the season cannot get here soon enough. I am beyond excited to see barkley play. i am actually really excited for preseason to see webb and lauletta take most of the snaps (hope thats the case) i expect it will be though as manning doesnt need to much time being a vet.
I would rather they had taken two offensive lineman and two defensive lineman than one and three. But, I guess they had to go with their board. I'm glad you mentioned that Hernandez may be better as a pass protector than some think. I don't see Lauletta as a future Manning or Simms, but maybe a future Foles or Keenum, which is good value in the 4th round.
I would rather they had taken two offensive lineman and two defensive lineman than one and three. But, I guess they had to go with their board. I'm glad you mentioned that Hernandez may be better as a pass protector than some think. I don't see Lauletta as a future Manning or Simms, but maybe a future Foles or Keenum, which is good value in the 4th round.
Carter isn't a defensive lineman. They had six picks: RB, QB, OL on offense... two DL's and one LB on defense.
the season cannot get here soon enough. I am beyond excited to see barkley play. i am actually really excited for preseason to see webb and lauletta take most of the snaps (hope thats the case) i expect it will be though as manning doesnt need to much time being a vet.
i think barkley n OBJ will keep DCs up at night!
It’s a new system, he’s going to need the reps.
We basically drafted a 35lb heavier version of Odell Beckham Â
I love the draft and Barkley, Hernandez and Carter were 3 of my favorite players I wanted for NYG. I also like the Hill and Lauletta picks. I would have loved another OL specifically Jamarco Jones or Tyrell Crosby in round 5 but I have to trust that DG knows what he is doing in that department.
I have a different opinion on is Lauretta in the 4th. Back up QB is still an important position on a team and he may be the perfect person to come in for a few games if needed. If he can develop into more - home run!
Odell is going to get a huge boost from Barkley. As great as Odell is, it’s been too easy for defenses to minimize his damage. But our running game has failed to make anyone pay for the over the top help. I don’t envy the position of DCs having to chose which of these guys to take their chances with.
regardless of the opinions on #2 QB or RB. We very likely have improved on a very serious problem on offense, oline and rushing. The results this season will tell us more and after many bad years of football hopefully we can count on the organization waking up.
Like many of us I feel pretty good about the draft, our new head coach, our new defensive coordinator and hopefully a season with less injury problems. Optimistic to a certain degree.
I was pulled back to 'reality' when I saw that Vegas has the Giants over/under at 6.5.
Vegas isn't always right, I'm taking the over.
the only thing where I differ is Lauletta. If he turns out to be future Foles or Keenum then that is a success. Seem like a good fit with Shurmur . With that development Lauletta could start here under Shurmur or fetch a draft choice in trade.
Irrespective of whether you think it's a great draft, or good have been even better, I don't think anyone believes any of the picks are WTF picks, as to what they were, or where they were taken, such as we've had in the past.
the only thing where I differ is Lauletta. If he turns out to be future Foles or Keenum then that is a success. Seem like a good fit with Shurmur . With that development Lauletta could start here under Shurmur or fetch a draft choice in trade.
I see it as them expanding their options from one to two. The pessimists will say that Webb and Lauetta are not serious options. They could be right. But this seems like a reasonable insurance policy to me. Giants are going to go with two very inexperienced reserves this year. That tells me they are thinking about the transition after Eli even if they publicly say he's strong as ever.
I have a different opinion on is Lauretta in the 4th. Back up QB is still an important position on a team and he may be the perfect person to come in for a few games if needed. If he can develop into more - home run!
I keep having to remember that the quarterbacks coming out are really young and this is their first professional job. They have a big learning curve ahead of them. I can see why Shurmur would be excited about Eli even on the back end of his career. Hoping Eli has some savy veteran QB play left in him.
Odell is going to get a huge boost from Barkley. As great as Odell is, it’s been too easy for defenses to minimize his damage. But our running game has failed to make anyone pay for the over the top help. I don’t envy the position of DCs having to chose which of these guys to take their chances with.
Barkley and Hernandez might help the defense more than the 3 defensive players drafted. Even improving the running game to average should help extend some drives and keep the D fresher.
Some are comparing Barkley's running style to Edgerrin James Â
And Barry Sanders. But I think he most resembles Gale Sayers. The cutbacks, the elusiveness, the burst, the 2nd gear and the toughness. What he does have over Gayle is the pass catching ability Gale Sayers highlights - ( New Window )
Was the selection sequence of RB + QB smarter than QB + RB.
