Years ago the Rams marched in here and destroyed the Giants 51-17. New GM new coach new QB but trending to the same result. This is what happens when someone born with a silver spoon inherits a business and not knowing what they are doing drives it into the ground.
You think the injuries and bad luck are tough now, just wait. If we continue to get our asses kicked every week like this, we’re going to have no one left by the end of the season to build this team around.
There’s a reason all our key players are getting g hurt, and it’s not bad luck…
Deep down I really believe this is all because the owners sold out the real fan base when they got in bed with the jests on MetLife. Both teams are going to suck for the next 20 years.
No, there is much more misery to come. At some point, Jones will get hurt with this line, and it will be worst than the 70's. At least during the 70's, we could enjoy watching the defense and the punter. Not here.
Remember as we go forward into the rest of the season...
Deep down I really believe this is all because the owners sold out the real fan base when they got in bed with the jests on MetLife. Both teams are going to suck for the next 20 years.
Agreed.
RE: Remember as we go forward into the rest of the season...
(1) We all have to execute the fundamentals better, starting with the coaches.
(2) I saw some good things out there.
(3) I didn't see any bad things yet because I didn't see the tape.
(4) We have to clean up our lack of tecchnical execution.
(1) We all have to execute the fundamentals better, starting with the coaches.
(2) I saw some good things out there.
(3) I didn't see any bad things yet because I didn't see the tape.
(4) We have to clean up our lack of tecchnical execution.
You forgot the “right there” cadence punctuating every sentence
Joe Judge can get fucked
RE: Remember as we go forward into the rest of the season...
you’ve ever done -post game at 2:45 LMAO!!
Oh and like Terps said, I hope they get destroyed every game. Mara is so concerned about optics maybe that will get through his thick skull that he needs to get himself and his family away from the team and get some real football people in here.
“What I’m about is an old school physical mentality. We’re going to put a product on the field that the people of this city and region are going to be proud of because this team will represent this area. We will play fast, we will play downhill, we will play aggressive. We will punch you in the nose for 60 minutes, we will play every play like it has a history and a life of its own, with a relentless, competitive attitude. We will play fundamentally sound, we will not beat ourselves. That is our mission right here… It’s a tough division, it’s a tough division and the city is full of tough people and they expect to see a program, they expect to see a product, that represents them. I’m going to do everything in my power, every day, to make sure the people of this city and this area turn on the TV or sit in the stadium seats and are proud to say that we’re their New York Giants.” ― Joe Judge (January 2020)
RE: Remember as we go forward into the rest of the season...
There is no arrow pointing up. Winning a couple meaningless games and accumulating moral victories...doesn't matter.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They've been humiliated for a decade, the more humiliated they get the worse the decisions become.
They can keep replacing people as much as they want, it doesn't mean anything if the replacement isn't any better. They don't know how to fix it and I don't have confidence they know what to look for to find someone that can. Even at full health this is a 6 or 7 win roster at best.
Because Jones needs to be replaced. He might be the worst QB in the division. To be fair, his HC and his bumbling buffoon of a GM need to be dismissed as well.
I’ve lived through the team of the 70s and at least they were competitive and the D was always keeping us in games. This is the worst Giants Football I’ve seen in my life and there been some real bad years. I’m not convinced anymore that Judge gets another year.
The team might have the least talent on defense in the nfl and it’s not a young unit at many key positions. The offensive line is not improved at all and our QB is prolific at turning the football over. NYG also have little cap room after Gettleman’s ill-advised spending sprees.
The year Gettleman drafted Barkley, he could have drafted Josh Allen on the 1st round and Nick Chubb on the 2nd round. And yeah, I am well aware the O line sucks and can't be fixed with 6th round picks and free agents.
RE: RE: Remember as we go forward into the rest of the season...
The year Gettleman drafted Barkley, he could have drafted Josh Allen on the 1st round and Nick Chubb on the 2nd round. And yeah, I am well aware the O line sucks and can't be fixed with 6th round picks and free agents.
