Checked out what some 49ers fans are saying about the loss

Juxtapose that with some on BBI saying that Shanahan always thinking 3-4 steps ahead is smart.

...and that was due to the special teams mishap. And that covered just 20 yards.

They basically kept Mahomes in check the entire game and had chances to build a lead, but never could do it.

In comment 16396725 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Juxtapose that with some on BBI saying that Shanahan always thinking 3-4 steps ahead is smart.

You are too funny. There is no bizarre comment you will not double down on.

...and can grow into the position, but I wonder how he will play with no necessarily great talent around him.

I feel his arm is just average, but accuracy is quite good.

Book still to be written on him.

I think that was their big issue.

when they had opportunities, eg the CMC fumble, Purdy missing open receivers for TD, Kyle missed a few playcalls, where the fook was Kittle, etc. This is where teams need to know or learn how to finish a SB win.

The muffed punt was a monster, it completely got KC re-engaged in the war for the remainder of the game.

SF probably wins

But Chiefs had the much better QB and the championship DNA. There was ALOT less pressure on the Chiefs.

Mike - so you are saying you agree with the way Shanahan coached that game?

that would have been a much different outcome.

In comment 16396736 logman said:

Quote:

SF probably wins

The Lions made the same mistake against SF in the championship game.

Certainly a much much different level of "quarterback hell." But when will the team around Purdy be better to put them over the edge over a team quarterbacked by an elite QB? Kittle, Samuels, Aiyuk, CMC and a strong offensive line, a great defense. If I'm objectively looking for a weak link, it's hard not to land on Purdy as efficient as he is.

Take the Mahomes throw before the Chiefs fumbled it away the next play. That was not the most advantageous coverage to throw into but Mahomes has the arm and talent to make that throw and it was a huge play that should have led to points. I don't see Purdy making those types of plays.

Was bad and typical Shanahan. But taking the ball in OT was the right choice. His defense was winded. As for Purdy, I think the game showed they can win it all with him. If not for screwed up punt, they probably would have. Who can they get with better numbers at such a cap friendly salary?

and is very low on the list of reasons why the Niners lost. He missed a few throws, it happens. The over throw to Aiyuk in the end zone was one of those misses, but he was getting hit as he threw. If that was completed, it would have been one of the greatest throws in Super Bowl history because of the pressure he was under. I came out of last night thinking that I don't see how anyone can view Purdy as a "game manager" or "system QB".

Then again, it gave their defense a much needed rest. And if both teams match scores it becomes sudden death and you want the ball in that situation. Of course, you’ve got to get to that point. But you should never put the ball into Mahomes hands with a chance to win the game with a TD (and no game clock to boot)

He has some great traits, but ultimately I think the arm limits him against elite defenses.

They will have another opportunity to evaluate his play next year. He was in point-of-fact only in his 2nd year in the NFL.

I know as Giants fans this it's hard to remember this, but players actually sometimes do get better with more experience.

They lost the Super Bowl in overtime to a top 5 all time coach and a top 5 all time QB. He and they had a fantastic season.

In comment 16396738 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Mike - so you are saying you agree with the way Shanahan coached that game?

No. He abandoned the run too soon which is the one thing he couldn't do. You have to keep Mahomes off the field and not make it Purdy vs. Spags.

But the OT decision was not a mistake. It just didn't result in them winning. Honestly, kicking off to start OT, with a gassed defense, was also not going to result in them winning.

Mahomes and Reid won this game. Shanahan didn't lose it.

In comment 16396740 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

In comment 16396736 logman said: Quote: SF probably wins The Lions made the same mistake against SF in the championship game.

I doubt he stops the special teams punt muff which was the turning point in the game for a KC offense which had been doing nothing.

In comment 16396740 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

In comment 16396736 logman said: Quote: SF probably wins The Lions made the same mistake against SF in the championship game.

Yup

is how Spags and the KC defense shut down the Niners running game for much of the game, and was putting on constant pressure on Purdy.

Spags has beaten better QB's before (Brady, Farve) in pressure situations if he has great pass rushers. In critical situations, Spags got pressure on Purdy and forced incompletions. That was the key, IMO.

right after the 2:00 warning - great blitz from Spags. SF needed to run the clock out in regulation and kick the game-winning FG as time expired, otherwise Mahomes was gonna take it.

didn't lose the game. But he did miss opportunities to gamble a bit. In the end, Spags was up for the challenge.

Neither QB played well frankly (I'm putting Mahomes on the "expectation" scale - as for him, this was a mediocre game, but when push came to shove, Mahomes willed that team in the 4th quarter/OT where it mattered).

In comment 16396742 widmerseyebrow said:

Quote:

Certainly a much much different level of "quarterback hell." But when will the team around Purdy be better to put them over the edge over a team quarterbacked by an elite QB? Kittle, Samuels, Aiyuk, CMC and a strong offensive line, a great defense. If I'm objectively looking for a weak link, it's hard not to land on Purdy as efficient as he is. Take the Mahomes throw before the Chiefs fumbled it away the next play. That was not the most advantageous coverage to throw into but Mahomes has the arm and talent to make that throw and it was a huge play that should have led to points. I don't see Purdy making those types of plays.

But the 49ers don't have any QB hell. Purdy is playing on a deal they can live with, even drafting another QB or signing a veteran. They have all the flexibility you could ask for.

small with some coaching decisions in the Super Bowl

I don’t think the coin toss decision is as cut and dry a bad call as some say. His defense was gassed, and if it went to sudden death they get the ball first

Simple difference is KC finished their drive, SF couldn’t when it counted

Shanahan getting pass happy despite having CMC and that OL yet again was a much bigger blunder

In comment 16396733 JonC said:

Quote:

when they had opportunities, eg the CMC fumble, Purdy missing open receivers for TD, Kyle missed a few playcalls, where the fook was Kittle, etc. This is where teams need to know or learn how to finish a SB win. The muffed punt was a monster, it completely got KC re-engaged in the war for the remainder of the game.

Turning point of the game

In comment 16396759 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

In comment 16396738 ryanmkeane said: Quote: Mike - so you are saying you agree with the way Shanahan coached that game? No. He abandoned the run too soon which is the one thing he couldn't do. You have to keep Mahomes off the field and not make it Purdy vs. Spags. But the OT decision was not a mistake. It just didn't result in them winning. Honestly, kicking off to start OT, with a gassed defense, was also not going to result in them winning. Mahomes and Reid won this game. Shanahan didn't lose it.

This. I also don’t ink abandoning the run too soon was the completely wrong decision. It’s not like they were up two touchdowns. The thought process was probably that a 10 point lead isn’t enough against KC and they needed to try to move it through the air and extend the lead. It blew up in their face, but I think the logic was right.

‘Bummer.’

In comment 16396780 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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‘Bummer.’

lol

In comment 16396780 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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‘Bummer.’

100%

it seems like a lot of people are bemoaning the state of the Niners' OL and lambasting McKivitz for letting Jones waltz by him for the key pressure in OT. They also seem less than optimistic about Lynch being able to draft the right replacements moving forward, now that Adam Peters is gone. "I can't believe Lynch drafted a kicker in the third round (Moody) with all our OL needs," etc.

Hey Niners, wanna see what a REAL bad offensive line looks line?

In comment 16396732 BleedBlue46 said:

Quote:

I think that was their big issue.

Shanny Jr. should've taken a page out of the Giants' playbook in SB 25 when Erhardt and Parcells controlled the clock by running the ball and controlling the LoS against the Bills' smallish defensive front. Like Marv Levy, he left running plays off the field.

In comment 16396769 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

But the 49ers don't have any QB hell. Purdy is playing on a deal they can live with, even drafting another QB or signing a veteran. They have all the flexibility you could ask for.

Their clock is ticking on "flexbility". They have a wealth of weapons on offense and defense because they aren't paying a QB. We'll see how much they value Purdy in 2 years when they have to pay him. Until then, their clock is ticking. Not QB hell, but by no means can they feel they have their long-term answer either as a long-term answer implies you are ok paying that person a premium salary. And if you pay Purdy even $40M a year (below market) you won't have money for all the weapons that today he benefits from.

