NFT: Knicks Chat: Go Bulls!

... maybe 5 years ago... but the C's are moving forward... he's the opposite of the direction they are going.

i know its milwaukee but if kidd and melo are still close i wonder if kidd could convince him to come?

parker and their first for melo? take on a bad contract?

In comment 13437002 Gmaniac1 said:

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... maybe 5 years ago... but the C's are moving forward... he's the opposite of the direction they are going.

how is he the opposite? you realize celtics are an older team right? especially if they resign thomas..

melo is exactly what they need right now and would have to give up a lot less then what they would have to give up for butler or George

that the Celtics go after Jimmy Butler.

They have lusted for him for quite some time and now Butler is lighting them up

In comment 13437009 ChicagoMarty said:

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that the Celtics go after Jimmy Butler. They have lusted for him for quite some time and now Butler is lighting them up

Of course it is. It's also much more likely the Bulls opt to hold onto Butler vs. Melo and that the price for Butler would be much, much higher. Chicago can ask for the Celtics top 3 pick (among other things). Melo obviously won't bring that back. It takes two to tango.

.

is exactly what they need, but how exactly is he what they need? He's a one-dimensional player who is older, doesn't make anyone around him better, 2 steps slower than he used to be when he was good and can't really score that well close to the basket anymore. He's a shooter now. The C's are loaded with premium draft picks and should be a team build off of that.

In comment 13437004 nygiants16 said:

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i know its milwaukee but if kidd and melo are still close i wonder if kidd could convince him to come? parker and their first for melo? take on a bad contract?

Aren't getting Parker and the 17th pick in the draft for Melo c'mon lol That's absurd.

and that we shouldn't expect much of a return for him. It's just laughable. If he was on any other team, he'd suddenly have a ton of value that teams would be killing to have. He's a great piece for a team that's close and needs an offensive threat. But he's on the Knicks, so he's a bum.

Melo definitely has his warts, but the worst decision he ever made from a pure basketball sense was coming to the Knicks and this clusterf*ck of an organization.

is taht the Cavs don't win it all and want Melo. Love doesn't really fit all that well and he's not adding much to what they are doing. If they lose, GM Lebron could push for Melo.

In comment 13437009 ChicagoMarty said:

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that the Celtics go after Jimmy Butler. They have lusted for him for quite some time and now Butler is lighting them up

Ok say here are the 2 offers..

1st this year and next year both bkn, crowder and brown for butler

or

celtics first this year and maybe next year and crowder for melo?

you get to keep both bkn picks to maybe even try and get george or add 2 more young pieces.

that's reality. Maybe if he opens up his list and teams start to bid against each other for his services.

In comment 13437017 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 13437004 nygiants16 said: Quote: i know its milwaukee but if kidd and melo are still close i wonder if kidd could convince him to come? parker and their first for melo? take on a bad contract? Aren't getting Parker and the 17th pick in the draft for Melo c'mon lol That's absurd.

parker already has 2 acl injuries, no guarantee he can get back to what he was starting to become..

In comment 13437021 Keith said:

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that's reality. Maybe if he opens up his list and teams start to bid against each other for his services.

This. The NTC kills a large portion of his value. He knows they want him gone and he can dictate where he goes. Our luck has the most realistic options (Cavs/LAC) having absolutely nothing to offer (unless as you said, Kevin Love is on the move).

would be willing to go. Do you think Melo believes that they can win a championship in Milwaukee if he goes there? I believe there are 2 scenarios in which Melo will agree to a trade.

1. A team is a legit contender(Cavs, Wiz maybe, GS, Houston?)
2. He gets to play with his buddies(Cavs, Bulls, Clippers)

In comment 13437021 Keith said:

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that's reality. Maybe if he opens up his list and teams start to bid against each other for his services.

If it's because of his NTC, then yes I agree that it kills his value. But that's not what people are typically saying about his value being low.

matter if Parker had 5 ACL injuries. He's 22 years old coming off a 20 and 6 and 3 season, 49% from the field, 37% from 3, 19.15 PER. The Bucks would laugh their asses off if the Knicks asked for Parker and the 17th pick for Melo.

In comment 13437006 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 13437002 Gmaniac1 said: Quote: ... maybe 5 years ago... but the C's are moving forward... he's the opposite of the direction they are going. how is he the opposite? you realize celtics are an older team right? especially if they resign thomas.. melo is exactly what they need right now and would have to give up a lot less then what they would have to give up for butler or George

My comment had less to do with age and more to do with the fact that Anthony doesn't fit into a Brad Stevens team based on defense and teamwork.

Anthony is the diametrical opposite of defense and team play.

And he's old, yes, I'm sure that factors in too.