I’ve lived through the team of the 70s and at least they were competitive and the D was always keeping us in games. This is the worst Giants Football I’ve seen in my life and there been some real bad years. I’m not convinced anymore that Judge gets another year.
.
He'll get another year, only because they have replaced the
last two guys after two years, in fact McAdoo didn't make it thru two years. I have lived thru the Giants since the 60's,
so I have seen a lot of BAD football in that time. I am not sure they are that stage yet, but they are getting there!
They weren't always competitive in the 70's either.
At least they had Tark around to keep it entertaining,
along with Homer Jones for a few years.
I’ve lived through the team of the 70s and at least they were competitive and the D was always keeping us in games. This is the worst Giants Football I’ve seen in my life and there been some real bad years. I’m not convinced anymore that Judge gets another year.
I've been thinking the same thing about remembering the 70's. This is the worse I can remember.
The year Gettleman drafted Barkley, he could have drafted Josh Allen on the 1st round and Nick Chubb on the 2nd round. And yeah, I am well aware the O line sucks and can't be fixed with 6th round picks and free agents.
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
Sarcasm?
Me? Never.
This roster is no better than it was when Gettleman
Because Jones needs to be replaced. He might be the worst QB in the division. To be fair, his HC and his bumbling buffoon of a GM need to be dismissed as well.
The QB class is really bad. I would keeps another year as a stop gap and look forward to the next year.
Very good defense. Their current HB, with the immortal name of Chubba Hubbard (a Ben & Jerry’s tie in is a must for the future) was acquired exactly the way you do this, with a wise 4th round selection for a player who was very good in college and routinely makes the first man miss. I think Darnold sux - he is holding the team back.
You watch other teams, and it looks like a different sport.
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
To add to the pain, Dallas will walk away with the division this year
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
The year Gettleman drafted Barkley, he could have drafted Josh Allen on the 1st round and Nick Chubb on the 2nd round. And yeah, I am well aware the O line sucks and can't be fixed with 6th round picks and free agents.
The Will Hernandez pick was really bad
Could have drafted Braden Smith instead of Hernandez as Sy urged. Or Darius Leonard.
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
Any plan that involves building around Jones and Barkley is one that I am not interested in at all.
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
ah what would be the point of that? That would be pretty much what you have now
And you have no pass rush why keep overpriced players and or inneffective players like Martinez around(not a playmaker); Bradberry (terrible), Lawrence (not a pass rusher)
Do not get me started on barkley. Also a rebuild with the same qb is not a rebuild
No one cares that we beat the cowboys without their QB. Did it seem like that was in the Cowboys' heads last week when they beat the Giants like a drum?
The only people that attached a meaning to that game were fans who desperately wanted that game to be a statement of the arrow pointing up.
you insinuated that Cowboys could withstand diversity. You responded by saying they lost QB and I responded pointing out that they struggled when faced with that adversity.
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
you insinuated that Cowboys could withstand diversity. You responded by saying they lost QB and I responded pointing out that they struggled when faced with that adversity.
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
Dude what is your point? That these scrubs are as good as the cowboys? Are you kidding with this. Easy schedule but their offense regularly puts up 40+ point on the board.
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
you insinuated that Cowboys could withstand diversity. You responded by saying they lost QB and I responded pointing out that they struggled when faced with that adversity.
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
I'm not even sure why the Cowboys matter here. They're well-equipped to survive any challenges to the season. And if they don't the Giants are still terrible. We'll laugh at the cowboys while the Giants are 9-27 in their last home games.
All attention needs to shift to evaluating the HC imo. You have to see if he should have the chance to change coordinators, QB etc.
Besides seeing coaching issues I am concerned at his ability to identify talent both in coach and players and establish a team that will eventually win and win big. I have no desire to retain a HC that does not show some character traits of a champion that inspires teams to max out to its potential.
