All you "Draft QB at #2" guys put it in writing. You are all writing Eli off for dead - or, at most, giving him a one year pity fuck.
I say Eli has 3 years of productive football left in him. I say our future franchise QB will still be playing college football next year, if not already on the roster. I say we draft Saquon Barkley to give Eli some F'n help and extend his career.
Put it down in writing, right now, if you have the guts. Giants34 (Greg) already has from another thread.
In summary I think the smartest thing to do is draft and work towards a future without Eli, not go all in to win with Eli short term. In that sense I am quitting on him. Thanks for the memories E.
Getting a QB now gets him cost controlled. You can get OBJ his much needed and deserved deal, with that cap space.
If OBJ doesn't work out you can jettison him by the time you have actually pay the QB.
Also, I don't like overpaying an RB. Any RB is basically 1 play away from having his career be over.
Sure Eli could play 3 more years, but milking every last ounce of football out of players is why we got into this current roster mess. It's better to part ways sooner rather then later.
Get a run game, shore up the O-line, solidify the D.Z
I give us a shot.
Documented.
But I want Sam Darnold. I want a future.
Am I quitting on Eli? No. But I want Darnold as a Giant for next 10-15 years.
But I want Sam Darnold. I want a future.
Am I quitting on Eli? No. But I want Darnold as a Giant for next 10-15 years.
Exactly where I am...............only replace Darnold with anyone candidate that can give us 10-15.......
It is likely that Eli will not be the Giants QB in three years.
As others have noted there needs to be a succession plan in place.
I think that there is a whole generation of Giant fans who do not know what it is like not to have an Eli Manning.
It really sucks.
Umm, ok.
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
Jesus Christ.
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
Hahahaha I love this post!
But I want Sam Darnold. I want a future.
Am I quitting on Eli? No. But I want Darnold as a Giant for next 10-15 years.
This pretty much sums my feelings up as well.
But there are a few posters on here that are so blinded by their love of Eli, it's either you're with him or against him. Count the OP and a few others that actually gave this thread legitimacy with a response acknowledging the same (see Britt's post and others etc).
Jesus Christ.
No, you're saying it's over and you're willing to go into rebuild mode right now.
What if Eli plays lights out behind Solder and Barkley? You still want to throw him away like yesterday's garbage? Or will you want Eli for yet another year, while our shiny brand new #2 pick rots on the bench?
Its not about getting Eli Manning his 3rd SB ring its about getting the Giants their 5th ring.
Drafting a QB at 2 is not about quitting on Eli and you dont draft Saquon to give Eli another chance at a ring.
You have got it all backwards.
The statistical difference between Webb and this years crop is minimal. Put Webb in every pre season snap , see if he can play.
The Giants are going to be drafting in the bottom 1/3 next year. That gives the Eli/Webb experiment a season and half to work self out.
There will be "franchise" QB's in next year and every years draft.If you have a superior OL and DL a slightly above average QB works fine.
Remember ELI has never been seen as a top 10 QB. You might say the epitome of a slightly above average QB
This is not a one year fix.
To the OP - you may want to take some time away from sports and focus on some other interests and get some perspective.
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Giving up on Eli and wanting them to draft a QB at 2 can be 2 completely different things.
Jesus Christ.
No, you're saying it's over and you're willing to go into rebuild mode right now.
What if Eli plays lights out behind Solder and Barkley? You still want to throw him away like yesterday's garbage? Or will you want Eli for yet another year, while our shiny brand new #2 pick rots on the bench?
If Eli plays lights out with Saquon Barkley, that means there wont be a shiny #2 pick rotting on the bench.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
There's no way we can tell if he's actually done or not.
From my perspective he's proven he's still able to read defenses and make some pretty amazing throws, so I'm signed on for taking Barkley, taking two OL in rounds 2 and 3, hell even cutting Marshall and signing Dez Bryant. I am all for doubling down on our 2-time super bowl MVP Iron Man of a quarterback. I think his pedigree has earned him one last shot at taking this team to the Promised Land one last time.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
Couldn't have presented it better. I'm skeptical the OP and others here can process this information clearly, however.
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
Great post pj
Listen, call it whatever you want, but rational fans realize drafting a qb doesn't mean you've given up on him, it means you realize what he is.
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Why are so many people here utterly incapable of separating two separate schools of thought? It fucking blows my mind.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
Couldn't have presented it better. I'm skeptical the OP and others here can process this information clearly, however.
