I wonder how many people get thrown under the bus in this meeting.
And Mara will see right through it.
this franchise is a fucking joke
seriously, could you at least wait for the fucking meeting to be done before the meltdown. Nobody said Mara is asking him to tell me how you will fix this. Judge is fucking delusional..
Because one thing we do know about Judge is that he's a professional bullshitter. He's an excellent used car salesman. Mara could come out of the meeting convinced that Judge can right this ship.
I think you have a right to be skeptical that Mara will not make the right decision and be conned. It is not like Mara has earned the benefit of the doubt with his judgment.
Oh I expect 100% Mara to buy whatever JJ spews this morning.
again it s like politics- screw shit up and then tell people why you are the one to fix it.
Judge has to be gone or this next year is meaningless..
The next year is going to be meaningless anyway, 10 years in we're somehow at year one of a complete rebuild. I'd can Judge, but if I was a GM looking at the squad and the cap mess, I might like a year of Judge on the hot seat instead standing this time next year explaining why my new HC pick struggled while I was trying to put the pieces in place to move forward. Again, not the way I'd do it, but organisationally I can see some benefits as well as downside. Depends how big of a mess they think they're in.
how can he say definitively he will be back. At the very least, Mara if he has doubts and it appears that he does, should say well "I will let the next GM decide" who he wants for a coach, but the decision to hire a GM will not be made in consultation with you or about you. If you want to present this plan to him, ok--but he will have free hands to do whatever he wants. How can you announce Judge coming back before hiring a GM if you have doubts?
I think you have a right to be skeptical that Mara will not make the right decision and be conned. It is not like Mara has earned the benefit of the doubt with his judgment.
Skeptical sure but let's hold the nasty, explosive comments for when we know exactly what is happening. Anyone of us would have said JJ would be the coach in 2022 if asked in Aug/Sept. You have to believe that Mara wants this to work but at this point it is beyond obvious that this is done.
Solomon Wilcox right now on Sirius is going off right now on how Judge needs to go. The feeling, the temperament and the results all say Judge is not the guy. Though he is pushing Graham to a degree to at least stay as the DC.
how can he say definitively he will be back. At the very least, Mara if he has doubts and it appears that he does, should say well "I will let the next GM decide" who he wants for a coach, but the decision to hire a GM will not be made in consultation with you or about you. If you want to present this plan to him, ok--but he will have free hands to do whatever he wants. How can you announce Judge coming back before hiring a GM if you have doubts?
This is where the Gettleman 'retirement' hurts. Gettleman should have been told retire a few weeks ago or get canned.
that he COULD have implemented before the season started.. but didn't?
The next issue I have with this is this...
The plan should be presented not only to Mara but to whoever the next GM is. THAT is the guy who should be deciding whether Joe stays or goes.
I wonder how many people get thrown under the bus in this meeting.
And Mara will see right through it.
this franchise is a fucking joke
seriously, could you at least wait for the fucking meeting to be done before the meltdown. Nobody said Mara is asking him to tell me how you will fix this. Judge is fucking delusional..
Are you new to Bbi, do you really need to ask that question.
you simply don't see many instances or any where a HC failed to win games his first 2 seasons only to kick the winning % up dramatically in year 3. I can think of one time over the last 25 years where the HC lost big over his first 2 then won a lot in year 3 and that instance was Dick Vermeil and the Rams.
PArcells needed 1 year of losing. Coughlin the same. Fassel won in his first year then was average or so before the 12-4 2000 season.
Look around, you just don't see it that often. Not to mention it's actually gotten worse in year 2 under Judge, not even a hint of improvement in any facet of the team.
It's time to go.
Mara should be telling him the new GM will make that decision
How is a defense with Lawrence and Williams this bad at stopping the run? How to run that play on offense handing the ball off to a WR to run into an unblocked DE? The team is poorly coached at every facet of the game and the staff must change. Other teams seem to understand their blocking assignments, how do our players not know their responsibilities at this point?
I may be wrong but it seems very rare that coaches meet with the owner
We are a lot closer than our record indicates
Our defense is nearly elite, with a pass rusher, it'll be elite
I "fixed" the culture
We need to revamp the offense by bringing in a new offensive coordinator
I learned a lot this season, I need to be more mature in press conferences
This is a poor pitch, but it has a good chance of working.
Hire a GM that knows what he's doing and let him make the decisions. Don't waste an hour this morning where you can be lining up interviews with GM candidates.
RE: RE: I may be wrong but it seems very rare that coaches meet with the owner
"Look, okay? All we need is an offensive coordinator, Mr. Mara? Alright? This team is an offensive coordinator away from being a contender. I wouldn't have to QB sneak the ball on 3rd and 9 if I had a great offensive coordinator."
The Carpenter ™️
@ThyCarpenter
·
11h
The birdies that told me Judge was safe weeks back and told me his post game presser put him in warmer water last week have given me no new news today. Mara will hear nothing other than fire Judge takes and it could boil over, but gun to my head he survives.
