Gil Brandt has graded 492 running backs over 60 years

because a perennial all-pro will wipe out any debate, regardless of what the others go on to do.

In comment 13950749 jcn56 said:

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because a perennial all-pro will wipe out any debate, regardless of what the others go on to do.

Wow. Stay healthy young man.

I like Brandt and he's obviously a legend. But how can you say 100% All Pro?

Who are his top 10 rated RBs of all time?

The expectations for this guy are out of this world - he literally has to be a first team all-pro out of the gates otherwise people are going to hold it against him.

But Brandt isn't the only one to have an out of this world grade on him. Quite a few analysts have him as one of their highest graded RB's ever from what I've seen.

Hard to argue with the logic behind the pick. He's clearly extremely highly-regarded.

I can't wait to see this kid play in blue.

In comment 13950768 Danny Kanell said:

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I can't wait to see this kid play in blue.

x10

Time will tell.

just as Mayock is, but this guy built the most consistently good, sometimes great, football teams from the ‘60s until he left with Landry after the ‘88 season. He hasn’t lost all that much on his fastball. Imho

In comment 13950772 Greg from LI said:

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Time will tell.

I fyou had to choose...

would you consider yourself cynic, skeptic, or contrarian?

In comment 13950766 arcarsenal said:

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The expectations for this guy are out of this world - he literally has to be a first team all-pro out of the gates otherwise people are going to hold it against him. But Brandt isn't the only one to have an out of this world grade on him. Quite a few analysts have him as one of their highest graded RB's ever from what I've seen. Hard to argue with the logic behind the pick. He's clearly extremely highly-regarded.

That wouldn't really be fair to him, either.

This first year I'm hoping for him to be able to read and pick up a blitz, not look to bounce everything outside, and help in the passing game.

While it's true the nothing and no one is a sure thing, it's also true that few, if anyone at all, has been evaluated and assigned higher grades than Barkley.

It's the production, game tape, skill set, competition, pro readiness, character, work ethic, personality, combine and clean injury history.

In terms of draft prospects, he is a straight A student. Can he not live up to that? Sure. But the evidence we have now does not lead in that direction. I read one scout say that any negative he had to jot down in his write-up of Barkley felt forced and like he needed to do so in order to complete the report.

Personally, I haven't seen this type of hype in football before. This is more than even Reggie Bush. I've only seen it for LeBron and Bryce Harper. Those 2 worked out pretty well.

at the idea of someone being skeptical of a player receiving this much hype.

He is mature, respectful, talked about walking into the building and looking at the 4 Lombardi trophies. Their meaning did not go unnoticed by him. He understands that this is a cornerstone franchise. He spoke about the history of the RB position for the Giants. He's not just immensely talented,he has that "it" factor about him that very few have. ( Eli has it, OBJ has it, LT had it). You win because of guys like this.

greatest D player in NFL history, back in ‘81..

And YES, time will tell as nothing is guaranteed

In comment 13950763 ZogZerg said:

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Who are his top 10 rated RBs of all time?

I would guess:

OJ
Ricky Williams
Marcus Allen
Adrian Peterson
LaDanian Tomlinson
Marshall Faulk

Are all on the list

that I had to google what a "snapback" is. Is that a common knowledge thing?

there is no chance that this kid lives-up to some of the super-human expectations. Sports media loves to tear down the very people they laud. Every single play will be over analyzed and used as evidence of greatness and failure.

He may be very good or even great. Some pointy headed football analysts are already investigating options to poke holes in Barkley.

In comment 13950795 BamaBlue said:

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there is no chance that this kid lives-up to some of the super-human expectations. Sports media loves to tear down the very people they laud. Every single play will be over analyzed and used as evidence of greatness and failure. He may be very good or even great. Some pointy headed football analysts are already investigating options to poke holes in Barkley.

Yep and it also seems like a lot of the detractors(mainly those who wanted the Giants to select a QB) are the ones setting the bar the highest.
"If he doesn't go into the Hall of Fame first ballot AND shit a golden football into my lap, then it was a bad pick!"

.

In comment 13950793 chopperhatch said:

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In comment 13950763 ZogZerg said: Quote: Who are his top 10 rated RBs of all time? I would guess: OJ Ricky Williams Marcus Allen Adrian Peterson LaDanian Tomlinson Marshall Faulk Are all on the list

It's grades coming out of college.....

1) Barkley
2) Tony Dorsett
3) Herschel Walker

compared against players they could have chosen instead is a legitimate topic however. If they weren't in love with one of these Quarterbacks, and any of them goes on to be excellent, then their evaluations were wrong. It would take an Adrian Peterson sort of career to be more valuable than a franchise quarterback. And even that is probably something some would argue.

With so much hype.

In comment 13950814 Greg from LI said:

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.

That's good. It's the best choice. "Prove it" without being unreceptive to being wrong.

In comment 13950784 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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at the idea of someone being skeptical of a player receiving this much hype.

It's also weird to see so many disgusted with the pick of someone who is likely the very best player in the draft.

