Hire Pat Murphy to replace Counsell. He was “my pick” for the Mets before the names of their actual candidates started leaking out. That’s nothing against Mendoza, didn’t even know he was on their radar until he was.
I recall that you posted a podcast interview with Pat Murphy. Listening to that interview, I came away impressed with the guy. I wish him luck with the Brew Crew, except when he plays the Mendoza Mets.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Puma says they expect to hire an ex-manager. Phil Nevin (who worked with Mendoza) in 2022 (and is up for the Padres managerial job) is one name I’ve heard, Clint Hurdle (might be joining Ron Washington in LA) is another. Doesn’t sound like David Ross is interested in coaching in 2024. Eric Chavez is almost certainly out unless he accepts a “demotion” to a lesser title than bench coach or FO position, though some teams are now carrying “associate managers” as well. Seems unlikely the Mets would do that with a rookie manager however.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Chavez was hired by the Yankees to be assistant hitting coach but it never happened as the Mets hired him away about 2 weeks later.
I recall that you posted a podcast interview with Pat Murphy. Listening to that interview, I came away impressed with the guy. I wish him luck with the Brew Crew, except when he plays the Mendoza Mets.
Fun to follow Brewers and Cubs considering the Counsell storyline AND Murphy being Counsell’s coach at ND.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Chavez was hired by the Yankees to be assistant hitting coach but it never happened as the Mets hired him away about 2 weeks later.
ah. I thought he was there the year prior. Ok so no real relationship there then.
Nevin looks like suitable pick. Hopefully he doesnt go to SD.
Is sort of this false narrative that Showalter was his own man and Mendoza won’t be. (This is in no way a knock on Buck Showalter) but Chavez, Hinske, Barnes, Hefner were all hired and/or promoted by the FO, not picked by Buck Showalter and that’s largely the norm in todays game. Buck brought in Cora, Wayne Kirby and Glenn Sherlock, so he had some say, and I expect that to be what happens with Mendoza. Ex-Mets GM Zack Scott told
me that he felt Jeremy Hefner was an asset to any organization and the Mets looked for ways to give him an even bigger role. Stearns opted to keep him so obviously he feels the same way.
were never totally on the same page, and id probably blame eppler for that more than buck because buck didnt hire himself.
i think buck is a quality manager who still has a stubborn side, is too deferential to veterans, and when things went bad last year didn't handle it well. he just kept waiting on veterans to make turns that didnt happen. neither was the right choice to transition the young players who we all knew we were on the way from before either of them were hired - though im also not sure there were any 'known' better options so it is what it is.
eppler was worse than buck because he was in charge of building org process and his org process was incoherent shit from the deadline of 2022 on. very muddled.
Sherman did a piece where he was now in charge of the Yankees and suggested calling the Mets and offering Jones/King/Hampton. I wouldn't trade Brandon Nimmo, but that's also not a bad package for the Mets. Usually these trade ideas are completely one sided.
RE: there is a narrative Showalter was his own man?
wasn't there just news that the front office was shoving Vogelbach down his throat?
Yes. The narrative very much is that Showalter was old school, did things his own way etc. But his coaching staff alone (especially in the roles that really matter ie bench coach, hitting coach, pitching coach... not his hires)
could see some trades today before the 40 man deadline. Teams looking to trade players to make room on their 40 and/or players they don't intend to add.
think Coleman Crow is the only absolute lock to be added today but I expect Jarvis to be added, they probably add Ramirez (though they may roll the dice) and I could see somebody like Suarez and/or Jackson added. I don't expect them to add a bunch of players. If they add more than 4 I'd be pretty surprised.
Jeff Young
@BaseballJeff1
Something to watch for today: The Rays have a full 40-man. The Giants and Rays have connected on a few minor 40-man moves in the past. Someone like Kameron Misner could be added or on the move today. TB is a team to watch for trades.
Sherman did a piece where he was now in charge of the Yankees and suggested calling the Mets and offering Jones/King/Hampton. I wouldn't trade Brandon Nimmo, but that's also not a bad package for the Mets. Usually these trade ideas are completely one sided.
Nimmo isn't untradeable for me if there's a good return. He is pretty likely to a corner in the next few years, he's always been injury prone, so he'll probably be a little over paid even if he's still a very good leadoff hitter.
id more doubt that there's a good return with how much is left on his contract. an interested team should just sign bellinger since the QO is lower comp than nimmo. even if it's a bit longer bellinger is 2 years younger. or one of the LF'ers to a much smaller deal. or keirmaier for way way less.
if the mets could get a good return for nimmo and just sign keirmaier as placeholder until acuna/jett/gilbert, id be ok with that. mcneil can move up to leadoff which is probably a more natural batting order spot for him than 5th or lower. reinvest some of the money saved in a LF like gurriel.
a lot of risk in the nimmo contract if the defense doesnt bounce back. but since cohen presumably knew what he was spending, im not giving him away at a discount bc of the contract, so like i said need a good return.
Sherman did a piece where he was now in charge of the Yankees and suggested calling the Mets and offering Jones/King/Hampton. I wouldn't trade Brandon Nimmo, but that's also not a bad package for the Mets. Usually these trade ideas are completely one sided.
Nimmo isn't untradeable for me if there's a good return. He is pretty likely to a corner in the next few years, he's always been injury prone, so he'll probably be a little over paid even if he's still a very good leadoff hitter.
id more doubt that there's a good return with how much is left on his contract. an interested team should just sign bellinger since the QO is lower comp than nimmo. even if it's a bit longer bellinger is 2 years younger. or one of the LF'ers to a much smaller deal. or keirmaier for way way less.
if the mets could get a good return for nimmo and just sign keirmaier as placeholder until acuna/jett/gilbert, id be ok with that. mcneil can move up to leadoff which is probably a more natural batting order spot for him than 5th or lower. reinvest some of the money saved in a LF like gurriel.
a lot of risk in the nimmo contract if the defense doesnt bounce back. but since cohen presumably knew what he was spending, im not giving him away at a discount bc of the contract, so like i said need a good return.
The proposal from Sherman (and again, he flat out admitted he the piece were about if he were running the Yankees not some news piece) is potentially a very strong one for the Mets on paper, in fact I find it very hard to believe the Yankees would do it.
Szymborski's NL ROY "ballot". Obviously has Carroll #1 but here is his Senga blurb for #2
"The Still Pretty Easy Part: Kodai Senga
I’m inclined to like Senga considerably more than his WAR simply because he has a significant history of outperforming his peripherals in Japan as well, so there’s more basis for believing in his ERA than for the typical pitcher in this position. Because of that, I’m closer to bWAR on Senga (4.4) than I am to fWAR. If forced at gunpoint to name the Dan’s Brain WAR for Senga, I’d probably put him at 3.8–4.0 or so. Also, that’s a very weird use of a firearm.
There’s always a writer or two who complains about Japanese players being eligible for the RoY award, but I think the idea that they shouldn’t be is preposterous. Nippon Professional Baseball appears a bit closer to the majors than Triple-A ball in the U.S. is — something like Triple-A 1/2 — but it’s a very different kind of league. While Triple-A hitters may be easier than NPB hitters, you’re also facing a rather different style of play and plate approaches, and now that some of the recent rule changes have hit in the majors, Triple-A ball is roughly a not-as-good MLB.
Despite facing different types of hitters, a spate of different rules, and against the backdrop of New York pressure and a collapsing team behind him, Senga was one of the few players who could really be counted on there. He had some issues with walks early on, and to his credit, he adjusted. But it wasn’t actually his control that was the issue; he actually threw more strikes earlier in the season! Instead, the issue was that after putting up an out-of-zone swing rate above 30% in each of his last two seasons in Japan, he was down in the low-20s early on with the Mets. As time went on, he got a better feel on how to lure MLB batters to their doom; in the second half, his 31.1% out-of-zone swing rate was right where it was in Japan. " Link - ( New Window )
that obviously doesn't stop most trades (max, jv) but who knows. i dont think they extended nimmo to trade him, unless they plan to also trade alonso and do more of a real reset.
Jon Morosi
@jonmorosi
Yankees are among the most active teams in the starting pitching market, and sources say they're showing early interest in Yoshinobu Yamamoto and Aaron Nola, among others.
Very encouraging words from Szymborski about Kodai Senga.
My minor concern with NPB Pitchers is that the baseball is slightly smaller (better spin rates over there), and that the NPB pitchers mound is a little different.
Kodai-san adjusted nicely last year. Now he just has to convince his good ol' buddy Yoshi Yamamoto to join the Mets.
to the rumors that Japanese players don't like to join teams with other Japanese stars out of deference to the star already there?
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
Ken Rosenthal reported that and he said it in reference to joining MLB teams. Japanese players are viewed in a "hierarchical" system so if you join a team in which there is another Japanese star you are expected to defer to him and treat him as a superior (that per Rosenthal's reporting).
to the rumors that Japanese players don't like to join teams with other Japanese stars out of deference to the star already there?
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
lol at the second question. Doesn't make much sense.
yeah, it intentionally didn't make sense, because I did not ever see the explanation DMM provided from Rosenthal.
Maybe the Mets have to trade Senga to get Yamamoto (if the Mets become a serious contender for Yamamoto but he is hesitant because of the presence of Senga).
Says SD is looking for MLB ready SP for Soto and as such has the Yankees, Mariners and Cubs as the favorites to land him
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Says SD is looking for MLB ready SP for Soto and as such has the Yankees, Mariners and Cubs as the favorites to land him
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Cubs/Yankees/Mariners all have good to very good SP options to offer in a Soto trade. Not sure why it would have to be "mediocre"
Cade Horton is a potential MLB #2, Ben Brown a 3 both are "close"
Yankees have King, Hampton, Thorpe, Will Warren
Mariners have Woo, Gilbert (MLB), Hancock, Bryce Miller
quote implies Yamamoto too lol Link - ( New Window )
i guess we can cross off the theory that yamamoto's agent was leaking the yankee interest to drive up the price for the mets. wow what a stupid self inflicted wound if true.
this is an area where cohen deserves credit - the way he respectfully stood behind his manager/gm im sure earned him some brownie points that helped get stearns (along with the $50m) and even though he had to trade 2 HOFers unexpectedly who said they didnt want to get traded, it seems like they were able to execute those moves as tactfully as possible. cohen has made the mets org extremely talent friendly.
Says SD is looking for MLB ready SP for Soto and as such has the Yankees, Mariners and Cubs as the favorites to land him
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Cubs/Yankees/Mariners all have good to very good SP options to offer in a Soto trade. Not sure why it would have to be "mediocre"
Cade Horton is a potential MLB #2, Ben Brown a 3 both are "close"
Yankees have King, Hampton, Thorpe, Will Warren
Mariners have Woo, Gilbert (MLB), Hancock, Bryce Miller
i dont know all of their systems but i do know brown a bit from him being mentioned as a possible return in an alonso trade, his numbers in AAA were a lot closer to jarvis than comfortable for me as a headliner for a big trade. if he was the headliner of an alonso trade id be thoroughly disappointed with that (and soto should bring back more than alonso would).
to Jarvis? He struck out 100 over 72 innings. His walk rate was way, way too high in AAA but he led all IL pitchers in k/9, his FIP was 4.66, Jarvis's was 7.00 with the Brewers and 6.70 with the Mets, you're also just picking one pitcher of the group I mentioned.
to Jarvis? He struck out 100 over 72 innings. His walk rate was way, way too high in AAA but he led all IL pitchers in k/9, his FIP was 4.66, Jarvis's was 7.00 with the Brewers and 6.70 with the Mets, you're also just picking one pitcher of the group I mentioned.
i picked out the 1 i know from your list who i also know has generally been considered a top 50 prospect even though he jumped up to walking 6 guys per 9, im sure there are others who are better but from looking around the league for alonso landing spots, as well as JV/scherzer landing spots, almost all the interesting arms mentioned have seemed off limits.
in the scherzer/jv trades, as well as any potential alonso trade, the mets would have probably preferred an MLB ready arm more than the padres. how many have we seen speculated on that would actually get us interested even for lesser non-soto assets? any of the other names you listed (honestly asking)?
Joe Pantorno
@JoePantorno
Carlos Mendoza not only sought advice from Luis Rojas in the interview process with the #Mets, but he also cited ex-#Mets manager Willie Randolph — who he considers a friend — as a coaching influence.
100% not being snarky, can you rephrase your question, I'm unsure what you're asking.
would you be happy with any of the names you mentioned above as the return for an alonso trade?
brown is the one i know best and if that's the main piece for an alonso trade i would not be super pumped about it.
Absolutely. Cade Horton might be the top RHP still in the minors, if he's not #1 he's damn near close, Bryce Miller, 3.98 FIP, 8.2 K/9 as a rookie with the Mariners this season, would arguably be the Mets #2 SP opening day, Woo's rookie season was "less" impressive but still struck out 9.5/9 and his underlying numbers were outstanding, near the top of the league in most key categories (linked)
(100% not looking to debate trading Alonso again, Eric asked me a question so I'm answering it).
chose 1 player that would be the toughest decision for each team today
"Mets: Justin Jarvis, RHP (No. 15)
Originally drafted by the Brewers in 2018 out of the North Carolina high school ranks, Jarvis was finding some consistent success in Double-A in 2023 and got bumped up to Triple-A before being sent to the Mets for Mark Canha, and he didn’t throw particularly well with Syracuse post-trade. But he has a four-pitch mix and could be a back-end starter capable of eating innings."
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
crazy that mets spent like $7m in bonuses combined on him and allan and neither is anywhere close to big leagues.
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
The will be a slew of minor-league trades today with 40-man rosters needing to be finalized starting with the Phillies acquiring minor league OF Hendry Mendez and infielder Robert Moore from the Milwaukee Brewers in exchange for infielder NF Oliver Dunn.
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
crazy that mets spent like $7m in bonuses combined on him and allan and neither is anywhere close to big leagues.
Allan I was fine with because he was significantly better than any other prospect available. Ginn less so because he required us to tank the remaining draft picks in that 5 round draft and I also thought Clayton Beeter and Tink Hence were close enough as prospects and would come cheaper.
Ben Badler
@BenBadler
Hendry Mendez and Robert Moore were going to rank in the 26-30 range in the Brewers Top 30.
Mendez just turned 20 and has some intriguing hitting traits from the left side, will need to hit the ball in the air with more frequency and stay on the field after dealing with injuries this year.
Laura Albanese
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
The Cincinnati Reds are expected to non-tender Nick Senzel
One of my biggest swing and misses in recent memory, LOVED HIM.
he is a slow adjuster, I'd still take a chance on him. But I am also stubborn - and in case anyone around never picked up on the fact that I hate admitting I am wrong about a player till they retired lol
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The Athletic MLB
@TheAthleticMLB
MLB's owners are expected to approve the Athletics' move to Las Vegas Thursday, sources tell @EvanDrellich
.
While the viability of the move's success is described as “iffy," the league's relocation committee perceives no better alternative.
More ⤵️
Expectation is once the ballpark plans are finalized, 2 new teams will be announced.
Laura Albanese
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
Laura Albanese
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
lol Randolf
She corrected her autocorrected immediately, I just didn't think it was worth posting.
wow that is awful. not to be morbid but puts a lot of things together that didnt make sense before. he had a procedure a few months ago and had cancer before, just awful news.
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Atlanta Braves
@Braves
The #Braves today claimed RHP Penn Murfee off waivers from the New York Mets and designated RHP Yonny Chirinos for assignment.
surprised they tried sneaking him through waivers. Yeah, he'll miss 2024 (or most of it) but they have plenty of current 40 man room and he could be placed on the 60 day once ST begins. Welp. What can you do?
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Luis Rojas is an A+ human being who had strong relationships with several players and staff. I'm sure Carlos gained valuable insights about the Mets as he prepared. I heard NYY people think Luis is one of the best coaches they've ever had which is not surprising. #Yankees #Mets
but a fantasy question, Dan: who you like better going forward: Riley Greene or Evan Carter? Looking like I may have to throw one back to the sea due to a numbers game
like both players but gun to my head probably Carter as he plays in a much better hitters ballpark, is younger and the general feeling is his tools all play up (should chip in 20+ steals). That being said both are probably future all-stars
of the more intriguing 2024 players to watch in the Mets system (Jefry Rosa). He has big boy power, we'll see how he does against better pitching (some BP video below) Link - ( New Window )
like both players but gun to my head probably Carter as he plays in a much better hitters ballpark, is younger and the general feeling is his tools all play up (should chip in 20+ steals). That being said both are probably future all-stars
Yeah, thanks. I was thinking Carter as well. Just more power potential, plus Greene seems to be injury prone. Like Greene too, just a roster crunch with too many players to keep. (13 keepers, and other 12 are Kirby, Gilbert, Skubal, Alonso, McLain, Lindor, Turner, Abrams, Encarnacion-Strand, Chourio, Soto, and Alvarez)
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
of the more intriguing 2024 players to watch in the Mets system (Jefry Rosa). He has big boy power, we'll see how he does against better pitching (some BP video below) Link - ( New Window )
a good pitcher but he's thrown 100, not 200, 100 innings twice in his career. Major buyer beware. Obviously, he has exciting upside but 30 years old with 529 CAREER innings pitched.
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
Salas likely to be added for the first time in many leagues as well.
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
Salas likely to be added for the first time in many leagues as well.
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I would keep Perez over Alvarez. It is too difficult for a catcher to be Mike Piazza these days.
This is the Mets only addition. The Mets will leave the likes of right-handed pitchers Justin Jarvis, Coleman Crow, and Joander Suarez, and utility Jeremiah Jackson exposed to the Rule 5 Draft on December 6th.
“ I'd also say that anyone talking about the latter's "upside" or "potential" should show their work because other than looking good in a uniform or taking 5 PM swings there isn't actually any granular upside or potential trait currently there, just past hype”
Interesting Jarvis, Crow, Jackson all added by Eppler not added
Seidler-dunno, guys like that sometimes get popped because they can just go on the 60 and the popping team gets a free of cost look at their rehab/ramp up (while the player gets the MLB minimum and service time), but it's very variable to what kind of reports and room other teams have
stearns leaving jarvis off probably tells us all we need to about him
crow is going to be out with tjs, not positive what the rule is w/r/t carry him after his rehab but that's one that seems like it could be a free look for someone.
all of it is probably much about nothing, it's hard enough to carry full time the brett baty's of the world without demoting them during a year. rule 5 is a pretty stupid concept, but especially for IFAs since they sign so young.
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I might go Eury over Edwin. Closers too volatile and you can still try and draft him back. Eury upside is huge. Harrison next. A C hitting 25-30 in fantasy is very valuable so keep Alvarez.
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I might go Eury over Edwin. Closers too volatile and you can still try and draft him back. Eury upside is huge. Harrison next. A C hitting 25-30 in fantasy is very valuable so keep Alvarez.
Tend to agree. Between those three and Elly. Diaz (I don’t keep closers with that few keepers) and Gimenez are out of the question for me
Seidler-dunno, guys like that sometimes get popped because they can just go on the 60 and the popping team gets a free of cost look at their rehab/ramp up (while the player gets the MLB minimum and service time), but it's very variable to what kind of reports and room other teams have
Yeah, I would have kept Crow and just IL him. A little shocked at Suarez. He was fantastic down the stretch and hit AA. What’s to stop a team from Oak that’s not in contention from taking him? I would really hate to lose him before seeing if that kind of success is sustainable
but id want alvarez and perez for sure. production at hard positions to find. eury upside is massive.
if you love elly i can see a case for his upside as #3 with the position flex. the k's could be a category killer depending on scoring but he certainly has a lot of splash production. if you are hunting upside it's not crazy to think he's one of the handful on the planet to do what acuna did last year one day. otherwise diaz or gimenez would seem to be very strong options, though maybe not potential league winners like the other 3.
K's are a massive issue for him, but he looks like a lock 30/30 guy and for the next 3 years in the 20th round that's a steal. He is my biggest sure thing to keep IMO.
Diaz is attractive to me because if he is 2022 Diaz he is a to 10 pitcher in our league since K/BB is one of our pitching stats. (W, SV, K, ERA, WHIP, and K/BB).
Eury only doubts I have are innings. How many will he pitch?
Alvarez is probably a top 15 catcher with a full season.
Harrison to me is in case someone gets hurt before I have to name my keepers.
Gimenez I kept last year and he was a disappointment, but in the 23rd round I can't complain.
Thank you all for the advice.
nothing earth shattering but martino says mets very in on yamamoto
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
Try and trade one of your big 4. Can you trade for a draft pick?
I like Mendoza's demeanor, hoping he turns out to be a Cora type.
We will see. If he doesn't work out, then send him on his way. t least this guy is collaborative and not set in his ways. Being younger helps a lot IMO. Buck is ready for the ricking chair and stubborn as a mule. He'll never manage again in all likelihood.
it's tough to evaluate someone who has never done something so
i think there's more to read from this hire about stearns than mendoza, who sounds fine but is an unknown. In that way it was a pretty ballsy choice to not hire someone with experience managing before. and to have been so clear in his conviction to move on from Buck who is a HOFer and is 1 year removed from the best season in decades. For all the problems the players did seem to enjoy playing for him.
Counsell would have been a no brainer but it seems like even there Stearns wasn't overly aggressive or desperate to bring him in.
He ran a low key process and ended up with what seems like a credible selection, but given the situation it also seems like a reasonably confident/ballsy choice. His first chance to get into a bidding war that would have won the backpages and he chose not to crack open the cohen vault even though presumably he could have if he'd wanted to. even if chicago didnt come out of nowhere it sounds like the met offer may not have even been that much higher than milwaukees.
of sheer curiosity, I wonder who the bench coach is. Mendoza has only worked for the Yankees and Stearns as a FO person has only worked for 2 teams and neither of those managers is available so if they stick to "an ex-Manager" as Puma reported, I'm curious to see who the pick is. Nevin (the one available ex-manager with Mendoza "experience" is apparently the heavy favorite for the Padres job). Mendoza praised Willie Randolph, but Willie also has been pretty open about his issues with modern analytics (maybe this doesn't even matter and they simply want a "vet" in the Don Zimmer mold. Just intrigued to see who they land on.
RE: it's tough to evaluate someone who has never done something so
i think there's more to read from this hire about stearns than mendoza, who sounds fine but is an unknown. In that way it was a pretty ballsy choice to not hire someone with experience managing before. and to have been so clear in his conviction to move on from Buck who is a HOFer and is 1 year removed from the best season in decades. For all the problems the players did seem to enjoy playing for him.
Counsell would have been a no brainer but it seems like even there Stearns wasn't overly aggressive or desperate to bring him in.
He ran a low key process and ended up with what seems like a credible selection, but given the situation it also seems like a reasonably confident/ballsy choice. His first chance to get into a bidding war that would have won the backpages and he chose not to crack open the cohen vault even though presumably he could have if he'd wanted to. even if chicago didnt come out of nowhere it sounds like the met offer may not have even been that much higher than milwaukees.