The feeling in the building is that it’s not looking good for Judge. Mara wasn’t crazy about that rant, but the product on the field the last six weeks could be his ultimate demise. I’m hearing 70/30 in favor of letting Judge go. Link - ( New Window )
My guess is Judge is safe and we see a deluge of press and threads today with the rationale being one more year, and with all the other openings, it’s a bad year to be in the market for a coach.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
The feeling in the building is that it’s not looking good for Judge. Mara wasn’t crazy about that rant, but the product on the field the last six weeks could be his ultimate demise. I’m hearing 70/30 in favor of letting Judge go. Link - ( New Window )
The feeling in the building is that it’s not looking good for Judge. Mara wasn’t crazy about that rant, but the product on the field the last six weeks could be his ultimate demise. I’m hearing 70/30 in favor of letting Judge go. Link - ( New Window )
The feeling in the building is that it’s not looking good for Judge. Mara wasn’t crazy about that rant, but the product on the field the last six weeks could be his ultimate demise. I’m hearing 70/30 in favor of letting Judge go. Link - ( New Window )
would mean he's fired. But technically if you go by the book organizationally, Gettleman "retired" this morning. So Judge's direct boss is gone, so now it goes up a level to ownership.
My guess is that Mara is talking to him to see if Judge throws up on himself and basically fires himself this morning. If Judge says enough for a stay of execution, Mara will keep him and say the new GM will decide his fate.
Hoping to see "Judge Fired" pinned as a thread title?
well, I do keep refreshing, but I honestly don't know what I hope to see.
I'm having a harder time than I ever have being optimistic about this team's near future.
Looking at the contracts on the books, it's a pretty substantial mess for the short term. I think they have 2 seasons of sleeping in the proverbial bed that they've made themselves.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
The Giants are going to be the laughingstock of the league all off season.
Mara knows this and this is his biggest fear. All Mara cares about is how he is viewed.
I think the only way Judge keeps his job is if he says he has Dan Mullen, or someone equally as big, lined up to be the OC. Or that the Giants should go all in on trading for Russell Wilson. He knows the narrative will need to completely change for him to not be viewed poorly.
that he COULD have implemented before the season started.. but didn't?
The next issue I have with this is this...
The plan should be presented not only to Mara but to whoever the next GM is. THAT is the guy who should be deciding whether Joe stays or goes.
I agree that the new GM should make the call. The offense was the biggest issue and Judge may have been saddled with Garret's schemes. He made mistakes. Parcells made mistakes his first year and he learned from them. It is possible that Judge could learn from these past two seasons. To me if he comes in with excuses and praise for what he has done then I would not be impressed. If he comes in with a credible way forward then my mind would be more open. Either way I would let the new GM make the call.
This meeting shouldn't take an hour. This should be a fast firing. The longer this goes, the more likely he is to stay. The fact that they haven't officially announced what's happening with Gettleman is a good sign though. If they announce Gettleman and nothing on Judge, it's even more likely Judge stays
promote Abrams because of Judge's "plan", I'm checking out for a season.
the damage will be done far past 1 season. This is the most important draft in recent giants history with two picks in the top 7. They have to get this right.
JJ and Abrams are no qualified to make these picks!
... but if I was a GM looking at the squad and the cap mess, I might like a year of Judge on the hot seat instead standing this time next year explaining why my new HC pick struggled while I was trying to put the pieces in place to move forward. Again, not the way I'd do it, but organisationally I can see some benefits as well as downside. Depends how big of a mess they think they're in.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
Exactly. Let the new GM, whoever it is, make the call, and Mara must make that clear to any potential GM candidate he interviews that the HC is that person's call
to present a plan, he's staying. If he were going to be fired the decision would already have been made and meeting would take 2 minutes.
Thats ridiculous. Judge's plan is to promote Abrams to GM. Mara knows he cannot do that. The fan base would totally revolt and the media would destroy him
are happening. Maybe they are talking with PR about messaging, or letting key players and management know. A 9am meeting on Monday is a bad sign for Judge
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
the boiling, festering hate that everyone else has. For me, the feeling is disappointment.....that Judge has turned out to be the coach who didn't live up to his introductory message. I had really hoped that he'd be the one to lead this franchise back to respectability. I kept reading that things were on the upturn behind the scenes, and every Sunday the same old crap showed up. There was a stretch where I thought his game management improved, but what do I know.
Judge picking his QB at 5, failing next year and then getting fired to saddle a new coach with a 2nd year QB he didn't choose is so perfectly Giants at every level.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
the boiling, festering hate that everyone else has. For me, the feeling is disappointment.....that Judge has turned out to be the coach who didn't live up to his introductory message. I had really hoped that he'd be the one to lead this franchise back to respectability. I kept reading that things were on the upturn behind the scenes, and every Sunday the same old crap showed up. There was a stretch where I thought his game management improved, but what do I know.
I'm in agreement with you. The problem is Judge made himself toxic over this last month. Had he just stayed the course and said very little, you could probably see a way forward without Gettleman and a new OC and/or QB.
There's not going to be any going back now on Judge with the fans and it's hard to blame any fan for that at this point. That said, I don't know how you're going to sell NYG fans on any first time hire, and even if fans like the name selected, that person isn't going to have long before it's going to be firing time for him too.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
You may be right. If I were the new GM I would want the Giants to hang onto all there "assets" including coaches. I would then sort out what is part of the future. I don't want the owner doing anything.
Judge picking his QB at 5, failing next year and then getting fired to saddle a new coach with a 2nd year QB he didn't choose is so perfectly Giants at every level.