In comment 16396800 BigTymer said:

Quote:

In comment 16396769 Mike from Ohio said: Quote: But the 49ers don't have any QB hell. Purdy is playing on a deal they can live with, even drafting another QB or signing a veteran. They have all the flexibility you could ask for. Their clock is ticking on "flexbility". They have a wealth of weapons on offense and defense because they aren't paying a QB. We'll see how much they value Purdy in 2 years when they have to pay him. Until then, their clock is ticking. Not QB hell, but by no means can they feel they have their long-term answer either as a long-term answer implies you are ok paying that person a premium salary. And if you pay Purdy even $40M a year (below market) you won't have money for all the weapons that today he benefits from.

I agree.

CMC, Kittle, Debo won't be nearly as effective two years from now.

The style in which they play the game takes a toll psychically.

In comment 16396732 BleedBlue46 said:

Quote:

I think that was their big issue.

That isn't true at all.

and their window is closing. Deebo is owed a fortune next year and has lost a step. Kittle is being paid a fortune and is now on the wrong side of 30 and is taking a beating being basically just a blocking TE on that roster. Greenlaw probably won't ever be the same player. They need to pay Ayuik. And they've played a ton of games over the last few seasons. They might have missed their chance.

They've been to 7 NFC championship games since 2011 and have no rings to show for it. Brutal.

.

In comment 16396800 BigTymer said:

Quote:

In comment 16396769 Mike from Ohio said: Quote: But the 49ers don't have any QB hell. Purdy is playing on a deal they can live with, even drafting another QB or signing a veteran. They have all the flexibility you could ask for. Their clock is ticking on "flexbility". They have a wealth of weapons on offense and defense because they aren't paying a QB. We'll see how much they value Purdy in 2 years when they have to pay him. Until then, their clock is ticking. Not QB hell, but by no means can they feel they have their long-term answer either as a long-term answer implies you are ok paying that person a premium salary. And if you pay Purdy even $40M a year (below market) you won't have money for all the weapons that today he benefits from.

They have a passable QB being paid less than $1M/year. They can compete with him next year while using that cap space to bolster the rest of the lineup. They can also draft a developmental QB in the mid rounds and let him sit and grow for a year or two. I wish the Giants had their QB situation.

Bottled up the Chiefs' run game, didn't let Mahomes improvise, at least in the first half, contained and frustrated Kelce, gave the offense a chance to put the game away early in the second half when KC went three-and-out with he kickoff. Unfortunately, for them, Spags'defense was a little bit better and Mahomes just took over in OT.

The 49ers have the better team overall, but in the big games I look primarily at the HC / QB (along with the coordinators). The Reid / Sir Patrick combination is very hard to beat. Throw in Spags’s track record in big games and you have your winner.

Purdy is a nice QB on rookie deal.....

is a mediocre QB. He might grow to be more, but there are a dozen QBs in the NFL I expect to see win that game for the Niners, and a dozen more from whom I would expect the same outcome. He is not special. He did enough to lose against the Lions, but for butterfingers by the Lions secondary. His team dominated in the first half of the SB, but ended up with 10 points, 7 on a trick play he was basically not involved in.

The Chiefs defense looked physically defeated. The Niners were really gashing them in the running game. Last set of downs, CMC rips off a six yard gain on first down. Then Shanahan decides to run a play action bootleg that didn't work - Purdy was under immediate pressure and dumped it off for no gain. Then an incompletion on third down.

It just seemed to me that, in that moment, you run until they stop it.

In comment 16396818 mfjmfj said:

Quote:

is a mediocre QB. He might grow to be more, but there are a dozen QBs in the NFL I expect to see win that game for the Niners, and a dozen more from whom I would expect the same outcome. He is not special. He did enough to lose against the Lions, but for butterfingers by the Lions secondary. His team dominated in the first half of the SB, but ended up with 10 points, 7 on a trick play he was basically not involved in.

And could have been called back due to penalty.

So much for the KC/Kelce/Mahomes conspiracy theorists...

In comment 16396818 mfjmfj said:

Quote:

is a mediocre QB. He might grow to be more, but there are a dozen QBs in the NFL I expect to see win that game for the Niners, and a dozen more from whom I would expect the same outcome. He is not special. He did enough to lose against the Lions, but for butterfingers by the Lions secondary. His team dominated in the first half of the SB, but ended up with 10 points, 7 on a trick play he was basically not involved in.

Purdy had the best quarterback rating in the league.
Link - ( New Window )

seriously they are the most loaded team...

They dont really have a glaring hole...

He wasn’t perfect but he did a lot of things right.

One thing to keep in mind is his timing, which is top notch. How often did you see a 49er receiver make a cut and the ball arrived instantly? I was counting the times Purdy delivered it. His release is also quick. (Jones is deficient in both areas, a major reason he isn’t a starting caliber QB.)

I think they will sign Purdy long term and won’t regret it.

In comment 16396822 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

The Chiefs defense looked physically defeated. The Niners were really gashing them in the running game. Last set of downs, CMC rips off a six yard gain on first down. Then Shanahan decides to run a play action bootleg that didn't work - Purdy was under immediate pressure and dumped it off for no gain. Then an incompletion on third down. It just seemed to me that, in that moment, you run until they stop it.

That 3rd and 4 at the 2 minute warning was their chance. But the Niners had other chances too. There were multiple times where I thought SF was going to take control and somehow the Chiefs got the stop.

Chad Pennington.

Good QB, smart, relies on timing and accuracy. Above average athlete, but not top shelf. Bit of a noodle arm. They can win with him and compete for championships IMO. He’s not a top shelf talent but he’s GOOD ENOUGH, something our guy isn’t. I think he left a few plays on the field, but frankly Mahomes did too. Niners lost due to mistakes - McCaffrey fumble, and punt return turnover. They were the better team for most of the contest.

They fumbled 4 times in a pretty short span of time and recovered 3 of them, 1 of them very improbably. Then there was the deflected punt TO - very bad luck for the 9ers.

He's capable, smart, instinctive, but he played a role in not winning the game when it was there to be had. He's probably 6 foot with an average arm, and you saw last night how it can play into a huge game, surrounded by huge men. I'm pretty sure Purdy can't see where he's throwing a good chunk of the time, and he's throwing to a spot where windows close fast.

In comment 16396733 JonC said:

Quote:

when they had opportunities, eg the CMC fumble, Purdy missing open receivers for TD, Kyle missed a few playcalls, where the fook was Kittle, etc. This is where teams need to know or learn how to finish a SB win. The muffed punt was a monster, it completely got KC re-engaged in the war for the remainder of the game.

agree, Jon. Went away from CMC too soon and went away from the quick slants/crossing patterns and outs too soon, which is where Purdy is solid. Shanahan went to the slower to develop patterns--did they hit one?-- and it took away all SF's rhythm.

ST muff, was a rookie, he had no clue what was going on in coverage, where the ball was.

In comment 16396740 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

In comment 16396736 logman said: Quote: SF probably wins The Lions made the same mistake against SF in the championship game.

Which makes it even worse! They only got by DET because tough guy Campbell didn't tell Johnson to keep running the fucking ball. Can you imagine Parcells allowing that to happen?

Shanahan has a track record of this, did the same as OC with the Falcons and let the Pats back in the game.

3 and outs, while only handing the ball to CMC once out of the nine plays was malpractice. He was grinding away tough yards on the D, and you could have kept controlling the ball. Really thought that was a poor way to come out.

In comment 16396725 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Juxtapose that with some on BBI saying that Shanahan always thinking 3-4 steps ahead is smart.

It's funny when people who aren't smart try to make statements about what is and isn't smart.

I bet their message board has idiots just like this one does. You should check it out and report back to us. Let us know if they're like you.