HEAVY belief is that Counsell was headed back to the Brewers before the Cubs got involved. I don't know the Mets exact final "offer" (I was told they spoke in generalities vs. presenting him with an exact number) because the Mets did not believe Counsell was strongly interested in coming to the Mets and that the Mets weren't going to get involved in a bidding war "just because".
Counsell apparently was very honest with the Mets about his preference to stay in Milwaukee when they initially spoke. The Mets were not blindsided here. Whether Mendoza was the right pick or not, we shall find out.
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Just thinking out loud here, I don't know if all 10 spots on the 40 are better than say, 7 spots plus 3 known players from your own system. I thought Orze showed promise, maybe Suarez too.
knows more than I do but they may well regret not protecting more of the arms. The Murfee thing was a flat out miscalculation. There was zero reason to put him on waivers now, if they needed a 40 man spot, then sure. It may not end up being something they regret, but they may.
knows more than I do but they may well regret not protecting more of the arms. The Murfee thing was a flat out miscalculation. There was zero reason to put him on waivers now, if they needed a 40 man spot, then sure. It may not end up being something they regret, but they may.
I agree Dan. Not sure about the thinking behind that one.
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Watch Murfee come back to haunt the Mets next year. The Metsiest thing ever.
The other name that stood out to me is Carlos De La Cruz. He's 6'8", from Yonkers and posted a 118 wRC+ this season in AA, can play all 3 OF positions and 1b... yes at 6'8" he's played some CF
On Yoshinobu Yamamoto, from @martinonyc
on Mets Hot Stove:
"A serious fit for [the Mets and Yankees], a guy that I hear is totally open to New York and a big market.
Oh boy, do the Mets like this guy. Everyone that scouted him in Japan likes him - comparisons to Tim Lincecum, 4-5 pitch guy with velocity.
Nobody that has seen him doubts that he's way better than Kodai Senga.
Kodai Senga is good. This guy is really, really, really good, potentially.
Definitely something to watch for the Mets and Yankees. It's the first free agent showdown, potentially, between the Mets and Yankees in the Steve Cohen era. He and Hal Steinbrenner have not been after the same guy yet.
Would be Cohens first real swing and miss.
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
Would be Cohens first real swing and miss.
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
In fairness, Gausman took less money to go to Toronto.
Would be Cohens first real swing and miss.
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
In fairness, Gausman took less money to go to Toronto.
Hence, the out of his control. He can’t miss here.
Jon Morosi
@jonmorosi
Sources: Dodgers among the most interested teams in RHP Yoshinobu Yamamoto, one of the top pitchers available this offseason. His posting window has yet to formally open.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
Who dat Dan?
Who? Manuel Margot? Rays OF owed 12 million who isn't very good.
if you ran a sports book and had to set the odds on which of Yamamoto/Nola/Snell ends up worth the most fwar next 3-5 years, im not really sure how you differentiate them beyond even odds. in the last 3 years only a few were worth more than nola even in a crappy pitchers park with mostly crappy D behind him. he could be a top 10 pitcher the next 3 years combined even with some regression.
as a position player soto being 5 years younger than ohtani is a bigger deal i think than with pitchers since age doesnt seem to matter quite as much. TJS in particular seems to have no age preference. if anything the younger/harder throwing guys seem to get it more than older lower velocity so you might even say yamamoto is higher risk.
the cost of acquisition may suck but my offseason plan A would probably be all in on Soto and then happy with any of those 3.
if for some reason they have big concerns on both nola/snell then maybe you go for montgomery + higher level 2/3rd arms like flaherty/lugo/imanaga.
quiet when it comes to mets rumors and not just because "Stearns runs a tight ship", not even seeing writers with "rumors" tying the Mets to anyone outside of Yamamoto.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
quiet when it comes to mets rumors and not just because "Stearns runs a tight ship", not even seeing writers with "rumors" tying the Mets to anyone outside of Yamamoto.
sort of reminiscent of eppler year 1 when the black friday news broke on canha/marte/escobar. those 3 were all very out of nowhere.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
defensive numbers have cratered and he's owed 12 million. His OPS vs. lefties was .665, in what scenario would we want him out there? He's mediocre.
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Watch Murfee come back to haunt the Mets next year. The Metsiest thing ever.
Yeah, if Penn Murfee throws even One Pitch for the Braves, I'll go ape-shit !!
Good Pitching is expensive. If one of these Mets' kids develops and gives a few years of cost-controlled innings...ouch !!
Jack Azoulay-Haron
@AzoulayHaron
The Yankees and Rays have been in touch regarding outfielder Manuel Margot, multiple sources tell @MLBNerds
. While a deal was not struck prior to the 6 PM Rule 5 deadline yesterday, Margot may still be an option for NYY, with other teams also in touch with TB regarding Margot.
Eno Sarris
@enosarris
Looks like Buddy Carlyle, who was the minor league pitching coordinator let go from the Angels just recently, has already been snapped up. He's the pitching coordinator for the Rays now. In terms of PD reputation, that's a big jump up, kind of interesting.
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
defensive numbers have cratered and he's owed 12 million. His OPS vs. lefties was .665, in what scenario would we want him out there? He's mediocre.
in the scenario where they are getting back some kind of asset that makes it worth it, like i said, and if it's off the bench in place of time that went to whoever this year's locastro or ortega would have been. the contract is obviously under water.
With Murfee claimed off of waivers @mets and Marcel Renteria hitting FA @mets currently have 9 P rehabbing from TJ (*a few injuries were never publicly announced so that number could be higher) #Mets
Jeff Passan
@JeffPassan
Big news: Major League Baseball's competition committee has proposed reducing the pitch clock with runners on base from 20 seconds to 18 seconds, sources tell ESPN. The new rule could be implemented in time for the 2024 season. Details free at ESPN:.
Jeff Passan
@JeffPassan
Big news: Major League Baseball's competition committee has proposed reducing the pitch clock with runners on base from 20 seconds to 18 seconds, sources tell ESPN. The new rule could be implemented in time for the 2024 season. Details free at ESPN:.
.@JonHeyman
believes that Yoshinobu Yamamoto has a 'preference' for the west coast 👀
But what are his realistic options there? The Giants and the Dodgers are the only ones. Let's say Ohtani signs with the Dodgers. Will they then ALSO go for YY? I have no idea about the Giants'spending habits. The Padres are broke, the A's are moving, and the Angels are weird. Seattle is the last one. They could easily be an option, but again, how much are they willing to spend?
Isn't is being reported that YY would like to be in a major market? Seattle ain't exactly that. The Dodgers are the only ones I fear getting YY if they strike out on Ohtani. IF they do, then I'm not so concerned. Sounds like the agent is drumming up interest in a big bidding war to me. The Yankees and the Mets seem to be the best fits though IMO. This is gonna be fascinating. Maybe not LeBron level, but fascinating nonetheless to follow.
The Padres, Dodgers and Giants are all interested in free-agent left-hander Blake Snell, reports Jon Heyman of The New York Post in a discussion with Lauren Shehadi of MLB Network (video courtesy of MLB Network on X).
The Padres, Dodgers and Giants are all interested in free-agent left-hander Blake Snell, reports Jon Heyman of The New York Post in a discussion with Lauren Shehadi of MLB Network (video courtesy of MLB Network on X).
Interesting. Guess we're all waiting to see which domino is the first to fall at this point.
Seattle adding Bolton for cash
Mets picking up Murfee until...
Braves sniping the Mets
Rays picking up Alexander off of waivers
Padres picking up Estrada off of waivers
Braves picking up Pedromo off of waivers
- Cash had to be part of the deal as staying under the luxury tax was a mandate
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
- Cash had to be part of the deal as staying under the luxury tax was a mandate
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
the other thing about PCA at that time is he was out for year with shoulder surgery and you never know how a player will bounce back from that. conforto just had the lowest power year of his career. that as a total unknown/risk any trading team was taking.
was also almost untested so recently drafted so it was almost like if the mets were to deal Houck this offseason, and he were to have some kind of significant injury on top of that.
i think that deal may have come down to a choice between matt allan and pca and the mets just chose the wrong injured guy.
the bigger issue with the deal was that baez ended up not being someone they extended (fortunately). had he been the .850+ ops 4/5 hitter behind alonso they still havent found (and a GG at 2b) that would have been a good trade. would he have continued hitting well here or tanked like he has in detroit? no idea but he is clearly a guy that needs to be in a good line up or else he expands the zone to an unhealthy level. that was true in chicago and now detroit where his contract looks as bad or worse than marte.
- Cash had to be part of the deal as staying under the luxury tax was a mandate
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
Small sample size, but in 6 games in A ball with the Mets, he hit .417 with more walks than Ks and a couple SBs. Didn't have much time before being injured, but showed quite well. Agreed with PJ. Doesn't outright say drafted solely for his glove. They don't have the concerns about his bat when they draft him, but they do after hitting .417? Make it make sense. The only way the trade ever made sense is if Baez was a player worth signing to an extension. They didn't when they traded for him (luckily in hindsight), and they didn't after he was here
enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
- Cash had to be part of the deal as staying under the luxury tax was a mandate
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
Small sample size, but in 6 games in A ball with the Mets, he hit .417 with more walks than Ks and a couple SBs. Didn't have much time before being injured, but showed quite well. Agreed with PJ. Doesn't outright say drafted solely for his glove. They don't have the concerns about his bat when they draft him, but they do after hitting .417? Make it make sense. The only way the trade ever made sense is if Baez was a player worth signing to an extension. They didn't when they traded for him (luckily in hindsight), and they didn't after he was here
From when the trade was made
"The cost for acquiring this pair was not insignificant, but it’s nothing the Mets can’t weather. The 19-year-old Crow-Armstrong was the 19th pick of the 2020 draft out of Los Angeles’ Harvard-Westlake High School, and was sixth on the Mets’ prospect list, with a 45 FV. He had only just begun his professional career, playing six games for the team’s A-level Port St. Lucie affiliate before tearing his labrum and damaging articular cartilage in his right (non-throwing shoulder), requiring season-ending surgery. Both his hit tool and his power grade out as average, not plus, but he’s a 60-grade runner and a 70+-grade defender. As Kevin Goldstein summarized, “He’s a potential impact defender with enough bat to play every day and hit seventh, or maybe second on a bad team.”"
The 19th overall pick in last year’s draft, Crow-Armstrong got off to a 10-for-24 start this season at Low-A St. Lucie before suffering a torn labrum in his left (non-throwing) shoulder that required season-ending surgery. He ranked as the Mets No. 6 prospect in their midseason update. Crow-Armstrong is an elite defensive center fielder for his age. He is a graceful athlete with plus speed who glides to the ball and makes the position look easy. He has elite instincts, plays fast and has a plus arm, giving him all the tools to be a perennial Gold Glove defender in the future. At the plate Crow-Armstrong takes controlled, mature at-bats, doesn’t have many holes in his swing and uses the whole field, but he doesn’t hit the ball very hard and has a lot of strength gains he needs to make. He has room to get more physical and add power, but it will be a long process. Crow-Armstrong’s speed, defense and instincts are carrying assets that should help him rise to the majors. Even if he just hits .250 with 10-15 home runs, he’ll be an everyday regular in center field.
I'm not defending the Mets, but yeah the word was his bat was only "okay" and his glove was A++
enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
?? He flat out said the Cubs made significant swing changes. Are you disagreeing with him? Because I'm not the one who said it.
"As an amateur, Crow-Armstrong had a contact-oriented approach at the plate that yielded line drives to all fields but not much home run power. After he switched organizations, Chicago helped him upgrade his left-handed stroke. He holds his hands higher and keeps his swing on plane longer, enabling him to pull and lift balls more easily."
"When the Mets made Crow-Armstrong the 19th overall pick in the 2020 Draft -- three selections after the Cubs took local high school shortstop Ed Howard -- the Harvard-Westlake School (Los Angeles) product was regarded a quality center fielder with plus speed but came with some questions about his offensive upside. That's no longer the case."
So yeah, Scott's statements 100% fit within the facts. Doesn't change it was a bad trade.
but if im remembering right that was the middle year with no DH so the mets couldnt get him. he undoubtedly would have cost less than PCA and had the mets extended him the vogelbach trade never happens.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
PCA trade was horrendous at the time and looks even worse now. We all knew deGrom was done for the year and the Mets ignored it. Scott even says they knew it was a possibility yet then tried to make an "all in" move.
If we look at the thread from when he was traded I bet 90% of us disagreed with it at the time.
enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
?? He flat out said the Cubs made significant swing changes. Are you disagreeing with him? Because I'm not the one who said it.
Yes, I disagree with him in trying to justify this trade to salvage his career or whatever his goal is. They traded a recent first round pick for a mediocre rental player when they didn't have much realistic hope of going far that year. Fine, PCA wasn't projected to be top 10 prospect worthy. But even with an exceptional glove at CF, his speed, and hitting .250 with 15 HR, that is a very valuable player.
The only way the deal made sense was signing Baez to a long-term deal. They didn't and he clearly wasn't a player worth signing to a long-term deal. So, they gave up one of the top prospects in the system for what exactly? Oh, but that's ok because the Mets would have sucked in developing him? Scott's a clown.
RE: you know what sucks? that same deadline schwarber got dealt cheap
but if im remembering right that was the middle year with no DH so the mets couldnt get him. he undoubtedly would have cost less than PCA and had the mets extended him the vogelbach trade never happens.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
I legitimately have never heard of the guy they traded Schwarber for. Aldo Ramirez? That was his final season in baseball (not kidding).
PCA trade was horrendous at the time and looks even worse now. We all knew deGrom was done for the year and the Mets ignored it. Scott even says they knew it was a possibility yet then tried to make an "all in" move.
If we look at the thread from when he was traded I bet 90% of us disagreed with it at the time.
He said at the time they knew it was probably a net negative long term move but didn't feel it was strongly one. Acknowledged they knew deGrom was probably not going to pitch again, which is more of a ?? because the only pitching they add was Williams/Rich Hill.
RE: you know what sucks? that same deadline schwarber got dealt cheap
but if im remembering right that was the middle year with no DH so the mets couldnt get him. he undoubtedly would have cost less than PCA and had the mets extended him the vogelbach trade never happens.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
Endy was lower rated than PCA, and at least Luchessi has been a cost-controlled backend rotation starter for the Mets for a couple years.
RE: RE: you know what sucks? that same deadline schwarber got dealt cheap
but if im remembering right that was the middle year with no DH so the mets couldnt get him. he undoubtedly would have cost less than PCA and had the mets extended him the vogelbach trade never happens.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
Endy was lower rated than PCA, and at least Luchessi has been a cost-controlled backend rotation starter for the Mets for a couple years.
im not saying it was predictable, just that the outcome was arguably just as bad or worse.
again the biggest thing everyone likes to forget is that PCA had the shoulder surgery which was a total unknown. that's not an insignificant injury for a guy whose power was already a major ?.
to the Cubs in a deal headlined by Christopher Morel would be one of the worst trades the Mets have made in recent history. Morel wouldn't crack my top 5 "wants" from the Cubs and I say that as someone who has more of an open mind trading Alonso than some others. Morel's essentially a slightly more versatile Vientos.
Jarrett Seidler
@jaseidler
my favorite running game is the Cubs leaking the most preposterous shit on the planet through the same half a dozen extremely gullible “reporters” and it then being credulously reported throughout baseball thus making it seem like they’re trying way harder than they actually are
to the Cubs in a deal headlined by Christopher Morel would be one of the worst trades the Mets have made in recent history. Morel wouldn't crack my top 5 "wants" from the Cubs and I say that as someone who has more of an open mind trading Alonso than some others. Morel's essentially a slightly more versatile Vientos.
Any Alonso to Mets deal starts with Horton and getting PCA back haha.
listening to the Zack Scott interview and his non mets thoughts are
really interesting. as an analytics guy he thinks teams have too many people in analytics at this point to negative detriment.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
PCA wasn't very good at the time we traded him, so we traded him. But if the Mets didn't think he was very good, why did they just draft him in the 1st round? And what, in the 6 games where he played for the organization and had a .417 BA and 1.063 made them change their organizational assessment of him?
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
PCA wasn't very good at the time we traded him, so we traded him. But if the Mets didn't think he was very good, why did they just draft him in the 1st round? And what, in the 6 games where he played for the organization and had a .417 BA and 1.063 made them change their organizational assessment of him?
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
He's saying they didn't think PCA was going to be a big offensive player. A GG caliber CFer still has value. The guy went 19th overall, he wasn't some top 5 pick. What he's saying is probably accurate, they didn't think PCA would hit for power and he has.
to the Cubs in a deal headlined by Christopher Morel would be one of the worst trades the Mets have made in recent history. Morel wouldn't crack my top 5 "wants" from the Cubs and I say that as someone who has more of an open mind trading Alonso than some others. Morel's essentially a slightly more versatile Vientos.
Any Alonso to Mets deal starts with Horton and getting PCA back haha.
PCA wasn't very good at the time we traded him, so we traded him. But if the Mets didn't think he was very good, why did they just draft him in the 1st round? And what, in the 6 games where he played for the organization and had a .417 BA and 1.063 made them change their organizational assessment of him?
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
He's saying they didn't think PCA was going to be a big offensive player. A GG caliber CFer still has value. The guy went 19th overall, he wasn't some top 5 pick. What he's saying is probably accurate, they didn't think PCA would hit for power and he has.
The only way the trade even made an iota of sense was if they signed Baez to a long-term deal. They didn't. It made no sense at the time with what evaluations of PCA were. An excellent CF glove with good speed, decent bat to ball ability, a good eye, and only a little bit of power. Now that he has developed more power? Even more dreadful of a trade. We know, Scott. You suck even more than we thought you did. Congrats?
wanted to sign Baez to a long term deal, Sandy made this clear.
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
It would have, but you just said that's the only way it made sense. That was what they were openly hoping to do.
I said if they signed him to a long-term deal. Not if they hoped to sign him to a long-term deal. An important distinction. Like between the two following sentences: 1. I am leaving my girlfriend for Margot Robbie and 2. I am leaving my girlfriend in hopes of getting Margot Robbie.
Only way the trade made any bit of sense in the context of PCA's value as a prospect, the Mets hope of making the playoffs and doing anything meaningful, and Baez' value as a player was if they signed an extension with him. They didn't. They didn't re-sign him as a FA either. Which turns out they dodged a bullet.
I always saw PCA as a Nimmo type with more speed and a better glove. Nimmo developed more power as he went on in his career. Not crazy to think PCA might do the same. Regardless, even without the power boost, PCA was a very valuable prospect and shouldn't have been traded for a rental of a player like Baez in a season like that.
even less when you consider they knew deGrom was likely done for the year (like most of us feared)
Baez was going to be FA even trading your #5 or #6 whatever it said prospect for the chance to negotiate directly with Baez was a price too steep for a team not contending.
Sort of like a worse version of the Leonard Williams trade the Giants made.
The only good news is Baez has been so bad in his two years with DET it's good they f-ed up and didn't sign him long-term.
wanted to sign Baez to a long term deal, Sandy made this clear.
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
It would have, but you just said that's the only way it made sense. That was what they were openly hoping to do.
I said if they signed him to a long-term deal. Not if they hoped to sign him to a long-term deal. An important distinction. Like between the two following sentences: 1. I am leaving my girlfriend for Margot Robbie and 2. I am leaving my girlfriend in hopes of getting Margot Robbie.
Only way the trade made any bit of sense in the context of PCA's value as a prospect, the Mets hope of making the playoffs and doing anything meaningful, and Baez' value as a player was if they signed an extension with him. They didn't. They didn't re-sign him as a FA either. Which turns out they dodged a bullet.
I always saw PCA as a Nimmo type with more speed and a better glove. Nimmo developed more power as he went on in his career. Not crazy to think PCA might do the same. Regardless, even without the power boost, PCA was a very valuable prospect and shouldn't have been traded for a rental of a player like Baez in a season like that.
Steve Cohen 100% could have outbid the Tigers, the Mets decided not to do so, and offered him a reported 40 million below what the Cubs did. They decided they didn't want him back, he would still be a Met right now if the did.
Margot Robbie example is completely absurd. The Mets given the money of the owner 99.9% could have brought back Baez if they wanted to. Your example doesn't have such a locked in outcome.
if baez continued playing the way he did as a met multi-year
that wouldn't have been a good trade? he had an .886 ops as a met and at age 28 put up a 4 fwar season - which was his 3rd 4+ fwar full season in a row. his age 25 and age 26 all star seasons were actually better. the only down year was the shortened age 27 2020 covid partial season.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
RE: if baez continued playing the way he did as a met multi-year
that wouldn't have been a good trade? he had an .886 ops as a met and at age 28 put up a 4 fwar season - which was his 3rd 4+ fwar full season in a row. his age 25 and age 26 all star seasons were actually better. the only down year was the shortened age 27 2020 covid partial season.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
but he was a pending FA, unless you had some advantage of acquiring him that made it more likely he'd sign with you, why trade any prospects in a dead season?
especially with you have Cohen's wallet behind you and can outbid anyone making the decision easier.
is the deadline to tender contracts. Does Vogey go?
id be pretty shocked if he's not gone. the opportunity cost of the roster spot isn't worth a mediocre hitter even at a cheap price if he cant play anywhere in the field.
stearns mentioned that they want to give young players chances but its unrealistic to expect all of them to be ready for those chances right away, which is 100% right. they need to have some veteran options who can play in the field if necessary. your justin turner idea is a great example of that, or perhaps one of the OF/DH options like gurriel or soler.
they need to get right the versatile roster construction eppler talked about (but couldn't deliver).
Margot Robbie example is completely absurd. The Mets given the money of the owner 99.9% could have brought back Baez if they wanted to. Your example doesn't have such a locked in outcome.
And that's the entire point. They didn't deem Baez worthy enough to keep around for more than a rental at the price he got. Why give up an asset like PCA for a rental when they were on the ropes anyway? Scott seem to be saying it was ok because they didn't think PCA would have the power he developed. Wrong. It was a bad trade then. Looking back it was a much worse trade. It was never justified for a rental, regardless of Scott's failed evaluations of PCA
Margot Robbie example is completely absurd. The Mets given the money of the owner 99.9% could have brought back Baez if they wanted to. Your example doesn't have such a locked in outcome.
And that's the entire point. They didn't deem Baez worthy enough to keep around for more than a rental at the price he got. Why give up an asset like PCA for a rental when they were on the ropes anyway? Scott seem to be saying it was ok because they didn't think PCA would have the power he developed. Wrong. It was a bad trade then. Looking back it was a much worse trade. It was never justified for a rental, regardless of Scott's failed evaluations of PCA
? It was a terrible process (and the thumbs down stuff likely didn't help) but they pretty clearly intended to bring Baez back, Sandy was on record stating as much. As for Scott's failed evaluations, he flat out said "we", Zack Scott certainly wasn't traded PCA on an island with others in the organization saying they loved him and he was a future star.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
·
2h
It was fun talking about Four Rings, Yankees analytics, Carlos Mendoza, and what goes into a deadline deal like the Baez trade. Happy to answer questions asked in the comments. #Mets #Yankees #RedSox
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Baseball Isn’t Boring
@BBisntBoring
·
4h
Morning podcast: Just outstanding stuff from @ZackScottSports talking @FourRingsSports, team-building, Cashman's take on the Yankees' analytics world, managerial candidates and the inside story for one big Mets trade.