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
How is a 1st round QB + 2nd round RB the fair comparison vs. 1st round RB + 4th round QB? If you want to compare apples to apples, you should be looking at the 4th round RBs that followed the Giants pick:
Mark Walton
Ito Smith
Kalen Ballage
Chase Edmonds
Otherwise, you're setting yourself up with a stacked deck because you're giving yourself a stronger RB prospect than a straight swap of the positions drafted in their respective rounds would suggest.
If you want to stake your point on Darnold/Rosen + any of the RBs I listed, go for it. But not Chubb/Guice/Jones.
People here often say they don’t care what the Jets do and that makes sense from a fan perspective. But look at this from the perspective of the owners and maybe the front office for a second. Even with Barkley the club has significant holes. They could easily by an 8-8 team this year and the next until Eli retires. And, what’s the likelihood that Eli’s replacement will be even an above average QB? Hopefully, but we’ll be lucky if we get that much.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
You start off the article stating this is a passing league And I do agree
But if you can’t run the ball you can’t win
Barkley was a no brainer whether or not Rosen and Darnold are great
People here often say they don’t care what the Jets do and that makes sense from a fan perspective. But look at this from the perspective of the owners and maybe the front office for a second. Even with Barkley the club has significant holes. They could easily by an 8-8 team this year and the next until Eli retires. And, what’s the likelihood that Eli’s replacement will be even an above average QB? Hopefully, but we’ll be lucky if we get that much.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
People here often say they don’t care what the Jets do and that makes sense from a fan perspective. But look at this from the perspective of the owners and maybe the front office for a second. Even with Barkley the club has significant holes. They could easily by an 8-8 team this year and the next until Eli retires. And, what’s the likelihood that Eli’s replacement will be even an above average QB? Hopefully, but we’ll be lucky if we get that much.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
What, exactly, is New York's team? Do they get special privileges or something? Free theater tickets? Free subway rides? Free burgers at Minetta Tavern?
the only thing where I differ is Lauletta. If he turns out to be future Foles or Keenum then that is a success. Seem like a good fit with Shurmur . With that development Lauletta could start here under Shurmur or fetch a draft choice in trade.
I see it as them expanding their options from one to two. The pessimists will say that Webb and Lauetta are not serious options. They could be right. But this seems like a reasonable insurance policy to me. Giants are going to go with two very inexperienced reserves this year. That tells me they are thinking about the transition after Eli even if they publicly say he's strong as ever.
Exactly. Now all our hope doesn’t rest on one project QB with potential. We have two and they both have really good upside that could develop or st the very least be good enough until we do find the next guy.
RE: RE: That will be the debate for many years... Â
Chubb/Jones/Guice all went in the 2nd round. Lauletta was a 4th round pick. So if you want to view it like that, then you need to either say:
Barkley/Hernandez/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold)/Chubb (Jones/Guice)/Cole Madison (Wyatt Teller)
or
Barkley/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold) and Hines (other >4th rd RB)
Unless drafting a QB at #2 would've magically given us an additional 2nd round pick with which to then draft a RB...
I knew this would be confusing for some
There is no additional 2nd round pick suggested. I'm declaring we take a RB, say Chubb, instead Hernandez in the second round. So then you have the QB + RB, in order.
In the third round, don't take Carter. Take Geno Christian instead, a terrific LT prospect out of Louisville.
So we get, in order, QB + RB + OL. And all the players I recommend were available at the time we selected. Thus, there is no re-arranging of the draft order or hoping players would have been there. These players were indeed there...
always, Eric. I am finding myself very preoccupied with the 1st round pick. I am sure Barkley will be great, but it will be awful if any of the other QBs available turn out to be top 5 QBs on a consistent basis. Time will tell. I just remember the misery of the years between Simms and Collins too well, I guess. If Barkley allows them to make one more run with Eli, then it was worth it.
Why does everyone say barkley is different than every other back? Â
Eric- wasn’t commenting on the validity of taking Barkley. I was just commenting on your statement that he was the safer pick. As I said, in my mind he was more risky pick.
Klatuu- you go realize these clubs are in business to make money and part of that is selling seat licenses and tickets. A winning team makes a lot more money which helps ownership but is in s better position to sign free agents which helps the team and the fans. I heard the Jets will have a boatload of money to spend next year ($100 million?). Unless the Giants are successful, that’s a problem for management
Eric- wasn’t commenting on the validity of taking Barkley. I was just commenting on your statement that he was the safer pick. As I said, in my mind he was more risky pick.
Klatuu- you go realize these clubs are in business to make money and part of that is selling seat licenses and tickets. A winning team makes a lot more money which helps ownership but is in s better position to sign free agents which helps the team and the fans. I heard the Jets will have a boatload of money to spend next year ($100 million?). Unless the Giants are successful, that’s a problem for management
I covered why I thought he was the riskier pick in the article.
