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I wish that we could trade Eli.

yatqb : 3/9/2018 7:16 pm
This roster is so thin that getting rid of him and going for the full rebuild would be my preference. I love Eli, but if he waived his no trade clause I'd trade him, because this team is quite a ways from a SB contender, and I'd prefer to suffer for a few more years with the hope that we could draft high again next year and rebuild the whole roster.

We'd recoup about $10M this year against the cap (but have $12M in dead cap costs) and would have $17M more cap space next offseason.

Eli is obviously not part of our future, so IMO it would be time to cut bait if he'd be willing to waive the no trade and we found a team interested in him.

(I know this has been beaten to death, but I was looking over the roster again, and I can't identify any other players who might be possible trade bait given their cap hits and/or talent level. We really are thin!)
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The problem I have w the anti eli guys  
jtgiants : 3/9/2018 9:42 pm : link
Is the giants themselves don't agree w you. They think, as do I, they bounce back this year and if they do eli will be here 2 more years. I really believe a lot of people will eat a lot of crow. Eli can still play and many people in the league agree. Your entitled to think he can't play but stop stating he's in decline as fact. I don't believe that's accurate
RE: The problem I have w the anti eli guys  
Jimmy Googs : 3/9/2018 9:56 pm : link
In comment 13856989 jtgiants said:
Quote:
Is the giants themselves don't agree w you. They think, as do I, they bounce back this year and if they do eli will be here 2 more years. I really believe a lot of people will eat a lot of crow. Eli can still play and many people in the league agree. Your entitled to think he can't play but stop stating he's in decline as fact. I don't believe that's accurate


stop stating he isn't in decline. I don't believe that's accurate either...
Eli should be gone...  
bw in dc : 3/9/2018 10:04 pm : link
But Mara won't ever let this happen. He's all in on Eli now more than ever.

The backlash by the media and the fans during Geno Gate shook him to the core. It was so bad he had to call his football muse - Ernie Accorsi - to help restore order.

So Ernie ordered Eli to untouchable status and brought in his old boy DG. And Mara nodded approvingly...
RE: The problem I have w the anti eli guys  
NYG07 : 3/9/2018 10:42 pm : link
In comment 13856989 jtgiants said:
Quote:
Is the giants themselves don't agree w you. They think, as do I, they bounce back this year and if they do eli will be here 2 more years. I really believe a lot of people will eat a lot of crow. Eli can still play and many people in the league agree. Your entitled to think he can't play but stop stating he's in decline as fact. I don't believe that's accurate


So just because the Giants are moving forward with Eli it is a foregone conclusion he is going to miraculously turn his play around and be great next year?

Also, stop calling us anti Eli. We are just pro Giants and think it is time to move on. I don't hate Eli and I never did. I used to defend him to no end. But he is not the same player he used to be, and if he is going to eat a huge chunk of the Giant's cap space then he needs to be much better than he has been the last two years.

Not in decline? He was worse in 2016 than he was in 2015. He was way worse in 2017 than he was in 2016. That is called a decline. I know you want to continue to make excuses for him but at what point should you demand a $22M QB elevates his teammates?
For me it's not even about Eli's decline, although that certainly is  
yatqb : 3/9/2018 10:51 pm : link
a concern. It's about him being 37 and having little time left, and about the horrid state of our roster.

If he was a franchise QB who would be around for the next decade he'd be part of the long term solution for the team and untouchable. But he's not, and we need a ton. So getting his $ off the cap, getting more picks, AND losing as many games as possible, will only help us down the line.


Bill, I agree. As was said in Shawshank, "Hope is a good thing, maybe the best thing". And I want spring to come sooner than it likely will if we keep Eli.
It’s simple. Just give Eli  
LAXin : 3/10/2018 12:37 am : link
A good offense line,
A solid running game,
A pass-catching TE,
A set of playmakers at receivers,
A QB-friendly offensive system,
and a great defense, such as the one that never gave up more than 20 points in any of Eli’s 8 career playoff victories.