Listen: https://pdst.fm/e/chtbl.com/track/42D75/traffic.megaphone.fm/CAD4289359628.mp3?updated=1700140387
Win: http://Fanduel.com/boring
Show more
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
·
1h
Hey @ZackScottSports
, just listened and didn’t hear an answer to my question. How close were you to this bigger trade with the Cubs? Who was the major leaguer you were going to get and who was the other big Mets prospect and player you were considering dealing?
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Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
·
23h
Former Mets GM Zack Scott says tomorrow he will explain the reasoning behind why the Mets did the Javy Baez/Trevor Williams for PCA trade at the 2021 trade deadline. Wonder if he touches on @Ken_Rosenthal’s reporting in Aug 2021 and explains this aspect of talks as well. twitter.com/zackscottsport…
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Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Then the catchers were dropped from the concept and at one point I asked for Bryant to be added. It was clear that they liked what they had for Bryant elsewhere so that quickly went nowhere. #Cubs #Mets
RE: RE: if baez continued playing the way he did as a met multi-year
that wouldn't have been a good trade? he had an .886 ops as a met and at age 28 put up a 4 fwar season - which was his 3rd 4+ fwar full season in a row. his age 25 and age 26 all star seasons were actually better. the only down year was the shortened age 27 2020 covid partial season.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
but he was a pending FA, unless you had some advantage of acquiring him that made it more likely he'd sign with you, why trade any prospects in a dead season?
especially with you have Cohen's wallet behind you and can outbid anyone making the decision easier.
the advantage you have is knowing if cohen want to retain a player he can retain a player just like he did with nimmo/diaz. before baez signed in detroit the mets had deals with marte, escobar, canha, scherzer and may have also added gausman. they just chose to spend the $ on different players because a different gm with a different vision came in.
here were the standings the day the mets made the trade:
the guys atlanta dealt for propelled them to a WS win - soler was WS MVP - even knowing Acuna was out for the year.
texas just won a WS after being aggressive at the deadline knowing JDG was 100% out for the year.
from that day forward obviously the team collapsed and PCA's rehab/development ended up at the farthest end of the good outcome as possible for the cubs, but even there i think the loss for the mets is overstated unless he ends up on some kind of even crazier MVP-level outcome. The mets did what they had to do to extend Nimmo in CF who is probably still a more valuable player for several seasons, and if they want to go buy a 2-4 win OF'er they can easily do so almost any offseason (this one included). It just costs more $, which is something cohen is willing to do. PCA's prospects of succeeding right away probably aren't different than Baty's were at this time a year ago so while you hate to give up any asset for what amounted to very little, there's a good amount of prospect shine on him that will be gone as quickly as it was with kelenic if the 30% k-rate doesn't improve.
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better.
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
It was PCA and "another top prospect". I'm guessing it was Mauricio. There were rumors of Contreras for Mauricio.
Image
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Then the catchers were dropped from the concept and at one point I asked for Bryant to be added. It was clear that they liked what they had for Bryant elsewhere so that quickly went nowhere. #Cubs #Mets
wow that would have been a massive deal.
i think that return would have had to have been (alvarez?).
clearly they dropped to an at the time lesser prospect in PCA for a lesser return.
Kimbrel brough back madrigal by himself, so Baez + Kimbrel + Contreras would have been something a lot more valuable than PCA which is probably alvarez.
BA's top mets prospects updated after the deadline were:
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
It was PCA and "another top prospect". I'm guessing it was Mauricio. There were rumors of Contreras for Mauricio.
i think it had to be alvarez. mets were getting back contreras under control for 2 years and kimbrel who brought back madrigal, who by himself was probably a better prospect than mauricio at that point in time.
madrigal was a consensus top 40 prospect pre-2021, #12 on BP, and hitting .305 for CWS in the big leagues when dealt.
mauricio was a consensus top 100 prospect but not top 50 on any list. alvarez was top 50 on BA and pipeline.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
had 1 year of control left, 2022 was his final season with the Cubs
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
had 1 year of control left, 2022 was his final season with the Cubs
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
The trade was consummated 7/30/2021, that's not 2 seasons of control. 2 seasons of control would be the Mets adding a player now, signed through 2025.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Sort of touches on that here.
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better."
had 1 year of control left, 2022 was his final season with the Cubs
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
The trade was consummated 7/30/2021, that's not 2 seasons of control. 2 seasons of control would be the Mets adding a player now, signed through 2025.
lets not do the pedantic thing, the nomenclature around that is always inconsistent. I didnt say he had 2 more seasons of control i said he had 2 seasons of control, which technically they would have gotten. control of contreras in 2 seasons not 1. yes 1.5 would have been a more accurate way of saying it.
I wasn't trying to be snarky. If you trade for a player at the deadline who has 1 year remaining usually people say that, they don't say you traded for a player with "2 seasons" left.
like Zack Scott is talking a lot. I wonder how people still employed will react to this. Not sure if he has any desire to get back involved with a franchise, but I doubt that they would be happy with the glimpse into the sausage making.
am I wrong on this and people don't care or would they think he's over-sharing.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Sort of touches on that here.
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better."
i thought he made the right decision between those 2 (and baez did perform).
it's weird but the not discussed enough poison pill of 2021/2023 was Carrasco.
1-5 with a 6 era in his 12 starts 2nd half 2021.
3-8 with a near 7 era in his 20 starts this year.
in 2021 they rushed him back without rehab starts and i guess last year he was decent but he was an almost auto-L every 5th day in the 2 parts of years where they massively underperformed. obviously wasnt just him but had he been just league average either year could have turned out differently.
like Zack Scott is talking a lot. I wonder how people still employed will react to this. Not sure if he has any desire to get back involved with a franchise, but I doubt that they would be happy with the glimpse into the sausage making.
am I wrong on this and people don't care or would they think he's over-sharing.
Got a ring with the Rangers and Stearns reached out to him before taking the Mets job so I don't think it's going to impact him much at all. He's stated he won't trades involving players who ended up not being traded/are still with the team that didn't trade them.
I wasn't trying to be snarky. If you trade for a player at the deadline who has 1 year remaining usually people say that, they don't say you traded for a player with "2 seasons" left.
thats because it is most commonly phrased in present tense moments so it makes the most sense to say "x more years of control".
we are talking about it retroactively so i was summing up how many total years the mets would have received. the precise number was 1.5 seasons (or 1.333) i imprecisely said "2" because bbi isnt the wsj and i didnt think i needed to use decimals.
yet to see him say anything particularly critical about anyone tbh, which is probably by design. Has only said positive things about guys like Mendoza (who he interviewed in Boston).
is the closest he's come to being critical and it was aimed at Heyman for saying the Mets should have hired somebody else
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Bad take. After 2020, Carlos was one of 3 finalists in Boston before we brought Alex Cora back. We spoke to 10 candidates with no ML managerial experience, and he was by far the most prepared to be a manager on day 1. Good hire! #NYM #Mets #Yankees #RedSox"
he's also running his own business so its promotion
he mentioned on the podcast he considers jobs back in leagues but for now it sounds like he's open to consulting on a pretty wide range of things and these types of things (along with twitter) are probably his primary means of getting his name out there beyond his existing network.
Daniel Vogelbach (5.138): $2.6MM
Trevor Gott (5.057): $2MM
Drew Smith (5.034): $2.3MM
Pete Alonso (5.000): $22MM
Luis Guillorme (4.159): $1.7MM
Joey Lucchesi (4.112): $2MM
Sam Coonrod (4.078): $900K
Jeff Brigham (3.142): $1.1MM
David Peterson (3.089): $2MM
DJ Stewart (2.168): $1.5MM
My guesses are Gott, Alonso, Smith, Guillorme, Lucchesi, Peterson and Stewart are all tendered and the rest are non-tendered. Guillorme is the one I'm least confident will be tendered.
Anyone have a link to the interview, I'd be curious to hear it
metZZ 1986🛜
@bkfan09
Add another interesting prospect to keep an eye on in 2024 , Acosta coming back from injury at the end of the DSL season , Went 4-4 in today’s Rangers vs. Mets instructs , now the game means nothing but it’s good to see him heathy
Loose lips sink ships — or, in this case, MLB teams’ chances of signing Shohei Ohtani.
Teams pursuing the top free agent — such as the Mets and perhaps the Yankees — have been informed that leaks will hurt their chances of bringing home the two-way superstar.
“If visits between Ohtani and a team are reported publicly, it will be held against the team, so the circles will be tiny and tight,” ESPN’s Jeff Passan reported.
WFAN host Greg Giannotti had a more sinister theory, though, about the awkward delivery and what may have caused it.
“I have heard, I have been told, that Gary, Keith, and Ron over the last number of years are never down talking to the players anymore.” Giannotti said earlier this week on “Boomer and Gio.”
“They don’t, and the players and the managers and the coaches, they can’t stand the fact that these guys are so popular, and they sit up there and pontificate in the booth, but they’re never down there talking to the players and they’re like bigger than life.
“My theory on this is that someone was needling Gary, Keith, and Ron and gave Mendoza that line. Because he goes, ‘Deep conversations.’ That is my take on this.”
He later added: “I just know that this past year, in particular, they were never talking to the players.”
RE: RE: Anyone have a link to the interview, I'd be curious to hear it
But, from reading the comments here, he made one very big bold faced lie lol
To Scott's credit, he's done a good job fixing his name around the sport, glad to see that.
here's the link, now spill them beans. or at least throw some clues. https://dcs.megaphone.fm/CAD4289359628.mp3?key=15b9cfe91bd59ead10c0c280cd9cd5ad&request_event_id=8b79d8e8-a018-4ed2-81a0-c7614b7fbbc9 - ( New Window )
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
One thing I did notice about the A's, despite their payrolls they have been able to mostly put together competent bullpens. Middle of the pack in FIP, era and fWAR 2015-2022. Horrendous in 2023.
WFAN host Greg Giannotti had a more sinister theory, though, about the awkward delivery and what may have caused it.
“I have heard, I have been told, that Gary, Keith, and Ron over the last number of years are never down talking to the players anymore.” Giannotti said earlier this week on “Boomer and Gio.”
“They don’t, and the players and the managers and the coaches, they can’t stand the fact that these guys are so popular, and they sit up there and pontificate in the booth, but they’re never down there talking to the players and they’re like bigger than life.
“My theory on this is that someone was needling Gary, Keith, and Ron and gave Mendoza that line. Because he goes, ‘Deep conversations.’ That is my take on this.”
He later added: “I just know that this past year, in particular, they were never talking to the players.”
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
thats interesting - id imagine big name players often make their feelings known (max sort of did the same thing this year) but this seems notable given what ended up transpiring with the thumbs down stuff. rojas and scott obviously seemed in over their heads managing a clubhouse that august (and in scotts case his own decision making), so i suppose this could be read in that direction as well.
having seen how the searches for execs played out in the following offseasons, i wonder how much the owners (or wilpons) set the deal to close at the most inconvenient time possible for cohen a few days after the offseason began.
really interesting. as an analytics guy he thinks teams have too many people in analytics at this point to negative detriment.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
I don't know if hockey is as reductive as baseball.
Analytics on football still aren't on par with baseball because of so many variables so I'm not sure hockey can be boiled down the same way either.
I have seen goal shares, win shares, expected goals, and other stats, but I don't think it's as easy to isolate an individual in any sport as it is in baseball with batter vs pitcher. everything else can be neutralized and therefore outcomes made somewhat predictable.
Can they do that in hockey?
What are the actions they could measure? shot velocity? release angle? I'd love to hear more but I'm naturally skeptical.
RE: RE: listening to the Zack Scott interview and his non mets thoughts are
really interesting. as an analytics guy he thinks teams have too many people in analytics at this point to negative detriment.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
I don't know if hockey is as reductive as baseball.
Analytics on football still aren't on par with baseball because of so many variables so I'm not sure hockey can be boiled down the same way either.
I have seen goal shares, win shares, expected goals, and other stats, but I don't think it's as easy to isolate an individual in any sport as it is in baseball with batter vs pitcher. everything else can be neutralized and therefore outcomes made somewhat predictable.
Can they do that in hockey?
What are the actions they could measure? shot velocity? release angle? I'd love to hear more but I'm naturally skeptical.
i agree, nothing is as statistically reductive as baseball. every batter/pitcher is an isolated individual event.
for hockey, like nextgen with nfl or statcast w/ mlb, i think the path forward is going to be based on movement tracking. acceleration, topspeed, "open rates", shot probability for goals over expectation, stuff like that.
i think natural stat trick and expected goals/high danger is the closest public data ive seen but i believe their methodology is just location based. shots from location x go in y% of the time. adding in the shot quality based on velocity/location/etc would take that to a different level and if had a database for all players id imagine we'd see a guy like mcdavid with just ridiculously higher adjusted scoring %. and conversely probably help quantify which goalies make the "hardest" saves.
so far all the hockey stuff I see is really just confirming what you saw, not predictive of an outcome or a likely/possible outcome.
It would be cool if they could do that - since it would help players know what skills to focus on. IOW if speed is not an material indicator/differentiator (it is) but edges are (they are too), that would be good to know for development (for example). Same with shot type, release angle, shot velocity, etc.
so far all the hockey stuff I see is really just confirming what you saw, not predictive of an outcome or a likely/possible outcome.
It would be cool if they could do that - since it would help players know what skills to focus on. IOW if speed is not an material indicator/differentiator (it is) but edges are (they are too), that would be good to know for development (for example). Same with shot type, release angle, shot velocity, etc.
guys like mcdavid are so good anyone can watch them and guess that they just constantly moving faster/shooting harder than everyone else. where it will be predictive is in finding guys who are underrated because their shot quality is better than whatever their present results are. not dissimilar to how a player like vientos' exit velocities/expected stats predicted that given regular playing time putting up numbers like he did in september was within reach and maybe even likely. the real numbers caught up with expected numbers.
family not expected to sell the Padres, we'll see what happens down the line but that's the claim.
"Now Kutsenda, a co-founder and managing partner at Seidler’s private equity firm, has assumed control on a temporary basis. While it is unclear how long Kutsenda will serve in that capacity, league sources said the Seidler family intends to honor Seidler’s wishes by retaining ownership of the Padres. Seidler and his extended family own a combined majority of the franchise, according to sources, with Seidler’s stake having been transferred to a trust."
RE: RE: RE: RE: Anyone have a link to the interview, I'd be curious to hear it
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
thats interesting - id imagine big name players often make their feelings known (max sort of did the same thing this year) but this seems notable given what ended up transpiring with the thumbs down stuff. rojas and scott obviously seemed in over their heads managing a clubhouse that august (and in scotts case his own decision making), so i suppose this could be read in that direction as well.
having seen how the searches for execs played out in the following offseasons, i wonder how much the owners (or wilpons) set the deal to close at the most inconvenient time possible for cohen a few days after the offseason began.
That's disgusting. NEVER let the inmates run the asylum. Lindor need to sht up and play ball. Scott's a moron.
Someone just texted me laughing, that he supposedly said this today
Don’t blame Lindor, Sandy or Cohen, they had nothing to do with the Baez trade. But it was made crystal clear to me that we needed to make a really big trade. Which forced my hands
Was it the guy in the third row, fifth seat giving him looks? WTF does that mean?? It wasn’t them, but they forced the trade. But they had nothing to do with it either 🤣
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
This seems like a crazy overpay for a solid RP. I'm sure the Braves will unlock him further and he'll turn into a shut down closer though.
The Vogey Tender thing is sort of a Litmus Test for the new regime.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
The Vogey Tender thing is sort of a Litmus Test for the new regime.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
Yeah, not going to lose sleep over Vogelbach if they tender him. As you said, he's cheap. They don't know what the offseason will bring. They will be, of course, looking for upgrades, but I'd rather them put money towards pitching if some of these DH guys are out of control price wise
has to be non-tendered. It's inexcusable to tender him or even contemplate keeping him.
He likely will not be. But just because he's tendered doesn't mean he's getting 300 ABs. They could for instance, trade him for a lower level "prospect" once they (as anticipated) sign another player to replace him. Tendering a contract is but one piece in the offseason puzzle. Not going to lose sleep either way.
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
This seems like a crazy overpay for a solid RP. I'm sure the Braves will unlock him further and he'll turn into a shut down closer though.
i think the braves wanted to remove those guys from their 40 man any way so this was just cashing in a bunch of spare parts for 1 usable player. maybe they would have been happy to keep 1 or 2 of them, but the others were just fodder.
it's sort of like a mets package of butto, nido, drew smith + an org filler prospect out of top 30. id happily cash that type of group in for a late game reliever under control for a few years.
says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Same here GF. That Murfee thing perplexed me too. I think logic will prevail with the Vogelsnack thing today, but you never know with this franchise. Hopefully Stearns can read the room...
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
lol. The comments would be hilarious, no doubt Shecky!
says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
The Vogey Tender thing is sort of a Litmus Test for the new regime.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Would love to hear your thinking behind this one.
I kept hearing rumors that Stearns had the inside scoop on whatever Counsell was thinking. When the deal finally went down, the SNY headline was 'David Stearns Surprised by Counsell's Cubs move'.
Fastball fouled back into the screen.
There were a couple of minor league pitchers that had shown some promise last summer. Suarez and Orze come to mind. Penn Murfee, could have easily been parked and then moved to the IL. The Mets 40-man was put together with only 33 players, leaving some guys unprotected. They got scooped on it. Did the Front Office expect to grab 7 players to fill out their roster?
Hanging curveball, fouled into the dugout.
Vogelbach has shown little as a far as a prototypical DH (Vientos almost out-homered him in far fewer at bats), and Vogey has no positional value.
In my opinion, the fan base is looking for a certain outcome on this one.
says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
This kind of injury is potentially career-ending. There is almost no chance he pitches 1/3 of 2024. Odds are he doesn't throw a pitch until 2025, not really sure how "optimistic" one can be on major shoulder surgery that he just had 4 weeks ago. If he misses all of 2024, then you're probably not offering him a QO. 12 million + the cost to acquire for a guy who more likely than not doesn't throw a pitch for your team is an odd move.
says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
This kind of injury is potentially career-ending. There is almost no chance he pitches 1/3 of 2024. Odds are he doesn't throw a pitch until 2025, not really sure how "optimistic" one can be on major shoulder surgery that he just had 4 weeks ago. If he misses all of 2024, then you're probably not offering him a QO. 12 million + the cost to acquire for a guy who more likely than not doesn't throw a pitch for your team is an odd move.
like i said the only way it makes sense is if there's a reason for people involved to be optimistic about the medical. we have no way of knowing that and comps to other players may or may not work because we dont know the extent of their surgeries. even acl/tjs arent all the same.
woodruff did an interview a few weeks ago where he says he was told he could pitch "next summer".
Quote:
“I’m two weeks into this thing and from talking with doctors, multiple doctors, there is a possibility of being open to me throwing at some point next summer. Now I’ve got a long way to go, but that is a possibility for me. As an athlete you have to set goals and something to look forward too.”
he's non-tendered I'd be very interested but probably more interested in Mahle who had TJ in May (a less worrisome injury) and should realistically pitch in July/August. 1 + a team option
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
I'm sure teams will call about Luis Robert. Getz admitted he;s discussed Eloy Jimenez.
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
I'm sure teams will call about Luis Robert. Getz admitted he;s discussed Eloy Jimenez.
Yeah that's really all they got but didn't include them as cost would be too high. Andrew Vaughan somewhat perhaps as an Alonso replacement but I don't love that.
among the teams that have called about Cease. They would turn him around for sure. I hope not.
Yikes I did miss Cease somehow. Good thing the Braves system probably needs a year or two for them to start developing guys again with all the influx of talent they had in the last few years from their system.
Mike Puma
@NYPost_Mets
Mets have been talking to teams potentially interested in Drew Smith ahead of tonight's deadline to tender contracts to arbitration eligible players.
Mike Puma
@NYPost_Mets
Mets have been talking to teams potentially interested in Drew Smith ahead of tonight's deadline to tender contracts to arbitration eligible players.
For his sake I hope it's some team with a big ballpark. Surprisingly he did lower his HR/9 from some of his previous years.
Buster Olney
@Buster_ESPN
Source: Pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto expected to be posted Monday. That means the 45-day negotiating window for MLB teams will start Tuesday.
Buster Olney
@Buster_ESPN
Source: Pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto expected to be posted Monday. That means the 45-day negotiating window for MLB teams will start Tuesday.
Even sooner. I heard it as Tuesday. Bad reporting.
gotta think that bodes well for Mauricio being on the roster and being the backup SS. DJ Stewart brought back on a 1 year deal.
New York Mets
@Mets
·
5m
We have opted not to tender a contract to right-handed pitchers Jeff Brigham, Sam Coonrod and Trevor Gott as well as infielders Luis Guillorme and Daniel Vogelbach.
that's that. presumably 2024 is indeed highly unlikely and now the question is if he takes a 2 year now or waits. not sure he has anything to gain by waiting.
interesting situation for the mets where they can essentially split his cost over 2 years and get a more valuable asset in 2025. obviously risky though.
gotta think that bodes well for Mauricio being on the roster and being the backup SS. DJ Stewart brought back on a 1 year deal.
New York Mets
@Mets
·
5m
We have opted not to tender a contract to right-handed pitchers Jeff Brigham, Sam Coonrod and Trevor Gott as well as infielders Luis Guillorme and Daniel Vogelbach.
Guillorme finally played like he looks last year. Him and Vogelblob must have the same nutritionist.
only makes sense as lotto ticket with pretty low salary and mostly incentives.
Aside from the spend factor involved and likely to fill spots, am curious if Stearns goes trade route for some activity. He showed a penchant for being willing to do that. I’m someone who feels a guy like McNeil might not be as long for the team as others.
if 5 players are signed around the minimum, that's $16m per player for 7 players.
counting short, stearns is going to have changed almost exactly 1/3 of the 40 man in 1 offseason.
They have to sign at least two starters. Likely a middle reliever/setup too. I’m more intrigued if there’s a move out there on position guys. I think they have to sign a solid OF for sure. Sure Stearns wants to add a bench/utility man. Sounds like they want to give Baty/Mauricio shots.
if 5 players are signed around the minimum, that's $16m per player for 7 players.
counting short, stearns is going to have changed almost exactly 1/3 of the 40 man in 1 offseason.
