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The Giants announced they have re-signed John Greco.

bumpsinthenight : 2/21/2018 11:52 am
per Patricia Trania Twitter
The Giants announced they have re-signed John Greco. - ( New Window )
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Flowers isn't even the weakest link on the OL now  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/21/2018 1:15 pm : link
If you can improve the rest of it, you can get by, I think. He wasn't the worst lineman on the team last season. Just identify what he can do best. It's probably not 'pass protection'.
Eric....  
Emlen'sGremlins : 2/21/2018 1:19 pm : link
....but didn't Greco perform at a high level in the Giants' Dirty Dancing Super Bowl commercial? Don't underestimate the importance of that!
RE: Flowers isn't even the weakest link on the OL now  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 1:20 pm : link
In comment 13838179 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
If you can improve the rest of it, you can get by, I think. He wasn't the worst lineman on the team last season. Just identify what he can do best. It's probably not 'pass protection'.


Much depends on how much we take Shurmur at his word.

Publicly, Shumur said team culture is exceptionally important and he won't tolerate football players who are not passionate about the game and HATE losing.

If you take him for his word, he is going to dump players who he thinks are not committed to the game.

Is Flowers one of those?

Objectively speaking, Flowers started off the season playing like crap, really settled down for the bulk of the middle of the season, and then began to fall apart late again.
RE: Eric....  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 1:20 pm : link
In comment 13838187 Emlen'sGremlins said:
Quote:
....but didn't Greco perform at a high level in the Giants' Dirty Dancing Super Bowl commercial? Don't underestimate the importance of that!


Arguably the high point of the 2017 season.
What does ĎFlemí think of this?  
est1986 : 2/21/2018 1:22 pm : link
Just kidding... the only way this is a good move is if it some how leads to the cutting of John Jerry... seriously.
.  
arcarsenal : 2/21/2018 1:24 pm : link
60+ comments on a John Greco thread?

Wowzas.
He's a veteran, backup, hog Mollie.  
old man : 2/21/2018 1:28 pm : link
Quite likely, just 1 of 90 for the moment, who can work with the young hogmollies on techniques and bringing them up to speed in the Shurmurs/ Hunter system.
That's the summary...oh, and likely moves John Jerry to Oakland with New house or Cindy and the best RT in the NFL to restore the best right side of an OL the NFL has ever seen ;-).
RE: .  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 1:40 pm : link
In comment 13838198 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
60+ comments on a John Greco thread?

Wowzas.


Well, we have a way to before we get into Bitcoin discussion numbers.
John Greco  
Big_Pete : 2/21/2018 1:49 pm : link
I think Greco is a solid depth guy and experienced veteran competition.

We should not overlook the fact that Hal Hunter coached Greco in 2016 so maybe he will help the transition to the new regime.

I also think Greco could be used to help mentor and provide leadership for our llargelt young. That could be particularly valuable should Pugh, Richburg and Fluker find greener pastures elsewhere.

I see the Greco as a cheap way of stabilising the Oli e depth ahead of free agency who at the very leasy will add value in training camp

RE: ...  
jvm52106 : 2/21/2018 1:52 pm : link
In comment 13838011 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Re-signing a 33-year old guard?

Makes little sense to me.


Cheap and a veteran... Can't have all cheap undrafted FA's...
RE: RE: Flowers isn't even the weakest link on the OL now  
Percy : 2/21/2018 1:52 pm : link
In comment 13838189 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 13838179 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


If you can improve the rest of it, you can get by, I think. He wasn't the worst lineman on the team last season. Just identify what he can do best. It's probably not 'pass protection'.



Much depends on how much we take Shurmur at his word.

Publicly, Shumur said team culture is exceptionally important and he won't tolerate football players who are not passionate about the game and HATE losing.

If you take him for his word, he is going to dump players who he thinks are not committed to the game.

Is Flowers one of those?

Objectively speaking, Flowers started off the season playing like crap, really settled down for the bulk of the middle of the season, and then began to fall apart late again.