That's the fear. If you're keeping Judge, it can't be to fire him next year.
Do it now, start fresh at all three key areas together: GM, head coach, QB.
If the new GM wants to keep anyone on this coaching staff,
10-23
Insulted other coaches and other teams
Got blown out by crappy teams
Lost by double-digits in what? 6 or 7 games?
Completely bullshitted and fabricated during a press conference, which could've cost the Giants draft picks or fines for tampering
I mean what the hell is John Mara clinging on to here?
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
You may be right. If I were the new GM I would want the Giants to hang onto all there "assets" including coaches. I would then sort out what is part of the future. I don't want the owner doing anything.
If someone is qualified to be our GM, then he likely already has an opinion on Judge (and probably very negative as it sounds like the league thinks he's a buffoon).
wants to keep Judge, if only to avoid firing a third coach after just two years. He wants to hear would Judge would do to correct this mess. That is a mistake IMO. Judge is a main reason we are in this position. He should be fired now.
First coach in Giants history to lose 13 games in a season, and six consecutive games by double digits.
Scored seven TDs since the bye, including three that were clearly in "garbage time."
10 - 23 overall record.
Terrible in game coach, including his awful clock management and use of TOs, along with his persistent refuse to try and convert on fourth down on the plus side of the field.
Insulting other teams and former coaches.
Judge picking his QB at 5, failing next year and then getting fired to saddle a new coach with a 2nd year QB he didn't choose is so perfectly Giants at every level.
That's the fear. If you're keeping Judge, it can't be to fire him next year.
Do it now, start fresh at all three key areas together: GM, head coach, QB.
^This. I don't want DG or Judge anywhere near any player personnel decisions. There are rumors that Judge loves Pickett. I'd be furious if we used a top 10 pick on him.
But Judge could be trying to convince Mara that he's failed because he doesn't have his QB, which is ridiculous. Whatever one may think of Jones, he isn't responsible for Judge's terrible clock management and use of TOs, or any of the FA signings or draft picks. Jones was also out for a significant part of the season.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
Maybe. I am not saying Judge has any rights. I want to give the new GM total reign, including firing the coach, if he wants to do that.
RE: But if Mara keeps Judge you damn well know the new GM is going
Tisch should hire McKinsey or Deloitte or KMPG to do a complete forensic audit of the Giants, without clearing with Mara of course, and claim it is part of his responsibilities on the "business side" of ownership.
There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
Maybe. I am not saying Judge has any rights. I want to give the new GM total reign, including firing the coach, if he wants to do that.
Clear the decks. You're assuming a new GM will want to talk to Judge and be tethered to having to make that observation and decision right off the bat.
Very few GMS would want that tar on them out the gate. They'd prefer a clear deck.
So if this meeting started at 9 am or even 9:20, wouldn't he
have been fired by now? I mean what is there to say if Mara's mind was made up? So my thinking is that IF he has been in a meeting since 9, Judge is back. Changes are being made and we are going to have to suffer through another long season after we hear how great an offseason they have. :(
comes across as very wishy-washy, someone who agonizes over what are very easy decisions. We have had 10 years of awful football, culminating in the worst season in the history of the franchise in terms of losses. Add in his off the field rants and insults to other teams and former coaches, and this is an easy decision. Yet Mara will keep him anyway, which of course will automatically eliminate any serious GM candidates from consideration.
RE: Why the fuck does Mara along get to make this decision?
Tisch should hire McKinsey or Deloitte or KMPG to do a complete forensic audit of the Giants, without clearing with Mara of course, and claim it is part of his responsibilities on the "business side" of ownership.
comes across as very wishy-washy, someone who agonizes over what are very easy decisions. We have had 10 years of awful football, culminating in the worst season in the history of the franchise in terms of losses. Add in his off the field rants and insults to other teams and former coaches, and this is an easy decision. Yet Mara will keep him anyway, which of course will automatically eliminate any serious GM candidates from consideration.
He's going to agonize to find a reason to keep him, then fire him by november next year.
RE: The problem with all these firings today, Mara can't compete
with these other owners for the few qualified coaches out there. he might be better off keeping Judge until next year.
There's tons of coaches out there. Keeping Judge just guarantees several more years of mediocrity.
I can see it now. Judge wins six or seven games next season on softer schedule and convinces everyone he got a turnaround, then they crater or flatline again in 2023.
He cannot handle the job. Poor preparation, in game management, and general handling of the team. And someone with his record has NO business insulting former or other coaches at all. Ever.
My fear is that Mara grew so comfortable with the idea of the team pointing up after last year, that he just can't pull the trigger now. He may look for a way to frame his decision to keep JJ and is counting on his snake oil to help him sell it. I hope I am wrong.
The idea of 'let the new GM pick' is unrealistic. Either he stays or does not. Any GM will have to be hired with a stance on JJ clear already. I am not sure what some people envisioning. A long conversation between the GM and Mara, and then careful deliberation about JJ's tenure, and then a decision? A new GM coming in would know whether they want JJ. Depending on Mara's stance, it would affect who is even interviewed.
We all saw and heard what we saw. He cannot handle the job. He is not a good coach right now. No half measures please!!!
I am done with this team if JJ is retained. Much, much better coaches are being let go today. He cannot handle the job.