He certainly had a great opportunity right now to show his ability and it’s not just wins and losses.
some of that could be related to lack of talent. The LBers suck right now. I think they might be the biggest detriment to the D, to include Edge. I see the players getting lost and not physical enough tackling. Crowder, Jackson and McKinney tackled like absolute crap and seemed to all shy away from being physical.
wasn't fucking talking to you and my point was pretty clear
No it is not clear. So like this team wins 10 in a row Dallas loses 6 in a row and the Giants win the NFC East?
I just love pie in the Skyiers. Here is what is going to happen Dak faces adversity ; overcomes it ; and goes on to win the NFC East and the MVP and some games in the playoffs if not the Super bowl. The giants are again a 6 win team. Does that answer your question about what happens to good teams that face adversity and bottom of the league teams when they face it?
Eli Manning was 9-23 as a starter in the final 32 starts of his NFL career.
The owners have changed general managers, head coaches, and quarterbacks. They jettisoned malcontents like Odell and people who were no longer seen as part of the solution like JPP. There’s been literally no improvement. In some areas, they’ve somehow got worse. This organization needs to be rebuilt from the top down. Can the owners, specifically John Mara, be trusted to hire the right person to run the operation? There’s little hope that the answer is yes.
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
Nothing is getting better. No arrow is pointing up. It never was.
Something has to change. We’ve been shit for far too long. Firing Gettleman, who seemingly hasn’t improved this franchise one iota since getting hired, is the first step. The quicker the better. He’s been an unmitigated disaster.
RE: You watch other teams, and it looks like a different sport.
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Excellent post.
The problem starts with the owners. Unfortunately, neither will sell, so we’re forced to hope that they change their outdated mode of decision-making. Good luck with that.
RE: RE: You watch other teams, and it looks like a different sport.
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
Reese sucked, his apologists notwithstanding. Gettlemen blew the second and sixth picks in the entire draft along with at least one other first round pick. They both threw away hundreds of millions of owner money on free agents due to their inability to evaluate what they had on hand.
based on Judge's comments in press conference, he has totally
Is nobody really has any idea who is making decisions. It just seems like you have several ideas of team building being commingled together with Mara trying to appease multiple people.
Easy to put it all on Dave but it runs much deeper.
Is nobody really has any idea who is making decisions. It just seems like you have several ideas of team building being commingled together with Mara trying to appease multiple people.
Easy to put it all on Dave but it runs much deeper.
The Giants readily tell you that decisions are made as a collective. It's DG, it's Mara, it's Judge.
Mara might not be involved in the day to day but he is the reason they hired the GM and the Head Coach. Those positions are not filled without John Mara's seal of approval.
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
What does that prove that Eli was a better QB than a lot of people give him credit for when he was an older player?
Macadoo was a west coast offense short passing game oc and coach. Could not think of a worse fit ; same with shurmur. i think i agree with the gilbride thing.
One thing people missed was Ojalari Loafing around the field
Yes I’ve heard him say it several times like it’s a highly effective process. Wonder how he is seeing it as a suitable process moving forward. John seems like the main guy removing and hiring the coaches.
Yes I’ve heard him say it several times like it’s a highly effective process. Wonder how he is seeing it as a suitable process moving forward. John seems like the main guy removing and hiring the coaches.
I doubt he will ever remove himself from having all that power.
Even when he admits the results are poor, as he has many times, he's not going to 'fire' himself. Privilege of power.
I think of how affective Goff was in that system on that team. He’s not all that now in Detroit. Looking at Jones, there’s some similarities. Jones was effective with Shurmur his first year and had a pretty nice rookie season. Jones has not been very effective in this Garrett system. I am pretty sure the Giants will look to replace Garrett this off-season and give Jones another new OC and new scheme. Now question is will there be a new GM and will he want to start anew with QB? Or will that guy give Jones competition and another year to prove himself? HC, whoever that may be will also have a say, I’m sure.
Just that many have taken the fall but it really comes down to poor drafting and a shift from what common traits all the good Giants teams had over the years.
