You have to go far into the playoffs leading your team. I don’t think we can answer this yet. Just my opinion.
Agreed. Patrick still gets the top spot for now.
I was thinking about this scenario the other day though: If the Knicks had to make one basket to win a championship and could give the ball to Melo, Ewing or Brunson, I'd choose Brunson. Doesn't mean he's the greatest just yet though.
On his way to be the best since Clyde, but not there yet. If he wins a chip, he's past Ewing. Bernard was my favorite player, but he just didn't do it long enough.
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
really had shit around him. He took a great Celtics team to 7 games and Rory Sparrow was his point guard. Truck Robinson was the other starting forward. Truly amazing how far Bernard took them.
doesn't have Ewing's length of top notch service, so its premature for that conversation. But he's significantly better than Melo in all ways that matter towards winning.
really had shit around him. He took a great Celtics team to 7 games and Rory Sparrow was his point guard. Truck Robinson was the other starting forward. Truly amazing how far Bernard took them.
He was unbelievable. That stretch he had he was the best pure scorer I’ve ever seen. My favorite Knick among many I’ve loved. I was sick when he got hurt and it still bothers me to this day when I think about it.
Just imagine if he didn’t get hurt what he and Ewing could have accomplished together. They were exactly what each other didn’t have during their Knicks career
Ewing is still one of the most underrated stars in sports. He was THE Knicks for over a decade. The biggest mistake the Knicks made in my lifetime was letting Bernard walk as a FA. He went on to score 20 ppg and be an all star in Washington. If he and Ewing had a few seasons together, Knicks history may have been very different. Instead, they let him walk and never had another star with Ewing. They had very good teams in the 90s, but Ewing was the only real star. He carried the Knicks.
You have to go far into the playoffs leading your team. I don’t think we can answer this yet. Just my opinion.
Agreed. Patrick still gets the top spot for now.
I was thinking about this scenario the other day though: If the Knicks had to make one basket to win a championship and could give the ball to Melo, Ewing or Brunson, I'd choose Brunson. Doesn't mean he's the greatest just yet though.
I'd give it to Ewing, but wouldn't have a problem with Brunson. Don't forget, he just had a shot to win a series and missed the shot...twice.
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I hate debates like this because it ends up seeming like you are criticizing the other guy, which is not the case. I absolutely love Brunson. But, I also love Ewing and shouldn't have to decide. I love both and they are from different eras, so there is no conflict.
And, Clyde is also grossly underrated when talking about greatest Knick.
RE: King was the best scorer and perhaps had he never been injured
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Huh? Ewing wasn't a top defender and rebounder? I have absolutely ZERO complaints or reservations about Ewing. If he played in any other era, he would have won a championship. It's amazing to me that fans still shit on Ewing. He is an all time great.
One, he wasn't even here for that long. Two, how do people shit on Ewing for not winning it all and then prop up Melo. Ewing went to at least the 2nd round (and had 2 Finals appearances) in over a decade. Melo had 1 2nd round appearance here and failed to make the post season for a half his time.
Brunson hasnt passed Ewing yet, he is getting there and he is loved by the fans but he has to do it for longer
Yup, simple answer. Not yet for Brunson. Melo gave it a worthy effort before he hurt his knee, he wasn’t the same after, and isn’t remotely part of the convo
Clyde was a phenomenal defender as well as facilitator. People forget that in the Willis Reed game he really took over after those initial baskets. There was also a game where someone tried to trash talk him and he destroyed them. It showed how much he usually held back a bit for the team.
Ewing was underrated. I think his legacy is affected though by not only the lack of championships but other things. One... Getting outplayed by Hakeem. Two... Other moments like the finger role. Three injuries. Compare his year one athleticism to later years. But still the Knicks were relevant every year he played. We are all excited about round 2. In most of his era... It was a given.
For Brunson being a PG and facilitator makes the difference. How many times did we see the team force the ball to Melo or Ewing only to have it fail in big spots. With someone who cma create their own shot and pass it makes all the difference. So while he can't be compared to either yet, he may be the best one to have in crunch time..
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Huh? Ewing wasn't a top defender and rebounder? I have absolutely ZERO complaints or reservations about Ewing. If he played in any other era, he would have won a championship. It's amazing to me that fans still shit on Ewing. He is an all time great.
How old are you? Do you remember when Ewing was drafted?