Did I miss something? These are really not too much to ask for, right? Many QBs in today’s NFL would need a lot more to be successful.
RE: It’s simple. Just give Eli  
bw in dc : 3/10/2018 1:34 am : link
In comment 13857219 LAXin said:
Quote:
A good offense line,
A solid running game,
A pass-catching TE,
A set of playmakers at receivers,
A QB-friendly offensive system,
and a great defense, such as the one that never gave up more than 20 points in any of Eli’s 8 career playoff victories.

Did I miss something? These are really not too much to ask for, right?
Many QBs in today’s NFL would need a lot more to be successful.


May as well throw in special teams. He’s going to need a great punter to bail him out of poor field position and a dependable FG kicker to get points when Eli can’t punch it in for six...

Then our “franchise QB” will have everything in place to just be one of the 22 starters trying to contribute to a winning team.
I think many on BBI are discounting the  
montanagiant : 3/10/2018 2:25 am : link
McAdoo was an abject failure on every front. I mean he was horrendous on a scale unmeasured before and if you add in a GM who deserved to be fired the year before due to a miserable draft record for quite a few years you have the perfect storm of an NFL version of the Keystone Cops.

The rest of the league knew this, the rest of the league realized how out of depth they both were, how utterly clueless and desperate they became as the season wore on. There were decisions made by both that had nothing to do with making the Giants a better team and everything to do with saving their asses. This was the single worst example of CYA at any cost that the NFL has seen in years. And while Mara may escape the rightful indignation towards himself to a large degree the fact still remains that he is also culpable in this perfect storm of a disaster. The other 31 teams understand that they realized that the talent played below expectations because of the leadership at the top. The cancers that developed were a result of players mimicking the same CYA aspect the HC and GM were guilty of.

These two were failures in every single area that describes their job and the rest of the NFL knows this. This roster is much better then what their record showed. Sure there are areas that need a complete overhaul (O-Line) and others that have question marks where none existed before (DB's, WR's) but we now have fucking grown-ups in charge, knowledgeable deeply experienced Football people who also realize how bad things were last season but understand there is a workable core that needs some foundation work and might just shock the rest of the league with some right moves.

Let them do their work
I forgot that BBI does not allow quotations in their subject box  
montanagiant : 3/10/2018 2:29 am : link
That subject should read:

I think many on BBI are discounting the "McAdoo/Reese Effect"
RE: Eli should be gone...  
JCin332 : 3/10/2018 3:32 am : link
In comment 13857010 bw in dc said:
Quote:
But Mara won't ever let this happen. He's all in on Eli now more than ever.

The backlash by the media and the fans during Geno Gate shook him to the core. It was so bad he had to call his football muse - Ernie Accorsi - to help restore order.

So Ernie ordered Eli to untouchable status and brought in his old boy DG. And Mara nodded approvingly...


You know reading your posts over time I have come to the conclusion you must be either 12 years old or living in a fantasy world...
RE: unfortunately, the cap  
micky : 3/10/2018 7:10 am : link
In comment 13856802 JonC said:
Quote:
gets in the way, and often human based loyalties too, which isn't a bad thing. I'd prefer to move on now, Part of the blood price for two rings may include hanging on another year too long while they put the full blueprint in place.


I like this post, and a sensible response, rather than a "fuck you" response.

I'd prefer to move on as well, but, I'm trusting getts and rest of decision makers on going about next year and future.

Thing is, if they did trade eli and other moves, if the direction, they could really parlay this draft into abundance of picks not only for this draft but future drafts, which would really set them up good flow of talent down the line.

If anything, it should be an interesting time here for the giants.
I think we should traded eli  
dep026 : 3/10/2018 7:54 am : link
For Pizza Hut and blow
RE: RE: Eli should be gone...  
bw in dc : 3/10/2018 7:59 am : link
In comment 13857239 JCin332 said:
Quote:
In comment 13857010 bw in dc said:


Quote:


But Mara won't ever let this happen. He's all in on Eli now more than ever.

