Apparently my grandmother was from a town in Russia called Zwonetz (as written on her naturalization papers in 1926, but written as "Swanic, Russia" on her arrival in 1909). I can't find either Zwonetz or Swanic on a map of Russia (but there's a Zwonitz in Germany that was founded by Slavs).
Is there a way other than Google Maps for finding the town on a map? It may have just been shtetl.
It depends on where you think the town may have been in Russia. But there were Germans as deep as the Volga River (aka the Volga Germans)... they no longer exist.
If you're looking at Ancestry.com or FamilySearch.org, look at the actual document. If it is written down as Prussia, then you definitely have your answer. Zwonitz is in Saxony, which was part of Prussia. In 1909, Prussia was part of the German Empire, but Prussians would probably have still called their country Prussia.
I've run into this looking over US census documents.
"Hey, you spelled his name wrong!"
"I can fix it, but it will take another week and it will cost you $10."
"Oh well."
"Vito Andolini?"
"Vito Corleone"
"Hey, you spelled his name wrong!"
"I can fix it, but it will take another week and it will cost you $10."
"Oh well."
But we have no idea what "Hoskin" means or what he was trying to say.
His son, my grandfather, once told a census taker his birthplace was Kiev. We're about 99% sure that's false. Kakhovka is near Odessa. but Kiev was in the news at the time they were taking the census. My mother thought he was probably just naming a place that people would recognize.
On the other hand, I was able to trace another branch of the family through a document on Ancestry and some internet sleuthing. That branch came to the U.S. through Canada and we've never been able to find a damn thing about where they came from, except that my grandfather was considered a "Galitzianer." (That indicates southeastern Europe, more or less.)
But it turned out that Ancestry had a transcript of the citizenship hearing for one of my grandfather's uncles. In those days, the citizenship process was run by the states, and NY State ran hearings in New York City. The uncle had to bring a character witness, who told the court "I live near him, and I knew him in the old country."
Turned out that guy's descendants were doing their own genealogy research, and while I was never able to trace my GG-Uncle, I was able to trace his character witness to a town in southeastern Poland: Ulanow.
And as it turned out, my father remembered that one of his forebears in that branch of the tree was buried in a Brooklyn cemetery for people from Ulanow, or that had a section for Ulanow people, or something. So we have finally traced that part of the clan to Ulanow. Still can't find any trace of them from the scant local records available online.
If anybody has any thoughts about what a native Yiddish and Russian speaker might have meant by "Hoskin," I'd love to hear them.
[quote] In comment 13984179 Milton said:
Quote:
Zwonitz, Germany was formerly part of Prussia, so it's possible, maybe even likely that that is where she was from.
If you're looking at Ancestry.com or FamilySearch.org, look at the actual document. If it is written down as Prussia, then you definitely have your answer. Zwonitz is in Saxony, which was part of Prussia. In 1909, Prussia was part of the German Empire, but Prussians would probably have still called their country Prussia. [/quote
Yep, I had ancestors from Posen, Germany and I've seen several different forms where they wrote down Germany, Prussia, and even Russia and the American officials didn't seem to know better. ]
Now you see why I am a stickler for spelling and grammar on here, you can't leave out letters!
No one will EVER leave the e out of Joey in describing your miserable ass.
I'm guessing they would have had a field day today. Either that, or we'd have a lot more Sanjay Smith's.
Both my grandfathers were Galitzianers, while both my grandmothers were Litvaks. The Litvak-Galitzianer divide was a thing. Miraculously, only one of those unions ended in divorce. That grandmother spoke sneeringly of her Galitzianer ex-husband. The other pair stayed married until my grandfather died at 89, though they didn't really get along.
Quote:
In 1909, Prussia was part of the German Empire, but Prussians would probably have still called their country Prussia.
Eric some would say the German Empire was part of Prussia!
p.s.--The irony for me is that I was told as a child that I was 3/4's Russian and 1/4 Austrian (none of my grandparents were born in America) and the truth is likely that they were neither Russian, nor Austrian. Instead they were definitely Ukrainian, probably Polish, and possibly German. Of course the reality is that they weren't Russian, Austrian, Ukrainian, Polish, German, or of any other Eurasian heritage, they were Jews from the shtetls of central/eastern Europe. But it would be nice to trace them to the actual villages they were from.