Ewing was billed as the next Bill Russell, a rim protector, shot blocker and supreme rebounder. He turned out to be a great all-around player and one of the best shooting centers ever. But never quite what he was supposed to be. One article compared his numbers to Walt Bellamy, who was no one’s idea of an all-timer. Another griped that instead of the next Bill Russell, he was a “bigger, burlier version of Bill Cartwright.” And remember the coverage of his small hands, which were part of why he wasn’t a better rebounder.
Ewing was underrated at the time and never shook that disappointment that he wasn’t what he was expected to be. Still underrated IMO, a great HoFer, a warrior who played through injury and proved to be a great leader. But never as good as Kareem or Hakeem, never considered the best center in the league, and of course they couldn’t beat MJ in the playoffs.
He and Clyde had the greatest careers of any Knicks, but Frazier overachieved and Ewing wasn’t seen that way. Brunson is also overachieving and fans love that.
He
RE: RE: RE: Too soon but the conversation is justified.
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Huh? Ewing wasn't a top defender and rebounder? I have absolutely ZERO complaints or reservations about Ewing. If he played in any other era, he would have won a championship. It's amazing to me that fans still shit on Ewing. He is an all time great.
How old are you? Do you remember when Ewing was drafted?
Ewing was billed as the next Bill Russell, a rim protector, shot blocker and supreme rebounder. He turned out to be a great all-around player and one of the best shooting centers ever. But never quite what he was supposed to be. One article compared his numbers to Walt Bellamy, who was no one’s idea of an all-timer. Another griped that instead of the next Bill Russell, he was a “bigger, burlier version of Bill Cartwright.” And remember the coverage of his small hands, which were part of why he wasn’t a better rebounder.
Ewing was underrated at the time and never shook that disappointment that he wasn’t what he was expected to be. Still underrated IMO, a great HoFer, a warrior who played through injury and proved to be a great leader. But never as good as Kareem or Hakeem, never considered the best center in the league, and of course they couldn’t beat MJ in the playoffs.
He and Clyde had the greatest careers of any Knicks, but Frazier overachieved and Ewing wasn’t seen that way. Brunson is also overachieving and fans love that.
He
Of course I remember when he was drafted. And I 100% consider him a great defender and rebounder. Just because a couple of other centers were slightly better rebounders, doesn't mean he was bad. Also, he played the bulk of his career with another big time rebounder in Oakley, which some of the other greats did not.
If he does this same shit for ten more years fine.
Everyone is so quick to project off the moment. We’re not there yet and to suggest that Brunson is Patrick Ewing after two seasons is DUMB. He’s got a wonderful chance to forge an unparalleled legacy here. I said it the night Knicks signed him all while so many said it was an overpay mistake. Fans are funny. Maybe we wait some more.
In that order....
Lets talk in 2 3 years
If the kids brings us a chip before then....well he moves up to 1
That’s fair for “best Knick since Clyde.” Brunson can pass King in a year or two; Bernard’s peak was relatively short. To pass Ewing, he’ll need a ring or a long, long run at this level.
In that order....
Lets talk in 2 3 years
If the kids brings us a chip before then....well he moves up to 1
That’s fair for “best Knick since Clyde.” Brunson can pass King in a year or two; Bernard’s peak was relatively short. To pass Ewing, he’ll need a ring or a long, long run at this level.
as still being in the conversation with Brunson... either is a Syracuse fan or a complete moron when it comes to basketball. Brunson is the best Knick since Ewing, no question.
As for comparing against Ewing, let's pump the breaks. Brunson has been here for only 2 years, but his trajectory is incredible right now. Not to mention it is tough to compare those two with Ewing being a center and Brinson a PG.
Threads like this are BS because they result in people shitting
on Ewing, who is legitimately in the argument for best Knick of all time and is an all time NBA great. He still isn't appreciated byt this fan base the way he should be.
really had shit around .......I was sick when he got hurt and it still bothers me to this day when I think about it.
Same. Bernard and Bavaro's knees, Mattingly's back. It was rough times.
The worst was when Bernard was nearing return from his initial injury and then hurt himself again running. IF memory serves, he stepped in a pothole or something for a setback.
I was at his first game back at MSG after the year and a half layoff. He played the night before in Philly, but the return to the Garden was electric. Their season was already over and they were ravaged by injuries. He didn't start, but the announced him with the starters. The place went nuts. Best crowd for a meaningless game. When he got up to go to the scorer's table, place was already loud. His first bucket was amazing.
I always maintained they made a huge mistake not re-signing him after that season. Even if only for a few seasons, pairing him with Ewing would have been magic. They underestimated how much he had left and just how great he could still be.
