the umpire had a lineup card that had Cabrera second and Flores 3rd, but Flores batted before Cabrera. AND CABRERA DOUBLED! Mickey Callway should be fired for this. Disgraceful.
How can you possibly write the wrong lineup down on the card you give the ump? I don't understand how you can make this mistake. Even if for some reason you manage to do so, shouldn't you double check before handing it in?
I remember Aaron Boone made a call to the bullpen in spring training, only to realize he had forgotten to warm up a pitcher in the first place. Rookies.
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I'm not overly impressed with Callaway either, I must admit. However, today's ridiculous mistake aside, I don't think it's right to blame him just yet. But Alderson I've had enough of. Same shit every year with this guy. Builds a team that yes, could be very good....as long as 95 different things all go right.
Riggleman to wait and see the outcome of the at-bat before bringing to the umps attention. IF the batter hitting out of turn is out, I believe (don't quote me) you can let it play out and take the out-of-order out the next time around.
Still paying Bobby Bo...can't get the lineup card right..can't get medical issues right..our owners are crooks who were in bed with Madolf..our NLCS MVP is on our division rival and whips us everytime we see him..it just goes on, and on, and on.
RE: Mickey Callaway has been a disaster as manager Â
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I’m disappointed that the starting pitching does not seem to have improved.OTOH,
I think he has done a pretty good job with the pen. Especially co side ring his closer blew three saves in a little over a week . Often when a closer does that, pen begins to unravel. But the pen has remained solid for the most part
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
The Mets have one of the worse bullpens in the NL. Fourth worst to be exact. Continues to over use the same pitchers and also trots out the same ineffective pitchers. Robles in a tight game? Really? It was a shot to no-one that he gave up a HR.
I still like Mickey but pointing to the bullpen is not the way you want to go in defending him.
I swear this is the most reactionary and emotional Â
fanbase in professional sports and it’s compounded on BBI for some reason. 2 weeks ago everyone was sky high and now we are back to being a joke. It’s called baseball. Highs and lows. The Mets have a few key guys out to injury and some of their big bats have been cold. They are going through a rough patch right now. As long as there are no long term knockouts to key players the Mets will bounce back.
RE: RE: RE: Mickey Callaway has been a disaster as manager Â
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
I'm confused...why would there be anti-Callaway noise during the Mets 11-1 start? Should there have been?
Personally, I mentioned more than a few times during that hot streak that it was mostly smoke and mirrors. And that hopefully the team wakes up before they stopped getting ALL the breaks in those first 11 wins. Well, the team didn't wake up and this is what we got.
RE: I swear this is the most reactionary and emotional Â
fanbase in professional sports and it’s compounded on BBI for some reason. 2 weeks ago everyone was sky high and now we are back to being a joke. It’s called baseball. Highs and lows. The Mets have a few key guys out to injury and some of their big bats have been cold. They are going through a rough patch right now. As long as there are no long term knockouts to key players the Mets will bounce back.
Hi, I'd like to introduce one extreme to the other extreme.
Can we stop saying that the bats are cold? It's May 9th.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
RE: I swear this is the most reactionary and emotional Â
fanbase in professional sports and it’s compounded on BBI for some reason. 2 weeks ago everyone was sky high and now we are back to being a joke. It’s called baseball. Highs and lows. The Mets have a few key guys out to injury and some of their big bats have been cold. They are going through a rough patch right now. As long as there are no long term knockouts to key players the Mets will bounce back.
This isn't a good team, man. If you don't see it now, I don't know what to tell you.
We've been hearing that the "bats are cold" for weeks.
We're struggling to even beat the Reds. The worst team in baseball.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
RE: RE: I swear this is the most reactionary and emotional Â
fanbase in professional sports and it’s compounded on BBI for some reason. 2 weeks ago everyone was sky high and now we are back to being a joke. It’s called baseball. Highs and lows. The Mets have a few key guys out to injury and some of their big bats have been cold. They are going through a rough patch right now. As long as there are no long term knockouts to key players the Mets will bounce back.
This isn't a good team, man. If you don't see it now, I don't know what to tell you.
We've been hearing that the "bats are cold" for weeks.
We're struggling to even beat the Reds. The worst team in baseball.
Wheeler is pitching a gem and Matz is coming off a gem too. The rotation will settle down. DeGrom returns Sunday. One week ago our bullpen was in the top third in the league. During this rough stretch the pen got beat up a bit but it’s still fine.... especially when Swarzak returns. The lineup was always going to depend on Rosario and 1B but it has plenty of good hitters in it. The lineup will at least be average and if the team stays relatively healthy we will be in the wild card mix. Count on it.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
We started 11-1 and now we're in 4th place in our own division on May 9th. That's awful and almost hard to do.
Can't keep blaming injuries and cold bats for everything. The Mets aren't the only team that have to deal with that stuff. It's the same excuses constantly.
We're going to be in the bottom third of the league in runs scored by the end of the week.
The bullpen isn't that good. It's average to below average.
I'll bet anything that this isn't a postseason team and the entire thing will have fallen apart before the 4th of July.
I just said we are going through a rough patch. If you thought we were going to stay on a 11-1 pace you probably were on drugs and if you think we are this bad you are out of your mind too. The bullpen isn’t bad. Rather than spewing stats over small samples look at the roster. Familia, Ramos, Swarzak, Sewald, Blevins, Gsellman, and Lugo are good and talented. Holy smokes.
Wheeler's two good outings have been against the two worst lineups in the NL.
The Marlins and Reds.
I need to see him actually succeed against a good lineup before I get too excited about this "gem". The start against Colorado was horrendous and the start against StL wasn't good either. He was passable against WSH.
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
I'm confused...why would there be anti-Callaway noise during the Mets 11-1 start? Should there have been?
Personally, I mentioned more than a few times during that hot streak that it was mostly smoke and mirrors. And that hopefully the team wakes up before they stopped getting ALL the breaks in those first 11 wins. Well, the team didn't wake up and this is what we got.
Of course not - just like we shouldn't have assumed that the Mets would finish with 120+ wins. The point though is that any pronouncements that Mickey needs to go at this point in the year is way too early. But now that the Mets are in a snide, all these people are full of conviction that Mickey is terrible and needs to go.