Flowers may not have been the weakest link, but surely he's been the most disappointing player on the OL.
Kind of what I'm expecting  
AcesUp : 2/21/2018 1:52 pm : link
One big splash signing, I'm hoping it's Norwell, these bottom of the roster vet types, a premium draft pick and maybe 1-2 mid-level last contract FAs (Sullivan, an LT cap casualty, etc). I actually see this line getting older in 2018 to stop the bleeding while they slowly rebuild at the same time.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 2/21/2018 1:53 pm : link
In comment 13838218 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 13838198 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


60+ comments on a John Greco thread?

Wowzas.



Well, we have a way to before we get into Bitcoin discussion numbers.


Touche!
Eric  
Thegratefulhead : 2/21/2018 1:54 pm : link
Isn't it about time you write something now that all the coaches are hired and we are bout hit free agency. Take all the things Gettleman, Shurmur and Mara have said and put it all in one place with your outlook on what that means and what free agency/draft you think or hope looks like for the Gmen in 2018. Anyways I am interested in your take, you write well.
RE: RE: Amazing how many people  
jvm52106 : 2/21/2018 1:56 pm : link
In comment 13838127 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 13838121 Breeze_94 said:


Quote:


are losing their mind over signing a depth guy at guard



Who is losing their mind? So someone doesn't agree with a move and that equates with "losing their mind"? Strange.


I will say you do seem more upset about this than I would expect. He might not even make the team but a veteran who knows the coach and the system that will be installed is very important.
I really don't get the  
ryanmkeane : 2/21/2018 1:58 pm : link
frustration over possibly getting Norwell. Despite the fact that Reese fucked up the OL...isn't getting one of the best interior lineman in the NFL a good thing? It's not like we are strapped for cash. We can afford this guy, and he's a pro bowler, and our OL sucks. What is the issue here?
My greatest concern with this signing is...  
BLUATHRT : 2/21/2018 1:59 pm : link
how does the FO view the crop of FA and draft eligible lineman, that they prioritized making this move? I know it's low hanging fruit, but would seem you'd wait to see what else you could tun over before making a move for a guy that wasn't going to be high on any one else's priority list.
RE: Eric  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:03 pm : link
In comment 13838244 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
Isn't it about time you write something now that all the coaches are hired and we are bout hit free agency. Take all the things Gettleman, Shurmur and Mara have said and put it all in one place with your outlook on what that means and what free agency/draft you think or hope looks like for the Gmen in 2018. Anyways I am interested in your take, you write well.


We're in a weird spot right now. I've seen a number of the beat writers generate space-filler articles because they have to, but there isn't much to discuss right now.

Because the Giants were forced to wait on Shumur (and Patricia and McDaniels), everything got pushed back by weeks. Then Shurmur had to wait until the OC spot got settled.

Right now, my understanding (based on public and private material) is that Shurmur and his staff are hunkered down evaluating everything. Because we have a new GM and new head coach with a team that was one of the worst in team history, I think it is very difficult to anticipate what is going to happen. I think free agency could be very wild. Not as exciting as 2005 or 2016 with all of the big names, but just in terms of sheer numbers and who stays and who goes. The discussion on draft on the other hand will get tedious. There are only so many players in discussion for the #2 spot and we will continue to see daily threads on the same player. (Thoughts will evolve but the names will be the same so many people will get burned out on those discussions).

I will do a free agent preview in a week or so but it will mainly point out the serious roster issues and related opportunities and/or problems.
jvm52106  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:08 pm : link
I'm not upset. But I don't see the upside on this. I could swear I read a blurb at the end of the season that this guy was considering retiring. I guarantee that 95 percent of Giants fans don't even know who John Greco is. If this was a guy who we added last year who ended up starting a couple of games and did decently, maybe I could bringing him back until someone beat him out in camp/preseason. But this is a guy who didn't even start for our injury-plagued and talent-deficient offensive line. And again, he's going to be 33 next month. We can bring 90 players into the offseason program. This re-signing doesn't make much sense to me.

