And it also explains why John Dorsey wants to stay away from Rosen. He certainly seems like a love him or hate him type of guy. And that's probably not going to change anytime soon if the Giants select him since half the board will probably hate the pick for various reasons, haha. Whether it's his health, preferring another player or maybe even having a new HC who they don't think will mesh with him.
That we know of exactly. The 2 already just means hes going to be prone to having more. On top of that he has a personality that probably won't mesh in a big city like NY.
so, Trent Dilfer, who knows him well and has supervised him, says he has a demanding personality like Peyton Manning, and that leads you to conclude, he is not like Peyton Manning but Ryan Leaf?
Dilfer says he's like Peyton, Brady and Rogers - guys who demand the best from themselves and everyone around them.
If he's the best pure QB in the draft, then he wil be able to walk the walk as well. Better to have a guy who wants to be the best and will rub some people the wrong way for it, then someone who doesn't care enough.
We need our QB of the future. We can't get it wrong. He seems like a "what-you-see-is what-you-get" kind of kid.
So do your due diligence, interview the shit out of him, and if he's a problem kid - decide if the 3rd best QB in the class is the answer.
From the GM to the coaches and his teammates, very similar to what guys like Brady and Rodgers demand in GB and New England. He was a spoiled brat at 17, pet Dilfer and made a complete 180 by this year. If I wasn’t already, I’m even more on board with drafting Rosen, if that’s possible.
Hopefully our front office and scouts have a good take on him and the other QB candidates. Seriously, because we read something, it doesn't mean we have an accurate picture of a person. Our info is not first hand info. In terms of QB arm, QB intelligence, Rosen is that and more and film shows that. The concussion issues can only be addressed by our medical staff. Of course, we also have to ask : Do we trust our medical staff? It's good that we have an experienced Gentlemen in charge who has made tough decisions in the past and has been willing to stand by them.
I'll admit that I didn't even know there was an embedded segment in the tweet. I had clicked on the OP's link 3 different times trying to follow along with what people were responding too. And each time I only saw the tweet. It was your response that made me click on the body of the tweet which launched the clip.
Remember that this is the guy who got invited to play a Trump golf course and wore a F*** TRUMP hat and didn't see the problem with it when given the chance to step back from it a bit. It has nothing to do with his politics either but in NY you can't be that guy. He will get baited every day and it will be miserable to follow the team. If you think this season has been a sideshow go ahead and put Rosen on Beckham on the same team and watch those interviews after a loss when the offense struggles.
In Cleveland or Green Bay the kid could thrive but it will go down as a horrible moment in NYG history if he gets drafted by them.
when our receivers drop catches and could be fireworks with Beckham and his ego. Right now this team needs very level headed guys that follow the process and handle their role.
Remember that this is the guy who got invited to play a Trump golf course and wore a F*** TRUMP hat and didn't see the problem with it when given the chance to step back from it a bit. It has nothing to do with his politics either but in NY you can't be that guy.
It's sad that the only reason there's any truth to this is because people insist on eating up the shit coverage that gets sold in this town.
Not sure if you meant this in a funny way, but that's probably true. And the same is true for Mantle based on what was written of his issues. Namath would've gotten destroyed for the guarantee, for the womanizing persona, etc. Mantle for his drinking.
The best QB.
The personality aside, the knees and concussions are scary.
No way he plays in '18 unless we get 2 good FAs and a day 1 draft pick, and they jell quickly.
At best 2019 w/ another FA and draft cycle.
Even playing out Elis current contract and he starts 2020 and he'll still be a little over 23.5 when the season starts, and they'll have another draft to finish putting a solid OL in front of him(though they likely would start ANY QB pick in '19).
I won't be upset if the Giants do take him. He is the most NFL ready QB in the draft and he has the second most impressive arm in the draft after Allen. With that said I don't believe the Giants will take him due to the concussion concerns.
RE: You can talk bad all you want about Namath, Eli or the Giants Â
the guy that dominated the game for well over a decade...
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
the guy that dominated the game for well over a decade...
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
He was The Mick...
I'm not talking about his baseball card. He can be all those things and also become a national story for having a drinking problem. Being a great athlete is no longer a shield. It was back then, it isn't now.