They have to sign at least two starters. Likely a middle reliever/setup too. I’m more intrigued if there’s a move out there on position guys. I think they have to sign a solid OF for sure. Sure Stearns wants to add a bench/utility man. Sounds like they want to give Baty/Mauricio shots.
for pos players i think plan A is soto and pretty much anyone other than jett williams is on table.
pads need CF, 1b, SP so mets best offer is probably something like Gilbert (or Acuna), Vientos, whatever SP pads like best, and id include Marte fully paid for since SD can then slot him into LF as a free replacement. if someone beats that offer it's the biggest return for a rental player i can recall. definitely a bigger return than lindor, and id say a bigger return than betts.
betts brough back verdugo, jeter downs, connor wong. verdugo was ranked as a consensus top 50 predebut, which is roughly where gilbert is right now, though he was post-debut and coming off a strong 817 ops season w lad.
if no soto then i think the move is signing 1 of the 20+ homer LF/DH guys on market (gurriel, soler, hernandez, etc). and probably redistributing the $ to signing a better 2nd SP.
unless an extension is baked in and agreed to right away and there’s no way Stearns makes the trade without it. As of now Boras is adamant he’s going to FA.
As for pitchers I can’t devote 30m to Lugo, Robertson, Severino. I’d go or a Lugo reunion but I’m not interested in the other two at those price points.
I don't think that Seth Lugo is going to go back to the Bullpen, after putting so much effort into his Starting role.
I confess to only recently distinguishing between the Verlander Outfielders and Drew "The Gun" Gilbert has the arm for RF. I think he's a keeper.
Ryan Clifford "The Big Red Dog" seems like a Lucas Duda type and he's the tradeable guy between the two players.
“ Sources: The New York Mets are hiring Houston Astros Scouting Director Kris Gross to oversee their amateur scouting. It is believed his title will be VP of Amateur Scouting.
Gross has spent the last 12 years w/Houston, including the last 5 as their scouting director.”
I don't think that Seth Lugo is going to go back to the Bullpen, after putting so much effort into his Starting role.
I confess to only recently distinguishing between the Verlander Outfielders and Drew "The Gun" Gilbert has the arm for RF. I think he's a keeper.
Ryan Clifford "The Big Red Dog" seems like a Lucas Duda type and he's the tradeable guy between the two players.
Lugo has said he views himself as a SP so you’re almost certainly correct
“ Sources: The New York Mets are hiring Houston Astros Scouting Director Kris Gross to oversee their amateur scouting. It is believed his title will be VP of Amateur Scouting.
Gross has spent the last 12 years w/Houston, including the last 5 as their scouting director.”
"Meanwhile, Tanous, a longtime fixture in Mets’ front offices, seems in line for a move into a large advisory role as a lead evaluator, a person familiar with the club’s thinking said."
lugo wanted to start so he could get paid - which he now will
im pretty sure if you give him the most money he'll pitch wherever he needs to pitch. if he's pitching great out of the rotation and you can't shift him to the BP that's a great "problem" to have, but if he's just mediocre it's a great flexibility to know he can shift to pen if say vasil or tidwell is ready for a call up.
the hires today (and the others they made) seem really encouraging. Brewer guy had a good track record of promotions in a good org, same with Astros guy, Green brings a lot of things to table.
with all the open roster spots it's hard to envision this being anything other than a crazy offseason. the open roster spots don't necessarily mean they are going to spend like crazy, but obviously they will spend where they think guys are fits. they have a lot of smart guys in the room. feels reminiscent of the early sandy/depo days of moneyball with money (except this time actually with money).
soto $30m ($41m extension starting next year)
yamamoto $30m
lugo $10m
lopez $10m (or another hard thrower)
robertson $10m
severino $10m (or another 1 year SP)
suter $5m (or another low velocity rp)
(+105m)
trade drew smith for anything (-$2.3m)
lugo starts year as your #3/4 starter but hopefully moves to the BP midseason/down the stretch.
$7m to spend on 6 minimum salary depth players players likely destined for cuse, $300k to spend at the new citi field casino.
What do you think about Chapman over Robertson?
Both past their prime, but Chapman is the type that pitching coaches think they can fix IMO.
i thought Robertson showed a lot of craftiness last year handling different situations well. i think each of the last 2 years he got burned out by bad teams who had him as their highest leverage player (40 innings in both 2023 as met closer and 2022 w/ cubs) when really he should be a 7th/8th inning guy who gets some easy outings and never gets pushed beyond 1 inning. post-trade deadline both years his walks went up by big margins, as did his babip which is probably in part an adjustment to a new team/new positioning. his FIPs didnt change either year pre or post trade.
havent seen as much of chapman recently, but the way id construct the bullpen id be looking for guys with experience in high leverage and with different types of stuff and good walk rates. id want 1 hard thrower, 1 softer thrower with 3 or 4 different pitches, and another guy somewhere in between. I think Robertson is a good in between guy with a lot of high leverage experience and i like some of the other younger hard thrower options better than chapman (like lopez).
unless an extension is baked in and agreed to right away and there’s no way Stearns makes the trade without it. As of now Boras is adamant he’s going to FA.
As for pitchers I can’t devote 30m to Lugo, Robertson, Severino. I’d go or a Lugo reunion but I’m not interested in the other two at those price points.
agree on the extension. i dont think it needs to happen day 1 but it has to be like lindor where you know they are open to it and the 2 sides are in the ballpark. judge got $40m per year. soto on $41 x 13 years is $533m and it pays him through his age 38. the total money on that may exceed what ohtani gets since he's 5 years older. id find it hard to imagine soto turning down anything $500m+.
like the Braves "big" move was Nola. I bet they move on to Gray
ff Passan
Verified
@JeffPassan
The Atlanta Braves were a real threat to poach Aaron Nola. But as negotiations with Nola and his agents, Joe Longo and Garrett Parcell, went on, the Phillies stepped up and gave out their biggest contract for a pitcher and 11th biggest ever.
@BNightengale
was on top of things.
He has been an in innings eater but he is trending downward. That’ll be an anchor contract in couple years. Keeps them competitive next few years and that’s really what this is about.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
He has been an in innings eater but he is trending downward. That’ll be an anchor contract in couple years. Keeps them competitive next few years and that’s really what this is about.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
Reportedly they have touched base with Wheeler on an extension this off-season. Unclear if they would do that and still with Yamamoto but you never know.
He has been an in innings eater but he is trending downward. That’ll be an anchor contract in couple years. Keeps them competitive next few years and that’s really what this is about.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
Reportedly they have touched base with Wheeler on an extension this off-season. Unclear if they would do that and still with Yamamoto but you never know.
I don’t see the Yamamoto interest as a likelihood. I think they’re just checking in and seeing if they can up ante on Mets.
Jon Morosi
@jonmorosi
As I reported on @MLBNetwork
a few moments ago, Brandon Woodruff is drawing interest from a majority of @MLB
teams in free agency.
Woodruff is expected to sign a multiyear deal following surgery. The Brewers declined to offer him a 2024 contract at Friday's deadline.
-Mets were not "in" on Nola and as of now are also not believed to be in on Snell.
can sign as soon as tomorrow, he has 45 days to sign.
The compensation to the Japanese team is now set in stone right? They receive $20 million or something like that.
", the release fee will be 20 percent of the first $25 million plus 17.5 percent of next $25 million plus 15 percent of the total guaranteed value exceeding $50 million."
their bp construction is basically exactly what i've been hoping mets would do going back like a half decade now. oday, iglesias, mchugh, lopez, smith, yates, etc.
and now they add a high velo arm along with a funky sinker lefty who gets a ton of ground balls/and also has a good slider.
with that lineup and that bullpen unseating them is going to be really hard.
not looking to overreact but these types of early strikes signings
are what the mets should be able to do with the benefit of cohen's $. in lopez' case he didnt even go above market and im not saying he was some kind of must sign, but why not identify whatever midlevel guys you like best and give them aggressive offers to get the ones you want?
clearly that's what the braves have been doing to positive effect for years now -- and as much as people talk about reliever risk they have probably gone multi-year on more relievers the past 3-4 years than any other team in baseball.
him the other day but I'd give Drew Rucinski a look on a minor league deal. He was horrendous in limited innings but people were pretty high on him (Law had him his #33 FA last off-season) Don't see much a downside if he's healthy.
Rucinski kicked around the majors for a few years, appearing with the Angels, Twins, and Marlins between 2014-18, which in and of itself is a great outcome for an undrafted free agent (out of an Ohio State University of some sort). He went to Korea after that season, however, and has reinvented himself, getting stronger, throwing harder, and adding a splitter, to the point where he might be able to come back to MLB as a starter. Rucinski was at 92-94 mph in relief before going to Korea, but over there has been more 94-96, with a cutter in the low 90s that’s probably his best pitch and an above-average curveball that might also miss some bats here. He’s coming off his best season to date, where he walked just 4.1 percent of batters and struck out almost a quarter, and in four years in the KBO he hasn’t missed a start, taking the ball 121 times in total and never throwing less than 177 innings in any season. This at least looks and sounds like a potential league-average starter here, but there’s risk involved in any starter coming from the KBO to MLB because the quality of hitters is much higher here. I could see two years and $16-18 million-ish, or maybe three years and $20-22 million, for a team that believes he has an excellent chance to remain a starter.
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
Japanese pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto has been officially posted and Major League Clubs have been notified. The window begins at 8 a.m. Tuesday and a club must sign him no later than 5 p.m. on January 4, 2024.
Justin Toscano
@JustinCToscano
Interesting note on late-inning reliever Reynaldo Lopez: He’ll prepare as a starting pitcher this winter and will be stretched out in spring training to give the Braves another option for the rotation. They think he can potentially help in both roles.
Jon Heyman
@JonHeyman
Lance Lynn agrees to Cardinals deal, 1 year plus option. Guarantees $10M in 2024, plus $1M buyout on option. Can be worth about $26M over 2 with escalators. Pluses: Started with Cards, lives nearby in southern Illinois. Pending physical tomorrow.
Justin Toscano
@JustinCToscano
Interesting note on late-inning reliever Reynaldo Lopez: He’ll prepare as a starting pitcher this winter and will be stretched out in spring training to give the Braves another option for the rotation. They think he can potentially help in both roles.
no real reason to not do this from the ATL perspective. if it works great, super cheap starter with the flex to go to the BP on a postseason roster that shrinks the rotation, if it doesn't he's paid like a reliever.
i'd give the exact same (or slightly bigger since he already proved he can do it) deal to Lugo and do the same. that's what they should have done last year.
RE: Braves just signed Reynaldo Lopez to a 3 year deal
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
Japanese pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto has been officially posted and Major League Clubs have been notified. The window begins at 8 a.m. Tuesday and a club must sign him no later than 5 p.m. on January 4, 2024.
On a minor league deal Sulser isn't a bad pickup. Had a big 2021, still [posted 10.1 k/9 in 2022. He's battled shoulder issues so far from a given he can help, but again zero downside
That sheds some light on the question of why Wright had so little trade value despite having three years of team control, and why nobody traded for Woodruff and tried to sign him to a multi-year contract with incentives and options. Pitchers recovering from Tommy John sign deals like this all the time: Germán Márquez, Mike Clevinger, Kirby Yates, Tommy Kahnle and so on.
If this were Tommy John surgery, Woodruff would be a virtual lock to be back to normal by Opening Day 2025. Márquez got two years and $20 million, while Clevinger got two years and $11.5 million for one year of rehab and another year of regularly scheduled programming. When healthy, Woodruff is way better than those guys, so if this were Tommy John, he would probably be in line for more money, more years, or both.
But rather than a one-year layoff with a high probability of recovery, Woodruff is in for an injury that — according to the very limited sample in the 2023 study — is about a coin flip that he’ll return, with the possibility that he’ll miss not one but two seasons. Link - ( New Window )
On a minor league deal Sulser isn't a bad pickup. Had a big 2021, still [posted 10.1 k/9 in 2022. He's battled shoulder issues so far from a given he can help, but again zero downside
50 more signings like this, PLEASE!!!!
No risk
He’s 90% cooked, but if he isn’t, great to have in AAA for those RP rotations they do all season.
Not till later in the off-season. It’s a risk, but where the Mets are pitching wise, they need to take a few of those swings.
Same with trading for Manoah.
They aren’t good moves if you are banking in them. But if you make three moves like that in tandem, one probably kinda works. One blows up, and third is your lotto ticket.
If all three bust, so be it. Just can’t take up the roster spots all off-season, so have o swing late.
Travis Sawchik
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
Travis Sawchik
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
currently have 9 rehabbing TJ. They had more until 2 weeks ago but Renteria left via FA, Murfee was picked off of waivers and Mathieu Cole Gordon were released.
currently have 9 rehabbing TJ. They had more until 2 weeks ago but Renteria left via FA, Murfee was picked off of waivers and Mathieu Cole Gordon were released.
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
pretty sure that's the sport which is a big step down from the regular bronco. cant get mad at a free car but cespedes wouldnt even give that garage space. like you said, hopefully hatchet buried and everyone happy.
probably be the 2nd best bat available after Ohtani...
This Day in Mets History
@NYMhistory
11/20/2006 Moises Alou and the Mets agree to a one-year, $7.5 million contract. Alou spent the final two years of his big league career in New York, hitting .342 in 102 games. In his age-40 season, Alou set a club record by recording a hit in 30 consecutive games.
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
pretty sure that's the sport which is a big step down from the regular bronco. cant get mad at a free car but cespedes wouldnt even give that garage space. like you said, hopefully hatchet buried and everyone happy.
Well, Cespedes also had a horse in his "garage" so not sure he's the best gauge. I tried to get my wife to want a bronco to replace her Honda Pilot, but no luck.
Travis Sawchik
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
While TJS is one valid metric to track under Pitch Clock Rules, I'd be curious to see a list of Pitchers on the IL with other Arm/Shoulder injuries (including short stays). Don't know if anybody tracked that across both leagues over the last few years.
“ Kiwoom Heroes superstar OF’er Lee Jung-hoo WILL be posted on Friday November 23rd, the day after Thanksgiving. Lee will then fly to the USA during the first week of December.”
Not the most exciting Rule 5 group but one guy I like is Shane Sasaki. Hit .301/.375/.465- 130 wRC+ in A+ with 7 homers and 12 steals. He's a career .302 hitter and can really run. A potential 4th OFer
Mets top 31 (keep in mind he's coming from a fantasy baseball focus)
Drew Gilbert
Jett Williams
Ronny Mauricio
Luisangel Acuña
Ryan Clifford
Christian Scott
Colin Houck
Blade Tidwell
Alex Ramirez
Kevin Parada
Dominic Hamel
Mike Vasil
Marco Vargas
Jeffry Rosa
Brandon Sproat
Tyler Stuart
Joander Suarez
Wilfredo Lara
Jacob Reimer
Julio Zayas
Jeremy Rodriguez
Boston Baro
Cristopher Larez
AJ Ewing
Jesus Baez
Justin Jarvis
Luis Rodriguez
Matt Rudick
Jonah Tong
Stanley Consuegra
Chris Clegg
@RotoClegg
I scouted both Ramirez and Parada a good bit this year. Parada is close to falling off hard. Ramirez does a lot of things well. Had 10 balls hit over 95 mph right at people in a series I was at. Plus a high projectable frame. There’s more there for both than what the numbers say
Chris Clegg
@RotoClegg
Ramirez still has a lot to prove but has all the intangibles to be a solid player. He does need a solid 2024 though
Chris Clegg
@RotoClegg
Questions on whether he can stick behind the plate due to arm strength. Contact skills have backed up every year since being drafted. Power has also taken a step back. He’s kinda a shell of the player he was at GT
"Back Of The Rotation Types
Coleman Crow, RHP, Mets
While he may have benefited from the pre-tacked Southern League balls, Crow’s fastball displayed a significant jump in induced vertical break and overall shape early in the season. He had the biggest year-over-year jump in vertical break and looked like a potential breakout in the making. The Mets acquired Crow in late June in exchange for Eduardo Escobar. Prior to the trade, Crow hit the injured list with an elbow sprain in May and the club announced on Aug. 11 he underwent Tommy John surgery. That could actually make it easier for a team to pick and keep Crow in 2024. The righty would occupy a 40-man roster spot all offseason, but will spend all next season on the 60-man injured list. Any team that selects Crow would then be required to carry him on their active MLB roster in 90 days in 2025 to fulfill Rule 5 roster requirements before being allowed to option him to the minors."
Stoves in Mets history. I know the gm meetings turned into poopageton but Nola being essentially only thing occurring so far is surprising. I suppose meetings in a week and a half will be the starting point for this offseason.
Stoves in Mets history. I know the gm meetings turned into poopageton but Nola being essentially only thing occurring so far is surprising. I suppose meetings in a week and a half will be the starting point for this offseason.
Everyone is after the same domino(s) and when they fall...
To be posted (KBO closer) if the Mets do indeed hire Jose Rosado it would make sense to get his take there (he’s been coaching in the KBO and worked for driveline).
To be posted (KBO closer) if the Mets do indeed hire Jose Rosado it would make sense to get his take there (he’s been coaching in the KBO and worked for driveline).
-really like the Stearns hire
-The Mets internally feel Jett Williams is the clear top prospect.
-Mauricio is viewed as a 6 or 7 hitter, hitting remains an open question.
-Jett Williams upside is above average regular, possible all-star, probably not a "perennial" all-star type.
-Rarely swings and misses, makes hard contact, should hit for a high average and OBP. Long term CF might be his best position. He can probably get to average MLB quality defense in SS if needed. They are confident he can easily play 2b if necessary
-Gilbert was ranked the Mets #3 prospect for them. Floor is an average MLB player, a lot of positive attributes, Acuna didn't play well post trade. Bottom of the order kind of player, potential starter at 2b. Clifford struggled the most post trade, park change didn't help, had trouble seeing the ball as well (the signage), if it clicks, profile is a slugging CO with a "good feel to hit".
-Felt the Scherzer return was light. Didn't think the Mets did as well as some of the early reporting (which he says was likely fed to the reporters by the Mets, which is common post trade). Thinks he's probably a good utility player vs. a starter
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
McCann contract was done by Sandy. Porter and I were GM finalists still interviewing when that was finished. Before I interviewed, I removed my case for Realmuto over Springer from the presentation because McCann was just about completed.
Christian Scott, top pitching prospect in the system, the Mets system does not have "TOP" type of arms, Scott a potential #3 SP if he can stay healthy/show durability, the Mets had him focus on his 4 seamer, added a sweeper, takes to new things quickly and throws strikes.
more on Scott-Feeling is Scott will be called up first (ahead of Vasil)
-Tidwell's control is shaky, improved as the season went on, changeup has improved a lot, opinions split starter, reliever, potential closer, #4 type of upside
scouting reports and production were both not great. He's going to have to improve all aspects of his defensive game to be playable at C, and/or improve his hitting to be in the discussion at a "secondary position", 1st base, some rival scouts would like to see him play 2b.
-Some don't love his unusual set up before he hits, Mets minor league ballparks don't help hitters. Seeing how he bounces back will be an interesting subplot for the Mets system.
Yabbour was released by the Twins in 2022 having never thrown a pro pitch for them. He signed with the Mariners and has been throwing smoke in the DSL, sitting 95 mph with dome riding life. Even though he’s 19, Yabbour isn’t especially projectable. His release isn’t consistent and neither is his breaking ball, but his arm strength makes him a young name to monitor in a system that’s tended to take velo-only guys and make them better.
You're welcome. Just to be clear, the episode was exclusively about the top 10, so a guy like Marco Vargas wasn't mentioned because he didn't make their top 10.
Mike Mayer
@mikemayer22
Mets have signed right-handed pitcher Joseph Yabbour to a minor league deal.
The 20-year-old had a 3.60 ERA and 12.6 K/9 in 20 innings this season in the DSL with the Mariners.
Cousin of the Acuna's.
Also disagree with Eddy that Tidwell upside is a #4. With his K rates his stuff clearly plays up. I can see him as a 3 or even if a 2 if he elevates more.
-Gilbert was ranked the Mets #3 prospect for them. Floor is an average MLB player, a lot of positive attributes, Acuna didn't play well post trade. Bottom of the order kind of player, potential starter at 2b.
Clifford struggled the most post trade, park change didn't help, had trouble seeing the ball as well (the signage), if it clicks, profile is a slugging CO with a "good feel to hit".
Great stuff Dan, thanks for posting this.
Help me understand the part about the signage...
Are they saying that the signs on the outfield wall at BK are giving Clifford trouble in seeing the pitch ?
-Gilbert was ranked the Mets #3 prospect for them. Floor is an average MLB player, a lot of positive attributes, Acuna didn't play well post trade. Bottom of the order kind of player, potential starter at 2b.
Clifford struggled the most post trade, park change didn't help, had trouble seeing the ball as well (the signage), if it clicks, profile is a slugging CO with a "good feel to hit".
Great stuff Dan, thanks for posting this.
Help me understand the part about the signage...
Are they saying that the signs on the outfield wall at BK are giving Clifford trouble in seeing the pitch ?
Yes. Clifford complained the signs on the walls in BK made it hard for him to pick up the ball.
Chris Clegg
@RotoClegg
Questions on whether he can stick behind the plate due to arm strength. Contact skills have backed up every year since being drafted. Power has also taken a step back. He’s kinda a shell of the player he was at GT
I saw Parada for three games in the Arizona Fall League. His arm is at best a 40. Guys were stealing off him left & right. He didn't impress me as a hitter either. He ended up hitting .186 with sub 7 OPS. Granted small sample, but how he ended up #1 is beyond my comprehension. Weak contact, high miss rate...etc. Injured? Tired?
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Puma says they expect to hire an ex-manager. Phil Nevin (who worked with Mendoza) in 2022 (and is up for the Padres managerial job) is one name I’ve heard, Clint Hurdle (might be joining Ron Washington in LA) is another. Doesn’t sound like David Ross is interested in coaching in 2024. Eric Chavez is almost certainly out unless he accepts a “demotion” to a lesser title than bench coach or FO position, though some teams are now carrying “associate managers” as well. Seems unlikely the Mets would do that with a rookie manager however.
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Chavez was hired by the Yankees to be assistant hitting coach but it never happened as the Mets hired him away about 2 weeks later.
Fun to follow Brewers and Cubs considering the Counsell storyline AND Murphy being Counsell’s coach at ND.
Quote:
he will name bench coach?
With all this talk about Soto, curious if Ryan Flaherty would be a discussion.
Should we assume Eric Chavez is out too? He did have some time with Yankees as ast. hitting coach so maybe Mendoza has enough history with him to keep him.
Chavez was hired by the Yankees to be assistant hitting coach but it never happened as the Mets hired him away about 2 weeks later.
ah. I thought he was there the year prior. Ok so no real relationship there then.
Nevin looks like suitable pick. Hopefully he doesnt go to SD.
me that he felt Jeremy Hefner was an asset to any organization and the Mets looked for ways to give him an even bigger role. Stearns opted to keep him so obviously he feels the same way.
i think buck is a quality manager who still has a stubborn side, is too deferential to veterans, and when things went bad last year didn't handle it well. he just kept waiting on veterans to make turns that didnt happen. neither was the right choice to transition the young players who we all knew we were on the way from before either of them were hired - though im also not sure there were any 'known' better options so it is what it is.
eppler was worse than buck because he was in charge of building org process and his org process was incoherent shit from the deadline of 2022 on. very muddled.