Was the selection sequence of RB + QB smarter than QB + RB.
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
i say that the order we did it is not even close to the other combination. Barkley is so far ahead it isn’t even funny. They would never have not gone Olin the 2nd so that’s not realistic. But if they went mad and did it, then they lost tons of points. Lauketta is closer to Darnold than Chib is to Barkley and at OL it’s 1sr round value versus 3rd round. Basically we trade superlative for average at best in toto.
Also don’t know why Rosen or Guise are even discussed. Giants apparently had no consideration for Rosen and both he and Buise give the appearance of being toxic. Teams ran away from both and it’s possible that they would be a net negative on the team no matter what skill level they might have.
However, I think the comparison has to be Barkley vs Darnold. According to sources, Darnold was the highest rated QB on the Giants board. So, if Darnold becomes a top 10 Franchise QB then the Giants F-d up. If Rosen does, then it doesn't really matter since they weren't going to pick him. It just means that they suck at evaluating QBs.
You can't start combining guys like some of you have. You then miss out on Hernandez.
all 3 will be forever compared. Gettlemen better pray that none of those QBs, esp. Darnold doesnt have a long, successful franchise qbs and Barkley just above average qb, and/or Webb or Kyle fail to be that successful heir apparent to Eli. Or, just having to kick that can down the road at QB position for years after.
For the all the hype, expectations, and taken at 2, Barkley to me, based on all this, nothing short of being inducted to the hall of fame would be nothing but a fail..again based on all this hype and expectations by everyone
However, I think the comparison has to be Barkley vs Darnold. According to sources, Darnold was the highest rated QB on the Giants board. So, if Darnold becomes a top 10 Franchise QB then the Giants F-d up. If Rosen does, then it doesn't really matter since they weren't going to pick him. It just means that they suck at evaluating QBs.
You can't start combining guys like some of you have. You then miss out on Hernandez.
There were many Giants fans who wanted Rosen. If Rosen goes onto be a stud, you had better believe everyone will remember the Giants passed on him. (And passed on the opportunity to trade down and draft him).
And I won’t wish failure on anyone. It doesn’t affect me.
I think what matters is, do we win more. Honestly feel, and I know that it’s an isolated view, that wins are somewhere between the most important thing, and the only thing.
i think barkley n OBJ will keep DCs up at night!
The rest of them? We'll see.
Carter isn't a defensive lineman. They had six picks: RB, QB, OL on offense... two DL's and one LB on defense.
Will he be glad it's gone or will he push the envelope even further?
i think barkley n OBJ will keep DCs up at night!
It’s a new system, he’s going to need the reps.
Teams won't be able to tee up on Odell and target him as much because they will be too distracted trying to defend other areas now.
All in all, a very nice offseason.
Odell is going to get a huge boost from Barkley. As great as Odell is, it’s been too easy for defenses to minimize his damage. But our running game has failed to make anyone pay for the over the top help. I don’t envy the position of DCs having to chose which of these guys to take their chances with.
Will he be glad it's gone or will he push the envelope even further?
Are you serious? Odell will be as supportive of Barkley as anyone else.
I was pulled back to 'reality' when I saw that Vegas has the Giants over/under at 6.5.
Vegas isn't always right, I'm taking the over.
I see it as them expanding their options from one to two. The pessimists will say that Webb and Lauetta are not serious options. They could be right. But this seems like a reasonable insurance policy to me. Giants are going to go with two very inexperienced reserves this year. That tells me they are thinking about the transition after Eli even if they publicly say he's strong as ever.
Bingo. I was just about to post the same.
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
Odell is going to get a huge boost from Barkley. As great as Odell is, it’s been too easy for defenses to minimize his damage. But our running game has failed to make anyone pay for the over the top help. I don’t envy the position of DCs having to chose which of these guys to take their chances with.
Barkley and Hernandez might help the defense more than the 3 defensive players drafted. Even improving the running game to average should help extend some drives and keep the D fresher.
Gale Sayers highlights - ( New Window )
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
Chubb/Jones/Guice all went in the 2nd round. Lauletta was a 4th round pick. So if you want to view it like that, then you need to either say:
Barkley/Hernandez/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold)/Chubb (Jones/Guice)/Cole Madison (Wyatt Teller)
or
Barkley/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold) and Hines (other >4th rd RB)
Unless drafting a QB at #2 would've magically given us an additional 2nd round pick with which to then draft a RB...
