Just said that Victor Cruz is being offered $21 million Guaranteed but wants more. I was wondering if that had been stated before or mentioned. Never heard of an exact number that we were offering till now.
Before Nicks and Cruz, you have to go back to Homer Jones before you had a Giant WR that sniffed the Pro Bowl. 40 years of blah, and they finally get 2 WR's that are Pro Bowl caliber and you are ready to let one walk and plug the next guy in without skipping a beat?
If he does something with the Giants right now...it will be a below market deal. If he rolls the dice and waits...he risks injury or a bad season.
The Giants are best to offer Cruz a below market deal which allows them to sign Nicks next year if they want to. The Giants should not get tied in to HUGE dollars at one position. It hurts the rest of the team.
My guess is that Cruz will will accept the Giants offer as the risk of not doing so is just too great.
Because somehow there are guys who think that comparing Cruz negatively to the two best receivers in football strengthens their argument that he's greedy. Makes no sense, but there you go.
at the end of the day, Nicks is the one who makes it happen. Cruz
is a potent weapon, but he is a complimentary one. Nicks is the game changer. If a choice has to be made, it has to be Nicks.Cruz cannot be Nicks, he is not that kind of player. He can't step into that role as we all saw this year.
he plays for the Tender, he is leaving 5 million on the table this season. That would mean that he would have to feel that he could more than make up for that 5 million as a UFA next year in Guaranteed money. That will not happen. He will sign, he just has no insentive to sign until he HAS to which is April 19.
Maybe he completely agrees with the Guaranteed money but wants more in incentives or per year or more years etc. etc.. We have no idea what is holding this up. Everybody needs to be patient and let the process play itself out.
At this point, calling him greedy for trying to get what he can is pretty ignorant of the way this business works. And to everybody involved other than fans, it is a business first.
Who said anything about caring about the Pro Bowl?
misreading the market for WRs of his caliber and type. It's $5-7 million market. That Seattle was dumb enough to overpay Harvin for potential when all he has lead the league at is migraines is their problem. It doesn't change what the sane world sees.
is that Smith and Cruz are totally different Wrs. One moved the chains, and fell down after getting the 1st down. The other looks to make big plays and aims for the end zone, after the catch. Both made the pro bowl that were fan favorites. Obviously, Cruz being more of a fan favorite now.
If anything, that's the highlight of our system. The other negative elements are a pain in the ass, but this part is an asset of our system.
Cruz in the open market would fetch closer to $10M than $7M.
was a level below Nicks & Cruz. Great Giant, no doubt, but not a great WR, a very good one indeed. Plax was a FA, you want to go that rout to replace Cruz it's going to cost, just like Plax did
You are absolutely right. But prob teams like the Lions, Dolphins, Vikings, Browns, Jets etc. Teams that know how to win super bowls only break back for the QB. Teams looking to make a big splash think differently.
While I think the fade of the offensive line was responsible for the rough second half in 2008, our WR's were not very good during that time. Smith had numerous drops, Hixon disappeared, and Toomer began to look old. WR was a consensus first round choice in the 2009 draft for that reason.
The Giants have made Cruz a fair offer, but I understand and don't blame him for trying to get more money. Steve Smith in 2010 is a cautionary tale for him, but the second half of 2008 should worry the Giants.
He may not be a top 5 receiver, but Cruz will not be easily replaced.
It's the RFA year ($3M) plus 4 years at $8M per year. It protects him from injury this year (ask Steve Smith how fast that $21 Million in guaranteed money can disappear). If he thinks the Giants are going to blink, he hasn't been paying attention.
The people who are saying Cruz should give Steve Smith a call
To replace Cruz to win either. We had a fucking team that won 2 superbowls without any good wideouts. There are many ways to do things, 1 thing that will surely RUIN a team is to overpay a player, Cruz was offered what the Giants are willing to pay, if he chooses he can leave, we will win without him. Replacing cruz may be very difficult, but with the money we save on Cruz there is a lot of talent we can add. You never, bid against yourself, never, and the Giants will not do that this year either with cruz, nor should they.
This guy is one of the best at his position. There are about 4 truly elite WRs. Cruz is not there but he's in the next group. And he's a hell of a lot better than Wallace and Bowe.
It isn't about Eli or the NYG passing system either. He can get open on anybody and then make plays after the catch. His game will work on any team, any system, and any QB.
The guy has not been paid. He's looking to maximize the cash on this contract. How can you blame him? This contract may be all he gets. He worked his ass off and deserves a big deal.
If they are offering $21 mill guaranteed then they are probably pretty close. I'd bet on Cruz signing very soon with the Giants.
he is a fcking UFA. HE IS NOT WAKE THE FCK UP. so whining that he isnt getting offered enough money is just stupid. he is a RFA. he can play for 2mio this year and risk snapping his leg in half or he can lock in 7mio+ this year and 20+ guaranteed.
whatever he chooses... is fine by me, but as an RFA, he doesnt "deserve" a penny more. if he were a UFA its a totally different story.
its not our fault the seahawks dont pay their qb 20mio a year and have that luxury. the giants dont. and seatlle and SF are doing an arms race... and i think seattle was dumb for paying him that.