The backlash by the media and the fans during Geno Gate shook him to the core. It was so bad he had to call his football muse - Ernie Accorsi - to help restore order.

So Ernie ordered Eli to untouchable status and brought in his old boy DG. And Mara nodded approvingly...



You know reading your posts over time I have come to the conclusion you must be either 12 years old or living in a fantasy world...


Mock away my friend. Mock away.

But let me remind you of this six day span last year at Jints Central:

Eli stands in front of his locker crying after being unceremoniously benched, a defiant coach has a press conference telling the world everyone is on board with the benching and ending of Eli’s streak, Geno is inextricably announced as the starter, Mara is AWOL, the media and the fans go into a frenzy, Geno plays and there are endless shots of Eli on the sidelines, there are rumors of a fan revolt for the Dallas game, Mara fires McAdoo, Mara crawls out of his bunker and has hastily prepared press conference where he looks as uncomfortable as a human being can look, Accorsi is summoned to Jints Central to “consult”, Reese is fired, the world awaits the white smoke from Jints Central for the next GM, in the most predictable act ever, Mara hires Accorsi’s buddy Dave Gettleman...

Indeed, I’m living in fantasy land...
Should be...  
bw in dc : 3/10/2018 8:00 am : link
inexplicably not inextricably...
still fail to see  
bc4life : 3/10/2018 8:25 am : link
the logic in cutting a QB you can win with now while adding or developing a young qb to eventually replace him.

I was totally okay with sitting him last year. They weren't going anywhere and weren't sure what they had behind him. no running game, wr corps decimated with injuries - why leave him in there to take a chance on getting him injured in meaningless games?




my point is  
bc4life : 3/10/2018 8:26 am : link
you can do both.
re: lack of talent  
bc4life : 3/10/2018 8:33 am : link
it's all about the OLine. Wr corps, secondary, and DL have a respectable amount of talent. Need some DLine depth and some LB talent, but it depnds on what new DC wants to do with them.

And I think we have to wait and see what O-Line they add and equally if not more important - what can they do with the palyers they have now. bit of a puzzle - OLine is the problem but they played fairly well in both game against Eagles - arguably best DLine in the league.

Eli is clearly near end of his career. But, I'm of the mind that we get the remaining quality years out of him while setting up an orderly transition. And he only has two years left on contract anyway.
one more point  
bc4life : 3/10/2018 8:43 am : link
re: rebuilding - Pugh, Richburg, Fluker, Vereen, Darkwa, Harris, Marshall, Wynn, Bromley, Casillas, Herzlich, Berhe - all will probably be gone.

about 1/4 of the roster are guaranteed gone. And, there will be a few more. FA has not even started yet and there is the draft. That is not even counting the 10-15 rookies who will be contending for jobs - 4-6 of them prety much guaranteed.


All together that is about 1/3 of the roster. Some of you act like by not cutting Eli = they will be standing pat. again, that argument makes no sense to me.
RE: RE: RE: Eli should be gone...  
JCin332 : 3/10/2018 8:58 am : link
In comment 13857287 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 13857239 JCin332 said:


Quote:


In comment 13857010 bw in dc said:


Quote:


But Mara won't ever let this happen. He's all in on Eli now more than ever.

The backlash by the media and the fans during Geno Gate shook him to the core. It was so bad he had to call his football muse - Ernie Accorsi - to help restore order.

So Ernie ordered Eli to untouchable status and brought in his old boy DG. And Mara nodded approvingly...



You know reading your posts over time I have come to the conclusion you must be either 12 years old or living in a fantasy world...



Mock away my friend. Mock away.

But let me remind you of this six day span last year at Jints Central:

Eli stands in front of his locker crying after being unceremoniously benched, a defiant coach has a press conference telling the world everyone is on board with the benching and ending of Eli’s streak, Geno is inextricably announced as the starter, Mara is AWOL, the media and the fans go into a frenzy, Geno plays and there are endless shots of Eli on the sidelines, there are rumors of a fan revolt for the Dallas game, Mara fires McAdoo, Mara crawls out of his bunker and has hastily prepared press conference where he looks as uncomfortable as a human being can look, Accorsi is summoned to Jints Central to “consult”, Reese is fired, the world awaits the white smoke from Jints Central for the next GM, in the most predictable act ever, Mara hires Accorsi’s buddy Dave Gettleman...

