I have a friend in the business, no direct connection to any one team. It is the same friend that told me about the Solder signing before it happened (Which I posted the signing and number of years before the story broke in the press on this board).
Anyway, he has told me the Browns organization is debating how to best ensure they get both Allen and Barkley. The current thinking is to take Barkley at one knowing the Giants will be forced to pick Darnold and the Jets prefer Rosen, thus ensuring Allen at 4. The only fear is the Jets in this scenario taking Allen.
They are afraid if they leave a choice of Darnold or Barkley to the Giants, they will choose Barkley.
My own opinion here, I could see the Browns inquiring with the Giants about pick 2.
...thanks so much for posting.
I know less than sh**, but I must say that your scenario makes a whole lotta sense!
Thanks again.
I am not sure who JonC's sources are, but they are clearly legit based on history. However, my personal opinion is the Giants board ranking will not matter here. Almost every board out there, professional or amateur have Barkley, Chubb, Nelson as the top 3 players based on grade. When a team is drafting a QB high, those rankings mean less simply due to the shear value of having a good QB. For example, Matt Ryan is a very good QB. He isn't the top guy in the league. Barry Sanders is one of the best backs in NFL history. I guarantee that Barry would have the higher "grade". Matt Ryan is clearly more valuable.
If you look around the sites, Eli is considered a bottom half QB. I have seen him ranked anywhere from 17-25 going into next season. Maybe these rankings are off, but you have to considered our fan bias too. He is 37 years old. How many teams would pass on a QB at the 2 pick when they have a bottom half of the league QB at age 37. It is a HUGE gamble that he will bounce back at this point. Gettleman would be staking his reputation on day 1 that Eli will return to his 2011-2012 form. I am not saying he definitely can't do that...but it just seems like a big risk.
Anyway...these are just my opinions. Hopefully will stimulate discussion.
I am not sure who JonC's sources are, but they are clearly legit based on history. However, my personal opinion is the Giants board ranking will not matter here. Almost every board out there, professional or amateur have Barkley, Chubb, Nelson as the top 3 players based on grade. When a team is drafting a QB high, those rankings mean less simply due to the shear value of having a good QB. For example, Matt Ryan is a very good QB. He isn't the top guy in the league. Barry Sanders is one of the best backs in NFL history. I guarantee that Barry would have the higher "grade". Matt Ryan is clearly more valuable.
If you look around the sites, Eli is considered a bottom half QB. I have seen him ranked anywhere from 17-25 going into next season. Maybe these rankings are off, but you have to considered our fan bias too. He is 37 years old. How many teams would pass on a QB at the 2 pick when they have a bottom half of the league QB at age 37. It is a HUGE gamble that he will bounce back at this point. Gettleman would be staking his reputation on day 1 that Eli will return to his 2011-2012 form. I am not saying he definitely can't do that...but it just seems like a big risk.
Anyway...these are just my opinions. Hopefully will stimulate discussion.
Many good points Jarvis. I would say a decision that high up you can bet ownership will have a big say in it. If you go QB at #2 you are basically saying to Eli this is your last year. A QB you are high on late round 1 (via trade up) or early rounds 2 or even 3 changes the dynamic drastically.
Right or wrong if Giants goals are:
1.Do 'right' (in their eyes) by Eli (after last years debacle) and give him to the end of his contract (which the Giants are big on) . That means 2 years IF he plays well this year under a much better HC/OC combination and improved OL.
2.Do right by Davis Webb who has been the consummate back up the day he stepped into the Giants facility and has busted his butt. A model Qb understudy and exactly the persona the Giants love for their Qb.
3. Take a Qb later in draft so investment is not as high and he can provide competition and insurance for Davis Webb in case he doesnt pan out.
This is well within their M.O. to do this. I am not saying I agree with this per se, but I could totally see Giants ownership doing this type of thing. Eli is like family to them (plus of course he brought 2 Super Bowl rings here). For better or for worse, this is an extremely loyal organization to a fault.
And Denver would be a likely candidate since it seems Elway has a clear QB favorite.
Quote:
Giants will trade down
And Denver would be a likely candidate since it seems Elway has a clear QB favorite.
I doubt this. I’d bet NYG runs to the podium for Darnold and doesn’t look back.
I think they stay and pick Darnold, and the Chubb or Nelson at #4.
I think they stay and pick Darnold, and the Chubb or Nelson at #4.
Agreed. It makes absolutely no sense for the Browns to get their 3rd or 4th choice by going RB at 1 and QB at 4. Smart money is Darnold at 1 and whoever is left of Barkley or Chubb at 4.
Joey, I was thinking about this the other day too. I think they take Barkley # 1. I think if that happens we take Chubb. They get a QB with their other pick then.