And fwiw, I was referring more to the people calling for his head. Just want to make that clear because you get extra testy when you think something is directed at you lol.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
And who said anything about staying on an 11-1 pace?
I would have been happy with .500 baseball for a while. We couldn't even do that. Instead we got swept in back to back series' and have lost 8 of our last 10 games. Now we're in 4th place.
This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
LOL, okay - everything is fine and dandy in Mets land as always.
You'll figure it out eventually.
Nothing is fine and dandy. We are going through a rough patch. Frazier, Swarzak, our catchers, and DeGrom are out. Most should be back shortly. Some of our most talented hitters STILL need to heat up. It’s called baseball. Find me at the end of the season. If we stay relatively healthy we’ll be in the playoff mix. The world isn’t ending on May 9th.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
Enough with beating the same dead horse. If you can’t see why we went down in flames last year when we lost Thor, Cespedes, Conforto, Familia and countless others for the year I don’t know what to tell you. If we make the playoffs this year it will be the third time in four years. Poor us.
If we finish off this win we’ll be 3 games over .500 Â
LOL, okay - everything is fine and dandy in Mets land as always.
You'll figure it out eventually.
Nothing is fine and dandy. We are going through a rough patch. Frazier, Swarzak, our catchers, and DeGrom are out. Most should be back shortly. Some of our most talented hitters STILL need to heat up. It’s called baseball. Find me at the end of the season. If we stay relatively healthy we’ll be in the playoff mix. The world isn’t ending on May 9th.
Same excuses constantly. I'll never understand why you have so much blind faith in the Mets and Alderson when they've had such little success.
How long do these guys need to heat up? We're 5 fucking weeks into the season now. Cmon. Enough.
deGrom missed a whopping one start. It's not like we've been without him for several turns.
d'Arnaud isn't coming back. Plawecki sucks (sorry, Shecky), Swarzak was moved to the 60 day and doesn't appear to be anywhere near returning.
If we can't win because a middle reliever and our crappy catching duo is hurt, this team was never good to begin with.
And now the Reds are primed to take a lead... good stuff.
I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
temper temper now phi, its a long season and now that the hot streak fluke start is over this team needs to learn what it truly is before adjusting and progressing. As long as Degrom/Thor are pitching the Mets will have a chance, but as far as hitting look around the league, everyone is struggling.
If Wheeler can hold down the 3 spot, that will make a huge difference.
Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Only a matter of time before the team accidentally cuts DeGrom. Â
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
RE: Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
To be fair Z is right, it is still early and some of these Â
hitters will rebound (conforto and ces looking at you). Also tough to predict both catchers get hurt that fast that early. Though on other side, Degrom missed one start (our only win in last 9 days mind you), Frazier just got hurt, Sandy has ZERo depth in the minors to address the few injuries they have had and Swarzak is really our only pitching injury through 6 weeks.
The fact is that this team is what we thought they were. A very flawed team that didnt fill its holes due to financial constraints and an unimaginative GM but a flawed team that has a punchers chance if they somehow scratch enough wins to get into a playoff series.
The bigger issue for the mets this year is that Atlanta and philly apparently are good and we were betting on beating them up to have any real shot. Long term, if they arent going to sign Thor & Degrom to extensions this off season they should trade everyone and break this sucker down.
RE: Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
I'm with Z, too many proven hitters for these guys not to start hitting. if Wheeler/Matz come to form then the rotation looks alot stronger. Cant let previous years disappointment affect a new season with a new manager.
I kinda compare this lineup to the Brewers who are just now starting to hit.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
temper temper now phi, its a long season and now that the hot streak fluke start is over this team needs to learn what it truly is before adjusting and progressing. As long as Degrom/Thor are pitching the Mets will have a chance, but as far as hitting look around the league, everyone is struggling.
If Wheeler can hold down the 3 spot, that will make a huge difference.
LOL, my temper is just fine. Not my problem if some can't see the forest through the trees. It's like some people believe that we've fielded a competitive team for years and this is just the norm.
Yes, the league is struggling with offense. BUT, the Mets are in the bottom half (if not the bottom third) of every offensive statistical category in the NL. This is a veteran team...if it takes them this long to adjust and progress, then its a bad sign.
Bottom line is...this team shouldn't be this bad for this long. This team has major warts in how it was constructed. That's nothing new. Our GM is stuck in the 90s version of baseball and relies on old reclamation projects of the same ilk. Outside of the first 12 games, the bullpen has been bad...it's not just one bad week like we heard in an earlier post. It is what it is, man. This isn't a playoff team...just like everyone thought before the season.
Anyone who wants to make a friendly bet or come up with reasonable terms... I will guarantee this team doesn't make the postseason. Right now, on May 9th I feel confident enough in this that I will put my handle on the line or whatever the bet is.
This is the same flawed baseball team we've been watching for the majority of the last few years.
We were very fortunate to even get a play in game in 2016. We won 87 games. That's very low for a WC team. And we lost the play in game anyway.
We've had one truly good baseball season in over 10 years.
I don't know why anyone trusts this team. They're second-rate and operate that way.
in that the lineup should hit better than it's done the past few weeks, but I'm less confident about the starting pitching. Vargas is picking up where he left off last year, and this was Wheeler's best outing in a while and he still has an ERA over 5.
For me, it really comes down to Alderson has been the GM for a LONG time here. I'm sick of excuses. I want to see a contending team or a new regime. Last year was crazy, so I was willing to give a pass. Not in 2018. Not after he's been GM for SO long.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Depends on the circumstances... if we don’t have any major knockout blows? Maybe. Baseball is crap shoot in the postseason and many of highs and lows during the regular season have been predicated by how many players are actually on the field. Sandy has dealt with franchise crippling blows (Harvey) over and over and we still seemed to have weathered most storms in spite of it. Seriously, how many teams could afford to lose one of the best starters in baseball In a blink of an eye ? Tends to make things more difficult.
RE: I'm trying to figure out who Mesoraco looks like Â
Our bullpen is good - yet we keep trotting Hansel Robles out there who literally has a HISTORIC HR rate to his name. Makes sense.