Indeed, I’m living in fantasy land...


You forgot he's innacurate and throws high and got OBJ and the rest of his receivers injured...
"I love Eli, but...."  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 9:02 am : link
If I had a dollar for every time....
Bc  
joeinpa : 3/10/2018 9:07 am : link
Do both!

What a novel and rational comment. What are you doing here?
RE: RE: RE: Eli should be gone...  
sundayatone : 3/10/2018 9:09 am : link
In comment 13857287 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 13857239 JCin332 said:


Quote:


In comment 13857010 bw in dc said:


Quote:


But Mara won't ever let this happen. He's all in on Eli now more than ever.

The backlash by the media and the fans during Geno Gate shook him to the core. It was so bad he had to call his football muse - Ernie Accorsi - to help restore order.

So Ernie ordered Eli to untouchable status and brought in his old boy DG. And Mara nodded approvingly...



You know reading your posts over time I have come to the conclusion you must be either 12 years old or living in a fantasy world...



Mock away my friend. Mock away.

But let me remind you of this six day span last year at Jints Central:

Eli stands in front of his locker crying after being unceremoniously benched, a defiant coach has a press conference telling the world everyone is on board with the benching and ending of Eli’s streak, Geno is inextricably announced as the starter, Mara is AWOL, the media and the fans go into a frenzy, Geno plays and there are endless shots of Eli on the sidelines, there are rumors of a fan revolt for the Dallas game, Mara fires McAdoo, Mara crawls out of his bunker and has hastily prepared press conference where he looks as uncomfortable as a human being can look, Accorsi is summoned to Jints Central to “consult”, Reese is fired, the world awaits the white smoke from Jints Central for the next GM, in the most predictable act ever, Mara hires Accorsi’s buddy Dave Gettleman...

Indeed, I’m living in fantasy land...


eli benched himself,mike francesa went nuts,the sports media followed up with the pile on and in the aftermath mara got cold feet and gave eli a 10% stake in the franchise.
I have to admit....  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 9:11 am : link
it's extremely entertaining to listen to the posters that declared Eli done, cut, traded, definitively this offseason scramble around bewildered that he's still here and not going anywhere.

Told ya. You refused to listen to logic and reason :)
I’ll say the same thing I said regarding Coughlin..  
Sean : 3/10/2018 9:12 am : link
There needs to be a plan. If the Giants take a QB at 2, there will be massive outcry to start him as soon as things go south. It will be last year all over again. If this is the intention, I’d move on from Eli now.

However, I’m also fine with the idea to commit to Eli for the next 3 years and throw away the last 2 years as utter incompetence. Look at the Saints model. Get Eli a legit RB & build the line through FA. Webb is developmental and he gets a few more years under Eli.

I’m not half assing it. Make a decision either way & commit to it. It makes no sense paying Eli & a rookie 2nd pick QB.
RE: I’ll say the same thing I said regarding Coughlin..  
sundayatone : 3/10/2018 9:22 am : link
In comment 13857354 Sean said:
Quote:
There needs to be a plan. If the Giants take a QB at 2, there will be massive outcry to start him as soon as things go south. It will be last year all over again. If this is the intention, I’d move on from Eli now.

However, I’m also fine with the idea to commit to Eli for the next 3 years and throw away the last 2 years as utter incompetence. Look at the Saints model. Get Eli a legit RB & build the line through FA. Webb is developmental and he gets a few more years under Eli.

I’m not half assing it. Make a decision either way & commit to it. It makes no sense paying Eli & a rookie 2nd pick QB.


you want to commit another 3yrs to eli in which he will be 40,he was mediocre at 35. that is not a good plan.
RE: RE: I’ll say the same thing I said regarding Coughlin..  
Sean : 3/10/2018 9:40 am : link
In comment 13857368 sundayatone said:
Quote:
In comment 13857354 Sean said:


Quote:


There needs to be a plan. If the Giants take a QB at 2, there will be massive outcry to start him as soon as things go south. It will be last year all over again. If this is the intention, I’d move on from Eli now.