In comment 16396739 eric2425ny said:

Quote:

that would have been a much different outcome.

Huh? How so?

Wilks and his unit were pretty much excellent all night, didn't get a lot of help from the offense, and just got beaten by an all time great at the end.

Mahomes would have done the same thing to any other DC, including Ryans.

He clearly has a great feel for the pocket, and avoided some sacks by moving laterally in the pocket, or stepping up as necessary. As others have said, at this point in time his arm strength probably lacks the elite downfield ability. Maybe he can improve upon that going forward.

Right now, he is on a cheap deal, so the 49ers have just about as much flexibility a team can have. They're qb situation is light years better than the Giants.

I wish we had their "issues".

At the end of the day, it was close and they lost to one of the greatest qb/coach combos of all time in OT.

NO team plays a perfect game. This is just the postmortem to channel the negative energy.

In comment 16396857 ManningLobsItBurressAlone said:

Quote:

3 and outs, while only handing the ball to CMC once out of the nine plays was malpractice. He was grinding away tough yards on the D, and you could have kept controlling the ball. Really thought that was a poor way to come out.

SPOT ON!

for beating a team with an elite QB and elite coaching can be very small. San Fran was clearly outplaying KC early on but the score was closer than the play on the field. I kept feeling this was not a good sign for SF chances. Once KC got some momentum, which was only a matter of time, they weren't going to give it back. Plus, that team (KC) has such confidence in winning by now, it was nearly a given they were going to win it if was close late, which is exactly what happened.

In comment 16396868 UberAlias said:

Quote:

for beating a team with an elite QB and elite coaching can be very small. San Fran was clearly outplaying KC early on but the score was closer than the play on the field. I kept feeling this was not a good sign for SF chances. Once KC got some momentum, which was only a matter of time, they weren't going to give it back. Plus, that team (KC) has such confidence in winning by now, it was nearly a given they were going to win it if was close late, which is exactly what happened.

another great point. leaving points on the field always comes back to haunt you.

But to me the two biggest factors was the special teams muff where it hit one of the blockers' leg and KC recovered, leading to the MVS score. It was an enormous momentum shift in the game. It's also completely fluke-y and unlucky. You can't blame it on the blocker...he's trying to block and he's not expected to see that ball. Maybe a communication thing, where the returner has to have an alert word he has to yell in that situation? Not sure. Just really unlucky for the 49ers there.

But also, an otherwise great game by Moody, he had that low extra-point kick that was blocked. To me, that was the 2nd biggest factor, allowing K.C. to only need a FG to take that game to OT. Perhaps they score a TD at the end of regulation and it wouldn't have mattered, but the play was still significant.

Sure, I agree with the criticism that Shanahan has to kick the ball away in OT rather than take it first. I thought that was a puzzling decision. And I wouldn't have criticized him for going for it rather than taking the 3, particularly in OT... but he left it on his defense against the greatest QB in the game. The bottom line is you kick it to Mahomes and take the 2nd possession knowing exactly what you need to win the game.

So for me, the first two situations aren't Shanahan's fault. I thought his team played very well. Purdy showed his classic poise on the biggest stage and seemed extremely prepared. The defense played very well all things considered, making multiple big stops throughout and holding the Chiefs down to under 20 points through 4 quarters.

I think it was two great teams that gave us a great game, both coaches deserve a ton of credit for how their teams performed, and for putting their teams in position to win a championship. I'm glad we got to watch a really fantastic game. And the only criticism I would give Shanny is the decision to take the ball first in OT.

KC stopped the Run cold, 49rs had to throw against a very good secondary -Spags knows D..

SF tried to run and couldnt get it going -3yrds a carry

KC special Teams was big strength all year, and was for the Supe

SF D played great, but the game plan all yr for KC - those watching knows - Keep game close and Let Ried and Mahomes figure out a way to get a winning score.. Great game.

Shannahan should have went on D in OT, but his D did look gassed.

The Oline - top 5 in the league
The WR - top 5 in the league
TE - Kittle - top 5 in the league
RB - McCaffrey & Mitchell - top 5 in the league

Shanahan is a superb play caller well.

Throw in that SF has a top 3 defense.

With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?"
No, it's not his game nor ability.
Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams.

decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did.

In comment 16396875 TheBlueprintNC said:

Quote:

KC stopped the Run cold, 49rs had to throw against a very good secondary -Spags knows D.. SF tried to run and couldnt get it going -3yrds a carry KC special Teams was big strength all year, and was for the Supe SF D played great, but the game plan all yr for KC - those watching knows - Keep game close and Let Ried and Mahomes figure out a way to get a winning score.. Great game. Shannahan should have went on D in OT, but his D did look gassed.

The 49ers ran all over the Chiefs in the first half. In the first two drives of the second half, the 49ers passed the ball six straight times, leading to two punts.

What I saw was a team that got away from the run.

You hold KC to 19 points in regulation, you absolutely have to win the game. End of story.

In comment 16396832 blueblood said:

Quote:

seriously they are the most loaded team... They dont really have a glaring hole...

They are very talented. I think one area they could get better at is at CB. Not that they are bad, but if they had another really great corner to pair with Ward I think it would serve them well.

In comment 16396885 Eric from BBI said:

Quote:

In comment 16396875 TheBlueprintNC said: Quote: KC stopped the Run cold, 49rs had to throw against a very good secondary -Spags knows D.. SF tried to run and couldnt get it going -3yrds a carry KC special Teams was big strength all year, and was for the Supe SF D played great, but the game plan all yr for KC - those watching knows - Keep game close and Let Ried and Mahomes figure out a way to get a winning score.. Great game. Shannahan should have went on D in OT, but his D did look gassed. The 49ers ran all over the Chiefs in the first half. In the first two drives of the second half, the 49ers passed the ball six straight times, leading to two punts. What I saw was a team that got away from the run.

This^. Shanahan's play calling throughout the game was the problem. You have to beat Mahomes by limiting how many changes he has to beat you. SF did not do that.

to force the FG and give the ball back to Mahomes was the play of the game. They get 1st dwn 49rs win game with FG no time left.. Big play

In comment 16396879 Tom in NY said:

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The Oline - top 5 in the league With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?" No, it's not his game nor ability. Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams.

I understand that its where we are in society (to hate instead of appreciate)

And I understand that once someone on TV says something, then the masses seem to think the same thing.

But it was not one time in the superbowl where you thought to yourself "Brock Purdy is mid level" stop the cap man

Brock Purdy is good AF. He has all the goods. He almost outplayed the "2nd greatest QB OF ALL TIME"

He made a big play with his legs. 80% of his throws were dimes. He missed a couple plays but thats because Chris Jones caused some havoc.

And keep in mind, Purdy was going against some all pros!

answer this? from a football standpoint, what can Purdy NOT do?

In comment 16396884 SomeFan said:

Quote:

decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did.

What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring.

Is it still terrible decision to receive?

In comment 16396737 Breeze_94 said:

Quote:

But Chiefs had the much better QB and the championship DNA. There was ALOT less pressure on the Chiefs.

This sorta thing matters.....the championship DNA, less pressure.

So much of this stuff is psychological.

The crazy thing that you're underestimating though is that Chiefs defense, and you could say special teams as well. They won the game a little more than Mahomes did.

In crunch time it becomes very tough to beat certain QBs.

This might've been forgotten but they were saying the entire Chiefs offense and defense were frustrated in the first half.

Normally when I hear that happening, the team wins by a lot.

Insane shit.

or maybe a huge possible component of it, is

having a QB that is borderline good, and thus not looking to upgrade and/or not being in a position to do so.

Being cheap should not preclude looking for an upgrade. But he's good enough to help get them to the SB, so why should they? Then it's time to re-sign him, and he isn't going to be cheap, but hey, he got them to the SB, so it's a tough decision to jettison him.

There's worse hells to be in, but Purdy may get in the way of acquiring an upgrade.