And why would we have a GM who needs to tear down, paired with a coach trying to win at all costs to retain his job. They need to cut high-priced players and set themselves up for 2023 now.
I'm dying to hear what Mara's press conference will be like
when he announces Judge is on a short leash and DG is retiring with Abrams taking over. Media better call them all out. They'll pay lip service to Offense will change and Scouting will get better....yadda yadda yadda....getting irate just typing this
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
RE: I'm dying to hear what Mara's press conference will be like
when he announces Judge is on a short leash and DG is retiring with Abrams taking over. Media better call them all out. They'll pay lip service to Offense will change and Scouting will get better....yadda yadda yadda....getting irate just typing this
"Nobody is more disappointed in this season than Joe. He knows he has to win more games."
why would we have a GM who needs to tear down, paired with a coach trying to win at all costs to retain his job. They need to cut high-priced players and set themselves up for 2023 now.
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
This is when it will all come out. Nothing will be leaked until like 2 minutes before
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
If Judge is "expected to do some Zoom press conferences after" team meeting doesn't this mean that he's still the HC?
Fired head coaches don't do (Zoom) press conferences right after they're fired.
Because he will be hired with his opinion of Judge in mind. We don't need to see anything further. He isn't an NFL coach right now. There is almost no one who thinks so.
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Because he will be hired with his opinion of Judge in mind. We don't need to see anything further. He isn't an NFL coach right now. There is almost no one who thinks so.
As long as you hire him with the ability to fire Judge, its no big deal. Trust me, a new GM is not going to want Joe Judge.
Think of the pathetic Dave Gettleman retirement party on the field yesterday. For better or worse (obviously for worse) Mara has great affection for these guys.
If they're going to let Joe Judge go, Mara's already proven with Gettleman that he has this desire to let them go on their own terms. I just can't fucking possibly comprehend they see any scenario where keeping Judge is the right move. It's just that obvious. So I'm wondering if they're going to let Judge speak to the media and tell the world they've "mutually decided to part ways" and suck each other off for 20 zoom minutes.
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
They can wait to hire the new HC, just get the bum HC out of the building sooner than later, so Mara isn't tempted to reverse course.
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
The difference is that if you can't even come up with one example of an owner not firing his HC at the end of the season and passing that decision on to the incoming GM, then it's not what smart organizations do.
they haven’t announced anything whereas other teams have has me accepting that Judge and Abrahams are going to be retained. I don’t think I’m going to watch the Giants next year if that is the case. Reports are coming out that the players want Joe gone. It’ll be even more of a dumpster fire than this season has been.
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
The difference is that if you can't even come up with one example of an owner not firing his HC at the end of the season and passing that decision on to the incoming GM, then it's not what smart organizations do.
I am not really looking for process, I know Mara stinks, I am looking for substance and the substance is to get Judge out and the right people in here. So, I will live with the fact they did it in a dopey way as long as they get him out
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
Hopefully they've been working on GM candidates in the back channels as it's not unheard of. But, they sure do tend to get more wrong than right at the Timex Center.
but the Giants have not even announced the inevitable retirement of their GM, which should be an easy no brainer.
And they just drag out whatever they're going to do with Judge, which sure as hell seems like they want to do anything to keep this clown.
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
I think that JonC has the take as Mara is a pusillanimous man and will let the new GM fire Judge so Mara can stay "above it"
There’s not one single football metric that’s gotten better with Judge as the coach. The Giants are worse this year than they were last year. The offense has been historically bad. The defense has been historically bad. Judge is historically bad. It’s nearly impossible that Judge is a good coach based on all objective data. If Mara keeps Judge it’s for no better reason than that he likes the cut of his jib.
Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
Colts, although I don't know if that's a smart organization given the owners antics and the Wentz trade. But when they signed Ballard, he kept Pagano for a year even though both Pagano and Griegson were on the hot seat. Ballard used that year to reshape the roster, amass draft and cap capital before moving on to Reich (after the McDaniels affair).
to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
Bears and Vikings both fired both today and waited. Were they not concerned?
I think this is basically how it works.
I seriously don’t think I could stand another year of this......
There’s not one single football metric that’s gotten better with Judge as the coach. The Giants are worse this year than they were last year. The offense has been historically bad. The defense has been historically bad. Judge is historically bad. It’s nearly impossible that Judge is a good coach based on all objective data. If Mara keeps Judge it’s for no better reason than that he likes the cut of his jib.
Mara is a study in bad judgment, but there is no logical reason to keep Judge. This is all optics and letting Jawn salve his wounded pride: "gee, I really think we need stability, he's got a promising future, we need to be patient, but we can't be patient in today's environment, we had to carefully consider" blah blah blah. In the end, Judge will be let go: there are too many voices saying he needs to go, including the locker room.
I’m not sure I agree. I think Judge and Jones would be Dead Men Walking in their absolute final year. If it doesn’t work, then the GM gets to do whatever he wants. I’m not even sure there would be any connection between Judge and Jones returning. They’re not picking up that option.
But I don’t even want to let the idea of Judge staying enter my thoughts.
In comment 15541703 bigbluescot said: Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
It's obvious John Mara does NOT want to fire Judge, and he DOES want to promote Abrams. My guess was that he was hoping for a last couple of wins as justification. Even now, he's probably talking to people to figure out how to sell this to the fans (he'll probably use Judge's talking points).