Robles was just in the minors. He’s been up for about a week and had one appearance because Vargas and others have gotten shredded and had to leave the game way early which had taxed our pen.
RE: RE: Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
That’s really dumb. We spent more than most teams in free agency this offseason and I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
His FIP is over 7 and he's already appeared 10 times.
Yes and that mostly goes back to earlier in the season. He was already shipped off to AAA and was only recently recalled due to circumstance. Yelling that the bullpen sucks because of Robles who’s the 7th or 8th option doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. He’ll be gone again soon.
I didn't say the bullpen sucked, I said it was average/below average. That's what it is. That's what the numbers say.
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
I don't see other good teams having that issue.
Are you watching every single game of another team and living and dying with them like you do the Mets? Because this happens to every player on every team. The Yankees have the most talented lineup in the sport and that fanbase was ready to jump off a cliff a few weeks into the season.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
That’s really dumb. We spent more than most teams in free agency this offseason and I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
Z - I always enjoy your optimism and it's certainly needed to be a fan of the Mets...but you have lost me if you think Sandy has been anything more than an average GM .
I didn't say the bullpen sucked, I said it was average/below average. That's what it is. That's what the numbers say.
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
Ok fair enough. I have the bullpen in the top third in the league and we’ll be in the postseason hunt all year. We’ll see.
Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
I don't see other good teams having that issue.
Are you watching every single game of another team and living and dying with them like you do the Mets? Because this happens to every player on every team. The Yankees have the most talented lineup in the sport and that fanbase was ready to jump off a cliff a few weeks into the season.
The Yankees have won like 16 of their last 17 games and lead all of baseball in offense. Their pitching is up there too.
also have a top farm system and are coming off of an ALCS appearance last year. The Mets are coming off of 90 losses and have a bottom farm system. The situations aren't comparable.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
also have a top farm system and are coming off of an ALCS appearance last year. The Mets are coming off of 90 losses and have a bottom farm system. The situations aren't comparable.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
This is recency bias. Sure they do “today” but it was completely flipped a few years ago. Yankees had a farm middle of the pack at best and Mets had a top 5 system heading into 2015. Mets were the envy of everyone coming off the WS appearance. Ebbs and flows.
Aren't most teams in the "postseason hunt" all year? Â
What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
also have a top farm system and are coming off of an ALCS appearance last year. The Mets are coming off of 90 losses and have a bottom farm system. The situations aren't comparable.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
This is recency bias. Sure they do “today” but it was completely flipped a few years ago. Yankees had a farm middle of the pack at best and Mets had a top 5 system heading into 2015. Mets were the envy of everyone coming off the WS appearance. Ebbs and flows.
2015 is the exception for the Mets under Alderson. It's not enough to save his job IMO.
It's not ebbs and flows. It's a decade of failure with one great year and one good year. Not good enough, especially with a bottom farm system at the moment. Time is ticking Sandy.
I'll be fine either way, either Mets will make the playoffs or we'll get a new GM. I have no loyalty to this middling regime. Only to the Mets.
What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
For the WS. The Mets haven’t had a bad farm system until this year and it’s mainly the result of injuries and graduations. No farm is a top system forever unless the ML roster is putrid forever.
All farms take a dip from time to time. If it’s awful for a 5 year stretch that’s totally different.
What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
He's built one of the worst farm systems in all of baseball, the guy can't build a bullpen for his life, and signed the WORST pitcher in baseball to a 2 year contract (Vargas). Being a Mets fan sucks
The hot start to this season got my hopes up. Now I feel even worst about the fate of this franchise even before the season even started!
Major League team stinks
Farm system sucks
Honestly, only entertainment I'd tolerate from the Mets now is bringing up Tebow to play everyday. At least that would be entertaining one way or another.
It's a bit early for this, and he's far and away my favorite player on the team, but before long it might really start to make sense to move deGrom to a contender.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
It's a bit early for this, and he's far and away my favorite player on the team, but before long it might really start to make sense to move deGrom to a contender.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
The Yankees make the most sense but I doubt the Wilpons will want to help the Yankees win a world series. There would be a substantial Yankees tax that would prohibit a trade. The Phillies could be interested but the Mets wouldn't be thrilled about moving him to a division rival.
The Coupons are terrified of losing customers to the Yankees, Â
Nyquist is right but the Wilpons have been losing customers to the Yankees for years now. If you were born in 1990 and started following baseball at 6 or 7 years old. Unless your family are Mets fans, the Yankees built their brand and fanbase. A 28 year old Yankee fan never went through what we have. Even missing the playoffs in 08 worked out so they could close their stadium with a sure game.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Ok so rather than just make sweeping generalizations in early May Â
I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
2013 looks awful. 2014 has Conforto and little else. It looks like Sandy's 1st draft was his best, Nimmo and Fulmer. I agree that drafts take time, but after 5 or 6 years, you can start to make assumptions, and my assumption is that those drafts weren't very good.
It's a bit early for this, and he's far and away my favorite player on the team, but before long it might really start to make sense to move deGrom to a contender.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
The Yankees make the most sense but I doubt the Wilpons will want to help the Yankees win a world series. There would be a substantial Yankees tax that would prohibit a trade. The Phillies could be interested but the Mets wouldn't be thrilled about moving him to a division rival.
If the Yanks keep pitching the way they have been, I dont see the Yanks giving up much for a 30 year old number 3/4 pitcher. German just got done throwing a gem in his first start, Gray has looked good last 2/3 outings and we have Justus Sheffield who is bound to be called up before long. Just dont see it. If he was a lefty, sure.
Btw, regarding batting out of order, when the manager brings out the line up card, doesnt he compare his with the one the ump gets right after he hands it to him?
I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
2013 looks awful. 2014 has Conforto and little else. It looks like Sandy's 1st draft was his best, Nimmo and Fulmer. I agree that drafts take time, but after 5 or 6 years, you can start to make assumptions, and my assumption is that those drafts weren't very good.
It's not like the 15 drafts before those were any good either....just sayin. It's an organizational flaw, not one person or one era.
He'd be one of the few available starters who'd warrant such a prospect. No way Archer or Fullmer would. Assuming deGrom's elbow is OK, the Mets could get a king's ransom.