You don't read my posts. If you did, you'd know that I'm fine with taking a QB at two, just as arc said.
I just believe Eli has more left in the tank as well, but am fine planning for the future.
You've been the one backtracking all season, and unlike you, if we don't take a QB at 2 next week, I won't have to do a massive about face.
Link - ( New Window )
+1...,except I say 6-7.
Second, I can only go by what management and the coaching staff feels. He was awful last year but played in a horrible system and had no talent around him. If they think last year was an outlier and he's got more left then I'd be good with drafting SB or trading down. If they think he's done or they're going to jettison him regardless of how he plays next year then they will hopefully draft a QB and prepare for the future.
The fundamental question is: can this team win a Super Bowl in the next two years? Any answer other than an emphatic "YES!" and we should be looking for his replacement immediately.
These are the cold facts in a world where the salary cap and time govern decision making.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
+1.
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In comment 13920856 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Why are so many people here utterly incapable of separating two separate schools of thought? It fucking blows my mind.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
Couldn't have presented it better. I'm skeptical the OP and others here can process this information clearly, however.
You don't read my posts. If you did, you'd know that I'm fine with taking a QB at two, just as arc said.
I just believe Eli has more left in the tank as well, but am fine planning for the future.
You've been the one backtracking all season, and unlike you, if we don't take a QB at 2 next week, I won't have to do a massive about face.
Britt, you've already responded giving credence to the stupid OP that it's "well documented" on both sides. As far as me, what, did I have an in season meltdown during a game that Eli is done? So i'm backtracking off an emotional post? You're the king of that over the years. And as far as the draft, i've been consistent (Not that it matters). Darnold if he's there, Barkley if he isn't. So i'm not QB or bust.
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
also this
And my opinion has been most in line with the Giants actions, subsequently, also.
This thread sucks.
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In comment 13920864 Danny Kanell said:
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In comment 13920856 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Why are so many people here utterly incapable of separating two separate schools of thought? It fucking blows my mind.
Believe it or not, you actually CAN want the Giants to draft a QB without it having to be some major indictment on Eli.
Here are facts...
Eli is 37 years old. He has not played all that well the past two seasons. Especially last year.
We are picking 2nd in what is considered to be one of the strongest QB drafts in recent memory.
However, it's also fair to point out how poor Eli's protection and supporting casts have been (especially with Beckham on the shelf)
I love Eli Manning. He's one of the greatest athletes I have ever had the pleasure of rooting for.
But I'm also not going to let that blind me or look the other way regarding his recent performance. Poor cast or not, he hasn't been good. And it's not out of the realm of possibilities that he might be close to the end.
A lot of people here don't want to believe that and are letting that mindset carry them into all sorts of irrational places regarding this draft.
Thinking the Giants should strongly consider a QB doesn't = "quitting on Eli" - and it's stupid that things always have to be so fucking black and white here.
I'm a huge Eli Manning fan who would love to see him give us one more run before it's over - I also realize that's unlikely and recognize that we have an opportunity here to draft a great successor.
It's really as simple as that.
Couldn't have presented it better. I'm skeptical the OP and others here can process this information clearly, however.
You don't read my posts. If you did, you'd know that I'm fine with taking a QB at two, just as arc said.
I just believe Eli has more left in the tank as well, but am fine planning for the future.
You've been the one backtracking all season, and unlike you, if we don't take a QB at 2 next week, I won't have to do a massive about face.
Britt, you've already responded giving credence to the stupid OP that it's "well documented" on both sides. As far as me, what, did I have an in season meltdown during a game that Eli is done? So i'm backtracking off an emotional post? You're the king of that over the years. And as far as the draft, i've been consistent (Not that it matters). Darnold if he's there, Barkley if he isn't. So i'm not QB or bust.
All I said was that people's opinions are well documented. This topic has been beaten to death. It's pretty god damned clear where people stand, agree?
All we can do now is wait and let it watch out, agree?
If you agree with both of those things, you agree with my (up to this point until you called me out) point in this thread.
This thread sucks.
Check the date, junior:
Britt in VA : 11/26/2017 8:17 pm : link
Here's how it's going to go.
Eli's replacement is drafted in Round 1 this year IF, and this is a big IF, they are in position to draft somebody they covet.
Davis Webb and new Quarterback duel it out for #2 in camp.
Eli starts the season, and depending on how it goes, he continues to play if they're winning or contributing.