The passing numbers were okay with McAdoo as OC but they couldn’t run which goes to my point above. Ultimately they don’t have enough players that impact the game physically.
RE: RE: It all started with the firing of Gilbride
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
he got it because the fat headed owners panicked after Manning had a lot of int’s one season and thought they needed a different offense. Wrong as per usual.
You should reflect. The owners have basically done everything you and your fellow travelers insisted needed to be done. You see the results.
I think of how affective Goff was in that system on that team. He’s not all that now in Detroit. Looking at Jones, there’s some similarities. Jones was effective with Shurmur his first year and had a pretty nice rookie season. Jones has not been very effective in this Garrett system. I am pretty sure the Giants will look to replace Garrett this off-season and give Jones another new OC and new scheme. Now question is will there be a new GM and will he want to start anew with QB? Or will that guy give Jones competition and another year to prove himself? HC, whoever that may be will also have a say, I’m sure.
teams have film on Jones and no his weaknesses.
RE: RE: RE: It all started with the firing of Gilbride
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
What does that prove that Eli was a better QB than a lot of people give him credit for when he was an older player?
Macadoo was a west coast offense short passing game oc and coach. Could not think of a worse fit ; same with shurmur. i think i agree with the gilbride thing.
Your opinion (and mine) is inconsequential in this discussion. The facts show the only QBs who threw more TDs than Eli in his two seasons with McAdoo as OC were Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers. (Drew Brees threw the same number as Eli.) Eli threw as many interceptions in his final season under Gilbride as he did the next two seasons under McAdoo despite more than double the attempts. I’m not saying McAdoo was worth a dirty nickel, but the idea that the downfall of the team began with Kevin Gilbride’s firing doesn’t make any sense.
The downfall of the team is 100% more about the downgrade in player personnel that started under Jerry Reese. The firing of Tom Coughlin, despite all of his issues, was accelerant.
Watching the Giants every time is like watching the
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
he got it because the fat headed owners panicked after Manning had a lot of int’s one season and thought they needed a different offense. Wrong as per usual.
You should reflect. The owners have basically done everything you and your fellow travelers insisted needed to be done. You see the results.
Forget opinions. Look at the numbers. You’re wrong.
Just that many have taken the fall but it really comes down to poor drafting and a shift from what common traits all the good Giants teams had over the years.
The passing numbers were okay with McAdoo as OC but they couldn’t run which goes to my point above. Ultimately they don’t have enough players that impact the game physically.
Certain QBs like Eli are just not going to look like they good numbers. Big play QBs are jut not going to have good looking numbers like short passing QBs.
Look at Joe Namath's numbers ; they look terrible but i've only seen him play one game on you tube ; you get why he was a good qb. his plays were like 30 yards plus at a time and big momentum plays
Doesn’t make any sense? It was a shift in philosophy and the biggest reason the Giants are in this position today.
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
Doesn’t make any sense? It was a shift in philosophy and the biggest reason the Giants are in this position today.
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
Agreed. It's usually talent. And we thought we had it.
Doesn’t make any sense? It was a shift in philosophy and the biggest reason the Giants are in this position today.
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
We’re not in disagreement on this particular point. Moves like drafting Ereck Flowers were a bigger harbinger of doom than firing Kevin Gilbride ever was. The philosophy wasn’t the issue as much as just drafting bad, ineffectual players was. Once that happens, you have to be aggressive in free agency and that’s how you end up with mercenaries. Those guys are fine when everything goes well, but they’re the first to give up when things go badly.
Even drafting Ereck Flowers is more complicated than
One on the line, one on defense. No matter the position.
Thomas is a lock down guy but the drop-off is staggering.
They have no fucking idea what they’re doing. Oh well, at least we can sleep easy knowing Mara saved $$$ on Rhule.
Yeah, OK.
There’s a reason all our key players are getting g hurt, and it’s not bad luck…
Why do I endure these games?
I'm ready if that happens, got the game recorded - not watching it now.