However, I’m also fine with the idea to commit to Eli for the next 3 years and throw away the last 2 years as utter incompetence. Look at the Saints model. Get Eli a legit RB & build the line through FA. Webb is developmental and he gets a few more years under Eli.

I’m not half assing it. Make a decision either way & commit to it. It makes no sense paying Eli & a rookie 2nd pick QB.



you want to commit another 3yrs to eli in which he will be 40,he was mediocre at 35. that is not a good plan.


Fine. Let’s move on now then. We have a new coach, the 2nd pick in the draft in what is considered a QB strong class. I have zero issue with this.
RE: RE: RE: I’ll say the same thing I said regarding Coughlin..  
sundayatone : 3/10/2018 9:42 am : link
In comment 13857389 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 13857368 sundayatone said:


Quote:


In comment 13857354 Sean said:


Quote:


There needs to be a plan. If the Giants take a QB at 2, there will be massive outcry to start him as soon as things go south. It will be last year all over again. If this is the intention, I’d move on from Eli now.

However, I’m also fine with the idea to commit to Eli for the next 3 years and throw away the last 2 years as utter incompetence. Look at the Saints model. Get Eli a legit RB & build the line through FA. Webb is developmental and he gets a few more years under Eli.

I’m not half assing it. Make a decision either way & commit to it. It makes no sense paying Eli & a rookie 2nd pick QB.



you want to commit another 3yrs to eli in which he will be 40,he was mediocre at 35. that is not a good plan.



Fine. Let’s move on now then. We have a new coach, the 2nd pick in the draft in what is considered a QB strong class. I have zero issue with this.


i concur doctor.
RE: RE: RE: I’ll say the same thing I said regarding Coughlin..  
Bill L : 3/10/2018 9:47 am : link
In comment 13857389 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 13857368 sundayatone said:


Quote:


In comment 13857354 Sean said:


Quote:


There needs to be a plan. If the Giants take a QB at 2, there will be massive outcry to start him as soon as things go south. It will be last year all over again. If this is the intention, I’d move on from Eli now.

However, I’m also fine with the idea to commit to Eli for the next 3 years and throw away the last 2 years as utter incompetence. Look at the Saints model. Get Eli a legit RB & build the line through FA. Webb is developmental and he gets a few more years under Eli.

I’m not half assing it. Make a decision either way & commit to it. It makes no sense paying Eli & a rookie 2nd pick QB.



you want to commit another 3yrs to eli in which he will be 40,he was mediocre at 35. that is not a good plan.



Fine. Let’s move on now then. We have a new coach, the 2nd pick in the draft in what is considered a QB strong class. I have zero issue with this.
its considered deep. Nobody has really said talented. Maybe Rosen as most pro-ready but with a ginormous early retirement risk. The rest are “ceiling”players if they can blah, blah, blah.

I think you’d do just as well, and probably better, in bringing Bridgewater on board.
Britt  
Bill2 : 3/10/2018 9:57 am : link
Given that you think about this often and are aware of how most sports careers end;

1What are your goals for the New York Giants?

2) by when do you want them accomplished?

3) What is your proposed plan for the New York Giants?

4) What actions could accelarate item 1 and 2 above?

Not feelings about those questions...concrete logical actions
Imo  
Bill2 : 3/10/2018 10:00 am : link
None of this can be really analyzed until we see the end of the first two phases of FA
RE: Britt  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 10:15 am : link
In comment 13857416 Bill2 said:
Quote:
Given that you think about this often and are aware of how most sports careers end;

1What are your goals for the New York Giants?

2) by when do you want them accomplished?

3) What is your proposed plan for the New York Giants?

4) What actions could accelarate item 1 and 2 above?