Yes. The narrative very much is that Showalter was old school, did things his own way etc. But his coaching staff alone (especially in the roles that really matter ie bench coach, hitting coach, pitching coach... not his hires)
@BaseballJeff1
Something to watch for today: The Rays have a full 40-man. The Giants and Rays have connected on a few minor 40-man moves in the past. Someone like Kameron Misner could be added or on the move today. TB is a team to watch for trades.
Nimmo isn't untradeable for me if there's a good return. He is pretty likely to a corner in the next few years, he's always been injury prone, so he'll probably be a little over paid even if he's still a very good leadoff hitter.
id more doubt that there's a good return with how much is left on his contract. an interested team should just sign bellinger since the QO is lower comp than nimmo. even if it's a bit longer bellinger is 2 years younger. or one of the LF'ers to a much smaller deal. or keirmaier for way way less.
if the mets could get a good return for nimmo and just sign keirmaier as placeholder until acuna/jett/gilbert, id be ok with that. mcneil can move up to leadoff which is probably a more natural batting order spot for him than 5th or lower. reinvest some of the money saved in a LF like gurriel.
a lot of risk in the nimmo contract if the defense doesnt bounce back. but since cohen presumably knew what he was spending, im not giving him away at a discount bc of the contract, so like i said need a good return.
Quote:
Sherman did a piece where he was now in charge of the Yankees and suggested calling the Mets and offering Jones/King/Hampton. I wouldn't trade Brandon Nimmo, but that's also not a bad package for the Mets. Usually these trade ideas are completely one sided.
Nimmo isn't untradeable for me if there's a good return. He is pretty likely to a corner in the next few years, he's always been injury prone, so he'll probably be a little over paid even if he's still a very good leadoff hitter.
id more doubt that there's a good return with how much is left on his contract. an interested team should just sign bellinger since the QO is lower comp than nimmo. even if it's a bit longer bellinger is 2 years younger. or one of the LF'ers to a much smaller deal. or keirmaier for way way less.
if the mets could get a good return for nimmo and just sign keirmaier as placeholder until acuna/jett/gilbert, id be ok with that. mcneil can move up to leadoff which is probably a more natural batting order spot for him than 5th or lower. reinvest some of the money saved in a LF like gurriel.
a lot of risk in the nimmo contract if the defense doesnt bounce back. but since cohen presumably knew what he was spending, im not giving him away at a discount bc of the contract, so like i said need a good return.
The proposal from Sherman (and again, he flat out admitted he the piece were about if he were running the Yankees not some news piece) is potentially a very strong one for the Mets on paper, in fact I find it very hard to believe the Yankees would do it.
"The Still Pretty Easy Part: Kodai Senga
I’m inclined to like Senga considerably more than his WAR simply because he has a significant history of outperforming his peripherals in Japan as well, so there’s more basis for believing in his ERA than for the typical pitcher in this position. Because of that, I’m closer to bWAR on Senga (4.4) than I am to fWAR. If forced at gunpoint to name the Dan’s Brain WAR for Senga, I’d probably put him at 3.8–4.0 or so. Also, that’s a very weird use of a firearm.
There’s always a writer or two who complains about Japanese players being eligible for the RoY award, but I think the idea that they shouldn’t be is preposterous. Nippon Professional Baseball appears a bit closer to the majors than Triple-A ball in the U.S. is — something like Triple-A 1/2 — but it’s a very different kind of league. While Triple-A hitters may be easier than NPB hitters, you’re also facing a rather different style of play and plate approaches, and now that some of the recent rule changes have hit in the majors, Triple-A ball is roughly a not-as-good MLB.
Despite facing different types of hitters, a spate of different rules, and against the backdrop of New York pressure and a collapsing team behind him, Senga was one of the few players who could really be counted on there. He had some issues with walks early on, and to his credit, he adjusted. But it wasn’t actually his control that was the issue; he actually threw more strikes earlier in the season! Instead, the issue was that after putting up an out-of-zone swing rate above 30% in each of his last two seasons in Japan, he was down in the low-20s early on with the Mets. As time went on, he got a better feel on how to lure MLB batters to their doom; in the second half, his 31.1% out-of-zone swing rate was right where it was in Japan. "
Link - ( New Window )
@jonmorosi
Yankees are among the most active teams in the starting pitching market, and sources say they're showing early interest in Yoshinobu Yamamoto and Aaron Nola, among others.
@MLBNetwork
@MLB
Alonso
Peterson absolute locks
Smith/Gott/Stewart/Lucchesi "likely" tendered
Guillorme I guess could be a surprise non-tender
Vogey is probably a goner
I guess we could see a surprise tender with SRF or Coonrod but both are out of options so sort of limited utility.
The Cincinnati Reds are expected to non-tender Nick Senzel
My minor concern with NPB Pitchers is that the baseball is slightly smaller (better spin rates over there), and that the NPB pitchers mound is a little different.
Kodai-san adjusted nicely last year. Now he just has to convince his good ol' buddy Yoshi Yamamoto to join the Mets.
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
lol at the second question. Doesn't make much sense.
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
Ken Rosenthal reported that and he said it in reference to joining MLB teams. Japanese players are viewed in a "hierarchical" system so if you join a team in which there is another Japanese star you are expected to defer to him and treat him as a superior (that per Rosenthal's reporting).
Quote:
to the rumors that Japanese players don't like to join teams with other Japanese stars out of deference to the star already there?
If it is true, what do they do on Japanese teams?
lol at the second question. Doesn't make much sense.
yeah, it intentionally didn't make sense, because I did not ever see the explanation DMM provided from Rosenthal.
Maybe the Mets have to trade Senga to get Yamamoto (if the Mets become a serious contender for Yamamoto but he is hesitant because of the presence of Senga).
Link - ( New Window )
Maybe sell them on the idea that more Japanese players is better not worse.
Maybe sell them on the idea that more Japanese players is better not worse.
i'd also try to play that card, perhaps even adding imanaga to the list as well. not sure there's another team willing to pay all of them like that.
doesnt sound like it's in the cards though.
yamamoto and soto seem like realistic possibilities though.
Cohen needs to be persuasive.
Lets trade for Soto and sign Yamamoto to a deal he can't refuse!
We need to get this train rolling!
The Mets introduce Carlos Mendoza as their next manager.
We will have the news conference LIVE on SNY & on our social channels.
@gappleSNY, @martinonyc, @Todd_Zeile, @jerryblevins, and
@SteveGelbs host our coverage.
⏰: 12 p.m.
📺: SNY
💻: X, Facebook, YouTube
Sure. Add him in the Soto deal, please.
Ouch. That would not make the Mets a good candidate
So, just to clarify, Stanton and Yamamoto have the same agent?
If so, fantastic!
Quote:
Joel Wolfe is Yamamoto’s agent
So, just to clarify, Stanton and Yamamoto have the same agent?
If so, fantastic!
Yup. Joel Wolfe.
Who also represents Senga and Edwin Diaz.
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Link - ( New Window )
Quote:
Says SD is looking for MLB ready SP for Soto and as such has the Yankees, Mariners and Cubs as the favorites to land him
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Cubs/Yankees/Mariners all have good to very good SP options to offer in a Soto trade. Not sure why it would have to be "mediocre"
Cade Horton is a potential MLB #2, Ben Brown a 3 both are "close"
Yankees have King, Hampton, Thorpe, Will Warren
Mariners have Woo, Gilbert (MLB), Hancock, Bryce Miller
i guess we can cross off the theory that yamamoto's agent was leaking the yankee interest to drive up the price for the mets. wow what a stupid self inflicted wound if true.
this is an area where cohen deserves credit - the way he respectfully stood behind his manager/gm im sure earned him some brownie points that helped get stearns (along with the $50m) and even though he had to trade 2 HOFers unexpectedly who said they didnt want to get traded, it seems like they were able to execute those moves as tactfully as possible. cohen has made the mets org extremely talent friendly.
Quote:
In comment 16288885 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Says SD is looking for MLB ready SP for Soto and as such has the Yankees, Mariners and Cubs as the favorites to land him
looking for pitching makes sense for them given the likely loss of snell and the fact that they are still going to have machado, bogaerts, tatis, kim, etc.
settling for mediocre return would be dumb though. megill and vasil as MLB ready SP options in a package headlined by Gilbert or Acuna seems like something that should be tough to beat. throw in marte fully paid for too.
Cubs/Yankees/Mariners all have good to very good SP options to offer in a Soto trade. Not sure why it would have to be "mediocre"
Cade Horton is a potential MLB #2, Ben Brown a 3 both are "close"
Yankees have King, Hampton, Thorpe, Will Warren
Mariners have Woo, Gilbert (MLB), Hancock, Bryce Miller
i dont know all of their systems but i do know brown a bit from him being mentioned as a possible return in an alonso trade, his numbers in AAA were a lot closer to jarvis than comfortable for me as a headliner for a big trade. if he was the headliner of an alonso trade id be thoroughly disappointed with that (and soto should bring back more than alonso would).
i picked out the 1 i know from your list who i also know has generally been considered a top 50 prospect even though he jumped up to walking 6 guys per 9, im sure there are others who are better but from looking around the league for alonso landing spots, as well as JV/scherzer landing spots, almost all the interesting arms mentioned have seemed off limits.
in the scherzer/jv trades, as well as any potential alonso trade, the mets would have probably preferred an MLB ready arm more than the padres. how many have we seen speculated on that would actually get us interested even for lesser non-soto assets? any of the other names you listed (honestly asking)?
would you be happy with any of the names you mentioned above as the return for an alonso trade?
brown is the one i know best and if that's the main piece for an alonso trade i would not be super pumped about it.
@JoePantorno
Carlos Mendoza not only sought advice from Luis Rojas in the interview process with the #Mets, but he also cited ex-#Mets manager Willie Randolph — who he considers a friend — as a coaching influence.
Quote:
100% not being snarky, can you rephrase your question, I'm unsure what you're asking.
would you be happy with any of the names you mentioned above as the return for an alonso trade?
brown is the one i know best and if that's the main piece for an alonso trade i would not be super pumped about it.
Absolutely. Cade Horton might be the top RHP still in the minors, if he's not #1 he's damn near close, Bryce Miller, 3.98 FIP, 8.2 K/9 as a rookie with the Mariners this season, would arguably be the Mets #2 SP opening day, Woo's rookie season was "less" impressive but still struck out 9.5/9 and his underlying numbers were outstanding, near the top of the league in most key categories (linked)
(100% not looking to debate trading Alonso again, Eric asked me a question so I'm answering it).
Link - ( New Window )
I assume they prefer somebody with managerial success but Phil Nevin was 119-149 as Angels manager so it's not like he has some incredible W/L record.
"Mets: Justin Jarvis, RHP (No. 15)
Originally drafted by the Brewers in 2018 out of the North Carolina high school ranks, Jarvis was finding some consistent success in Double-A in 2023 and got bumped up to Triple-A before being sent to the Mets for Mark Canha, and he didn’t throw particularly well with Syracuse post-trade. But he has a four-pitch mix and could be a back-end starter capable of eating innings."
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
Involves minor leaguers per Heyman, aka 40 man maneuvering
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
crazy that mets spent like $7m in bonuses combined on him and allan and neither is anywhere close to big leagues.
@BNightengale
The will be a slew of minor-league trades today with 40-man rosters needing to be finalized starting with the Phillies acquiring minor league OF Hendry Mendez and infielder Robert Moore from the Milwaukee Brewers in exchange for infielder NF Oliver Dunn.
Quote:
Ginn was the A's choice
"A’s: JT Ginn, RHP (No. 18)
The Mets’ second-round pick of the 2020 Draft was sent to the A’s in the Chris Bassitt trade of 2022 and he’s continued to have trouble staying healthy. A forearm strain limited him to 12 outings in 2022 (though he threw well in the Arizona Fall League that fall), then he threw only 26 2/3 innings in 2023 as he dealt with biceps tendinitis. He has the stuff to start, though his sinker-slider combination could be an appealing bullpen asset for teams interested in nabbing him."
crazy that mets spent like $7m in bonuses combined on him and allan and neither is anywhere close to big leagues.
Allan I was fine with because he was significantly better than any other prospect available. Ginn less so because he required us to tank the remaining draft picks in that 5 round draft and I also thought Clayton Beeter and Tink Hence were close enough as prospects and would come cheaper.
What? When did this happen? Who's got MLB now?
@BenBadler
Hendry Mendez and Robert Moore were going to rank in the 26-30 range in the Brewers Top 30.
Mendez just turned 20 and has some intriguing hitting traits from the left side, will need to hit the ball in the air with more frequency and stay on the field after dealing with injuries this year.
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
Link - ( New Window )
The Cincinnati Reds are expected to non-tender Nick Senzel
One of my biggest swing and misses in recent memory, LOVED HIM.
he is a slow adjuster, I'd still take a chance on him. But I am also stubborn - and in case anyone around never picked up on the fact that I hate admitting I am wrong about a player till they retired lol
The Athletic MLB
@TheAthleticMLB
MLB's owners are expected to approve the Athletics' move to Las Vegas Thursday, sources tell @EvanDrellich
.
While the viability of the move's success is described as “iffy," the league's relocation committee perceives no better alternative.
More ⤵️
Expectation is once the ballpark plans are finalized, 2 new teams will be announced.
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
lol Randolf
Quote:
Laura Albanese
@AlbaneseLaura
Mendoza dodges the direct ask on whether Willie Randolf is in consideration as bench coach. He smiles and says he greatly respects him.
lol Randolf
She corrected her autocorrected immediately, I just didn't think it was worth posting.
Yeah - he didn't look good last year or two. They were definitely trying to win one for him last few seasons.
wow that is awful. not to be morbid but puts a lot of things together that didnt make sense before. he had a procedure a few months ago and had cancer before, just awful news.
Quote:
owner Peter Seidler, RIP. He was 63.
Yeah - he didn't look good last year or two. They were definitely trying to win one for him last few seasons.
He was considered one of the nicest owners in baseball and a really good man.
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Atlanta Braves
@Braves
The #Braves today claimed RHP Penn Murfee off waivers from the New York Mets and designated RHP Yonny Chirinos for assignment.
@ZackScottSports
Luis Rojas is an A+ human being who had strong relationships with several players and staff. I'm sure Carlos gained valuable insights about the Mets as he prepared. I heard NYY people think Luis is one of the best coaches they've ever had which is not surprising. #Yankees #Mets
he's already talked with Francisco Lindor, Pete Alonso, Brandon Nimmo, and Edwin Díaz, among other Mets:
"With Pete Alonso, it felt like we were on the phone for 45 minutes and it felt like we could've kept going"
Link - ( New Window )
Yeah, thanks. I was thinking Carter as well. Just more power potential, plus Greene seems to be injury prone. Like Greene too, just a roster crunch with too many players to keep. (13 keepers, and other 12 are Kirby, Gilbert, Skubal, Alonso, McLain, Lindor, Turner, Abrams, Encarnacion-Strand, Chourio, Soto, and Alvarez)
The Braves piss me off with every move they make !!
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
15 HR is insane for the DSL
Metsmerized Online
@Metsmerized
Report: Rays Expected to Trade Tyler Glasnow This Offseason http://dlvr.it/SyqtJ6 #Mets #LGM
Metsmerized Online
@Metsmerized
Report: Rays Expected to Trade Tyler Glasnow This Offseason http://dlvr.it/SyqtJ6 #Mets #LGM
Career high last year of 120 innings. He is 30. If the price is right, but major durability concerns.
Quote:
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
Salas likely to be added for the first time in many leagues as well.
Quote:
In comment 16289308 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
picked up Wyatt Langford late in the season because Chris Clegg was losing his mind over his fantasy upside. There certainly is a big time influx of young talent in the league (particularly on the position player side).
In my one dynasty league we can't pick up drafted players same year. I'm sure Yamamoto, Crews, Skenes, and Langford will be the top 4 picks in my draft this year
Salas likely to be added for the first time in many leagues as well.
Someone already has him unfortunately.
The Astros have added their No. 11 prospect, Kenedy Corona, to the 40-man roster, protecting him from the Rule 5 Draft.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I would keep Perez over Alvarez. It is too difficult for a catcher to be Mike Piazza these days.
“ I'd also say that anyone talking about the latter's "upside" or "potential" should show their work because other than looking good in a uniform or taking 5 PM swings there isn't actually any granular upside or potential trait currently there, just past hype”
Interesting Jarvis, Crow, Jackson all added by Eppler not added
crow is going to be out with tjs, not positive what the rule is w/r/t carry him after his rehab but that's one that seems like it could be a free look for someone.
all of it is probably much about nothing, it's hard enough to carry full time the brett baty's of the world without demoting them during a year. rule 5 is a pretty stupid concept, but especially for IFAs since they sign so young.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I might go Eury over Edwin. Closers too volatile and you can still try and draft him back. Eury upside is huge. Harrison next. A C hitting 25-30 in fantasy is very valuable so keep Alvarez.
Quote:
and talking fantasy baseball. My league we keep 3 players and we get them at their draft round for 3 years then they cost a 1st or we can't keep them. I have some good options.
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
I might go Eury over Edwin. Closers too volatile and you can still try and draft him back. Eury upside is huge. Harrison next. A C hitting 25-30 in fantasy is very valuable so keep Alvarez.
Tend to agree. Between those three and Elly. Diaz (I don’t keep closers with that few keepers) and Gimenez are out of the question for me
Yeah, I would have kept Crow and just IL him. A little shocked at Suarez. He was fantastic down the stretch and hit AA. What’s to stop a team from Oak that’s not in contention from taking him? I would really hate to lose him before seeing if that kind of success is sustainable
LOVE IT! Increases the Mets' chances to sign YY.
if you love elly i can see a case for his upside as #3 with the position flex. the k's could be a category killer depending on scoring but he certainly has a lot of splash production. if you are hunting upside it's not crazy to think he's one of the handful on the planet to do what acuna did last year one day. otherwise diaz or gimenez would seem to be very strong options, though maybe not potential league winners like the other 3.
K's are a massive issue for him, but he looks like a lock 30/30 guy and for the next 3 years in the 20th round that's a steal. He is my biggest sure thing to keep IMO.
Diaz is attractive to me because if he is 2022 Diaz he is a to 10 pitcher in our league since K/BB is one of our pitching stats. (W, SV, K, ERA, WHIP, and K/BB).
Eury only doubts I have are innings. How many will he pitch?
Alvarez is probably a top 15 catcher with a full season.
Harrison to me is in case someone gets hurt before I have to name my keepers.
Gimenez I kept last year and he was a disappointment, but in the 23rd round I can't complain.
Thank you all for the advice.
Could Yoshinobu Yamamoto set up the first Steve Cohen-Hal Steinbrenner showdown over a top-level free agent? Would a contract look like 7-8 years at $30 million/year? @gappleSNY , @martinonyc & @JimDuquetteGM discuss on Mets Hot Stove https://on.sny.tv/nI6cUk8 - ( New Window )
Edwin Diaz: 22nd round (we have 25 rounds)
Elly de la Cruz: 20th round
Francisco Alvarez: 22nd round (if I keep both him and Diaz one would be 21st round)
Eury Perez: 12th round
Kyle Harrison: 23rd round
Andres Gimenez: 23rd round (would be 2nd time keeping him)
So, my thoughts were the 1st 3 players.
but Eury in the 12th for the next 3 years seemed enticing too and Harrison could be a TOR starter too.
What would you do?
Try and trade one of your big 4. Can you trade for a draft pick?
We will see. If he doesn't work out, then send him on his way. t least this guy is collaborative and not set in his ways. Being younger helps a lot IMO. Buck is ready for the ricking chair and stubborn as a mule. He'll never manage again in all likelihood.
Counsell would have been a no brainer but it seems like even there Stearns wasn't overly aggressive or desperate to bring him in.
He ran a low key process and ended up with what seems like a credible selection, but given the situation it also seems like a reasonably confident/ballsy choice. His first chance to get into a bidding war that would have won the backpages and he chose not to crack open the cohen vault even though presumably he could have if he'd wanted to. even if chicago didnt come out of nowhere it sounds like the met offer may not have even been that much higher than milwaukees.
Counsell would have been a no brainer but it seems like even there Stearns wasn't overly aggressive or desperate to bring him in.
He ran a low key process and ended up with what seems like a credible selection, but given the situation it also seems like a reasonably confident/ballsy choice. His first chance to get into a bidding war that would have won the backpages and he chose not to crack open the cohen vault even though presumably he could have if he'd wanted to. even if chicago didnt come out of nowhere it sounds like the met offer may not have even been that much higher than milwaukees.
HEAVY belief is that Counsell was headed back to the Brewers before the Cubs got involved. I don't know the Mets exact final "offer" (I was told they spoke in generalities vs. presenting him with an exact number) because the Mets did not believe Counsell was strongly interested in coming to the Mets and that the Mets weren't going to get involved in a bidding war "just because".
Counsell apparently was very honest with the Mets about his preference to stay in Milwaukee when they initially spoke. The Mets were not blindsided here. Whether Mendoza was the right pick or not, we shall find out.
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Quote:
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Just thinking out loud here, I don't know if all 10 spots on the 40 are better than say, 7 spots plus 3 known players from your own system. I thought Orze showed promise, maybe Suarez too.
I agree Dan. Not sure about the thinking behind that one.
Quote:
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Watch Murfee come back to haunt the Mets next year. The Metsiest thing ever.
on Mets Hot Stove:
"A serious fit for [the Mets and Yankees], a guy that I hear is totally open to New York and a big market.
Oh boy, do the Mets like this guy. Everyone that scouted him in Japan likes him - comparisons to Tim Lincecum, 4-5 pitch guy with velocity.
Nobody that has seen him doubts that he's way better than Kodai Senga.
Kodai Senga is good. This guy is really, really, really good, potentially.
Definitely something to watch for the Mets and Yankees. It's the first free agent showdown, potentially, between the Mets and Yankees in the Steve Cohen era. He and Hal Steinbrenner have not been after the same guy yet.
The Mets really want him, and so do the Yankees."
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
In fairness, Gausman took less money to go to Toronto.
Quote:
Would be Cohens first real swing and miss.
We’ve all heard the stories of how he will do WHATEVER it takes to get what he wants. So unless it’s something out of his control…
In fairness, Gausman took less money to go to Toronto.
Hence, the out of his control. He can’t miss here.
@jonmorosi
Sources: Dodgers among the most interested teams in RHP Yoshinobu Yamamoto, one of the top pitchers available this offseason. His posting window has yet to formally open.
@MLB
@MLBNetwork
@WBSC
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
Who dat Dan?
Quote:
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
Who dat Dan?
Who? Manuel Margot? Rays OF owed 12 million who isn't very good.
@ZackScottSports
And speaking of transparency, someday soon I'll give my perspective on the Baez/Williams/cash for PCA trade. #Mets
as a position player soto being 5 years younger than ohtani is a bigger deal i think than with pitchers since age doesnt seem to matter quite as much. TJS in particular seems to have no age preference. if anything the younger/harder throwing guys seem to get it more than older lower velocity so you might even say yamamoto is higher risk.
the cost of acquisition may suck but my offseason plan A would probably be all in on Soto and then happy with any of those 3.
if for some reason they have big concerns on both nola/snell then maybe you go for montgomery + higher level 2/3rd arms like flaherty/lugo/imanaga.