Yeah, OK.
I had this nightmare a few nights ago. Mara kept Gettleman but doubled the number of Computaaaah Guys on the staff.
I thought rock bottom was years ago.
Not even close. Expect more half measures in the off-season as we continue the downward slide.
No, there is much more misery to come. At some point, Jones will get hurt with this line, and it will be worst than the 70's. At least during the 70's, we could enjoy watching the defense and the punter. Not here.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
Agreed.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
Inclined to agree. This cannot continue.
What a joke.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
Agreed. This is LOL bad.
(1) We all have to execute the fundamentals better, starting with the coaches.
(2) I saw some good things out there.
(3) I didn't see any bad things yet because I didn't see the tape.
(4) We have to clean up our lack of tecchnical execution.
(1) We all have to execute the fundamentals better, starting with the coaches.
(2) I saw some good things out there.
(3) I didn't see any bad things yet because I didn't see the tape.
(4) We have to clean up our lack of tecchnical execution.
You forgot the “right there” cadence punctuating every sentence
Joe Judge can get fucked
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They are going to win a game and people are going to make callout threads asking why the "DG haters are quiet today".
They have no fucking idea what they’re doing. Oh well, at least we can sleep easy knowing Mara saved $$$ on Rhule.
They spent a shit ton of money this off-season, you can’t call them cheapskates.
And I like Rhule, but he can’t win a game without Christian McCaffery. You think it’d be any different here?
Quote:
There is no arrow pointing up. Winning a couple meaningless games and accumulating moral victories...doesn't matter.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They are going to win a game and people are going to make callout threads asking why the "DG haters are quiet today".
probably the sanest way to be a Giants fan
Quote:
In comment 15417013 Go Terps said:
Quote:
There is no arrow pointing up. Winning a couple meaningless games and accumulating moral victories...doesn't matter.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They are going to win a game and people are going to make callout threads asking why the "DG haters are quiet today".
I can't imagine that happening until the team wins something like 5 games in a row.
They did it after the New Orleans win, lol.
The Giants have not ponied up for a proven winner Head Coach since Coughlin.
Time to pay up.
Oh and like Terps said, I hope they get destroyed every game. Mara is so concerned about optics maybe that will get through his thick skull that he needs to get himself and his family away from the team and get some real football people in here.
Quote:
There is no arrow pointing up. Winning a couple meaningless games and accumulating moral victories...doesn't matter.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They are going to win a game and people are going to make callout threads asking why the "DG haters are quiet today".
Yep, you can always count on that kind of optimism/delusion around here.
Just stop with the excuses. Yeah not fair for the Giants… no other NFL team has to deal with injuries…
+1
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
They've been humiliated for a decade, the more humiliated they get the worse the decisions become.
They can keep replacing people as much as they want, it doesn't mean anything if the replacement isn't any better. They don't know how to fix it and I don't have confidence they know what to look for to find someone that can. Even at full health this is a 6 or 7 win roster at best.
Quote:
even bother to watch. I've decided that until there is significant change, I'll find other things to do on Sundays.
probably the sanest way to be a Giants fan
LOL! Thanks.
Take Jones out, before he gets hurt, what's the point Judge?
2) Sundays are now to root against Chicago. We have a lot of options with 2 top 5 picks.
Yeah - I can't wait till they bring in the future HOF'er ... Glennon. What are they waiting for?
2) Sundays are now to root against Chicago. We have a lot of options with 2 top 5 picks.
Accumulate those draft picks, they need 'em.
Hopefully there is a new GM making the selections.
Respectfully, what would that accomplish?
One win team with ton of injuries at WR but relatively healthy on defense getting routed as McVay outcoaches us and our DB's mail it in. Scary.
Quote:
This is just embarrassing.
Respectfully, what would that accomplish?
Give someone on the staff an opportunity. Since this not working.
Quote:
There is no arrow pointing up. Winning a couple meaningless games and accumulating moral victories...doesn't matter.