I absolutely get those that wanted a QB. So, there would be natural disappointment. But, the disdain for the Barkley pick is as if they both passed on a QB with the same type of rating Barkley has (that QB didn't exist in this draft) and drafted a reach/project in his place. Since all the QBs came with serious questions and Barkley is a consensus excellent pick, why the anger?

Most people are.

In comment 13950780 Go Terps said:

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In comment 13950766 arcarsenal said: Quote: The expectations for this guy are out of this world - he literally has to be a first team all-pro out of the gates otherwise people are going to hold it against him. But Brandt isn't the only one to have an out of this world grade on him. Quite a few analysts have him as one of their highest graded RB's ever from what I've seen. Hard to argue with the logic behind the pick. He's clearly extremely highly-regarded. That wouldn't really be fair to him, either. This first year I'm hoping for him to be able to read and pick up a blitz, not look to bounce everything outside, and help in the passing game.

I would agree.

I think if people are going to expect 2000 scrimmage yards in year one, it's probably not fair to him and not that realistic.

I do think he has to be productive in year one - and I believe he will be. But doing all of the little things will matter just as much as the gaudy numbers.

Play the game.

I appreciate his confidence but we have drafted too many #1
RB busts to fall for the hype blindly

In comment 13950817 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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compared against players they could have chosen instead is a legitimate topic however. If they weren't in love with one of these Quarterbacks, and any of them goes on to be excellent, then their evaluations were wrong. It would take an Adrian Peterson sort of career to be more valuable than a franchise quarterback. And even that is probably something some would argue.

To me the QBs' careers have more to do with that discussion than Barkley does. We can throw Maycock out because he was off the board. So, if Rosen is hurt a lot or his injury history affects his career, if Darnold continues to throw a lot of INTs, if Allen's lack of accuracy continues and/or his past comments impact his stature with the team, and if Jackson's lack of size and accuracy are issues, then anything out of Barkley still justifies the pick. Realistically, I think the Giants would have been looking only at Darnold and Rosen, so those are the two I would focus on.

4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway

It will still mean we blew the draft if Darnold, Allen, Rosen turn into franchise qbs and we are stuck with avaregare qb play going forward for the duration of SB career

If we find a franchise qb by trading 3 1st rounders or sign a Kirk Cousins type for big money and Darnold, Rosen, Allen are all franchise qbs's or 1 of them turns into a franchise qb then it will mean we screwed up

Only thing that will make the SB legit, is that he turns into a HOF type of back, Darnold blows and is not great or the other 2 and we draft a stud one in a couple of year or the back ups we have now turn into studs. That is the only way

In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said:

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4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway

Keep damage controlling. 1 or 3 of them it dont matter because the Giants told you that SB was worth it because the qb's all were not primed for being franchise qb's

Only way your argument has merit is if we drafted a qb and one of the other qb's turned into HOF type.

But DG told everyone that the qb's were not worth crap and none were touched by the hand of GOD

and, if Barkley is who is supposed to be and we sign a Cousins guy for only money, then not only will I be as happy as a pig in shit but I would almost guarantee that we will double the playoff win total of those teams (or, at least he Jets) over the life of those QB's. SO, what's most important to you?

In comment 13950866 NYSports1 said:

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In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: 4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway Keep damage controlling. 1 or 3 of them it dont matter because the Giants told you that SB was worth it because the qb's all were not primed for being franchise qb's Only way your argument has merit is if we drafted a qb and one of the other qb's turned into HOF type. But DG told everyone that the qb's were not worth crap and none were touched by the hand of GOD

Saying they weren't in love with any of the QB's and saying they "were not worth crap" are completely different notions.

If you need gross hyperbole like this to make your point, you probably don't have a very good one.

In comment 13950866 NYSports1 said:

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In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: 4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway Keep damage controlling. 1 or 3 of them it dont matter because the Giants told you that SB was worth it because the qb's all were not primed for being franchise qb's Only way your argument has merit is if we drafted a qb and one of the other qb's turned into HOF type. But DG told everyone that the qb's were not worth crap and none were touched by the hand of GOD

No damage control. The Giants didn’t value any of the top 4 as franchise guys. Period. End of story. Moving on

Both are winners with pedigree and athleticiism

Most of the best all time QBs have come in later rounds- Unitas, Montana, Marino, Tarkenton, Brady.....the list goes on and on

These 5 are arguably the best NFL QBs of all time

In comment 13950866 NYSports1 said:

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In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: 4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway Keep damage controlling. 1 or 3 of them it dont matter because the Giants told you that SB was worth it because the qb's all were not primed for being franchise qb's Only way your argument has merit is if we drafted a qb and one of the other qb's turned into HOF type. But DG told everyone that the qb's were not worth crap and none were touched by the hand of GOD

hate to play the game that others do, but could you supply a tape of DG calling any of the qb's crap?

In comment 13950784 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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at the idea of someone being skeptical of a player receiving this much hype.

It’s fine to be skeptical, but you should be skeptical of every player in this draft then.

Rushing: 250 att 4.5 y/a 1125 yds (well below recent top rookies)
Receiving: 50 rec 10.0 y/c 500 yds (Kamara had 81 and 10.2 y/r)

Total: 1625 yds, 300 touches, 10+ TDs

In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said:

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4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway

that’s disingenuous to good degree...

