To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
RE: RE: So don’t tell me Schrager went to Univ of Mich too?
You should work at increasing the quality of your posts.
Whatever. The spin and the rumors feed the themselves around GM circles. The manner in which Getts was duped into using his first pick in Rd 1 on Jones in 2019 is testament to that. Don’t need to feed or confirm it with a Schrager mock of all things.
You should work at increasing the quality of your posts.
Whatever. The spin and the rumors feed the themselves around GM circles. The manner in which Getts was duped into using his first pick in Rd 1 on Jones in 2019 is testament to that. Don’t need to feed or confirm it with a Schrager mock of all things.
I don't know what this response means. I've just noticed recently that you seem more interested in being combative than interacting.
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
‘That’s how you become great man. Hang your balls out there.’
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
I personally dislike Schrager who comes across as a buffoonish clown every time I have seen him. How about he's just making shit up. Really multiple teams called him a guy who it hardly seems like would have any connections of import in the league. And if he did how about maybe its a plant from Arizona that wants Minnesota to think maybe the Cards have other offers out there so if they want #4 they better sweeten the pot.
RE: Either Schoen's got the JJM smoke bombs working,
Or he has told everyone to say they aren't going JJM in the building while liking him. We have 2 asshats saying we aren't going JJM. Which either means we still have some legit leaks or Schoen is trying to get JJM to slide to 6.
Hrs definitely doing a great job this year, I love it.
Do you actually believe a player will fall because of what the media says??? You think I GM likes a player and then passes because the media said something about him? Seriously?
is already fighting for his job so he may in fact swing for the fences. If he succeeds he will be here, if he fails he will be fired and wont have to worry about what he gave up. But with Jones being an owner fav and Mara probably wanting Jones to have one more fighting chance I would bet that the Giants have to stick at 6 and only take a QB if he is there and most likely get a stud WR to help DJ.
My guess is Maye is the guy if available at 6. He didnt have a great season but if he was in last years draft he would have a higher grade imo based on potential. I think McCarthy is the smart player, knows the game but doesnt have the wow factor. Basically his ceiling is a low end top 10 QB but most likely a middle of the pack guy.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Scouting changes a lot. Interviews, combine, pro days.
You're another poster who only makes insulting posts. I just looked at your posting history. Every post except one is attacking other posters for their opinion.
You might want to try another site. You don't seem happy here.
still think NE picks a QB at #3. If they pick JJM, then the Giants and the Vikings will likely get in a bidding war for Maye at #4. I have repeatedly said that I think bidding wars are a terrible draft strategy, but teams do it almost every year for QBs. Schoen would have to at least offer #6, #47, and our #1 next year because Minnesota would likely offer #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year. Both offers are competitive, but we should have the edge because Arizona would only be dropping to #6 and already has a lot of draft capital this year. All of this assumes that Arizona even wants to trade.
If Maye somehow slips to #5, then the Vikings have the edge IMO since I can't believe Schoen would make the same offer to move up one spot.
If NE picks Maye, then there is really no reason to trade up to #4 or #5. Minnesota is unlikely to make the same offer for JJM, preferring instead to stay at #11 and take Penix. And no other team would likely be able to move to #4 or #5.
I would take JJM if he gets to #6. But if he does and the Giants don't want him, then they will likely have several suitors who want to move up to #6. At least one of those offers could entice them to trade down, even though by doing so they would almost certainly miss out on all of the "big three" WRs. I could see Minnesota offering #11 and #23 for #6. It would be very ironic if instead of competing with the Vikings, they became our trade partner.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
This has been answered, you just refuse to accept the answer
"scared money don't make money" quip by Schoen was about whether they should trade down, not up, although I suppose it could be used to support doing both.
Schoen and Daboll were worried Schmitz would not be available at #57. When he was, Schoen made the remark as a joke to alleviate the tension. Nobody wanted to trade down and risk losing Schmitz.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
This has been answered, you just refuse to accept the answer
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Well per Jim Harbaugh, JJ had the greatest pro day in the history of QB pro days.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Well per Jim Harbaugh, JJ had the greatest pro day in the history of QB pro days.
So he's got that going for him...which is nice.
On your death bed you will receive total consciousness...
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
I think the deal is in placec already. Plus, who cares if the pick is top 10 next year, so is this year's pick. If you get the shot at your QB and Maye is Dabs's type of QB, you take the shot!