If you like the Giants, root for losses and hopefully the change that the humiliation may bring with it.
Inclined to agree. This cannot continue.
If thats what it takes then so be it.
I remember when they passed on Zack Martin
He'll get another year, only because they have replaced the
last two guys after two years, in fact McAdoo didn't make it thru two years. I have lived thru the Giants since the 60's,
so I have seen a lot of BAD football in that time. I am not sure they are that stage yet, but they are getting there!
They weren't always competitive in the 70's either.
At least they had Tark around to keep it entertaining,
along with Homer Jones for a few years.
I've been thinking the same thing about remembering the 70's. This is the worse I can remember.
Chrissy has no clue what he’s even watching at this point.
To be fair, it's obvious he needs the coaching practice.
Even Dolan was smart enough to find someone to run his teams instead of himself.
Even Dolan was smart enough to find someone to run his teams instead of himself.
Only one problem. He has no guts.
Stay the course and your plan will come to fruition.
The Will Hernandez pick was really bad
Sarcasm?
One of the funniest thread starters in quite awhile.
And, boy, do Giants fans need a lot of humor!
1964 -1980
Quote:
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
Sarcasm?
Me? Never.
The QB class is really bad. I would keeps another year as a stop gap and look forward to the next year.
Very good defense. Their current HB, with the immortal name of Chubba Hubbard (a Ben & Jerry’s tie in is a must for the future) was acquired exactly the way you do this, with a wise 4th round selection for a player who was very good in college and routinely makes the first man miss. I think Darnold sux - he is holding the team back.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
Quote:
The year Gettleman drafted Barkley, he could have drafted Josh Allen on the 1st round and Nick Chubb on the 2nd round. And yeah, I am well aware the O line sucks and can't be fixed with 6th round picks and free agents.
The Will Hernandez pick was really bad
Could have drafted Braden Smith instead of Hernandez as Sy urged. Or Darius Leonard.
That it’s a false narrative that Joe Judge is guaranteed at least one more season.
And, today’s game (injuries and all), has done nothing to change my mind.
So, one mo’ time… this is how it will unfold:
(1) Dave Gettleman gives a none-too gracious “retirement” speech;
(2) A new G.M. Is brought in, hopefully someone chosen out of John Mara’s comfort zone;
(3) The new G.M. announces an entirely new team philosophy that requires a change in direction;
(4) Hence the hiring of a new Head Coach;
(5) And thus the re-build begins anew… again.
They played a year without their QB. Adversity. They look fine.
Agreed.
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
Any plan that involves building around Jones and Barkley is one that I am not interested in at all.
Fire DG... hire a GM to build around these 12 players
Daniel Jones
Saquon Barkley
Andrew Thomas
Kadarius Toney
Kenny Golladay
Sterling Shepard
Azeez Ojulari
Leonard Williams
Dexter Lawerence
Blake Martinez
James Bradberry
Xavier McKinney
If judge can't win more than 6 games get rid of him, Graham and Garrett.
ah what would be the point of that? That would be pretty much what you have now
And you have no pass rush why keep overpriced players and or inneffective players like Martinez around(not a playmaker); Bradberry (terrible), Lawrence (not a pass rusher)
Do not get me started on barkley. Also a rebuild with the same qb is not a rebuild
Joe Judge has lost this team.
No one cares that we beat the cowboys without their QB. Did it seem like that was in the Cowboys' heads last week when they beat the Giants like a drum?
The only people that attached a meaning to that game were fans who desperately wanted that game to be a statement of the arrow pointing up.
Go Dawgs'...
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
Dude what is your point? That these scrubs are as good as the cowboys? Are you kidding with this. Easy schedule but their offense regularly puts up 40+ point on the board.
Quote:
In comment 15417584 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
Tough loss today. But the players played tough and fought to the end. I think we can all look at the tape on Monday and find opportunities to improve. But we’re building something here.
Sarcasm?
Me? Never.
Haha ya got me!
The games have gotten secondary given all the continuing injuries.