One of two things happen, the Giants have a successful season which results in Eli starting the following season in his final year in his deal and whatever happens happens? Or they struggle and the new coach decides mid season that it's time to make the transition and they do it, ala Warner to Eli.
I know it's hard for people to wrap their heads around, but here's what's NOT going to happen:
Davis Webb will not start any game this season. His best case scenario is to be elevated to number 2 and come in the 2nd half of games to get some time.
Eli will not be cut or traded in the offseason.
Eli will not be a pay cut. I could see him restructuring if he works out an agreement that he will be allowed to play out his contract and retire gracefully, but who knows....
I've been consistent with that train of thought since then.
November 2017 - ( New Window )
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girl way to put it. "Who's quitting on Eli"?
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
also this
keep just lurking
Eli is at the end of a Great career. Maybe he has 1 year left, maybe 2 and an outside chance at 3. I happen to believe that his best days are behind him and he is in decline. Everyone faces the age factor and some at different ages. I dont see the same player from a few years back. He is not the player that led us to the Superbowl. It has pretty much been 6 years since this team was competitive.
It's time for the next chapter. Plenty of great QBs have gone on to teams that are considered a contender and have had success, if Eli wants to continue after this season I think he has a right to do that but this should be his last season if the Giants draft a QB. If we somehow decide not draft a QB I think its a mistake and if the GM is right about Eli we will be in a worse position to draft a QB. The Giants are not and should not be looking at this current roster as a Superbowl contender one or 2 players away. the team was a disaster last year, we have improved some areas and downgraded in others especially at CB.
Start the future regime, draft a QB and let Eli have his swan song. If somehow he puts together a great season and we are a strong playoff contender you can keep him another year. I just don't see that scenario and we are looking at a 6-8 win season. if we draft a QB and have a 6-8 win season Eli rides nicely off to the sunset. If we dont draft a QB and we have a 6-8 win season Eli, the coaches and GM will get roasted with the woulda,coulda shouldas because at least one of the QBs will be good enough.
Ok DK, take a breath
:::Attack the post, not the poster:::
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Here is where Eli is - he's got even less mobility than ever, has happier feet than ever, still makes panicked decisions when the pocket collapses, and has never had a howitzer. Other than that, he's terrific.
Will he pull a game or two out of his arse now and again? Absolutely. And that will be the fuel the Eli is God Club needs to keep hope alive.
I have been all in for blowing the team up and trusting the process. Instead, we are postponing the inevitable with the hope that Eli will make another deal with the football devil and we make some inexplicable run through the playoffs. I really can't think of a dumber plan...
It was a disgusting display by the organization. How could you not get upset? If they go with QB next week, so be it. I'm fine with closing the chapter on Eli that way, but to bench him for Geno was pathetic.
I'm starting to get embarrassed for you. Do you really not understand the difference between actions taken in a work environment and fans opinions on an internet message board?
Nothing on this thread matters at all. No fans opinions of Eli matter. Eli is not worried about whether or not people believe in you. Whatever happens, he will be fine.
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In comment 13920805 pjcas18 said:
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girl way to put it. "Who's quitting on Eli"?
WTF.
And wanting it documented like it has some importance or consequence.
who the fuck are you? "I want it documented" - ok chief, we'll document it for you.
It's football, QB's rarely perform at an elite (or even high) level at Eli's age or beyond.
In sports it's better to replace someone a year too early than a year too late - especially your high dollar assets.
He's got 2 years left on his contract extending him beyond then probably guarantees the latter in my statement above this.
You should think about removing the emotional attachment to a 37 year old man.
also this
keep just lurking
Doubling down on the maturity - nice job.
2? You never liked him and gave up on him before 2007. haha
What people should all quit on is the sentimental influence on your football opinions.
Pff... I did this a LONG time ago.
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Put it down in writing, right now, if you have the guts.
Pff... I did this a LONG time ago.
Nobody has ever quit on you!!!
Only cause no one ever believed in you either.
See how much I have grown. Even I laughed at this one.
The 2nd daughter has made me a better man.
Well put. I was thinking more of beer muscle syndrome. Yours is much funnier :-)
Quote:
In comment 13920988 Brown Recluse said:
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Put it down in writing, right now, if you have the guts.
Pff... I did this a LONG time ago.
Nobody has ever quit on you!!!
Only cause no one ever believed in you either.
Not even remotely true. You've been a believer since day one and you know it.
Nothing surprising here.
Nothing surprising here.