On the flip side, he's only in his second year. His injury derailed their shot at the SB last year, and he played well enough this year to have a shot at winning it all. The arm strength and height aren't improving with age, but everything mental should improve with experience.

In comment 16396911 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive?

Well, we can assume anything. But if the score a TD, you are never going to punt so you give yourself an extra down to get a first down. It is putting your team in the best position to win. Your scenario doesn't really address the point.

In comment 16396917 SomeFan said:

Quote:

In comment 16396911 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive? Well, we can assume anything. But if the score a TD, you are never going to punt so you give yourself an extra down to get a first down. It is putting your team in the best position to win. Your scenario doesn't really address the point.

what point?

In comment 16396911 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive?

If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game. Why would you kick that advantage away?

In comment 16396725 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Juxtapose that with some on BBI saying that Shanahan always thinking 3-4 steps ahead is smart.

Fans mad after a SB loss and finding tons of things to blame it on is the only is as predictable as the sunrise. Glad that now means Shanahan is think 14 steps ahead to his own detriment.

Is to assume that highly drafted or touted players will take time to develop while lower drafted players are finished products.

I see this bias all over the place.

There’s no reason to think Purdy v 2026 won’t be a significantly better player than v 2023. He’s a green 2nd player from a minor football program that came close to bringing home a ring in his 27th pro start.

After Baltimore beat the Giants in 2001. Everyone was throwing Jim Fassel and the coaching staff under the bus, as well as Kerry Collins. When I look back at that game from a distance I can see that the Giants were simply outplayed by Baltimore, and the Ravens defence is one of the best the Giants ever faced in the SB.
Looking at that game last night, IMO both defences controlled the game. It could have been won by either team. It was a fine defensive game, and that's the type of game that I love. Spags is an awesome DC, and this was Steve Wilks 1st season as the 49ers DC. It makes me wonder what sort of job Jerome Henderson would have done if he was given the chance.

In comment 16396908 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396879 Tom in NY said: Quote: The Oline - top 5 in the league With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?" No, it's not his game nor ability. Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams. I understand that its where we are in society (to hate instead of appreciate) And I understand that once someone on TV says something, then the masses seem to think the same thing. But it was not one time in the superbowl where you thought to yourself "Brock Purdy is mid level" stop the cap man Brock Purdy is good AF. He has all the goods. He almost outplayed the "2nd greatest QB OF ALL TIME" He made a big play with his legs. 80% of his throws were dimes. He missed a couple plays but thats because Chris Jones caused some havoc. And keep in mind, Purdy was going against some all pros! answer this? from a football standpoint, what can Purdy NOT do?

IMO he cannot win in the playoffs on another team right now.

In comment 16396927 cosmicj said:

Quote:

Is to assume that highly drafted or touted players will take time to develop while lower drafted players are finished products. I see this bias all over the place. There’s no reason to think Purdy v 2026 won’t be a significantly better player than v 2023. He’s a green 2nd player from a minor football program that came close to bringing home a ring in his 27th pro start.

Sure but his limitations won’t improve in all likelihood - arm and athletic ability. So his ceiling is limited as a result. Can he get better at the rest? Sure, but it’s a big uphill battle with those limitations. He’s never going to be able to consistently pick up crucial 3rd downs with his legs, for example.

In comment 16396923 allstarjim said:

Quote:

If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game

this doesnt make sense (to me)

i'm receiving the ball with the intention of getting 7

I'm adding intense pressure to Pacheco (who's already fumbled once) and to that WR group that has come up small all season. I'm making sure I have Kelce locked up. Mahommes is Mahommes
_______________________________________________________

You kick it. Less pressure on the guys I mentioned above and now the intense pressure shifts to ....

Purdy - a second year QB
Deebo - who is playing on a bad hammy
Kittles - who is playing with a bad shoulder
CMC - who has already fumbled and is gassed
__________________________________________________________

From a mental perspective, I'd rather walk on the field with the mindset...

"guys, we're up 7, offense did its job, one stop and we're champs"

Mahones > Purdy

Can Purdy develop into a nice QB? Sure....but I see a lot of Kirk Cousins in his game....

Take away some of those weapons and he is Mac Jones.

2 things can be true here:

(1) Purdy is a huge asset to a playoff caliber team that affords them the luxury to use the cap on rest of the roster

(2) Purdy is not a franchise QB capable of leading a playoff team when his salary counts $40M+ of the cap

Criteria (2) is VERY hard. We've seen a number of teams put high quality teams on the field when they don't have the pay their QB. Being a high caliber team WHILE paying your QB a high salary requires a different level of QB.

In comment 16396923 allstarjim said:

Quote:

In comment 16396911 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive? If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game. Why would you kick that advantage away?

Because it's an even bigger advantage (by a wide margin) to possess the ball first in sudden death, and knowing what you need to do is only valuable if your opponent leaves any available points for you to surpass his score. If you take the ball first and hang eight on your opponent, they're left playing for a tie scenario followed by you getting the ball back again for sudden death.

Taking the ball is the right decision. That does not mean that it leads to the winning outcome, because you still have to beat your opponent on the field.

In comment 16396930 SirLoinOfBeef said:

Quote:

IMO he cannot win in the playoffs on another team right now.

Why tho? Spell it out for me?

Purdy can't win with another team because?

Cause he isn't accurate? wrong
Cause he doesn't have pocket presence? wrong
Cause he has bad mechanics? wrong
Cause he can't throw the deep ball? wrong

Again, just tell me what he can't do please. thats all i'm asking. cause maybe i'm missing something

I mean, no QB is really winning a superbowl without a talented roster, lets be honest

look at the last 10-15 superbowl winners. all rosters were very good

In comment 16396940 Gatorade Dunk said:

Quote:

If you take the ball first and hang eight on your opponent, they're left playing for a tie scenario followed by you getting the ball back again for sudden death.

say this louder! cause noone ever mentions this!!!

(it would take guts) but if you receive 1st, score and get 2...your winning % has to be in the 90s at that point

cause now your opponent has to get a TD, a 2 point conversion, and then stop you from getting in fg range!

Their QB is a back up.
Their offense didn’t have the same energy level in the second half. They looked gassed.
Defense couldn’t stop Mahomes and Co. like they did in first half.

That’s all I have.

In comment 16396936 GiantBlue said:

Quote:

Mahones > Purdy Can Purdy develop into a nice QB? Sure....but I see a lot of Kirk Cousins in his game.... Take away some of those weapons and he is Mac Jones.

Posts like this leave me speechless. There’s a segment of posters who literally don’t know what they’re talking about.

In comment 16396908 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396879 Tom in NY said: Quote: The Oline - top 5 in the league With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?" No, it's not his game nor ability. Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams. I understand that its where we are in society (to hate instead of appreciate) And I understand that once someone on TV says something, then the masses seem to think the same thing. But it was not one time in the superbowl where you thought to yourself "Brock Purdy is mid level" stop the cap man Brock Purdy is good AF. He has all the goods. He almost outplayed the "2nd greatest QB OF ALL TIME" He made a big play with his legs. 80% of his throws were dimes. He missed a couple plays but thats because Chris Jones caused some havoc. And keep in mind, Purdy was going against some all pros! answer this? from a football standpoint, what can Purdy NOT do?

At not point in my post did I "hate rather than appreciate."
My point, giving SF and Purdy full credit for getting to the SB, is that eventually the mid-level QB is going to be force d to make high level plays that they are not capable of.
When did I come to this conclusion about Purdy?
I watched him since his freshman year at Iowa State. He was a good college QB, playing on solid teams at ISU but consistently demonstrated a mediocre to solid arm throughout his career.
You say that he "almost outplayed Mahomes." He never did that in the game, nor should be asked to (Mahomes is the Generational QB and a clear 1st ballot HOF). He operated the offense efficiently, getting to ball out to wide open receivers on short routes that allowed the receivers to run.
It's a great offense, but on a 3rd down with 2 minutes to go KC turned up the pressure and Purdy couldn't deliver.
As you point out, he's only in his 2nd season so perhaps he'll continue to get better. The question is, will the SF surrounding cast always be as good as what he had on the field yesterday?