This team is probably going to have double digit losses by Thanksgiving.
They have not hit a rough spot yet and have had an easy schedule
I'm not even sure why the Cowboys matter here. They're well-equipped to survive any challenges to the season. And if they don't the Giants are still terrible. We'll laugh at the cowboys while the Giants are 9-27 in their last home games.
Besides seeing coaching issues I am concerned at his ability to identify talent both in coach and players and establish a team that will eventually win and win big. I have no desire to retain a HC that does not show some character traits of a champion that inspires teams to max out to its potential.
He certainly had a great opportunity right now to show his ability and it’s not just wins and losses.
Joe Judge has lost this team.
I'm not sure how they can honestly believe in him anymore
I am in favor of executing the team
Quote:
Joe Judge has lost this team.
I'm not sure how they can honestly believe in him anymore
You mean running laps like pee wee football hasn’t been helpful?
Joe Judge has lost this team.
Once the veterans decide that it's another lost season, it's going to get really ugly. Think McAdoo's 2nd season
No it is not clear. So like this team wins 10 in a row Dallas loses 6 in a row and the Giants win the NFC East?
I just love pie in the Skyiers. Here is what is going to happen Dak faces adversity ; overcomes it ; and goes on to win the NFC East and the MVP and some games in the playoffs if not the Super bowl. The giants are again a 6 win team. Does that answer your question about what happens to good teams that face adversity and bottom of the league teams when they face it?
The owners have changed general managers, head coaches, and quarterbacks. They jettisoned malcontents like Odell and people who were no longer seen as part of the solution like JPP. There’s been literally no improvement. In some areas, they’ve somehow got worse. This organization needs to be rebuilt from the top down. Can the owners, specifically John Mara, be trusted to hire the right person to run the operation? There’s little hope that the answer is yes.
What a complete and total disaster.
Quote:
Joe Judge has lost this team.
Once the veterans decide that it's another lost season, it's going to get really ugly. Think McAdoo's 2nd season
Can it get uglier than today?
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Excellent post.
The problem starts with the owners. Unfortunately, neither will sell, so we’re forced to hope that they change their outdated mode of decision-making. Good luck with that.
Quote:
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
Arguably the worst GM in professional sports.
Quote:
In comment 15417667 M.S. said:
Quote:
Joe Judge has lost this team.
Once the veterans decide that it's another lost season, it's going to get really ugly. Think McAdoo's 2nd season
Can it get uglier than today?
Yes.
Quote:
The QB has protection. Players are fast. Receivers are open. The offenses look confident. The defenses get beaten but they look organized. The players are intense.
Why TF don't the Giants look like that? Year after goddam year, it's the same thing. O-line can't protect the QB. D doesn't get a pass rush. Receivers don't scare anyone. D can't get off the field. Return game is underwhelming. They don't even have a top punter, which they had with Jennings, Landeta and Feagles.
It's not one unit. It's the whole team. This isn't a matter of replacing the QB or the OC or even the HC. It was like this under McAdoo, and under Shurmur, and in Coughlin's last years. They've run a nice experiment and pretty much proven that the problem is deeper than the HC, the coordinators or any particular players. It's a bad organization.
Dave Gettleman.
Never thought I'd live to see a worse GM than Reese. JR was light years ahead of this buffoon.
If Mara and Tisch are feeling badly, tough shit: these two sperm recipients need to suffer financially for their idiotic decisions. - but they wont’t.
You didn't see that in guys like Flowers and Apple.
Easy to put it all on Dave but it runs much deeper.
Easy to put it all on Dave but it runs much deeper.
The Giants readily tell you that decisions are made as a collective. It's DG, it's Mara, it's Judge.
Mara might not be involved in the day to day but he is the reason they hired the GM and the Head Coach. Those positions are not filled without John Mara's seal of approval.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
You didn't see that in guys like Flowers and Apple.
I don't see great talent in Jones. His talent is similar to other journeymen like Mariota and Trubisky.
