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Have to give it to TC...

Zepp : 4/28/2018 8:09 am
He is building an absolutely awesome roster in Jacksonville. I felt at the time that we fired the wrong guy a couple of years back. TC just downright knows football and Mara knew it when he said he hated letting all that knowledge leave the building. But whatever its history.

Jacksonville is gonna be good for a while and they’re gonna be nasty.

Hats off TC.
Hes not the GM.  
Brown Recluse : 4/28/2018 8:11 am : link
.
The defensive additions to that already dominant defense  
Diver_Down : 4/28/2018 8:13 am : link
is scary. Snagged a tall receiver, also. But the defensive side of the ball - look out.
I think TC & Gettleman have similar philosophies..  
Sean : 4/28/2018 8:13 am : link
TC & Reese never seemed in sync.
RE: Hes not the GM.  
Diver_Down : 4/28/2018 8:14 am : link
In comment 13942289 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
.


You are absolutely correct. The GM, Caldwell, does Tom's bidding. Tom runs the football operations.
RE: Hes not the GM.  
TrueBlue56 : 4/28/2018 8:16 am : link
In comment 13942289 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
.


Not in title, but if you don't think his handprint isn't all over that team, then I don't know what to tell you.

It's funny how the jaguars team when Coughlin was first brought in, the giants and now current jaguars all have similar staples...strong offensive line, running game and pass rushers

But he isn't the GM

...  
christian : 4/28/2018 8:18 am : link
The vast majority of talent on that team preceeded Coughlin and was the result of years of drafting at the top because they were awful.
So basically coughlin does nothing at his  
bradshaw44 : 4/28/2018 8:21 am : link
Office in Jax. The detractors literally can’t give him an ounce of credit. The guy is having a real affect on the organization and team. And you better believe he’s got input on that roster. Whether you like it or not.
Do the Giants still let him into  
Jimmy Googs : 4/28/2018 8:23 am : link
our gym facility to work out?
That is why  
PaulN : 4/28/2018 8:24 am : link
When Coughlin left and Reese was in total; command we went to shit. Wellington Mara used to say that he was okay if the head coach and GM didn't always see things the same way all the time in fact he thought that EA and Fassel thought too much alike and when he brought in Coughlin EA was not comfortable, but they worked well together, I thought Tom and Reese worked well together, but I think over time the thinking of Tom getting too old gave Reese more power and that is when it all went down the tubes.
What could have been...  
nzyme : 4/28/2018 8:25 am : link
If TC had Gettleman Manning would probably already have a 3rd ring!
Picking Ronnie Harrison  
Diver_Down : 4/28/2018 8:26 am : link
to add to the secondary has to be steal. I'm surprised he slipped to the Jags. While they don't need him in that secondary, it is a matter of the rich getting richer.
I'm surprised  
mittenedman : 4/28/2018 8:29 am : link
the Jags passed on Hernandez at the end of the 1st. The Giants were worried.
Did Jax take a QB yet?  
robbieballs2003 : 4/28/2018 8:29 am : link
If not that might likely be a target. They need better OL play and better QB play but that team is pretty stacked everywhere else.
He runs the Jags  
Oscar : 4/28/2018 8:30 am : link
I doubt the GM is allowed to decide what to have for breakfast in the morning without Coughlin’s sign off.
...  
christian : 4/28/2018 8:32 am : link
I think how events unfolded after Coughlin left show Mara would have preferred him stay and go upstairs.

Mara has wanted this to end well for everyone, he's been falling on his face for 3 straight years because of it. Hopefully this dorky cycle of striving for continuity and not hurting feelings is over.

Good for Tom, he's a good football guy. He also stepped into a situation with tons of cap room and a bunch of highly drafted players from years of being awful.
RE: ...  
Big Rick in FL : 4/28/2018 8:33 am : link
In comment 13942303 christian said:
Quote:
The vast majority of talent on that team preceeded Coughlin and was the result of years of drafting at the top because they were awful.