Oh also, I wouldn't know what the TV announcers have to say about any of this. I never have my TV volume on as they tend to annoy me....and I rarely if ever watch pre-game shows/ESPN BS.

In comment 16396933 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

In comment 16396927 cosmicj said: Quote: Is to assume that highly drafted or touted players will take time to develop while lower drafted players are finished products. I see this bias all over the place. There’s no reason to think Purdy v 2026 won’t be a significantly better player than v 2023. He’s a green 2nd player from a minor football program that came close to bringing home a ring in his 27th pro start. Sure but his limitations won’t improve in all likelihood - arm and athletic ability. So his ceiling is limited as a result. Can he get better at the rest? Sure, but it’s a big uphill battle with those limitations. He’s never going to be able to consistently pick up crucial 3rd downs with his legs, for example.

UConn - that’s an effective response. You would expect the more athletic players to have more growth potential. So is a bias that has some basis in reality but is taken entirely too far. Let me put it that way.

Purdy is reasonably fast, btw. He ran a 4.8 at the combine.

But he has enough talent to be a top ten starter in the NFL with his strong supporting cast. And with his minimal impact to the cap for the next two years, the roster will only get better. He can absolutely lead SF to a championship. It is why SF is already the favorite to win Super Bowl 59, despite yesterday's outcome.

And this is because Purdy may not have been able to win this game in overtime against arguably the best player and emerging dynasty in NFL history, but he was by no means the reason they lost it. In fact, he outplayed Tua, Josh and Lamar against this defense in this year's postseason. If not for the two deadly turnovers, the blocked extra point and Shanahan's head scratching abandonment of the run in the third quarter yesterday, Purdy would be a champion today.

In comment 16396940 Gatorade Dunk said:

Quote:

In comment 16396923 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 16396911 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive? If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game. Why would you kick that advantage away? Because it's an even bigger advantage (by a wide margin) to possess the ball first in sudden death, and knowing what you need to do is only valuable if your opponent leaves any available points for you to surpass his score. If you take the ball first and hang eight on your opponent, they're left playing for a tie scenario followed by you getting the ball back again for sudden death. Taking the ball is the right decision. That does not mean that it leads to the winning outcome, because you still have to beat your opponent on the field.

It's not sudden death, though. If you stop KC, you have the ball with needing only a FG to win. If they score, the pressure is on them to decide (and execute a 2 point try) without knowing if SF is even going to score. I think Reid in that scenario would just kick the extra point. Then even if KC scores, you know you can decide to tie it or go for 2 for the win, and you're not considering a FG or punt in that scenario.

It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball (and you will get the ball regardless of what KC does). The pressure argument doesn't hold water for me. It's OT in the Super Bowl, there's already tremendous pressure no matter decision is made. They put themselves in a 4th down decision to kick a FG, which allowed KC to win the game with 6. Didn't need to do that.

Unless it's 4th and 7 or longer, I'm probably going for it if I'm deep in KC territory with the ball first. But if they had kicked, and KC scores, you know what you need. I don't see receiving the ball first is an advantage at all.

This was discussed in postgame and on SportsCenter at length, every analyst/commentator said that kicking it first would have been the better play.

In comment 16396960 cosmicj said:

Quote:

In comment 16396933 UConn4523 said: Quote: In comment 16396927 cosmicj said: Quote: Is to assume that highly drafted or touted players will take time to develop while lower drafted players are finished products. I see this bias all over the place. There’s no reason to think Purdy v 2026 won’t be a significantly better player than v 2023. He’s a green 2nd player from a minor football program that came close to bringing home a ring in his 27th pro start. Sure but his limitations won’t improve in all likelihood - arm and athletic ability. So his ceiling is limited as a result. Can he get better at the rest? Sure, but it’s a big uphill battle with those limitations. He’s never going to be able to consistently pick up crucial 3rd downs with his legs, for example. UConn - that’s an effective response. You would expect the more athletic players to have more growth potential. So is a bias that has some basis in reality but is taken entirely too far. Let me put it that way. Purdy is reasonably fast, btw. He ran a 4.8 at the combine.

Purdy made big plays with his legs both last night and in the NFCCG. He's a good decision maker/processor, and accurate. I agree the supporting cast matters big with him, but he's a good QB.

In comment 16396927 cosmicj said:

Quote:

Is to assume that highly drafted or touted players will take time to develop while lower drafted players are finished products. I see this bias all over the place. There’s no reason to think Purdy v 2026 won’t be a significantly better player than v 2023. He’s a green 2nd player from a minor football program that came close to bringing home a ring in his 27th pro start.

This is a fair point, and one that I am certain I am guilty of from time to time.
Purdy, at times, shows some of the traits that made Montana so difficult to play agains. JM was the perfect rhythm passer for Walsh's offense, but was also a good scrambler and had great feel for the game.
My issue with Purdy is that I have never seen him throw an out pattern with true pro level velocity (in college or NFL), nor have I seen him throw it deeper than 20 yards with any high level NFL velocity. I have seen him be efficient, intelligent, and able to hit short routes that are wide open with regularity.
He's 2 years into his career, so I think we can all agree he has been superb given the expectations of his low draft status. Let's see how he does when his team is not stacked to the gills at all levels.

In comment 16396950 Giant John said:

Quote:

Their QB is a back up. Their offense didn’t have the same energy level in the second half. They looked gassed. Defense couldn’t stop Mahomes and Co. like they did in first half. That’s all I have.

Purdy's a backup now?

I feel like we're at the portion of the program where every quarterback in the NFL sucks, except Patrick Mahomes. This happens every year around this time, with the exception of the years a different guy wins the Super Bowl. Then everyone except that guy and Patrick Mahomes suck.

In comment 16396966 allstarjim said:

Quote:

In comment 16396940 Gatorade Dunk said: Quote: In comment 16396923 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 16396911 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive? If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game. Why would you kick that advantage away? Because it's an even bigger advantage (by a wide margin) to possess the ball first in sudden death, and knowing what you need to do is only valuable if your opponent leaves any available points for you to surpass his score. If you take the ball first and hang eight on your opponent, they're left playing for a tie scenario followed by you getting the ball back again for sudden death. Taking the ball is the right decision. That does not mean that it leads to the winning outcome, because you still have to beat your opponent on the field. It's not sudden death, though. If you stop KC, you have the ball with needing only a FG to win. If they score, the pressure is on them to decide (and execute a 2 point try) without knowing if SF is even going to score. I think Reid in that scenario would just kick the extra point. Then even if KC scores, you know you can decide to tie it or go for 2 for the win, and you're not considering a FG or punt in that scenario. It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball (and you will get the ball regardless of what KC does). The pressure argument doesn't hold water for me. It's OT in the Super Bowl, there's already tremendous pressure no matter decision is made. They put themselves in a 4th down decision to kick a FG, which allowed KC to win the game with 6. Didn't need to do that. Unless it's 4th and 7 or longer, I'm probably going for it if I'm deep in KC territory with the ball first. But if they had kicked, and KC scores, you know what you need. I don't see receiving the ball first is an advantage at all. This was discussed in postgame and on SportsCenter at length, every analyst/commentator said that kicking it first would have been the better play.

The third possession is absolutely sudden death. That's the bigger advantage, and you only get to be the first to possess the ball in that scenario by being the first to possess the ball in the original scenario.

I haven't run all the implied probabilities, but I do expect that the output would likely suggest that the options are actually pretty close to even, but that taking the ball first is slightly favorable.

And you don't need to quote ESPN's on-air personalities to make your point. I already think your point of view is more intelligent than theirs to begin with, and nothing they say would change my view (whereas I'm open to having my mind changed by someone like yourself whose intelligence I respect).