RE: A year ago I would've given up Gleyber for deGrom. Not now though. Â
He'd be one of the few available starters who'd warrant such a prospect. No way Archer or Fullmer would. Assuming deGrom's elbow is OK, the Mets could get a king's ransom.
Whoa. Even knowing what yiu know now about Gleyber? I still wouldnt have. Id have goven up a similar package to what we gave Oakland for Gray. Maybe sthrown in McKinney.
No, I mean at the time, without having seen Gleyber. Â
I doubt Cashman would've. Cubs gave up a top five prospect for Quintana, so the Mets would be crazy to accept anything less than that caliber of prospect, plus other fillers. I wouldn't trade Gleyber for any pitcher right now. That's why I'm not a GM.
Anyway, don't mean to turn a Mets thread into Yankees talk Â
He'd be one of the few available starters who'd warrant such a prospect. No way Archer or Fullmer would. Assuming deGrom's elbow is OK, the Mets could get a king's ransom.
Whoa. Even knowing what yiu know now about Gleyber? I still wouldnt have. Id have goven up a similar package to what we gave Oakland for Gray. Maybe sthrown in McKinney.
There is no way that offer would come close to getting a deal done.
....weeks ago? At least there is an amicable relationship between GMs. If a deGrom trade with the Yankees helps restock this team and sets them up for the future, I could live with it. I am already being thanked by Jets fans for giving them Darnold as if I am on the staff so why not spread the wealth?
I'm assuming chopper doesnt watch deGrom pitch a lot.
Ive watched him pitch. I think hes great. I just dont see how it would be an automatic switching of spots for Masa from 2 to 3. His last three and deGrom's are very similar. Tanaka went thru a really bad 3 game stretch that ballooned his ERA. They really have been quite similar in terms of production this year.
I echo bceagle about ruining this thread with Yanks talk. Just wanted to point out, I dont see the Yankees going real big on another RHP this year given what they did last year. And if they did, I think a lot would have to happen for the Yanks to drop Tanaka in the rotation for an acquisition.
I didn't say the bullpen sucked, I said it was average/below average. That's what it is. That's what the numbers say.
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
Ok fair enough. I have the bullpen in the top third in the league and we’ll be in the postseason hunt all year. We’ll see.
Post-season hunt???? Playoffs? Playoffs??? You are delusional this team is sinking fast and will be out of it by July 4th and probably sellers at the deadline!
…is what is so deflating. Sure, I as one customer can refuse to buy tickets or merchandise. But in all seriousness, there is nothing I can do but be indifferent. As you guys know that is not possible. We all have our other teams. Even with the Eli mess last year, we all knew that the Mara and Tisch families care about their franchises. My comments may be empowering the Yankee fans who lurk but if you would just allow me to compare the ownership. I grew up in a time where the Mets and Yankees could actually be compared and discussed as fun. The Yankees with Don Mattingly, Rickey Henderson, Winfield, Dave Righetti, hell I remember Jack Clark as a Yankee and we had Doc, Darryl, Keith. I was excited for Gregg Jefferies! I wish we got to see interleague back then. But in the mid-to-late 90s, the Yankees built their core and that is when they became the franchise we know of today (I am sure this is arguable but it’s now I remember). Hell, I remember being so happy for them in 96 because they beat the Braves. Anyway, pulling myself back to the point. Is George and the Steinbrenner ownership now, care about their franchise and for the most part care about their fans. Now some Mets fans say “go root for the Yankees then”. That’s not how fandom works, unfortunately or I’d be a Penguins, Warriors and Eag…..ehhhhh no, but you get my point,
So now to the Mets. The Wilpons and Sandy (it appears) do not care for their fanbase. They hang on to this franchise after being in bed with Madoff (as one of you pointed out earlier) and do not invest in their team. The GM makes a snarky remark last fall when the Yankees added Giancarlo Stanton and he tells us “we have Nimmo”. Arcarsenal made a great observation in that we get one or two years of hope and then it is a decade long slump. I don’t know fellas (and ladies) I am just venting. There is nothing in the minor leagues, our major league roster is flawed. I would actually be more energized if they would move some of their valuable assets versus trying to scotch tape these holes on a sinking ship.
Legally no one can demand the Wilpons sell the team so here we are, stuck with ownership who will continue to embarrass us. What the owners do not get that it is us fans that pay (emotionally) for their futility.
I am not sure if some of you used to watch pro wrestling but the Yankees are the WWF and the Mets are WCW. McMahon is Steinbrenner. You know what in 1996-98, WCW briefly took over the industry. In a very short period of time, the Mets were the talk of the town (by the way I cringed at the “Take Back New York” shirts – it’s like does anyone know about teasing the baseball gods?) But in the end the WWF “won” the Monday Night War.
The major league team is struggling with veterans. The minor leagues aren’t producing anyone which in turn, why would I have any confidence in the scouting and player development staff in improving the pipeline. I fear this has to get worse before it has to get better! Sorry for the rant – it’s therapeutic, I guess.
repeat... not saying that the Mets should do this...
but, if you traded Thor, DeGrom, Cespedes, Conforto, Nimmo, Matz, Wheeler, Familia, Cabrera, Lagares, and anyone else, strip the entire thing bare as can be, the Mets would likely have one of the best collection of young/farm talent in baseball tomorrow. Can also add the #6 pick this year, a top pick in 2018 after tanking, and at least another top pick in 2019. They'd have tons of draft slot money to just load up on young talent. With the lowered payroll, maybe the Mets could go all-in on international prospects too.
Something similar worked for the Astros and Cubs. They'd have to get a new/good GM though, you wouldn't trust Sandy, Ricco or Omar to do a complete rebuild.
repeat... not saying that the Mets should do this...
but, if you traded Thor, DeGrom, Cespedes, Conforto, Nimmo, Matz, Wheeler, Familia, Cabrera, Lagares, and anyone else, strip the entire thing bare as can be, the Mets would likely have one of the best collection of young/farm talent in baseball tomorrow. Can also add the #6 pick this year, a top pick in 2018 after tanking, and at least another top pick in 2019. They'd have tons of draft slot money to just load up on young talent. With the lowered payroll, maybe the Mets could go all-in on international prospects too.