They're athletes, not role-models. Superstars with an ability Â
Of any of the QB's but I don't see how the Giants can risk the 2nd pick on a guy with his concussion history, or his knee and shoulder injuries.
The guy either missed or didn't finish 12 of his team's last 20 games. We're going to go from Iron Man Eli to that?
As Parcells said "the best ability is availability" and we need to use the pick on someone who will be consistently on the field. Not someone who has a history of not getting out there.
Go watch the Elite11 on youtube when Rosen was there. He created the most stir. Dilfer's staff couldn't figure the guy out. Some loved him, others couldn't stand the prick. But almost unanimously they thought he had a brilliant football mind...Despite all the backlash it created, Rosen still went back to help Dilfer in his camp. So that shows some maturity.
It's almost best that the Jints don't draft him because the NY media will go into overdrive to get under the guy's skin. It'll be target practice, and relentless.
I love his skill set, but there is a Sam Bradford element (injuries) and Cutler element (potentially prickly attitude) that could limit the ceiling.
This is why Darnold is the safer pick...
RE: They're athletes, not role-models. Superstars with an ability Â
the guy that dominated the game for well over a decade...
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
He has no real mobility now and he'll have even less when he is 30.
The NFL currently are not getting a lot of great pass protectors, but they are getting a lot of elite pass rushers. Nearly every team has at least one. Very difficult now to win in the NFL as a pure pocket QB because you don't get pure pockets.
You have to at least buy time with the legs. And I know everyone is going to talk about Brady and Matt Ryan and so on. But it makes no sense to me to automatically start with a guy with a pretty big limitation in that regard. I don't think you need a guy to run around like Russell Wilson, but you do need a guy that can move around and avoid pressure, buy some time and make plays. Darnold can do that, so can Allen and Mayfield. I do not believe Rosen can, and that isn't going to get better as he ages.
Didn't Aaron Rodgers have concussion issues and they designed him a fancy new helmet and he hasn't suffered them since "that we know of", I'm pretty sure the team that drafts Rosen could do the same.
He has no real mobility now and he'll have even less when he is 30.
This isn't true. Maybe not as much as Aaron Rodgers or a young Roethlisberger, but at least as much as Brady, Peyton, Eli, Ryan, and a very long list of successful NFL pocket passers who weren't a big threat to run. I would liken him to the early years of Joe Montana (when it comes to mobility), if you're old enough to remember those days.
Will get under Rosen's skin or "destroy" him is absurd.
Destroy him for what reason exactly? Because he's a smart guy that demands excellence from himself and others? Sounds like a New Yorker to me.
Get used to it guys. Unless Cleveland surprises everyone and picks him instead of Darnold, Rosen will be the Giants' pick. 100% Completion Rate - ( New Window )
The Browns have a need at QB, so it would stand to reason that the Giants have no shot at Rosen except for the fact that Rosen is making it known that he would rather not be selected #1 overall if it means going to Cleveland.
An added wrinkle is that the Browns GM, Dorsey, has been quoted as advising "stay away" from Rosen in an article that was published while Dorsey was between jobs. Whether those were his true feelings or just some gamesmanship, it gives Rosen a legitimate excuse to "boycott" them when it comes to invites for an interview, workout, etc., without being accused of being spoiled or entitled. It will be interesting to see how Dorsey handles questions about the quote (I've yet to hear his response to being "outed" but he is sure to be questioned about it until he comes clean).
But just because it might be problematic for the Browns to select Rosen, doesn't mean they won't do it or trade away the pick to another team that will. Two things have to happen for this not to be the case...
1) There needs to be another QB on the same level as Rosen. He doesn't have to be Rosen's equal, but he needs to be close enough that the Browns won't want to risk losing out on him with the #4 overall pick, and also close enough that the Browns won't know for sure who the Giants like best at QB. We don't want a repeat of what happened in 2004 when the Chargers were able to score a bundle in trade from the Giants and still came away with the QB they preferred (Rivers) all because Accorsi had shown his hand for all the world to see.
