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2017 NYG #1 in an offensive stat - by a decent margin

pjcas18 : 3/9/2018 1:53 pm
it is.....


Dropped passes. I still don't think dropped passes is an official stat and some people will have a conniption and break out in hives since it's from PFF, but man that's a lot of dropped passes:

That's because Eli  
fireitup77 : 3/9/2018 1:58 pm : link
always throws the ball high ;)

.  
arcarsenal : 3/9/2018 2:02 pm : link
All I can think about is that perfect ball Eli dropped right into Marshall's gut down the sideline against DET in Week 2 at a crucial moment and he fucking drops it.
Jerrell Adams Drop In Last Game  
TheVette : 3/9/2018 2:02 pm : link
Easy TD - microcosm of the whole season.
Just part of what Sy said all year in the game reviews.  
Racer : 3/9/2018 2:15 pm : link
Worst 'situation' of any QB in the league. Guys frequently whiffing in pass pro, light on NFL caliber targets, painful number of drops.
Shurmur's offense right among the best...  
Dan in the Springs : 3/9/2018 2:16 pm : link
wonder how much the system can help improve this stat and how much it's a result of QB/WR execution.

This season might tell us something.
Get the quants on this......  
WideRight : 3/9/2018 2:22 pm : link
Is there a correlation between QB and drops? Is there a correlation between anything(route/coach/scorekeeper) and drops?

If it is a whole lot of nothing, then we can expect a pretty significant improvement just from reversion to the mean.
I said it in another thread  
Knee of Theismann : 3/9/2018 2:28 pm : link
The idea that Eli is in "Steep Decline" is a belief only held by Giants fans who are frustrated watching the team lose over the last 5 years. Around the NFL the general consensus is that if put in the right situation Eli can still win a super bowl. Wasn't that how it always was with him? Even in 2011 he had 2 elite WRs (yes Nicks was Elite in his short-lived prime) and an offensive line that actually allowed him to step up in the pocket. Give him that and a healthy group of offensive weapons who can catch the ball and then we'll really know what we have in Eli.
I have some gripes about this stat.  
phil in arizona : 3/9/2018 2:36 pm : link
For example, we passed 608 times last season. We've had more opportunity to drop the ball as oppose to a team like Chicago, who passed only 473 times. You can calculate drop rates (ours is roughly 7.5%, still terrible), but that doesn't give any situational context (Down, distance, defensive scheme, etc).

That being said, it's obvious that we've had major issues in this area. Hopefully Shurmer can make the much needed improvements to scheme and discipline. A talent upgrade wouldn't hurt either.
If I remember right  
Peppers : 3/9/2018 2:38 pm : link
Engram had 11 of those.

One of the reasons I think NYG should go get a sure handed receiver who is a good route runner.

I know we have some interest in Sutton but his teammate Trey Quinn is a guy they should look at. Had one of the lowest drop rates in the country.
Yeah  
phil in arizona : 3/9/2018 2:51 pm : link
but we also have to get out of situations where safeties are sitting back, waiting to tee off on whatever poor sucker we have running a slant.
Drops go both ways. Without question the Giant receivers  
Jimmy Googs : 3/9/2018 2:56 pm : link
had their share of gaffs. But sometimes when its 3rd and long and our guys run routes just near that line and are about to get their asses kicked in...it changes concentration levels.

It also doesn't help when the ball isn't on the money, and it requires reaching up or behind them even if it is catchable.

Thats how guys go on the IR...
RE: Shurmur's offense right among the best...  
BigBlueinChicago : 3/9/2018 2:59 pm : link
In comment 13856311 Dan in the Springs said:
Quote:
wonder how much the system can help improve this stat and how much it's a result of QB/WR execution.

This season might tell us something.


A "system" can't turn guys into better catchers of the ball.

If you go back over the last say, 10 years, the Giants have had a alarming habit of being close to the top of the league in the dropped pass statistic spanning numerous coaches, from Fassel to Coughlin to Mc****.
Wow.  
est1986 : 3/9/2018 3:15 pm : link
That's almost 3 drops a game.
RE: Wow.  
est1986 : 3/9/2018 3:15 pm : link
In comment 13856363 est1986 said:
Quote:
That's almost 3 drops a game.


Compared to just one per game from New Orleans.
I've watched the team for decades...  
Torrag : 3/9/2018 3:18 pm : link
...I've never seen so many dropped passes as we had last year. It was stunning to me.
This is just so surprising  
Bill L : 3/9/2018 3:18 pm : link
Especially given the plethora of highly skilled receivers on the team

I just knew Eli was the...  
M.S. : 3/9/2018 3:18 pm : link

...most accurate NFL passer.

It seemed  
SLIM_ : 3/9/2018 3:35 pm : link
like we were averaging 1 drop TD pass a game.
We spoke about this during season  
idiotsavant : 3/9/2018 3:36 pm : link
And during Kurt Warner (holy crap) and in conjunction with the wr injuries discussion.

Poor OL play can reduce time window for passing.

Which, even more so given qbs experiences,in reality, than we imagine, can reduce the variety and length of passing routes.

Defenses are not stupid. Having fewer and shorter routes to defend they are able to sit back and hammer the receivers:

which leads to drops AND injuries.

So...Jerry's weakness at drafting OL lead to the rash of WR injuries and drops.