In comment 13950866 NYSports1 said:

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In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: 4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway Keep damage controlling. 1 or 3 of them it dont matter because the Giants told you that SB was worth it because the qb's all were not primed for being franchise qb's Only way your argument has merit is if we drafted a qb and one of the other qb's turned into HOF type. But DG told everyone that the qb's were not worth crap and none were touched by the hand of GOD

You’re embellishing way too much here...

Allen - busts
Rosen - Matt Ryan
Darnold - Eli

How good does Barkley then need to be to justify the pick?
- Tiki with a SB MVP?
- Faulk?
- Top 3 all time?

Does your opinion change if Lauletta (or Webb) develops into a Cousins/Alex Smith level QB?

No chance he can live up to this nonsense. Touch by the hand of God is going to be the dumbest thing any GM has ever said. JPP of tight ends times a million.

As far as Gil Brant goes is he serious? I have 2 words:

BO JACKSON.

The Manster, Roger Staubach, LT the rest I was all skeptical of including all of this years draftees.

I'm a born skeptic

For instance, If 1 of these 3 turn into an Andy Dalton level quarterback and SB turns into an all pro RB are will still regretting it?

Dalton signed a second contract with his team for nearly 100 million, and quarterbacked a team to 4 straight playoff appearances. He's a franchise quarterback correct? So, would you be upset if we passed on the next Andy Dalton?

In comment 13950886 Jimmy Googs said:

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In comment 13950853 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: 4 Qbs goes on to a HOF career, there is no certainty that we would have picked THAT QB out of the 4 anyway that’s disingenuous to good degree...

It's npot really. It *has* to be Darnold and no other. Because he was, based on all accounts that even had has so much as glancingly considering a QB, the only alternative. How the others do is completely irrelevant.

In comment 13950861 NYSports1 said:

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It will still mean we blew the draft if Darnold, Allen, Rosen turn into franchise qbs and we are stuck with avaregare qb play going forward for the duration of SB career If we find a franchise qb by trading 3 1st rounders or sign a Kirk Cousins type for big money and Darnold, Rosen, Allen are all franchise qbs's or 1 of them turns into a franchise qb then it will mean we screwed up Only thing that will make the SB legit, is that he turns into a HOF type of back, Darnold blows and is not great or the other 2 and we draft a stud one in a couple of year or the back ups we have now turn into studs. That is the only way

Winning a Superbowl wouldn't?

In comment 13950905 BigK said:

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In comment 13950861 NYSports1 said: Quote: It will still mean we blew the draft if Darnold, Allen, Rosen turn into franchise qbs and we are stuck with avaregare qb play going forward for the duration of SB career If we find a franchise qb by trading 3 1st rounders or sign a Kirk Cousins type for big money and Darnold, Rosen, Allen are all franchise qbs's or 1 of them turns into a franchise qb then it will mean we screwed up Only thing that will make the SB legit, is that he turns into a HOF type of back, Darnold blows and is not great or the other 2 and we draft a stud one in a couple of year or the back ups we have now turn into studs. That is the only way Winning a Superbowl wouldn't?

Wow. I think that you might be the first person who mentioned or seemed to take into account team results in any of these conversations.

When we had Vereen I said each year that he should have been our leading receiver after Beckham. The running back in space against a linebacker is usually going to be the biggest mismatch available in the passing game.

Check out the numbers of the two best rookie running backs last year, Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt:

Kamara: Rush: 120/728/8, Rec.: 81/826/5
Total: 201 Touches, 1554 yds, 7.7 yds/touch, 13 TD

Hunt: Rush: 272/1327/8, Rec.: 53/455/3
Total: 325 Touches, 1782 yds, 5.5 yds/touch, 11 TD

If I had to pick one or the other, I'd rather Barkley's rookie season looked like Kamara's. I'm hoping for explosive plays, particularly in the passing game.

In comment 13950912 Go Terps said:

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When we had Vereen I said each year that he should have been our leading receiver after Beckham. The running back in space against a linebacker is usually going to be the biggest mismatch available in the passing game. Check out the numbers of the two best rookie running backs last year, Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt: Kamara: Rush: 120/728/8, Rec.: 81/826/5 Total: 201 Touches, 1554 yds, 7.7 yds/touch, 13 TD Hunt: Rush: 272/1327/8, Rec.: 53/455/3 Total: 325 Touches, 1782 yds, 5.5 yds/touch, 11 TD If I had to pick one or the other, I'd rather Barkley's rookie season looked like Kamara's. I'm hoping for explosive plays, particularly in the passing game.

Hunt didn't have as many explosive plays, but I hope Barkley gets the ball as much as he did (300-325 touches) rather than the 200 touches Kamara had. With this OL, averaging 5.0 yards/rush might be a bit of a stretch, but I fully expect Barkley to exceed Hunt's 8.6 yards/rec number.

Ultimately, I can see 300 touches with 6.0-6.5 yds/touch which would likely be a ROY season.