I am starting to feel that's how this may play out.
1) Darnold - (Browns Can't take the chance of another guy)
2) Barkley - (Has Giants written all over him)
3) Allen, Rosen or Mayfield - (whoever the Jets have rated higher
4) Chubb (Browns will be thrilled to team Chubb and Garrett and take a RB in the 2nd round)
5) Allen, Rosen or Mayfield
I have no inside info, I just feel this is what is going to happen.
If Giants want only Darnold:
Dorsey: Dave, Johnnie here
Gettle: Johnnie boy
Dorsey: Would you trade your #2 pick for Darnold and a 2nd
Gettle: Make it a 2019 3rd and 5th for Dahhneld
Dorsey: Done
If Giants want only Allen:
Dorsey: Dave, Johnnie here
Gettle: Johnnie boy
Dorsey: Would you trade your #2 pick for Darnold and a 2nd
Gettle: No
Dorsey: OK, thx
Gettle: [gets trade back offers from DEN]
If Giants want only Barkley:
Dorsey: Dave, Johnnie here
Gettle: Johnnie boy
Dorsey: Would you trade your #2 pick for Darnold and a 2nd
Gettle: No
Dorsey: OK, thx
Gettle: [gets trade back offers from DEN]
Pete44 : 11:25 am : link : reply
When all is said and done, the most likely scenario is what we all think will happen:
I haven't seen any consensus on what will happen, let alone a scenario "we all think will happen".
Basically, I won't be surprised at anything on draft night, and that includes trading down and seeing Roger Goodell in a Snow White costume.
1) Darnold - (Browns Can't take the chance of another guy)
2) Barkley - (Has Giants written all over him)
3) Allen, Rosen or Mayfield - (whoever the Jets have rated higher
4) Chubb (Browns will be thrilled to team Chubb and Garrett and take a RB in the 2nd round)
5) Allen, Rosen or Mayfield
I have no inside info, I just feel this is what is going to happen.
Pete, I think this is the most likely (and 'boring' LOL) scenario.
Allen and Barkley or
Darnold and Chubb?
If they take Barkley #1 at least there is some plausible deniability by taking Allen as the third QB
Quote:
I think the Browns are most likely going Darnold. Seems to be a huge risk to take Allen at 1. I think this is hype. I know for a fact the NFL love intrigue at the top due to the fact that the draft is prime time TV on thursday night. That is a huge time slot. They could go Allen..I am just speculating.
I am not sure who JonC's sources are, but they are clearly legit based on history. However, my personal opinion is the Giants board ranking will not matter here. Almost every board out there, professional or amateur have Barkley, Chubb, Nelson as the top 3 players based on grade. When a team is drafting a QB high, those rankings mean less simply due to the shear value of having a good QB. For example, Matt Ryan is a very good QB. He isn't the top guy in the league. Barry Sanders is one of the best backs in NFL history. I guarantee that Barry would have the higher "grade". Matt Ryan is clearly more valuable.
If you look around the sites, Eli is considered a bottom half QB. I have seen him ranked anywhere from 17-25 going into next season. Maybe these rankings are off, but you have to considered our fan bias too. He is 37 years old. How many teams would pass on a QB at the 2 pick when they have a bottom half of the league QB at age 37. It is a HUGE gamble that he will bounce back at this point. Gettleman would be staking his reputation on day 1 that Eli will return to his 2011-2012 form. I am not saying he definitely can't do that...but it just seems like a big risk.
Anyway...these are just my opinions. Hopefully will stimulate discussion.
Many good points Jarvis. I would say a decision that high up you can bet ownership will have a big say in it. If you go QB at #2 you are basically saying to Eli this is your last year. A QB you are high on late round 1 (via trade up) or early rounds 2 or even 3 changes the dynamic drastically.
Right or wrong if Giants goals are:
1.Do 'right' (in their eyes) by Eli (after last years debacle) and give him to the end of his contract (which the Giants are big on) . That means 2 years IF he plays well this year under a much better HC/OC combination and improved OL.
2.Do right by Davis Webb who has been the consummate back up the day he stepped into the Giants facility and has busted his butt. A model Qb understudy and exactly the persona the Giants love for their Qb.
3. Take a Qb later in draft so investment is not as high and he can provide competition and insurance for Davis Webb in case he doesnt pan out.
This is well within their M.O. to do this. I am not saying I agree with this per se, but I could totally see Giants ownership doing this type of thing. Eli is like family to them (plus of course he brought 2 Super Bowl rings here). For better or for worse, this is an extremely loyal organization to a fault.
Hasn't Eli said that he would be ok with the Giants drafting a QB? Of course that could just be lip service, but I thought he publicly said that, or at least Gettleman said that he said that?