Something similar worked for the Astros and Cubs. They'd have to get a new/good GM though, you wouldn't trust Sandy, Ricco or Omar to do a complete rebuild.
That's what the Braves did also but the key is trading for/drafting the right players and developing them. The Mets should also invest heavily into international scouting.
Are you trying to say the Mets are a little league organization?
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I’m disappointed that the starting pitching does not seem to have improved.OTOH,
I think he has done a pretty good job with the pen. Especially co side ring his closer blew three saves in a little over a week . Often when a closer does that, pen begins to unravel. But the pen has remained solid for the most part
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This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
I still like Mickey but pointing to the bullpen is not the way you want to go in defending him.
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In comment 13959269 PatchoguePete said:
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This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
I'm confused...why would there be anti-Callaway noise during the Mets 11-1 start? Should there have been?
Personally, I mentioned more than a few times during that hot streak that it was mostly smoke and mirrors. And that hopefully the team wakes up before they stopped getting ALL the breaks in those first 11 wins. Well, the team didn't wake up and this is what we got.
Hi, I'd like to introduce one extreme to the other extreme.
Can we stop saying that the bats are cold? It's May 9th.
This isn't a good team, man. If you don't see it now, I don't know what to tell you.
We've been hearing that the "bats are cold" for weeks.
We're struggling to even beat the Reds. The worst team in baseball.
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
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fanbase in professional sports and it’s compounded on BBI for some reason. 2 weeks ago everyone was sky high and now we are back to being a joke. It’s called baseball. Highs and lows. The Mets have a few key guys out to injury and some of their big bats have been cold. They are going through a rough patch right now. As long as there are no long term knockouts to key players the Mets will bounce back.
This isn't a good team, man. If you don't see it now, I don't know what to tell you.
We've been hearing that the "bats are cold" for weeks.
We're struggling to even beat the Reds. The worst team in baseball.
Wheeler is pitching a gem and Matz is coming off a gem too. The rotation will settle down. DeGrom returns Sunday. One week ago our bullpen was in the top third in the league. During this rough stretch the pen got beat up a bit but it’s still fine.... especially when Swarzak returns. The lineup was always going to depend on Rosario and 1B but it has plenty of good hitters in it. The lineup will at least be average and if the team stays relatively healthy we will be in the wild card mix. Count on it.
Oh boo hoo...go to MMO then with all of the "knowledgeable" Mets fans. Maybe they like to sniff the unicorn farts out of your rear.
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I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
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I sit back silent 90% of the time while you guys piss and moan after every loss.
Oh boo hoo...go to MMO then with all of the "knowledgeable" Mets fans. Maybe they like to sniff the unicorn farts out of your rear.
You’re the one calling me out for being extremely optimistic when I’ve barely said shit.
Can't keep blaming injuries and cold bats for everything. The Mets aren't the only team that have to deal with that stuff. It's the same excuses constantly.
We're going to be in the bottom third of the league in runs scored by the end of the week.
The bullpen isn't that good. It's average to below average.
I'll bet anything that this isn't a postseason team and the entire thing will have fallen apart before the 4th of July.
The Marlins and Reds.
I need to see him actually succeed against a good lineup before I get too excited about this "gem". The start against Colorado was horrendous and the start against StL wasn't good either. He was passable against WSH.
You'll figure it out eventually.
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In comment 13959280 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13959269 PatchoguePete said:
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This instance aside, he was supposed to come here with Eiland and fix the pitching staff. Instead, Harvey has been traded, Vargas has been trash, Matz has been inconsistent, and Wheeler has been inconsistent. This season has been a great start followed by a big ol pile of trash. Fire Callaway.
I said about 20,000 times that it wouldn't be long until the fans started complaining about the new manager.
Only took until the end of April!
This team has and had much bigger problems than Terry Collins.
I wonder where all this anti-Callaway noise was when the Mets started off red hot. The start was staggering because this roster was always hit or miss to begin with. Honestly, I'm more disappointed in how our hitting has been (Conforto, Ces, Bruce, et. al), but even with that, it's way too early to be calling for anyone's head.
I'm confused...why would there be anti-Callaway noise during the Mets 11-1 start? Should there have been?
Personally, I mentioned more than a few times during that hot streak that it was mostly smoke and mirrors. And that hopefully the team wakes up before they stopped getting ALL the breaks in those first 11 wins. Well, the team didn't wake up and this is what we got.
Of course not - just like we shouldn't have assumed that the Mets would finish with 120+ wins. The point though is that any pronouncements that Mickey needs to go at this point in the year is way too early. But now that the Mets are in a snide, all these people are full of conviction that Mickey is terrible and needs to go.
And fwiw, I was referring more to the people calling for his head. Just want to make that clear because you get extra testy when you think something is directed at you lol.
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In comment 13959308 ZGiants98 said:
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I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
I would have been happy with .500 baseball for a while. We couldn't even do that. Instead we got swept in back to back series' and have lost 8 of our last 10 games. Now we're in 4th place.
hey can you fuck off thanks
You'll figure it out eventually.
Nothing is fine and dandy. We are going through a rough patch. Frazier, Swarzak, our catchers, and DeGrom are out. Most should be back shortly. Some of our most talented hitters STILL need to heat up. It’s called baseball. Find me at the end of the season. If we stay relatively healthy we’ll be in the playoff mix. The world isn’t ending on May 9th.
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In comment 13959318 PhiPsi125 said:
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In comment 13959308 ZGiants98 said:
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I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
Enough with beating the same dead horse. If you can’t see why we went down in flames last year when we lost Thor, Cespedes, Conforto, Familia and countless others for the year I don’t know what to tell you. If we make the playoffs this year it will be the third time in four years. Poor us.
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LOL, okay - everything is fine and dandy in Mets land as always.
You'll figure it out eventually.
Nothing is fine and dandy. We are going through a rough patch. Frazier, Swarzak, our catchers, and DeGrom are out. Most should be back shortly. Some of our most talented hitters STILL need to heat up. It’s called baseball. Find me at the end of the season. If we stay relatively healthy we’ll be in the playoff mix. The world isn’t ending on May 9th.