I want to keep cruz, and we will... but offering a guy money that you dont have just doesnt make sense. he has a lot to lose.
and Eli. So if Cruz wants to bounce. The hardest part is to find the right WR to be productive in the slot and at Z. That's actually one position I am not worried about.
I think the Harvin comp is what the Cruz team is looking at and using in negotiations. If they are I'd call it a smart move and not a greedy one.
Giants may have to bump it up (and they should) and keep Cruz. He gets a few more million guaranteed and the Giants get a top 5-12 WR in his PRIME for several more years.
Sure, but we're the ones who have to deal with the fallout.
It's not our fault Baltimore gave an above-average QB $20.1 million per year, 5 months after New Orleans gave a great QB $20 million. It's no one's fault but Baltimore's. But now every team has to deal with their franchise QB saying "that's the market, match it bitch".
He has handled this entire process with class. He was vastly underpaid last season and didn't say a peep.
This year, he is well within his rights to pursue opportunities in restricted free agency. There is a bid and ask. The rest is just negotiation. If anything the Giants have been the ones leaking info in this situation and we have no heard a word from the Cruz camp - further proof that this dude is all class.
Labeling him "greedy" is just ridiculous.
For my part, I do think the Giants offer feels about right for the market and I think Victor will eventually come around to that understanding as well. But it is a complicated situation given the flat near term cap until the next TV deal.
is us having cruz this year and then being able to decide on cruz/nicks next year after seeing randle and JJ play for real... then im 100% ok with that. we get another year of cruz and everyone has to prove their worth.
Calvin Johnson... $60 million guaranteed
Why are these guys' names coming up in a discussion about Victor Cruz and his contract negotiations?
The Giants are best to offer Cruz a below market deal which allows them to sign Nicks next year if they want to. The Giants should not get tied in to HUGE dollars at one position. It hurts the rest of the team.
My guess is that Cruz will will accept the Giants offer as the risk of not doing so is just too great.
Maybe he completely agrees with the Guaranteed money but wants more in incentives or per year or more years etc. etc.. We have no idea what is holding this up. Everybody needs to be patient and let the process play itself out.
At this point, calling him greedy for trying to get what he can is pretty ignorant of the way this business works. And to everybody involved other than fans, it is a business first.
If anything, that's the highlight of our system. The other negative elements are a pain in the ass, but this part is an asset of our system.
The Giants have made Cruz a fair offer, but I understand and don't blame him for trying to get more money. Steve Smith in 2010 is a cautionary tale for him, but the second half of 2008 should worry the Giants.
He may not be a top 5 receiver, but Cruz will not be easily replaced.
Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see. Now back to #CruzDayTuesday
he posted a similar tweet a few weeks ago I seem to remember, what it means, only he knows the
This guy is one of the best at his position. There are about 4 truly elite WRs. Cruz is not there but he's in the next group. And he's a hell of a lot better than Wallace and Bowe.
It isn't about Eli or the NYG passing system either. He can get open on anybody and then make plays after the catch. His game will work on any team, any system, and any QB.
The guy has not been paid. He's looking to maximize the cash on this contract. How can you blame him? This contract may be all he gets. He worked his ass off and deserves a big deal.
If they are offering $21 mill guaranteed then they are probably pretty close. I'd bet on Cruz signing very soon with the Giants.
whatever he chooses... is fine by me, but as an RFA, he doesnt "deserve" a penny more. if he were a UFA its a totally different story.
isn'tt as big as it seems.
I want to keep cruz, and we will... but offering a guy money that you dont have just doesnt make sense. he has a lot to lose.
VC has been a model citizen representing his franchise very admirably..
He is a better than average slot guy, but not a number one that can carry a team.
Cruz cannot be a total fool after recent history has shown us in Smith and Tiki missing out on NY dollar by taking the wrong route.
I think the Harvin comp is what the Cruz team is looking at and using in negotiations. If they are I'd call it a smart move and not a greedy one.
Giants may have to bump it up (and they should) and keep Cruz. He gets a few more million guaranteed and the Giants get a top 5-12 WR in his PRIME for several more years.
It's not our fault Baltimore gave an above-average QB $20.1 million per year, 5 months after New Orleans gave a great QB $20 million. It's no one's fault but Baltimore's. But now every team has to deal with their franchise QB saying "that's the market, match it bitch".
This year, he is well within his rights to pursue opportunities in restricted free agency. There is a bid and ask. The rest is just negotiation. If anything the Giants have been the ones leaking info in this situation and we have no heard a word from the Cruz camp - further proof that this dude is all class.
Labeling him "greedy" is just ridiculous.
For my part, I do think the Giants offer feels about right for the market and I think Victor will eventually come around to that understanding as well. But it is a complicated situation given the flat near term cap until the next TV deal.
Some of you really need to watch his highlights from the past two years.
If we give in to an increased guarantee, then they'll give in to an additional year or two. Probably something along those lines