kerry and Fassel. No one is saying they are Brady and Belichick, but dont act entitled to that shit after some of the shit we trotted out there the entire decade of the 90s.

Collins was picked up on a "what do we have to lose" scenario based on really bad QB play over the not to recent past. His physical talent wasn't in question but he was a hot mess otherwise. I don't know who got into his head to straighten him out but it happened fast and the Giants seemed to ride the wave for as long as they could. I think it was considered a lower cost/good performance thing because to draft someone during that time may not have outweighed what became a reliable commodity until Fassel eroded the team. I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season. There was a good QB class coming out for '04 and the rest is history. So, there initially wasn't a clear expectation when he was picked up but became a pleasant surprise. For a while there, the Giants were putting up some points.

But I was so disappointed in that Super Bowl against the Ravens. It wasn't just him it was the whole team never showed up.

In comment 16468810 MNP70 said:

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I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season.

This absolutely, definitely, did not happen.

about drafting Gallery unless it was after the fact. I think fans, myself included, were thinking of Coughlin coming into his Giants tenure like he came into his time with the Jaguars, and that was by drafting an elite left tackle like Tony Boselli.

Obviously, Gallery didn't even sniff that hype, and 2 Super Bowl wins later...

In comment 16468814 Blue21 said:

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But I was so disappointed in that Super Bowl against the Ravens. It wasn't just him it was the whole team never showed up.

It’s still baffles me to this day why Fassel did not bench KC for Jason Garrett in the Super Bowl after Kerry dislocated his shoulder or whatever injury he suffered halfway through the game

If given maximum time in the pocket he could pick apart any defense. Put big pressure on him and his happy feet would render him totally ineffective. Remember him in the super bowl

He simply wore out his welcome in Carolina. People forget 2 years before coning to NY he took the expansion Carolina Panyhers to the Conference Championship game and went to the pro bowl. Had a gun for an arm and had one of the best playoff games I have seen a QB have in that 41-0 drubbing of the Vikings.He went 28-39 for 381 yards with 5 TD passes.

In comment 16468804 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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Man, did he have an arm.

His deep passes were as pretty as anyone else's

In comment 16468810 MNP70 said:

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Collins was picked up on a "what do we have to lose" scenario based on really bad QB play over the not to recent past. His physical talent wasn't in question but he was a hot mess otherwise. I don't know who got into his head to straighten him out but it happened fast and the Giants seemed to ride the wave for as long as they could. I think it was considered a lower cost/good performance thing because to draft someone during that time may not have outweighed what became a reliable commodity until Fassel eroded the team. I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season. There was a good QB class coming out for '04 and the rest is history. So, there initially wasn't a clear expectation when he was picked up but became a pleasant surprise. For a while there, the Giants were putting up some points.

Giants management and Fassel pretty much told Kerry when they signed him that he had to stay sober and out of trouble or they would cut him so fast his head would spin. And thankfully he did.

In comment 16468795 Matt in SGS said:

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he did get an extension before the 2002 season, it was a 2 year deal that ran through the 2004 season. But his career was really tied to Fassel. Once Fassel was out after 2003 and Coughlin came in and Collins was turning 32 before the 2004 season. It was pretty clear to see the Giants were going to go QB in that draft so Coughlin could build around his new QB. As I recall, Wellington wasn't happy about drafting Collins' replacement and begrudgingly told Accorsi to do what he needed to, but he liked Collins because he led the Giants to a Super Bowl and all the adversity he overcame. I also remember the Giants offering him the chance to mentor their new QB (in this case Eli). Coming into his contract year, Collins didn't want to do that and asked for his release, so the Giants granted that, which opened the door for Kurt Warner who was a June 1st cut and was looking for a job.

Kerry said after they hired Coughlin, TC walked right past him in the hallway and didn’t even look at him and he knew it was over in New York

Kerry was a literal revelation at the time. This franchise was so offensively inept at the time.

with the ten cent brain and the million dollar arm. Outstanding seam pass. Big step up from previous stiffs

thought drafting Eli was about Acorsi's love of Eli, not an indictment of Collins. Collins was a 10 to 20 QB. Good enough to win. Not good enough to carry you. The high draft choice and great QB availability happened to coincide.

And I can't remember where exactly. Maybe Accorsi's book that he wrote on Eli Manning, but Accorsi knew after the 2000 superbowl that Collins was not the quarterback to lead the team to a superbowl. Collins had a deer in the headlights look and lost command of the offense.

In comment 16468931 TrueBlue56 said:

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And I can't remember where exactly. Maybe Accorsi's book that he wrote on Eli Manning, but Accorsi knew after the 2000 superbowl that Collins was not the quarterback to lead the team to a superbowl. Collins had a deer in the headlights look and lost command of the offense.

To be fair, it seems like most people don't know he was much better under pass rush before he had his jaw broken by Romanowski. That was one of the most brutal QB hits I have ever seen. He was a pretty good QB with (as mentioned ad-nauseum) an absolute cannon for an arm.

In comment 16469046 Johnny5 said:

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In comment 16468931 TrueBlue56 said: Quote: And I can't remember where exactly. Maybe Accorsi's book that he wrote on Eli Manning, but Accorsi knew after the 2000 superbowl that Collins was not the quarterback to lead the team to a superbowl. Collins had a deer in the headlights look and lost command of the offense. To be fair, it seems like most people don't know he was much better under pass rush before he had his jaw broken by Romanowski. That was one of the most brutal QB hits I have ever seen. He was a pretty good QB with (as mentioned ad-nauseum) an absolute cannon for an arm.