Ridiculous 22 in the 4th, 14 of 14 from the line, 43 total on 14 of 26 shooting...FIFTH straight 39+ pt game in playoffs. Not perfect with the turnovers but stone cold killer with the shot creation and finishing. Historic run in NBA history. I was a big Patrick fan but I don't remember Patrick EVER being unstoppable to this degree.
RE: Brunson with one of the great closer performances tonight
Ridiculous 22 in the 4th, 14 of 14 from the line, 43 total on 14 of 26 shooting...FIFTH straight 39+ pt game in playoffs. Not perfect with the turnovers but stone cold killer with the shot creation and finishing. Historic run in NBA history. I was a big Patrick fan but I don't remember Patrick EVER being unstoppable to this degree.
Patrick had to rely on someone getting him the ball, which Brunson doesn’t.
Right now Brunson is one of the very best players in the NBA
King really can plant his flag in '84 but little else playoff wise. This is the 2nd straight playoff Brunson is doing it. Till someone hangs 2 banners in the rafters they're not passing Clyde though.
King really can plant his flag in '84 but little else playoff wise. This is the 2nd straight playoff Brunson is doing it. Till someone hangs 2 banners in the rafters they're not passing Clyde though.
Agreed. Patrick still gets the top spot for now.
I was thinking about this scenario the other day though: If the Knicks had to make one basket to win a championship and could give the ball to Melo, Ewing or Brunson, I'd choose Brunson. Doesn't mean he's the greatest just yet though.
Jalen isn't there yet.
But win a ship? Then he's one of top legends in NY sports history, not just the Knicks.
Why getting into a divisive unprovable debate?
Why getting into a divisive unprovable debate?
You must be new to bbi
But the fact that King and Melo are the only others in the conversation is saying something.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
I love Bernard and Ewing but didn't win it all
He was unbelievable. That stretch he had he was the best pure scorer I’ve ever seen. My favorite Knick among many I’ve loved. I was sick when he got hurt and it still bothers me to this day when I think about it.
Just imagine if he didn’t get hurt what he and Ewing could have accomplished together. They were exactly what each other didn’t have during their Knicks career
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We have a NY team that’s winning
Why getting into a divisive unprovable debate?
You must be new to bbi
Lol
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You have to go far into the playoffs leading your team. I don’t think we can answer this yet. Just my opinion.
Agreed. Patrick still gets the top spot for now.
I was thinking about this scenario the other day though: If the Knicks had to make one basket to win a championship and could give the ball to Melo, Ewing or Brunson, I'd choose Brunson. Doesn't mean he's the greatest just yet though.
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I hate debates like this because it ends up seeming like you are criticizing the other guy, which is not the case. I absolutely love Brunson. But, I also love Ewing and shouldn't have to decide. I love both and they are from different eras, so there is no conflict.
And, Clyde is also grossly underrated when talking about greatest Knick.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Yup, simple answer. Not yet for Brunson. Melo gave it a worthy effort before he hurt his knee, he wasn’t the same after, and isn’t remotely part of the convo
Ewing was underrated. I think his legacy is affected though by not only the lack of championships but other things. One... Getting outplayed by Hakeem. Two... Other moments like the finger role. Three injuries. Compare his year one athleticism to later years. But still the Knicks were relevant every year he played. We are all excited about round 2. In most of his era... It was a given.
For Brunson being a PG and facilitator makes the difference. How many times did we see the team force the ball to Melo or Ewing only to have it fail in big spots. With someone who cma create their own shot and pass it makes all the difference. So while he can't be compared to either yet, he may be the best one to have in crunch time..
Quote:
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Huh? Ewing wasn't a top defender and rebounder? I have absolutely ZERO complaints or reservations about Ewing. If he played in any other era, he would have won a championship. It's amazing to me that fans still shit on Ewing. He is an all time great.
Ewing was billed as the next Bill Russell, a rim protector, shot blocker and supreme rebounder. He turned out to be a great all-around player and one of the best shooting centers ever. But never quite what he was supposed to be. One article compared his numbers to Walt Bellamy, who was no one’s idea of an all-timer. Another griped that instead of the next Bill Russell, he was a “bigger, burlier version of Bill Cartwright.” And remember the coverage of his small hands, which were part of why he wasn’t a better rebounder.
Ewing was underrated at the time and never shook that disappointment that he wasn’t what he was expected to be. Still underrated IMO, a great HoFer, a warrior who played through injury and proved to be a great leader. But never as good as Kareem or Hakeem, never considered the best center in the league, and of course they couldn’t beat MJ in the playoffs.