Same excuses constantly. I'll never understand why you have so much blind faith in the Mets and Alderson when they've had such little success.
How long do these guys need to heat up? We're 5 fucking weeks into the season now. Cmon. Enough.
deGrom missed a whopping one start. It's not like we've been without him for several turns.
d'Arnaud isn't coming back. Plawecki sucks (sorry, Shecky), Swarzak was moved to the 60 day and doesn't appear to be anywhere near returning.
If we can't win because a middle reliever and our crappy catching duo is hurt, this team was never good to begin with.
And now the Reds are primed to take a lead... good stuff.
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In comment 13959318 PhiPsi125 said:
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In comment 13959308 ZGiants98 said:
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I’m saying some bats are cold NOW which is partly responsible for our rough stretch? Players don’t go hot and cold all season wrong or are you trying to tell me players like Cespedes and Conforto are bad players?
I'm saying that you've been banging the drum since day one that the bats are cold. And they have been. But it's May 9th. If every single of your starters are cold from day one (except for Cabrera and Frazier for a short period) then there is a problem. But its a problem every year...so maybe they are not so great? I don't know, you tell me.
Yes it’s May 9th but proven players like Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera, etc are going to play up to the back of their baseball cards. This crap happens every year and it’s like people are watching a brand new sport every time. It never fails.
And how does that work out every year? Not so great, right? Teams as inconsistent as the Mets are don't win a damn thing. Dude, there is major problems with this team. Sorry if you can't see it when everyone else in the world can. If you don't like the threads, then just stay off them.
temper temper now phi, its a long season and now that the hot streak fluke start is over this team needs to learn what it truly is before adjusting and progressing. As long as Degrom/Thor are pitching the Mets will have a chance, but as far as hitting look around the league, everyone is struggling.
If Wheeler can hold down the 3 spot, that will make a huge difference.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
The fact is that this team is what we thought they were. A very flawed team that didnt fill its holes due to financial constraints and an unimaginative GM but a flawed team that has a punchers chance if they somehow scratch enough wins to get into a playoff series.
The bigger issue for the mets this year is that Atlanta and philly apparently are good and we were betting on beating them up to have any real shot. Long term, if they arent going to sign Thor & Degrom to extensions this off season they should trade everyone and break this sucker down.
I'm with Z, too many proven hitters for these guys not to start hitting. if Wheeler/Matz come to form then the rotation looks alot stronger. Cant let previous years disappointment affect a new season with a new manager.
I kinda compare this lineup to the Brewers who are just now starting to hit.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
temper temper now phi, its a long season and now that the hot streak fluke start is over this team needs to learn what it truly is before adjusting and progressing. As long as Degrom/Thor are pitching the Mets will have a chance, but as far as hitting look around the league, everyone is struggling.
If Wheeler can hold down the 3 spot, that will make a huge difference.
LOL, my temper is just fine. Not my problem if some can't see the forest through the trees. It's like some people believe that we've fielded a competitive team for years and this is just the norm.
Yes, the league is struggling with offense. BUT, the Mets are in the bottom half (if not the bottom third) of every offensive statistical category in the NL. This is a veteran team...if it takes them this long to adjust and progress, then its a bad sign.
Bottom line is...this team shouldn't be this bad for this long. This team has major warts in how it was constructed. That's nothing new. Our GM is stuck in the 90s version of baseball and relies on old reclamation projects of the same ilk. Outside of the first 12 games, the bullpen has been bad...it's not just one bad week like we heard in an earlier post. It is what it is, man. This isn't a playoff team...just like everyone thought before the season.
This is the same flawed baseball team we've been watching for the majority of the last few years.
We were very fortunate to even get a play in game in 2016. We won 87 games. That's very low for a WC team. And we lost the play in game anyway.
We've had one truly good baseball season in over 10 years.
I don't know why anyone trusts this team. They're second-rate and operate that way.
For me, it really comes down to Alderson has been the GM for a LONG time here. I'm sick of excuses. I want to see a contending team or a new regime. Last year was crazy, so I was willing to give a pass. Not in 2018. Not after he's been GM for SO long.
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Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
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Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Depends on the circumstances... if we don’t have any major knockout blows? Maybe. Baseball is crap shoot in the postseason and many of highs and lows during the regular season have been predicated by how many players are actually on the field. Sandy has dealt with franchise crippling blows (Harvey) over and over and we still seemed to have weathered most storms in spite of it. Seriously, how many teams could afford to lose one of the best starters in baseball In a blink of an eye ? Tends to make things more difficult.
He looks like a grown up and slimmer Ham/The Great Hambino from The Sandlot, who also happened to be a catcher lol
Robles was just in the minors. He’s been up for about a week and had one appearance because Vargas and others have gotten shredded and had to leave the game way early which had taxed our pen.
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Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
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In comment 13959378 arcarsenal said:
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Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
His FIP is over 7 and he's already appeared 10 times.
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In comment 13959364 ZGiants98 said:
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Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
That’s really dumb. We spent more than most teams in free agency this offseason and I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
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In comment 13959388 ZGiants98 said:
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In comment 13959378 arcarsenal said:
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Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
I don't see other good teams having that issue.
His FIP is over 7 and he's already appeared 10 times.
Yes and that mostly goes back to earlier in the season. He was already shipped off to AAA and was only recently recalled due to circumstance. Yelling that the bullpen sucks because of Robles who’s the 7th or 8th option doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. He’ll be gone again soon.
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
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In comment 13959394 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13959388 ZGiants98 said:
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In comment 13959378 arcarsenal said:
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Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
I don't see other good teams having that issue.
Are you watching every single game of another team and living and dying with them like you do the Mets? Because this happens to every player on every team. The Yankees have the most talented lineup in the sport and that fanbase was ready to jump off a cliff a few weeks into the season.
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In comment 13959379 Metnut said:
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In comment 13959364 ZGiants98 said:
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Tell me specifically who won’t heat up? Tell me who of Conforto, Cespedes, Bruce, Frazier, Cabrera will have awful stat lines at season’s end? Who of Thor/DeGrom won’t have an ace line at the end of the season? Something tells me Wheeler and Matz’s lines are going to look fine too (for 3 and 4 guys). Tell me specifically and let’s compare in October. It’s so easy to sling daggers over small samples but baseball proves over and over again it’s a looooong season filled with highs and lows.