2) If there isn't another QB prospect on Rosen's level, then there needs to be a non-QB prospect (i.e, Barkley) who stands out above the other non-QB prospects. This would make the Browns less willing to trade out of the top spot with the Broncos or Jets because they would be risking the loss of that guy to Indy with the third overall pick. And this is again another reason for the Giants to keep their thoughts to themselves (QB? RB? DE? OL? Only Gettleman's hairdresser knows for sure!).
Barring those two things, I would expect the Browns to either select Rosen (and deal with the war of wills to follow) or trade the pick to a team willing to pay a high price for a QB that's head and shoulders above the rest. So I'll be rooting like hell for Darnold and Barkley to blow away the scouting community during the combine and pro days up ahead.
If its not Darnold draft Barkley and try to win.
That we know of exactly. The 2 already just means hes going to be prone to having more. On top of that he has a personality that probably won't mesh in a big city like NY.
S T A Y A W A Y!!!!!!!!
We already have players with personality problems where half the locker room hates him. We don't need another one. Especially in the NY market.
Darnold or Rosen or Barkley!
Top tier. Thank god Indy won.
If its not Darnold draft Barkley and try to win.
so, Trent Dilfer, who knows him well and has supervised him, says he has a demanding personality like Peyton Manning, and that leads you to conclude, he is not like Peyton Manning but Ryan Leaf?
If he's the best pure QB in the draft, then he wil be able to walk the walk as well. Better to have a guy who wants to be the best and will rub some people the wrong way for it, then someone who doesn't care enough.
We need our QB of the future. We can't get it wrong. He seems like a "what-you-see-is what-you-get" kind of kid.
So do your due diligence, interview the shit out of him, and if he's a problem kid - decide if the 3rd best QB in the class is the answer.
This post makes less than zero sense
BRING HIM ON. Love to have him.
The people who bitched about Eli's lack of fire and personality will love Rosen.
And if Cleveland takes him, grab Darnold.
Rosen is the high floor guy. Injury history is a big problem. Knees and concussions are the worst risk for a QB. Better to have broken some bones.
I'll admit that I didn't even know there was an embedded segment in the tweet. I had clicked on the OP's link 3 different times trying to follow along with what people were responding too. And each time I only saw the tweet. It was your response that made me click on the body of the tweet which launched the clip.
The media would destroy him.
Remember that this is the guy who got invited to play a Trump golf course and wore a F*** TRUMP hat and didn't see the problem with it when given the chance to step back from it a bit. It has nothing to do with his politics either but in NY you can't be that guy. He will get baited every day and it will be miserable to follow the team. If you think this season has been a sideshow go ahead and put Rosen on Beckham on the same team and watch those interviews after a loss when the offense struggles.
In Cleveland or Green Bay the kid could thrive but it will go down as a horrible moment in NYG history if he gets drafted by them.
The media would destroy him.
Remember that this is the guy who got invited to play a Trump golf course and wore a F*** TRUMP hat and didn't see the problem with it when given the chance to step back from it a bit. It has nothing to do with his politics either but in NY you can't be that guy.
It's sad that the only reason there's any truth to this is because people insist on eating up the shit coverage that gets sold in this town.
Not sure if you meant this in a funny way, but that's probably true. And the same is true for Mantle based on what was written of his issues. Namath would've gotten destroyed for the guarantee, for the womanizing persona, etc. Mantle for his drinking.
The personality aside, the knees and concussions are scary.
No way he plays in '18 unless we get 2 good FAs and a day 1 draft pick, and they jell quickly.
At best 2019 w/ another FA and draft cycle.
Even playing out Elis current contract and he starts 2020 and he'll still be a little over 23.5 when the season starts, and they'll have another draft to finish putting a solid OL in front of him(though they likely would start ANY QB pick in '19).
No one knows who is.
Rosen seems to be handling the media hate crucible just fine so far
With his background, though, you'd have to be concerned that he's one big hit away from potentially walking away.
I feel like it's been covered pretty well what his problems were. I don't think it's some kind of secret that he wouldn't get away with it today.
As opposed to the current bum, right?
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
He was The Mick...
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
He was The Mick...
I'm not talking about his baseball card. He can be all those things and also become a national story for having a drinking problem. Being a great athlete is no longer a shield. It was back then, it isn't now.