That would explain why he hasn't fired Judge (who should have been shown the door after his rant), and retained Gettleman up to the last second. The man cannot make a decision without checking the polls.
John Mara is showing why he's the worst owner in the NFL right now; he cannot make a decision on his own, he has to have someone to blame if it goes bad. Judge WILL be fired, either this year, or early next year, since there is no way to make this a competitive team in 2022 with the lousy cap management. Mara will let the new GM do it.
the kool aide flavor was so indescribably delicious that day I had visions that this man ( a Bozo) could be our own Bill Belichek Jr, and some day Joe might emulate his mentor and become GM too.
LOL, I must have been loaded that day. Pete Townsend says it best, We Won't Get Fooled Again, NO NO NO....
And Mara will see right through it.
this franchise is a fucking joke
Judge has to be gone or this next year is meaningless..
And Mara will see right through it.
this franchise is a fucking joke
seriously, could you at least wait for the fucking meeting to be done before the meltdown. Nobody said Mara is asking him to tell me how you will fix this. Judge is fucking delusional..
What are the solutions? Name names?
I think you have a right to be skeptical that Mara will not make the right decision and be conned. It is not like Mara has earned the benefit of the doubt with his judgment.
Judge has to be gone or this next year is meaningless..
The next year is going to be meaningless anyway, 10 years in we're somehow at year one of a complete rebuild. I'd can Judge, but if I was a GM looking at the squad and the cap mess, I might like a year of Judge on the hot seat instead standing this time next year explaining why my new HC pick struggled while I was trying to put the pieces in place to move forward. Again, not the way I'd do it, but organisationally I can see some benefits as well as downside. Depends how big of a mess they think they're in.
I think Judge said yesterday he expected to meet with them later in the week.
I'd imagine that sort of meeting is pretty common on Black Monday for eliminated teams.
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If not, that's not a good sign for Judge.
I think Judge said yesterday he expected to meet with them later in the week.
Then it's probably not a good sign for him. But, then again, who knows.
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In comment 15540909 jeff57 said:
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If not, that's not a good sign for Judge.
I think Judge said yesterday he expected to meet with them later in the week.
Then it's probably not a good sign for him. But, then again, who knows.
I agree. Not getting my hopes up though.
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point taken. I just have had it
I think you have a right to be skeptical that Mara will not make the right decision and be conned. It is not like Mara has earned the benefit of the doubt with his judgment.
Skeptical sure but let's hold the nasty, explosive comments for when we know exactly what is happening. Anyone of us would have said JJ would be the coach in 2022 if asked in Aug/Sept. You have to believe that Mara wants this to work but at this point it is beyond obvious that this is done.
Solomon Wilcox right now on Sirius is going off right now on how Judge needs to go. The feeling, the temperament and the results all say Judge is not the guy. Though he is pushing Graham to a degree to at least stay as the DC.
Terrible season has made Mara rethink and Judge is fighting to keep that plan going
Damn, this just reminded me how lame its gonna be not having Joe Gatto on Impractical Jokers anymore
Music to Mara's ears.
This is where the Gettleman 'retirement' hurts. Gettleman should have been told retire a few weeks ago or get canned.
The fly would be the smartest person in the room.
The next issue I have with this is this...
The plan should be presented not only to Mara but to whoever the next GM is. THAT is the guy who should be deciding whether Joe stays or goes.
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I wonder how many people get thrown under the bus in this meeting.
And Mara will see right through it.
this franchise is a fucking joke
seriously, could you at least wait for the fucking meeting to be done before the meltdown. Nobody said Mara is asking him to tell me how you will fix this. Judge is fucking delusional..
Are you new to Bbi, do you really need to ask that question.
Music to Mara's ears.
Don't forget Judge adding he is going to lean on Chris and Tim more.
he is there but has a glass of champagne in his hand and a girl on his lap. Barely listening to what Judge is saying
That said, I wish Mara wouold fall on his own swords, figuratively speaking of course.
And Mara will see right through it.
I'm not sure John Mara can see through the "got your nose" gag.
Every bit of this. Blow the whole damn thing up and start over.
PArcells needed 1 year of losing. Coughlin the same. Fassel won in his first year then was average or so before the 12-4 2000 season.
Look around, you just don't see it that often. Not to mention it's actually gotten worse in year 2 under Judge, not even a hint of improvement in any facet of the team.
It's time to go.
With his rantings , he’s been TRYING to, but they’re to stubborn to listen .
Guarantee he's going to blame injuries and don't put it past him to blame Daniel Jones and throw him under bus and ask for 2 years to get a new QB.
We are a lot closer than our record indicates
Our defense is nearly elite, with a pass rusher, it'll be elite
I "fixed" the culture
We need to revamp the offense by bringing in a new offensive coordinator
I learned a lot this season, I need to be more mature in press conferences
This is a poor pitch, but it has a good chance of working.
I seriously may just stop following the team after almost 40 years.
That's my thinking as well.
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At 9am the morning after the last game NOT to get fired.
That's my thinking as well.
We can hope.
Guarantee he's going to blame injuries and don't put it past him to blame Daniel Jones and throw him under bus and ask for 2 years to get a new QB.