Masterclass by Schoen here. If Maye is a no go, they can draft their WR or get an absolute haul from one of these teams that want McCarthy, and possibly STILL get a receiver at that trade down spot.
in another thread, I was told a long time ago that the Giants once tried to influence Dallas to take a QB. I don't remember the specific details, but I think it Manziel in the draft where they took Zack Martin. It didn't work. But that doesn't mean teams don't try.
Maybe I'm misremembering but didn't Jerry REALLY want Manziel and his son won out?
trade down for draft assets in 2025. I like the wide receivers, but with Jones at the helm, I don't think it'll make much of a difference.
Something in this draft has to be about getting a new QB. Either taking one in Rd1. Or navigating up for one of the Tier 2 guys. Or (as you state) trading down for assets to set yourself up better in 2025 to pick your guy.
Not sure which is the optimum path, but do Something.
RE: RE: Either Schoen's got the JJM smoke bombs working,
Or he has told everyone to say they aren't going JJM in the building while liking him. We have 2 asshats saying we aren't going JJM. Which either means we still have some legit leaks or Schoen is trying to get JJM to slide to 6.
Hrs definitely doing a great job this year, I love it.
Do you actually believe a player will fall because of what the media says??? You think I GM likes a player and then passes because the media said something about him? Seriously?
I think you misinterpreted what I was saying. I was referring to asshats actually.
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
And all the talk about him going earlier is just hype, the league will see through it just like Malik Willis and no one's going to call looking to trade up
was either told to do the job with Eli or was stupid enough to think everything was great and couldn’t pass up on a top talent at a low priority position.
It’s very very clear Schoen plans to upgrade QB. We just have no idea how the Giants rank these guys. Not taking a QB at 6 means 3 or 4 players are gone, the trade up package was either too costly, or we have 2nd round or worse grades on whichever QB is left.
I really want to upgrade at QB but not blindly. There’s always round 2 to take whoever is left as well.
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Whether we go QB or WR or trade up giving up the number one year makes me worry. Whomever we draft at one this year I still think the Giants will be picking in the top ten next year. This is a pessimistic view but lets keep the number one in 25
...that maybe they have some space in their ratings among the top 3 WRs possibly with scheme fit.
One of the exacerbating factors in their awful pass protection is that they haven't really had a boundary WR that wins quickly off the line since OBJ. Hyatt and Slayton both have the top end speed but are bigger downfield threats (and Slayton almost never shows up until we're down a couple scores.....and the timing of his holdout might indicate a guy that knows his targets could plummet) . Even if Golladay wasn't damaged good that we overpaid for it's the same thing - he didn't separate until he was downfield.
That makes me wonder if they might have Odunze scored a little lower since he's not the polished route runner or as crafty off the line and tends to lean on positioning. Thus if QBs go 1/2/3 they're trying to coax someone to jump them for McCarthy. SD is almost surely going WR given they jettisoned both their starters (Harbaugh was also Marvin Harrison Sr's first NFL QB).
was either told to do the job with Eli or was stupid enough to think everything was great and couldn’t pass up on a top talent at a low priority position.
It’s very very clear Schoen plans to upgrade QB. We just have no idea how the Giants rank these guys. Not taking a QB at 6 means 3 or 4 players are gone, the trade up package was either too costly, or we have 2nd round or worse grades on whichever QB is left.
I really want to upgrade at QB but not blindly. There’s always round 2 to take whoever is left as well.
I’d also like to see them come away with a QB in this draft but I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t and we have to wait until 2025.
...that maybe they have some space in their ratings among the top 3 WRs possibly with scheme fit.
One of the exacerbating factors in their awful pass protection is that they haven't really had a boundary WR that wins quickly off the line since OBJ. Hyatt and Slayton both have the top end speed but are bigger downfield threats (and Slayton almost never shows up until we're down a couple scores.....and the timing of his holdout might indicate a guy that knows his targets could plummet) . Even if Golladay wasn't damaged good that we overpaid for it's the same thing - he didn't separate until he was downfield.
That makes me wonder if they might have Odunze scored a little lower since he's not the polished route runner or as crafty off the line and tends to lean on positioning. Thus if QBs go 1/2/3 they're trying to coax someone to jump them for McCarthy. SD is almost surely going WR given they jettisoned both their starters (Harbaugh was also Marvin Harrison Sr's first NFL QB).