At least when spags took over, in short crossing type nice the chains passes, you saw an adjustment where wrs would turn back towards ball, sell totally out for catch not YACs and then go down. At least we moved the chains and drops were reduced.

But that's in context not a recipe for future schemes obviously.
Typo nice the chains  
idiotsavant : 3/9/2018 3:38 pm : link
= move the chains
That settles it...  
bw in dc : 3/9/2018 3:41 pm : link
Eli is still he man, just needs better receivers.

So with the #2 pick in the draft the New York Giants select Calvin Ridley, WR, Alabama.

Onto the playoffs...
Eli needs to throw  
SHO'NUFF : 3/9/2018 4:42 pm : link
tighter spirals. Grip strength!
RE: I said it in another thread  
Jim in Tampa : 3/9/2018 5:28 pm : link
In comment 13856324 Knee of Theismann said:
Quote:
The idea that Eli is in "Steep Decline" is a belief only held by Giants fans who are frustrated watching the team lose over the last 5 years. Around the NFL the general consensus is that if put in the right situation Eli can still win a super bowl. Wasn't that how it always was with him? Even in 2011 he had 2 elite WRs (yes Nicks was Elite in his short-lived prime) and an offensive line that actually allowed him to step up in the pocket. Give him that and a healthy group of offensive weapons who can catch the ball and then we'll really know what we have in Eli.


Not sure where you're getting this "general consensus" from that Eli's still got it, but that's just not the case.

Here's a quote from Colin at Great Blue North from yesterday's thread concerning Eli...

"almost everything I heard from within the Giants org the past couple of years was that Eli just wasn't playing very well."

Colin thinks the Giants should take a QB at 2 and I agree with him. But even if you think Eli still has "it" he's 37 and not going to play forever.

Eli - ( New Window )
Even if you  
old man : 3/9/2018 6:10 pm : link
Dump 1/3 of that on Eli we are still top 10.
It's concentration, technique, and strength.
I've noticed other receivers less talented than ours, historically hold onto passes when hit immediately while ours drop them, even Nicks and OBJ in our recent history.
My guess it's mostly concentration.
Injured WRs  
GeoMan999 : 3/9/2018 6:41 pm : link
Not surprising stat considering we were playing with our number 4, 5, 6, and 7 WR!
Makes sense  
GeoMan999 : 3/9/2018 6:46 pm : link
If Eli had an average or median drop rate of 29 that is 16 extra completions, which would have increased his completion percentage to 64.5%.
RE: RE: I said it in another thread  
Bill L : 3/9/2018 7:05 pm : link
In comment 13856524 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
In comment 13856324 Knee of Theismann said:


Quote:


The idea that Eli is in "Steep Decline" is a belief only held by Giants fans who are frustrated watching the team lose over the last 5 years. Around the NFL the general consensus is that if put in the right situation Eli can still win a super bowl. Wasn't that how it always was with him? Even in 2011 he had 2 elite WRs (yes Nicks was Elite in his short-lived prime) and an offensive line that actually allowed him to step up in the pocket. Give him that and a healthy group of offensive weapons who can catch the ball and then we'll really know what we have in Eli.



Not sure where you're getting this "general consensus" from that Eli's still got it, but that's just not the case.

Here's a quote from Colin at Great Blue North from yesterday's thread concerning Eli...

"almost everything I heard from within the Giants org the past couple of years was that Eli just wasn't playing very well."

Colin thinks the Giants should take a QB at 2 and I agree with him. But even if you think Eli still has "it" he's 37 and not going to play forever. Eli - ( New Window )
. Itís a mixed bag for sure. I think every independent talent evaluator with attribution, including former GM, players, scouts said he still has it. The NYG current GM and coach say he still has it. A couple writers and a questionable football ďstatsĒ site says heís done. Colinís inside the giants sources say heís done. I would wonder if those people are old or new refine though, since old regime people were actively trying to scapegoat Manning for last season and there might be residual animosity there that influences their views.

Reality is nobody probably knows anything u til we see what happens with a better team and a good offensive scheme. Anything else is just wind.
Refine = regime  
Bill L : 3/9/2018 7:06 pm : link
Fat fingers
why would bad OL lead to more drops?  
Vanzetti : 3/9/2018 7:19 pm : link
by definition, a dropped pass is one that should have been caught. A pass that is too high, too low or behind a guy does not count as a drop. A drop is a pass that hits a guys hands in front.

In other words, it is not a pass where you say, "That was behind him but a #1 receiver should make that catch." It is a ball that any receiver should have caught.
I cannot see why anyone would be stunned at this  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/9/2018 7:37 pm : link
Look at the receivers who played last year.
If the Giants had about 16 fewer drops  
eclipz928 : 3/10/2018 7:24 am : link
or 1 additional catch per game, they would be right around the league average. I don't see 1 more catch each game making a difference in how Eli and this offense performed last season
RE: RE: I said it in another thread  
81_Great_Dane : 3/10/2018 2:57 pm : link
In comment 13856524 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
Here's a quote from Colin at Great Blue North from yesterday's thread concerning Eli...

"almost everything I heard from within the Giants org the past couple of years was that Eli just wasn't playing very well."


For better or worse, the coach, most of his staff, the GM and his first deputy were all let go. Those guys all were happy to pin blame on Eli.

That doesn't mean they were wrong.
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