Throwing someone under the bus implies they are not part of the problem. Much of the offensive struggles are a direct result of Jones.
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the problem he's festered, he should be fired without conversation.
Guarantee he's going to blame injuries and don't put it past him to blame Daniel Jones and throw him under bus and ask for 2 years to get a new QB.
Throwing someone under the bus implies they are not part of the problem. Much of the offensive struggles are a direct result of Jones.
As we saw after he want down for the season, right?
Ludicrous Speed
Judge providing a plan was Duggans guess.
No. He can’t possibly be that stupid.
Maybe they're having breakup sex
He sure is... this is a guy who was swayed by late season wins vs teams that packed it in under the last few coaches...
He's going to go with the "show patience" "seen some improvements" tone-deaf crap
@ThyCarpenter
·
11h
The birdies that told me Judge was safe weeks back and told me his post game presser put him in warmer water last week have given me no new news today. Mara will hear nothing other than fire Judge takes and it could boil over, but gun to my head he survives.
Love, The Carpenter
Hahaha
Link - ( New Window )
YES! On pins and needles lol
yup.
'Excellent...excellent.'-Newman.
What the fuck is the “30” based on????
That fucker blocked me on Twitter
My guess is that Mara is talking to him to see if Judge throws up on himself and basically fires himself this morning. If Judge says enough for a stay of execution, Mara will keep him and say the new GM will decide his fate.
@TheDougRush
Brian Flores: 19-14. Ended the season winning 8 of his last 9.
Joe Judge: 10-23. Ended the season losing 7 of his last 8.
Yet, Flores got fired first today. #BlackMonday
well, I do keep refreshing, but I honestly don't know what I hope to see.
I'm having a harder time than I ever have being optimistic about this team's near future.
Looking at the contracts on the books, it's a pretty substantial mess for the short term. I think they have 2 seasons of sleeping in the proverbial bed that they've made themselves.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
Mara knows this and this is his biggest fear. All Mara cares about is how he is viewed.
I think the only way Judge keeps his job is if he says he has Dan Mullen, or someone equally as big, lined up to be the OC. Or that the Giants should go all in on trading for Russell Wilson. He knows the narrative will need to completely change for him to not be viewed poorly.
The next issue I have with this is this...
The plan should be presented not only to Mara but to whoever the next GM is. THAT is the guy who should be deciding whether Joe stays or goes.
I agree that the new GM should make the call. The offense was the biggest issue and Judge may have been saddled with Garret's schemes. He made mistakes. Parcells made mistakes his first year and he learned from them. It is possible that Judge could learn from these past two seasons. To me if he comes in with excuses and praise for what he has done then I would not be impressed. If he comes in with a credible way forward then my mind would be more open. Either way I would let the new GM make the call.
the damage will be done far past 1 season. This is the most important draft in recent giants history with two picks in the top 7. They have to get this right.
JJ and Abrams are no qualified to make these picks!
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... but if I was a GM looking at the squad and the cap mess, I might like a year of Judge on the hot seat instead standing this time next year explaining why my new HC pick struggled while I was trying to put the pieces in place to move forward. Again, not the way I'd do it, but organisationally I can see some benefits as well as downside. Depends how big of a mess they think they're in.
This could make sense to them.
Easy answer from me
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the wall for that meeting.
The fly would be the smartest person in the room.
LOLLLL
the giants couldn't field 53 guys because of abrams...fuck that guy
The decision should already be made based on the low quality football.
If true, and Judge got an opportunity to plead his case. The decision was already made to keep him.
Mara is probably zooming Tisch, explaining to Steve why he wants to give JJ another year
Exactly. Let the new GM, whoever it is, make the call, and Mara must make that clear to any potential GM candidate he interviews that the HC is that person's call
Thats ridiculous. Judge's plan is to promote Abrams to GM. Mara knows he cannot do that. The fan base would totally revolt and the media would destroy him
John Mara is brainless. Let's keep the worst coach in the league.
This too...
You can take what happened to Flores today and paste it here for January 2023.
Judge is so out of his league being a HC.
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There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
LMAO good one
I'm in agreement with you. The problem is Judge made himself toxic over this last month. Had he just stayed the course and said very little, you could probably see a way forward without Gettleman and a new OC and/or QB.
There's not going to be any going back now on Judge with the fans and it's hard to blame any fan for that at this point. That said, I don't know how you're going to sell NYG fans on any first time hire, and even if fans like the name selected, that person isn't going to have long before it's going to be firing time for him too.
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There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
You may be right. If I were the new GM I would want the Giants to hang onto all there "assets" including coaches. I would then sort out what is part of the future. I don't want the owner doing anything.
That's the fear. If you're keeping Judge, it can't be to fire him next year.
Do it now, start fresh at all three key areas together: GM, head coach, QB.
Insulted other coaches and other teams
Got blown out by crappy teams
Lost by double-digits in what? 6 or 7 games?
Completely bullshitted and fabricated during a press conference, which could've cost the Giants draft picks or fines for tampering
I mean what the hell is John Mara clinging on to here?
Toss in Jones back at QB and it's hard not to join you.
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In comment 15541196 Reale01 said:
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There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
totally disagree. They need to burn it down. Every last piece. Start over for real. Judge is the worst HC i have ever seen.
