I read today a few times here about firing the HC and GM.
Sunday night was embarrassing. The OL was a crap show.
But the team was 11-5 with the rookie HC last year and the same O-Line. Let them get their work in.
With increasingly short prep time every summer for teams sometimes they may come out ultra rusty and disorganized for a week.
Dallas is a top team who is very well coached. They are probably going to be the best team we play all year.
Let's table the chicken little shtick for another 2 weeks or so please?
:-)
Not hitting the panic button yet, but it will be pretty close if our offense looks the same next Monday night.
One year....good in 2015. This year does not count yet. And we still went 11-5.
Anyone remember the Ravens in 2000. That offense was horrible, but they had a great D.
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Offense has been shit for two years!
One year....good in 2015. This year does not count yet. And we still went 11-5.
Anyone remember the Ravens in 2000. That offense was horrible, but they had a great D.
The 2000 Ravens defense was arguably the greatest defense of all time. They're in the same conversation as the 85 Bears and 2002 Bucs.
This defense is not that.
As far as the season goes, the first week usually has no relationship with week 4 much less week 16. They may have displayed issues that carried over from last year, but it is early. You also can't overlook Dallas holding on every play and getting some questionable calls. Wouldn't have changed the outcome...but makes things look worse.
As far as the coach goes, I agree that his game plans are questionable and that he should not be calling plays. The offense has been poor under him. But before we all try and hijack Coughlin back from Jacksonville let's remember some of the positives. First, the team has been much healthier overall despite OBJ and even if injury prevention is difficult to determine. Second, is that the coach has shown he is flexible in some ways. Everyone wanted more blocking from TEs and an actual fullback last year. Against Dallas they did that. Didn't help, but at least there is a change. Third, is that he is willing to change personnel and to trust younger players. I don't actually think Coughlin ever would move on from Jerry. I think Mac will.
As far as Jerry Reese goes, I agree that his inability to put a good line is an issue. Bromley instead of Gabe Jackson still kills me. Not trading down and taking another corner plus a lineman 2 years ago was also a mistake. But...you have to remember in the two years we chose a lineman something unprecedented happened at the top of the draft. The Collins issue and the Tunsil video both occurred in years when we were choosing lineman - in the week before the draft. We may have ended up with Scherff and Conklin. And perhaps we should have picked Tunsil anyway, I think someone ahead of us certainly would have and perhaps Tenn doesn't jump us.
I agree it looked terrible (if one could even look at all) but this isn't the season. Yes, it's the same set of issues we had last year, but there is time to change.
Not hitting the panic button yet, but it will be pretty close if our offense looks the same next Monday night.
Yes, this is what disturbs me a lot. We did nothing in preseason and don't kid yourself, week 3 is telling. So what did that game against the Jets tellus? Our OL sux, no runners, and so will our offense crap again this year.
...it's only preseason
...it's only the first game
So, when do the excuses stop and the improving happen?
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In comment 13595906 Tittle 9 20 64 said:
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Offense has been shit for two years!
One year....good in 2015. This year does not count yet. And we still went 11-5.
Anyone remember the Ravens in 2000. That offense was horrible, but they had a great D.
The 2000 Ravens defense was arguably the greatest defense of all time. They're in the same conversation as the 85 Bears and 2002 Bucs.
This defense is not that.
The Ravens offense also had Jonathan Ogden and Jamal Lewis so they could at least move the ball.
Since this HC took over the Giants have had the worst offense of the Manning era. It is definitely time to be concerned.
Also, the D carried this squad to 11 wins. It had a talent infusion and Spags can do what he does. Since McAdoo became HC and play caller the O has been a joke. Hope I am wrong, but it certainly is time to be concerned with this coach and if the O keeps on going this way on Monday, it will be full panic time.
I understand this is a sort of coping mechanism for many of you, but you aren't being realistic.
...it's only preseason
...it's only the first game
So, when do the excuses stop and the improving happen?