Do you agree that Sandy should be fired if the team misses the playoffs this year?
If not, is it because you think only making the division series once in a decade and having a bottom 10 farm system is the best that the Mets can do? Tell me specifically how you define success, if you think one trip to the final 8 per decade is successful.
Sandy is the one person I've had the biggest gripe with. It feels like we bargain bin hunt every year and our drafts have been subpar.
That’s really dumb. We spent more than most teams in free agency this offseason and I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
Z - I always enjoy your optimism and it's certainly needed to be a fan of the Mets...but you have lost me if you think Sandy has been anything more than an average GM .
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
Ok fair enough. I have the bullpen in the top third in the league and we’ll be in the postseason hunt all year. We’ll see.
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In comment 13959405 ZGiants98 said:
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In comment 13959394 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13959388 ZGiants98 said:
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In comment 13959378 arcarsenal said:
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Cabrera has already been hot most of the year - that's not going to last. He's starting to hit a lull now. He's not going to start hitting .500. He's cooling down.
It's also not out of the question for Conforto to have a down/off year coming back from the shoulder injury. He hasn't looked right yet.
Bruce will be Bruce - but so far he's literally been replacement-level.
deGrom has already been fantastic and we've still blown games where he's been close to untouchable.
Cespedes is always banged up. I don't trust him to stay healthy all year. And even if he does, it's not going to be enough.
Rosario isn't helping either.
I’m asking you who, if healthy, is going to have a horrific stat line at the end of the season. You guys are screaming at me that we are 5 weeks into the season so it shouldn’t be an excuse. Apparently everyone needs to be hot from May9th on. Tell me who’s going to have a really bad year? Conforto? That’s not enough to destroy us. It would have to be multiple players. So who?
Why is this relevant?
No one said everyone needs to be hot from May 9th on - I just am sick of hearing "the bats are ice cold" over and over again. How long does that grace period last?
Bruce, Cespedes, Cabrera, Frazier and Conforto can all have career average years and it still won't guarantee a single thing.
what do you mean why is it relevant? It’s relevant because most are underperforming and historically are good players. You are saying that it’s been 5 weeks so no more excuses right? You must also be saying they won’t bounce back then either right?
Because none of them need to have a "horrific" year for the team to still suck or struggle.
Why is it always our collective group of hitters that get "ice cold" at the same time for 4 and 5 weeks at a time?
I don't see other good teams having that issue.
Are you watching every single game of another team and living and dying with them like you do the Mets? Because this happens to every player on every team. The Yankees have the most talented lineup in the sport and that fanbase was ready to jump off a cliff a few weeks into the season.
The Yankees have won like 16 of their last 17 games and lead all of baseball in offense. Their pitching is up there too.
We're not even close to them.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
This is recency bias. Sure they do “today” but it was completely flipped a few years ago. Yankees had a farm middle of the pack at best and Mets had a top 5 system heading into 2015. Mets were the envy of everyone coming off the WS appearance. Ebbs and flows.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
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also have a top farm system and are coming off of an ALCS appearance last year. The Mets are coming off of 90 losses and have a bottom farm system. The situations aren't comparable.
I'd love to see a Mets team that is smartly run like the Yankees. Would love to poach would of their top assistants this offseason if we get rid of Sandy, Omar and Ricco.
This is recency bias. Sure they do “today” but it was completely flipped a few years ago. Yankees had a farm middle of the pack at best and Mets had a top 5 system heading into 2015. Mets were the envy of everyone coming off the WS appearance. Ebbs and flows.
2015 is the exception for the Mets under Alderson. It's not enough to save his job IMO.
It's not ebbs and flows. It's a decade of failure with one great year and one good year. Not good enough, especially with a bottom farm system at the moment. Time is ticking Sandy.
I'll be fine either way, either Mets will make the playoffs or we'll get a new GM. I have no loyalty to this middling regime. Only to the Mets.
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What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
Yup, that works.
All farms take a dip from time to time. If it’s awful for a 5 year stretch that’s totally different.
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In comment 13959442 PhiPsi125 said:
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What a vague statement to hang your hat on. I guess it's the easiest statement to make when you want to weasel your way out of an argument. It kinda plays on both sides of the fence.
Is this a joke? Of course I’m not saying they are going to be in the “hunt” in spirit. lol. I’m saying they will be in range of an actual postseason spot up until the last week of the season barring catastrophic season ending injuries. Is that specific enough for you?
Yup, that works.
Deal. :)
Major League team stinks
Farm system sucks
Honestly, only entertainment I'd tolerate from the Mets now is bringing up Tebow to play everyday. At least that would be entertaining one way or another.
Can't even win a series against the worst team in the NL.
This team is in major trouble.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
The Yankees make the most sense but I doubt the Wilpons will want to help the Yankees win a world series. There would be a substantial Yankees tax that would prohibit a trade. The Phillies could be interested but the Mets wouldn't be thrilled about moving him to a division rival.
Nyquist is right but the Wilpons have been losing customers to the Yankees for years now. If you were born in 1990 and started following baseball at 6 or 7 years old. Unless your family are Mets fans, the Yankees built their brand and fanbase. A 28 year old Yankee fan never went through what we have. Even missing the playoffs in 08 worked out so they could close their stadium with a sure game.
2013 looks awful. 2014 has Conforto and little else. It looks like Sandy's 1st draft was his best, Nimmo and Fulmer. I agree that drafts take time, but after 5 or 6 years, you can start to make assumptions, and my assumption is that those drafts weren't very good.
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It's a bit early for this, and he's far and away my favorite player on the team, but before long it might really start to make sense to move deGrom to a contender.
I thought there was a good match with Astros last season before they got Verlander. This season, there is a team across town who could use him, although I'd rather get kicked in the nuts repeatedly before shipping deGrom to the Bronx and watching him dominate the postseason over there.
If there were a farm system altering offer on the table and you are below .500 yet again, I'm not sure how you don't consider it long and hard.