You may be right. If I were the new GM I would want the Giants to hang onto all there "assets" including coaches. I would then sort out what is part of the future. I don't want the owner doing anything.
If someone is qualified to be our GM, then he likely already has an opinion on Judge (and probably very negative as it sounds like the league thinks he's a buffoon).
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promote Abrams because of Judge's "plan", I'm checking out for a season.
Toss in Jones back at QB and it's hard not to join you.
All the signals are there this is the outcome. The patience talk, the taking caring Danny’s long term health and return talk.
First coach in Giants history to lose 13 games in a season, and six consecutive games by double digits.
Scored seven TDs since the bye, including three that were clearly in "garbage time."
10 - 23 overall record.
Terrible in game coach, including his awful clock management and use of TOs, along with his persistent refuse to try and convert on fourth down on the plus side of the field.
Insulting other teams and former coaches.
He's probably meeting with John Mara right now.
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Judge picking his QB at 5, failing next year and then getting fired to saddle a new coach with a 2nd year QB he didn't choose is so perfectly Giants at every level.
That's the fear. If you're keeping Judge, it can't be to fire him next year.
Do it now, start fresh at all three key areas together: GM, head coach, QB.
^This. I don't want DG or Judge anywhere near any player personnel decisions. There are rumors that Judge loves Pickett. I'd be furious if we used a top 10 pick on him.
But Judge could be trying to convince Mara that he's failed because he doesn't have his QB, which is ridiculous. Whatever one may think of Jones, he isn't responsible for Judge's terrible clock management and use of TOs, or any of the FA signings or draft picks. Jones was also out for a significant part of the season.
I'll check out on 22 and beyond.
This is beyond insulting.
what a well run organization would do...so the giants wont do it
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In comment 15541196 Reale01 said:
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There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
Maybe. I am not saying Judge has any rights. I want to give the new GM total reign, including firing the coach, if he wants to do that.
Lost decade incoming..........
Shit football is bad for business.
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In comment 15541337 GiantTuff1 said:
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In comment 15541196 Reale01 said:
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There is no need to fire Judge today. Get the input from him. Hire a new GM. You HAVE to get that right. Let the GM run the show. He or she may decide to keep Judge or some of his coaches.
This too...
No, Judge lost that right with his actions the last half of the season. He deserves to be fired outright.
Maybe. I am not saying Judge has any rights. I want to give the new GM total reign, including firing the coach, if he wants to do that.
Clear the decks. You're assuming a new GM will want to talk to Judge and be tethered to having to make that observation and decision right off the bat.
Very few GMS would want that tar on them out the gate. They'd prefer a clear deck.
Shit football is bad for business.
Agreed.
He's going to agonize to find a reason to keep him, then fire him by november next year.
There's tons of coaches out there. Keeping Judge just guarantees several more years of mediocrity.
I can see it now. Judge wins six or seven games next season on softer schedule and convinces everyone he got a turnaround, then they crater or flatline again in 2023.
My fear is that Mara grew so comfortable with the idea of the team pointing up after last year, that he just can't pull the trigger now. He may look for a way to frame his decision to keep JJ and is counting on his snake oil to help him sell it. I hope I am wrong.
The idea of 'let the new GM pick' is unrealistic. Either he stays or does not. Any GM will have to be hired with a stance on JJ clear already. I am not sure what some people envisioning. A long conversation between the GM and Mara, and then careful deliberation about JJ's tenure, and then a decision? A new GM coming in would know whether they want JJ. Depending on Mara's stance, it would affect who is even interviewed.
We all saw and heard what we saw. He cannot handle the job. He is not a good coach right now. No half measures please!!!
I'm fucking done with this team if Judge is back.
More so than him being back is Mara’s wishy washiness. He went into that meeting with the idea of firing him but wanted to be talked out of it.
If you really believed in him you would have given a public vote of confidence weeks ago.
If you built this up to have a Monday morning meeting where you keep him you cannot fault fans are thinking you are either clueless, soft or both.
And why would we have a GM who needs to tear down, paired with a coach trying to win at all costs to retain his job. They need to cut high-priced players and set themselves up for 2023 now.
@JordanRaanan
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
"Nobody is more disappointed in this season than Joe. He knows he has to win more games."
THIS!
@JordanRaanan
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
Hahaha. What a clownshow.
@JordanRaanan
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
This is when it will all come out. Nothing will be leaked until like 2 minutes before
Yes, the longer we don't hear specifically that he is out or he is back means that Mara is putting it in the hands of the new GM.
Not the worst strategy by the way.
@JordanRaanan
There is definitely uncertainty from those inside the building on what ownership will do with Joe Judge. So they wait. Giants have a team meeting at noon. Judge and players are expected to do some Zoom press conferences after.
If Judge is "expected to do some Zoom press conferences after" team meeting doesn't this mean that he's still the HC?
Fired head coaches don't do (Zoom) press conferences right after they're fired.
Couldn't it just be: "What went wrong? How would you fix it going forward? Ok, Joe. We're hiring a new GM. He'll get back to you soon."
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Right. Which, alas, kills that notion.
That just doesn't make sense. It be a gutless move for an owner to leave the firing to an INCOMING GM.