That's not true, Odunze's ability to get a clean release off the line is elite.
Could be trying to show NE they have other options and aren't deaperate?
In fact, I am amazed that most people don’t see this.
Quote:
and trying to maneuver NE to achieve it.
Could be trying to show NE they have other options and aren't deaperate?
Maybe, but NE could just take Maye or McCarthy at 3.
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
Quote:
.
You should work at increasing the quality of your posts.
Whatever. The spin and the rumors feed the themselves around GM circles. The manner in which Getts was duped into using his first pick in Rd 1 on Jones in 2019 is testament to that. Don’t need to feed or confirm it with a Schrager mock of all things.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
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In comment 16472997 JonC said:
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and trying to maneuver NE to achieve it.
Could be trying to show NE they have other options and aren't deaperate?
Maybe, but NE could just take Maye or McCarthy at 3.
Agreed, they likely only make this move if they have a deal in place to go right back up to pick 4 with AZ.
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In comment 16473004 ThomasG said:
Quote:
.
You should work at increasing the quality of your posts.
Whatever. The spin and the rumors feed the themselves around GM circles. The manner in which Getts was duped into using his first pick in Rd 1 on Jones in 2019 is testament to that. Don’t need to feed or confirm it with a Schrager mock of all things.
I don't know what this response means. I've just noticed recently that you seem more interested in being combative than interacting.
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
‘That’s how you become great man. Hang your balls out there.’
Then keep it to yourself.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Hrs definitely doing a great job this year, I love it.
Do you actually believe a player will fall because of what the media says??? You think I GM likes a player and then passes because the media said something about him? Seriously?
My guess is Maye is the guy if available at 6. He didnt have a great season but if he was in last years draft he would have a higher grade imo based on potential. I think McCarthy is the smart player, knows the game but doesnt have the wow factor. Basically his ceiling is a low end top 10 QB but most likely a middle of the pack guy.
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Scouting changes a lot. Interviews, combine, pro days.
You might want to try another site. You don't seem happy here.
If Maye somehow slips to #5, then the Vikings have the edge IMO since I can't believe Schoen would make the same offer to move up one spot.
If NE picks Maye, then there is really no reason to trade up to #4 or #5. Minnesota is unlikely to make the same offer for JJM, preferring instead to stay at #11 and take Penix. And no other team would likely be able to move to #4 or #5.
I would take JJM if he gets to #6. But if he does and the Giants don't want him, then they will likely have several suitors who want to move up to #6. At least one of those offers could entice them to trade down, even though by doing so they would almost certainly miss out on all of the "big three" WRs. I could see Minnesota offering #11 and #23 for #6. It would be very ironic if instead of competing with the Vikings, they became our trade partner.
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
This has been answered, you just refuse to accept the answer
Schoen and Daboll were worried Schmitz would not be available at #57. When he was, Schoen made the remark as a joke to alleviate the tension. Nobody wanted to trade down and risk losing Schmitz.
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In comment 16473045 ThomasG said:
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
This has been answered, you just refuse to accept the answer
Yup
Not on my team thanks
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Well per Jim Harbaugh, JJ had the greatest pro day in the history of QB pro days.
So he's got that going for him...which is nice.
Yup
Not on my team thanks
Your team? You paying all the bills?
Quote:
In comment 16473045 ThomasG said:
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
Well per Jim Harbaugh, JJ had the greatest pro day in the history of QB pro days.
So he's got that going for him...which is nice.
On your death bed you will receive total consciousness...
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
I think the deal is in placec already. Plus, who cares if the pick is top 10 next year, so is this year's pick. If you get the shot at your QB and Maye is Dabs's type of QB, you take the shot!
Maybe I'm misremembering but didn't Jerry REALLY want Manziel and his son won out?
Something in this draft has to be about getting a new QB. Either taking one in Rd1. Or navigating up for one of the Tier 2 guys. Or (as you state) trading down for assets to set yourself up better in 2025 to pick your guy.
Not sure which is the optimum path, but do Something.
Quote:
Or he has told everyone to say they aren't going JJM in the building while liking him. We have 2 asshats saying we aren't going JJM. Which either means we still have some legit leaks or Schoen is trying to get JJM to slide to 6.