Yup! Only team in NFL history to pick top 5 for 5 consecutive years. Coughlin has very little to do with the success of the Jaguars last year or even this year. The majority of the talent was already in place. The credit needs to go to Doug Marrone. He's a great coach and it constantly gets overlooked.
RE: That is why  
St. Jimmy : 4/28/2018 8:43 am : link
In comment 13942314 PaulN said:
Quote:
When Coughlin left and Reese was in total; command we went to shit. Wellington Mara used to say that he was okay if the head coach and GM didn't always see things the same way all the time in fact he thought that EA and Fassel thought too much alike and when he brought in Coughlin EA was not comfortable, but they worked well together, I thought Tom and Reese worked well together, but I think over time the thinking of Tom getting too old gave Reese more power and that is when it all went down the tubes.
The team went to shit long before Coughlin left. I'd say the middle of the 2012 season.
Jacksonville a laughingstock when TC not there  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 4/28/2018 8:43 am : link
Lol nobody weasel coach Marrone.
No bigger fan of Coughlin  
RetroJint : 4/28/2018 8:47 am : link
than me, and I weep at the thought of what might have been had he also been Giants GM. However, the Bryan choice seems redundant . He already has a ton of money invested in the middle of the defensive line. I understand that metrics analysis of Bryan place him as one of the best athletes in the draft . And Harrison and Chark, relative to where they were drafted , along with Gesicki, who went to Miami , are the steals of the first two days of this thing .

But Puz retired . They need a backer who can honk it up out there against the run. Mack and Smith are insanely fast , but they are still vulnerable to straight ahead, Bogart runs . The inside guys didn’t match their value board relative to their slot , I guess .

This is Coughlin’s team . Last season Marrone remarked that he spent more time with Tom than he did his wife . Tom regrets his inability to communicate with his staff from the booth upstairs . That’s about as hands on as it gets . But Marrone & Caldwell are smart enough to welcome TC’s vast knowledge of the game . The Giants weren’t . The solution was right in front of their faces . Ownership didn’t have the balls to execute it .
RE: Jacksonville a laughingstock when TC not there  
Big Rick in FL : 4/28/2018 8:48 am : link
In comment 13942339 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Lol nobody weasel coach Marrone.


What the fuck are you trying to say?
Jacksonville was focused on rebuilding the defense  
I Love Clams Casino : 4/28/2018 9:07 am : link
Way before Tom Coughlin arrived there
Jacksonville has been building  
Rflairr : 4/28/2018 9:26 am : link
That roster way before Tom got there. They can’t but do it with all those high picks
RE: No bigger fan of Coughlin  
Diver_Down : 4/28/2018 9:45 am : link
In comment 13942345 RetroJint said:
Quote:
than me, and I weep at the thought of what might have been had he also been Giants GM. However, the Bryan choice seems redundant . He already has a ton of money invested in the middle of the defensive line. I understand that metrics analysis of Bryan place him as one of the best athletes in the draft . And Harrison and Chark, relative to where they were drafted , along with Gesicki, who went to Miami , are the steals of the first two days of this thing .

But Puz retired . They need a backer who can honk it up out there against the run. Mack and Smith are insanely fast , but they are still vulnerable to straight ahead, Bogart runs . The inside guys didn’t match their value board relative to their slot , I guess .

This is Coughlin’s team . Last season Marrone remarked that he spent more time with Tom than he did his wife . Tom regrets his inability to communicate with his staff from the booth upstairs . That’s about as hands on as it gets . But Marrone & Caldwell are smart enough to welcome TC’s vast knowledge of the game . The Giants weren’t . The solution was right in front of their faces . Ownership didn’t have the balls to execute it .


I look at the Bryant and Harrison picks as luxury items that will pay off next year. Malik Jackson and Barry Church can be cap casualties as they dump a pile of cash in Ramsey's lap. Bryant and Harrison can serve as rotation guys this year and take over the starting roles next year without the defense missing a beat.
RE: No bigger fan of Coughlin  
Mike in NY : 4/28/2018 9:49 am : link
In comment 13942345 RetroJint said:
Quote:
than me, and I weep at the thought of what might have been had he also been Giants GM. However, the Bryan choice seems redundant . He already has a ton of money invested in the middle of the defensive line. I understand that metrics analysis of Bryan place him as one of the best athletes in the draft . And Harrison and Chark, relative to where they were drafted , along with Gesicki, who went to Miami , are the steals of the first two days of this thing .

But Puz retired . They need a backer who can honk it up out there against the run. Mack and Smith are insanely fast , but they are still vulnerable to straight ahead, Bogart runs . The inside guys didn’t match their value board relative to their slot , I guess .