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
How is a 1st round QB + 2nd round RB the fair comparison vs. 1st round RB + 4th round QB? If you want to compare apples to apples, you should be looking at the 4th round RBs that followed the Giants pick:
Mark Walton
Ito Smith
Kalen Ballage
Chase Edmonds
Otherwise, you're setting yourself up with a stacked deck because you're giving yourself a stronger RB prospect than a straight swap of the positions drafted in their respective rounds would suggest.
If you want to stake your point on Darnold/Rosen + any of the RBs I listed, go for it. But not Chubb/Guice/Jones.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
But if you can’t run the ball you can’t win
Barkley was a no brainer whether or not Rosen and Darnold are great
Also, corners don't need much integration to be effective.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
I believe I covered all of that.
Now, we gifted Darnold to the Jets. What happens if he becomes the new Eli of New York? I will never stop rooting for the Giants but if Darnold becomes that kind of QB, the Jets will become New York’s team and will be way closer to winning it all than the Giants,
What I’m saying is that going forward this could be a multi million business decision. Far from being the safe pick, I think drafting Barkley was the riskier pick.
What, exactly, is New York's team? Do they get special privileges or something? Free theater tickets? Free subway rides? Free burgers at Minetta Tavern?
Quote:
the only thing where I differ is Lauletta. If he turns out to be future Foles or Keenum then that is a success. Seem like a good fit with Shurmur . With that development Lauletta could start here under Shurmur or fetch a draft choice in trade.
I see it as them expanding their options from one to two. The pessimists will say that Webb and Lauetta are not serious options. They could be right. But this seems like a reasonable insurance policy to me. Giants are going to go with two very inexperienced reserves this year. That tells me they are thinking about the transition after Eli even if they publicly say he's strong as ever.
Exactly. Now all our hope doesn’t rest on one project QB with potential. We have two and they both have really good upside that could develop or st the very least be good enough until we do find the next guy.
Chubb/Jones/Guice all went in the 2nd round. Lauletta was a 4th round pick. So if you want to view it like that, then you need to either say:
Barkley/Hernandez/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold)/Chubb (Jones/Guice)/Cole Madison (Wyatt Teller)
or
Barkley/Lauletta vs Rosen (Darnold) and Hines (other >4th rd RB)
Unless drafting a QB at #2 would've magically given us an additional 2nd round pick with which to then draft a RB...
I knew this would be confusing for some
There is no additional 2nd round pick suggested. I'm declaring we take a RB, say Chubb, instead Hernandez in the second round. So then you have the QB + RB, in order.
In the third round, don't take Carter. Take Geno Christian instead, a terrific LT prospect out of Louisville.
So we get, in order, QB + RB + OL. And all the players I recommend were available at the time we selected. Thus, there is no re-arranging of the draft order or hoping players would have been there. These players were indeed there...
How is Barkley different than that?
How is Barkley different than that?
Much bigger and faster.
Klatuu- you go realize these clubs are in business to make money and part of that is selling seat licenses and tickets. A winning team makes a lot more money which helps ownership but is in s better position to sign free agents which helps the team and the fans. I heard the Jets will have a boatload of money to spend next year ($100 million?). Unless the Giants are successful, that’s a problem for management
Something - ( New Window )
Klatuu- you go realize these clubs are in business to make money and part of that is selling seat licenses and tickets. A winning team makes a lot more money which helps ownership but is in s better position to sign free agents which helps the team and the fans. I heard the Jets will have a boatload of money to spend next year ($100 million?). Unless the Giants are successful, that’s a problem for management
I covered why I thought he was the riskier pick in the article.
Are Barkely & Lauletta < = or > than Rosen/Darnold & Chubb/Jones/Guice?
The clock is running...
Also don’t know why Rosen or Guise are even discussed. Giants apparently had no consideration for Rosen and both he and Buise give the appearance of being toxic. Teams ran away from both and it’s possible that they would be a net negative on the team no matter what skill level they might have.
You can't start combining guys like some of you have. You then miss out on Hernandez.
For the all the hype, expectations, and taken at 2, Barkley to me, based on all this, nothing short of being inducted to the hall of fame would be nothing but a fail..again based on all this hype and expectations by everyone
You can't start combining guys like some of you have. You then miss out on Hernandez.
There were many Giants fans who wanted Rosen. If Rosen goes onto be a stud, you had better believe everyone will remember the Giants passed on him. (And passed on the opportunity to trade down and draft him).
I think what matters is, do we win more. Honestly feel, and I know that it’s an isolated view, that wins are somewhere between the most important thing, and the only thing.