Now if John Greco comes in and ends up being a valuable starter or back-up, I'll gladly eat my words. What he does bring is versatility. He can play center, guard, and tackle.
I'll be that guy  
Sy'56 : 2/21/2018 2:11 pm : link
He was decent for us in his limited time.
RE: I really don't get the  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:15 pm : link
In comment 13838250 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
frustration over possibly getting Norwell. Despite the fact that Reese fucked up the OL...isn't getting one of the best interior lineman in the NFL a good thing? It's not like we are strapped for cash. We can afford this guy, and he's a pro bowler, and our OL sucks. What is the issue here?


I don't think our salary cap position is as rosy as some think. We have a ton of unsigned players (many of whom won't be re-signed). But once you start signing/re-signing players, available cap space evaporates quickly. We've got some serious $$$ invested in the QB, DL, and DB positions. (WR too although I expect we'll part ways with Marshall and probably Harris).

If we sign Norwell, and I expect we'll make a serious run at him, we're going to over-pay. That's OK. But you have to be careful with how many of those over-pay contracts are on the roster. Eli is vastly overpaid right now. So are both our DE's. You have guys like John Jerry and Rhett Ellison making serious coin. Beckham's contract is going to be a killer.
RE: I'll be that guy  
Big_Pete : 2/21/2018 2:15 pm : link
In comment 13838266 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
He was decent for us in his limited time.


That sums it up nicely Sy
RE: I'll be that guy  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:17 pm : link
In comment 13838266 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
He was decent for us in his limited time.


I was waiting for Sy. I remember his comments from one of his reviews.
RE: RE: I really don't get the  
ryanmkeane : 2/21/2018 2:22 pm : link
In comment 13838270 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:


If we sign Norwell, and I expect we'll make a serious run at him, we're going to over-pay. That's OK. But you have to be careful with how many of those over-pay contracts are on the roster. Eli is vastly overpaid right now. So are both our DE's. You have guys like John Jerry and Rhett Ellison making serious coin. Beckham's contract is going to be a killer.

Good points...if Norwell was on the other side of 30 I would say it would be an interesting decision. Being that he's 26 and just getting to his prime, I think it's a slam dunk move. Eli most likely coming off the books after this year or next, and i have a feeling that the DEs will restructure or possibly be a cap casualty eventually. Gettleman and Shurmur are pretty much dead set on fixing this OL. If they don't land Norwell, it'll be a pretty big blow to that plan.
One thing  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:22 pm : link
to keep in mind with Greco, is he has played a little center. So as posted above with John Jerry, this could be a more telling move if the Giants have come to some conclusions about Richburg and/or Jones.
ryanmkeane  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 2:23 pm : link
In more ways than one (Matt's comments above), the Norwell situation is similar to Ron Stone back in the late 1990s.
hopefully this signing plus offseason additions to come...  
Torrag : 2/21/2018 2:26 pm : link
...signifies the end of the John Jerry era.
From age ability wise it doesn't make sense but....  
edavisiii : 2/21/2018 2:26 pm : link
He could serve as a mentor to the young lineman. Even if he gets cut at the end of camp, they probably think it would be good to have him in the meeting room. Knows the system and the coaches. Might serve as a 1/2 player, 1/2 coach during camp and if the injury bug hits, you never know.
Not concerned (yet)  
Gross Blau Oberst : 2/21/2018 2:40 pm : link
When Grecco makes the final 53 man roster, then I will be concerned.

Grecco could just be a transition player through training camp, as part of the adjustment to the Shurmur schemes.

If Grecco make the 53 man roster and is considered "Key" depth, then it will be time to worry.