Not feelings about those questions...concrete logical actions


Bill, my thoughts are....

Rebuild the core of the team. Regain control of both lines of scrimmage through rebuilding the offensive line and and establishing a strong running game.

I think this could be turned around quickly with some thrifty moves this offseason. Signing Norwell and potentially another veteran to put in between existing pieces on the line and add cohesion could improve the line greatly, and quickly.

Personally, I would draft Barkley, but if he wasn't available I'd also be happy with Nelson for the reason I stated above. Norwell and Nelson would be an incredible haul towards controlling the offensive LOS. Norwell and Barkley would be equally impressive.

As for Eli, I would draft a pro style/ready QB in a later round, 2nd or after. I personally believe that recent draft history shows these players have a lot more impact and are ready to play/contribute earlier than highly touted spread offense QB's. Let Davis Webb and this draft pick QB duel it out in training camp for number 2 on the depth chart.

Eli starts, and one of two things happens. The team gets turned around quickly and they have success, at which point Eli will start again the following season and an evaluation will be made on the situation in the last year of his contract, or the team struggles and the coach decides to make a change mid season from Eli to whomever has won the opportunity to step in between Davis Webb and future QB.

I do believe there is talent on this team, and I do believe that any team in the NFL can go from worst to first in a single offseason.
I'll play..  
IIT : 3/10/2018 10:26 am : link
Quote:
1) What are your goals for the New York Giants?


Superbowl


Quote:
2) by when do you want them accomplished?


ASAP


Quote:
3) What is your proposed plan for the New York Giants?


Restock the following positions with average or above talent through FA and the draft in this order of priority:

OL
RB
WR2
LB
FS
CB


Quote:
4) What actions could accelarate item 1 and 2 above?


See answer to question 3.



The plan is simple, the execution less so. But that's why DG gets paid the big bucks.

The Giants already accomplished my original number 1 and 2 tasks which were fire Reese and fire McAdoo.

I do think they can pull it off and I think Eli deserves another shot. He threw behind that shit line for years without ever throwing them or Reese under the bus.

Let him swing for the fences this year with a legit line. If he strikes out, then I'll get behind scrapping him.
Britt  
Bill2 : 3/10/2018 10:34 am : link
Good plan imo.

But to me a good runnning game requires 4 new lineman, one more blocking TE, someone other than marshal so the safeties have to play further back and 2 new rb...and a QB who is a threat enough that you have to defend back and the sidelines.

Seriously. And it may need 5 new lineman.

Meanwhile that has to be done while adding to the defense and a punter and kicker.

Again, how close to the goal we are is going to be much better handicapped in 5 weeks.

And although it is true that a team can go from bad to a good record exposed in the playoffs in one year is is also very true that a team can bump along bad to mediocre for a decade or two.

The fans of teams that showed a flash record of 9 and 7 admidst years of rationalizing hopa hopa are the largest segment of NFL fans.

To me, the goal is not a good year. To me the goal is escape velocity.

Sorry i watched the late 60s and all of the seventies

A strong running game and offensive line.....  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 10:37 am : link
Cures a lot of what ills this team. It also greatly benefits the qb, regardless of whether it's Eli or a young quarterback. We have not had these things in nearly a decade.

In fact, I truly believe the leave is cycling back around to this model, along with spread concepts because colleges are not producing pro style qb's anymore. It's all about the system.
And no, the goal is not a good year but....  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 10:43 am : link
it is a benefit of a savvy off-season if they make the right moves. Immediate and long term success can coexist in the NFL.
RE: I agree  
Optimus-NY : 3/10/2018 10:48 am : link
In comment 13856741 The_Boss said:
Quote:
I think “going for it” with Eli is a mistake. I don’t think they’ll surpass either Dallas or Philadelphia in the next 2 years. In fact, I think there’s a better chance this team goes 6-10 next year than 10-6. There are so many moving parts on this roster. Concentrating on building something more sustainable over a long period instead of hoping for one more lightening in a bottle run is the prudent move. Going “all in” on Eli is not. At this stage, he likely needs an elite roster to win a Super Bowl. They are far from that.