I don't know if this ever came out, but prior to the SB against the Ravens, Fassel thought it'd be a great idea to install a different offense just for that 1 game. Let's just say it did not go over well with the players and their performance or lack thereof showed it. Who knows if the Ravens would have been able to do the same thing with any offense the Giants had. That Romanowski hit was really bad. Ouch!

In comment 16468873 jnoble said:

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Kerry said after they hired Coughlin, TC walked right past him in the hallway and didn’t even look at him and he knew it was over in New York

Apparently Coughlin also did this to Bortles at Jacksonville. I'm kind of conflicted on how I feel about it. On one hand, it's a bit of a dick move, but on the other hand, there's little purpose in playing fake nice to a player who is not in your future plans. In fact, I feel like the current Giants could use a little bit of this ruthlessness.

In comment 16469488 Lambuth_Special said:

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In comment 16468873 jnoble said: Quote: Kerry said after they hired Coughlin, TC walked right past him in the hallway and didn’t even look at him and he knew it was over in New York Apparently Coughlin also did this to Bortles at Jacksonville. I'm kind of conflicted on how I feel about it. On one hand, it's a bit of a dick move, but on the other hand, there's little purpose in playing fake nice to a player who is not in your future plans. In fact, I feel like the current Giants could use a little bit of this ruthlessness.

One could surmise being signed by the Giants is a bit of ruthlessness!

As a low risk bet on his potential. After 2000 they likely saw him as the franchise QB which he was for another 3 years. After the disaster of the 2003 season, a new coach and a chance to draft Manning, Rivers or Big Ben, the writing was on the wall.

He was responsible for one of the greatest games to watch as a Giants fan (41-0) and for that I’m grateful.

MNP70 said:

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I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season.

an_idol_mind said:

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This absolutely, definitely, did not happen.

What a bizarre recollection. The 2003 Giants beat the Jets in Week 9 to even their record at 4-4. Eight consecutive losses followed, with Collins missing the last three after getting hurt in Week 14. He never took another snap in blue.

Collins wasn't the biggest problem with that team, and his Giant tenure wasn't discernibly worse than what Eli Manning showed prior to December 29, 2007. If Jeremy Shockey hadn't dropped an easy TD at Candlestick on January 5, 2003, we might remember Collins very differently. On the other hand, Accorsi was probably right that we had seen both the best and worst of Kerry Collins, and that neither was good enough.

In comment 16469488 Lambuth_Special said:

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In comment 16468873 jnoble said: Quote: Kerry said after they hired Coughlin, TC walked right past him in the hallway and didn’t even look at him and he knew it was over in New York Apparently Coughlin also did this to Bortles at Jacksonville. I'm kind of conflicted on how I feel about it. On one hand, it's a bit of a dick move, but on the other hand, there's little purpose in playing fake nice to a player who is not in your future plans. In fact, I feel like the current Giants could use a little bit of this ruthlessness.

Tom Coughlin does not strike me as the type of person who can fake nice to anybody

But it makes me think less of Coughlin. How childish. He couldn’t just meet them after being hired and tell them face to face that he wants to make a change? IMO just ignoring them like that is a chickenshit move. Pretty weak.

In comment 16468824 an_idol_mind said:

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In comment 16468810 MNP70 said: Quote: I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season. This absolutely, definitely, did not happen.

i'm pretty sure he was hurt for the last game the Giants played with him on the team. Didnt Jesse Palmer finish out that year?

In comment 16470325 Greg from LI said:

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But it makes me think less of Coughlin. How childish. He couldn’t just meet them after being hired and tell them face to face that he wants to make a change? IMO just ignoring them like that is a chickenshit move. Pretty weak.

The silent treatment is definitely not an honorable manuever but I understand it on level given the power dynamics. Wellington loved Collins, so I wonder if this was Coughlin's way of asserting his control until he got his preferred QB in without saying anything directly, ie "fuck what the owner says to you, I decide who my starting QB is."

And we see what happens when the coach/GM lets themselves get steamrolled. Before Schoen and Daboll even got to their offices, Mara went forward with the "we've failed Jones" speech and Jones showed up to Daboll's press conference and was immediately trying to ingratiate himself asking Daboll for input about the playbook. It all seems like a combined power move in hindsight, so I have more appreciation for Coughling icing Collins even if it goes against his straight-shooter reputation.

during that era.

:thumbsup:

would have been the QB for a few more years.

Eli was "offered" to the NYG and Ernie accepted. The behind the scenes stuff had nothing to do with Kerry Collins.

In comment 16470364 Bear vs Shark said:

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In comment 16468824 an_idol_mind said: Quote: In comment 16468810 MNP70 said: Quote: I think they won his last game and got carried off the field which was ridiculous after a 4-12 season. This absolutely, definitely, did not happen. i'm pretty sure he was hurt for the last game the Giants played with him on the team. Didnt Jesse Palmer finish out that year?

Kerry got injured for the rest of the season during a Bills game after the refs turned a blind eye so Bruce Smith could get his record-setting sack on a late hit reverse suplexing Collins and hurting him in the process. At least that’s how I remember it