Yeah, this was really going to go far when you proclaimed that people just want to give Eli a "one year pity fuck"
Some riveting analysis there.
Trash usually gets met with trash.
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of some posters. The usual suspects.
Nothing surprising here.
Yeah, this was really going to go far when you proclaimed that people just want to give Eli a "one year pity fuck"
Some riveting analysis there.
Trash usually gets met with trash.
Wait, am I an Eli basher suspect now since I yhink this thread is silly!
Always time for a first.
Looking forward to your next wonderfully useless contribution to BBI.
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In comment 13921050 SHO'NUFF said:
Quote:
of some posters. The usual suspects.
Nothing surprising here.
Yeah, this was really going to go far when you proclaimed that people just want to give Eli a "one year pity fuck"
Some riveting analysis there.
Trash usually gets met with trash.
Wait, am I an Eli basher suspect now since I yhink this thread is silly!
Always time for a first.
ARE YOU QUITTING ON HIM OR NOT?
I NEED IT IN WRITING. NOW. ON RECORD.
You are a combative imbecile. That's a bad combination.
If your definition of quitting on Eli is caring about the future of the franchise at the most important position in sports then you're damn right I'm quitting on Eli.
That's been well-documented numerous times already..
Nothing surprising here.
Ur mom?
Agree. I think he has a lot of good football left in the tank.
If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
To what extent? I don't think he's done. I also don't think he should have any years added to his contract.
Quote:
Believe eli will prove many on this site wrong.
Agree. I think he has a lot of good football left in the tank.
If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
KW was 32 when St. Louis jettisoned him.
If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
What kind of pick would you get for Wentz, Goff, Luck, Cam, Ryan, Rodgers, Wilson, maybe even Cousins? I think Eli only has value to Giants fans right now. And it's purely sentimental value.
Problem is too many posters cannot separate the want of reasonable fans to seize on a rare opportunity to succeed Eli and he fact that they aren't necessarily giving up on Eli. They just realize that Eli is a 20m game manager at best and there is an opportunity to set the giants up for the long haul.
What kind of pick would you get for Wentz, Goff, Luck, Cam, Ryan, Rodgers, Wilson, maybe even Cousins? I think Eli only has value to Giants fans right now. And it's purely sentimental value.
Problem is too many posters cannot separate the want of reasonable fans to seize on a rare opportunity to succeed Eli and he fact that they aren't necessarily giving up on Eli. They just realize that Eli is a 20m game manager at best and there is an opportunity to set the giants up for the long haul.
Objectively? Zero. Because he has a no trade clause.
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Objectively tell me what Eli Manning trade value is right now? Would you get more for second pick than for Eli? Would Buffalo give you 3 first round picks for Eli right now?
What kind of pick would you get for Wentz, Goff, Luck, Cam, Ryan, Rodgers, Wilson, maybe even Cousins? I think Eli only has value to Giants fans right now. And it's purely sentimental value.
Problem is too many posters cannot separate the want of reasonable fans to seize on a rare opportunity to succeed Eli and he fact that they aren't necessarily giving up on Eli. They just realize that Eli is a 20m game manager at best and there is an opportunity to set the giants up for the long haul.
Objectively? Zero. Because he has a no trade clause.
Tricky tricky, I see what you did there. When was the last time a no trade clause stopped a team from inquiring and offering value? You won't answer the question because you and I both know the answer regarding his value.
Of course, for a no trade clause to be exercised a team and the Giants would need to agree on principle in a trade. Then Eli would need to decline.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
protection to function at a high level, and that won't be available next year. Time for a fresh, new young QB to take over for Eli. Someone who's not afraid to hang in the pocket when the heat is on or take off and scramble for a first down when need be.
Eli was great. Time to move on.
Ps if Acorsi says the Giants have at least two more good years out of Eli, then depend upon it... they are going QB at #2.
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In comment 13921273 Britt in VA said:
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
I think it matters if for no other reason than it is one of the few ways that everyone can stay grounded regarding what Eli is as a player at this point. Certainly if there were reports swirling all winter that other teams were very interested in Eli (as there clearly were for Beckham), those who are adamant about not "quitting" on Eli would be using that as support for their position that Eli still has good years left. So why is the apparent absence of interest any less valid support for those who believe he's probably done?
Also, when you talk about his "value to the Giants," unless you are referring to some unique offensive scheme they run particularly suited to Eli's skills, which I do not believe to be the case, then I can only assume you are referring to some sort of sentimental value. I think that should not matter at all, especially when it comes to what the Giants decide to do with the second pick.