This is Coughlin’s team . Last season Marrone remarked that he spent more time with Tom than he did his wife . Tom regrets his inability to communicate with his staff from the booth upstairs . That’s about as hands on as it gets . But Marrone & Caldwell are smart enough to welcome TC’s vast knowledge of the game . The Giants weren’t . The solution was right in front of their faces . Ownership didn’t have the balls to execute it .


Tom Coughlin needed to step away from coaching. It was clear that his message was no longer getting through. Now if only we had gone with a better coach than McAdoo it probably would have worked. I don’t think Marrone would have had the same success here because he is too similar to Coughlin.
Haters gonna Hate  
NNJ Tom : 4/28/2018 9:53 am : link
Good for Coach. He deserves all the success he earns. If the Giants don't win the Superbowl, I will be routing for Jacksonville.

RE: Jacksonville has been building  
HomerJones45 : 4/28/2018 10:05 am : link
In comment 13942406 Rflairr said:
Quote:
That roster way before Tom got there. They can’t but do it with all those high picks
Haters going to hate. The 5 years before TC got there and hired Marrone: 3-13, 5-11, 3-3, 4-12, 2-14. Yep, awesome and obvious accumulation of talent there as they managed 1 more win than when they started the rebuild. Hilariously, this is where our now departed GM scouted for linebacker talent. Idiot.

Khan knew what he was doing when he suggested to TC that he run the whole thing and then backed away and let him do it.

Laurel and Hardy in the owners' box didn't. They fucked up big time. Let's see if DG can navigate around Jawn's need to stick his nose into football operations. Frankly, the draft is an indication that he can't but will see. Let's hope Barkley is all that and the bag of chips his fervent admirers believe he is and pray for Eli's continued good health.
Zepp agree 100%  
JerrysKids : 4/28/2018 10:18 am : link
Tom should have never been forced out, he is a great football man. He is a gem, Jacksonville is going to be a force to be reckoned with.
you are forgetting a huge point  
giantfan2000 : 4/28/2018 10:32 am : link
TC was kicked up stairs at Jacksonville and became Executive Vice President of Football Operations

Gee the Giants could have done the EXACT same thing but we already have a Senior Vice President, Player Personnel.
An Executive who probably was partially responsible for many of the horrible decisions Giants have made the past few years

CHRIS MARA

so don't blame Reese for this

blame Nepotism
Giants definitely made a mistake with Coughlin  
ghost718 : 4/28/2018 10:42 am : link
That's all there is to it.
RE: What could have been...  
old man : 4/28/2018 10:45 am : link
In comment 13942315 nzyme said:
Quote:
If TC had Gettleman Manning would probably already have a 3rd ring!


Or more. '08 - we'd had more @WR than plax, in '10 our ST would have had a real punter, or at least better pursuers than our miss and watch huge on DJs romp to the EZ, and DG would NOT let that OL get bad enough to collapse the last 1/2 of '12, nor would the last 5 seasons have happened.
RE: Giants definitely made a mistake with Coughlin  
Mike Graves : 4/28/2018 10:47 am : link
In comment 13942546 ghost718 said:
Quote:
That's all there is to it.



how?? The only mistake was hiring McAdoo when we let coughlin go after missing the playoffs 4 straight year sand 3 losing seasons in a row
RE: RE: Jacksonville has been building  
Rflairr : 4/28/2018 10:51 am : link
In comment 13942475 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
In comment 13942406 Rflairr said:


Quote:


That roster way before Tom got there. They can’t but do it with all those high picks

Haters going to hate. The 5 years before TC got there and hired Marrone: 3-13, 5-11, 3-3, 4-12, 2-14. Yep, awesome and obvious accumulation of talent there as they managed 1 more win than when they started the rebuild. Hilariously, this is where our now departed GM scouted for linebacker talent. Idiot.

Khan knew what he was doing when he suggested to TC that he run the whole thing and then backed away and let him do it.

Laurel and Hardy in the owners' box didn't. They fucked up big time. Let's see if DG can navigate around Jawn's need to stick his nose into football operations. Frankly, the draft is an indication that he can't but will see. Let's hope Barkley is all that and the bag of chips his fervent admirers believe he is and pray for Eli's continued good health.