In comment 16396957 Tom in NY said:

Quote:

He operated the offense efficiently, getting to ball out to wide open receivers on short routes that allowed the receivers to run. It's a great offense, but on a 3rd down with 2 minutes to go KC turned up the pressure and Purdy couldn't deliver. As you point out, he's only in his 2nd season so perhaps he'll continue to get better.

"getting to ball out to wide open receivers on short routes"

you CLEARLY didnt watch the superbowl bro, clearly

and nobody is gonna deliver when you have Chris Jones comin at you unblocked

scroll thru some of these "dink n dunks"
purdy - ( New Window )

In comment 16396982 Gatorade Dunk said:

Quote:

In comment 16396966 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 16396940 Gatorade Dunk said: Quote: In comment 16396923 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 16396911 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396884 SomeFan said: Quote: decision to ever take the ball in OT in the Super Bowl. If you take defense, you stop them, then you only need a FG. If they score, you give yourself 4 downs and never consider punting. Just seems dumb what he did. What if you take the ball, score a TD and stop the other team from scoring. Is it still terrible decision to receive? If you can stop them 2nd, you can stop them first. It's an advantage to know what you need to win the game. Why would you kick that advantage away? Because it's an even bigger advantage (by a wide margin) to possess the ball first in sudden death, and knowing what you need to do is only valuable if your opponent leaves any available points for you to surpass his score. If you take the ball first and hang eight on your opponent, they're left playing for a tie scenario followed by you getting the ball back again for sudden death. Taking the ball is the right decision. That does not mean that it leads to the winning outcome, because you still have to beat your opponent on the field. It's not sudden death, though. If you stop KC, you have the ball with needing only a FG to win. If they score, the pressure is on them to decide (and execute a 2 point try) without knowing if SF is even going to score. I think Reid in that scenario would just kick the extra point. Then even if KC scores, you know you can decide to tie it or go for 2 for the win, and you're not considering a FG or punt in that scenario. It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball (and you will get the ball regardless of what KC does). The pressure argument doesn't hold water for me. It's OT in the Super Bowl, there's already tremendous pressure no matter decision is made. They put themselves in a 4th down decision to kick a FG, which allowed KC to win the game with 6. Didn't need to do that. Unless it's 4th and 7 or longer, I'm probably going for it if I'm deep in KC territory with the ball first. But if they had kicked, and KC scores, you know what you need. I don't see receiving the ball first is an advantage at all. This was discussed in postgame and on SportsCenter at length, every analyst/commentator said that kicking it first would have been the better play. The third possession is absolutely sudden death. That's the bigger advantage, and you only get to be the first to possess the ball in that scenario by being the first to possess the ball in the original scenario. I haven't run all the implied probabilities, but I do expect that the output would likely suggest that the options are actually pretty close to even, but that taking the ball first is slightly favorable. And you don't need to quote ESPN's on-air personalities to make your point. I already think your point of view is more intelligent than theirs to begin with, and nothing they say would change my view (whereas I'm open to having my mind changed by someone like yourself whose intelligence I respect).

Appreciate it. I think you kick it so you don't worry about a third possession. The only way you have a third possession if I'm in Shanny's shoes is if KC scores a TD and converts a 2-point try, which again, I think Reid would bet on his defense to stop SF from scoring a TD or stopping the 2 point try, meaning he would probably kick the extra point. And if I'm wrong about Reid in that scenario, he still has to convert the 2-point try.

So if I play this out, and even if KC scores a TD and kicks the extra point, I'm using all 4-downs to get into the end zone, and I'm going for 2 to win or lose the game right there. There's not going to be a third possession if I'm Shanahan, in almost any scenario. The one caveat would be if I'm in FG range to tie and it's 4th and long. Or if I have a penalty on the 2 point try and it's backed up so that I need to convert a 12 yard 2-point try. But I'll take the odds that I will avoid those situations with my personnel.

KC used their advantage by having the ball second. They knew they needed 6 to win and played accordingly. If SF misses the FG, they can play it conservatively in FG range and take the 3 to win. But as played, with 4th and 4 from the KC 9, I think if you're Shanny with the ball first, and the proposition is kick a 3 and hope to stop Mahomes from a TD, or go for it, and even if you fail, you have the Chiefs backed up inside their own 10, I think he should play for the TD there, not take 3. Taking the 3 there was all because they took the ball first, and gave all the advantage to KC.

To me, all of that is avoided simply by taking the ball second.

In comment 16396966 allstarjim said:

Quote:

It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball

I still struggle with what this actually means!!

As if I don't already know what I need to do to win the game before OT starts

(1) i need to receive the ball
(2) i need to score a TD
(3) if i cant get a TD, i need to make a fg

then i kick it off

(1) i will need to make a stop on 4th down before they get in FG range
(2) if they get in FG range, i need to make a stop on 3rd down to force a fg
(3) i need to block this fg
(4) if i can't block it....

they kick off.....

(1) i need to get to their 38-40 yard line and i'm doing everything to get there!
(2) Moody needs to make a superbowl winning fg

THATS THE SCRIPT!

AND TO END THIS DUMB ASS ARGUMENT - LETS CHANGE THE SCENARIO

KC WINS THE TOSS - WHAT DO YOU THINK ANDY REID IS GONNA DO?????? KICK OFF??? LMAO, YEAR OK

In comment 16396808 OBJ_AllDay said:

Quote:

and their window is closing. Deebo is owed a fortune next year and has lost a step. Kittle is being paid a fortune and is now on the wrong side of 30 and is taking a beating being basically just a blocking TE on that roster. Greenlaw probably won't ever be the same player. They need to pay Ayuik. And they've played a ton of games over the last few seasons. They might have missed their chance. They've been to 7 NFC championship games since 2011 and have no rings to show for it. Brutal.

We should have such problems.

SF did not attack down the field. You can only throw so many swings and slants. In these games, your #3 or #4 wideout is often a difference maker, and yet, Shanahan didn't send Johnson or McCloud down the field. A DC like Spagnuolo will make you pay for that by squeezing the field so your short routes are harder to complete.

He has a great feel in the pocket and buys time easily, he also understands the game and makes good decisions. His arm is definitely good enough (not Allen but good) and he can run.

The loss wasn't on him, it was on the 49er mistakes. CMC fumble, miffed punt, and a blocked XP. Right there its 10 pts. I also do think Shanahan got away from the run too early, I wonder if they saw something on the 2nd half tape that KC was running and thought they couldn't run?

He has exceptional skill players around him. Samuel, Aiyuk and Jennings are better than what KC put out there at WR. CMC or Pacheco really

I think it is fair to criticize not figuring out how to use Kittle. When you have a great receiving back like CMC and a player like Kittle it can put extreme pressure on the D

Could he have thought his D was so gassed that he didn’t want to put them on the field first. You got beat by the best player in the game playing that like that late

Other amazing thing is that is was a very well officiated game

In comment 16396997 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396966 allstarjim said: Quote: It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball I still struggle with what this actually means!! As if I don't already know what I need to do to win the game before OT starts (1) i need to receive the ball (2) i need to score a TD (3) if i cant get a TD, i need to make a fg then i kick it off (1) i will need to make a stop on 4th down before they get in FG range (2) if they get in FG range, i need to make a stop on 3rd down to force a fg (3) i need to block this fg (4) if i can't block it.... they kick off..... (1) i need to get to their 38-40 yard line and i'm doing everything to get there! (2) Moody needs to make a superbowl winning fg THATS THE SCRIPT! AND TO END THIS DUMB ASS ARGUMENT - LETS CHANGE THE SCENARIO KC WINS THE TOSS - WHAT DO YOU THINK ANDY REID IS GONNA DO?????? KICK OFF??? LMAO, YEAR OK

Yes, is the answer to your question. In either scenario, you will need a stop of some kind, because both teams are going to get an opportunity to possess the ball. Only by taking the ball 2nd do you know exactly what you need to win the game. That is a strategic advantage, I'm not sure what you don't understand.