One more ring!
Eli Manning is finished as a starting NFL QB. He has been deteriorating for two, maybe three years. Of course, the cast of characters throws a spotlight on and highlights his preexisting weaknesses - immobile, below average avoiding the sack, happy feet, misses high a lot.
Don't get me wrong. I go back to 1956, to Charley Conerly, to Y.A. Tittle. Eli was good, just sub-elite. The two championships were great.
But it's over and it has been over for a while.
If Webb is not starting by week six-eight I will be very surprised. And if I'm wrong you can come back and rag on me right here.
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In comment 13921273 Britt in VA said:
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They have committed to him. That's reality my friend.
How they move forward is up for discussion, but Eli Manning is the guy for the start of the 2018 season.
I think you are being far too literal. The point is that if other teams are not willing to trade valuable assets to have Eli Manning be their quarterback, what does that say about the value of Eli Manning as a starting quarterback in the league? The Giants are holding an overpriced, rapidly depreciating asset whose value increasingly seems to be sentimental. Fine, he will be the quarterback to start 2018. However, I believe lax's point is that the continued presence of Eli Manning on the roster should not stand in the way of the team taking any of these quarterbacks, all of whom at this point are more valuable assets than Eli Manning.
It doesn't matter what the hypothetical value of a hypothetical trade is. And it says NOTHING about Eli's value to the Giants, which is all that matters.
Of course it matters, value is what you are willing to pay for something. Of course Eli has value to the Giants, but it is increasingly sentimental.
I'll ask you this question again, if the Giants go 7-9 or 8-8 next year and the year after, featuring another Eli medicore season, are you going to consider that a comeback and use that as evidentiary support that Eli rebounded? What should my expectation be, I am willing to adjustment my realm of thinking? What I'm hearing from the Eli has years left crowd is that I should expect him to lead us to a super bowl over the next two seasons. In order to accomplish that, Eli is going to need to play at a super bowl level for an entire season. He simply cannot be a bystander on a ride to the SB. So should that be my expectation? I have very little interest in personal success, but it's hard not to tie Eli's success to that of the team.
So is 7-9 or 8-8 or even 9-7 good enough for you? Because now we've taken ourselves out of the running for a blue chip qb prospect, in what will be weak qb drafts anyway, and passed on a blue chip prospect in 2018 because Eli has years left.
"I am Eli Manning"
"I am Eli Manning"
Will the REAL Eli Manning please stand up?
That is the question.....
Because of the injuries, the OL, and the system Eli played under these last two seasons, I have no idea of how good or how bad he actually is....
Anyone just looking at stats, is just crazy......Eli is getting older.....he will never be the Eli of 2011 ever again....I have seen him go down because he senses something that isn't there......The pounding he has taken over these last 7 seasons, because we failed to put an OL in front of him, has taken it's toll.....I don't see this OL being fixed in one season.....can it be better? How can it not be? But will it be enough, to give Eli the confidence to hang in there to complete a throw.....no one has a crystal ball that can predict that......
I would like to think, if this line can protect him better, if it can start to convert 3rd and short runs, if it can finally learn to run a screen play, if OBj can still be the pre injury OBj, if SS and EE can take that next step, and if we can find a RB that can be a starter and carry the load, and another WR to compliment the rest of the offense, then there are no more excuses for Eli......he either performs like we hope he can, or else the spiral will continue.....
I want him to have another shot with a decent offense.....if he doesn't pan out, so be it......but we also have to have a backup plan in case this doesn't go as expected....at #2, you take a QB, if you think he is the guy of the future......if he isn't you don't......there are multiple ways this can go, but just about every scenario has been already posted......the day of the draft can't come soon enough....
I don’t get the debate. Seems everyone I talk to and debate the pick inevitably goes back to Eli and what he has left. Eli shouldnt be a factor. Period. He’s 37 and coming off an unproductive season. Yes we can win with him. But he’s 37. 37!!!!
Scout the qb. Vet the qb. If you love the qb you take the qb. Period.
Eli may not be THE PROBLEM the last two years but he sure as hell wasnt the solution either.
Don’t be stupid or loyal here. Think damnit.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
And since this years draftable QBs suck, let’s help him out!!
With a new system, 4-5 new starters on the line or in different positions, a new no. 2 WR, coming off a year where he struggled to hold onto the ball, struggled with accuracy on short throws, struggled with zip on throws outside of the hashes, Manning playing championship-type football would be a miracle.
