I have to assume that Schoen knew what the parameters would be for a trade up to 3/4 when making the Burns trade. But, he probably didn't anticipate the Vikings acquiring another first round pick when he made the deal.
If NYG does like McCarthy, they'd be in a much better situation with the 39th and 47th pick to offer NE/ARI in a trade up. Having #39 right now would put Schoen in a much more advantageous position.
Do you still make the trade knowing the Vikings would acquire an additional first?
A mistake would be trading up for a QB this year
Hey Bill, do you still live in the Knoxville area?
There are 22 positions on the football field and the Giants had exactly 1 edge rusher who was any good. All they had to give up to trade and sign a top 10 edge player in the league was the 39th pick in the draft?
You can’t just sacrifice everything for a chance at a QB. Your team won’t be any good if you don’t build it with talented players.
I get it. Burns is a nice player. And we got him at solid value. But the QB and the offense has to be the top priority. And Burns isn't good enough to derail the rebuilding of this offense. He's good but he's not LT. And with the salary we have to pay him, he's not some fantastic bargain. We're talking about an 8 sack guy who doesn't show up to every game. We already have a guy like that -- KT. Again, I think Burns can be part of a good defense, but he's not worth failing to get Drake Maye.
In the lottery? NFW. Not this crop of Edge prospects.
QB would still be the hot topic. If we moved down, then Edge prospects would come more in focus.
The Burns acquisition is still an interesting topic. I don't think forking over the second rounder was a bad idea as much as the contract. Burns is now higher paid than much more accomplished players like Watt, Garrett, Hunter, etc. In other words, he's being paid to be an elite player.
Are you sure he is? I'm not...
I get it. Burns is a nice player. And we got him at solid value. But the QB and the offense has to be the top priority. And Burns isn't good enough to derail the rebuilding of this offense. He's good but he's not LT. And with the salary we have to pay him, he's not some fantastic bargain. We're talking about an 8 sack guy who doesn't show up to every game. We already have a guy like that -- KT. Again, I think Burns can be part of a good defense, but he's not worth failing to get Drake Maye.
You make that trade and don't look back. How do we know the Pats don't take him or they simply like another team's offer better?
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If not having #39 gets in the way of moving up to #3 and obtaining the QB we want, then I will regret the move.
I get it. Burns is a nice player. And we got him at solid value. But the QB and the offense has to be the top priority. And Burns isn't good enough to derail the rebuilding of this offense. He's good but he's not LT. And with the salary we have to pay him, he's not some fantastic bargain. We're talking about an 8 sack guy who doesn't show up to every game. We already have a guy like that -- KT. Again, I think Burns can be part of a good defense, but he's not worth failing to get Drake Maye.
You make that trade and don't look back. How do we know the Pats don't take him or they simply like another team's offer better?
You can do a lot with #39 in this draft. It can be a piece that lets you trade into the first round to grab Penix/Nix, after selecting Nabers. I would rather have Nabers-Penix than Burns.
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In comment 16477533 Darwinian said:
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If not having #39 gets in the way of moving up to #3 and obtaining the QB we want, then I will regret the move.
I get it. Burns is a nice player. And we got him at solid value. But the QB and the offense has to be the top priority. And Burns isn't good enough to derail the rebuilding of this offense. He's good but he's not LT. And with the salary we have to pay him, he's not some fantastic bargain. We're talking about an 8 sack guy who doesn't show up to every game. We already have a guy like that -- KT. Again, I think Burns can be part of a good defense, but he's not worth failing to get Drake Maye.
You make that trade and don't look back. How do we know the Pats don't take him or they simply like another team's offer better?
You can do a lot with #39 in this draft. It can be a piece that lets you trade into the first round to grab Penix/Nix, after selecting Nabers. I would rather have Nabers-Penix than Burns.
Why not all 3?
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we'd be talking about taking an edge in the first round.
In the lottery? NFW. Not this crop of Edge prospects.
QB would still be the hot topic. If we moved down, then Edge prospects would come more in focus.
The Burns acquisition is still an interesting topic. I don't think forking over the second rounder was a bad idea as much as the contract. Burns is now higher paid than much more accomplished players like Watt, Garrett, Hunter, etc. In other words, he's being paid to be an elite player.