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
sort of reminiscent of eppler year 1 when the black friday news broke on canha/marte/escobar. those 3 were all very out of nowhere.
Quote:
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
defensive numbers have cratered and he's owed 12 million. His OPS vs. lefties was .665, in what scenario would we want him out there? He's mediocre.
Quote:
In comment 16289984 Named Later said:
Quote:
Was there any benefit in not adding some of those Pitchers to the 40-man ?? I know Coleman Crow had surgery, but why did they risk him ? Why risk losing Suarez, Orze, or even Brendan Hardy?
Mets Merized says that the Mets 40-man currently has 33 players. The space was available, why not hold on to every Pitcher with any promising stuff ?
The Braves 40 is full, yet they claimed Penn Murfee. Will they have to put him back on waivers today ?
Braves waived Yonny Chirinos in order to claim Murfee.
The "advantage" is keeping a 40 man spot open. They seemingly will have 10+ of them come Friday. They gambled with Murfee and the Braves may have made them pay.
Watch Murfee come back to haunt the Mets next year. The Metsiest thing ever.
Yeah, if Penn Murfee throws even One Pitch for the Braves, I'll go ape-shit !!
Good Pitching is expensive. If one of these Mets' kids develops and gives a few years of cost-controlled innings...ouch !!
@AzoulayHaron
The Yankees and Rays have been in touch regarding outfielder Manuel Margot, multiple sources tell @MLBNerds
. While a deal was not struck prior to the 6 PM Rule 5 deadline yesterday, Margot may still be an option for NYY, with other teams also in touch with TB regarding Margot.
@enosarris
Looks like Buddy Carlyle, who was the minor league pitching coordinator let go from the Angels just recently, has already been snapped up. He's the pitching coordinator for the Rays now. In terms of PD reputation, that's a big jump up, kind of interesting.
Quote:
In comment 16290129 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
Sources tell @AzoulayHaron
and I that the Mets and Rays had substantial talks about OF Manuel Margot leading up to yesterdays 6 p.m. ET 40-man Rule 5 draft protection deadline. Something to keep tabs on moving forward as the Mets ponder potential offseason offensive upgrades.
i would imagine this would have been a salary dump + minor asset bribe. margot is $10m and 11% of the rays current payroll. he was worth .4 fwar last year so that is an under water contract.
i expect margot would have been an expensive 4th OFer or maybe Marte insurance. his OF range is still 80th percentile and his sprint speed is 75th percentile. been around forever but still just 29 years old.
defensive numbers have cratered and he's owed 12 million. His OPS vs. lefties was .665, in what scenario would we want him out there? He's mediocre.
in the scenario where they are getting back some kind of asset that makes it worth it, like i said, and if it's off the bench in place of time that went to whoever this year's locastro or ortega would have been. the contract is obviously under water.
Link - ( New Window )
Very good interview with the Nerds. A Vulcan Change-Up. Shapes and Angles.
Brooks may have a future as a Pitching Coach after he hangs 'em up.
@JeffPassan
Big news: Major League Baseball's competition committee has proposed reducing the pitch clock with runners on base from 20 seconds to 18 seconds, sources tell ESPN. The new rule could be implemented in time for the 2024 season. Details free at ESPN:.
@JeffPassan
Big news: Major League Baseball's competition committee has proposed reducing the pitch clock with runners on base from 20 seconds to 18 seconds, sources tell ESPN. The new rule could be implemented in time for the 2024 season. Details free at ESPN:.
I still despise the pitch clock.
believes that Yoshinobu Yamamoto has a 'preference' for the west coast 👀
Or do you think he's cooked and it's already an albatross contract that will only get worse?
Or do you think he's cooked and it's already an albatross contract that will only get worse?
No
believes that Yoshinobu Yamamoto has a 'preference' for the west coast 👀
But what are his realistic options there? The Giants and the Dodgers are the only ones. Let's say Ohtani signs with the Dodgers. Will they then ALSO go for YY? I have no idea about the Giants'spending habits. The Padres are broke, the A's are moving, and the Angels are weird. Seattle is the last one. They could easily be an option, but again, how much are they willing to spend?
Isn't is being reported that YY would like to be in a major market? Seattle ain't exactly that. The Dodgers are the only ones I fear getting YY if they strike out on Ohtani. IF they do, then I'm not so concerned. Sounds like the agent is drumming up interest in a big bidding war to me. The Yankees and the Mets seem to be the best fits though IMO. This is gonna be fascinating. Maybe not LeBron level, but fascinating nonetheless to follow.
He would take that team to another level. They're already pretty close. Dave Dombrowski has done a heckuva job there.
Interesting. Guess we're all waiting to see which domino is the first to fall at this point.
Seattle adding Bolton for cash
Mets picking up Murfee until...
Braves sniping the Mets
Rays picking up Alexander off of waivers
Padres picking up Estrada off of waivers
Braves picking up Pedromo off of waivers
Sorry for the non sequitur. Had to get that off my chest.
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
He didn't say that outright, but he credited the Cubs and PCA with the changes he made to his swing.
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
the other thing about PCA at that time is he was out for year with shoulder surgery and you never know how a player will bounce back from that. conforto just had the lowest power year of his career. that as a total unknown/risk any trading team was taking.
was also almost untested so recently drafted so it was almost like if the mets were to deal Houck this offseason, and he were to have some kind of significant injury on top of that.
i think that deal may have come down to a choice between matt allan and pca and the mets just chose the wrong injured guy.
the bigger issue with the deal was that baez ended up not being someone they extended (fortunately). had he been the .850+ ops 4/5 hitter behind alonso they still havent found (and a GG at 2b) that would have been a good trade. would he have continued hitting well here or tanked like he has in detroit? no idea but he is clearly a guy that needs to be in a good line up or else he expands the zone to an unhealthy level. that was true in chicago and now detroit where his contract looks as bad or worse than marte.
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
Small sample size, but in 6 games in A ball with the Mets, he hit .417 with more walks than Ks and a couple SBs. Didn't have much time before being injured, but showed quite well. Agreed with PJ. Doesn't outright say drafted solely for his glove. They don't have the concerns about his bat when they draft him, but they do after hitting .417? Make it make sense. The only way the trade ever made sense is if Baez was a player worth signing to an extension. They didn't when they traded for him (luckily in hindsight), and they didn't after he was here
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
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- Cash had to be part of the deal as staying under the luxury tax was a mandate
-PCA was ranked their #5 best prospect and they had questions about his bat. He acknowledged the system was very thin/top heavy.
-A 7 player deal was also discussed with the Cubs
-They did know about deGrom's health status, it wasn't 100% clear he was done for the year but the possibility existed
-Even at the time he felt it was a "net negative" long term deal even at the time but not a major one.
-Credits PCA and the Cubs staff with helping him develop his bat.
Small sample size, but in 6 games in A ball with the Mets, he hit .417 with more walks than Ks and a couple SBs. Didn't have much time before being injured, but showed quite well. Agreed with PJ. Doesn't outright say drafted solely for his glove. They don't have the concerns about his bat when they draft him, but they do after hitting .417? Make it make sense. The only way the trade ever made sense is if Baez was a player worth signing to an extension. They didn't when they traded for him (luckily in hindsight), and they didn't after he was here
From when the trade was made
"The cost for acquiring this pair was not insignificant, but it’s nothing the Mets can’t weather. The 19-year-old Crow-Armstrong was the 19th pick of the 2020 draft out of Los Angeles’ Harvard-Westlake High School, and was sixth on the Mets’ prospect list, with a 45 FV. He had only just begun his professional career, playing six games for the team’s A-level Port St. Lucie affiliate before tearing his labrum and damaging articular cartilage in his right (non-throwing shoulder), requiring season-ending surgery. Both his hit tool and his power grade out as average, not plus, but he’s a 60-grade runner and a 70+-grade defender. As Kevin Goldstein summarized, “He’s a potential impact defender with enough bat to play every day and hit seventh, or maybe second on a bad team.”"
So his statement isn't exactly untrue
Age: 19
The 19th overall pick in last year’s draft, Crow-Armstrong got off to a 10-for-24 start this season at Low-A St. Lucie before suffering a torn labrum in his left (non-throwing) shoulder that required season-ending surgery. He ranked as the Mets No. 6 prospect in their midseason update. Crow-Armstrong is an elite defensive center fielder for his age. He is a graceful athlete with plus speed who glides to the ball and makes the position look easy. He has elite instincts, plays fast and has a plus arm, giving him all the tools to be a perennial Gold Glove defender in the future. At the plate Crow-Armstrong takes controlled, mature at-bats, doesn’t have many holes in his swing and uses the whole field, but he doesn’t hit the ball very hard and has a lot of strength gains he needs to make. He has room to get more physical and add power, but it will be a long process. Crow-Armstrong’s speed, defense and instincts are carrying assets that should help him rise to the majors. Even if he just hits .250 with 10-15 home runs, he’ll be an everyday regular in center field.
I'm not defending the Mets, but yeah the word was his bat was only "okay" and his glove was A++
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
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enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
?? He flat out said the Cubs made significant swing changes. Are you disagreeing with him? Because I'm not the one who said it.
"When the Mets made Crow-Armstrong the 19th overall pick in the 2020 Draft -- three selections after the Cubs took local high school shortstop Ed Howard -- the Harvard-Westlake School (Los Angeles) product was regarded a quality center fielder with plus speed but came with some questions about his offensive upside. That's no longer the case."
So yeah, Scott's statements 100% fit within the facts. Doesn't change it was a bad trade.
Rogers is the same reporter who said Alonso wanted to be traded to the Cubs..
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
If we look at the thread from when he was traded I bet 90% of us disagreed with it at the time.
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In comment 16291091 DanMetroMan said:
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enjoying Scott's recent comments but one thing I will note, he's a baseball consultant now so he does go out of his way to not knock anybody within baseball. For instance, I'd love to know why (in his opinion) the Cubs were able to unlock PCA's bat (and almost immediately) and the Mets weren't.
- Found it somewhat interesting hearing him acknowledge they basically knew deGrom was done for the season
- He also talked about David Stearns and admitted he didn't really know him too well but that they had a nice long conversation when Stearns was considering taking the Mets job
-Spoke very highly of Mendoza
The Mets weren't able to unlock PCA's bat? He played 6 games for them.
?? He flat out said the Cubs made significant swing changes. Are you disagreeing with him? Because I'm not the one who said it.
Yes, I disagree with him in trying to justify this trade to salvage his career or whatever his goal is. They traded a recent first round pick for a mediocre rental player when they didn't have much realistic hope of going far that year. Fine, PCA wasn't projected to be top 10 prospect worthy. But even with an exceptional glove at CF, his speed, and hitting .250 with 15 HR, that is a very valuable player.
The only way the deal made sense was signing Baez to a long-term deal. They didn't and he clearly wasn't a player worth signing to a long-term deal. So, they gave up one of the top prospects in the system for what exactly? Oh, but that's ok because the Mets would have sucked in developing him? Scott's a clown.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
I legitimately have never heard of the guy they traded Schwarber for. Aldo Ramirez? That was his final season in baseball (not kidding).
If we look at the thread from when he was traded I bet 90% of us disagreed with it at the time.
He said at the time they knew it was probably a net negative long term move but didn't feel it was strongly one. Acknowledged they knew deGrom was probably not going to pitch again, which is more of a ?? because the only pitching they add was Williams/Rich Hill.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
Endy was lower rated than PCA, and at least Luchessi has been a cost-controlled backend rotation starter for the Mets for a couple years.
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but if im remembering right that was the middle year with no DH so the mets couldnt get him. he undoubtedly would have cost less than PCA and had the mets extended him the vogelbach trade never happens.
but the past is the past. that's the type of breakage you have when your FO constantly turns over. the endy/luchessi trade may have been even worse (i think that was done porters last day as GM).
thankfully cohen can outspend mistakes like that. buying acuna, gilbert, clifford, and rodriguez last deadline for free agents they gave up 0 compensation for hopefully puts us ahead of the game.
Endy was lower rated than PCA, and at least Luchessi has been a cost-controlled backend rotation starter for the Mets for a couple years.
im not saying it was predictable, just that the outcome was arguably just as bad or worse.
again the biggest thing everyone likes to forget is that PCA had the shoulder surgery which was a total unknown. that's not an insignificant injury for a guy whose power was already a major ?.
@jaseidler
my favorite running game is the Cubs leaking the most preposterous shit on the planet through the same half a dozen extremely gullible “reporters” and it then being credulously reported throughout baseball thus making it seem like they’re trying way harder than they actually are
Any Alonso to Mets deal starts with Horton and getting PCA back haha.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
He's saying they didn't think PCA was going to be a big offensive player. A GG caliber CFer still has value. The guy went 19th overall, he wasn't some top 5 pick. What he's saying is probably accurate, they didn't think PCA would hit for power and he has.
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to the Cubs in a deal headlined by Christopher Morel would be one of the worst trades the Mets have made in recent history. Morel wouldn't crack my top 5 "wants" from the Cubs and I say that as someone who has more of an open mind trading Alonso than some others. Morel's essentially a slightly more versatile Vientos.
Any Alonso to Mets deal starts with Horton and getting PCA back haha.
Yeah well, that's not happening lol
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PCA wasn't very good at the time we traded him, so we traded him. But if the Mets didn't think he was very good, why did they just draft him in the 1st round? And what, in the 6 games where he played for the organization and had a .417 BA and 1.063 made them change their organizational assessment of him?
I get PCA has developed more power with the Cubs than he was projected to when he was drafted. High school player develops more power as he matures. News at 11. But I don't buy Scott's narrative that PCA was some mediocre prospect that he is using to justify a truly horrendous trade.
He's saying they didn't think PCA was going to be a big offensive player. A GG caliber CFer still has value. The guy went 19th overall, he wasn't some top 5 pick. What he's saying is probably accurate, they didn't think PCA would hit for power and he has.
The only way the trade even made an iota of sense was if they signed Baez to a long-term deal. They didn't. It made no sense at the time with what evaluations of PCA were. An excellent CF glove with good speed, decent bat to ball ability, a good eye, and only a little bit of power. Now that he has developed more power? Even more dreadful of a trade. We know, Scott. You suck even more than we thought you did. Congrats?
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
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wanted to sign Baez to a long term deal, Sandy made this clear.
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
It would have, but you just said that's the only way it made sense. That was what they were openly hoping to do.
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In comment 16291156 DanMetroMan said:
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wanted to sign Baez to a long term deal, Sandy made this clear.
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
It would have, but you just said that's the only way it made sense. That was what they were openly hoping to do.
I said if they signed him to a long-term deal. Not if they hoped to sign him to a long-term deal. An important distinction. Like between the two following sentences: 1. I am leaving my girlfriend for Margot Robbie and 2. I am leaving my girlfriend in hopes of getting Margot Robbie.
Only way the trade made any bit of sense in the context of PCA's value as a prospect, the Mets hope of making the playoffs and doing anything meaningful, and Baez' value as a player was if they signed an extension with him. They didn't. They didn't re-sign him as a FA either. Which turns out they dodged a bullet.
I always saw PCA as a Nimmo type with more speed and a better glove. Nimmo developed more power as he went on in his career. Not crazy to think PCA might do the same. Regardless, even without the power boost, PCA was a very valuable prospect and shouldn't have been traded for a rental of a player like Baez in a season like that.
Baez was going to be FA even trading your #5 or #6 whatever it said prospect for the chance to negotiate directly with Baez was a price too steep for a team not contending.
Sort of like a worse version of the Leonard Williams trade the Giants made.
The only good news is Baez has been so bad in his two years with DET it's good they f-ed up and didn't sign him long-term.
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In comment 16291160 KDavies said:
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In comment 16291156 DanMetroMan said:
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wanted to sign Baez to a long term deal, Sandy made this clear.
Which would have further compounded a dreadful trade.
It would have, but you just said that's the only way it made sense. That was what they were openly hoping to do.
I said if they signed him to a long-term deal. Not if they hoped to sign him to a long-term deal. An important distinction. Like between the two following sentences: 1. I am leaving my girlfriend for Margot Robbie and 2. I am leaving my girlfriend in hopes of getting Margot Robbie.
Only way the trade made any bit of sense in the context of PCA's value as a prospect, the Mets hope of making the playoffs and doing anything meaningful, and Baez' value as a player was if they signed an extension with him. They didn't. They didn't re-sign him as a FA either. Which turns out they dodged a bullet.
I always saw PCA as a Nimmo type with more speed and a better glove. Nimmo developed more power as he went on in his career. Not crazy to think PCA might do the same. Regardless, even without the power boost, PCA was a very valuable prospect and shouldn't have been traded for a rental of a player like Baez in a season like that.
Steve Cohen 100% could have outbid the Tigers, the Mets decided not to do so, and offered him a reported 40 million below what the Cubs did. They decided they didn't want him back, he would still be a Met right now if the did.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
but he was a pending FA, unless you had some advantage of acquiring him that made it more likely he'd sign with you, why trade any prospects in a dead season?
especially with you have Cohen's wallet behind you and can outbid anyone making the decision easier.
id be pretty shocked if he's not gone. the opportunity cost of the roster spot isn't worth a mediocre hitter even at a cheap price if he cant play anywhere in the field.
stearns mentioned that they want to give young players chances but its unrealistic to expect all of them to be ready for those chances right away, which is 100% right. they need to have some veteran options who can play in the field if necessary. your justin turner idea is a great example of that, or perhaps one of the OF/DH options like gurriel or soler.
they need to get right the versatile roster construction eppler talked about (but couldn't deliver).
And that's the entire point. They didn't deem Baez worthy enough to keep around for more than a rental at the price he got. Why give up an asset like PCA for a rental when they were on the ropes anyway? Scott seem to be saying it was ok because they didn't think PCA would have the power he developed. Wrong. It was a bad trade then. Looking back it was a much worse trade. It was never justified for a rental, regardless of Scott's failed evaluations of PCA
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Margot Robbie example is completely absurd. The Mets given the money of the owner 99.9% could have brought back Baez if they wanted to. Your example doesn't have such a locked in outcome.
And that's the entire point. They didn't deem Baez worthy enough to keep around for more than a rental at the price he got. Why give up an asset like PCA for a rental when they were on the ropes anyway? Scott seem to be saying it was ok because they didn't think PCA would have the power he developed. Wrong. It was a bad trade then. Looking back it was a much worse trade. It was never justified for a rental, regardless of Scott's failed evaluations of PCA
? It was a terrible process (and the thumbs down stuff likely didn't help) but they pretty clearly intended to bring Baez back, Sandy was on record stating as much. As for Scott's failed evaluations, he flat out said "we", Zack Scott certainly wasn't traded PCA on an island with others in the organization saying they loved him and he was a future star.
Daniel Vogelbach (5.138): $2.6MM
Trevor Gott (5.057): $2MM
Drew Smith (5.034): $2.3MM
Pete Alonso (5.000): $22MM
Luis Guillorme (4.159): $1.7MM
Joey Lucchesi (4.112): $2MM
Sam Coonrod (4.078): $900K
Jeff Brigham (3.142): $1.1MM
David Peterson (3.089): $2MM
DJ Stewart (2.168): $1.5MM
Daniel Vogelbach (5.138): $2.6MM
Trevor Gott (5.057): $2MM
Drew Smith (5.034): $2.3MM
Pete Alonso (5.000): $22MM
Luis Guillorme (4.159): $1.7MM
Joey Lucchesi (4.112): $2MM
Sam Coonrod (4.078): $900K
Jeff Brigham (3.142): $1.1MM
David Peterson (3.089): $2MM
DJ Stewart (2.168): $1.5MM
And no there aren't 16 names there, I removed the players who are already gone.
@ZackScottSports
·
2h
It was fun talking about Four Rings, Yankees analytics, Carlos Mendoza, and what goes into a deadline deal like the Baez trade. Happy to answer questions asked in the comments. #Mets #Yankees #RedSox
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Baseball Isn’t Boring
@BBisntBoring
·
4h
Morning podcast: Just outstanding stuff from @ZackScottSports talking @FourRingsSports, team-building, Cashman's take on the Yankees' analytics world, managerial candidates and the inside story for one big Mets trade.
Listen: https://pdst.fm/e/chtbl.com/track/42D75/traffic.megaphone.fm/CAD4289359628.mp3?updated=1700140387
Win: http://Fanduel.com/boring
Show more
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
·
1h
Hey @ZackScottSports
, just listened and didn’t hear an answer to my question. How close were you to this bigger trade with the Cubs? Who was the major leaguer you were going to get and who was the other big Mets prospect and player you were considering dealing?
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Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
·
23h
Former Mets GM Zack Scott says tomorrow he will explain the reasoning behind why the Mets did the Javy Baez/Trevor Williams for PCA trade at the 2021 trade deadline. Wonder if he touches on @Ken_Rosenthal’s reporting in Aug 2021 and explains this aspect of talks as well. twitter.com/zackscottsport…
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Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Then the catchers were dropped from the concept and at one point I asked for Bryant to be added. It was clear that they liked what they had for Bryant elsewhere so that quickly went nowhere. #Cubs #Mets
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that wouldn't have been a good trade? he had an .886 ops as a met and at age 28 put up a 4 fwar season - which was his 3rd 4+ fwar full season in a row. his age 25 and age 26 all star seasons were actually better. the only down year was the shortened age 27 2020 covid partial season.
obviously he went off a cliff so it turned out to be a blessing in disguise but that wasnt exactly glaringly obvious at the time. which is why he got paid $140m.
but he was a pending FA, unless you had some advantage of acquiring him that made it more likely he'd sign with you, why trade any prospects in a dead season?
especially with you have Cohen's wallet behind you and can outbid anyone making the decision easier.
the advantage you have is knowing if cohen want to retain a player he can retain a player just like he did with nimmo/diaz. before baez signed in detroit the mets had deals with marte, escobar, canha, scherzer and may have also added gausman. they just chose to spend the $ on different players because a different gm with a different vision came in.
here were the standings the day the mets made the trade:
the guys atlanta dealt for propelled them to a WS win - soler was WS MVP - even knowing Acuna was out for the year.
texas just won a WS after being aggressive at the deadline knowing JDG was 100% out for the year.
from that day forward obviously the team collapsed and PCA's rehab/development ended up at the farthest end of the good outcome as possible for the cubs, but even there i think the loss for the mets is overstated unless he ends up on some kind of even crazier MVP-level outcome. The mets did what they had to do to extend Nimmo in CF who is probably still a more valuable player for several seasons, and if they want to go buy a 2-4 win OF'er they can easily do so almost any offseason (this one included). It just costs more $, which is something cohen is willing to do. PCA's prospects of succeeding right away probably aren't different than Baty's were at this time a year ago so while you hate to give up any asset for what amounted to very little, there's a good amount of prospect shine on him that will be gone as quickly as it was with kelenic if the 30% k-rate doesn't improve.