In comment 13437027 DanMetroMan said:

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matter if Parker had 5 ACL injuries. He's 22 years old coming off a 20 and 6 and 3 season, 49% from the field, 37% from 3, 19.15 PER. The Bucks would laugh their asses off if the Knicks asked for Parker and the 17th pick for Melo.

ok how about just the 17th pick 😎

In comment 13437026 PhiPsi125 said:

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In comment 13437021 Keith said: Quote: that's reality. Maybe if he opens up his list and teams start to bid against each other for his services. If it's because of his NTC, then yes I agree that it kills his value. But that's not what people are typically saying about his value being low.

It's a combination of things. Obviously his NTC cuts his value significantly, but lets say he didn't have that. What do you believe his value would be? I don't think it would be much better. A mid to late first and maybe a young player? He's been the centerpiece of some disasterously bad teams. His warts have been on full display. His own team has mentioned that we can't win with him.

In comment 13437028 Gmaniac1 said:

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In comment 13437006 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13437002 Gmaniac1 said: Quote: ... maybe 5 years ago... but the C's are moving forward... he's the opposite of the direction they are going. how is he the opposite? you realize celtics are an older team right? especially if they resign thomas.. melo is exactly what they need right now and would have to give up a lot less then what they would have to give up for butler or George My comment had less to do with age and more to do with the fact that Anthony doesn't fit into a Brad Stevens team based on defense and teamwork. Anthony is the diametrical opposite of defense and team play. And he's old, yes, I'm sure that factors in too.

age should not factor in when your top 2 players are over 30..

its funny because according to the post stevens was for the melo trade and ainge was the one who hesitated..

the right price Melo would make sense for the Celtics. An additional scorer who can occasionally take over games. That said if I were them I'd only be offering a low ball offer for him. On paper they are actually a great fit as the price wouldn't impact their overall plan.

... if the Knicks were willing to accept next-to-nothing... or assorted garbage... then the C's might be interested.

Happy?

I still say his lack of D and team-offense-killing tendency to iso is a total non-fit with the Celtics... and I openly question if Melo would be satisfied with the role of 7th or 8th guy off the bench.

It would essentially be a 1 year tryout to see if it works. Unless other teams start bidding up the price, the C's have the pieces to make it work where they won't feel it.

In comment 13437045 Keith said:

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It would essentially be a 1 year tryout to see if it works. Unless other teams start bidding up the price, the C's have the pieces to make it work where they won't feel it.

Well my point is they have enough assets that at the right price it's a worthy gamble. They can both build through the draft/what they are doing and also add Melo. They have enough chips.

If they lose to a Gobert-less Jazz team in the first round they have to shake up their roster.

What about DeAndre for Melo? Makes the Clips more "west coast" with their wing scoring and DeAndre next to KP would be an unreal defensive frontcourt.

In comment 13437041 Gmaniac1 said:

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... if the Knicks were willing to accept next-to-nothing... or assorted garbage... then the C's might be interested. Happy? I still say his lack of D and team-offense-killing tendency to iso is a total non-fit with the Celtics... and I openly question if Melo would be satisfied with the role of 7th or 8th guy off the bench.

he wouldnt be a 7th or 8th guy iff the bench for boston thats ridiculous...

Ainge has never built through the draft guarantee he makes a trade for now in the off season, will it be melo? i dont know

In comment 13437021 Keith said:

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that's reality. Maybe if he opens up his list and teams start to bid against each other for his services.

I don't think he has a whole lot of value even without the NTC. His contract, diminished athleticism, and non-existent zeal for playing defense all knock his value down. I believe he could definitely be reinvigorated in a new place, but that doesn't mean I expect a valuable rotation piece or a high 1st round draft pick in return for him. I think the best we could do for him is a young player who hasn't quite developed or a pair of first round picks with heavy protections attached to them.

in his article today said the Celts were pro trading for Melo at the trade deadline, and one of the main reasons Ainge wasn't was due to giving up cap space this offseason.

But come July, Crowder, Smart, Celtics 2017 first for Melo could make a lot of sense.

In comment 13437048 elisha2014 said:

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If they lose to a Gobert-less Jazz team in the first round they have to shake up their roster. What about DeAndre for Melo? Makes the Clips more "west coast" with their wing scoring and DeAndre next to KP would be an unreal defensive frontcourt.

Doesn't do anything for the Knicks. They would be getting Jordan for one year and then be forced to give him a MONSTER max deal starting in his age 30 season while still paying Noah.

... on the C's roster.

He wouldn't knock Jae Crowder out at the 3. If the C's tried to wedge him into the 4 spot... their main problem of rebounding would go from bad to worse.

Furthermore: the C's are already developing a young wing with good potential in Jalen Brown. They've also got a top pick in the upcoming draft to develop (assuming they keep the pick)

Do they want to take those minutes and give them to an aging Melo? As a fan... I don't.

In comment 13437053 Jon in NYC said:

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But come July, Crowder, Smart, Celtics 2017 first for Melo could make a lot of sense.