In comment 16396742 widmerseyebrow said:

Quote:

Certainly a much much different level of "quarterback hell." But when will the team around Purdy be better to put them over the edge over a team quarterbacked by an elite QB? Kittle, Samuels, Aiyuk, CMC and a strong offensive line, a great defense. If I'm objectively looking for a weak link, it's hard not to land on Purdy as efficient as he is. Take the Mahomes throw before the Chiefs fumbled it away the next play. That was not the most advantageous coverage to throw into but Mahomes has the arm and talent to make that throw and it was a huge play that should have led to points. I don't see Purdy making those types of plays.

What game were you watching? Chris Jones was in Purdy’s face all night long. He was having to throw much quicker than he wanted because of the pressure. When Spags went all in on blitzing, this put more pressure on the passing game. As you can see based on the one OT possession they had, they moved it to the 3-4 yard line, but thanks to the OL, Purdy had to throw the 3rd down pass much quicker than he liked. Not his fault. And of course, the play before that, KC stuffed the RB to keep them from getting the first down. Not Purdy’s fault.

Purdy was very good ….Mahomes was maybe slightly better or they were even, but he also had a great TE who gets open. Purdy didn’t have Kittle break loose one time. He was a no show. That didn’t help.

In comment 16396984 riceneggs said:

Quote:

In comment 16396957 Tom in NY said: Quote: He operated the offense efficiently, getting to ball out to wide open receivers on short routes that allowed the receivers to run. It's a great offense, but on a 3rd down with 2 minutes to go KC turned up the pressure and Purdy couldn't deliver. As you point out, he's only in his 2nd season so perhaps he'll continue to get better. "getting to ball out to wide open receivers on short routes" you CLEARLY didnt watch the superbowl bro, clearly and nobody is gonna deliver when you have Chris Jones comin at you unblocked scroll thru some of these "dink n dunks" purdy - ( New Window )

I always find it amusing when trying to chat with other members on hear respectfully, while disagreeing, when the other guy dumps a "bro" type comment to be anything other that respectful. No need to be condescending.
Also, it wasn't Chris Jones that came at him unblocked on that play, it was McDuffie, but please continue to share with me what I did or did not see.

Please enjoy all the championships you expect to see Purdy deliver to SF.

Easy to say "well sometimes it doesn't work out."

No. It was the Super Bowl. Much like Dan Campbell fans saying "well it was the right call you live with the result."

No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

We re probably talking a totally different ending with the 9ers winning

In comment 16397058 ryanmkeane said:

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Easy to say "well sometimes it doesn't work out." No. It was the Super Bowl. Much like Dan Campbell fans saying "well it was the right call you live with the result." No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

Eh, not so sure about that. Run twelve times in a row? Nah.

Very hard to do that these days, for any team.

Than how come the Niners didn't win? It was clear they were the better defense yesterday.

In comment 16396879 Tom in NY said:

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The Oline - top 5 in the league The WR - top 5 in the league TE - Kittle - top 5 in the league RB - McCaffrey & Mitchell - top 5 in the league Shanahan is a superb play caller well. Throw in that SF has a top 3 defense. With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?" No, it's not his game nor ability. Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams.

The one thing you got wrong here is OL....not top 5 in the league.

If it was, they'd be hoisting the Lombardi yesterday, guaranteed.

More like the mid to upper teens. Run blocking maybe better than pass blocking, but not by a ton....especially considering it's a zone blocking scheme.

The Eagles, Lions....those teams have a top 5 OL.

Purdy's a top 5 QB before that's a top 5 OL.

Easily.

In comment 16397026 allstarjim said:

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In comment 16396997 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396966 allstarjim said: Quote: It's a clear advantage to kick it away and know what you need to win when you get the ball I still struggle with what this actually means!! As if I don't already know what I need to do to win the game before OT starts (1) i need to receive the ball (2) i need to score a TD (3) if i cant get a TD, i need to make a fg then i kick it off (1) i will need to make a stop on 4th down before they get in FG range (2) if they get in FG range, i need to make a stop on 3rd down to force a fg (3) i need to block this fg (4) if i can't block it.... they kick off..... (1) i need to get to their 38-40 yard line and i'm doing everything to get there! (2) Moody needs to make a superbowl winning fg THATS THE SCRIPT! AND TO END THIS DUMB ASS ARGUMENT - LETS CHANGE THE SCENARIO KC WINS THE TOSS - WHAT DO YOU THINK ANDY REID IS GONNA DO?????? KICK OFF??? LMAO, YEAR OK Yes, is the answer to your question. In either scenario, you will need a stop of some kind, because both teams are going to get an opportunity to possess the ball. Only by taking the ball 2nd do you know exactly what you need to win the game. That is a strategic advantage, I'm not sure what you don't understand.

This 24/7/365

In comment 16397058 ryanmkeane said:

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Easy to say "well sometimes it doesn't work out." No. It was the Super Bowl. Much like Dan Campbell fans saying "well it was the right call you live with the result." No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

Have you watched the Chiefs?

For starters their run defense is very good, running it 12 times in a row wouldn’t work out.

Every team that sacrifices trying to score for keeping the Chiefs off the field more often than not ends up losing.

In comment 16396941 riceneggs said:

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In comment 16396930 SirLoinOfBeef said: Quote: IMO he cannot win in the playoffs on another team right now. Why tho? Spell it out for me? Purdy can't win with another team because? Cause he isn't accurate? wrong Cause he doesn't have pocket presence? wrong Cause he has bad mechanics? wrong Cause he can't throw the deep ball? wrong Again, just tell me what he can't do please. thats all i'm asking. cause maybe i'm missing something I mean, no QB is really winning a superbowl without a talented roster, lets be honest look at the last 10-15 superbowl winners. all rosters were very good

I saw him him throw it deep last night. Too deep actually. Over the open receiver.

I'm not saying he won't be a good QB. I just don';t see him winning it all without an incredibly talented team around him.

Actually, trade QBs and Mahomes wins easily last night IMO. Purdy, nope.

In comment 16397058 ryanmkeane said:

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Easy to say "well sometimes it doesn't work out." No. It was the Super Bowl. Much like Dan Campbell fans saying "well it was the right call you live with the result." No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

You are just using cliches now. You, nor anyone else knows when a coach is going off feel or by analytics. And then you assume the Chiefs can’t win if they run CMC? You have an elite crystal ball.

The 49ers offensive line is/was not very good, and that was on clear display last night. CMC had a few impressive runs, but he also got obliterated in the backfield a few times as well. They averaged 3.5 YPC, it's not like they were gashing them.

On their final drive of the 4th, should they have run on 2&5? Probably. But the Chiefs D was living in the backfield.

In comment 16397058 ryanmkeane said:

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No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

I am a big Shanahan fan and would trade a high draft pick for him if he was available and we had an opening for HC.

But I think you are onto something with the bold. After Shanahan gets off script (let's call the first 25 of a game), he does seem to struggle with the feel for a game when it gets tight. By contrast, peers like Reid, McVay, Payton seem to find the right mix of plays in those moments and keep the defenses off balance.

Now, to be fair, maybe that's because he hasn't had that elite QB-type who are more reliable in big moments. Yet, when I heard Mahomes speak after the game, he was effusive how well Reid called those big drives when it was clutch time.

But just doesn’t have the arm talent. He is an above average game manager playing on a great team. Shanahan didn’t call a great game. They are the more talented team overall but KC has a big advantage at QB. Purdy is Foles 2.0 imo. High end backup low end starter.

Purdy isn’t the reason they lost, but he didn’t make the plays to win either.

Why take the ball 1st in OT??? You give the opponent automatic 4 downs every time if you score. That may have cost them the win right there

In comment 16397058 ryanmkeane said:

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Easy to say "well sometimes it doesn't work out." No. It was the Super Bowl. Much like Dan Campbell fans saying "well it was the right call you live with the result." No. There has to be some semblance of control of the game or feel for the moment. Shanahan play-called his way to death in this game. You run the ball with McCaffrey 12 times in a row in that 3rd quarter and the Chiefs probably end up going away quietly.