And after the cryfest last year from the player and the fans when he was asked to put the future well being of the organization ahead of his pride, I seriously doubt it will go well if the tides turn and he's asked to what was done for him in 2004.
And that time is now over. Eli is not going to provide us sufficient quality QB play or be a consistent winner for this team much longer, it at all.
The Giants need to draft a QB with the #2 pick and then they need to give him a real chance to win the job as soon as possible, whether Eli is still around or not.
Otherwise, the Giants are quitting on us...
So I am not giving up!! Never!!
Here is where Eli is - he's got even less mobility than ever, has happier feet than ever, still makes panicked decisions when the pocket collapses, and has never had a howitzer. Other than that, he's terrific.
Will he pull a game or two out of his arse now and again? Absolutely. And that will be the fuel the Eli is God Club needs to keep hope alive.
I have been all in for blowing the team up and trusting the process. Instead, we are postponing the inevitable with the hope that Eli will make another deal with the football devil and we make some inexplicable run through the playoffs. I really can't think of a dumber plan...
You realize you’re blasting the team for something they haven’t done yet.
Rosen will start less than 50 games in his career.
As it's always been
Not really. Most on this board place enough caveats on their posts that they never portray a true conviction one way or another.
The true minority position is either scolded or disregarded...
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
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In comment 13921157 WillVAB said:
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
To be fair, he was 33 when he was on the Giants and retired at 38. Eli is 37 now. So it isn't apples to apples. Although perhaps Eli's lack of injuries would allow him to go on longer.
I love Eli to fucking death, I grew up watching him play from 14 to 29.
But father time catches everyone. This is what's best for the franchise, and I'll always root for Eli regardless. He has nothing left to prove to me.
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I have no idea what he has left, playing behind our horrible OL leaves me in a position where I can't even speculate.
I believes he deserves a chance to prove he still has it. But will our OL perform well enough in 2018 for him to have a real opportunity? Right now I have my doubts.
Well you did think RG3 was going to be a stud and that he was built well to take the NFL pounding and you were wrong then. NO reason to think you suddenly reverse course and start getting anything right.
Huh?
I have never posted anything about RGIII.
But since you ask, no I am not a big fan of running QBs. QBs that can move and extend plays, sure, not running QBs.
You seem to think I am somebody... I'm not sure who...
I told you I have not posted for a number of years. Before that I was never the prolific poster that many of you are.
There is one thread that some long time BBIers might remember me from. And this should come as no shock as to the topic. People were posting how upset they were about Financial Crisis/Bailout. I spent time on the thread explaining why it was necessary and why "Too Big To Fail" mattered. I went on to explain the mechanism by which we got in trouble, and how it caused the money systems to freeze up. Why the Gov't had to step in. I also said on that thread that the US Gov't would make a ton of money out of the deal. Its too bad the archives don't go back that far.
Middle school? I thought this was pre-k.
Some teams take decades to find a quality starting QB. I believe the NYG are in a unique place in the draft to take a QB in which teams would give up 4-5 premium picks to be in.
I snag the QB and "quit" on Eli a year or two early than a year too late which may have us scrambling for years and years to find his replacement.
Do I think he can play after this season? probably. But as much as he is my favorite athlete I have ever rooted for, I believe the name on the front of the Jersey is more important than the name on the back of the Jersey and having a succession plan for the QB position is more important than just about anything at this point, IMO.
That might not be worth as much as you think.
What about dull knives?
Lol yeah look at the 4/20 thread
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In comment 13921157 WillVAB said:
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If they run Eli out of town it will be like when the Rams ran Kurt Warner out of town.
There were a handful of years between Kurt Warner's last run as a Ram and him becoming a good player again in Arizona. That's half the reason the Giants were able to sign him for Eli's rookie year. Nobody wanted him.
Try one year.
Nobody wanted him because he had some injuries, was getting old, and his numbers dropped. The stat dorks looked at the numbers just like they’ve been doing with Eli.
It’s a team game. Warner goes to Zona with some nice pieces and ends up solidifying a HoF career. The same could happen w Eli if DG builds a better roster than Reese.
Maybe instead of trying to make fun of "stat dorks" you could benefit from actual information. Kurt Warner did nothing from 2005 to 2007. Unless you want to tell me he passed your "eye test" with 17 touchdowns and 14 INT in 15 starts.