Until then, the team is just filling out the bottom end of the roster until Free Agency and the draft arrive. Bodies are needed for minicamps too.
RE: jvm52106  
GiantTuff1 : 2/21/2018 2:49 pm : link
In comment 13838264 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm not upset. But I don't see the upside on this. I could swear I read a blurb at the end of the season that this guy was considering retiring. I guarantee that 95 percent of Giants fans don't even know who John Greco is. If this was a guy who we added last year who ended up starting a couple of games and did decently, maybe I could bringing him back until someone beat him out in camp/preseason. But this is a guy who didn't even start for our injury-plagued and talent-deficient offensive line. And again, he's going to be 33 next month. We can bring 90 players into the offseason program. This re-signing doesn't make much sense to me.

Now if John Greco comes in and ends up being a valuable starter or back-up, I'll gladly eat my words. What he does bring is versatility. He can play center, guard, and tackle.


So what if he was considering retirement at one point.

Nick Foles was.

Larry Fitzgerald for the past several seasons.

When you get into your 30s thoughts like this run through your mind, but if he signed the contract you know he is committed to seeing it through. That's what matters.

And I whole heartedly agree with Matt that veterans, even if declined, are better than never-have-been projects who can completely non-start an entire offense. I'd rather have guys who have done it and hope they can turn it up enough like Lomas Brown and Glenn Party did.
GiantTuff1  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 3:03 pm : link
I think you are getting into odd territory when you start comparing John Greco to Larry Fitzgerald.
Eric  
afann : 2/21/2018 3:25 pm : link
Just because Greco didnít play over our crap OL doesnít mean they were better. Do you think you think the old coaching staff was any good at evaluating players? I mean BM wanted Geno over Eli. They were reluctant to try different players on the OL.
I find all these discussions about the OL  
Reb8thVA : 2/21/2018 3:35 pm : link
incredibly frustrating because last year at draft time we could see where all this was heading. Its just a gnawing reminder of how poorly this organization was run the last 5-6 years.



RE: Eric  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/21/2018 3:46 pm : link
In comment 13838358 afann said:
Quote:
Just because Greco didnít play over our crap OL doesnít mean they were better. Do you think you think the old coaching staff was any good at evaluating players? I mean BM wanted Geno over Eli. They were reluctant to try different players on the OL.


afann... No it doesn't. But if you combine that with the fact that he was cut twice recently, including by the Browns and well past his prime, the odds on him being part of the solution to this line are a bit long in my opinion.

I guess I didn't realize there were so many Giants fans praying we'd re-sign John Greco.
People keep mentioning  
Gman11 : 2/21/2018 3:54 pm : link
Greco mentoring the younger players. I don't know about that. He's not a superstar that is never in jeopardy of being cut. In a business as cut throat as the NFL, if I'm him I don't know if I'm going to mentor some kid who's going to put me out of a job.
Not impressed. They should have went after his brother  
ThatLimerickGuy : 2/21/2018 4:09 pm : link
RE: RE: Eric....  
M.S. : 2/21/2018 4:21 pm : link
In comment 13838191 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 13838187 Emlen'sGremlins said:


Quote:


....but didn't Greco perform at a high level in the Giants' Dirty Dancing Super Bowl commercial? Don't underestimate the importance of that!



Arguably the high point of the 2017 season.

It WAS the highpoint of the season!
Kirwan said he spoke with one of Greco's coaches  
Racer : 2/21/2018 4:44 pm : link
at a 'previous stop' (had to be Bob Wylie at Cleveland in 2016) who was 'unhappy with management for not wanting to keep him. Tough guy, you can trust him, quality depth.'

On 2/21 I can deal with some more of that even if he's 33. Get pissed when nobody is behind him on the depth chart of the final 53.
Greco  
Dragon : 2/21/2018 4:51 pm : link
This is the kind of move made after FA and the draft not to impressed with any of the roster moves made so far point.
I think this is a smart re-sign  
adamg : 2/21/2018 4:51 pm : link
Cheap quality depth
RE: Greco  
arcarsenal : 2/21/2018 6:55 pm : link
In comment 13838468 Dragon said:
Quote:
This is the kind of move made after FA and the draft not to impressed with any of the roster moves made so far point.


Can we have dorgan back and get rid of you permanently?