Are you sure he is? I'm not...
I guarantee you we would have a bunch of fans saying edge at #6 or trading down slightly to take an edge.
It wasn't.
It was terrible. 27th in the NFL.
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we'd be talking about taking an edge in the first round.
In the lottery? NFW. Not this crop of Edge prospects.
QB would still be the hot topic. If we moved down, then Edge prospects would come more in focus.
The Burns acquisition is still an interesting topic. I don't think forking over the second rounder was a bad idea as much as the contract. Burns is now higher paid than much more accomplished players like Watt, Garrett, Hunter, etc. In other words, he's being paid to be an elite player.
Are you sure he is? I'm not...
I don't often agree with you BW, but on the Burns trade we're in lockstep!
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In comment 16477533 Darwinian said:
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If not having #39 gets in the way of moving up to #3 and obtaining the QB we want, then I will regret the move.
I get it. Burns is a nice player. And we got him at solid value. But the QB and the offense has to be the top priority. And Burns isn't good enough to derail the rebuilding of this offense. He's good but he's not LT. And with the salary we have to pay him, he's not some fantastic bargain. We're talking about an 8 sack guy who doesn't show up to every game. We already have a guy like that -- KT. Again, I think Burns can be part of a good defense, but he's not worth failing to get Drake Maye.
You make that trade and don't look back. How do we know the Pats don't take him or they simply like another team's offer better?
You can do a lot with #39 in this draft. It can be a piece that lets you trade into the first round to grab Penix/Nix, after selecting Nabers. I would rather have Nabers-Penix than Burns.
They can always trade 2025 picks if they are really intent to trade back into the 1st.
Who they like of the non top 4 QBs will be interesting.
Plus, look at Sy's evals of edge rushers in the draft. Not great. To me it seems like we acquired a talent that was not available in the draft this year.
And yeah, before the deal there were threads before the combine discussing the various top ER available in the draft. Verse vs Dallas Turner vs Latu vs Chop Robinson.
As was mentioned, the defense was awful last year and the glaring hole opposite K. Thibs was something that needed to be addressed.
And I didn’t love the trade at the time. But, with the benefit of time to think about it and without the benefit of hindsight two years from now - it was a good move.
It wasn't.
It was terrible. 27th in the NFL.
Yep, and it's down one of its best players.
So, no. Getting an elite edge rusher for pick 39 and 2025 5th was a great move.
It wasn't.
It was terrible. 27th in the NFL.
I, for one, am happy to have a new DC and to have a legit pass rusher (who can also do the other things a OLB does) opposite KT. The addition of Burns, in my opinion, paves the way for at least one of him, KT, and Lawrence having an absolutel monster year.
We got him for a second round pick and it is an area of need. Why is this even a question?
This was why I was never that opposed when they had signed Vernon who was 25 at the time
A pass rush can make things difficult for the best QBs while lack of a pass rush almost guarantees you defense is on the field way too long
What did Tepper do? He got rid of his best player and his cap headache so he could get weapons for his galactic mistake at quarterback. How do you think the locker room in Carolina feels about this right about now? Oh yes of course. The same way the Giants locker room felt last year when Schoen bet the ranch on our galactic mistake at quarterback.
It will be interesting if he can take his game to that next level like DJ Moore did when he left. Burns has never played next to someone like Dexter Lawrence. He's young, talented, next to the best player he's ever played with, and a good fit for the new defense.
In terms of losing the immediate draft chip I think you don't hesitate when you are getting good value - like was mentioned, one pick needed to go to edge one way or another. If they really need to move up from #6 they can use 2025 picks too.
You seem like a pleasant person.
That said Burns fills a clear need and is better then Any edge who would have been available day 2 and probably the entire draft.
The question is how does the giants use the capital they have, which we find out this week
What did Tepper do? He got rid of his best player and his cap headache so he could get weapons for his galactic mistake at quarterback. How do you think the locker room in Carolina feels about this right about now? Oh yes of course. The same way the Giants locker room felt last year when Schoen bet the ranch on our galactic mistake at quarterback.
Allen is considered to be very good against the run and had 17.5 sacks last year. I hope you are looking into your crystal ball and seeing that Burns "will" become the same player as Josh Allen because right now he isn't and it's not even close.