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better.
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
It was PCA and "another top prospect". I'm guessing it was Mauricio. There were rumors of Contreras for Mauricio.
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Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Then the catchers were dropped from the concept and at one point I asked for Bryant to be added. It was clear that they liked what they had for Bryant elsewhere so that quickly went nowhere. #Cubs #Mets
wow that would have been a massive deal.
i think that return would have had to have been (alvarez?).
clearly they dropped to an at the time lesser prospect in PCA for a lesser return.
Kimbrel brough back madrigal by himself, so Baez + Kimbrel + Contreras would have been something a lot more valuable than PCA which is probably alvarez.
BA's top mets prospects updated after the deadline were:
1. Alvarez
2. Baty
3. Mauricio
4. Vientos
5. Allan
6. Ginn
7. Megill
8. Ramirez
9. Dominguez
10. Cortes
https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/2021-new-york-mets-midseason-top-30-prospects-update/ - ( New Window )
Quote:
all I want to know is who this "top prospect" was
"There were so many different combos discussed, so it's hard to remember the exact details. There was a bigger trade discussion involving McCann (paid down), Dom Smith, and another top Mets prospect to ChC with Contreras, Kimbrel, Baez, and Williams coming back.
"
It was PCA and "another top prospect". I'm guessing it was Mauricio. There were rumors of Contreras for Mauricio.
i think it had to be alvarez. mets were getting back contreras under control for 2 years and kimbrel who brought back madrigal, who by himself was probably a better prospect than mauricio at that point in time.
madrigal was a consensus top 40 prospect pre-2021, #12 on BP, and hitting .305 for CWS in the big leagues when dealt.
mauricio was a consensus top 100 prospect but not top 50 on any list. alvarez was top 50 on BA and pipeline.
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
Quote:
had 1 year of control left, 2022 was his final season with the Cubs
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
The trade was consummated 7/30/2021, that's not 2 seasons of control. 2 seasons of control would be the Mets adding a player now, signed through 2025.
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
Don't believe that for a second.
@SotoC803
A decent bat is pretty much it. Granted its not NEARLY as good as Cubs fans make it seem.
Morel hit 9 bombs in his first 12 games in '23 and then posted a .227 AVG/.735 OPS, 17 HR, 54 RBI over the next 95 games.
A decent stat line....but certainly not "headliner" worthy.
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Quote:
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Sort of touches on that here.
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better."
Quote:
In comment 16291263 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
had 1 year of control left, 2022 was his final season with the Cubs
the 2 years were 2021/2022. the meaning was just that unlike kimbrel (who cost madrigal) and baez (who cost pca), contreras wasnt a rental. so to get all 3 would have been a significant price.
The trade was consummated 7/30/2021, that's not 2 seasons of control. 2 seasons of control would be the Mets adding a player now, signed through 2025.
lets not do the pedantic thing, the nomenclature around that is always inconsistent. I didnt say he had 2 more seasons of control i said he had 2 seasons of control, which technically they would have gotten. control of contreras in 2 seasons not 1. yes 1.5 would have been a more accurate way of saying it.
am I wrong on this and people don't care or would they think he's over-sharing.
Quote:
In comment 16291267 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Addressing the pressures at the deadline. I've seen people say that Steve, Sandy, or Lindor were the drivers for the trade. That's absolutely not true. It was made clear to me that we had to do something significant which is not an ideal starting point but it was what it was.
He also completely denies Lindor pushed for Baez. Said he asked Lindor about Baez and how he might handle the NY media and that was it.
this seems like a contradiction, unless he's saying the trade was entirely his choosing but he felt compelled to have to make a big trade?
others may disagree but i dont think it was unfair that he was pushed to do something significant. they were 5 games up, had Carrasco set to debut as a Met, Walker had made the ASG, Stroman/Megill pitched well in July, the hope of syndergaard (who came back) and jdg (who didnt but said he could have pitched postseason) - it obviously just all blew up. very different situation from being under .500, 10 games back of wild card and almost 20 back in division like this year.
Sort of touches on that here.
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
I polled our deadline room on Baez vs Bryant and it was an exact 50-50 split. I preferred Baez because Lindor was injured at the time, he gave us a more versatile roster (e.g., McNeil could go to OF if needed), and I thought he would handle NY better."
i thought he made the right decision between those 2 (and baez did perform).
it's weird but the not discussed enough poison pill of 2021/2023 was Carrasco.
1-5 with a 6 era in his 12 starts 2nd half 2021.
3-8 with a near 7 era in his 20 starts this year.
in 2021 they rushed him back without rehab starts and i guess last year he was decent but he was an almost auto-L every 5th day in the 2 parts of years where they massively underperformed. obviously wasnt just him but had he been just league average either year could have turned out differently.
am I wrong on this and people don't care or would they think he's over-sharing.
Got a ring with the Rangers and Stearns reached out to him before taking the Mets job so I don't think it's going to impact him much at all. He's stated he won't trades involving players who ended up not being traded/are still with the team that didn't trade them.
thats because it is most commonly phrased in present tense moments so it makes the most sense to say "x more years of control".
we are talking about it retroactively so i was summing up how many total years the mets would have received. the precise number was 1.5 seasons (or 1.333) i imprecisely said "2" because bbi isnt the wsj and i didnt think i needed to use decimals.
"Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
Bad take. After 2020, Carlos was one of 3 finalists in Boston before we brought Alex Cora back. We spoke to 10 candidates with no ML managerial experience, and he was by far the most prepared to be a manager on day 1. Good hire! #NYM #Mets #Yankees #RedSox"
sidenote his 2 blog posts on his website are reasonably interesting (especially this one).
https://fourringssports.com/analytics-drive-winning/ - ( New Window )
Daniel Vogelbach (5.138): $2.6MM
Trevor Gott (5.057): $2MM
Drew Smith (5.034): $2.3MM
Pete Alonso (5.000): $22MM
Luis Guillorme (4.159): $1.7MM
Joey Lucchesi (4.112): $2MM
Sam Coonrod (4.078): $900K
Jeff Brigham (3.142): $1.1MM
David Peterson (3.089): $2MM
DJ Stewart (2.168): $1.5MM
My guesses are Gott, Alonso, Smith, Guillorme, Lucchesi, Peterson and Stewart are all tendered and the rest are non-tendered. Guillorme is the one I'm least confident will be tendered.
To Scott's credit, he's done a good job fixing his name around the sport, glad to see that.
To Scott's credit, he's done a good job fixing his name around the sport, glad to see that.
here's the link, now spill them beans. or at least throw some clues.
https://dcs.megaphone.fm/CAD4289359628.mp3?key=15b9cfe91bd59ead10c0c280cd9cd5ad&request_event_id=8b79d8e8-a018-4ed2-81a0-c7614b7fbbc9 - ( New Window )
@bkfan09
Add another interesting prospect to keep an eye on in 2024 , Acosta coming back from injury at the end of the DSL season , Went 4-4 in today’s Rangers vs. Mets instructs , now the game means nothing but it’s good to see him heathy
Teams pursuing the top free agent — such as the Mets and perhaps the Yankees — have been informed that leaks will hurt their chances of bringing home the two-way superstar.
“If visits between Ohtani and a team are reported publicly, it will be held against the team, so the circles will be tiny and tight,” ESPN’s Jeff Passan reported.
“I have heard, I have been told, that Gary, Keith, and Ron over the last number of years are never down talking to the players anymore.” Giannotti said earlier this week on “Boomer and Gio.”
“They don’t, and the players and the managers and the coaches, they can’t stand the fact that these guys are so popular, and they sit up there and pontificate in the booth, but they’re never down there talking to the players and they’re like bigger than life.
“My theory on this is that someone was needling Gary, Keith, and Ron and gave Mendoza that line. Because he goes, ‘Deep conversations.’ That is my take on this.”
He later added: “I just know that this past year, in particular, they were never talking to the players.”
Quote:
But, from reading the comments here, he made one very big bold faced lie lol
To Scott's credit, he's done a good job fixing his name around the sport, glad to see that.
here's the link, now spill them beans. or at least throw some clues. https://dcs.megaphone.fm/CAD4289359628.mp3?key=15b9cfe91bd59ead10c0c280cd9cd5ad&request_event_id=8b79d8e8-a018-4ed2-81a0-c7614b7fbbc9 - ( New Window )
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
One thing I did notice about the A's, despite their payrolls they have been able to mostly put together competent bullpens. Middle of the pack in FIP, era and fWAR 2015-2022. Horrendous in 2023.
“I have heard, I have been told, that Gary, Keith, and Ron over the last number of years are never down talking to the players anymore.” Giannotti said earlier this week on “Boomer and Gio.”
“They don’t, and the players and the managers and the coaches, they can’t stand the fact that these guys are so popular, and they sit up there and pontificate in the booth, but they’re never down there talking to the players and they’re like bigger than life.
“My theory on this is that someone was needling Gary, Keith, and Ron and gave Mendoza that line. Because he goes, ‘Deep conversations.’ That is my take on this.”
He later added: “I just know that this past year, in particular, they were never talking to the players.”
Giannotti is a clown
KBO in English
@KBO_ENG
🚨LG Twins closer, widely known as Team Koreas closer, and the best closer in the KBO, Go Woo-suk, will be posted to the MLB.
Best of luck in your new opportunity stateside, Go.
This will mark yet another young promising Korean player in the MLB!
Go is related to Lee Jung-hoo
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
thats interesting - id imagine big name players often make their feelings known (max sort of did the same thing this year) but this seems notable given what ended up transpiring with the thumbs down stuff. rojas and scott obviously seemed in over their heads managing a clubhouse that august (and in scotts case his own decision making), so i suppose this could be read in that direction as well.
having seen how the searches for execs played out in the following offseasons, i wonder how much the owners (or wilpons) set the deal to close at the most inconvenient time possible for cohen a few days after the offseason began.
@timbhealey
Yoshinobu Yamamoto update: He is playing golf with the Cardinals’ Lars Nootbaar today, according to Nootbaar’s Instagram.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
I don't know if hockey is as reductive as baseball.
Analytics on football still aren't on par with baseball because of so many variables so I'm not sure hockey can be boiled down the same way either.
I have seen goal shares, win shares, expected goals, and other stats, but I don't think it's as easy to isolate an individual in any sport as it is in baseball with batter vs pitcher. everything else can be neutralized and therefore outcomes made somewhat predictable.
Can they do that in hockey?
What are the actions they could measure? shot velocity? release angle? I'd love to hear more but I'm naturally skeptical.
Quote:
really interesting. as an analytics guy he thinks teams have too many people in analytics at this point to negative detriment.
for PJ - he consults with hockey teams too and says he thinks hockey is about 20 years behind baseball in terms of using analytics lol. having some first hand experience with the league office i buy that.
i feel like scott came off better in that 1 interview than he ever did as met gm. but i guess that year was basically his first year dealing with the media in a significant manner.
I don't know if hockey is as reductive as baseball.
Analytics on football still aren't on par with baseball because of so many variables so I'm not sure hockey can be boiled down the same way either.
I have seen goal shares, win shares, expected goals, and other stats, but I don't think it's as easy to isolate an individual in any sport as it is in baseball with batter vs pitcher. everything else can be neutralized and therefore outcomes made somewhat predictable.
Can they do that in hockey?
What are the actions they could measure? shot velocity? release angle? I'd love to hear more but I'm naturally skeptical.
i agree, nothing is as statistically reductive as baseball. every batter/pitcher is an isolated individual event.
for hockey, like nextgen with nfl or statcast w/ mlb, i think the path forward is going to be based on movement tracking. acceleration, topspeed, "open rates", shot probability for goals over expectation, stuff like that.
i think natural stat trick and expected goals/high danger is the closest public data ive seen but i believe their methodology is just location based. shots from location x go in y% of the time. adding in the shot quality based on velocity/location/etc would take that to a different level and if had a database for all players id imagine we'd see a guy like mcdavid with just ridiculously higher adjusted scoring %. and conversely probably help quantify which goalies make the "hardest" saves.
It would be cool if they could do that - since it would help players know what skills to focus on. IOW if speed is not an material indicator/differentiator (it is) but edges are (they are too), that would be good to know for development (for example). Same with shot type, release angle, shot velocity, etc.
It would be cool if they could do that - since it would help players know what skills to focus on. IOW if speed is not an material indicator/differentiator (it is) but edges are (they are too), that would be good to know for development (for example). Same with shot type, release angle, shot velocity, etc.
guys like mcdavid are so good anyone can watch them and guess that they just constantly moving faster/shooting harder than everyone else. where it will be predictive is in finding guys who are underrated because their shot quality is better than whatever their present results are. not dissimilar to how a player like vientos' exit velocities/expected stats predicted that given regular playing time putting up numbers like he did in september was within reach and maybe even likely. the real numbers caught up with expected numbers.
"Now Kutsenda, a co-founder and managing partner at Seidler’s private equity firm, has assumed control on a temporary basis. While it is unclear how long Kutsenda will serve in that capacity, league sources said the Seidler family intends to honor Seidler’s wishes by retaining ownership of the Padres. Seidler and his extended family own a combined majority of the franchise, according to sources, with Seidler’s stake having been transferred to a trust."
Quote:
Nothing to spill, his big lie was saying Lindor had nothing to do with it. He 110% pushed for it, and 'they' pushed the FO to make a "flashy" move. And they didn't pull back when they knew JdG was hurt because of that.
thats interesting - id imagine big name players often make their feelings known (max sort of did the same thing this year) but this seems notable given what ended up transpiring with the thumbs down stuff. rojas and scott obviously seemed in over their heads managing a clubhouse that august (and in scotts case his own decision making), so i suppose this could be read in that direction as well.
having seen how the searches for execs played out in the following offseasons, i wonder how much the owners (or wilpons) set the deal to close at the most inconvenient time possible for cohen a few days after the offseason began.
That's disgusting. NEVER let the inmates run the asylum. Lindor need to sht up and play ball. Scott's a moron.
Don’t blame Lindor, Sandy or Cohen, they had nothing to do with the Baez trade. But it was made crystal clear to me that we needed to make a really big trade. Which forced my hands
Was it the guy in the third row, fifth seat giving him looks? WTF does that mean?? It wasn’t them, but they forced the trade. But they had nothing to do with it either 🤣
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap.
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
Quote:
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
This seems like a crazy overpay for a solid RP. I'm sure the Braves will unlock him further and he'll turn into a shut down closer though.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Would love to hear your thinking behind this one.
Quote:
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
Yeah, not going to lose sleep over Vogelbach if they tender him. As you said, he's cheap. They don't know what the offseason will bring. They will be, of course, looking for upgrades, but I'd rather them put money towards pitching if some of these DH guys are out of control price wise
He likely will not be. But just because he's tendered doesn't mean he's getting 300 ABs. They could for instance, trade him for a lower level "prospect" once they (as anticipated) sign another player to replace him. Tendering a contract is but one piece in the offseason puzzle. Not going to lose sleep either way.
wow, surprised Chavez accepted that.
so is Eric Hinske out then?
Curious if we keep Glen Sherlock (I think was a Buck guy) since he's done well working with Alvarez
Quote:
“Demoted” from bench coach back to hitting coach, Barnes from hitting coach to assistant hitting coach.
wow, surprised Chavez accepted that.
so is Eric Hinske out then?
Curious if we keep Glen Sherlock (I think was a Buck guy) since he's done well working with Alvarez
Hinske wasn’t mentioned in the release so I’m assuming he’s gone but who knows?
Quote:
Quote:
Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
Atlanta acquires reliever Aaron Bummer from the Chicago White Sox in exchange for RHP Michael Soroka, LHP Jared Shuster, INF Nicky Lopez, INF Braden Shewmake and minor-league RHP Riley Gowens.
probably all spare parts they were trying to clear off the 40 man but seems like a pretty big package for a rp with control issues - but he does get a ton of ground balls, avoids hard contact, and a lot of k's. shewmake and shuster (graduated) were top 10/20 prospects for the braves in the last couple years. makes the brooks raley trade look pretty cheap. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/aaron-bummer-has-an-amazing-pitch-but-it-is-not-the-one-you-think/ - ( New Window )
This seems like a crazy overpay for a solid RP. I'm sure the Braves will unlock him further and he'll turn into a shut down closer though.
i think the braves wanted to remove those guys from their 40 man any way so this was just cashing in a bunch of spare parts for 1 usable player. maybe they would have been happy to keep 1 or 2 of them, but the others were just fodder.
it's sort of like a mets package of butto, nido, drew smith + an org filler prospect out of top 30. id happily cash that type of group in for a late game reliever under control for a few years.
Same here GF. That Murfee thing perplexed me too. I think logic will prevail with the Vogelsnack thing today, but you never know with this franchise. Hopefully Stearns can read the room...
Quote:
Lord help us if vogey is tendered today. Would really be the first sour taste of the Stearns era. The Murfee thing doesn't sit well with me either with so much 40 man space but let's see what he does.
Nobody expects him tobe tendered,but the value of the 40 man spot is greater than the $2mm cost.
And they don’t need the 40 man spot TODAY.
Literally the WORST case scenario is you tender him and eat the $2mm if/when you need the spot. Best case is you have a near minimum wage guy at the end of your bench.
I ALMOST WANT THEM TO TENDER HIM, JUST FOR THE HILSRIOUS COMMENTS THAT WILL SURELY FOLLOW.
lol. The comments would be hilarious, no doubt Shecky!
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
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The Vogey Tender thing is sort of a Litmus Test for the new regime.
I would venture to say that Stearns 'fouled-off 2 good pitches' when he guessed wrong on his former manager's intentions and then miscalculated on putting together his 40-man.
Would love to hear your thinking behind this one.
I kept hearing rumors that Stearns had the inside scoop on whatever Counsell was thinking. When the deal finally went down, the SNY headline was 'David Stearns Surprised by Counsell's Cubs move'.
Fastball fouled back into the screen.
There were a couple of minor league pitchers that had shown some promise last summer. Suarez and Orze come to mind. Penn Murfee, could have easily been parked and then moved to the IL. The Mets 40-man was put together with only 33 players, leaving some guys unprotected. They got scooped on it. Did the Front Office expect to grab 7 players to fill out their roster?
Hanging curveball, fouled into the dugout.
Vogelbach has shown little as a far as a prototypical DH (Vientos almost out-homered him in far fewer at bats), and Vogey has no positional value.
In my opinion, the fan base is looking for a certain outcome on this one.
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says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
This kind of injury is potentially career-ending. There is almost no chance he pitches 1/3 of 2024. Odds are he doesn't throw a pitch until 2025, not really sure how "optimistic" one can be on major shoulder surgery that he just had 4 weeks ago. If he misses all of 2024, then you're probably not offering him a QO. 12 million + the cost to acquire for a guy who more likely than not doesn't throw a pitch for your team is an odd move.
Quote:
In comment 16292204 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
says teams are interested in trading for Woodruff. I don't get it. His projected arb is 11-12, he's going to likely miss all of 2024 and then is a FA. So you're going to trade a prospect to pay a guy 11-12 with the hope he comes back earlier than expected and looks so good he's worth offering the QO (21-ish million)? If he's non-tendered I understand the interest.
im not sure how insurance works on initial contracts bc i wonder if that pays down some of the price, but lets put that aside.
i think the way to look at it is this:
healthy he is a 3+ fwar pitcher.
if he comes back for approx the final 1/3 year + playoffs, that's 1 fwar prorated.
ben clemens estimate the price/war of FA in 2021 at 8.5m, so with some strong markets i'd guess today it's closer to 10-11m
so his arb number isn't too far off an optimistic outcome for his rehab. and if the optimistic outcome hits, like you mentioned you can QO him, which he probably turns down, and then you add the return of a QO FA if he departs (or you keep him).
the downside is rehab goes poorly and you blew $11-12m (unless there's insurance in which case the downside is hedged).
for a team like mets it's a good use of $ if there's reason to be optimistic about the medicals imo.
This kind of injury is potentially career-ending. There is almost no chance he pitches 1/3 of 2024. Odds are he doesn't throw a pitch until 2025, not really sure how "optimistic" one can be on major shoulder surgery that he just had 4 weeks ago. If he misses all of 2024, then you're probably not offering him a QO. 12 million + the cost to acquire for a guy who more likely than not doesn't throw a pitch for your team is an odd move.
like i said the only way it makes sense is if there's a reason for people involved to be optimistic about the medical. we have no way of knowing that and comps to other players may or may not work because we dont know the extent of their surgeries. even acl/tjs arent all the same.
woodruff did an interview a few weeks ago where he says he was told he could pitch "next summer".
even for happy talk that quote isn't all that encouraging. at this stage happy talk is common, as are rumors that "there's a lot of interest" when deadlines are coming up. we'll see what happens at the deadline, if it's a big long shot he's available next year he almost certainly gets non-tendered (and not traded).
https://wisportsheroics.com/milwaukee-brewers-brandon-woodruff-shoulder-surgery-pitch-in-2024-news-notes-rumors/ - ( New Window )
So even he doesn't sound particularly confident he's pitching in 2024, let alone 1/3 of a season.
Verified
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Jon Morosi
Verified
@jonmorosi
·
11m
Trade today: Rockies acquire right-hander Cal Quantrill from the Guardians for catcher Kody Huff.
Verified
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
Quote:
Bob Nightengale
Verified
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
I'm sure teams will call about Luis Robert. Getz admitted he;s discussed Eloy Jimenez.
Quote:
In comment 16292282 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Bob Nightengale
Verified
@BNightengale
·
4m
Attention all shoppers.
Chicago White Sox GM Chris Getz: "I've made it very clear that the White Sox are willing to listen in on any of our players.''
Too bad they don't have much on that roster. Gregory Santos would intrigue me as a 7th/8th inning guy but he isn't even arb eligible until years from now so doubt they sell him unless it's a decent return.
I'm sure teams will call about Luis Robert. Getz admitted he;s discussed Eloy Jimenez.
Yeah that's really all they got but didn't include them as cost would be too high. Andrew Vaughan somewhat perhaps as an Alonso replacement but I don't love that.
Yikes I did miss Cease somehow. Good thing the Braves system probably needs a year or two for them to start developing guys again with all the influx of talent they had in the last few years from their system.
@NYPost_Mets
Mets have been talking to teams potentially interested in Drew Smith ahead of tonight's deadline to tender contracts to arbitration eligible players.
@NYPost_Mets
Mets have been talking to teams potentially interested in Drew Smith ahead of tonight's deadline to tender contracts to arbitration eligible players.
For his sake I hope it's some team with a big ballpark. Surprisingly he did lower his HR/9 from some of his previous years.
@Buster_ESPN
Source: Pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto expected to be posted Monday. That means the 45-day negotiating window for MLB teams will start Tuesday.
@Buster_ESPN
Source: Pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto expected to be posted Monday. That means the 45-day negotiating window for MLB teams will start Tuesday.
Even sooner. I heard it as Tuesday. Bad reporting.
@anne__rogers
Source: #Royals have acquired RHP Kyle Wright from the Braves for RHP Jackson Kowar.