This is overly emotional jibber-jabber. You have moved on to he blew the game with the OT decision to he blew the game by not running 12 times in a row until the Chiefs go away quietly? Neither of those things was going to happen.

Sometimes the losing team didn’t lose because of a big bad man who ruined it for them. Sometimes they get beat by a better team. Stop looking for fall guys where none exist.

In comment 16397166 Rudy5757 said:

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But just doesn’t have the arm talent. He is an above average game manager playing on a great team. Shanahan didn’t call a great game. They are the more talented team overall but KC has a big advantage at QB. Purdy is Foles 2.0 imo. High end backup low end starter. Purdy isn’t the reason they lost, but he didn’t make the plays to win either. Why take the ball 1st in OT??? You give the opponent automatic 4 downs every time if you score. That may have cost them the win right there

Pretty solid post.

I was wondering if in the back of Shanahan's mind, he may have been concerned his D was gassed having just been on the field for that stressful last drive of regulation by KC. So, perhaps that went into his calculation...?

In comment 16397166 Rudy5757 said:

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Why take the ball 1st in OT??? You give the opponent automatic 4 downs every time if you score. That may have cost them the win right there

The first team gets four downs also. All of the aggressiveness that people seem to think only comes by virtue of circumstance is available to both teams.

Taking the ball first is the correct move. Kicking a field goal on the opening possession, particularly against Mahomes (and Butker), is not. You have to be prepared to trade TDs. That doesn't change by kicking off, because even if you hold KC to a FG (after kicking), you're going to give the ball back to them in sudden death if you settle for a FG yourself. The only way your FG wins is with a stop/turnover (and that also applies regardless of whether you take the ball first or second).

So you need to score a TD on your only guaranteed overtime possession either way, and only one of the two choices gives you the first crack at possessing the ball if/when the format shifts to sudden death. It's high stakes, but that's the nature of overtime - there is not a scenario that isn't high leverage there.

...who's gone to TWO NFC championship games and ONE Super Bowl in his two years in the league while the Giants continue slogging into year 6 with a mediocre Daniel Jones on scholarship is simply hilarious.

Thought an underrated key to the Chiefs victory was Mahomes legs. He was the team's leading rusher.

Also, agree that blitz at the end by Spags was the smart move. 49ers had many chances to put them away but came up short. Who cares?

Bummer!

They should have won the game in regulation... period. The majority of the mistakes were made before the end of the 4th QTR.

In overtime, both the offense and defense failed. They allowed KC to have their longest drive of the game to score the winning TD.

Of course, there is no comparison between the two but BP played fairly well against a great gameplan by Spags, whose players executed well.

Chiefs just made more plays when they needed to.

Giving Mahommes the ball first or second, you're really just picking your poison.

In comment 16396930 SirLoinOfBeef said:

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In comment 16396908 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396879 Tom in NY said: Quote: The Oline - top 5 in the league With all that said, at any point in the game last night were you thinking "Purdy's going to burn them deep here?" No, it's not his game nor ability. Maybe they can win a championship with Purdy (they have excelled in season and make it through the playoffs) but so far, small sample size, the model seems to come up short against elite teams. I understand that its where we are in society (to hate instead of appreciate) And I understand that once someone on TV says something, then the masses seem to think the same thing. But it was not one time in the superbowl where you thought to yourself "Brock Purdy is mid level" stop the cap man Brock Purdy is good AF. He has all the goods. He almost outplayed the "2nd greatest QB OF ALL TIME" He made a big play with his legs. 80% of his throws were dimes. He missed a couple plays but thats because Chris Jones caused some havoc. And keep in mind, Purdy was going against some all pros! answer this? from a football standpoint, what can Purdy NOT do? IMO he cannot win in the playoffs on another team right now.

He definitely can. How far one goes depends on the team. If you really think Garoppolo and Purdy cannot win playoff games without Shanahan, then one has to acknowledge that the guy is really damn good. Bill Belichick 1-1 record postseason without Brady (Browns), no postseason appearances in New England without Brady. Nobody else can do more with "less" as many people seem to view these guys. McVay made 2 Super Bowls with two #1 overall QBs for comparison.

Mahomes for all his greatness kinda had a 2013 Russell Wilson type SB run this year. Which is fine, but let's call it like it is.

In comment 16397107 SirLoinOfBeef said:

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In comment 16396941 riceneggs said: Quote: In comment 16396930 SirLoinOfBeef said: Quote: IMO he cannot win in the playoffs on another team right now. Why tho? Spell it out for me? Purdy can't win with another team because? Cause he isn't accurate? wrong Cause he doesn't have pocket presence? wrong Cause he has bad mechanics? wrong Cause he can't throw the deep ball? wrong Again, just tell me what he can't do please. thats all i'm asking. cause maybe i'm missing something I mean, no QB is really winning a superbowl without a talented roster, lets be honest look at the last 10-15 superbowl winners. all rosters were very good I saw him him throw it deep last night. Too deep actually. Over the open receiver. I'm not saying he won't be a good QB. I just don';t see him winning it all without an incredibly talented team around him. Actually, trade QBs and Mahomes wins easily last night IMO. Purdy, nope.

Mahomes is unique. Very likely the only QB that could've won the game for the Chiefs the other night was him.

Purdy is already a very good QB, but unfortunately the margins for winning against KC in a big game are very tight. Not everyone can be amazing, but good luck finding someone out and out superior, very easily.

Spagnuolo and the KC coaching staff were very complimentary of him after the game, impressed at how he was able to read their zone coverages. One guy saw "some Brees in him".

Comparing QBs aren't very linear. If you came up with 15 traits for a QB and you ranked all 32 starters, you'd have results all over the place.

Purdy likely lacks the velocity to attack elite defenses in certain areas like skinny posts and arrow routes, but has great anticipation and ability to go through progressions when he has time and can improvise pretty well.

And again if you think that's all nonsense, then Kyle is the best HC of all time, taking backup QBs to overtime against the greatest ever.

and we are still talking about which QB to take at 6.

He has 6 all pros on offense alone. Outside Aiyuk - there were all all-pros before Purdy got there. It makes a masssive difference when a QB has all that talent surrounding him.

I mean look at the drop off from Hurts from last year to this year. When the eagles got banged up on the OL and WR - hurts went from a MVP candidate last year to a very average one at the end of this year.

Talent matters. Whether it’s the QB or surrounding cast.

In comment 16397933 JT039 said:

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and we are still talking about which QB to take at 6. He has 6 all pros on offense alone. Outside Aiyuk - there were all all-pros before Purdy got there. It makes a masssive difference when a QB has all that talent surrounding him. I mean look at the drop off from Hurts from last year to this year. When the eagles got banged up on the OL and WR - hurts went from a MVP candidate last year to a very average one at the end of this year. Talent matters. Whether it’s the QB or surrounding cast.

Eagles just beat up on bad teams last year.

I think their luck ran out and got way too many favorable calls this year. I don't think they were that good and it all caught up to them. Was nice watching them fall back down to earth against the 49ers and then after that the Cardinals and Giants and the Buccaneers just destroying them completely. I wasn't all too impressed by the 2022 Philadelphia Eagles.

In comment 16397933 JT039 said:

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and we are still talking about which QB to take at 6. He has 6 all pros on offense alone. Outside Aiyuk - there were all all-pros before Purdy got there. It makes a masssive difference when a QB has all that talent surrounding him. I mean look at the drop off from Hurts from last year to this year. When the eagles got banged up on the OL and WR - hurts went from a MVP candidate last year to a very average one at the end of this year. Talent matters. Whether it’s the QB or surrounding cast.

If Purdy was on the Giants this year, you're probably in the playoffs.

And you would have money to fund other positions.

I'm no fan of Jones but Brock Purdy isn't elevating the Giants to the playoffs lol he'd be murdered his first start behind this offensive line

F’n comical.

We don’t have one guy on offense that could start at their respective position in the 49ers.

What a total insult to the rest of the offense.