So true
and those who keep saying our defense will win us 11 games again this season I saw some reasons to be concerned in the Dallas game that score could have been a lot worse then 19 points and there were not to many 3 and outs
The coach is still talking about technique. Their first performance this year rendered them non-competitive.
That one unit all by itself can compromising an otherwise talented and impressive roster.
Given what you saw Sunday, how comfortable are you with that unit going into this Monday. This team suddenly, has the look of a team that might struggle to win 7 or 8 games let alone be a contender.
They can't run the ball, and often cannot protect the passer. They are not a difficult team to scheme against because of the O line deficiency..
Someone wrote the other day, summing up the optimism surrounding this team in the preseason,
"The Emperor has no clothes" It seems very appropriate.
However, he does have to take a hit for not addressing the OL, especially since he has ten million in cap space that could have been spent on an OL. I understand not overpaying but he misplayed the whole Hankins/OL thing.
...it's only preseason
...it's only the first game
So, when do the excuses stop and the improving happen?
You're generously forgetting all the excuses from last season. Remember how many people here were saying that McAdoo was intentionally holding back the offense because he knew the defense could win close games? This offense is holly fuck all bad. You think Belichick could only score 3 points with Sunday night's Giants team? Forget about the GOAT H/C, would Pep Hamilton be able to coax another 3 points from the likes of Eli, Marshall, Shep, Engram, Vereen, Perk, et al? Our offense has been among the worst in the NFL since last season. What we saw in Dallas was bad enough to hit the panic button.
Consider, you committed to a veteran QB whose strength has always been as drop back, down field gunslinger. His skills deteriorating somewhat, but still top ten. Asked him to learn and run an offense not well suited to his skill-set. No real mobility and has never had the accuracy/touch for short passing game. Square peg, round hole.
Run a predictable, limited and crummy offensive game plan poorly executed that doesn't recognize or compensate for the above. Lack of production (points scored) by offense over two years attests. Results are ultimate measurement.
These factors are exposed and compounded by an offensive line which is primarily staffed to pass block for immobile QB. It is only marginally capable in that area and putrid at run blocking. Lousy job of acquiring and training talent to fit system biggest contributor. GM big factor.
Resulting lack of run game allows opponents to stack their defenses to thwart McAdoo's dink/dunk offense. Constant pressure has made Eli into a visibly jittery, confidence shaken QB.
Moreover, our running backs are at best second level talent. Based on performance, Perkins is not a prime time running back. Others best suited as role players. None scare opponents at all.
It may get better, but Dallas defense not great, and they stoned us. Defense will help us win games, but offense must find a way to score 20 points on its own (not as set up by the D) or its a long season ahead.
If it goes south quickly, work in kids to find what you have and strive to upgrade offense in off-season to acceptable level, to take advantage of what Eli has left and the window that existing defense affords.
For every "Fire Reese! Fire Ben! Bench Eli" nut job, we have an opposing "Too early to tell. May need 5-7 years to really evaluate the line" nut job.
Intelligent fans are right to be concerned about this offense, and especially the offensive line which has been bad for an extended period with essentially the same players. They also realize we made the playoffs with this same line and offensive scheme last year.
It would be helpful if we stopped worrying about the outliers on both sides of the crazy continuum and tried to focus conversation on reality.
Let things settle in before we bring out the pitchforks
They haven't had a long period of ineptitude, either. They just won a Super Bowl. The Giants haven't scored 20 points in their last 7 games and haven't scored 30 in almost 2 years.
Well yeah. But for me it is not being a game out of first. It is a pattern going back to pre-season last year. The hope I had was to see that pattern broken...more beef n the TEs, a bit of a running game, a new big target receiver. Then when you see the same old thing, or worse, it does not feel like a one game thing.
Of course we are not out of the running, but when you look back, you kind of have to doubt that this team is going to suddenly start marching up and down the field.
Let things settle in before we bring out the pitchforks
The Patriots are not the Giants. They are perennial winners. They make the playoffs every season. They win Super Bowls. They have arguably the best head coach and QB in NFL history on the same team.
Stop it.