You're smoking crack.

No way the C's give up even close to that haul for Melo. None.

in a 3 way where Jordan goes elsewhere, but why would the Clippers do that? How could Melo and Blake work and why would they rather Melo over Blake? Jordan fits with Blake and Paul.

and make no mistake... Jordan has surpassed Blake as their second best player.

what do you think you are going to have to offer to get butler or paul george

I can see Smart, fillers, their own 1st for Melo. I think Phils job will be to get multiple teams involved. I believe that a trade with Cleveland is the most likely with Love coming to the Knicks, if the Cavs do not win it all.

In comment 13437061 Gmaniac1 said:

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In comment 13437053 Jon in NYC said: Quote: But come July, Crowder, Smart, Celtics 2017 first for Melo could make a lot of sense. You're smoking crack. No way the C's give up even close to that haul for Melo. None.

You call that a haul? The fuck is wrong with you?

their team is built on old players that is no better than a 1st or 2nd round team..

is a league average SF at best and Smart is a severely limited offensive player who just flipped the bird to a fan at their home stadium.

You think that's a haul for an NBA all star?

Come the eff on.

He'd be a veteran culture-changer we desperately need. Throw in a first rounder and I'm good. The Celts have always been the most sensible trade partner.

2017 first. The "BKN pick" is swap right

Cavs get knocked out. They agree to trade Love for Melo.

1. Would you rather keep Love or flip him for pieces?
2. What do you think Phil would rather do?

In comment 13437018 PhiPsi125 said:

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and that we shouldn't expect much of a return for him. It's just laughable. If he was on any other team, he'd suddenly have a ton of value that teams would be killing to have. He's a great piece for a team that's close and needs an offensive threat. But he's on the Knicks, so he's a bum. Melo definitely has his warts, but the worst decision he ever made from a pure basketball sense was coming to the Knicks and this clusterf*ck of an organization.

+1. People continue to not understand that asking guys to play roles over their current ability sets them up to fail. But get guys in the correct role and they shine. Melo needs to be the #3 or lower player on a very good team (#2 scoring option).

In comment 13437081 Keith said:

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Cavs get knocked out. They agree to trade Love for Melo. 1. Would you rather keep Love or flip him for pieces? 2. What do you think Phil would rather do?

I would rather flip Love, and I think Phil would as well.

In comment 13437084 Deej said:

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+1. People continue to not understand that asking guys to play roles over their current ability sets them up to fail. But get guys in the correct role and they shine. Melo needs to be the #3 or lower player on a very good team (#2 scoring option).

But a team is going to be paying him like a number one player though. How does that help his trade value?

... the C's were very unwilling to give him up.

Y'all severely underrate him. He may not be an all-star, but he has the following positives:

- Good contract
- Team leader
- Tough defender
- ~40% 3 pt shooter

I wouldn't give him up straight up for Melo at this point in their respective careers. I venture to guess the majority of NBA execs feel the same way.

In comment 13437027 DanMetroMan said:

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matter if Parker had 5 ACL injuries. He's 22 years old coming off a 20 and 6 and 3 season, 49% from the field, 37% from 3, 19.15 PER. The Bucks would laugh their asses off if the Knicks asked for Parker and the 17th pick for Melo.

It doesn't make sense for Melo but I think Parker is best used as a ticket to rid themselves of their bad contracts and maybe get a starting center out of it. Just don't see how Parker fits with Brogdon, middleton, GF and Maker. He's going to get a max deal, I wouldn't want to touch that if I'm Milwaukee, but what if I'm Brooklyn or Orlando? Flip Parker, Henson, teletovic for Vucevic or Brook Lopez and you're into something.

In comment 13437080 giantsfan44ab said:

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2017 first. The "BKN pick" is swap right

you are right

In comment 13437062 Keith said:

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in a 3 way where Jordan goes elsewhere, but why would the Clippers do that? How could Melo and Blake work and why would they rather Melo over Blake? Jordan fits with Blake and Paul.

Actually, I think there has been a lot of analysis that Blake and Jordan dont fit well at all. Offensively, they're both guys who need to be near the basket.

Blake scares the shit out of me. Super athletic PFs tend to have very sharp falloffs. Once they cant jump out of the gym, they're cooked. They're not guys to bet on into their 30s. Putting aside whether Blake's injury history makes him any riskier than random players.

In comment 13437093 Gmaniac1 said:

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... the C's were very unwilling to give him up. Y'all severely underrate him. He may not be an all-star, but he has the following positives: - Good contract - Team leader - Tough defender - ~40% 3 pt shooter I wouldn't give him up straight up for Melo at this point in their respective careers. I venture to guess the majority of NBA execs feel the same way.

wait you think crowder is the rreason you didnt get butler or george? if that is the case ainge should be fired on the spot...

crowder is not the reason, ainge didnt want to give up the bkn picks, which i dont blame him