Quote:
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
What does that prove that Eli was a better QB than a lot of people give him credit for when he was an older player?
Macadoo was a west coast offense short passing game oc and coach. Could not think of a worse fit ; same with shurmur. i think i agree with the gilbride thing.
I doubt he will ever remove himself from having all that power.
Even when he admits the results are poor, as he has many times, he's not going to 'fire' himself. Privilege of power.
The passing numbers were okay with McAdoo as OC but they couldn’t run which goes to my point above. Ultimately they don’t have enough players that impact the game physically.
Quote:
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
You should reflect. The owners have basically done everything you and your fellow travelers insisted needed to be done. You see the results.
Quote:
In comment 15417868 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
What does that prove that Eli was a better QB than a lot of people give him credit for when he was an older player?
Macadoo was a west coast offense short passing game oc and coach. Could not think of a worse fit ; same with shurmur. i think i agree with the gilbride thing.
Your opinion (and mine) is inconsequential in this discussion. The facts show the only QBs who threw more TDs than Eli in his two seasons with McAdoo as OC were Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers. (Drew Brees threw the same number as Eli.) Eli threw as many interceptions in his final season under Gilbride as he did the next two seasons under McAdoo despite more than double the attempts. I’m not saying McAdoo was worth a dirty nickel, but the idea that the downfall of the team began with Kevin Gilbride’s firing doesn’t make any sense.
The downfall of the team is 100% more about the downgrade in player personnel that started under Jerry Reese. The firing of Tom Coughlin, despite all of his issues, was accelerant.
Quote:
In comment 15417868 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
Mara has been searching for the answer that was as clear then as it is today.
Eli Manning’s numbers under McAdoo as coordinator were excellent. How do you think he got the head coaching job in the first place? This is a dumpster fire with numerous horrific decisions, but firing Gilbride isn’t one of them.
he got it because the fat headed owners panicked after Manning had a lot of int’s one season and thought they needed a different offense. Wrong as per usual.
You should reflect. The owners have basically done everything you and your fellow travelers insisted needed to be done. You see the results.
Forget opinions. Look at the numbers. You’re wrong.
The passing numbers were okay with McAdoo as OC but they couldn’t run which goes to my point above. Ultimately they don’t have enough players that impact the game physically.
Certain QBs like Eli are just not going to look like they good numbers. Big play QBs are jut not going to have good looking numbers like short passing QBs.
Look at Joe Namath's numbers ; they look terrible but i've only seen him play one game on you tube ; you get why he was a good qb. his plays were like 30 yards plus at a time and big momentum plays
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
Agreed. It's usually talent. And we thought we had it.
Guess what?...
The point isn’t Gilbride . It was accepting that winning the lines is not fundamental football 101. You can’t scheme your way to championships if you can’t impose your will on the lines. The issue was talent then as it is today.
We’re not in disagreement on this particular point. Moves like drafting Ereck Flowers were a bigger harbinger of doom than firing Kevin Gilbride ever was. The philosophy wasn’t the issue as much as just drafting bad, ineffectual players was. Once that happens, you have to be aggressive in free agency and that’s how you end up with mercenaries. Those guys are fine when everything goes well, but they’re the first to give up when things go badly.
Who were the people in the room when that decision was made? Coughlin absolutely was. Wasn't Pat Flaherty? A lot of people got that wrong.
I'd trade him ASAP, but don't think there are many teams willing to trade for him.
Even Dolan was smart enough to find someone to run his teams instead of himself.
I don't have confidence in his ability to hire the right people to run the football operations.
Quote:
He’d fire Gettleman and start the search process for a President to run all football operations, hire the GM and make the final call regarding Judge.
Even Dolan was smart enough to find someone to run his teams instead of himself.
I don't have confidence in his ability to hire the right people to run the football operations.
Well, that’s fair. But, he’s the owner. Gotta keep swinging. Gettleman has had more than enough time and he’s been laughably incompetent.
Link - ( New Window )