Exactly.
RE: A year from now  
Optimus-NY : 3/10/2018 10:48 am : link
In comment 13856737 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
the Giants will reportedly have 70 million in cap room. That includes the contracts of Eli and JPP but if the Giants cut both of them next year then they would save approximately 25 million more. This season will be tough unless they add a QB with the 2nd pick and he gets some playing time later in the year and plays well.

Imagine the optimism around here going into the 2019 season with a new franchise QB and all that cap room not to mention another potential early 1st round pick in the 10-15 range.


Right on.
Did  
bc4life : 3/10/2018 10:51 am : link
Wentz get playing time before he became a stater?

Did Eli?
the key question re: Eli is can he still lead to wins in big games?  
Eric on Li : 3/10/2018 10:51 am : link
it's simple, and it's binary. IMO it's yes. I didn't see much difference in his performance between 2016 (when he played excellent in Lambeau) and 2017 - just a lot less Beckham and Shepard (and good defense). He lit up the SB champs twice this year, once without any of his starting receivers, and gave the team 4th quarter leads at the beginning of the season against decent opponents. He posted fair stats (19 td/13 in/3500 yards) with perhaps the worst supporting cast around him in football.

So what does that "yes" mean to me? He's the starting QB until the moment a better option comes along. A 20 or 21 year old Andrew Luck/Carson Wentz might be a better option. Another NFL team offering a 1st or 2nd round pick might lead to a better option. He's certainly getting up there in age where they need to actively have their eyes open to both scenarios, but this desire to move on from him is strange. I might be wrong but I don't think the Steelers fans or Charger fans are as desperate to get rid of his contemporaries Rivers/Big Ben.

And with all of that said, as much as the starting QB is the most important position in all sports, even Aaron Rodgers would have a tough time leading this Giant roster to wins if they don't improve their play in the trenches. They need to get better running the football, stopping the run and rushing the passer no matter who the QB is. So to answer the questions above posted by Bill, that's where my focus would be. Improve the flaws of the entire roster and actively search for young QB's. Those 2 things can happen independently of wishing away the best qb in franchise history. I do not think it's out of the question that a good offseason and solid health luck can lead to another playoff appearance like 2016.
People won’t appreciate him  
Carl in CT : 3/10/2018 10:54 am : link
Until he is gone.
Also I think "going for it" is a bit of a misnomer  
Eric on Li : 3/10/2018 10:57 am : link
Is improving the OL "going for it"? The pass rush? The defense? Don't we want to fix those areas of the team to support whatever young QB ultimately takes the reigns after Eli?

I don't think anyone is advocating overpaying a very short term move as many wanted with a 34 year old Andrew Whitworth last year or as they did with Brandon Marshall. The most "win now" move I've seen anyone endorse is signing Nate Solder, who is the same age Shaun O'hara was when he signed with the Giants.
My goal is to accelerate the growth of the team towards  
yatqb : 3/10/2018 11:06 am : link
a decade of excellent football. Eli might allow for a better season next year, but is not part of the long term solution for this team.

I've always been an Eli defender and loyalist, but all good things come to an end, and sometimes it's better to do this a year early than a year late. Well, imo we're already beyond that point with Eli.

I don't doubt that with a rebuilt OL and LB corps we might play around .500 ball next year with Eli at the helm. But that doesn't get us near the promised land. Only by giving our kid QB(s) a chance to play and grow do we accomplish that. We'd have to tolerate losing a LOT of games for a year or two, but at the end of that time we might be quite a talented, young team.

Keeping Eli just suspends that type of growth. And I love Eli. But facts are facts.


Montana, I agree with your assessments of McAdoo and Reese, but the roster is awful right now. Let's hope for the best in FA and the draft.
I also don't believe that we need to replace every lineman....  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 11:12 am : link
I think one or two quality starters placed between existing players will make a big difference. Coughlin had the same line playing decently in 2015. Coaching is a big part too, and mcadoo sucked.
RE: People won’t appreciate him  
bw in dc : 3/10/2018 11:14 am : link
In comment 13857478 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Until he is gone.