Guillorme
Brigham
Gotta
Coonrod
DJ Stewart signed to a 1 year deal.
New York Mets
@Mets
·
5m
We have opted not to tender a contract to right-handed pitchers Jeff Brigham, Sam Coonrod and Trevor Gott as well as infielders Luis Guillorme and Daniel Vogelbach.
that's that. presumably 2024 is indeed highly unlikely and now the question is if he takes a 2 year now or waits. not sure he has anything to gain by waiting.
interesting situation for the mets where they can essentially split his cost over 2 years and get a more valuable asset in 2025. obviously risky though.
New York Mets
@Mets
·
5m
We have opted not to tender a contract to right-handed pitchers Jeff Brigham, Sam Coonrod and Trevor Gott as well as infielders Luis Guillorme and Daniel Vogelbach.
Guillorme finally played like he looks last year. Him and Vogelblob must have the same nutritionist.
Mets have tons of open room now.
13. Believe we're at 27.
Should be 14 with Zack Short on the roster that's a waste.
Ks down. BBs up. HRs way up.
Quote:
i have the met active roster payroll currently about $110m lower than last year's OD (which then increased with the Gott trade).
13. Believe we're at 27.
Should be 14 with Zack Short on the roster that's a waste.
28. SRF was removed on the website by mistake remains on the 40 man
that's literally almost $10m per slot.
if 5 players are signed around the minimum, that's $16m per player for 7 players.
counting short, stearns is going to have changed almost exactly 1/3 of the 40 man in 1 offseason.
Quote:
In comment 16292790 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
i have the met active roster payroll currently about $110m lower than last year's OD (which then increased with the Gott trade).
13. Believe we're at 27.
Should be 14 with Zack Short on the roster that's a waste.
28. SRF was removed on the website by mistake remains on the 40 man
That's what I get for using Mets official site.
Aside from the spend factor involved and likely to fill spots, am curious if Stearns goes trade route for some activity. He showed a penchant for being willing to do that. I’m someone who feels a guy like McNeil might not be as long for the team as others.
that's literally almost $10m per slot.
if 5 players are signed around the minimum, that's $16m per player for 7 players.
counting short, stearns is going to have changed almost exactly 1/3 of the 40 man in 1 offseason.
They have to sign at least two starters. Likely a middle reliever/setup too. I’m more intrigued if there’s a move out there on position guys. I think they have to sign a solid OF for sure. Sure Stearns wants to add a bench/utility man. Sounds like they want to give Baty/Mauricio shots.
yamamoto $30m
lugo $10m
lopez $10m (or another hard thrower)
robertson $10m
severino $10m (or another 1 year SP)
suter $5m (or another low velocity rp)
(+105m)
trade drew smith for anything (-$2.3m)
lugo starts year as your #3/4 starter but hopefully moves to the BP midseason/down the stretch.
$7m to spend on 6 minimum salary depth players players likely destined for cuse, $300k to spend at the new citi field casino.
Quote:
how's everyone spending it?
that's literally almost $10m per slot.
if 5 players are signed around the minimum, that's $16m per player for 7 players.
counting short, stearns is going to have changed almost exactly 1/3 of the 40 man in 1 offseason.
They have to sign at least two starters. Likely a middle reliever/setup too. I’m more intrigued if there’s a move out there on position guys. I think they have to sign a solid OF for sure. Sure Stearns wants to add a bench/utility man. Sounds like they want to give Baty/Mauricio shots.
for pos players i think plan A is soto and pretty much anyone other than jett williams is on table.
pads need CF, 1b, SP so mets best offer is probably something like Gilbert (or Acuna), Vientos, whatever SP pads like best, and id include Marte fully paid for since SD can then slot him into LF as a free replacement. if someone beats that offer it's the biggest return for a rental player i can recall. definitely a bigger return than lindor, and id say a bigger return than betts.
betts brough back verdugo, jeter downs, connor wong. verdugo was ranked as a consensus top 50 predebut, which is roughly where gilbert is right now, though he was post-debut and coming off a strong 817 ops season w lad.
if no soto then i think the move is signing 1 of the 20+ homer LF/DH guys on market (gurriel, soler, hernandez, etc). and probably redistributing the $ to signing a better 2nd SP.
As for pitchers I can’t devote 30m to Lugo, Robertson, Severino. I’d go or a Lugo reunion but I’m not interested in the other two at those price points.
I confess to only recently distinguishing between the Verlander Outfielders and Drew "The Gun" Gilbert has the arm for RF. I think he's a keeper.
Ryan Clifford "The Big Red Dog" seems like a Lucas Duda type and he's the tradeable guy between the two players.
Gross has spent the last 12 years w/Houston, including the last 5 as their scouting director.”
I confess to only recently distinguishing between the Verlander Outfielders and Drew "The Gun" Gilbert has the arm for RF. I think he's a keeper.
Ryan Clifford "The Big Red Dog" seems like a Lucas Duda type and he's the tradeable guy between the two players.
Lugo has said he views himself as a SP so you’re almost certainly correct
yamamoto $30m
lugo $10m
lopez $10m (or another hard thrower)
robertson $10m
severino $10m (or another 1 year SP)
suter $5m (or another low velocity rp)
(+105m)
trade drew smith for anything (-$2.3m)
lugo starts year as your #3/4 starter but hopefully moves to the BP midseason/down the stretch.
$7m to spend on 6 minimum salary depth players players likely destined for cuse, $300k to spend at the new citi field casino.
Eric doing Lugo dirty lol, the man wants to start ha
I watched DR on Marlins last year, he looks slightly cooked
yamamoto $30m
lugo $10m
lopez $10m (or another hard thrower)
robertson $10m
severino $10m (or another 1 year SP)
suter $5m (or another low velocity rp)
(+105m)
trade drew smith for anything (-$2.3m)
lugo starts year as your #3/4 starter but hopefully moves to the BP midseason/down the stretch.
$7m to spend on 6 minimum salary depth players players likely destined for cuse, $300k to spend at the new citi field casino.
What do you think about Chapman over Robertson?
Both past their prime, but Chapman is the type that pitching coaches think they can fix IMO.
Patrick Sandoval comes off as a SP who needs a fresh start and new coaching to unlock his talent.
I've watched him take over a game from time to time.
Gross has spent the last 12 years w/Houston, including the last 5 as their scouting director.”
Unclear what this means for Tanous at this time.
the hires today (and the others they made) seem really encouraging. Brewer guy had a good track record of promotions in a good org, same with Astros guy, Green brings a lot of things to table.
with all the open roster spots it's hard to envision this being anything other than a crazy offseason. the open roster spots don't necessarily mean they are going to spend like crazy, but obviously they will spend where they think guys are fits. they have a lot of smart guys in the room. feels reminiscent of the early sandy/depo days of moneyball with money (except this time actually with money).
Quote:
soto $30m ($41m extension starting next year)
yamamoto $30m
lugo $10m
lopez $10m (or another hard thrower)
robertson $10m
severino $10m (or another 1 year SP)
suter $5m (or another low velocity rp)
(+105m)
trade drew smith for anything (-$2.3m)
lugo starts year as your #3/4 starter but hopefully moves to the BP midseason/down the stretch.
$7m to spend on 6 minimum salary depth players players likely destined for cuse, $300k to spend at the new citi field casino.
What do you think about Chapman over Robertson?
Both past their prime, but Chapman is the type that pitching coaches think they can fix IMO.
i thought Robertson showed a lot of craftiness last year handling different situations well. i think each of the last 2 years he got burned out by bad teams who had him as their highest leverage player (40 innings in both 2023 as met closer and 2022 w/ cubs) when really he should be a 7th/8th inning guy who gets some easy outings and never gets pushed beyond 1 inning. post-trade deadline both years his walks went up by big margins, as did his babip which is probably in part an adjustment to a new team/new positioning. his FIPs didnt change either year pre or post trade.
havent seen as much of chapman recently, but the way id construct the bullpen id be looking for guys with experience in high leverage and with different types of stuff and good walk rates. id want 1 hard thrower, 1 softer thrower with 3 or 4 different pitches, and another guy somewhere in between. I think Robertson is a good in between guy with a lot of high leverage experience and i like some of the other younger hard thrower options better than chapman (like lopez).
As for pitchers I can’t devote 30m to Lugo, Robertson, Severino. I’d go or a Lugo reunion but I’m not interested in the other two at those price points.
agree on the extension. i dont think it needs to happen day 1 but it has to be like lindor where you know they are open to it and the 2 sides are in the ballpark. judge got $40m per year. soto on $41 x 13 years is $533m and it pays him through his age 38. the total money on that may exceed what ohtani gets since he's 5 years older. id find it hard to imagine soto turning down anything $500m+.
-Both Nightengale and Rosenthal have pieces today suggesting the Braves are likely working on something “big”
-Both Nightengale and Rosenthal have pieces today suggesting the Braves are likely working on something “big”
Braves need a reliable veteran SP to frontline their rotation. Burnes would be scary there.
Interesting.
*Yamamoto not Ohtani
ff Passan
Verified
@JeffPassan
The Atlanta Braves were a real threat to poach Aaron Nola. But as negotiations with Nola and his agents, Joe Longo and Garrett Parcell, went on, the Phillies stepped up and gave out their biggest contract for a pitcher and 11th biggest ever.
@BNightengale
was on top of things.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
Reportedly they have touched base with Wheeler on an extension this off-season. Unclear if they would do that and still with Yamamoto but you never know.
Quote:
He has been an in innings eater but he is trending downward. That’ll be an anchor contract in couple years. Keeps them competitive next few years and that’s really what this is about.
I’m curious whether they extend Wheeler a couple years.
Reportedly they have touched base with Wheeler on an extension this off-season. Unclear if they would do that and still with Yamamoto but you never know.
I don’t see the Yamamoto interest as a likelihood. I think they’re just checking in and seeing if they can up ante on Mets.
@jonmorosi
As I reported on @MLBNetwork
a few moments ago, Brandon Woodruff is drawing interest from a majority of @MLB
teams in free agency.
Woodruff is expected to sign a multiyear deal following surgery. The Brewers declined to offer him a 2024 contract at Friday's deadline.
-Mets were not "in" on Nola and as of now are also not believed to be in on Snell.
The compensation to the Japanese team is now set in stone right? They receive $20 million or something like that.
The compensation to the Japanese team is now set in stone right? They receive $20 million or something like that.
Quote:
can sign as soon as tomorrow, he has 45 days to sign.
The compensation to the Japanese team is now set in stone right? They receive $20 million or something like that.
", the release fee will be 20 percent of the first $25 million plus 17.5 percent of next $25 million plus 15 percent of the total guaranteed value exceeding $50 million."
Trivino
Kept Johnson and Jimenez and now added one of the best FA RP's to add to Minter. They did trade Anderson so that's a loss.
and now they add a high velo arm along with a funky sinker lefty who gets a ton of ground balls/and also has a good slider.
with that lineup and that bullpen unseating them is going to be really hard.
clearly that's what the braves have been doing to positive effect for years now -- and as much as people talk about reliever risk they have probably gone multi-year on more relievers the past 3-4 years than any other team in baseball.
2022 (NC Dinos, KBO): 2.97 ERA, 193.2 IP, 34 BB, 194 K, 14 HR
Rucinski kicked around the majors for a few years, appearing with the Angels, Twins, and Marlins between 2014-18, which in and of itself is a great outcome for an undrafted free agent (out of an Ohio State University of some sort). He went to Korea after that season, however, and has reinvented himself, getting stronger, throwing harder, and adding a splitter, to the point where he might be able to come back to MLB as a starter. Rucinski was at 92-94 mph in relief before going to Korea, but over there has been more 94-96, with a cutter in the low 90s that’s probably his best pitch and an above-average curveball that might also miss some bats here. He’s coming off his best season to date, where he walked just 4.1 percent of batters and struck out almost a quarter, and in four years in the KBO he hasn’t missed a start, taking the ball 121 times in total and never throwing less than 177 innings in any season. This at least looks and sounds like a potential league-average starter here, but there’s risk involved in any starter coming from the KBO to MLB because the quality of hitters is much higher here. I could see two years and $16-18 million-ish, or maybe three years and $20-22 million, for a team that believes he has an excellent chance to remain a starter.
@BNightengale
Japanese pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto has been officially posted and Major League Clubs have been notified. The window begins at 8 a.m. Tuesday and a club must sign him no later than 5 p.m. on January 4, 2024.
@JustinCToscano
Interesting note on late-inning reliever Reynaldo Lopez: He’ll prepare as a starting pitcher this winter and will be stretched out in spring training to give the Braves another option for the rotation. They think he can potentially help in both roles.
@JonHeyman
Lance Lynn agrees to Cardinals deal, 1 year plus option. Guarantees $10M in 2024, plus $1M buyout on option. Can be worth about $26M over 2 with escalators. Pluses: Started with Cards, lives nearby in southern Illinois. Pending physical tomorrow.
@JustinCToscano
Interesting note on late-inning reliever Reynaldo Lopez: He’ll prepare as a starting pitcher this winter and will be stretched out in spring training to give the Braves another option for the rotation. They think he can potentially help in both roles.
no real reason to not do this from the ATL perspective. if it works great, super cheap starter with the flex to go to the BP on a postseason roster that shrinks the rotation, if it doesn't he's paid like a reliever.
i'd give the exact same (or slightly bigger since he already proved he can do it) deal to Lugo and do the same. that's what they should have done last year.
$hit! I wanted him with the Mets badly! Would've been the perfect setup guy for Diaz.
@BNightengale
Japanese pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto has been officially posted and Major League Clubs have been notified. The window begins at 8 a.m. Tuesday and a club must sign him no later than 5 p.m. on January 4, 2024.
Gotta get him.
Joe Kelly is a legend from the Jomboy Media lip reading videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coSL_bN1gQw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=IBNIfyd6cbE
New York Mets
@Mets
We’ve signed RHP Cole Sulser to a minor league contract with an invitation to Major League Spring Training.
If this were Tommy John surgery, Woodruff would be a virtual lock to be back to normal by Opening Day 2025. Márquez got two years and $20 million, while Clevinger got two years and $11.5 million for one year of rehab and another year of regularly scheduled programming. When healthy, Woodruff is way better than those guys, so if this were Tommy John, he would probably be in line for more money, more years, or both.
But rather than a one-year layoff with a high probability of recovery, Woodruff is in for an injury that — according to the very limited sample in the 2023 study — is about a coin flip that he’ll return, with the possibility that he’ll miss not one but two seasons.
Link - ( New Window )
50 more signings like this, PLEASE!!!!
No risk
He’s 90% cooked, but if he isn’t, great to have in AAA for those RP rotations they do all season.
Quote:
Kelly would be a decent get for the Mets IMO.
Joe Kelly is a legend from the Jomboy Media lip reading videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coSL_bN1gQw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=IBNIfyd6cbE
LMFAO
Same with trading for Manoah.
They aren’t good moves if you are banking in them. But if you make three moves like that in tandem, one probably kinda works. One blows up, and third is your lotto ticket.
If all three bust, so be it. Just can’t take up the roster spots all off-season, so have o swing late.
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
2014: 30
2015: 24
2016: 19
2017: 18
2018: 24
2019: 16
2020: 29
2021: 32
2022: 26
2023: 27
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Like the color looks good.
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
2014: 30
2015: 24
2016: 19
2017: 18
2018: 24
2019: 16
2020: 29
2021: 32
2022: 26
2023: 27
less than 1 per year per team is lower than i would have guessed.
9 minor leaguers
Quote:
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
pretty sure that's the sport which is a big step down from the regular bronco. cant get mad at a free car but cespedes wouldnt even give that garage space. like you said, hopefully hatchet buried and everyone happy.
This Day in Mets History
@NYMhistory
11/20/2006 Moises Alou and the Mets agree to a one-year, $7.5 million contract. Alou spent the final two years of his big league career in New York, hitting .342 in 102 games. In his age-40 season, Alou set a club record by recording a hit in 30 consecutive games.
Quote:
In comment 16297215 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Tim Healey
@timbhealey
The big Mets news of the week: Jeff McNeil finally got a car from Francisco Lindor, per Garrett Parcell, one of McNeil’s agents at Paragon Sports.
In May 2022, Lindor offhandedly promised McNeil a car if he won the batting title. Then McNeil did.
Now, he gets a new Ford Bronco.
Love to see players get along. Hope these two have buried the hatchet.
pretty sure that's the sport which is a big step down from the regular bronco. cant get mad at a free car but cespedes wouldnt even give that garage space. like you said, hopefully hatchet buried and everyone happy.
Well, Cespedes also had a horse in his "garage" so not sure he's the best gauge. I tried to get my wife to want a bronco to replace her Honda Pilot, but no luck.
@Travis_Sawchik
According to @MLBPlayerAnalys
's excellent TJS database, there was no spike in Tommy John cases in year one of the pitch clock era. TJS cases by year among major league pitchers:
2014: 30
2015: 24
2016: 19
2017: 18
2018: 24
2019: 16
2020: 29
2021: 32
2022: 26
2023: 27
While TJS is one valid metric to track under Pitch Clock Rules, I'd be curious to see a list of Pitchers on the IL with other Arm/Shoulder injuries (including short stays). Don't know if anybody tracked that across both leagues over the last few years.
Good to see.
This is how good front offices are built right here…
With Shildt being hired as the Padres new manager, seems like a decent chance Phil Nevin is @mets next bench coach #Mets
Drew Gilbert
Jett Williams
Ronny Mauricio
Luisangel Acuña
Ryan Clifford
Christian Scott
Colin Houck
Blade Tidwell
Alex Ramirez
Kevin Parada
Dominic Hamel
Mike Vasil
Marco Vargas
Jeffry Rosa
Brandon Sproat
Tyler Stuart
Joander Suarez
Wilfredo Lara
Jacob Reimer
Julio Zayas
Jeremy Rodriguez
Boston Baro
Cristopher Larez
AJ Ewing
Jesus Baez
Justin Jarvis
Luis Rodriguez
Matt Rudick
Jonah Tong
Stanley Consuegra
@RotoClegg
I scouted both Ramirez and Parada a good bit this year. Parada is close to falling off hard. Ramirez does a lot of things well. Had 10 balls hit over 95 mph right at people in a series I was at. Plus a high projectable frame. There’s more there for both than what the numbers say
Chris Clegg
@RotoClegg
Ramirez still has a lot to prove but has all the intangibles to be a solid player. He does need a solid 2024 though
@RotoClegg
Questions on whether he can stick behind the plate due to arm strength. Contact skills have backed up every year since being drafted. Power has also taken a step back. He’s kinda a shell of the player he was at GT
"Back Of The Rotation Types
Coleman Crow, RHP, Mets
While he may have benefited from the pre-tacked Southern League balls, Crow’s fastball displayed a significant jump in induced vertical break and overall shape early in the season. He had the biggest year-over-year jump in vertical break and looked like a potential breakout in the making. The Mets acquired Crow in late June in exchange for Eduardo Escobar. Prior to the trade, Crow hit the injured list with an elbow sprain in May and the club announced on Aug. 11 he underwent Tommy John surgery. That could actually make it easier for a team to pick and keep Crow in 2024. The righty would occupy a 40-man roster spot all offseason, but will spend all next season on the 60-man injured list. Any team that selects Crow would then be required to carry him on their active MLB roster in 90 days in 2025 to fulfill Rule 5 roster requirements before being allowed to option him to the minors."
Everyone is after the same domino(s) and when they fall...
80/80 on the name.
-really like the Stearns hire
-The Mets internally feel Jett Williams is the clear top prospect.
-Mauricio is viewed as a 6 or 7 hitter, hitting remains an open question.
I'll keep updating
-Rarely swings and misses, makes hard contact, should hit for a high average and OBP. Long term CF might be his best position. He can probably get to average MLB quality defense in SS if needed. They are confident he can easily play 2b if necessary
Zack Scott
@ZackScottSports
McCann contract was done by Sandy. Porter and I were GM finalists still interviewing when that was finished. Before I interviewed, I removed my case for Realmuto over Springer from the presentation because McCann was just about completed.
-Tidwell's control is shaky, improved as the season went on, changeup has improved a lot, opinions split starter, reliever, potential closer, #4 type of upside
-Some don't love his unusual set up before he hits, Mets minor league ballparks don't help hitters. Seeing how he bounces back will be an interesting subplot for the Mets system.
-Mets like Nolan McLean a lot. Scott the only SP in the system viewed as a potential "better than 4".
@mikemayer22
Mets have signed right-handed pitcher Joseph Yabbour to a minor league deal.
The 20-year-old had a 3.60 ERA and 12.6 K/9 in 20 innings this season in the DSL with the Mariners.
Yabbour was released by the Twins in 2022 having never thrown a pro pitch for them. He signed with the Mariners and has been throwing smoke in the DSL, sitting 95 mph with dome riding life. Even though he’s 19, Yabbour isn’t especially projectable. His release isn’t consistent and neither is his breaking ball, but his arm strength makes him a young name to monitor in a system that’s tended to take velo-only guys and make them better.
You're welcome. Just to be clear, the episode was exclusively about the top 10, so a guy like Marco Vargas wasn't mentioned because he didn't make their top 10.
@mikemayer22
Mets have signed right-handed pitcher Joseph Yabbour to a minor league deal.
The 20-year-old had a 3.60 ERA and 12.6 K/9 in 20 innings this season in the DSL with the Mariners.
Cousin of the Acuna's.
Also disagree with Eddy that Tidwell upside is a #4. With his K rates his stuff clearly plays up. I can see him as a 3 or even if a 2 if he elevates more.
Clifford struggled the most post trade, park change didn't help, had trouble seeing the ball as well (the signage), if it clicks, profile is a slugging CO with a "good feel to hit".
Great stuff Dan, thanks for posting this.
Help me understand the part about the signage...
Are they saying that the signs on the outfield wall at BK are giving Clifford trouble in seeing the pitch ?
Quote:
-Gilbert was ranked the Mets #3 prospect for them. Floor is an average MLB player, a lot of positive attributes, Acuna didn't play well post trade. Bottom of the order kind of player, potential starter at 2b.
Clifford struggled the most post trade, park change didn't help, had trouble seeing the ball as well (the signage), if it clicks, profile is a slugging CO with a "good feel to hit".
Great stuff Dan, thanks for posting this.
Help me understand the part about the signage...
Are they saying that the signs on the outfield wall at BK are giving Clifford trouble in seeing the pitch ?
Yes. Clifford complained the signs on the walls in BK made it hard for him to pick up the ball.
@RotoClegg
Questions on whether he can stick behind the plate due to arm strength. Contact skills have backed up every year since being drafted. Power has also taken a step back. He’s kinda a shell of the player he was at GT
I saw Parada for three games in the Arizona Fall League. His arm is at best a 40. Guys were stealing off him left & right. He didn't impress me as a hitter either. He ended up hitting .186 with sub 7 OPS. Granted small sample, but how he ended up #1 is beyond my comprehension. Weak contact, high miss rate...etc. Injured? Tired?