Hrs definitely doing a great job this year, I love it.
Do you actually believe a player will fall because of what the media says??? You think I GM likes a player and then passes because the media said something about him? Seriously?
I think you misinterpreted what I was saying. I was referring to asshats actually.
Quote:
In comment 16473027 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...that JJ is not worthy.
Had he thrown 10 more passes per game and his %#s were the same, would you feel differently?
More volume could help standing and solidifying a day 2 pick. But still would fall short of seeing a dynamic passer at the college level to go high rd 1 with him.
Jan 15th he was a day 2 guy...didnt play any games after that did he...
what changed?
He was projected from pick 13 to 2nd round then
Link - ( New Window )
If the hype is real then nyg should take him
I just don't get it. It's like buying a Ferrari with no engine.
Get the QB. Plain and simple. Whether it be Maye or McCarthy. Enough is enough.
I just don't get it. It's like buying a Ferrari with no engine.
Get the QB. Plain and simple. Whether it be Maye or McCarthy. Enough is enough.
Yep. It's 2018 all over again.
It’s very very clear Schoen plans to upgrade QB. We just have no idea how the Giants rank these guys. Not taking a QB at 6 means 3 or 4 players are gone, the trade up package was either too costly, or we have 2nd round or worse grades on whichever QB is left.
I really want to upgrade at QB but not blindly. There’s always round 2 to take whoever is left as well.
WR is a different position than RB.
WR is a different position than RB.
To move up to three, you have to give up next year's #1 and other picks. Next year's #1 has a good chance to be a top ten pick. And you don't really want Maye thrown to the wolves as a rookie.
If Maye turns out to be stud, it's well worth it.
Not saying don't do it, but you have to understand the true stakes here.
But if he doesn't, the team won't recover for five years.
Whether we go QB or WR or trade up giving up the number one year makes me worry. Whomever we draft at one this year I still think the Giants will be picking in the top ten next year. This is a pessimistic view but lets keep the number one in 25
One of the exacerbating factors in their awful pass protection is that they haven't really had a boundary WR that wins quickly off the line since OBJ. Hyatt and Slayton both have the top end speed but are bigger downfield threats (and Slayton almost never shows up until we're down a couple scores.....and the timing of his holdout might indicate a guy that knows his targets could plummet) . Even if Golladay wasn't damaged good that we overpaid for it's the same thing - he didn't separate until he was downfield.
That makes me wonder if they might have Odunze scored a little lower since he's not the polished route runner or as crafty off the line and tends to lean on positioning. Thus if QBs go 1/2/3 they're trying to coax someone to jump them for McCarthy. SD is almost surely going WR given they jettisoned both their starters (Harbaugh was also Marvin Harrison Sr's first NFL QB).
Also, don't discount the value of the Cowden/Ossenfort relationship. I think it at the very least gets us the opportunity to match a better offer.
Also, don't discount the value of the Cowden/Ossenfort relationship. I think it at the very least gets us the opportunity to match a better offer.
Correct on both accounts.
It’s very very clear Schoen plans to upgrade QB. We just have no idea how the Giants rank these guys. Not taking a QB at 6 means 3 or 4 players are gone, the trade up package was either too costly, or we have 2nd round or worse grades on whichever QB is left.
I really want to upgrade at QB but not blindly. There’s always round 2 to take whoever is left as well.
I’d also like to see them come away with a QB in this draft but I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t and we have to wait until 2025.
One of the exacerbating factors in their awful pass protection is that they haven't really had a boundary WR that wins quickly off the line since OBJ. Hyatt and Slayton both have the top end speed but are bigger downfield threats (and Slayton almost never shows up until we're down a couple scores.....and the timing of his holdout might indicate a guy that knows his targets could plummet) . Even if Golladay wasn't damaged good that we overpaid for it's the same thing - he didn't separate until he was downfield.
That makes me wonder if they might have Odunze scored a little lower since he's not the polished route runner or as crafty off the line and tends to lean on positioning. Thus if QBs go 1/2/3 they're trying to coax someone to jump them for McCarthy. SD is almost surely going WR given they jettisoned both their starters (Harbaugh was also Marvin Harrison Sr's first NFL QB).
That's not true, Odunze's ability to get a clean release off the line is elite.