He and Clyde had the greatest careers of any Knicks, but Frazier overachieved and Ewing wasn’t seen that way. Brunson is also overachieving and fans love that.
He
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In comment 16506486 81_Great_Dane said:
Quote:
He’s roughly equivalent to Bernard, who was the best scorer I saw on the Knicks until Brunson, and Brunson is a better facilitator.
Patrick was a better all-around player but his career always carried a whiff of disappointment because he wasn’t the dominant defender and rebounder we expected.
Melo isn’t in the conversation for best Knick ever IMO.
I’m just old enough to remember the ‘73 Knicks, don’t remember the 1970 team. Clyde was a different kind of player from Brunson. He worked more within a team concept—but he had Dave DeBusschere, Bill Bradley and Earl Monroe on the court with him. He usually didn’t need to carry the team the way Brunson has. But whatever you needed for a win, he could give it to you.
Clyde could shoot, facilitate, rebound, everything.
This Knicks team reminds me of the ‘73 team more than the 90s teams. In those years, when we looked at the box score, the first thing we looked for was how many Knicks were in double figures. When this team is really firing on all cylinders, it’s similar.
Huh? Ewing wasn't a top defender and rebounder? I have absolutely ZERO complaints or reservations about Ewing. If he played in any other era, he would have won a championship. It's amazing to me that fans still shit on Ewing. He is an all time great.
How old are you? Do you remember when Ewing was drafted?
Ewing was billed as the next Bill Russell, a rim protector, shot blocker and supreme rebounder. He turned out to be a great all-around player and one of the best shooting centers ever. But never quite what he was supposed to be. One article compared his numbers to Walt Bellamy, who was no one’s idea of an all-timer. Another griped that instead of the next Bill Russell, he was a “bigger, burlier version of Bill Cartwright.” And remember the coverage of his small hands, which were part of why he wasn’t a better rebounder.
Ewing was underrated at the time and never shook that disappointment that he wasn’t what he was expected to be. Still underrated IMO, a great HoFer, a warrior who played through injury and proved to be a great leader. But never as good as Kareem or Hakeem, never considered the best center in the league, and of course they couldn’t beat MJ in the playoffs.
He and Clyde had the greatest careers of any Knicks, but Frazier overachieved and Ewing wasn’t seen that way. Brunson is also overachieving and fans love that.
He
This is his second season with Knicks
Everyone is so quick to project off the moment. We’re not there yet and to suggest that Brunson is Patrick Ewing after two seasons is DUMB. He’s got a wonderful chance to forge an unparalleled legacy here. I said it the night Knicks signed him all while so many said it was an overpay mistake. Fans are funny. Maybe we wait some more.
Lets talk in 2 3 years
If the kids brings us a chip before then....well he moves up to 1
Lets talk in 2 3 years
If the kids brings us a chip before then....well he moves up to 1
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In that order....
Lets talk in 2 3 years
If the kids brings us a chip before then....well he moves up to 1
That’s fair for “best Knick since Clyde.” Brunson can pass King in a year or two; Bernard’s peak was relatively short. To pass Ewing, he’ll need a ring or a long, long run at this level.
Could have said it better
As for comparing against Ewing, let's pump the breaks. Brunson has been here for only 2 years, but his trajectory is incredible right now. Not to mention it is tough to compare those two with Ewing being a center and Brinson a PG.
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really had shit around .......I was sick when he got hurt and it still bothers me to this day when I think about it.
Same. Bernard and Bavaro's knees, Mattingly's back. It was rough times.
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In comment 16506495 ElitoCanton said:
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really had shit around .......I was sick when he got hurt and it still bothers me to this day when I think about it.
Same. Bernard and Bavaro's knees, Mattingly's back. It was rough times.
I was at his first game back at MSG after the year and a half layoff. He played the night before in Philly, but the return to the Garden was electric. Their season was already over and they were ravaged by injuries. He didn't start, but the announced him with the starters. The place went nuts. Best crowd for a meaningless game. When he got up to go to the scorer's table, place was already loud. His first bucket was amazing.
I always maintained they made a huge mistake not re-signing him after that season. Even if only for a few seasons, pairing him with Ewing would have been magic. They underestimated how much he had left and just how great he could still be.
Patrick had to rely on someone getting him the ball, which Brunson doesn’t.
Unless we win a title with Brunson.