He didn’t even hire Marrone. lol
He should have been kicked upstairs  
ghost718 : 4/28/2018 10:51 am : link
Keeping Jerry over him? give me a break
RE: He should have been kicked upstairs  
Rflairr : 4/28/2018 10:55 am : link
In comment 13942567 ghost718 said:
Quote:
Keeping Jerry over him? give me a break


Blah. The only mistake was hiring that clown McAdoo.
I'm a Coughlin guy, but there's good reason to be jealous  
Eric on Li : 4/28/2018 10:58 am : link
in Jax. Since he got there they have dedicated more to building the trenches than any other team in the NFL.

2017 - added Cam Robinson, Calais Campbell (signed DPOY for less than we signed JPP), tried to get Branden Albert as well even though that didn't work out, re-emphasized their running game too

2018 - added Norwell at the expense of letting some skill players sign elsewhere, drafted a future replacement for Campbell since he's already 31.

If Reese (and Mcadoo) had done what Coughlin did in the 2017 offseason instead of spending money on Marshall and JPP they'd both still have jobs here.
...  
christian : 4/28/2018 11:13 am : link
Coughlin plays an extremely different role in Jacksonville than Chris Mara -- it's comical to make that comparison.

Coughlin is a great football mind, one of the truly successful men of this generation, and the Giants were lucky to have him. These generations of fans will look back and have a golden age of New York Football Giants success to remember fondly.

There's no need to pretend the last few years of his coaching tenure were not impressive. The front office was the right move for him. His pride wasn't going to let him do that as a Giant, and the circumstances wouldn't have allowed it.

There's also no need to pretend like Jacksonville wasn't a team with a lot of young talent, a lot of cap space, a good owner and a remedy made situation with a very good head coaching candidate right there in the building.
RE: RE: Jacksonville has been building  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/28/2018 11:18 am : link
In comment 13942475 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
In comment 13942406 Rflairr said:


Quote:


That roster way before Tom got there. They can’t but do it with all those high picks

Haters going to hate. The 5 years before TC got there and hired Marrone: 3-13, 5-11, 3-3, 4-12, 2-14.


That's exactly where the high picks that make that defense and got them Fournette came from. Quit playing yourself.
RE: ...  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 4/28/2018 11:34 am : link
In comment 13942647 christian said:
Quote:
Coughlin plays an extremely different role in Jacksonville than Chris Mara -- it's comical to make that comparison.

Coughlin is a great football mind, one of the truly successful men of this generation, and the Giants were lucky to have him. These generations of fans will look back and have a golden age of New York Football Giants success to remember fondly.

There's no need to pretend the last few years of his coaching tenure were not impressive. The front office was the right move for him. His pride wasn't going to let him do that as a Giant, and the circumstances wouldn't have allowed it.

There's also no need to pretend like Jacksonville wasn't a team with a lot of young talent, a lot of cap space, a good owner and a remedy made situation with a very good head coaching candidate right there in the building.


Right and ballsy thing to do would have been to replace Reese or Chris Mara with Coughlin.

Too much to expect from an organization that threw Gilbride, Fewell, Coughlin, and Eli under the bus.
I was never a TC fan...  
bw in dc : 4/28/2018 11:35 am : link
for his coaching, but that guy can evaluate talent. One of the GREAT evaluators and developers of receivers I've ever seen.

I would have been a supporter of tossing out Reese and going with TC as the GM if that was an option.
Coghlan’s coaching lost us 3-4 games his last year here  
TD : 4/28/2018 11:44 am : link
It was time. Period. He’s done as a coach.

As a front office guy, he’s doing well it seems. Credit to the GM and coach but Tom gets some too.

One thing to remember, though - TC HAD INPUT ON REESE’S PICKS.

I know ppl gloss over that and want to blame Reese for everything but it’s widely known a few of Reese’s busts were actually TC busts.

Anyway, good luck to him. He was part of two championships here and gave his all as a coach.
Coughlin - not Coghlan  
TD : 4/28/2018 11:45 am : link
.
RE: That is why  
djm : 4/28/2018 4:27 pm : link
In comment 13942314 PaulN said:
Quote:
When Coughlin left and Reese was in total; command we went to shit. Wellington Mara used to say that he was okay if the head coach and GM didn't always see things the same way all the time in fact he thought that EA and Fassel thought too much alike and when he brought in Coughlin EA was not comfortable, but they worked well together, I thought Tom and Reese worked well together, but I think over time the thinking of Tom getting too old gave Reese more power and that is when it all went down the tubes.


Hard to argue with this.
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