You also want the new GM's first press conference to be an uplifting time, not one where he has to address whether or not he's going to fire Judge.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
As long as you hire him with the ability to fire Judge, its no big deal. Trust me, a new GM is not going to want Joe Judge.
If they're going to let Joe Judge go, Mara's already proven with Gettleman that he has this desire to let them go on their own terms. I just can't fucking possibly comprehend they see any scenario where keeping Judge is the right move. It's just that obvious. So I'm wondering if they're going to let Judge speak to the media and tell the world they've "mutually decided to part ways" and suck each other off for 20 zoom minutes.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
GM must be willing to work with Judge. And Jones.
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Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
And we better now see some long drawn-out GM search. They should have been thinking about this all year.
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to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
They can wait to hire the new HC, just get the bum HC out of the building sooner than later, so Mara isn't tempted to reverse course.
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In comment 15541624 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
GM must be willing to work with Judge. And Jones.
Agree 100%. Nightmare scenario.
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In comment 15541637 Essex said:
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In comment 15541624 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
The difference is that if you can't even come up with one example of an owner not firing his HC at the end of the season and passing that decision on to the incoming GM, then it's not what smart organizations do.
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In comment 15541658 Jim in Tampa said:
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In comment 15541637 Essex said:
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In comment 15541624 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
what is the difference? As long as we get rid of him, what does it matter?
The difference is that if you can't even come up with one example of an owner not firing his HC at the end of the season and passing that decision on to the incoming GM, then it's not what smart organizations do.
I am not really looking for process, I know Mara stinks, I am looking for substance and the substance is to get Judge out and the right people in here. So, I will live with the fact they did it in a dopey way as long as they get him out
I'm fucking done with this team if Judge is back.
i will never support them again.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
Not a medium Pepsi tho!
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to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
Hopefully they've been working on GM candidates in the back channels as it's not unheard of. But, they sure do tend to get more wrong than right at the Timex Center.
And they just drag out whatever they're going to do with Judge, which sure as hell seems like they want to do anything to keep this clown.
Typical Mara's thinking they always know best....
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to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Right. Which, alas, kills that notion.
It depends on philosophy though, right?
Who's calling the shots, the HC or the GM?
If it's going to be the GM, you have to hire a GM first and let him decide on his HC.
And a new GM usually has a HC he's already targeting....
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to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
But you don't want to hire a coach until you have the GM lined up, so I don't see the downside to leaving it up to the new GM. Just hire the new GM quickly and they should be way ahead of the game on that because they have known for a while they will need one.
I think that JonC has the take as Mara is a pusillanimous man and will let the new GM fire Judge so Mara can stay "above it"
GM must be willing to work with Judge. And Jones.
And Abrams.
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In comment 15541624 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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Literally doing nothing is all he has to do on this issue.
Get a GM, then step away and wait for the phone to ring.
Exactly just tell Judge that we are hiring a new GM and he will decide. you can make your case to him, but I am. not going to force his hand either way. Done. That is how a smart organization does it
Can you think of eve one "smart organization" that has actually let an incoming GM decide whehter he wants to keep the HC?
Colts, although I don't know if that's a smart organization given the owners antics and the Wentz trade. But when they signed Ballard, he kept Pagano for a year even though both Pagano and Griegson were on the hot seat. Ballard used that year to reshape the roster, amass draft and cap capital before moving on to Reich (after the McDaniels affair).
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to the new GM, but that would be considerable lost time in finding a new HC.
Which why not canning Gettleman weeks ago was such a stupid idea. Hell, even have him put out a statement via Hanlon three or four weeks ago saying 'yadda yadda Health reasons' and have a bunch of GM interviews lined up or completed by now.
I fear we end up in a review situation, with some business consultancy or, god forbid, Ernie, and are left with the dregs of the GM and HC packs.
Bears and Vikings both fired both today and waited. Were they not concerned?
I think this is basically how it works.
Then the stories will come out
Getting that feeling too. Now just promote Abrams and I will opt out this fall watching or even supporting this team.
GM must be willing to work with Judge. And Jones.
I’m not sure I agree. I think Judge and Jones would be Dead Men Walking in their absolute final year. If it doesn’t work, then the GM gets to do whatever he wants. I’m not even sure there would be any connection between Judge and Jones returning. They’re not picking up that option.
But I don’t even want to let the idea of Judge staying enter my thoughts.
JJ should be let go, but I'm not worried about missing out on a HC.
GM is most important to me, IMO, and that GM probably has a few guys in mind anyway that he's close to.
It's obvious John Mara does NOT want to fire Judge, and he DOES want to promote Abrams. My guess was that he was hoping for a last couple of wins as justification. Even now, he's probably talking to people to figure out how to sell this to the fans (he'll probably use Judge's talking points).
That would explain why he hasn't fired Judge (who should have been shown the door after his rant), and retained Gettleman up to the last second. The man cannot make a decision without checking the polls.
John Mara is showing why he's the worst owner in the NFL right now; he cannot make a decision on his own, he has to have someone to blame if it goes bad. Judge WILL be fired, either this year, or early next year, since there is no way to make this a competitive team in 2022 with the lousy cap management. Mara will let the new GM do it.
LOL, I must have been loaded that day. Pete Townsend says it best, We Won't Get Fooled Again, NO NO NO....