Role-models should be your Mom or Dad...
The guy either missed or didn't finish 12 of his team's last 20 games. We're going to go from Iron Man Eli to that?
As Parcells said "the best ability is availability" and we need to use the pick on someone who will be consistently on the field. Not someone who has a history of not getting out there.
It's almost best that the Jints don't draft him because the NY media will go into overdrive to get under the guy's skin. It'll be target practice, and relentless.
I love his skill set, but there is a Sam Bradford element (injuries) and Cutler element (potentially prickly attitude) that could limit the ceiling.
This is why Darnold is the safer pick...
Role-models should be your Mom or Dad...
I agree with you. I think it sucks that the "media" is even a part of the landscape here.
- won 7 World Series with the Yankees
- was an All-Star 16 of his 20 seasons
- 500+ home runs
- arguably the greatest offensive outfielder in MLB history
- and could steal a base and run down a deep ball with the best of them just to round out his game
He was The Mick...
And he don’t pay no Sonny Colegnero’s rent either
If its not Darnold draft Barkley and try to win.
If that's the case Rather trade down to 5 or 6 if possible. Get the remaining Barkley Fitzpatrick or Nelson.
I'm as nervous about concussions and his injury history as any off field stuff
He absolutely, positively, most certainly does NOT.
The NFL currently are not getting a lot of great pass protectors, but they are getting a lot of elite pass rushers. Nearly every team has at least one. Very difficult now to win in the NFL as a pure pocket QB because you don't get pure pockets.
You have to at least buy time with the legs. And I know everyone is going to talk about Brady and Matt Ryan and so on. But it makes no sense to me to automatically start with a guy with a pretty big limitation in that regard. I don't think you need a guy to run around like Russell Wilson, but you do need a guy that can move around and avoid pressure, buy some time and make plays. Darnold can do that, so can Allen and Mayfield. I do not believe Rosen can, and that isn't going to get better as he ages.
Didn't Aaron Rodgers have concussion issues and they designed him a fancy new helmet and he hasn't suffered them since "that we know of", I'm pretty sure the team that drafts Rosen could do the same.
Destroy him for what reason exactly? Because he's a smart guy that demands excellence from himself and others? Sounds like a New Yorker to me.
Get used to it guys. Unless Cleveland surprises everyone and picks him instead of Darnold, Rosen will be the Giants' pick.
100% Completion Rate - ( New Window )
An added wrinkle is that the Browns GM, Dorsey, has been quoted as advising "stay away" from Rosen in an article that was published while Dorsey was between jobs. Whether those were his true feelings or just some gamesmanship, it gives Rosen a legitimate excuse to "boycott" them when it comes to invites for an interview, workout, etc., without being accused of being spoiled or entitled. It will be interesting to see how Dorsey handles questions about the quote (I've yet to hear his response to being "outed" but he is sure to be questioned about it until he comes clean).
But just because it might be problematic for the Browns to select Rosen, doesn't mean they won't do it or trade away the pick to another team that will. Two things have to happen for this not to be the case...
1) There needs to be another QB on the same level as Rosen. He doesn't have to be Rosen's equal, but he needs to be close enough that the Browns won't want to risk losing out on him with the #4 overall pick, and also close enough that the Browns won't know for sure who the Giants like best at QB. We don't want a repeat of what happened in 2004 when the Chargers were able to score a bundle in trade from the Giants and still came away with the QB they preferred (Rivers) all because Accorsi had shown his hand for all the world to see.
2) If there isn't another QB prospect on Rosen's level, then there needs to be a non-QB prospect (i.e, Barkley) who stands out above the other non-QB prospects. This would make the Browns less willing to trade out of the top spot with the Broncos or Jets because they would be risking the loss of that guy to Indy with the third overall pick. And this is again another reason for the Giants to keep their thoughts to themselves (QB? RB? DE? OL? Only Gettleman's hairdresser knows for sure!).
Barring those two things, I would expect the Browns to either select Rosen (and deal with the war of wills to follow) or trade the pick to a team willing to pay a high price for a QB that's head and shoulders above the rest. So I'll be rooting like hell for Darnold and Barkley to blow away the scouting community during the combine and pro days up ahead.