How many teams have made roster moves in the last 3 weeks that have "impressed" you?

The real FA signings haven't even fucking started yet.

Good lord.
A first.  
XBRONX : 2/21/2018 7:32 pm : link
the word quality in a sentence mentioning Greco.
I like the signing  
mrvax : 2/21/2018 7:33 pm : link
if it's vet minimum. He's a plug-in backup guard for a year.
Let's look it like this  
DavidinBMNY : 2/21/2018 9:11 pm : link
Greco exhibits the qualities Shurmer/Gettleman want. They know him. The OL coach knows him.

He has the makeup and he has experience.

If he's a 16 game starter for us, that's a bad smell.

As a depth player who can challenge for a spot on the roster and hopefully be a spot starter he's ok.

There isn't a glut of OL talent out there and those folks aren't free until Mid March anyway.

Is there someone we could actually sign right now from another team who is better?

Let's hope Fluker is next.
RE: jvm52106  
jbeintherockies : 2/21/2018 9:11 pm : link
In comment 13838264 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm not upset. But I don't see the upside on this.

What have we learned? Because of the reduced practice time that teams have since the new collective bargaining agreement veteran offensive linemen are more valuable.

He is a serviceable, experienced offensive lineman. You need those. This signing reminds me of the Grey Ruegamer signing back in 2006.

Eric you sound panicked. Never  
section125 : 2/21/2018 10:00 pm : link
"heard" you like this. It's February. Greco is one of 90 guys. If someone better comes along, he can be let go. Right now he is an NFL caliber player, lower caliber maybe, but still someone who can play in the NFL.
You still need 90 guys by training camp and I guarantee you they will have a 4th QB who is a camp arm only, and just like there will be several camp OL/OG. All fill in practice time but ultimately will be let go. Whether they sign now or June is irrelevant.

Now just for shits and giggles, just because somebody was let go by Cleveland doesn't mean the are a bad player because Cleveland wouldn't know a good player if it hit them in the face.

And BTW, the oline at the end of the year was playing better than earlier in the year with 4 and 5 different players. Greco was one of them.
What Matt SGS said  
HomerJones45 : 2/21/2018 11:31 pm : link
there are going to be a bushel of OL acquired- rookies, UDFA, draft picks, over-the-hill vets, other teams' cuts- in the hopes we can sift through the bushel and come up with five that can start.
RE: Brown Recluse  
Milton : 2/22/2018 4:57 am : link
In comment 13838079 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I guess I'd just rather give one of the 90 available roster spots to a younger player, even an undrafted one.
Until there is a draft, there isn't an available roster spot for a drafted prospect let alone an undrafted one. I'm guessing Greco signed for the vet minimum including the subsidy (and at this point there is no reason to believe anything other than that). This is a non-story.
RE: Eric you sound panicked. Never  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2/22/2018 7:45 am : link
In comment 13838701 section125 said:
Quote:
"heard" you like this. It's February. Greco is one of 90 guys. If someone better comes along, he can be let go. Right now he is an NFL caliber player, lower caliber maybe, but still someone who can play in the NFL.
You still need 90 guys by training camp and I guarantee you they will have a 4th QB who is a camp arm only, and just like there will be several camp OL/OG. All fill in practice time but ultimately will be let go. Whether they sign now or June is irrelevant.

Now just for shits and giggles, just because somebody was let go by Cleveland doesn't mean the are a bad player because Cleveland wouldn't know a good player if it hit them in the face.

And BTW, the oline at the end of the year was playing better than earlier in the year with 4 and 5 different players. Greco was one of them.


Not sure how being disappointed in a roster move equates with "panic"... methinks your are reading far too much into my comments. I simply don't understand this roster move unless Greco has more in the tank than the last three coaching staffs he played for let on.
Backups are backups for a reason  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/22/2018 9:09 am : link
because they're not good enough to start. I don't really see what there is to be disappointed about. They weren't going to sign Josh Sitton yesterday.
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