Time to start that clock.
Unfortunately..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/10/2018 12:06 pm : link
it isn't the potty mouth stuff people should focus on:

Quote:
And enjoy the potty mouth comments coming your way
Jimmy Googs : 3/9/2018 7:50 pm : link : reply
because it means you took the unpopular albeit rational view that sometimes it gets worse before it gets better.


It is the thought that it is a rational decision. We don't gain any equity by getting rid of Eli, especially if the return isn't decent. We actually will have dead money when just a year from now we can trade or release him without a significant cap impact.

Whenever there's pushback on removing Eli, it is getting to the point that people who defend eli are the ones getting shouted down - and frankly, it is less of a defense of Eli and more that it just doesn't make sense to move him.

I truly believe there are posters who think Eli is the #1 problem on the team. And yet we're told that the take on trading him is rational? It isn't, no matter ho many times people try to post that it is.
FMIC  
Bill2 : 3/10/2018 12:15 pm : link
We both know that 1) being open to trade Eli and 2) trading Eli for a worthwhile return and 3) trading him even if its an option at the right least risky time are all very different things.

Imo, the operative words are not Eli this or Eli that but rather: " being open"
Here's why it makes no sense to cut or trade Eli....  
Britt in VA : 3/10/2018 12:19 pm : link
He's due to make $22 million next year, barring a restructure.

Cutting him would result in a dead cap hit of 12.5 million.

We need a veteran QB on the roster next year. They're not just going to throw a rookie out there, or Davis Webb, week 1. Look around the league.... Look at the QB's making around 10 million per year (the difference between Manning's dead cap hit and actual cap hit).

Mike Glennon, Chicago, $14 million
Jay Cutler, Miami, $10 million
Tyrod Taylor, Buffalo, $9.7 million
Jameis Winston, Tampa Bay, $6.9 million
Marcus Mariota, Tennessee, $6.6 million
Blake Bortles, Jacksonville, $6.57 million
Josh McCown, N.Y. Jets, $6.5 million

So what's a better value to you to start next year?

Eli Manning at 22 million, or one of the above guys as 12.5 million (dead money) plus their salary?

Either way, you're going to have about 20 million in cap space allotted to the starting QB position.

Bang for buck, Eli is more valuable playing for us next year than anything we'd get in return for him, for multiple reasons.
Bill..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/10/2018 12:19 pm : link
completely agree. If a team makes an offer for Eli that is a significant return and the stance is under no conditions should Eli be moved, than that is a very poor stance to take.

We now have weekly trade eli threads that posture he needs to be off the roster for the team to move forward or that a newly drafted QB should come right in (or worse yet, have Webb take over while the new guy gets acclimated). And people call that a rational discussion.
RE: Unfortunately..  
sundayatone : 3/10/2018 12:20 pm : link
In comment 13857570 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
it isn't the potty mouth stuff people should focus on:



Quote:


And enjoy the potty mouth comments coming your way
Jimmy Googs : 3/9/2018 7:50 pm : link : reply
because it means you took the unpopular albeit rational view that sometimes it gets worse before it gets better.



It is the thought that it is a rational decision. We don't gain any equity by getting rid of Eli, especially if the return isn't decent. We actually will have dead money when just a year from now we can trade or release him without a significant cap impact.

Whenever there's pushback on removing Eli, it is getting to the point that people who defend eli are the ones getting shouted down - and frankly, it is less of a defense of Eli and more that it just doesn't make sense to move him.

I truly believe there are posters who think Eli is the #1 problem on the team. And yet we're told that the take on trading him is rational? It isn't, no matter ho many times people try to post that it is.


look who just showed up,the little boy in the eli manning pajamas.
Another  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/10/2018 12:23 pm : link
gem of a post by sundayatone.

If you read my comment and picture me in Manning pajamas, then you match the mental picture I have of you being a fucking ignorant asswipe.

Good job.
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