The Yankees make the most sense but I doubt the Wilpons will want to help the Yankees win a world series. There would be a substantial Yankees tax that would prohibit a trade. The Phillies could be interested but the Mets wouldn't be thrilled about moving him to a division rival.
If the Yanks keep pitching the way they have been, I dont see the Yanks giving up much for a 30 year old number 3/4 pitcher. German just got done throwing a gem in his first start, Gray has looked good last 2/3 outings and we have Justus Sheffield who is bound to be called up before long. Just dont see it. If he was a lefty, sure.
Btw, regarding batting out of order, when the manager brings out the line up card, doesnt he compare his with the one the ump gets right after he hands it to him?
deGrom is immediately the number 1 pitcher on the Yankees. Come on.
deGrom is immediately the number 1 pitcher on the Yankees. Come on.
Absolutely not. Both Sevvy and Tanaka are our 1 and 2.
deGrom is immediately the number 1 pitcher on the Yankees. Come on.
Absolutely not. Both Sevvy and Tanaka are our 1 and 2
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I can’t think of a single draft that can be labeled a complete bust yet. Drafts take time.
2013 looks awful. 2014 has Conforto and little else. It looks like Sandy's 1st draft was his best, Nimmo and Fulmer. I agree that drafts take time, but after 5 or 6 years, you can start to make assumptions, and my assumption is that those drafts weren't very good.
It's not like the 15 drafts before those were any good either....just sayin. It's an organizational flaw, not one person or one era.
My main point is I doubt the Yankees would give up a ton for him.
Whoa. Even knowing what yiu know now about Gleyber? I still wouldnt have. Id have goven up a similar package to what we gave Oakland for Gray. Maybe sthrown in McKinney.
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He'd be one of the few available starters who'd warrant such a prospect. No way Archer or Fullmer would. Assuming deGrom's elbow is OK, the Mets could get a king's ransom.
Whoa. Even knowing what yiu know now about Gleyber? I still wouldnt have. Id have goven up a similar package to what we gave Oakland for Gray. Maybe sthrown in McKinney.
There is no way that offer would come close to getting a deal done.
I'm assuming chopper doesnt watch deGrom pitch a lot.
Don't go too far out on a limb there.
I'm assuming chopper doesnt watch deGrom pitch a lot.
Ive watched him pitch. I think hes great. I just dont see how it would be an automatic switching of spots for Masa from 2 to 3. His last three and deGrom's are very similar. Tanaka went thru a really bad 3 game stretch that ballooned his ERA. They really have been quite similar in terms of production this year.
I echo bceagle about ruining this thread with Yanks talk. Just wanted to point out, I dont see the Yankees going real big on another RHP this year given what they did last year. And if they did, I think a lot would have to happen for the Yanks to drop Tanaka in the rotation for an acquisition.
3-5.. if we're lucky.
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Gonna be a long week for the Amazins.
3-5.. if we're lucky.
2-6 imo
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I didn't say the bullpen sucked, I said it was average/below average. That's what it is. That's what the numbers say.
My prediction: The Mets miss the postseason once again and it gets blamed on more injuries or things not going our way.. as usual. And then we'll try to do this all over again next year.
Ok fair enough. I have the bullpen in the top third in the league and we’ll be in the postseason hunt all year. We’ll see.
Post-season hunt???? Playoffs? Playoffs??? You are delusional this team is sinking fast and will be out of it by July 4th and probably sellers at the deadline!
So now to the Mets. The Wilpons and Sandy (it appears) do not care for their fanbase. They hang on to this franchise after being in bed with Madoff (as one of you pointed out earlier) and do not invest in their team. The GM makes a snarky remark last fall when the Yankees added Giancarlo Stanton and he tells us “we have Nimmo”. Arcarsenal made a great observation in that we get one or two years of hope and then it is a decade long slump. I don’t know fellas (and ladies) I am just venting. There is nothing in the minor leagues, our major league roster is flawed. I would actually be more energized if they would move some of their valuable assets versus trying to scotch tape these holes on a sinking ship.
Legally no one can demand the Wilpons sell the team so here we are, stuck with ownership who will continue to embarrass us. What the owners do not get that it is us fans that pay (emotionally) for their futility.
I am not sure if some of you used to watch pro wrestling but the Yankees are the WWF and the Mets are WCW. McMahon is Steinbrenner. You know what in 1996-98, WCW briefly took over the industry. In a very short period of time, the Mets were the talk of the town (by the way I cringed at the “Take Back New York” shirts – it’s like does anyone know about teasing the baseball gods?) But in the end the WWF “won” the Monday Night War.
The major league team is struggling with veterans. The minor leagues aren’t producing anyone which in turn, why would I have any confidence in the scouting and player development staff in improving the pipeline. I fear this has to get worse before it has to get better! Sorry for the rant – it’s therapeutic, I guess.
I look forward to reading the Mets Minors posts.
but, if you traded Thor, DeGrom, Cespedes, Conforto, Nimmo, Matz, Wheeler, Familia, Cabrera, Lagares, and anyone else, strip the entire thing bare as can be, the Mets would likely have one of the best collection of young/farm talent in baseball tomorrow. Can also add the #6 pick this year, a top pick in 2018 after tanking, and at least another top pick in 2019. They'd have tons of draft slot money to just load up on young talent. With the lowered payroll, maybe the Mets could go all-in on international prospects too.
Something similar worked for the Astros and Cubs. They'd have to get a new/good GM though, you wouldn't trust Sandy, Ricco or Omar to do a complete rebuild.
but, if you traded Thor, DeGrom, Cespedes, Conforto, Nimmo, Matz, Wheeler, Familia, Cabrera, Lagares, and anyone else, strip the entire thing bare as can be, the Mets would likely have one of the best collection of young/farm talent in baseball tomorrow. Can also add the #6 pick this year, a top pick in 2018 after tanking, and at least another top pick in 2019. They'd have tons of draft slot money to just load up on young talent. With the lowered payroll, maybe the Mets could go all-in on international prospects too.
Something similar worked for the Astros and Cubs. They'd have to get a new/good GM though, you wouldn't trust Sandy, Ricco or Omar to do a complete rebuild.
That's what the Braves did also but the key is trading for/drafting the right players and developing them. The Mets should also invest heavily into international scouting.